INFO LAMS - RVF - Aftermarket exhaust, carbon parts?

[smithmZXR]

Hi, I've bought a RVF 400 and I see it is LAMS approved now. Can anyone tell me if I can legally put a aftermarket exhaust on it / swap for carbon parts (tyga performance parts, I think the exhaust adds 6-8hp??)? Any help would be much appreciated, or else I will call on Tuesday and try to find out.

Cheers,

Mike

[James Deuce]

Nope. It has to remain as it left the factory. Any modification makes it ineligible for LAMS status. If you need to replace parts, you have to use factory ones.

[smithmZXR]

Thanks, it's not so much of getting a WoF etc but in the case of insurance etc also. Cheers for the quick reply.

[Jantar]

Hi, I've bought a RVF 400 and I see it is LAMS approved now. Can anyone tell me if I can legally put a aftermarket exhaust on it / swap for carbon parts (tyga performance parts, I think the exhaust adds 6-8hp??)? Any help would be much appreciated, or else I will call on Tuesday and try to find out.

Cheers,

Mike

You can put an aftermarket exhaust on it provided it doesnt alter the power to weight ratio. Ie it must not increase power or decrease overall weight. Thus your idea of a tyga exhaust would make it non compliant. If you really need a new exhaust then as James Deuce says, the only real way is replace with a factory item.

[FJRider]

As the legislation is written ... modifications for the purpose of increasing the power to weight ratio is not allowed.
If an aftermarket exhaust system was just fitted ... as no standard original part was available to be fitted. With no (or little) gain to HP ... and wasn't an obvious and/or loud pipe (and not speeding) ... not much would be said.

BUT ... With the Carbon pipe ... with re-jetting to get the best out of the system ... intentional performance gains were sought.

As far as insurance goes ... riding a motorcycle outside the class of your license ... may not affect your insurance. If the bike had a WOF, was up to date with registration ... they may still cover you. (ASK THEM)

[steve74]

The other thing to consider is how would anyone know? Vtnz don't have dyno's. the police don't have a clue what your bike is, let alone how much power it's got or if the exhaust is factory? You wont find many bog standard Japanese 400cc bikes that haven't had holes drilled in the air box or a jet/ needle modification or an aftermarket exhaust to increase horsepower. I just can't see how they can prove it on the spot. Fair enough in a major accident they might investigate modifications which I guess may void insurance but our local cops won't have a clue?

[Subike]

The other thing to consider is how would anyone know? Vtnz don't have dyno's. the police don't have a clue what your bike is, let alone how much power it's got or if the exhaust is factory? You wont find many bog standard Japanese 400cc bikes that haven't had holes drilled in the air box or a jet/ needle modification or an aftermarket exhaust to increase horsepower. I just can't see how they can prove it on the spot. Fair enough in a major accident they might investigate modifications which I guess may void insurance but our local cops won't have a clue?

finally a man that can think.
If others had been following Rastacats thread, he stated that a high majority of the popo;s dont even know about the law change, let alone what a bike rating is full stop.
But do be aware, this could be the start of bikes having to be certified like cars and hot rods are, so I would not make too much noise about checking out a bikes legal position with the land transport, they will find another reason to tax us.
Keep your bike , clean, tidy and licensed, you should not have a problem.
Notify your insurance company of any Major changes, which everyone should do without saying.
And enjoy your ride

[FJRider]

The other thing to consider is how would anyone know? Vtnz don't have dyno's. the police don't have a clue what your bike is, let alone how much power it's got or if the exhaust is factory? You wont find many bog standard Japanese 400cc bikes that haven't had holes drilled in the air box or a jet/ needle modification or an aftermarket exhaust to increase horsepower. I just can't see how they can prove it on the spot. Fair enough in a major accident they might investigate modifications which I guess may void insurance but our local cops won't have a clue?

If his luck is as good as mine ... the first booze check-point he finds himself at ... will have a cop that owns one, and knows the lam's laws well.

And depending on the circumstances of the stop ... and attitude of the rider (and cop) at the time. A complience notice may also be issued (on suspicion of non-complience of LAM's regulations). Which is not a ticket ... but still costs.

The risk is his ... but are the 6 or so horses gained worth the possible extra costs ... if he is caught.

The OP himself can decide that.

[McFatty1000]

With regards to this, what about 250s that have had modifications? I have a slip on on mine which I have had since before the lams laws and was put on by a previous owner so don't have the original. Wouldn't think it actually does anything for my bike honestly but I'd rather not have to find a stock pipe to make things legit?

[FJRider]

With regards to this, what about 250s that have had modifications? I have a slip on on mine which I have had since before the lams laws and was put on by a previous owner so don't have the original. Wouldn't think it actually does anything for my bike honestly but I'd rather not have to find a stock pipe to make things legit?

If it doesn't increase the power to weight ratio ... it is allowed.

http://www.nzta.govt.nz/licence/getting/motorcycles/approved-motorcycles.html

Those people with a non-compliant LAMs class bike from before the legislation came in ... can apply for an exemption.

[Glowerss]

With regards to this, what about 250s that have had modifications? I have a slip on on mine which I have had since before the lams laws and was put on by a previous owner so don't have the original. Wouldn't think it actually does anything for my bike honestly but I'd rather not have to find a stock pipe to make things legit?

With 250s it doesn't matter. Only matters on 251cc - 569.

[FJRider]

With 250s it doesn't matter. Only matters on 251cc - 569.

Incorrect ... Any motorcycle modified in a way that increases its power-to-weight ratio is no longer LAMS-compliant, regardless of whether it appears on the list.

[McFatty1000]

Ok, just saw this on the nzta site:

Please note

Any motorcycle modified in a way that increases its power-to-weight ratio is no longer LAMS-compliant, regardless of whether it appears on the list.

If you are a rider on a learner or restricted motorcycle licence, it is your responsibility to ensure you are riding a LAMS-approved motorcycle, as produced by the manufacturer. If in doubt, seek confirmation from the manufacturer’s agent or dealership. If you are unsure who to contact, details for all major motorcycle importers are available on the Motor Industry Association website (external link).

So I guess that'd include mine? However, they're going off the factory specs right? Mine will have lost horses over the years so where does that put it now? Even a small increase in power now wouldn't off set this...

[FJRider]

Ok, just saw this on the nzta site:



As always ... if you're on the restricted license ... don't attract the attention of plod. If said plod is having a slow day ... or just in the mood (after you fail the attitude test) he/she will go looking for issues to ticket you with.
Some plod may not know ... or care. Some WILL ... and will care.

For the 18 months of the restricted license ... be good boys and girls. Especially ... if your bike "Features" non OEM parts.

Individual choice for doing this of course.

Ignorance of the rules is no excuse ... as always.

[jasonu]

Hi, I've bought a RVF 400 and I see it is LAMS approved now. Can anyone tell me if I can legally put a aftermarket exhaust on it / swap for carbon parts (tyga performance parts, I think the exhaust adds 6-8hp??)? Any help would be much appreciated, or else I will call on Tuesday and try to find out.

Cheers,

Mike

I'll bet the exhaust doesn't add 6-8hp

[Dave-]

fuck this is a poorly put together law.

so some poor cunt with a cbr250 (which makes piss all power) now has to go out and buy an OEM exhaust (impossible to find, inappropriately expansive to buy) just so his bike is now legal?

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[McFatty1000]

fuck this is a poorly put together law.

so some poor cunt with a cbr250 (which makes piss all power) now has to go out and buy an OEM exhaust (impossible to find, inappropriately expansive to buy) just so his bike is now legal?



It would seem so? Although, then it also says that all 250's are learner legal so one could potentially argue over it? It seems a bit of a grey area though.

However, should I be going for an exemption for my bike due to having it beforehand, even though its likely that its making under the manufacturers specs? I'd love to have it dynoed but for a 250, its not worth the money

[Jantar]

fuck this is a poorly put together law.

so some poor cunt with a cbr250 (which makes piss all power) now has to go out and buy an OEM exhaust (impossible to find, inappropriately expansive to buy) just so his bike is now legal?


There is no requirement to fit an OEM exhaust, or any other OEM part. The only requirement is that the replacement part must not increase the power to weight ratio. Even if it does change it slightly, I'm sure that as long as it isn't louder, and so draw attention to your bike, then no-one would be worried.

[Subike]

fuck this is a poorly put together law.

so some poor cunt with a cbr250 (which makes piss all power) now has to go out and buy an OEM exhaust (impossible to find, inappropriately expansive to buy) just so his bike is now legal?

Not the only class of vehicle that has to deal with this sort of thing, low volume certification is the bane of any person wanting to modify any vehicle, from a mini to a kenworth truck. Put a set of wide wheels on you Corolla, then add some clip on flares for the guards, certification needed, and thats the easy one. Look out all you cafe racer builders, street fighters, choppers, etc, how long will it be till certification will be needed to operate these on the road...I would advise that you keep your bike up to WOF spec at all times, not attract the attention of the Popo's, and you should have a good ride.The last thing we want is to start being labeled along side the boy racers for modified noisey dangerous vehicles. Al though certain makes of bike already encroach upon the sound regulations from new...

[Glowerss]

Incorrect ... Any motorcycle modified in a way that increases its power-to-weight ratio is no longer LAMS-compliant, regardless of whether it appears on the list.


fuck this is a poorly put together law.

so some poor cunt with a cbr250 (which makes piss all power) now has to go out and buy an OEM exhaust (impossible to find, inappropriately expansive to buy) just so his bike is now legal?

Now, this might just be me reading logic where none exists, but......

The way I read it, is any 250 that isn't a 2smoker is legal. This excludes shit like massively fucking with it (IE swapping motors or motor internals). You'd have to meet an officer that had just found out his wife was shaggin his dog or something to get pissy about an exhaust on a 250. And considering what Rastus has been saying, most don't even know the rules have changed. It'll be a cold day in hell before somebody gets written a ticket/non compliance for a zorst on a 250.

I suspect (and again, might be trying to insert logic where non exists) but I suspect that the whole "must not modify bike to increase power to weight ratio" is largely for either A) bikes that are only just fit within the 150kw/tonne limit,

Or, the most likely candidate, bikes that are restricted to meet LAMS requirements. Shit like the restricted Hyobag 650s. I would imagine that the main intent of the rule regarding modifications that increase power, is aimed at warning people not to derestrict their bikes.

Regardless, if it was me on a 250 and I had an aftermarket can, I wouldn't worry about it. You'd have to meet a cop that A) knows about bikes, B) knows the LAMS rules, and C) is either properly pedantic, or having an extremely bad day and D) to fail the attitude test. Particularly if it's not an obviously after market can.

My 2cents anyway.

[FJRider]

Now, this might just be me reading logic where none exists, but......

Don't try to bring logic to legislation discussions ...


The way I read it, is any 250 that isn't a 2smoker is legal. This excludes shit like massively fucking with it (IE swapping motors or motor internals). You'd have to meet an officer that had just found out his wife was shaggin his dog or something to get pissy about an exhaust on a 250. And considering what Rastus has been saying, most don't even know the rules have changed. It'll be a cold day in hell before somebody gets written a ticket/non compliance for a zorst on a 250.

As legislation is written ... unless the 250's are on the forbidden list ... they are automatically LAM's compliant. As such ... subject to LAM's rules and legislation.
Cops that know little of the new reg's will be more of a danger ... than those that do. You want to risk it .... go ahead.


I suspect (and again, might be trying to insert logic where non exists) but I suspect that the whole "must not modify bike to increase power to weight ratio" is largely for either A) bikes that are only just fit within the 150kw/tonne limit,

Logic and legislation do not mix. No modifications to increase power is allowed. No exceptions (or limits) are stated.


Or, the most likely candidate, bikes that are restricted to meet LAMS requirements. Shit like the restricted Hyobag 650s. I would imagine that the main intent of the rule regarding modifications that increase power, is aimed at warning people not to derestrict their bikes.

Actually ... motorcycles that have restrictions that can be removed are NOT on the allowed list.


Regardless, if it was me on a 250 and I had an aftermarket can, I wouldn't worry about it. You'd have to meet a cop that A) knows about bikes, B) knows the LAMS rules, and C) is either properly pedantic, or having an extremely bad day and D) to fail the attitude test. Particularly if it's not an obviously after market can.

D) would be the usual reason ... depending on what reason ... the cop had stopped you for anyway.


My 2cents anyway.

Value for money.

[98tls]

If his luck is as good as mine ... the first booze check-point he finds himself at ... will have a cop that owns one, and knows the lam's laws well.

And depending on the circumstances of the stop ... and attitude of the rider (and cop) at the time. A complience notice may also be issued (on suspicion of non-complience of LAM's regulations). Which is not a ticket ... but still costs.

The risk is his ... but are the 6 or so horses gained worth the possible extra costs ... if he is caught.

The OP himself can decide that.

:laugh:I was up in Timaru the other day,on my way to the Suzuki shop up there, i ended up with a cop on my arse,i pull over and stop at the bike shop,so does he,he says "is that a 98" :confused:im thinking "wtf" then upon walking round the bike he says "well it was a TL1000":laugh:Turned out a nice bloke who had one the same frogsnot green way back,no mention of any legal issues re front end etc,he loved it.

[FJRider]

:laugh:I was up in Timaru the other day,on my way to the Suzuki shop up there, i ended up with a cop on my arse,i pull over and stop at the bike shop,so does he,he says "is that a 98" :confused:im thinking "wtf" then upon walking round the bike he says "well it was a TL1000":laugh:Turned out a nice bloke who had one the same frogsnot green way back,no mention of any legal issues re front end etc,he loved it.

Some cops do ride bikes ... some older one's may be ex MOT. They started their careers on bikes.

Did he like the piss yellow ???

[Glowerss]

Don't try to bring logic to legislation discussions ...


Actually ... motorcycles that have restrictions that can be removed are NOT on the allowed list.



Yeah, fair enough all around. Like I said, was probably just reading intent rather then actual fact, based on my latest dealings with the NZTA ( We didnt "MEAN" to leave up the document saying you could finish up your L and R process under the old system).

Minor point though, there are heaps of restricted bikes on the LAMS list where the restrictions can be removed. Nearly all of them in fact. Just with varying degrees of expense and difficulty. There are a few bikes on the list made specifically for LAMS type laws, but most of em are simply the same bike with some ways shoved in to restrict power output. From what I was reading ages ago, a lot of em are restricted either at the ECU or carbs. The hyobags I think it was you used to just replace a bit in the carbs and off you go.

[Subike]

Wait for it......the master will have a reply soon

[98tls]

Some cops do ride bikes ... some older one's may be ex MOT. They started their careers on bikes.

Did he like the piss yellow ???

Must ave,as i said mate he once had one the same colour which is why he wanted a look i suppose.anyways oi with the piss yellow eh,bit large coming from someone that sits down to piss.:laugh:

[FJRider]

Wait for it......the master will have a reply soon

It's a really simple reply ..... I'll highlight the important bit (and think carefully on its implied implications)

ANY modifications for the purpose of increasing horsepower is forbidden.

Regardless if the modifications are simple or not.

Key words ... for the purpose of ...



The master has spoken ...

[Dave-]

It's a really simple reply ..... I'll highlight the important bit (and think carefully on its implied implications)

ANY modifications for the purpose of increasing horsepower is forbidden.

Regardless if the modifications are simple or not.

Key words ... for the purpose of ...



The master has spoken ...

so paint them fluro

"It's for the purpose of safety officer"

To be honest I dunno why I get so worked up about this shit, I quit road riding, my fuckin' bike doesn't even have headlights.

Fuckit.
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