So many choices

[superjackal]

Hi

Being new to motorcycles, one of the most enjoyable aspects has been researching what to buy next. I have about 12 months to go before I can sit my full (thanks to the regulatory changes) but I’ve narrowed down my choices somewhat. My clear favourite so far is Triumph’s Street Triple. Other favourites include:

Triumph Street Triple
BMW S1000RR
Triumph Speed Triple
Harley Davidson Seventy-Two
Kawasaki Z1000
Triumph Daytona 675
Kawasaki Ninja ZX636
Triumph Bonneville America

I’m sure many others will pop up on the radar over the next 12 months.

My question is what these bikes are like day to day. I ride about 40kms each day and part of the reason I went 2 wheels was to save on gas and cut through traffic easily.

My budget’s about $20k and I want to buy new (never had a new car or bike – this is a once off treat). As much as I like the idea of a BMW1000RR, I can’t see myself going with a bike with that much power and price tag. I’m “flexible” with speed limits and I don’t want to end up a messy pulp biting off more than I can chew.

Can anyone recommend a good middle weight, easy on gas when you want it to be, great through traffic, lots of fun to ride, bike for about $20K?

Cheers
GNJ

[James Deuce]

Street Triple. Best engine ever and easy to ride well, as well as being light on its feet and easy handle when pushing it around.

It sounds to me like you are going on looks with some of those choices so your best bet is to start sitting on some of them prior to upgrading, at the very least. I'd wait until I had my full and book a bunch of test rides then make your mind up. Buyer regret after making a poorly researched decision is a bitch, especially so with motorcycles as ergonomics make up such a huge part of the riding experience.

"Your First Big Bike(tm)" should be as easy to manage as possible while still pushing some limbic system buttons.

[Maha]

Out of that list, the Striple would be #1 choice...like this primo example--->> http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=543636810
Ultimately, you will have to ride, then decide.

[Subike]

+_1 for the Stripple,would own one myself if I had good control of my right wrist, fantastic bike, poss one of the top 10 ever produced

[\m/]

Any one of them will be a big step up from a GN250, so out of the bikes you listed the 675s and ZX6R would probably be the most sensible choices.

My question is what these bikes are like day to day. I ride about 40kms each day and part of the reason I went 2 wheels was to save on gas and cut through traffic easily.
The riding position of a sportbike should be fine for your 40k commute, I ride 50ks each way to/from work and it's perfectly comfortable, though it does get a bit sore on long trips. My 750 uses about 5L/100k on my mostly open road commute, 600s would use about the same, 1000s a bit more. Be warned though that what you save on petrol you spend on tires.

[skippa1]

I can only see one choice.....what do you think it may be?

[James Deuce]

The riding position of a sportbike should be fine for your 40k commute.

Maybe. A 1994 RVF400 is MUCH more comfortable than a 2012 R6. MUCH.

For me.

Ergonomics are REALLY personal and often just sitting on a bike doesn't give the full impact of the stress you are putting on different joints and muscles until you ride it. The R6 made me cry in about 3 kms. The RVF I commuted 76kms in each direction on with no issue.

[superjackal]

It sounds to me like you are going on looks with some of those choices so your best bet is to start sitting on some of them prior to upgrading, at the very least.

Can't deny some of it is about looks, though some would argue there's not a lot pretty about the Street Triple. I think it looks a bit like Mick Jagger.

Feel a little guilty about wasting salesmen's time but then, I guess, it is my $$$ at the end.

[Subike]

A good salesperson does not mind having his time wasted, a bad sales man just wants your money,
Sitting on bikes to experience the feel is all part of the search, a salesperson who does not allow that is not going to sell many bikes.
The Stripple might have a bit to be desired in some peoples eyes, but once you have ridden one, the looks dont matter anymore

[Banditbandit]

From that list - any of the Triumphs or the 675 Ninja ... but none on that list would be my first choice of bikes for daily transport adn weekend fun ...

But hey - go with what you want ...

[skippa1]

Hi

Being new to motorcycles, one of the most enjoyable aspects has been researching what to buy next. I have about 12 months to go before I can sit my full (thanks to the regulatory changes) but I’ve narrowed down my choices somewhat. My clear favourite so far is Triumph’s Street Triple. Other favourites include:

Triumph Street Triple
BMW S1000RR
Triumph Speed Triple
Harley Davidson Seventy-Two
Kawasaki Z1000
Triumph Daytona 675
Kawasaki Ninja ZX636
Triumph Bonneville America

I’m sure many others will pop up on the radar over the next 12 months.

My question is what these bikes are like day to day. I ride about 40kms each day and part of the reason I went 2 wheels was to save on gas and cut through traffic easily.

My budget’s about $20k and I want to buy new (never had a new car or bike – this is a once off treat). As much as I like the idea of a BMW1000RR, I can’t see myself going with a bike with that much power and price tag. I’m “flexible” with speed limits and I don’t want to end up a messy pulp biting off more than I can chew.

Can anyone recommend a good middle weight, easy on gas when you want it to be, great through traffic, lots of fun to ride, bike for about $20K?

Cheers
GNJ
I will give you a hand,


Triumph Street Triple - good resale value, good commuting position, got some street cred and ample power
BMW S1000RR - from a GN250? You already think it is too fast and you cant afford it
Triumph Speed Triple - from a GN250?
Harley Davidson Seventy-Two - easy reach to the ground, docile power delivery, got some street cred, good resale value
Kawasaki Z1000 - from a GN250?
Triumph Daytona 675 - I wouldnt have thought it was a great choice for commuting
Kawasaki Ninja ZX636 - I wouldnt have thought it was a great choice for commuting
Triumph Bonneville America - a bit too docile in power delivery, poor ground clearance, heavy for what it is

Striple if you are looking for sporty, HD if you are looking for cruisey

[skinman]

With the exception of the 72 all the bikes listed are pretty good if the ego's work for you
its not that I am knocking Harleys its just the 72 is strictly designed for short runs as its got a pathetic tank, bugger all suspension, terrible brakes, and thats what the reviewers say so I would hate to actually ride one.

could suggest that going from a GN you keep to a relatively easy bike to manage, either light or with the weight low down.

have fun shopping & dont be afraid to ask to ride any bike you might want to buy...you are the one spending the money.

suggest you go into shops wearing sensible gear for riding as you will be taken more seriously.

[superjackal]

From that list - any of the Triumphs or the 675 Ninja ... but none on that list would be my first choice of bikes for daily transport adn weekend fun ...

But hey - go with what you want ...

So, what would you recommend? I'm completely open to ideas.

[superjackal]

I will give you a hand,


Triumph Street Triple - good resale value, good commuting position, got some street cred and ample power
BMW S1000RR - from a GN250? You already think it is too fast and you cant afford it
Triumph Speed Triple - from a GN250?
Harley Davidson Seventy-Two - easy reach to the ground, docile power delivery, got some street cred, good resale value
Kawasaki Z1000 - from a GN250?
Triumph Daytona 675 - I wouldnt have thought it was a great choice for commuting
Kawasaki Ninja ZX636 - I wouldnt have thought it was a great choice for commuting
Triumph Bonneville America - a bit too docile in power delivery, poor ground clearance, heavy for what it is

Striple if you are looking for sporty, HD if you are looking for cruisey

Regarding the big sports bikes, that's part of my concern, they're a big step up from a GN but I'm told you get used to the power pretty quickly. I think the Striple's a good step up I'd probably keep for a long time.

The negative's I've heard about the 72 is not much power and pretty uncomfortable riding position. I sat on one at Wellington Motorcycles and while it looked good, it's wider then it looks and the seating was... uh... uncomfortable. Gorgeous looking bike though and a great price.

What kind of fuel do the HDs use? I'm told they can be frugal.

[iYRe]

going to any of those from a gn250 seems mad to me..

Go for a 600.. any number of them are decent.. gsx, z, etc.. go have a look at fast bikes mag, they regularly write up reviews on exactly this sort of thing, various riders and bikes, and compare.

[Subike]

Have you noticed most of us have recommended the physically smaller and lighter bikes?
The stripple being probably the smallest and lightest of your list. Thats why I agreed and said it.
I concur with what other people are saying about the 72, its a posers bike, not a riders bike, an 883 std sportster would be more fun IMO.
But do look at the mid range bikes around the 500 - 650 cc area, plenty of good ones to be had, a good step up from your GN.
Don't toss aside our recommendations, as some of them come from riders with many years and miles behind us.
We want to see you still enjoying yourself in 30 years time, Not becoming another statistic in 3 mths because you went toooooo big toooooo soon. Cheers and enjoy the journey of shopping

[\m/]

What kind of fuel do the HDs use? I'm told they can be frugal.
Don't know what the fuel economy is like but it has a pathetic 7.9l tank, smaller than your GN.

[superjackal]

Have you noticed most of us have recommended the physically smaller and lighter bikes?

Would you say the Striple falls into that category?

I have thought about a 500-600cc bike as another interim before a big bike. But which one???

What would be a good LAMS approved intermediate step? To be honest, the GN is frustratingly underpowered (I do lots of motorway travel). On the way to work this morning the Wellington headwind reduced my speed on the motorway down to 75kph.

The LAMS Ducati Monster 659 looks good, but pricey. Hyosung's GT650RNL looks like fun...

[Subike]

I am sure very soon, there will be someone who will come along and give you some good ideas on the lams sportier style of bike, Im more into cruzers, so would recommend the XVS Yamaha 650 Star. But I believe there are some great bikes out there for around the 10k you have, that will more than meet your interest and ability. Mossy, Drew, PaulNZ, Greywolf, Conquiztador being members who IMO would give you good direction. But in the end it comes down to your choice, there are others who will just say get on a 1000 and ride it.....you will learn. But.....:sweatdrop

[HappyGOriding]

How bout the new GSR750? Looks way cool but dont know much about it apart from being an inline four

[Subike]

How bout the new GSR750? Looks way cool but dont know much about it apart from being an inline four

not a lams bike

[HappyGOriding]

not a lams bike

yeah I know but neither were the others on the OP list

[nerrrd]

What would be a good LAMS approved intermediate step? To be honest, the GN is frustratingly underpowered (I do lots of motorway travel). On the way to work this morning the Wellington headwind reduced my speed on the motorway down to 75kph.

I like the look of the kawasaki mid range 650s, er6n, ninja 650r, there are LAMS approved versions available this year but they're not cheap (around $16,000), I've not ridden them, but they come across as midway between a sports bike and commuter.

Or you could go for a mighty BMW 650 single like mine! Less raw power but cheaper to run, versatile and pretty good value new (G650GS around $13,000.) A bit of a tractor compared to a sports bike, though.

And I've seen some negative net chatter around about quality issues with some new Beemers, but there's a 2 year warranty, so YMMV.

[Glowerss]

Would you say the Striple falls into that category?

I have thought about a 500-600cc bike as another interim before a big bike. But which one???

What would be a good LAMS approved intermediate step? To be honest, the GN is frustratingly underpowered (I do lots of motorway travel). On the way to work this morning the Wellington headwind reduced my speed on the motorway down to 75kph.

The LAMS Ducati Monster 659 looks good, but pricey. Hyosung's GT650RNL looks like fun...

A LAMS approved intermediate step would be a GS500. Get you off your ginny for not too much overlay for the next year, give you a good bonus step. Nice power, look decent, not too expensive. Newerish ones are pretty cheap.

I'd avoid the restricted for LAMS bikes. They're almost always going to be heavy and massively underpowered because they weren't designed to be that way.

An RVF400 is another LAMS bike that would last you into your full. Never ridden one personally, but at 63 BHP they've got a fair bit of power, and they handle pretty damn well.


As for non LAMS bikes that would suit your criteria, there's a lot of stuff out there. If you don't HAVE to buy new, consider things like the Honda hornet 600/900, 750 katana.

Otherwise, some other suggestions would be SV650s/gladius/v-strom. All are great bikes and would probably be more suited to all round use then a full on 120+ BHP sportsbike. Especially jumping off of a Gn250.

Otherwise the little triple would be a better idea. Or a GSR750 which are fairly tame by most accounts.

There's a shit of a lot of choice out there.

[Blackbird]

I've owned a Street Triple for over 3 years now and love it to bits. I've actually come from a bigger bike so can probably offer a slightly different perspective.

Here are my 2 real world takes on owning a Striple. The first is an early comparison with my much-loved Honda Blackbird and the second is a longer term review of the Striple by itself.

http://geoffjames.blogspot.co.nz/2010/01/street-triple-vs-blackbird-some.html

http://geoffjames.blogspot.co.nz/2010/08/triumph-street-triple-review-revisited.html

Hope you find them useful.

Cheers,

Geoff

[bosslady]

Don't underestimate the power of some of the bikes you've listed. My flatmate has a BMW S1000RR, upgraded from a Kawasaki Ninja ZX6R even for him (track only bikes) it was a big step up. The GN250 whilst a good learner bike, is a snail! I'd not dream of going from my GN to the Beemer, but then I don't have a death wish, nor anything to (over) compensate for, lol. Besides it's a gass guzzler compared to the Ninja from my observation.

[Hitcher]

Test ride a Z1000. They do most things pretty darned well. Ultimately the only reliable indicator is saddle time and finding a bike that suits you really well. One size does not fit all, when it comes to motorcycles.

[nakedsv]

I dont have any experience with big bikes but moved from a vl250 cruiser to an sv650 and have found it a great all round bike, easy to control power but enough that I can comfortably do long rides with my wife on the back. Seems to me that the 650-750 range is a good step up from a 250. Must admit though if I had the cash when buying my bike I would have probably gone for the street triple.

[superjackal]

Otherwise the little triple would be a better idea. Or a GSR750 which are fairly tame by most accounts.

There's a shit of a lot of choice out there.

Oooooh! The GSR750 is a nice looking machine!

[Gremlin]

Regarding the big sports bikes, that's part of my concern, they're a big step up from a GN but I'm told you get used to the power pretty quickly. I think the Striple's a good step up I'd probably keep for a long time.
If your only experience of motorcycling so far has been the GN, mate, you truly have no idea just how fast big bikes will accelerate, and therein lies the danger. Sure, if you have a controlled right hand and can say hand on heart you'll be restrained, maybe the 1L bikes will be OK, but I would advise against it.

Step to something mid range and well ridden, the bigger capacity won't have much of an edge on the road anyway, as it's difficult to get the power down properly. The main differences are apparent at high speed (200+) and a lot more torque in bigger bikes, so you cruise in a higher gear. Anything you buy isn't going to be as frugal as a GN as well. Only thing mid range that will probably get close is the Honda NC700S and NC700X.

Wait until you have the full before test riding, as it's very personal. Don't buy what we want, buy what you like and feels comfortable and suits you. Other option is to step up to a LAMS bike now, so that when you have your full you have more experience with bigger bikes.

[Insanity_rules]

Ride them all then decide. I personally like the street triple myself as a commuter bike. Good position, not too many faults and a great weekend runner too. Daytona would also be good once you've gotten used to the sports bike crouch.

[superjackal]

Only thing mid range that will probably get close is the Honda NC700S and NC700X.



Hey thanks, those are really nice bikes I hadn't heard of.

Don't know if you remember, but I can assure you the wait for a bigger bike is agony. If the g'ment hadn't changed the rules I'd have my full by now!

[Maha]

Regarding the big sports bikes, that's part of my concern, they're a big step up from a GN but I'm told you get used to the power pretty quickly. I think the Striple's a good step up I'd probably keep for a long time.



In a way thats true, when I had a GN, I wanted and bought a 600 Yamaha sports bike, and to be honest, although I loved the bike, it wasn't long before the 'want bigger' entered my head. So sold the Yamaha and bought Triumph Sprint.
But its still the best way to go...250-600. If I had it all over again, and the street triple was around, I would have one...no question.

Think about the difference in HP...GN = 22hp? Kawasaki Z1 = 130-140 hp?

[superjackal]

Think about the difference in HP...GN = 22hp? Kawasaki Z1 = 130-140 hp?

I'm glad (and sad) that I came to bikes later in life. Being a father makes you consider your driving choices differently. I'm not a bullet-proof 20 yr old with something to prove. I want a bike I'll keep for a long time that will give me plenty of enjoyment.

Believe it or not, the sensation of speed is very present on a GN250. Just today I was wringing her out on the way to work. Head tucked behind the bars, knees tucked in tight to the tank. Near 100kph in a headwind! Feels like you're doing 200kph. Got a few bemused looks from cars as they passed me though! :2thumbsup

Will a horse whip make my GN go faster?

[superjackal]

I've owned a Street Triple for over 3 years now and love it to bits. I've actually come from a bigger bike so can probably offer a slightly different perspective.

Here are my 2 real world takes on owning a Striple. The first is an early comparison with my much-loved Honda Blackbird and the second is a longer term review of the Striple by itself.

http://geoffjames.blogspot.co.nz/2010/01/street-triple-vs-blackbird-some.html

http://geoffjames.blogspot.co.nz/2010/08/triumph-street-triple-review-revisited.html

Hope you find them useful.

Cheers,

Geoff

Thoroughly enjoyed your articles, thanks. Makes me want one even more.

[Garfield]

I was thinking I wanted to jump up to a big bike from my 250 as soon as I had my full. I test rode a Bandit 1200 and realised that adrenalin was brown and runny. I thought that the more sensible approach would be to step up in increments and i decided to look at the 600 range and eventually settled on the Bandit 600 which I love to bits. Perhaps in a couple of years I might go up to the bigger bikes but for the moment I am more than happy.
BUT each to their own. :yes:

[Jackal]

Buy a bike that suits your KB name.....

276190

[superjackal]

Buy a bike that suits your KB name.....

Excellent suggestion!

[JafaSaffer]

Stay off a litre bike for at least a few more years. Around a 600cc would be my recommendation.

BMW S1000RR - don't even start thinking that way until you have at least 3 VERY solid years of 600cc riding behind you. Expensive bike and it will happily throw you off if its not respected.

Triumph Street Triple gets my vote.

[Old Steve]

Go round the dealers and sit on them. When I got my full license the local Triumph dealer let me take a Street triple for a ride. Way to tall for my short legs, I could only touch the ground with my toes. Riding it was something else - would be very easy to lose my license.

In the end I chose a Suzuki Boulevard M50, 805 cc cruiser. Comfortable lower seat, so it was easy to stand flat footed at the lights, low centre of gravity made it easier to handle, more powerful than my learner 250 so I could finally pass cars on the open road. Large tank, 275 km range - more if the right hand was constrained.

But you'll have to choose the bike which suits you. Dealers shouldn't mind you going in and kicking tyres. If they get used to you they'll be more likely to offer you a test ride when you get your full license.

Though I'd still recommend a secondhand bike as your first bigger bike, same applies as for your learner bike, you might lay it down, forget the side stand, it'll be heavier and more liable to fall over at slow speed.

[Blackbird]

Go round the dealers and sit on them. When I got my full license the local Triumph dealer let me take a Street triple for a ride. Way to tall for my short legs, I could only touch the ground with my toes. Riding it was something else - would be very easy to lose my license.

One of our female riders in IAM faced the same dilemma as she's 5ft tall. However, the dealer sourced an adjustable dogbone kit for her Triple which allows her to plant her feet firmly now it's lowered. They're available for quite a lot of bikes and at least it extends your range of options. :niceone:

[superjackal]

Though I'd still recommend a secondhand bike as your first bigger bike, same applies as for your learner bike, you might lay it down, forget the side stand, it'll be heavier and more liable to fall over at slow speed.

That's good advice, hadn't thought of dropping a new bike. Perhaps a LAMs intermediate woudl be the way to go. I like the look of the Suzuki GS500 as an intermediate.

[arcane12]

In theory a _good_ LAMS intermediate bike should hold it's price nicely as there will be many cannier (or better advised) new riders looking for something like that.

Of course you can always do what I did and get what sounds like a good intermediate bike that does not suit you physcially and still be 'stuck' on something till your full :P

Still, I do enjoy it, just whish it was a bit bigger (with the same engine). I hope I pick something better next time! I guess I should have just test rode everything I could so I could get a good feel of the 'range'. I just felt bad about testing something I was not that serious about.

[superjackal]

In theory a _good_ LAMS intermediate bike should hold it's price nicely as there will be many cannier (or better advised) new riders looking for something like that.

Of course you can always do what I did and get what sounds like a good intermediate bike that does not suit you physcially and still be 'stuck' on something till your full :P

Still, I do enjoy it, just whish it was a bit bigger (with the same engine). I hope I pick something better next time! I guess I should have just test rode everything I could so I could get a good feel of the 'range'. I just felt bad about testing something I was not that serious about.

Yes, I just can't make up my mind. Having worked in Sales myself I can't stand tyre kickers. I think 18 months is too long for older drivers. To be honest, I'm not really interested in any mid-range bikes under the LAMs category. I'll probably just slug it out on the GN.

[Glowerss]

Yes, I just can't make up my mind. Having worked in Sales myself I can't stand tyre kickers. I think 18 months is too long for older drivers. To be honest, I'm not really interested in any mid-range bikes under the LAMs category. I'll probably just slug it out on the GN.

Find an RVF400 that isn't stupidly priced. At some 63+ BHP It shouldn't be a LAMS bike, but it is. Got that sexy V4 engine, looks the business, and just about anyone who has one doesn't want to let em go :bleh:

Course that's assuming you A) fit on the thing and B) can handle the riding position :laugh:

Be a hoot and a half though! I'd fully own one if I could afford it :devil2:

[arcane12]

Yes, I just can't make up my mind. Having worked in Sales myself I can't stand tyre kickers. I think 18 months is too long for older drivers. To be honest, I'm not really interested in any mid-range bikes under the LAMs category. I'll probably just slug it out on the GN.

Well good luck with that! You may have more patience than me. When I found out it was going to be another 18 months (I missed out by a couple of months, if only I had started 2-3 months earlier), I started looking for my LAMS bike. The idea was it would have become my full bike. But due to how much I had to spend, an inexperience with bikes I choose poorly for my needs.

The Boulevard is a great commuter, but poor tourer. It lacks long distance comfort (for me particularly, but my friend also commented on it a little while ago too). Also a 10L tank reduces the range to a little over 200km. As far as I can see a bike like my friends (a 750 Honda Shadow) would have been perfect, but for LAMS. It's power to weight is easily within the limits, it's not that much heavier than my bike, but just putting itself out of the running due to the 750. It's got a bigger tank, and is much more comfortable to sit on.

I am seriously considering getting one on my full! But this time I will go for some longish rides on some sport bikes, tourers, and others to find 'my' bike. I guess the wait might mean I have saved a bit more money to get something real decent!

[arcane12]

Find an RVF400 that isn't stupidly priced. At some 63+ BHP It shouldn't be a LAMS bike, but it is. Got that sexy V4 engine, looks the business, and just about anyone who has one doesn't want to let em go :bleh:

Course that's assuming you A) fit on the thing and B) can handle the riding position :laugh:

Be a hoot and a half though! I'd fully own one if I could afford it :devil2:

53 BHP stock according to the interwebs. That would put it at around 140ish kw/t depending on wet weight. Close to limit, so one of the quicker ones, if you can find a well looked after almost 20yr old bike!

[Glowerss]

53 BHP stock according to the interwebs. That would put it at around 140ish kw/t depending on wet weight. Close to limit, so one of the quicker ones, if you can find a well looked after almost 20yr old bike!

Yeah, go find some Dynos of bone stock RVFs. They put out more then 53 at the wheel. With a few simple mods like rejetting and a new muffler, some of them got up to nearly 60 at the wheel.

Meaning they're slightly more than what the VFR 400s put out (which aren't LAMS compliant). VFR 400s were quoted around 61.

Anyone whose ever ridding an RVF400 could probably tell you they really shouldn't be a LAMS bike :laugh:

[superjackal]

Well good luck with that! You may have more patience than me. When I found out it was going to be another 18 months (I missed out by a couple of months, if only I had started 2-3 months earlier), I started looking for my LAMS bike. The idea was it would have become my full bike. But due to how much I had to spend, an inexperience with bikes I choose poorly for my needs.

The Boulevard is a great commuter, but poor tourer. It lacks long distance comfort (for me particularly, but my friend also commented on it a little while ago too). Also a 10L tank reduces the range to a little over 200km. As far as I can see a bike like my friends (a 750 Honda Shadow) would have been perfect, but for LAMS. It's power to weight is easily within the limits, it's not that much heavier than my bike, but just putting itself out of the running due to the 750. It's got a bigger tank, and is much more comfortable to sit on.

I am seriously considering getting one on my full! But this time I will go for some longish rides on some sport bikes, tourers, and others to find 'my' bike. I guess the wait might mean I have saved a bit more money to get something real decent!

I've looked at the Boulevard - looks like a big GN?

18 months is too long. Torture really. Thanks god I don't have to go through the learner stage like that!

Wonder who came up with 18 months. Seems like an arbitrary number to me. Makes sense for 18yr olds but for people with 20 years on the road? C'mon....

[arcane12]

Yeah, go find some Dynos of bone stock RVFs. They put out more then 53 at the wheel. With a few simple mods like rejetting and a new muffler, some of them got up to nearly 60 at the wheel.

Meaning they're slightly more than what the VFR 400s put out (which aren't LAMS compliant). VFR 400s were quoted around 61.

Anyone whose ever ridding an RVF400 could probably tell you they really shouldn't be a LAMS bike :laugh:

If that's the case they probably aren't LAMS compliant then. The law states that it must be on the list AND comply with the 660cc limit AND the 150kw/t limit. So if it does not comply (either by mistaken addtion to list, or modifications) then no go. Also with mods, even if it keeps it inside the limits it's a no go. Any increase to power to weight rules it out. :( Until you get you full :D


I've looked at the Boulevard - looks like a big GN?

18 months is too long. Torture really. Thanks god I don't have to go through the learner stage like that!

Wonder who came up with 18 months. Seems like an arbitrary number to me. Makes sense for 18yr olds but for people with 20 years on the road? C'mon....

:laugh: A big GN, I'm hurt :bleh: *looks at google image search* :blink: Ok I see what you mean, but not so much in reality. I can see why GN's get listed as cruisers sometimes then.

It's all arbitary numbers really. Riding hours is probably better. Otherwise it might as well not have any time factor. But how do you accurately track hours in the saddle? It's a hard job coming up with a good system that ticks all the boxes - affordable, reliably trainder riders/drivers, and is measurable.

[superjackal]

If that's the case they probably aren't LAMS compliant then. The law states that it must be on the list AND comply with the 660cc limit AND the 150kw/t limit. So if it does not comply (either by mistaken addtion to list, or modifications) then no go. Also with mods, even if it keeps it inside the limits it's a no go. Any increase to power to weight rules it out. :( Until you get you full :D



:laugh: A big GN, I'm hurt :bleh: *looks at google image search* :blink: Ok I see what you mean, but not so much in reality. I can see why GN's get listed as cruisers sometimes then.

It's all arbitary numbers really. Riding hours is probably better. Otherwise it might as well not have any time factor. But how do you accurately track hours in the saddle? It's a hard job coming up with a good system that ticks all the boxes - affordable, reliably trainder riders/drivers, and is measurable.

Heh heh, sorry, if you read my posts, I'm a huge GN fan so it was a compliment!

I guess 18 months was thought through carefully. I just don't think it should apply to me. Like speed limits. :rolleyes:

[Banditbandit]

So, what would you recommend? I'm completely open to ideas.

Bandits, of course - or the new TNAB the GSX...F range ... 600/1200 or 650/1250 ... excellent all round bike .. (and probably more than you can handle straight from a GN) ... the 650 would be a good learning curve

Seriously - have a look at one ... someone said "The Bandit is a bike no-one wants - ubntil a mate gets one."

[Banditbandit]

Oooooh! The GSR750 is a nice looking machine!

Yeah very pretty - a real riders bike - unlike the wanky versions of the GSXR1000 ...

You'll either scare yourself shitless or die ...

[arcane12]

Heh heh, sorry, if you read my posts, I'm a huge GN fan so it was a compliment!

I guess 18 months was thought through carefully. I just don't think it should apply to me. Like speed limits. :rolleyes:

Oh good. I think. :D

I don't know how much thought was put into it over 'We need to change this. Ok, how about we make them take more time? Anyone got any better ideas? Nope, to hard. Ok extend the time it is.' I jest, but I wouldn't put it past them to go for easiest solution over a more complicated, but more fair solution. Look at the cc rating on LAMS. It should have been thrown out completely. And if they think people will get onto bikes that are too heavy without being powerful, then set a weight limit. They must have had the weights to work out kw/t! Or reserved the right for discretion as it still has to be on the list as well as the other factors. 'Not on list, no go. You can apply for an exemption if you want'.

[Gremlin]

I guess 18 months was thought through carefully. I just don't think it should apply to me. Like speed limits. :rolleyes:
Guys, there are threads covering the LAMS rules, but, in short, under the old system there were approved courses to reduce your time on licence, and under the new system there are courses. The courses themselves have changed, and there are far less providers (3 across the country).

Have a look, and see which provider is in your region. It's still very new, as the courses were only recently announced.

[JimmyC]

I didn't know any such course were available yet. This from NZTA - In late 2013, the NZ Transport Agency expects to introduce a competency based training and assessment (CBTA) course as an alternative path to progress through the restricted and full licensing stages. Once developed, applicants who successfully complete this course will be able to present a CBTA certificate at the agent in lieu of some graduated licensing system requirements.

[superjackal]

Guys, there are threads covering the LAMS rules, but, in short, under the old system there were approved courses to reduce your time on licence, and under the new system there are courses. The courses themselves have changed, and there are far less providers (3 across the country).

Have a look, and see which provider is in your region. It's still very new, as the courses were only recently announced.

There are plans to introduce courses which will reduce the time but nothing available yet. I reckon it'll take around, ooh, say... 18 months to come up with another curriculum? By which time.....

[JimmyC]

I'll give them 11 months... by which stage I'll have been on my restricted for 12 and be just in time! ;-)

[Jkmorris25]

I can't believe that a 750 honda shadow is not in the lams, why not! power to ratio is fine! Why stop at a cc rating some of the 600cc are a faster and more dangerous, once again another rule that doesn't make it very fear for the road user come on guys can you get right for once, all your doing is following other rules made up by other country's (aus) less homework for the Nzta I guess.


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[lukemc1878]

I can't believe that a 750 honda shadow is not in the lams, why not! power to ratio is fine! Why stop at a cc rating some of the 600cc are a faster and more dangerous, once again another rule that doesn't make it very fear for the road user come on guys can you get right for once, all your doing is following other rules made up by other country's (aus) less homework for the Nzta I guess.


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they are focused on the CC over the power to weight ratio the sheer weight of some of the harley's compared to a 600cc honda cbr is insanity

[quickbuck]

There are plans to introduce courses which will reduce the time but nothing available yet. I reckon it'll take around, ooh, say... 18 months to come up with another curriculum? By which time.....




Actually they are available very soon. Click on the big banner in my signature, or visit www.rideforever.co.nz to find a provider in your area.





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[quickbuck]

they are focused on the CC over the power to weight ratio the sheer weight of some of the harley's compared to a 600cc honda cbr is insanity




Ummm, a CBR600 is NOT a LAMS approved bike, so not sure of your point.
CBR500 is a very different machine....





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[Gremlin]

Ummm, a CBR600 is NOT a LAMS approved bike, so not sure of your point.
CBR500 is a very different machine....
Except just to confuse things, Honda is releasing a CBR650R (whether that moniker stays for NZ is unknown)... LAMS? Who knows...

Honda doesn't have nearly enough bikes in the mid range now :facepalm:

[ggreen]

I have fallen for these things, and that will certainly be my next move.

[Larksea]

I really wanna know if the CB650F will release in NZ. Anyone know?

man, do people jump from a GN250 to a big bike? I can imagine that going from a 20hp kitten to a much heavier 60+hp beast must be like learning to ride all over again.

[Banditbandit]

I can't believe that a 750 honda shadow is not in the lams, why not! power to ratio is fine! Why stop at a cc rating some of the 600cc are a faster and more dangerous, once again another rule that doesn't make it very fear for the road user come on guys can you get right for once, all your doing is following other rules made up by other country's (aus) less homework for the Nzta I guess.


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They might not have done a LAMS assessment on it yet ..

[Gremlin]

They might not have done a LAMS assessment on it yet ..
745cc. It won't comply as it's over 660cc.

[Grashopper]

man, do people jump from a GN250 to a big bike? I can imagine that going from a 20hp kitten to a much heavier 60+hp beast must be like learning to ride all over again.
I went to a 40hp Spada from a GN and that was a huge jump lol

[Larksea]

I went to a 40hp Spada from a GN and that was a huge jump lol

yeah vt250, my bike is not as bad as a GN its been a good learner bike and its about 26-27hp. its good because I can zip around town and cruise at 100-120 on the open road but I can't go apeshit on it.

I've got myself a project bike to fix up for when I get my full but its a 82 vf750 and should be around the 80hp mark.

Its probably a good thing the vf750 wont be ready to ride by the time i have my full in a couple months :) Gonna get my full, sell the vt250 get a cb500f, duke or an mt03 while I keep working on the vf750 get some more experience before I jump on something with 80 ponies that can hit 200k/h in a blink.

[Vinz0r]

If that's the case they probably aren't LAMS compliant then. The law states that it must be on the list AND comply with the 660cc limit AND the 150kw/t limit. So if it does not comply (either by mistaken addtion to list, or modifications) then no go. Also with mods, even if it keeps it inside the limits it's a no go. Any increase to power to weight rules it out. :( Until you get you full :D


The funny thing about the RVF is that the NZTA go by the factory specified horsepower when deciding whether to add the bike to the LAMS list. As everyone knows, the factory specified horsepower of the RVF is quite a bit lower than what it's actually making in the real world. So in stock form with no modifications it's over the 150kw/t limit, but is still technically a LAMS bike.

[TheJZA]

What’s everyone’s thoughts on the CBR650R vs MT-09 as a second bike? I have an MT-07 LA now but already planning my next bike like everyone else haha. I think the CBR650R looks awesome, has 94Hp and 64Nm with a beautiful howl when you rev it up. The MT-09 is significantly more powerful at 115Hp and 88Nm but I’ve heard it’s a bit of a monster and I also don’t think it looks anywhere near as cool as the CBR650R. I’ve calculated power to weight ratios including my weight of approx 110kg with gear and the MT is next level powerful both for Hp and torque. They’re both similarly priced so even though the engines are different size I think they still both compete for my money. Another bike I’ve considered is the VFR800 but it seems to be a bit too heavy and not a huge amount of power but it does have some nice features and it’s an attractive bike. Thoughts?

[Black Knight]

MT-09 all the way mate-or better still XSR900-if you can find one.