Speeding Ticket - Advice!

[PseudoDave]

Hey guys,

Well I just got my first speeding ticket; "alleged speed", 123 in a 100 zone. I was coming down a hill on a long straight on highway 16 with a car in front of me, there was a police car coming the other way with another car in front of him. He clocks me, I didnt even see him. About 5 min later, I am pulled over and issued the ticket. $170 fine and 35 points...

Here is the thing, I have it all on camera (GoPro). My speedo overclocks by 8% as measured by GPS.. This I can confirm!

Looking at the video, I come down the hill at a speed of 121 (111 Kph real speed), hit a few bumps on the lead up to a bridge, this is when my speed jumps to 133 (123 real) kph, and within a second (literally timed in the video), I drop back down to 121 Kph, about 5 seconds later, I pass the police car, I was doing 116 (108) Kph on my speedo, still with the other car about 20 meters in front of me the whole way. I have another min of video with me just following the car at the same speed.

Question, is it worth trying to get this fixed? I was behind this other car the whole way and looking at the video, I was over the speed limit by an average of about 8-11 kph real speed for 30 seconds either side of the police car pinging me, except for around a second when i hit the bumps (you can see the camera shake in the video).. I ride a GSXR1000 and the throttle is a little sensitive at times, the bumps must of just nudged my wrist (sounds like an excuse, I know, but looking at the video, you can not see my wrist move at all and I do come off the throttle almost instantly).

Thanks for the advice. Never had a ticket before and I think this a little excessive for what happened.

Dave

[Madness]

You were speeding. You got a ticket. Now you should suck it up and pay the ticket and learn that SH16 on any given Sunday is a place where you take your chances if you exceed the posted speed limit.

Did you go from a Hyobag 250 to a GSXR1000? If so, maybe a little throttle control practice is in order?

You're welcome.

[rustic101]

:corn:
This ought to be a good watch given you have already coughed to exceeding the posted limit.

[Rhys]

You are wasting your time, your video shows you are speeding, the cop says you were speeding, game set and match

[Mogwa]

Post the video so we can all be judges, and mabey give some good advice:facepalm:

[FJRider]

:corn:
This ought to be a good watch given you have already coughed to exceeding the posted limit.

AND ... coughed to actually traveling at that speed. Regardless how long you were AT that speed.

Do you have a garden rake and a hill handy ... to push your shit up .. ???

[SMOKEU]

Good luck escaping the tax Nazis.

[PseudoDave]

I didn't deny I was exceeding the posted speed limit, I just think it is a little harsh that I am having to cop to the over 20+ Kph demerit points when I was under that speed for 99% of the time, and have the video to prove it..

I have no problem paying the fine for the lower speed class, I exceeded the speed limit and will pay the consequences, just feel disappointed that I am having the 35 point one for going to the 20+ speed for less than a second (honestly!)..

Having never had a speeding ticket for riding in 10 years, I am just a little miffed.

No I didn't go from a 250 to a 1000, I don't own a car so use the 250 for daily commuting and in the rain. Get good fuel economy and don't mess up my shiny bike. I have owned quite a few other bikes in my time.


Thanks,
Dave

[FJRider]

Post the video so we can all be judges, and mabey give some good advice:facepalm:

Videos can be used as evidence of an illegal act. He might get a ticket ..... oh wait ...

Best advice ... pay the fine.

[Madness]

I was under that speed for 99% of the time

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/sm/custom/8f29036700.jpg

[scumdog]

when I was under that speed for 99% of the time, and have the video to prove it..


Dave

I don't kill people 99% of the time and the bastards still want to do me for murder...:confused:

[Madness]

I don't kill people 99% of the time and the bastards still want to do me for murder...:confused:

If you went over a bump whilst holding the trigger of a gun pointed at somebodys head and said bump caused the unintentional disharge of said weapon, I think you should have got off with a stern talking to.

:facepalm:

[Laava]

I don't kill people 99% of the time and the bastards still want to do me for murder...:confused:

No...it's Marina they want to do you for. And good thing too.

[FJRider]

I didn't deny I was exceeding the posted speed limit, I just think it is a little harsh that I am having to cop to the over 20+ Kph demerit points when I was under that speed for 99% of the time, and have the video to prove it..

I have no problem paying the fine for the lower speed class, I exceeded the speed limit and will pay the consequences, just feel disappointed that I am having the 35 point one for going to the 20+ speed for less than a second (honestly!)..

Having never had a speeding ticket for riding in 10 years, I am just a little miffed.

No I didn't go from a 250 to a 1000, I don't own a car so use the 250 for daily commuting and in the rain. Get good fuel economy and don't mess up my shiny bike. I have owned quite a few other bikes in my time.


Thanks,
Dave

It takes less than a second of consistent speed .... to get a "Locked on" speed ... The cop got lucky. YOU however didn't.

Learn better throttle control as has been suggested. Remember ... two more such tickets and you get to walk for a bit ...

If you don't want more tickets ... stick to the 250.

[tri boy]

Take it international:woohoo:

[PseudoDave]

If you went over a bump whilst holding the trigger of a gun pointed at somebodys head and said bump caused the unintentional disharge of said weapon

:facepalm:

Hardly the same, Police are allowed to use discretion in enforcing the law. Before you call bullshit, are you saying people have not been cautioned for minor offences which others have had more severe punishment or even got off speeding tickets in the past?

The discretion am looking for is that I was driving the same speed as 4 cars in front of me and a car behind me, I hit a bump pretty hard which caused me to accelerate to which I came off the throttle almost instantly. You say learn throttle control, how can you control hitting a big bump on the lead up to a bridge? I had a loose grip but it still jarred me enough.

I was pinged at the speed which was my highest during that acceleration. The bump is very clear in the video, the camera is thrown all over the place. Even the officer said that he took multiple speed records and that was my highest. The discretion I was asking advice for, was it worth explaining the situation and trying to have the demerit points reduced to one lower band which is an accurate reflection of the speed I was doing.. Rather than having to settle paying the fine for a higher class which was not a true representative of the speed.. I was in the middle of traffic, and I was the only one pinged!

For everyone saying "a well you just admitted it, good luck you idiot". I never said that I was trying to get off the ticket, only that I have the ticket reduced to a true representative of the speed I was driving.. A bit of discretion if you will!

I was only asking for advice in case anyone else has done something similar because I am sure things like this have happened in the past. Being called an idiot and generally being a dick isn't very nice and not helpful...

[speeding_ant]

Honestly, it's not worth the effort. I know it sucks, but just work harder to make sure it doesn't happen again.

You'll waste hours of your time trying to reduce the price of a ticket. Not sure what you get paid per hour, but I doubt it'll be worth your while.

[FJRider]

Police are allowed to use discretion in enforcing the law.

YOU are allowed to use your discretion to be obeying the law.

And we really feel sorry for you.




honest ... :no:

[Madness]

Someone call the fucking Waaaambulance...

Good luck with that. Perhaps if you were averaging closer to the speed limit when you hit the bump and lost control (because that's clearly what happened from your own description) you might not have ended up doing the incredibly high speed the Rozzer clocked you at. The fact that you were riding at the same speed as other road users around you who were in cars is almost irrrelevant, the only relevance being that you might have now learned that a Rozzer on SH16 is going to pull a bike over in preference to pulling a car over for doing the same (alleged) speed. They call it Hazard County in Rodney District for a reason.

This is yet another case of Rozzers Vs Biker. You will not get any leniency from writing a letter to the Plod, let alone if you include any of the admissions you've made here already. You might get some leniency from a Judge or JP, although I seriously doubt it. Take your chances in court, if you can afford the time off work for what in a best case scenario would be a reduction in Demerits, any reduction in financial penalty could be offset by Court Costs.

We all know the rules of the game. Don't go whining if you get pinged because the Rozzers do not have the discretion they used to have.

Sorry if this seems harsh but that's life, innit?

[Subike]

Hello idiot, good afternoon dick head, you got caught, end of story, pay the fine learn to control your wrist,
Its dicks like you who dont now how to control you fucking ago in the right place that have caused us all to pay high ACC fees,
You are still a frigging learned son, slow the fuck down, learn to pace yourself,
Pay the fine, no amount of tec instrumentation, videos, what ever , excuses , crying a long story will not change it
Be a man, control your wrist, pay the fine.
If you cant do that, then fucking walk until you learn

Now stop and think, why is it that every reply says basically the same thing??
Wear the label, you printed it.

[PseudoDave]

YOU are allowed to use your discretion to be obeying the law.

And we really feel sorry for you.




honest ... :no:


See this is what I mean. Hardly helping or giving advice, just being a dick for the sake of being a dick! What happened to a biker community? Or is it just laugh at someone who has some misfortune. Sure you have never had or never will get a ticket. I am not asking for sympathy, I don't feel sorry for my self, just disappointed in the situation.

No you are not allowed to use your discretion in obeying the law. I was unlucky that I got pinged at the higher speed, and the cop decided to use my highest speed for the ticket, as opposed to the lower speeds he also measured. I will just bite the bullet and pay the fine. It is my first ticket ever in over 10 years, will just be more careful in the future.

[bogan]

Hahahaha, the pic didn't embed, but it was worth following the link (http://www.godlikeproductions.com/sm/custom/8f29036700.jpg)

Someone's having a slow sunday and decided to troll kb, I hope :pinch:

[PseudoDave]

Hello idiot, good afternoon dick head, you got caught, end of story, pay the fine learn to control your wrist,
Its dicks like you who dont now how to control you fucking ago in the right place that have caused us all to pay high ACC fees,
You are still a frigging learned son, slow the fuck down, learn to pace yourself,


Very sweet of you, such a nice person and such nice advice. I am hardly a learner, although still learning, and I haven't crashed yet. How am a dick with a "ago" (I assume you missspelt ego), and the cause of high ACC?

[speeding_ant]

Among the people calling you a dick head, idiot, etc are people giving you friendly advice. Your choice if you wish to listen to that or not :facepalm:

[Madness]

I will just bite the bullet and pay the fine.... will just be more careful in the future.

See, the advice you have recieved has been helpful seeing as you've so quickly and efficiently reached the only sensible course of action to take under the circumstances.

A Highway Patrol Officer on duty along SH16 is not going to do you, or any other motorcyclists any favours. Remember that next time you're up there.

[Madness]

Hahahaha, the pic didn't embed, but it was worth following the link (http://www.godlikeproductions.com/sm/custom/8f29036700.jpg)

Someone's having a slow sunday and decided to troll kb, I hope :pinch:

On the contrary, it did embed. Do you have some cookie issues from all that pron you've been looking at?

Be a good lass & remove the embedded image in your quote, Mr Jantar is watching... :confused:

[bogan]

On the contrary, it did embed. Do you have some cookie issues from all that pron you've been looking at?

Be a good lass & remove the embedded image in your quote, Mr Jantar is watching... :confused:

It embedded for you cos you had already seen it, so it was cached, it has embedded for me now, after I have gone to the link and got it in my cache also (its something to do with hotlinking or whatever). So technically I wasn't quoting an embedded image, I was quoting a post to reply to for thread coherence... and Mr Jantar loves that thread coherence

[PseudoDave]

Among the people calling you a dick head, idiot, etc are people giving you friendly advice. Your choice if you wish to listen to that or not :facepalm:

I do thank them for that advice.

My original post asked "is it worth trying to get this fixed?" I knew that it probably wasn't and to just bite the bullet, but was wondering if anyone had gone through this type of scenario before with a favourable outcome. That was all I was asking. I wasn't trying to get out of a ticket, merely asking if it was worth explaining and asking for a lower "band" ticket.

[Coolz]

It is very unusual for a speedo to be out over the whole speed range. A speedo that reads under at 50k can be acurate at 100k. It depends how it was calibrated. Your reading at 120k could have been spot on. Check your speedo against your gps at different speeds to find the true reading else you might find yourself getting more tickets.

[FJRider]

See this is what I mean. Hardly helping or giving advice, just being a dick for the sake of being a dick! What happened to a biker community? Or is it just laugh at someone who has some misfortune. Sure you have never had or never will get a ticket. I am not asking for sympathy, I don't feel sorry for my self, just disappointed in the situation.

Pandering to the fanciful wishes of any that want off a ticket they have admitted too ... on the grounds of "Unfair" ... is laughable. The advice you got was Pay the fine. ANY other advice will cost you ... and will end with the same result.
You finding the advice "Unhelpful" is equally laughable. But sometimes GOOD advice is both unwanted and unliked. But still the best advice.
I have had tickets ... and paid the fine as I WAS guilty of speeding. All those times I was not "miffed" ... I was really pissed off. But. My problem ... such is life. Welcome to the real world.

And there is NO requirement to offer ONLY helpful advice on this site. And you are the dick that got pinged at over 120 km/hr ... :killingme



No you are not allowed to use your discretion in obeying the law. I was unlucky that I got pinged at the higher speed, and the cop decided to use my highest speed for the ticket, as opposed to the lower speeds he also measured. I will just bite the bullet and pay the fine. It is my first ticket ever in over 10 years, will just be more careful in the future.

The discretion IS there ... but the penalties are known and obvious ... IF CAUGHT. (as you have already found)

[Jantar]

On the contrary, it did embed. Do you have some cookie issues from all that pron you've been looking at?

Be a good lass & remove the embedded image in your quote, Mr Jantar is watching... :confused:

Yes, Mr Jantar is watching. And Mr Bogan is also correct that it didn't embed. So no penalty, or even warning for Mr Bogan because as far as he was concerned there was no embedded content. I have now fixed that minor discrepancy. :innocent:

[PseudoDave]

It is very unusual for a speedo to be out over the whole speed range. A speedo that reads under at 50k can be acurate at 100k. It depends how it was calibrated. Your reading at 120k could have been spot on. Check your speedo against your gps at different speeds to find the true reading else you might find yourself getting more tickets.

Thanks for that, I actually have my GPS running on video at the same time as my speedo. Although it is not quite as clear due to the sun, you can just make it out at times.. It is about accurate below 30, runs about 4-5% under between 50-70, and 8% under at 70-130, then about 10%+ above 130.

[Haggis2]

It is very unusual for a speedo to be out over the whole speed range. A speedo that reads under at 50k can be acurate at 100k. It depends how it was calibrated. Your reading at 120k could have been spot on. Check your speedo against your gps at different speeds to find the true reading else you might find yourself getting more tickets.

No its not - have you heard of speedohealers? If it was uncommon they would not be needed

[unstuck]

More PD coming up methinks.:shifty:

[Madness]

Yes, Mr Jantar is watching. And Mr Bogan is also correct that it didn't embed. So no penalty, or even warning for Mr Bogan because as far as he was concerned there was no embedded content. I have now fixed that minor discrepancy. :innocent:

Thank Jebus!

[PseudoDave]

Pandering to the fanciful wishes of any that want off a ticket they have admitted too ... on the grounds of "Unfair" ... is laughable. The advice you got was Pay the fine. ANY other advice will cost you ... and will end with the same result.
You finding the advice "Unhelpful" is equally laughable. But sometimes GOOD advice is both unwanted and unliked. But still the best advice.
I have had tickets ... and paid the fine as I WAS guilty of speeding. All those times I was not "miffed" ... I was really pissed off. But. My problem ... such is life. Welcome to the real world.

And there is NO requirement to offer ONLY helpful advice on this site. And you are the dick that got pinged at over 120 km/hr ... :killingme




The discretion IS there ... but the penalties are known and obvious ... IF CAUGHT. (as you have already found)

Please point out my post which says that I want off the ticket? Point out the advice which I said was unhelpful?

I said I was wondering if it was worth trying to plead to a lower band. And I said people generally being dicks and not offering advice were the unhelpful.

My opinion before this was to just bite the bullet, but if there was a way to lower it, was asking for advice. People saying that there isn't and just pay it are reinforcing my opinion, people generally laughing and calling me stupid for what? Exceding the speed limit, getting caught, and asking if there was a tested means to lower the "fine" due to circumstances, are not exactly offering advice to an honest question.

Sure no one posting here has never been pinged speeding, or if there was a way to lower it, would do it?

I am not from NZ so don't know if there is any play with the road laws... It started as an honest question to see if it was worth it, and turned into a circus of people acting like dicks.

[Madness]

Thanks for that, I actually have my GPS running on video at the same time as my speedo. Although it is not quite as clear due to the sun, you can just make it out at times.. It is about accurate below 30, runs about 4-5% under between 50-70, and 8% under at 70-130, then about 10%+ above 130.

Maybe you should think about all that electrical gadetry and the potential it has to act as a distraction away from things like; your speed and the presence of Rozzers. See how many crash videos there are on YouTube with fucktards chatting away to their video cameras before ultimately kissing the side of another vehicle. I don't get it, what's the point? Is it a sexual thing?

[speeding_ant]

Don't know about you, but I get turned on watching videos of me riding :shit:

[PseudoDave]

Maybe you should think about all that electrical gadetry and the potential it has to act as a distraction away from things like; your speed and the presence of Rozzers. See how many crash videos there are on YouTube with fucktards chatting away to their video cameras before ultimately kissing the side of another vehicle. I don't get it, what's the point? Is it a sexual thing?

Its more of a case of I don't know the country and I need a GPS to find my way around, and I like to video my rides to send to my dad in the UK so he can see what NZ is like.

[FJRider]

Thanks for that, I actually have my GPS running on video at the same time as my speedo. Although it is not quite as clear due to the sun, you can just make it out at times.. It is about accurate below 30, runs about 4-5% under between 50-70, and 8% under at 70-130, then about 10%+ above 130.

Put a mark on the glass of the speedo at the appropriate speed limits. So .... if you exceed it ... you know you are speeding. Just up to you how far over the limits you choose to go.

[Madness]

Its more of a case of I don't know the country and I need a GPS to find my way around, and I like to video my rides to send to my dad in the UK so he can see what NZ is like.

Fairy nuff. Try sending a postcard.

:innocent:

[PseudoDave]

Put a mark on the glass of the speedo at the appropriate speed limits. So .... if you exceed it ... you know you are speeding. Just up to you how far over the limits you choose to go.

Problem with this one, I wasn't even looking at the speedo, was just following the traffic in front and assumed I was doing OK (I know). I only know the "out" on the speedo from using the GPS in the UK. I am used to 70mph limits being from the UK, so have to get used to adjusting my speed to the 100 kph limit. I will just stay under the speedo reading from now on, saves a lot of problems.

[pritch]

then about 10%+ above 130.

And that "above 130" bit was on a private road I trust? :whistle:

But seriously, most people in your situation consider it another form of road tax. Just pay up and learn what you can from the experience.
If you start to accumulate points you might consider acquiring a radar detector and learning how to use it?

Or you could stay under the limit?

[PseudoDave]

And that "above 130" bit was on a private road I trust? :whistle:

But seriously, most people in your situation consider it another form of road tax. Just pay up and learn what you can from the experience.
If you start to accumulate points you might consider acquiring a radar detector and learning how to use it?

Or you could stay under the limit?


Ha, using the bike at the track and having a tracker for G-force and lean angles. Uses a GPS to mark positions and follow track times. I know the speed which I take corners so can compare to GPS data.. I imported my bike when I moved here, was a lot cheaper than buying one here.

Thought about a radar detector in the past but this is the first ticket I have had so dont think it would be worth it. Just pay more attention to my speed in the future.

[unstuck]

Just pay more attention to my speed in the future.

Best advice anyone could of given you really.:Punk:

[FJRider]

Its more of a case of I don't know the country and I need a GPS to find my way around, and I like to video my rides to send to my dad in the UK so he can see what NZ is like.

I'm sure you dad will appreciate the vid of you getting a ticket. And the indicated speeds on them.

[Skiwi]

If you think your "evidence" will trump the cops in a court of law ya dreaming!:no:

You sped & got caught, stop your whining and pay the fine, end of story.

[Toaster]

Hey guys,

Well I just got my first speeding ticket; "alleged speed", 123 in a 100 zone. .... I think this a little excessive for what happened.

Dave

Hi Dave, I guess this issue is long done and dusted, but your comment that you think the infringement notice to be "a little excessive" intrigues me. Was not your speed "a little excessive" also given you know the speed limit is 100km/h? Your action met in kind by an appropriate response maybe?

Regardless of the actions of other road users, we are always responsible for our own actions. When I got done for speeding on a Hayabusa a few years back the cop apologised for ending my perfect record. I said I was the one who ended it, not him. I got ticketed for a lapse in attention which was fair enough.

[PseudoDave]

Hi Dave, I guess this issue is long done and dusted, but your comment that you think the infringement notice to be "a little excessive" intrigues me. Was not your speed "a little excessive" also given you know the speed limit is 100km/h? Your action met in kind by an appropriate response maybe?

Regardless of the actions of other road users, we are always responsible for our own actions. When I got done for speeding on a Hayabusa a few years back the cop apologised for ending my perfect record. I said I was the one who ended it, not him. I got ticketed for a lapse in attention which was fair enough.

While I agree with you, my speed was excessive, hence I was always willing to accept a ticket, I was looking to see if it was possible to lower the band in which I was placed. The thing that I found "a little excessive" was the fact that I was only doing the noted speed for less than a second and he even acknowledged that it was the highest out of the multiple recorded speeds he took. The rest being around 10 kph slower. My point being, would it not have been more fair (I know, the world isn't fair) to be ticketed at an average of the recorded speeds, rather than an obvious outlier, a quick increase in speed which was decreased immediately as shown by the measurements? Yes you could argue that it is the top speed which should count as it is the scale to which the is law broken, but when it was such a short time and obviously not consistent, should that not be taken into consideration and leniency shown as a result? Well I know the official answear seems to be no, and from the opinion of the other board users replies the answear seems to be no, but that is what I found to be "a little excessive".

What is done is done, I will pay the price and learn from it.

[unstuck]

What is done is done, I will pay the price and learn from it.

Good man.:Punk::Punk:

[FJRider]

The thing that I found "a little excessive" was the fact that I was only doing the noted speed for less than a second and he even acknowledged that it was the highest out of the multiple recorded speeds he took. The rest being around 10 kph slower.

Sounds like you failed the attitude test roadside too ...

[PseudoDave]

Sounds like you failed the attitude test roadside too ...

You would have thought this to be over now, but you have to have another go again. A silly comment commenting on my attitude when you have no idea what went down or know me at all.

Dicks will be dicks I suppose!

And for the sake of argument;

Actually I had no idea about any of this at the time because I was just plodding along behind another car. It was only after I saw the video did I know what happened. In fact, I got a free tyre pressure gauge, visor cleaner, discounted "uphill rider training" vouchers, and some other stuff from an Auckland transport employee that was also in the police car.. Maybe they were targeting bikes, I don't know.

[unstuck]

In fact, I got a free tyre pressure gauge, visor cleaner, discounted "uphill rider training" vouchers, and some other stuff from an Auckland transport employee that was also in the police car.. Maybe they were targeting bikes, I don't know.

Not quite free, now was it.:innocent: How much was the ticket again. Cheaper to buy that stuff from supercheap or ripco.:Punk:

[Dogboy900]

I think its possibly worth writing a letter (or do the Police use email now? Sometimes they seem well behind in communicating with the public!))
I doubt you would get a reduction but I reckon its worth 5 minutes to give it a go. I don't consider 120 odd K's to be certain death material either, but many on here apparently do. I think in most cases a police officer is more likely to target a speeding bike than a speeding car, not 100% sure why that is, but I have heard too many of stories of bikes pulled out of the flow of traffic to doubt it.

Good luck ;)

[mulletman]

PD, dunno why ya getting flamed , you admitted wrong doing and asked a simple Q.
Ive gone over bumps on my current bike and its caused me to momentarily speed up as well.(at what ever speed).
A radar detector may help especially when the plods using his gear looking for speeders, gives you a bit of a chance and a wee reminder (check your speed) where your at , as in your case in a line of other road users.

[Madness]

I got a free tyre pressure gauge, visor cleaner, discounted "uphill rider training" vouchers, and some other stuff from an Auckland transport employee that was also in the police car.. Maybe they were targeting bikes, I don't know.

Nah, they always give you that stuff after they've given you a ticket. If you're really lucky you might get some McDonalds vouchers.

[mulletman]

Nah, they always give you that stuff after they've given you a ticket. If you're really lucky you might get some McDonalds vouchers.

Actually i didnt have to 'score' a ticket to get the above, just showed license, reg and wof.
Was targeted being on my bike, cop sorta apologized for stopping me but 'had been instructed' to 'check' all bikes.

[FJRider]

Nah, they always give you that stuff after they've given you a ticket. If you're really lucky you might get some McDonalds vouchers.

The presence of "the Auckland Traffic" whatever ... probably forced the cops hand. To retain their campaign reputation of speed policing strictness ... over 120 km's these days is a cert for "paperwork" ... and discussion on the unfairness of it wont help.

The last vehicle in a line of vehicles is often pinged ... no other vehicles behind them to confuse the Hawk .... and often is a bike ... pulling out to pass said line of traffic. (as the mufti goes past the other way)

[SPman]

If you went over a bump whilst holding the trigger of a gun pointed at somebodys head and said bump caused the unintentional disharge of said weapon, I think you should have got off with a stern talking to.

:facepalm:

What a stupid fucking analogy!
The fact you are holding a gun to someones head, implies the intent - otherwise you shouldn't be packing - regardless of how it goes off, you'd be done!

[f2dz]

I'm sure you've realised this by now, but KB is the wrong place to come for sympathy, not that you were probably looking for any.

Like others have said, and I think you already concluded, you've got to suck it up and pay it. Tickets always suck, and make you feel like shit for a while.

You can't do anything different about it than learn from it. Or next time, you could try out running them... :innocent:

[sil3nt]

post the fucking video already :rolleyes:

[Mort]

Yeah I've seen the cops on SH16 skulking about waiting to ping bikers basically doing no harm what so ever. Meanwhile a few k's to the east is SH1 where there is a mass of traffic blasting through a high crash area where lives have been lost where, you might imagine, the mere presence of a cop car would have a significant impression on thousands of drivers and actually do some public good. But no. They'd much rather cruise around and hide behind bushes in the middle of nowhere waiting patiently (and presumably completing a crossword) for one or two relatively harmless riders to ride by.

Cops should be deployed where they can do the most good not where the scenery appears most pleasing.

Dave, you have my sympathies. Welcome to NZ where cops are merciless ticket robots..

[PuppetMaster]

Yeah I've seen the cops on SH16 skulking about waiting to ping bikers basically doing no harm what so ever. Meanwhile a few k's to the east is SH1 where there is a mass of traffic blasting through a high crash area where lives have been lost where, you might imagine, the mere presence of a cop car would have a significant impression on thousands of drivers and actually do some public good. But no. They'd much rather cruise around and hide behind bushes in the middle of nowhere waiting patiently (and presumably completing a crossword) for one or two relatively harmless riders to ride by.

Cops should be deployed where they can do the most good not where the scenery appears most pleasing.

Dave, you have my sympathies. Welcome to NZ where cops are merciless ticket robots..


LOL. Unfortunately true. Although I do think you are giving your average cop a little too much credence, I doubt they are smart enough to do a crossword.

[skippa1]

Nah, they always give you that stuff after they've given you a ticket. If you're really lucky you might get some McDonalds vouchers.


shit....Im going to go get me a ticket for some free McDees:yes:

[imdying]

It is very unusual for a speedo to be out over the whole speed range. A speedo that reads under at 50k can be acurate at 100k. It depends how it was calibrated.This rubbish is wrong.

OP, get on eBay and buy a radar detector.

[Zedder]

Yeah I've seen the cops on SH16 skulking about waiting to ping bikers basically doing no harm what so ever. Meanwhile a few k's to the east is SH1 where there is a mass of traffic blasting through a high crash area where lives have been lost where, you might imagine, the mere presence of a cop car would have a significant impression on thousands of drivers and actually do some public good. But no. They'd much rather cruise around and hide behind bushes in the middle of nowhere waiting patiently (and presumably completing a crossword) for one or two relatively harmless riders to ride by.

Cops should be deployed where they can do the most good not where the scenery appears most pleasing.

Dave, you have my sympathies. Welcome to NZ where cops are merciless ticket robots..

Yeah, I agree with your comments on SH1 and SH16.

Talking of SH16, did you post videos on YouTube under the name Morticus Maximus? I ride up there a lot and enjoyed those as well as the others posted.

[R650R]

Yeah its a bugger when a couple of K's puts you into next demerit category, not worth going to court though for several reasons:

1) You can't selectively use evidence. If you enter the video as evidence the cops will have the right to see the entire days recording not just the five seconds when the cop is coming towards you, same with the GPS data. No doubt there is record perhaps of you going even faster, you will end up with extra tickets. Courts already accept GPS data as evidence of speeding in accident cases.

2) The cops evidence will be taken as official record and you've already admitted at roadside nodoubt to speeding and arguing a couple of km an hour based on your amatuer gps use versus the professional expert (in eyes of courts) reading from radar system. The court will see it as timewasting and pedantic sorry.

BTW a note for everybody if you are going to ride fast on a regular basis you should not have any GPS sat nav type devices fitted or have cellphone turned on (preferably take battery out) as the cops will use the info against you in a crash. Arguing like the thread author has also puts it on record that you have this device and they will ask for it. Think this is how a trucky mate ended up in court after the same thing, he argued with a waikato highway patrol unit that his gps said 96 when the cop did him for 98... several months later CVIU gets his gps records and no one elses from same company and takes him to court. The evidence was damning but lucky the cops made a procedural error with regards to evidence and he got off... was the same with his fuelcard receipts which would be the equivlent of filling your bike up and using eftpos instead of cash...

There was a recent article in the states to about tomtom selling speed data to cops. Not an individual basis as that would violate privacy laws but as a roadmap to where people are in general do speed xxx. Notice that cops seem to park in places they never did before. If you speed with satnav your telling the cops where all the good roads are...

Sorry but best option is to wear this one.

[PseudoDave]

Yeah, already paid the fine. Was just curious to see if anyone had done anything like this before and how they went about it. Another thing I found, the radar system they use is +-3kph accurate, so in theory I could have been in the lower class than what the machine pinged me for, again, not worth the hassle though.

May actually consider a Radar Detector, just to be extra safe in the future!

[R650R]

Yeah, already paid the fine. Was just curious to see if anyone had done anything like this before and how they went about it. Another thing I found, the radar system they use is +-3kph accurate, so in theory I could have been in the lower class than what the machine pinged me for, again, not worth the hassle though.

May actually consider a Radar Detector, just to be extra safe in the future!

Radar detectors are no wallet saver on their own, you still have to be alert and proactive. Had one once then took it off as too much of a distraction. You need to spend the big dollars to get one that doesn't false alarm all the time also. Up your way you'll get lasered before you have the chance to hit the brakes anyway. At our trucking firm the only driver with a radar detector was also the one who got the most tickets... and he had a $1000 top of the line one too.

[scumdog]

Dave, you have my sympathies. Welcome to NZ where cops are merciless ticket robots..

Why, thank ya sah, thank ya verry much indeed!:woohoo:

[scumdog]

LOL. Unfortunately true. Although I do think you are giving your average cop a little too much credence, I doubt they are smart enough to do a crossword.

We have to do crosswords AND write out tickets now?:gob:

Dang, how WILL I get the time....:blink:

[pritch]

Radar detectors do work, but as has been said it does need to be a good one, and you need to keep doing whatever you did to avoid tickets previously. Eyes open, time and place, whatever.

Some luddites don't like them, but that's because they don't know what a detector can do. Eyeballs can't see around corners or through solid objects, a good detector will. Never decide though that the detector makes you "bullet proof" that's asking for trouble. Probably big trouble.

[FJRider]

Dave, you have my sympathies. Welcome to NZ where cops are merciless ticket robots..

Those same cops thank you for spreading the message ... :killingme

[Jantar]

Yeah its a bugger when a couple of K's puts you into next demerit category, not worth going to court though for several reasons:

1) You can't selectively use evidence. If you enter the video as evidence the cops will have the right to see the entire days recording not just the five seconds when the cop is coming towards you, same with the GPS data. No doubt there is record perhaps of you going even faster, you will end up with extra tickets. Courts already accept GPS data as evidence of speeding in accident cases......

This part is incorrect. The cops cannot demand to see the entire day's record on the chance that you were going faster somewhere else. They must have good reason to suspect that you committed an offence at a certain place and time, and then they can get a search warrnt to obtain any data that you have pertaining to that time and place.


Think this is how a trucky mate ended up in court after the same thing, he argued with a waikato highway patrol unit that his gps said 96 when the cop did him for 98... several months later CVIU gets his gps records and no one elses from same company and takes him to court. The evidence was damning but lucky the cops made a procedural error with regards to evidence and he got off.

I suspect the "procedural error" was the illegal obtaining of evidence. Can you ask your trucky mate to either verify this, or to comment on what else the procedural error might have been.

[Deano]

What happened to a biker community?

Sharing a common interest does not necessarily make people 'buddies', or require them to be supportive of one another.

I think a lot of bikers (incl some KBers) are complete twats. Don't expect too much from people, life will be a lot easier.

And to add to your story. I know a biker who got ticketed for exceeding 100kph, while in a traffic flow of several vehicles. His speed did not fluctuate at all and so he was doing the same as the other cars, but the cop singled him out, so beware.

[Arrowolf]

You payed it, you learned a lesson, it will not happen again.
You payed it, you want to have fun on the bike, it will happen again.

Your choice !

[PseudoDave]

You payed it, you learned a lesson, it will not happen again.
You payed it, you want to have fun on the bike, it will happen again.

Your choice !

I will just hit the track up here to push it, and find a nice little road in which I can't speed on to relax.

Anyone know any decent roads like that? I only know the Coromandel area which is always too busy and the West Coast/Woodcocks Rd which is probably my favourite at the moment close to Auckland..

[Gremlin]

May actually consider a Radar Detector, just to be extra safe in the future!
A radar detector isn't a magic device to stop speeding tickets. You can't expect to speed, and it's going to warn you ahead of time. Cops will use instant on, so no warning is given. I have a radar detector (a good one) and wrack up many km. I don't use it to speed, simply to know when to keep a closer eye on my speedo, and whether it's safe to overtake this car here, or maybe later, but generally, I'm not speeding.


I will just hit the track up here to push it, and find a nice little road in which I can't speed on to relax.

Anyone know any decent roads like that?
Take speed to the track. You'll never know (on any road) if a tractor has just pulled out of a driveway, or there is a pile of loose stones around the next corner. That said, just go explore, all roads in NZ are fun, one way or another.

[nzmikey]

Sounds like you failed the attitude test roadside too ...

Prrffttt there is no such thing ... The cunt that fucked me last year was not giving a fuck either way & I kept my mouth shut for once & was nice to him.

Not so much next time

[FJRider]

Prrffttt there is no such thing ... The cunt that fucked me last year was not giving a fuck either way & I kept my mouth shut for once & was nice to him.

Not so much next time

We do have a few of those down here too. I got pinged once for 126 km/hr ... on a road I hadn't seen a cop on in 20 years. Turns out he had been responding to a 111 police emergency call in the area. And returning to the station ... as usual ... turned the radar on and was trolling for business.
Lucky me eh .. !!

Saying nothing apart from polite answers to the usual questions (while admitting nothing) with a smile on the dial ... has got me a better end result ... than questioning/ranting ... the legality/fairness/point/reason for being stopped. (funny that)

Anybody that exceeds any posted speed limit (anywhere/any road) can expect to be ticketed. If they aren't ... it's a good day for them.

[scumdog]

Prrffttt there is no such thing ... The cunt that fucked me last year was not giving a fuck either way & I kept my mouth shut for once & was nice to him.

Not so much next time

How come I read that sort of comment from North Islanders so ofter?

And rarely hear of it from South Islanders?

Glad I live in the south - the deep south...you can shove your warmer weather, big concerts and cockroaches...

[McFatty1000]

Yeah, the South is good for that from my experience

Managed to pass 'the test' when I was pulled over, ended up having a good talk with a cop who rode as well (Not a bike cop), prob learnt a better lesson then and there than any ticket would have taught

[Coldrider]

Nah it's not that good, I've had a cockroach freeride me down to the Brass. You could tell who hadn't seen one before.

[BoristheBiter]

How come I read that sort of comment from North Islanders so ofter?

And rarely hear of it from South Islanders?

Glad I live in the south - the deep south...you can shove your warmer weather, big concerts and cockroaches...

Because we have traffic Nazi's that love to take licences of bikers.
They are twats, and are an embarrassment to the police name and most GD wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire.

One wank stain in particular likes to bait bikes by flying up behind them, tail gating then backing off then doing it again to get the bike to speed off.
Forgets we all know what he does so we just a wee laugh and go on with our day.

And yes you ginger cunt if you are trolling our forums again I do mean you.
(SG if you are ginger I don't mean you)

[nzmikey]

How come I read that sort of comment from North Islanders so ofter?

And rarely hear of it from South Islanders?

Glad I live in the south - the deep south...you can shove your warmer weather, big concerts and cockroaches...
If there we some good paying jobs, less shaky ground, less corrupt landlords & less southerners I would be there ....
but for now I am stuck in the N.I. ... more to the point stuck in NZ until the woman finishes her degree & starts making some real money .

Then I can kick back & do my projects & I spose some form of parenting.

[R650R]

This part is incorrect. The cops cannot demand to see the entire day's record on the chance that you were going faster somewhere else. They must have good reason to suspect that you committed an offence at a certain place and time, and then they can get a search warrnt to obtain any data that you have pertaining to that time and place.



I suspect the "procedural error" was the illegal obtaining of evidence. Can you ask your trucky mate to either verify this, or to comment on what else the procedural error might have been.

In regard to point one as soon as the video or gps record is entered into evidence the cops have the right to examine it. An astute prosecuter would probably ask to see a wider timeframe to verify the accuracy of the image/data. In any case he's already known to be speeding and on a high performance vehicle it would be a simple matter for the cops to get a warrant. In the truck company case don't think it was a warrant he just asked that the 'records be handed over forthwith', its not as difficult as made out in some tv shows.
Bit like in how many murder cases the defence lawyer doesn't let the defendant testify evidence to defend himslef as they know the cops will have him say something damaging as they have the right to cross examine evidence and witnesses.

I sat in the court room to watch the case. The error was in producing the evidence as hearsay, as they couldn't produce anyone to testify the accuracy of the data and couldn't even state where the server was located that stored the data or if it was even in NZ. If it was straight speeding they would have nailed him due to previous court precedents but the case was about dates and times at certain GPS locations versus logbook entries. He was quite lucky to get off and I suspect the cops won't be making the same mistake again. I would say it will be very expensive for anyone to try defend a similar case in the future as there will be significant witness expenses from having experts from the gps,data and fuelcard centres testify as to the accuracy of times on their systems.
Moral of the story is if you having fancy techno gps goodies in your vehicle or Eroad GPS type road tax units installed you need to really behave yourself out there.

[Jantar]

In regard to point one as soon as the video or gps record is entered into evidence the cops have the right to examine it. An astute prosecuter would probably ask to see a wider timeframe to verify the accuracy of the image/data.


This is absolutely correct. Therefore if entering GPS data as evidence, then you must supply a printout of the data from further away than the radar could possibly have detected you and allowed an officer to absolutely identify the vehicle in the beam. This would be a minimum of 2 km, and would tend to use double that, or 4 km before the point at which the alleged speeding took place. A printable file of the output in either CSV or Excel format should be available to show where the printout came from. Also a secure file of that same section of the record in the origional GPS format must be made available for police examination should they so wish. However it is not neccessary to supply 8000 km of travel data (which is what my GPS holds) to prove what happened at that time and place.


In any case he's already known to be speeding ....

No he isn't. Untill found guilty by the court he is only suspected of speeding.

.........


I sat in the court room to watch the case. The error was in producing the evidence as hearsay, as they couldn't produce anyone to testify the accuracy of the data and couldn't even state where the server was located that stored the data or if it was even in NZ.

Most GPS systems store the data onboard. I know trucking companies also store it on a server, and I archive my GPS data onto my home computer, but the data used in evidence must be date and time stamped with the download time, and date and time stamped with the file conversion time. It is not necessary for anyone to testify to the accuracy of the data if the secure file is in the origional GPS format, because that data cannot be altered. Glider pilots use this as evidence of completing tasks, as any file that is uploaded into the GPS is automatically stripped of timing data.



.....
Moral of the story is if you having fancy techno gps goodies in your vehicle or Eroad GPS type road tax units installed you need to really behave yourself out there.

Again I agree. I have been stopped by a cop and accused of speeding when I knew I wasn't. I asked him to note that the bike was equiped with a GPS, that the GPS was recording, that the GPS time was dd-mm-yyyy hh:mm:ss, that the GPS location was xxx.xx.xx yyy.yy.yy, and to note the serial number of the GPS as it is in the metadata of the download. Instead, he got back into his car and drove off without giving me a ticket. In that particular incident I would have happy for the whole 1650 km ride to have made available as evidence as I was pre-riding the 1000 miler route and ensuring that I was staying within the speed limit, or within 10 kmh above or below it as muich as possible. Antime I found myself even slightly above I would back off to 95 - 100. So when the cop claimed I was doing 117 kmh I knew he was bullshitting, and the GPS would have confirmed that.

[R650R]

It is not necessary for anyone to testify to the accuracy of the data if the secure file is in the origional GPS format, because that data cannot be altered.


It is a right under common law for the defendant and probably the prosecution also to be able to cross examine any evidence and question/cross examine the provider of that evidence. Hence entering data or a computer printout was pronounced as hearsay evidence as its from a third party not present in the court who cannot be questioned. This was from one of HB's top lawyers and the cops and judge squirmed when he read it out as they knew the whole case was blown right there. Although we as ordinary people accept gps in a court there needs to be a real person to testify that the system timeclock hasn't been altered during maintanance and is accurate also, did it compensate for daylight savings etc. Same with the fuelcard receipts there was no one from the service station or fuel company to testify. For some reason the clock at Caltex bombay was always out by 45mins as a perfect example of trusting data.

Even devices like satnav and phones also record peak speeds and time/place stamps as administrative data on the service providors network, even if your not making a call. They store this data (very cheap to do so) so they know what there customers want/need/go, where to build the extra cellphone towers etc. This data can be accessed if needed.

Bottom line in this case is you don't want to be waving gadgets around like this unless you are squeaky clean.

[Jantar]

..... Although we as ordinary people accept gps in a court there needs to be a real person to testify that the system timeclock hasn't been altered during maintanance and is accurate also, did it compensate for daylight savings etc. .........

Hence the reason for requesting that the officer note the GPS time and location as displayed on the device at the time and location of the offence. That way even if the GPS timeclock had been altered to some other reference point (not likely in New Zealand, but potentially possible) then as long as the GPS time recorded by the officer matches the GPS time of the printout and the origional file sample, then it wouldn't matter if it no longer matched NZST or NZDT. What is important is that the time stamp at each sample step is consistant, and that time step is at satelite level, not device level. The Device gets its reference time from the satelites.

Here is part of a typical GPS record where the GPS is set to record at every change of speed of more than 5% of any change of direction. The format here is:
Record # dd/mm/yyyy hh:mm:ss Elevation Leg-m leg-time Leg-speed Heading Lat Lon

1079 13/11/2010 9:59:56 a.m. 330 m 25 m 0:00:01 91 km/h 120° true S44 54.273 E168 24.802
1080 13/11/2010 9:59:57 a.m. 330 m 130 m 0:00:05 94 km/h 101° true S44 54.280 E168 24.819
1081 13/11/2010 10:00:02 a.m. 326 m 136 m 0:00:05 98 km/h 113° true S44 54.293 E168 24.916
1082 13/11/2010 10:00:07 a.m. 330 m 98 m 0:00:04 88 km/h 142° true S44 54.322 E168 25.011
1083 13/11/2010 10:00:11 a.m. 329 m 52 m 0:00:02 94 km/h 157° true S44 54.364 E168 25.057
1084 13/11/2010 10:00:13 a.m. 329 m 110 m 0:00:04 99 km/h 146° true S44 54.390 E168 25.072

[nzpomybikerider]

Being an old codger, my advise is to pay up and move on, maybe keep to the back roads whenever possible and if on the main highway keep to the speed limit

[R650R]

The Device gets its reference time from the satelites.



Yes/perhaps but who calibrates the satellite and checks its accuracy on a consistant basis. If used as evidence an expert must be able to testify to back it up. The court is not concerned that you the user thinks its accurate, that has to be backed up by an expert witness. Say a set of brakes are faulty, its not enough for the prosecution to say that, they have to call in the guy from the testing station to testify who physically examined the wreck after the crash. The court room and legalese is a whole different ballgame from showing your mates where you went for a ride.
Another thing to consider is although you may not be speeding, your average speed through twisty road especially on a DR having fun may not conform to the LTSA/Police view of a safe speed for that road. Truckers know about this and the magic 81km/h average speed when filling in their logbook, there has been courtcases on this too but i don't have firsthand knowledge.

[Jantar]

Yes/perhaps but who calibrates the satellite and checks its accuracy on a consistant basis.......
Now this is getting rediculous. Who calibrates the cop's watch on a consistant basis? Yet the court will accept the officer's time from his watch as a valid time. The police radar must be calibrated at certain intervals, and guess what time standard is used internationally now as a time reference for this; Its GPS time. If GPS time cannot be accepted as accurate then nor can any system that uses time as a basis, and that includes ALL speed measuring devices.

[R650R]

Speeding during working hours does not make a lot of sense as you are on the bosses time and you are just buying yourself paycuts plus it would go against you as far as the cost of private vehicle insurance goes. If the boss is encouraging it to meet unreasonable deadlines they are breaking the law as well as employment law as failing to provide a safe workplace. I once had a trial in a job where illegal parking was required to meet deadlines and they wanted me to pay stuff that.

Speeding in a truck is as little as 4km/h over the limit all year round, easily done. Over ten years of transport industry including akld and england and the only parking tickets I had was trailer at night parked in industrial area on road with no red light. We found the ticket 2 months later when truck went in for a service, silly cop jammed it in radiator grill and it got sucked into some invisible spot!
Although in an ideal world we should obey all laws in reality there are a lot of practical situations where a little extra speed makes sense. Its only a paycut if you don't workout a way to book in the extra $...

[SVboy]

Hello idiot, good afternoon dick head, you got caught, end of story, pay the fine learn to control your wrist,
Its dicks like you who dont now how to control you fucking ago in the right place that have caused us all to pay high ACC fees,
You are still a frigging learned son, slow the fuck down, learn to pace yourself,
Pay the fine, no amount of tec instrumentation, videos, what ever , excuses , crying a long story will not change it
Be a man, control your wrist, pay the fine.
If you cant do that, then fucking walk until you learn

Now stop and think, why is it that every reply says basically the same thing??
Wear the label, you printed it.

Thats a harsh post-have you NEVER exceeded the limit? Have you never done something dickheady on a bike like say a huge burnout on grass while pissed out of your head..and then dropped it. If you had been injured, should we be blaming you for ACC levy rises? The OP has taken his medicine, but I think you have called the kettle black!

[R650R]

Now this is getting rediculous.

Welcome to the realm of the legal system. Take a seat in the public gallery one day, its quite mindblowing. You should have seen the othercase that was on before that, service station attendant who punched a customer that then attacked him with machete afterwards...