Hard vs soft luggage

[Devil]

Help me out here guys (and gals). I'm struggling to find the right direction. I've got a new KTM 690 Enduro R, and i'm mid-farkle. Luggage is the next item on my list.
I have hard luggage (Caribou cases) on my R1200GSA and love them. They're damn solid. Completely waterproof. Totally secure (which is a big thing for me as I can leave the bike for long periods unattended).
They've had falls and come out completely unscathed. They're designed to pop off the bike in a crash.

I do plan on heading over dodgier terrain on the new bike - but I am no mad erzberg freak. I know a lot of you hard core fullas prefer soft luggage, i'm assuming for its lower potential to do damage to the subframe?
Is that the only argument on the 'For' side of soft luggage?
Hard luggage has so many Pro's that matter to me (Keeping everything clean, dry, secure and in one piece. Inner bags rock!) yet I see soft panniers as being such a compromise.

Here's some softies that look purposeful. The dry factor and being able to secure them to the bike are bonuses:
http://www.adventure-spec.com/default/adventure-spec-magadan-panniers.html

Or do I head down the touratech route with zega's?
http://touratech.co.nz/shop/2826-aluminium-pannier-system-with-stainless-steel-rack-ktm-690-enduro-enduro-r-29-35-litre.html
http://touratech.co.nz/shop/2906-zega-pro-pannier-system-31-38-ltr-ktm-690-enduro-enduro-r.html

I could of course totally overspend and get both (the soft panniers require a rack anyway - they fit on the touratech rack).

Arguments for/against? Help? Is there a factor i'm totally missing?
Money is irrelevant (although i'd prefer not to end up buying both, but if thats what makes me happy then... ;) )

[Eddieb]

Supposedly hard bags are dangerous on the lower legs and ankles in rougher terrain as there's no give if your foot gets caught on something.

I use the Wolfman expedition bags and rate them. My clothes were dry even are 2 minutes fully submerged in the Okuku river and they come with little straps to allow them to mount to any racks.

http://wolfman.ehrenwerks.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=5

[wysper]

I guess the other risk with hard luggage and a drop is you are more likely to break a pannier or mounting bracket than with soft luggage. (I would think, but I could be quite wrong)
Something to add in to the mix maybe.

[Rosie]

I've never had hard luggage, but here are some of the things I like about soft luggage:

As Eddie said, it doesn't hurt so much when you get whacked by your luggage (or whacked by your riding companion's luggage :facepalm:)

Soft bags (depending on design) can expand or contract as required - even if you aren't carrying much, your gear is held together nice and firmly and sits snugly against the bike. Nothing rattles. And your rear end is only as wide as it needs to be on the day.

As Wysper said; you are more likely to damage the soft bags themselves, rather than mounting points on the bike, and field repairs on soft bags/straps are fairly straighforward (I imagine plastic cases would be harder to repair, but I don't actually know).

My Andystrapz pannierz are (still) pretty weatherproof but I pack my clothes and sleeping bag into lightweight drybags, that keeps them dry and keeps everything organised (clothes have to be packed into something, so it may as well be a dry bag)

And soft bags can also double as bicycle panniers... if one is so inclined :blink:

[clint640]

I do plan on heading over dodgier terrain on the new bike - but I am no mad erzberg freak. I know a lot of you hard core fullas prefer soft luggage, i'm assuming for its lower potential to do damage to the subframe?
Is that the only argument on the 'For' side of soft luggage?
)

Lower potential to do damage to my legs mainly. Plus heaps lighter & the rack can be lighter too (or no rack with giant loop style) Because they are not going to break your legs they can also be mounted lower & more forward than hard bags lowering your CoG & reducing stress on the subframe. Depending on the rack setup they can sit further inboard also. Another important thing for rough terrain use is that the variable volume, they can strap down on the contents preventing stuff from rattling around. Also they are generally smaller than hard luggage which stops one from carrying too much shit.

Cheers
Clint

[Devil]

Hmm, I did buy some heavy duty bicycle panniers a few years back that were on special from Torpedo 7 but never ended up using them. I wonder if I go the hard luggage route, then I can just throw those over for dodgier rides.

[Transalper]

ADVGD wrote a good article on some pros and cons of each.
The answer is a very personal one, what's right for me may not be right for others so no hard and fast rules.
In the bigger bike doing easier terrain I like hard luggage (though I don't have any right now) and on the little bike doing more technical stuff I like soft smaller bags and being forced to pack lighter as I really do notice the effect heavy/overloaded luggage has on the handling.
www.adventureguide.co.nz/articles/12/270/hard-luggage-vs-soft-luggage (http://www.adventureguide.co.nz/articles/12/270/hard-luggage-vs-soft-luggage.php)

I don't recognise the hard luggage you mentioned you already have but wonder if you couldn't simply get a rack to mount them to the KTM?

[dmoo1790]

I've trapped my foot under a soft bag twice and I shudder to think what it would have felt like if it had been a hard bag. IMHO the only real advantage of hard bags in NZ is convenience. Soft bags take a bit longer to get into compared to popping the latch on a hard bag.

I have tried a GL Great Basin but didn't really like it. Very tough and secure on the 690 but hard to pack and fiddly when re-fueling. I now have Wolfman E12 saddle bags plus a small dry bag. Plenty for weekend trips and the dry bag is easier to deal with than the GL when it comes to re-fueling.

For longer trips I need more room so I'm thinking I'll end up with the Wolfman racks and dry panniers. Apparently I could still fit the E12's with the panniers so I could have a lot of weight relatively low and forward. Downside is the permanent extra weight of the rack but I can't find a rack-less solution that will give me enough capacity below seat height.

Those Magadan bags look pretty tough but I don't think you need them for NZ.

[dmoo1790]

Here's why I need more capacity. Road riding only. In case you're wondering I rode from Ak to Seddon with this load but carried a lot less stuff for the off-road stuff we did from there.

278791

And here's a light load for a day ride. You can also see the Guard-It (G-It) rear/tail rack. I like it. Very light and survived the ridiculous load I put on it.

278790

You can also see one of the big pluses of soft luggage in these pics. In the first pic the dry bag is packed to the max and in the second it is almost empty. Same bag, different days. :)

[Devil]

That convenience part is such a huge thing though. Particularly when I still do a lot of road/gravel riding.
I would do a soft duffel style top bag either way.

At this moment i'm leaning towards the zega cases, now that i've remembered I still have those cycle panniers about somewhere. Best dig them out to see if they'll fit on the bike.

[gav24]

Hmm, I did buy some heavy duty bicycle panniers a few years back that were on special from Torpedo 7 but never ended up using them. I wonder if I go the hard luggage route, then I can just throw those over for dodgier rides.

Yep, that's what I do!
I made up some racks at work from 12mm tubing (any 1/2 decent fabricator or engineer can do the same) which look very similar to the wolf man racks and I just attach the Oxford cycle panniers that I already had. Lots of pockets and useful bits. Also they come with those waterproof rain covers which are good for rain but probably poo for lying in rivers!

[clint640]

Once Nic's XT gets back from engine surgery I'll get some pics of the T7 bicycle pannier mounts I made for you. The clips on the panniers fitted 5/8 tube so they were made out of that in 4130 & came out real good. I might even make a similar mounting system for the 640 & get some. The T7 panniers aren't huge though, Andys are a bit bigger, those Magadan ones look lots bigger.

After being brutalised for 60K km my Andy's are due for replacement & I'm thinking of getting the same again, or getting some made to a very similar design locally, I'd still need something bigger than the T7's for carrying the full camping kit.

IMHO, with a GSA in the shed, the 690 should be being jumped, wheelied, punted up knarly tracks & crashed whenever it is taken out otherwise you might as well be on the 1200, therefore soft luggage is the only sensible option.:cool:

Cheers
Clint

[Waihou Thumper]

Here's why I need more capacity. Road riding only. In case you're wondering I rode from Ak to Seddon with this load but carried a lot less stuff for the off-road stuff we did from there.


Holy Crap, how long were you heading away for? No wonder they say 690 sub frame needs strengthening:crazy:
Carrying a spare bike in that lost? Or a lot of clean undies:)

[dmoo1790]

Holy Crap, how long were you heading away for? No wonder they say 690 sub frame needs strengthening:crazy:
Carrying a spare bike in that lost? Or a lot of clean undies:)

Yes, lot's of spare undies. :) I was away a month and carried tent, sleeping bag, mat, laptop, rear sprocket, two front sprockets, chain (major gearing change), etc, etc. Actually it wasn't real heavy because a lot of stuff was bulky but light. Things like shoes, fleece, etc just chew up packing space.

There is in fact no problem with the 690 subframe (aka fuel tank). If the bike can take a passenger then it can easily take way more than I'll ever carry. The potential problems are in the tank mounting bolts and rear rack mounting bolt inserts and maybe the rear rack itself. So far no probs with my bike.

[stormtrooper]

Wolfman saddle packs with mounting bars have worked for me on the KLR, open road and off road ridding, really good mounting system and super easy to put on and take off:niceone:

[.chris]

I much prefer soft luggage purely because it is lighter (not that I have ever run hard luggage, but the weight puts me off).

Just that gear security issue.

If you want to come around and have a look at the setup I have for my 690 feel free to give me a shout.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-dtPM7XBYhDw/URnRIhlbBRI/AAAAAAAANFM/qX-z0D_oKvM/s800/IMG_3229.JPG

[Phreaky Phil]

I have both. I have had Touratech Panniers on the BMW for years. I used soft panniers for the TAT and glad I did. I would have wrecked the hard panniers on a trip like that. ( if you come off they will bend/break :( ) In the last few days on the TAT we rode at times with a German guy who had hard panniers. We had the discussion about catching your leg on them. A couple of days later we got to the bottom of some tricky stuff and waited for him. He took quite a while to arrive and guess what ? Had fallen off and got his leg pinned under a pannier and couldnt move. He finally got out. Leg not broken but real sore.
Having said that I have just finished fitting the Hard panniers to the DR for an up coming South Island trip, although I dont expect any real tough riding.
So horses for courses.