New Ngauranga camera

[Rhys]

It looks like the Ngauranga gorge Camera has been changed to a rego plate recognition camera, If your rego is on hold an other route may be better

[oneofsix]

It looks like the Ngauranga gorge Camera has been changed to a rego plate recognition camera, If your rego is on hold an other route may be better

yeah a bit of a bummer. Finally decided today that there was no camera in the gorge so not to watch the speedo - luckily spotted the new fitting just in time. Wasn't rocketing down but the first number on the dial was a 9 and not an 8 when I spotted it.

[Asher]

A paintball a day keeps the taxes away.

[Dragon]

Good thing I brought new rego the other day then, generally I do 80 till just after the camera seen a few cops on the other side pulling people up however

[Swoop]

Foot over numberplate should solve the problem...

[BuzzardNZ]

Thanks for the warning. :clap:

[MIXONE]

Are these cameras going to be the norm now?

[sgtp]

how do you tell the difference from a speed and rego checking camera?

[Dragon]

Foot over numberplate should solve the problem...

Ride backward/wheelie?

[oneofsix]

how do you tell the difference from a speed and rego checking camera?

They took away the old enclosure and now have put up a new totally different one. They are introducing rego cameras. What's your bet that they wont install a rego camera when they run a camera in the enclosure? Especially with this being one of the most profitable locations in NZ.

[Jeff Sichoe]

I feel safer already!!

[St_Gabriel]

So if the rego was on hold, what would the fine be? I would assume there would be no demerit point portion to the offence as points dont apply to speeding offences detected by camera.

[Coldrider]

So if the rego was on hold, what would the fine be? I would assume there would be no demerit point portion to the offence as points dont apply to speeding offences detected by camera.riding with rego on hold is demerit point issue if caught by the popo.

[roogazza]

So if the rego was on hold, what would the fine be? I would assume there would be no demerit point portion to the offence as points dont apply to speeding offences detected by camera.

I believe 150 bucks unless it's changed ?

No plate = no bucks unless nabbed.

[Scuba_Steve]

glass bottle, petrol, orange juice, rag, lighter, and darkness. I hear they make for a good combination :shifty:

[Coldrider]

I feel safer already!!Truman Burbank wouldn't.

[pete376403]

glass bottle, petrol, orange juice, rag, lighter, and darkness. I hear they make for a good combination :shifty:
orange juice? is it thirsty work?

[oneofsix]

orange juice? is it thirsty work?

remember how sticky orange juice is? just a guess. Also heard liquid soap works. I would guess the idea is basically napalm

[FJRider]

So if the rego was on hold, what would the fine be? I would assume there would be no demerit point portion to the offence as points dont apply to speeding offences detected by camera.

It is not a speed camera as such ... it is a Plate recognition camera. Demerits will apply.

[St_Gabriel]

It is not a speed camera as such ... it is a Plate recognition camera. Demerits will apply.

In which case, who would get the demerits added to their licence? The registered owner? seems unreasonable if they are not the operator. The operator? How can you conclusively prove who that was? Would be interesting to get a definite answer from the resident members of the force.

[oneofsix]

Saw the front of it on the way home tonight, looks a bit like this but without the light looking thing to the side, rather it has a wide rectangular window underneath the triangle one.

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2010/01/redflex.jpg


Whilst speeding fine via camera don't incur demerits due to the driver not being conclusively identified however registration is the registered person responsibility, yeah I know it isn't conclusive proof that the registered person is at fault, (stolen vehicle, WOF "test drive" ( remember you require a WOF to register the vehicle) etc) but I wouldn't want to take the risk if I was sitting near the limit.

[Scuba_Steve]

orange juice? is it thirsty work?

tis indeed, needs to be the type with pulp too :msn-wink:

[FJRider]

In which case, who would get the demerits added to their licence? The registered owner? seems unreasonable if they are not the operator. The operator? How can you conclusively prove who that was? Would be interesting to get a definite answer from the resident members of the force.

The Registered owner gets the letter. It is their responsibility to provide details on who was operating the vehicle at the time ... or pay the fine. As it is now for any photo tickets.

[Coldrider]

In which case, who would get the demerits added to their licence? The registered owner? seems unreasonable if they are not the operator. The operator? How can you conclusively prove who that was? Would be interesting to get a definite answer from the resident members of the force.If the camera is ANPR when operational, there would be Popo cars around, or there would be no point.

[FJRider]

If the camera is ANPR when operational, there would be Popo cars around, or there would be no point.

Not so. You just get mail.

[Coldrider]

Not so. You just get mail.an ordinary speed camera can do that, without speeding.

[rustic101]

glass bottle, petrol, orange juice, rag, lighter, and darkness. I hear they make for a good combination :shifty:

I'd suggest one of the 18 monitored CCTV cameras in the gorge is actually looking at that camera. Good luck to the person that tries it on....:msn-wink:

[MIXONE]

I'd suggest one of the 18 monitored CCTV cameras in the gorge is actually looking at that camera. Good luck to the person that tries it on....:msn-wink:

Bloody spoilsport.

[davereid]

Saw the front of it on the way home tonight, looks a bit like this but without the light looking thing to the side, rather it has a wide rectangular window underneath the triangle one.

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2010/01/redflex.jpg


Whilst speeding fine via camera don't incur demerits due to the driver not being conclusively identified however registration is the registered person responsibility, yeah I know it isn't conclusive proof that the registered person is at fault, (stolen vehicle, WOF "test drive" ( remember you require a WOF to register the vehicle) etc) but I wouldn't want to take the risk if I was sitting near the limit.

The danger isn't one of being unregistered, having no WOF etc. Just get thoses things, or get a single plate you can use on all your vehicles.

The danger is the gradual creep of the surveillance state.

Right now we can say glib things like "what do you have to worry about if you are not breaking the law?"

Trouble is, at various times, the law has made it illegal to dance if you are irish, breast feed if you are maori, be in a union or not be in a union.

I am always nervous when the state gives itself tools like this.

[Berries]

Trouble is, at various times, the law has made it illegal to dance if you are irish.
Have you seen Riverdance?

FFS.

[oneofsix]

The danger isn't one of being unregistered, having no WOF etc. Just get thoses things, or get a single plate you can use on all your vehicles.

The danger is the gradual creep of the surveillance state.

Right now we can say glib things like "what do you have to worry about if you are not breaking the law?"

Trouble is, at various times, the law has made it illegal to dance if you are irish, breast feed if you are maori, be in a union or not be in a union.

I am always nervous when the state gives itself tools like this.

That is the wider picture and applies more to things like the governments plan allow more information sharing between departments to "combat benefit fraud" (another thread so please don't discuss here). However I can see where this and the CCTV traffic cameras down the gorge along SH1 could be mis-used in future as the government tries to control more and more of your personal life. But right now this is about traffic cameras with the sharing of the information limited to the police, they are the only ones with access to these photos - right?


:corn:

[FJRider]

The danger isn't one of being unregistered, having no WOF etc. Just get thoses things, or get a single plate you can use on all your vehicles.

The danger is the gradual creep of the surveillance state.

Right now we can say glib things like "what do you have to worry about if you are not breaking the law?"

Trouble is, at various times, the law has made it illegal to dance if you are irish, breast feed if you are maori, be in a union or not be in a union.

I am always nervous when the state gives itself tools like this.

They can also be used to track (stolen/wanted) vehicles along those monitored roads .... prior to and after any reported incident/accident on those roads. They are not solely for the issue of infringement notices. So they may well be to YOUR advantage as well at some future time.


Only those with things to hide need worry.

[oneofsix]

Only those with things to hide need worry.

yeah but when you have to hide just due to a your believe be it religious or political or because of your colour or what ever other reason the powers that be pick on it is plan wrong, making that and the "done nothing wrong" one the most dangerous platitudes around.

[Scuba_Steve]

I'd suggest one of the 18 monitored CCTV cameras in the gorge is actually looking at that camera. Good luck to the person that tries it on....:msn-wink:

I did mention darkness in the ingredients + a balaclava/helmet is an optional recommendation when bringing justice to the corrupt overlords

[Zedder]

Have you seen Riverdance?

FFS.

He's right though, it was illegal at one time. As were many other liberties.

[Zedder]

They can also be used to track (stolen/wanted) vehicles along those monitored roads .... prior to and after any reported incident/accident on those roads. They are not solely for the issue of infringement notices. So they may well be to YOUR advantage as well at some future time.


Only those with things to hide need worry.

Yep, they are there for other things apart from infringment issuing. Ultimately it's about expediency and economic use of resources.

The anti "only those with things to hide need to worry" people might want to think about the law and order these systems allow also.

Sure it can go the other way, some say it has, but until the fully armed cops and fully kitted out army outnumber us and take away our guns, computers and cell phones plus other means of communication, then it's probably not something to worry about too much.

[FJRider]

yeah but when you have to hide just due to a your believe be it religious or political or because of your colour or what ever other reason the powers that be pick on it is plan wrong, making that and the "done nothing wrong" one the most dangerous platitudes around.

English translation please. :scratch:

Or edit it so it can be understood ... what it is you are trying to say ... :rolleyes:

[Cammey]

English translation please. :scratch:

Or edit it so it can be understood ... what it is you are trying to say ... :rolleyes:

He has read history. He knows that benevolent governments are an aberration, and that all governments eventually turn on their people. My Dad was a Watersider, he went on strike in 1951, wanting the 15 hour day reduced to 8 hours. The government of the day locked out union members, and used the army. They then denied him any benefits, made his union an illegal organisation and made it illegal to give money, food, or support of any kind to the strikers. Kiwis ignored the government, and supported the laid off workers. That was possible because the government didnt have the ability to enforce laws that most people thought were abhorrent. But now, these types of technology allow the government to pass unpopular laws, and enforce them effectively, even if they have no public support.

[Ocean1]

One of the stated purposes of the new rigs is to allow automatic speed related pingings. If your number turns up in Ngauranga at 10:00 and Otaki at 10:40 you'll be getting a ticket in the mail. If that's 10:00 and 10:50 you'll still be getting a ticket because there's several bits of <100kph involved. But here's the thing: if they adopt all of the elements of the UK system ours is modeled from and your numbers snapped in Ngauranga at 10:00 and Otaki at 11:00 you'll also be getting a ticket, even though the various speed limits over their respective distances add up to less than 60min. The rationale is that while it might be mathmaticaly possible for you to have obeyed the speed limit it's "statistically unlikely" that you did.

What we're seeing, here is a natural extension of the already seriously eroded right to be treated as innocent until proven guilty: the assumption of guilt without factual proof. Is anyone stupid enough to believe there won't be any further steps in this direction?

[awa355]

One of the stated purposes of the new rigs is to allow automatic speed related pingings. If your number turns up in Ngauranga at 10:00 and Otaki at 10:40 you'll be getting a ticket in the mail. If that's 10:00 and 10:50 you'll still be getting a ticket because there's several bits of <100kph involved. But here's the thing: if they adopt all of the elements of the UK system ours is modeled from and your numbers snapped in Ngauranga at 10:00 and Otaki at 11:00 you'll also be getting a ticket, even though the various speed limits over their respective distances add up to less than 60min. The rationale is that while it might be mathmaticaly possible for you to have obeyed the speed limit it's "statistically unlikely" that you did.

What we're seeing, here is a natural extension of the already seriously eroded right to be treated as innocent until proven guilty: the assumption of guilt without factual proof. Is anyone stupid enough to believe there won't be any further steps in this direction?

If they get this survelance system complete to this level, the police could always get Mark Lundy to test it for them.

[rustic101]

I did mention darkness in the ingredients + a balaclava/helmet is an optional recommendation when bringing justice to the corrupt overlords


Lol fair point maybe I forgot to mention the CCTV cameras see in the dark and go further a field than just the gorge at some point along the way the 'Man' will get ya :eek:

[Zedder]

One of the stated purposes of the new rigs is to allow automatic speed related pingings. If your number turns up in Ngauranga at 10:00 and Otaki at 10:40 you'll be getting a ticket in the mail. If that's 10:00 and 10:50 you'll still be getting a ticket because there's several bits of <100kph involved. But here's the thing: if they adopt all of the elements of the UK system ours is modeled from and your numbers snapped in Ngauranga at 10:00 and Otaki at 11:00 you'll also be getting a ticket, even though the various speed limits over their respective distances add up to less than 60min. The rationale is that while it might be mathmaticaly possible for you to have obeyed the speed limit it's "statistically unlikely" that you did.

What we're seeing, here is a natural extension of the already seriously eroded right to be treated as innocent until proven guilty: the assumption of guilt without factual proof. Is anyone stupid enough to believe there won't be any further steps in this direction?

Innocent until proven guilty actually means it is up to the prosecution to prove their case. Is anyone stupid enough to believe it means anything else?

[Coldrider]

Innocent until proven guilty actually means it is up to the prosecution to prove their case. Is anyone stupid enough to believe it means anything else?Mark Lundy could set the times.

[Ocean1]

Innocent until proven guilty actually means it is up to the prosecution to prove their case. Is anyone stupid enough to believe it means anything else?

Yeah, I did have you in mind when I asked that. Try failing to defend a traffic ticket, fuckwit, and then go see how much proof it took to convict you.

[pete376403]

Have you seen Riverdance?

FFS.

Public dancehalls Act 1935
http://www.setdance.com/pdha/pdha.php

[PeeJay]

Lol fair point maybe I forgot to mention the CCTV cameras see in the dark and go further a field than just the gorge at some point along the way the 'Man' will get ya :eek:

Another use for a FPV flying machine
mount a mini paintball gun on your helicopter or "drone" and do your bit for freedom
If you are really serious, make like a kamikazi without the permanent after affects
No wonder the govt wants to ban them

[Zedder]

Yeah, I did have you in mind when I asked that. Try failing to defend a traffic ticket, fuckwit, and then go see how much proof it took to convict you.

Everyone has the right to challenge the case.

For you, the amazing car jumping, mind construct, non-believer-in-car-crash-physics person that you are, it should be a piece of cake.

Also, hopefully everyone doesn't feel too bad that their career/job is non Ocean1 approved due to your statement that "engineering is the only true calling".

[FJRider]

He has read history. He knows that benevolent governments are an aberration, and that all governments eventually turn on their people. My Dad was a Watersider, he went on strike in 1951, wanting the 15 hour day reduced to 8 hours. The government of the day locked out union members, and used the army. They then denied him any benefits, made his union an illegal organisation and made it illegal to give money, food, or support of any kind to the strikers. Kiwis ignored the government, and supported the laid off workers. That was possible because the government didnt have the ability to enforce laws that most people thought were abhorrent. But now, these types of technology allow the government to pass unpopular laws, and enforce them effectively, even if they have no public support.

There is a big difference between not wanting to work a 15 hour day (although many still work them, even in this day and age) ... and getting (potentially) pinged for no current rego.
It is not so much about abhorrent unfair laws ... but the possibility of getting caught, when you thought there would be little chance of such.

Most people probably wont even know what the capabilities of the cameras are ... what restrictions are placed on the operators ... or how/wher they are used.

Scaremongering by a few with something to hide usually. If all the information you have on the ANPR program is what you have read in these (or similar) forums ... check out this site.

http://techliberty.org.nz/wp-content/uploads/ANPR-manual.pdf

Interestingly ... the camera in the Ngauranga will most likely be just a speed camera. Unless it is directly connected to either a Police vehicle, or Police station via hard wire system. The amount of data required to be transmitted by "other" means ... would make it plainly obvious.

But don't let lack of facts stand in the way of a good rant ...

[Ocean1]

Everyone has the right to challenge the case.

The default procedure is that your found guilty, with no more proof than the original document.


For you, the amazing car jumping, mind construct, non-believer-in-car-crash-physics person that you are, it should be a piece of cake.

Also, hopefully everyone doesn't feel too bad that their career/job is non Ocean1 approved due to your statement that "engineering is the only true calling".

Whats tha? a list of agruements you've previously lost?

Dude, I've got better things to do than prove you wrong a second time.

[Ocean1]

There is a big difference between not wanting to work a 15 hour day (although many still work them, even in this day and age) ... and getting (potentially) pinged for no current rego.
It is not so much about abhorrent unfair laws ... but the possibility of getting caught, when you thought there would be little chance of such.

You're wrong FJ, both issues are exactly about abhorrent unfair laws, the possibility of getting caught has fuck all to do with it.

Don't get me wrong, I can see there are serious savings and improved efficiencies in the use of the technology. But the price is too high.


Interestingly ... the camera in the Ngauranga will most likely be just a speed camera. Unless it is directly connected to either a Police vehicle, or Police station via hard wire system. The amount of data required to be transmitted by "other" means ... would make it plainly obvious.

Data comm's limits? Please, dude, the likely traffic even from that site is no problem whatsoever.

[FJRider]

You're wrong FJ, both issues are exactly about abhorrent unfair laws, the possibility of getting caught has fuck all to do with it.



So the comment that getting caught with no rego is a more distinct possibility than before has nothing to do with methods of enforcement ... but about unfair laws ... ???

And ... is having the requirement to have the rego of the vehicle you operate on the roads current ... an unfair law ... ???

[Scuba_Steve]

And ... is having the requirement to have the rego of the vehicle you operate on the roads current ... an unfair law ... ???

it is as soon as you get more than 1, or if you have a bike, or if you have a diesel.

[FJRider]

it is as soon as you get more than 1, or if you have a bike, or if you have a diesel.

Funny how not many complained until the ACC levy was increased.

And the biggest moan about the ANPR program is the (supposed) increased chance of getting caught.

And I have more than one vehicle ... and don't see an issue with it. If you can't afford more than one vehicle ... DON'T ... because it wont get cheaper anytime soon.

[Scuba_Steve]

Funny how not many complained until the ACC levy was increased.

And the biggest moan about the ANPR program is the (supposed) increased chance of getting caught.

And I have more than one vehicle ... and don't see an issue with it. If you can't afford more than one vehicle ... DON'T ... because it wont get cheaper anytime soon.

people always griped about it but it was liveable. Now prices have been increased way far in excess of liveable or fair, and at a time when the Govt is forcing up all other prices making the whole living a struggle for many.

Maybee you like being financially raped & hey good for you, but the majority of us don't like being extorted.
I used to get all 3 of my vehicles (at the time) for the price of 1 bike (current). It would cost me around 4x that now, thats around 1.8k extra ontop of all the other increased living costs just to drive 1 vehicle of my choice... So I choose to follow the spirit, purpose, intent of the law rather than the letter & do all my vehicles for the price of 1 bike still.

[FJRider]

people always griped about it but it was liveable. Now prices have been increased way far in excess of liveable or fair, and at a time when the Govt is forcing up all other prices making the whole living a struggle for many.

Maybee you like being financially raped & hey good for you, but the majority of us don't like being extorted.
I used to get all 3 of my vehicles (at the time) for the price of 1 bike (current). It would cost me around 4x that now, thats around 1.8k extra ontop of all the other increased living costs just to drive 1 vehicle of my choice... So I choose to follow the spirit, purpose, intent of the law rather than the letter & do all my vehicles for the price of 1 bike still.

People gripe more when they don't pay rego and get pinged for it. And the more that don't will only encourage TPTB to find more ways to stop it.

I lived in Singapore for a few years. Their "Road Tax" system was based on engine capacity. The bigger the engine ... the more you paid. My 750 Honda cost me about $700 (NZ) a year. The fines for no Road Tax were in the thousands of $$$ ... and that was back in the eighties.

Some people just don't realize how well off they are. Time to reassess your choice (and need/number) of vehicles maybe ...

[Zedder]

The default procedure is that your found guilty, with no more proof than the original document.



Whats tha? a list of agruements you've previously lost?

Dude, I've got better things to do than prove you wrong a second time.


So did you fight them like you're always going on about on here. You've probably never done it or protested about anything of worth in your life but you do like to bluster on and on.

They certainly weren't any arguments on my part only bizarre comments by you. At the very least they're entertaining but, it's time to face up to the fact that this isn't The Matrix and you're not Neo even though you have the belief you can save the world from the evil powers that be. Just remember which pills to take.

[Madness]

I blame the extraordinary heat we're experiencing this summer.

:corn:

[Zedder]

I blame the extraordinary heat we're experiencing this summer.

:corn:

Yeah, it's Madness...

[bogan]

Interestingly ... the camera in the Ngauranga will most likely be just a speed camera. Unless it is directly connected to either a Police vehicle, or Police station via hard wire system. The amount of data required to be transmitted by "other" means ... would make it plainly obvious.

But don't let lack of facts stand in the way of a good rant ...

Amount of data? A number plate takes up what, 4 bytes, multiply that by say 5 million vehicles, even a dial up connection could download the whole database in a few hours, 3G for just the changes is easily within its capabilities.

But don't let lack of facts stand in the way of a good rant ...

[rustyrobot]

It looks like the Ngauranga gorge Camera has been changed to a rego plate recognition camera

Hmmm, what evidence is there that this is a camera which means there will be a different process of some sort?

It seems to me that if all NZ Police/NZTA wanted to do was compare the Plate number (which current cameras obviously capture - I know this from experience) against the Vehicle Licencing (aka Registration) data at that date, they could do it with the current hardware.

I would have thought that most likely reason for he change of camera was just for a better quality image.

Ready to be corrected, but seems like a big call to make without any evidence.

[caspernz]

Hmmm, what evidence is there that this is a camera which means there will be a different process of some sort?

It seems to me that if all NZ Police/NZTA wanted to do was compare the Plate number (which current cameras obviously capture - I know this from experience) against the Vehicle Licencing (aka Registration) data at that date, they could do it with the current hardware.

I would have thought that most likely reason for he change of camera was just for a better quality image.

Ready to be corrected, but seems like a big call to make without any evidence.

Give it a week? If there's no wah-wah thread about "I got pinged for no rego" on KB by then...it's not an ANPR camera :rolleyes:

[FJRider]

Give it a week? If there's no wah-wah thread about "I got pinged for no rego" on KB by then...it's not an ANPR camera :rolleyes:

Would anybody really admit it ... after the warning it could be an ANPR camera ... ??

[R650R]

Give it a week? If there's no wah-wah thread about "I got pinged for no rego" on KB by then...it's not an ANPR camera :rolleyes:

Good point Casper.

I watched a documentary about these cams when in UK where they have had them for awhile. Apparently one in ten vehicles is worth stopping by the law for rego/wof/crime related issues. One of the cops reckoned he could even park an ANPR wagon outside the copshop and do an honest days work.
If it was an ANPR cam I'm sure the police would relish doing a big media release about it. They already had the mobile ANPR vans in our local newspaper ages ago.
The biggest worry for biker is still the *555er saddo stuck in the que with his wife and 2.5 children in the people carrier while we lanesplit past him... :)

I'd love to cross examine one of those witnesses. "Sir just to be fair we thought we'd follow you for awhile and check on your driving to see if your qualified to judge someone else, this is what we recorded..."

[Scuba_Steve]

The biggest worry for biker is still the *555er saddo stuck in the que with his wife and 2.5 children in the people carrier while we lanesplit past him... :)

I'd love to cross examine one of those witnesses. "Sir just to be fair we thought we'd follow you for awhile and check on your driving to see if your qualified to judge someone else, this is what we recorded..."

Have you been hit with a *555??? I've always wondered if they actually went past the submission stage & if so just what the recipient received

[R650R]

Have you been hit with a *555??? I've always wondered if they actually went past the submission stage & if so just what the recipient received

Got stopped once in the truck by a cop so he could tell me how good my driving was and didn't know what the caller was talking about. One of the other guys got pinged for failing to give way at a roundabout by a sacred off duty firefighter and his wife, he got pulled and a $125 fine. If they have two or more witnesses I think your buggered unless you want to play out the court game... I know in the bay here they treat the calls with priority even though some of them are pathetic minor complaints. Funny though of all the times I phoned in epic blind corner overtakers while in the btrain I never once saw any of them stopped by police and often there were cops in the area, but life is never fair...

[Shadows]

Have you been hit with a *555??? I've always wondered if they actually went past the submission stage & if so just what the recipient received
If you ring *555 they act on it. It's the same as dialling 111 without having to ask to be put through to the cops.

[Scuba_Steve]

I usually do it online, I've called once after seeing some wanker almost hit a bike when forcing into the other lane because he didn't want to merge

On the phone I was told they'll get the cops in the area on the lookout. If not found he'll just get a letter saying someone noticed him being a wanker, don't do it next time & if I want to formally complain goto a cop shop.
When doing online however it just says they'll send a message reminding them of their wrong doings but if you want to lodge a formal complaint then ya gotta go through da cop shop i.e the letter sent out is just a "you've done something wrong, do it right next time" rather than a fine. Which I'm happy with, most people are ignorant of the law & just need to know.
I was just wondering if anyone had received these "bad driving" letters & what they entailed etc

[oneofsix]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/motoring/8391824/Speed-cameras-get-smarter-on-roads

Our speedy news media must be having a slow day so finely decided to print about the camera. As suspected, it now appears that when they are slow adjust the limit up again they will be able to ping you with the new camera being that "If the speed limit in the gorge is changed temporarily, the new camera can be adjusted remotely", so those days where the signs still say 60 and yet there is no traffic :nono: Drive to the signs, NOT the conditions. :nya: Don't keep your eyes on the road, instead watch to overhead gantries an your speedo. "If people are travelling under the speed limit, there's absolutely nothing to worry about." :laugh:

this is playing with the truth a bit; "Police do not record the amount of revenue collected by each speed camera, but Mr Griffiths said there was "strong evidence" that cameras encouraged drivers to slow down, and reduced crashes."
They know which cameras "issue" the most tickets and yet don't know the revenue figures - yeah right. And, as well discussed before there is in fact strong evidence that camera increase crashes and no evidence, just assumption, that they reduce them.

[roogazza]

I haven't read back far so don't know if this has been reported?
The camera in the Gorge was reported on the news just minutes ago that it has gone digital. That is all that was said.
So is it NPR type or just speeding as it was ?

[oneofsix]

I haven't read back far so don't know if this has been reported?
The camera in the Gorge was reported on the news just minutes ago that it has gone digital. That is all that was said.
So is it NPR type or just speeding as it was ?

They neither confirm nor deny. It's digital and can be downloaded remotely to a central site. Draw your own conclusions but mine say that it isn't a large leap from the digital photo going to a central site to the central site doing auto Reg checking. You wont see the flash so you wont know until you get the letter.

[superjackal]

Does it read absolutely everything or just when the speed sensor triggers? In other words if you're doing 60 in a 80 does it read your plate anyway?

[Coldrider]

The camera in the gorge that can photograph a speedster amoungst six lanes of traffic simultaneously is shooting blanks.

[pete376403]

Community spirit...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Bw2C_XR64Y

[veldthui]

If you ring *555 they act on it. It's the same as dialling 111 without having to ask to be put through to the cops.

Rubbish. I called *555 following a truck one day that was all over the road. I followed him for 50kms and there was even a cop going the other way that past us but no sign. I went in to the cop shop in town after he stopped and told him where to find the guy. They actually went round and turned out he was not drunk but tired and was falling asleep at the wheel. Decided he better pull over in the end. He nearly took out 5 cars and two bridges but no sign of any cop except the one that went the other way and carried on even though I flash my lights and waved at him.
Turns out they were all too busy to care.

[R650R]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/9357678/Ngauranga-Gorge-camera-takes-ticket-haul-up-46-per-cent

"Police have provided data on fastest recorded speeds at camera sites in the past, but refused to specify September's fastest gorge drivers - declining the data "in the interest of public safety".

"Police do not want to encourage copycat offending by presenting what may be seen as a target to some drivers," the Official Information Act response read.

Mr Stables said: "Police will not be releasing these figures due to concerns that it glamorises unsafe driver behaviour." In recent years, cars have been clocked travelling as fast as 168kmh down the gorge."

Translation: There's a boat load of people here speeding all the time and not crashing, releasing the numbers would contradict our antispeed message.
One thing I've noticed is that whenever there is these newspaper articles in the oh wow category of we caught someone fast its never more than the 170ish mark, except for that duke rider in Napier snapped at eskdale.
I agree speed is dangerous and we need enforcement to some level but wonder what they police think they will achieve not revealing info here... Wonder what the average patrol car speed past there is responding to the suburbs/city?

[Berg]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/9357678/Ngauranga-Gorge-camera-takes-ticket-haul-up-46-per-cent

"Police have provided data on fastest recorded speeds at camera sites in the past, but refused to specify September's fastest gorge drivers - declining the data "in the interest of public safety".

"Police do not want to encourage copycat offending by presenting what may be seen as a target to some drivers," the Official Information Act response read.

Mr Stables said: "Police will not be releasing these figures due to concerns that it glamorises unsafe driver behaviour." In recent years, cars have been clocked travelling as fast as 168kmh down the gorge."

Translation: There's a boat load of people here speeding all the time and not crashing, releasing the numbers would contradict our antispeed message.
One thing I've noticed is that whenever there is these newspaper articles in the oh wow category of we caught someone fast its never more than the 170ish mark, except for that duke rider in Napier snapped at eskdale.
I agree speed is dangerous and we need enforcement to some level but wonder what they police think they will achieve not revealing info here... Wonder what the average patrol car speed past there is responding to the suburbs/city?
Sooooo, would you rather the police have to respond to rapes, murders, assaults at normal road speed remembering that police drivers HAVE to pass a practical driving test regularly? I think I would trust a police driver "priority one" driving as opposed to some of the other LCD (lowest common denominator) drivers in NZ.
Having had a speed camera ticket in a patrol car I can assure the paper war is long and tedious if you believe it was obtained while needing to respond to an incident at speed and many cops have just paid them as their notes have not stood up to the required scrutiny.
As for the Gorge camera, let's call it what it really is. An enforcement tool for detecting stupidity. Anybody with media access or local knowledge knows this camera is there yet many locals still get snapped (yep I've spoken to a few). And saying people don't crash in the Gorge is also completely incorrect. There are several crashes there every month (many nose to tail) with some being very serious. The camera is just one tool the police are using to attempt to lower that crash rate (and yep, that sounds like the company line but that's why I go to work. I don't have a ticket quota, I don't make any extra for issuing tickets, the police make nothing from issuing tickets, I'm just interested in everybody being safe and everybody paying what they are required to pay just like I have to)

[Scuba_Steve]

Sooooo, would you rather the police have to respond to rapes, murders, assaults at normal road speed remembering that police drivers HAVE to pass a practical driving test regularly? I think I would trust a police driver "priority one" driving as opposed to some of the other LCD (lowest common denominator) drivers in NZ.

:blink: Wait! when did the Govt introduce financial penalties for these? Or have the Police gone back to doing their job in recent months that I wasn't aware of?
So Popo HAVE to "pass practical driving test regularly" yet they still can't drive; these aren't the same "driving tests" taxi drivers take is it?




As for the Gorge camera, let's call it what it really is. An enforcement tool for detecting stupidity.


If you're gonna "call it what it really is" do so! it's a scam tool used for profit! nothing more



Anybody with media access or local knowledge knows this camera is there yet many locals still get snapped (yep I've spoken to a few). And saying people don't crash in the Gorge is also completely incorrect. There are several crashes there every month (many nose to tail) with some being very serious. The camera is just one tool the police are using to attempt to lower that crash rate (and yep, that sounds like the company line but that's why I go to work. I don't have a ticket quota, I don't make any extra for issuing tickets, the police make nothing from issuing tickets, I'm just interested in everybody being safe and everybody paying what they are required to pay just like I have to)

And yet it's failing miserably in-fact it makes the gorge more dangerous than it needs to be.
Strange to how before the camera is 100, after the camera is 100, but past the camera is 80 on a hill at a decent grade no less, hmm I wonder why it's setup like that... <_<
No-ones trying to "lower the crash rate here" if they were they'd make it 100 & remove the camera, no they're trying to scam people for a fuckload of cash moneys that is all.

[roogazza]

Sooooo, would you rather the police have to respond to rapes, murders, assaults at normal road speed remembering that police drivers HAVE to pass a practical driving test regularly? I think I would trust a police driver "priority one" driving as opposed to some of the other LCD (lowest common denominator) drivers in NZ.
Berg, I'd be interested to hear about the current Police driver testing at regular intervals? I was involved with Police driver training for nearly 10 years. Though that was from 35 years ago !
Your average policeman, is average as a driver. I'm betting they still won't allow training in speed even tho they go to the local Wgton track Manfeild.
I was involved way back with the introduction of track work, but I can say that we fought tooth and nail for years with Nat headquarters, sometimes just for our very existance. Imagine Police wiping driver Training ? Which is exactly what they tried at one stage.

[Berg]

:blink: Wait! when did the Govt introduce financial penalties for these? Or have the Police gone back to doing their job in recent months that I wasn't aware of?
So Popo

Have a little respect. Mr Popo was the charming individual who ran over and killed a Porirua policeman while attempting to evade a few years back! By using that nickname for police you are showing a little disrespect

HAVE to "pass practical driving test regularly" yet they still can't drive; these aren't the same "driving tests" taxi drivers take is it?

Ahh, no.



If you're gonna "call it what it really is" do so! it's a scam tool used for profit! nothing more



And yet it's failing miserably in-fact it makes the gorge more dangerous than it needs to be.
Strange to how before the camera is 100, after the camera is 100, but past the camera is 80 on a hill at a decent grade no less, hmm I wonder why it's setup like that... <_<
No-ones trying to "lower the crash rate here" if they were they'd make it 100 & remove the camera, no they're trying to scam people for a fuckload of cash moneys that is all.

Let's study that 80kph area. Steep downhill, merging traffic from Johnsonville, Newlands, ultra heavy traffic flows both North and South, trucks pulling into and out of Taylor Preston's and the quarry and, to finish off, a shitload of nose to tails often nowhere near the camera because the average Wellington driver is in fact very average at best.

But hey, I've had my licks from cameras in the past and I still see them as somewhat of a speed deterrent. If I travelling in a known camera spot I ensure I'm not speeding. How can that be difficult?

[Scuba_Steve]

Let's study that 80kph area. Steep downhill, merging traffic from Johnsonville, Newlands, ultra heavy traffic flows both North and South, trucks pulling into and out of Taylor Preston's and the quarry and, to finish off, a shitload of nose to tails often nowhere near the camera because the average Wellington driver is in fact very average at best.

But hey, I've had my licks from cameras in the past and I still see them as somewhat of a speed deterrent. If I travelling in a known camera spot I ensure I'm not speeding. How can that be difficult?

That camera has failed to decrease the accident rate it's still the same if not higher than back when that road was dangerous with an intersection at the top, merging is MUCH easier at faster speeds & the trucks coming out can't even achieve 60 let alone 80.

travelling to a known camera zone you "ensure you're not speeding", how you do that then? I can tell you every day theres thousands of people doing that usually by heavy braking regardless of speed & steering at a speedo rather than the road or vehicles around of them... but hey that's what you call "safety" right!

[Banditbandit]

I was on Ngauranga Gorge - down on Friday, back up on Sunday .. it's fucking hard to keep to 80ks .. I needed to use brakes going down .. simply letting it roll, means I got too much speed on ... engine braking was not nearly good enough

Going up was nearly as bad ... I kept changing between 2nd and 3rd to keep the speed down ...

I was wondering if there were cameras in the gorge ... maybe I should expect a ticket in a couple of weeks ..

[pzkpfw]

What I hate about this stuff is it can be indiscriminant.

Having been overseas a few weeks, I came back to a car with an expired WOF. Now, I knew it was up to WOF standard, so drove it to the dealer for its annual service and WOF check - would anyone expect a tow truck to be used? (It passed the WOF with zero issues). And of course, until the WOF was done, I couldn't get the license either.

(The timing of it all meant that I hadn't sorted this stuff before the trip. Maybe I could have been smarter.)

I drove past the gorge camera to do go to the dealer (early morning, no time to "waste" going the "long way"), and apparently with plate recognition I could be getting a "no WOF" ticket in the mail.

The kicker is, if I were deliberately not getting a WOF over an extended period, or was someone not buying my license as an ACC protest or something, I could easily just drive a different way and avoid the gorge camera.

We are humans, not computers, and even when we basically try to follow the rules we need some flexibility (a-la x km/h margin on speeding tickets). What's the margin on the gorge?

[Berg]

What I hate about this stuff is it can be indiscriminant.

Having been overseas a few weeks, I came back to a car with an expired WOF. Now, I knew it was up to WOF standard, so drove it to the dealer for its annual service and WOF check - would anyone expect a tow truck to be used? (It passed the WOF with zero issues). And of course, until the WOF was done, I couldn't get the license either.

(The timing of it all meant that I hadn't sorted this stuff before the trip. Maybe I could have been smarter.)

I drove past the gorge camera to do go to the dealer (early morning, no time to "waste" going the "long way"), and apparently with plate recognition I could be getting a "no WOF" ticket in the mail.

The kicker is, if I were deliberately not getting a WOF over an extended period, or was someone not buying my license as an ACC protest or something, I could easily just drive a different way and avoid the gorge camera.

We are humans, not computers, and even when we basically try to follow the rules we need some flexibility (a-la x km/h margin on speeding tickets). What's the margin on the gorge?
If? you get a WOF ticket in this situation you have a lawful defence. You will be required to prove that you were in deed taking said vehicle for a WOF to the infringement bureau and it should go away. Unsure of camera tolerance but suspect (suspect only) 10% (8kph) or the standard 10kph

[Scuba_Steve]

If? you get a WOF ticket in this situation you have a lawful defence. You will be required to prove that you were in deed taking said vehicle for a WOF to the infringement bureau and it should go away. Unsure of camera tolerance but suspect (suspect only) 10% (8kph) or the standard 10kph

been there, done that, it's bullshit. They're [:Police:] there to extort, you have to take them to court to be granted even a possibility of your legal rights.
And the camera has 4km/h tolerance reported by the great media propaganda machine

[Ender EnZed]

No mention in this latest article about any tickets issued for no WOF/Rego. Is there any actual evidence this is an ANPR camera?



And the camera has 4km/h tolerance reported by the great media propaganda machine

Got a link? I've been past it plenty of times assuming the limit was 89km/h and never got a ticket.

[Scuba_Steve]

No mention in this latest article about any tickets issued for no WOF/Rego. Is there any actual evidence this is an ANPR camera?

Na I haven't seen anything official, but they have said the new cams along with the multi-lane scamming can also do red-light runners, & "lane non-compliance"
But they do mention "other advanced features" no mention exactly what they are other than to list a few as above so it might still be a possibility, just not a confirmed one or one currently operational as I'm sure they'll me more than happy to tell everyone more ways they tend to illegally extract money.




Got a link? I've been past it plenty of times assuming the limit was 89km/h and never got a ticket.

Na I've got a PDF on my laptop but the motherboard died on Fri so won't be able to get it off till I get that fixed.
Tho looking round the Googley I might have got that slightly wrong, seems it might have been that these new ones with the remote command can be adjusted for the 4km/h holiday scam & run at the usual scam "tolerance" rest of time.

[R650R]

Sooooo, would you rather the police have to respond to rapes, murders, assaults at normal road speed...

No I didn't say something that silly, just that it would be interesting to see the numbers/stats.
I'm all for the cops going flat out to catch crooks that's what we pay them for and don't think they should abandon pursuits either as I've seen several times people that they've been chasing come past our place like a rocket even though they've abandoned it...
I live near a busy junction so I'm regularly treated to the sounds of an SV6 commodore being redlined in 2nd and third gear down the street... at night the tyre noise from them coming down the main drag is quite surreal too...
Like another poster mentioned though I do find their vehicle operation a bit untidy at times. They need to learn the in slow out fast technique, all too often they are pushing the front end of those cars a bit too hard mid corner.
I find it hard to believe that its too hard to keep record of when patrols are responding to urgent incidents and are getting tickets for it... but that's an internal; issue for you guys to sort out...
I think the real reason we wont see the stats from that camera is that the 85% percentile speed is quite high...
Oh well it wont be long before we're all GPS tracked and ticketed automatically by computer, wont even get treated to the spectacle of red and blue lights... :)

[roogazza]

No mention in this latest article about any tickets issued for no WOF/Rego. Is there any actual evidence this is an ANPR camera?

Got a link? I've been past it plenty of times assuming the limit was 89km/h and never got a ticket.

It's pretty safe to assume it's a more capable speed camera. As they've said, it does multi lanes, so just an update.
It won't be mentioned tho to keep you on your toes lol.

I would have thought if it was ANPR there would be pursuit vehicles nearby, No ?
Snapping away all day everyday generating paper doen't seem logical.Then courts would be full of Not Guilties ?

[Ender EnZed]

It's pretty safe to assume it's a more capable speed camera. As they've said, it does multi lanes, so just an update.
It won't be mentioned tho to keep you on your toes lol.

It always seemed likely. It could well be they just haven't started using it's full capabilities yet though it would be a bit surprising if it turns out they tried for but didn't get the necessary political support for ANPR when it was installed.


I would have thought if it was ANPR there would be pursuit vehicles nearby, No ?
Snapping away all day everyday generating paper doen't seem logical.Then courts would be full of Not Guilties ?

Why? Once the camera takes a photo then they've got all the evidence they need to issue an infringement notice.