OT.Very.Heretical even.About CARS! Guzzi/Duc owners Italian=pile of shit. True?

[Ixion]

I hope that Eytie engineering ain't the pile of shit that rumour has it

Cos I've joined the dark side. Gone and bought a new (to me) cage. An Alfa Romeo. GTV 3000. It's going to be TOTALLY unreliable. And absurdly expensive to maintain. And an engineering disaster. And Mrs Ixion has already pointed out that it is totally impractical. I accept all that. It's all true.

BUT IT'S *BEAUTIFUL*

Please someone tell me that what everyone is joyfully and gloatingly telling me about Italian engineering and build quality isn't ALWAYS true.

It will certainly cause dissention in the gargre. The BMW will despise it with Teutonic arrogance. Li'll Ratty will cheek it and adore it from afar. And the Pajero will follow it round with an expression of calf like worship, and humbly offer to ram and crush anything that does not bow down and worship it.

But now that I've gone and done the deed I'm afraid that Eytie engineering will bankrupt me and drive me totally doolally (and, I'm already half way there remember )

Ducati and Guzzi owners, there must be SOMETHING good to say about the Eyties engineering?

[matthewt]

My last two italian bikes have been the most reliable I've owned. Despite me treating them like crap and doing crazy hours at times they have just kept on ticking. 36k on a MV F4 and 22k on the Brutale.

[Ixion]

My last two italian bikes have been the most reliable I've owned. Despite me treating them like crap and doing crazy hours at times they have just kept on ticking. 36k on a MV F4 and 22k on the Brutale.

Whew. Just let me point this out to Mrs Ixion. See dear !

[James Deuce]

I have a FIAT Citivan. I've owned it for 11 years and it owes me nothing. It is slowly rotting away though. The only "problem" I've had is two reg/rec units because the heatsink falls off and it is on the back of the alternator, firmly wedged against a toasty engine block. YOu can tell that the heatsink has fallen off because the engine dies on left hand corners, starts spluttering when travelling in a straight line, and then dies. Wait 10 mins and you're off again.

All the Interior trim is crap and things fall off all the time. The paint is crap. BUt is keeps on going, almost no matter what.

Oh yeah. It's had 3 sets of tyres and two sets of wheel bearings.

[Mooch]

I love the finish of those v6 alfa engines , complete with the polished air intake manifolds. They should run clear engine covers !.I thing Alfa's have come to age now , the old problem used to be rust . believe it was sorted in the 90's .Being an italian owner my Ducati has been cheaper to run than a kawasaki I owned compared over 20,000 kms (Tires aside). Can't speak for guzzi owners cos they've always been a bit strange.

[mstriumph]

According to Marion's Grandad, Italian tanks were so good during WW2 that they could go as fast backwards as they could forwards - now THAT has to be a plus in some circumstances??

---- just trying to be helpful here --- :rofl:

[LB]

.
.
Congrats on your purchase Ixion. There's something about owning Italian machinery that can't really be explained. It's all about what you feel in the heart. Welcome.

Alfas are lovely cars. Did you know there's an Alfa Club?
.
.

[SPman]

Used to have an Alfa Berlina 2l - the toughest, most fun pile of shit on 4 wheels I've ever owned. 185000 miles on the original engine and could still do Picton - Gebbes Pass with a full load in 31/2 hours without any drama.
Have any doubts - join AROC - plenty of advice there. http://www.arocnz.org.nz/
- and those Alfa V6's sound sooooo good ........

[Paul in NZ]

Oh stop moaning - You have it now and whats the chance of finding 2 people in NZ daft enough to buy one... Suck it up son and enjoy!

My Guzzi is a pretty reliable old brick once you have sorted it's little foibles and jokes... No different to any other mass produced vehicle but they have a certain something only the insane can appreciate.. ENJOY!

[louisb]

I used to own a Lancia Beta 2000... After rebuilting it (engine, rust, respray, suspension) it was a fantastic car. sounded like a ferrari at full throttle, handling was so much fun and would do 200km/h. I'm a mechanic so that helped :)

[Motu]

Pitchers,we need pitchers to know what this thing is.

25 yrs ago I worked for a Fiat agent,and a lot of other euro cars came in on their coat tails....shit,we got some good stuff in,I remember working on Armstrong Siddley's,Vanden Pla's,Porche,we had a 404 as a shop hack.I used to like the 1750 Coupes,but we mainly did Suds then,they were a bit of a pain to work on.

Italian stuff back then was as good as anything else - but time showed they rusted away with frightening speed and interior trim just fell apart.They don't rust these days,but the trim is still crap.Bear in mind that the Euros have a very good recycling scheme in opperation (they don't ship to NZ) and the car is built to be 90% recyclable...toss this in that bin,this in this bin.When I was playing around with my 1987 Escort in 1997 I was trying to get parts from England,and I was asked ''are you restoring it?'' A 10yr old car was considered very old.

[vifferman]

I very nearly bought an Alfalfa after I wrecked my VFR750, and very nearly gave up biking for good. I test drove a 145 (I think) that was in very good nick, but it was SOOOO much more ugly than our Peugeot, and disappointing in comparison. If, at that time, I'd driven the Peugeot 205 GTi we bought last year, there's no way I'd have a bike now.

I used to have a Fiat 132. Of all the vehicles (including bikes) I've owned, I have the best memories of the Fiat. It had 13 previous owners, had probably been crashed and/or rolled, but it was so much fun (although the 205 is easily the MOST fun). The engine developed peak power at 6750 rpm, so unlike your average Jap car that has a softish peak at around 4 - 4500 rpm, it just kept building up the power as you revved it, and with the standard factory extractors and a 4-barrel Weber carb, it just sounded SOOO good. Handling wasn't too bad either, once I took the oversized tyres off, chucked away the toasted shocks and put some Gabriel RedRiders on. Eventually the WOF guys noticed that one of the radius arms on the rear axle was shot, so that put paid to the 'active rear-wheel steering' (decelerate on left-hand corners, accelerate on right-hand corners, and the axle would help the turning).
Apart from the rust, the only real problem we had in the four years or so we owned it was that the master cylinder had been sleeved instead of replaced, and after 6 return visits to the brake place, I decided it was no longer safe for the wife to drive, as braking had become a lottery: sometimes they worked normally, sometimes the pedal went to the floor. :eek:
So we chucked it in the auction, and bought a Telstar (the singularly MOST boring vehicle I've ever owned).:yawn:

I recently bought a 1997 Fiat Punto for #1 son. Despite the soft suspension and performance, it's a lovely car to drive, and seems quite well designed. But reading through the service history the original owner gave us, it's required what seems like an inordinate amount of repair work: discs replaced, radiator replaced, gearbox and clutch fixed, headlight replaced, fuel tank replaced, and a whole list of other problems. Some of this may be due to being almost solely driven around D'Auckland by someone who was probably not the best driver in the world, but it's a worrisomely long list. The one that gets me is the heater core leaking onto the ECU, apparently a common complaint. The ECU has been cleaned and wrapped in plastic, and allegedly Fiat (actually F.I.A.T.) eventually got smart and shifted the ECU somewhere else, but if the ECU craps out, we're up for over half the purchase price of the car. Phark....

Cars... who'd want to own them - they're nowt but a huge money sink...

[Blackbird]

Mrs Ixion will not like the fact that my Dad bought an Alfa GTV brand new in the 70's and it burned oil right from the start and the sills rotted in the first year of ownership :no: A real Monday car if ever there was one!!!

Let's hope they've improved since then - lovely looking car though :Punk:

[Motu]

I think the worst thing you will find with it is - unlike Italian cars of old,and more so than the Japs - they have removed all tinkering potential,absolutly nothing to twiddle with,if something goes wrong,it's into Continental for a vacuum of your bank account.

[vifferman]

I think the worst thing you will find with it is - unlike Italian cars of old,and more so than the Japs - they have removed all tinkering potential,absolutly nothing to twiddle with,if something goes wrong,it's into Continental for a vacuum of your bank account.
True, dat. :yes:
I did most of the work on my 132: fixed the gearbox linkages*, replaced the shocks, tuned the engine, replaced the brake pads and took the disks off for machining, replaced the cam belt, did some electrical work, replaced the fuel pump, replaced the radius arm, etc. etc. On our 306, I don't even change the oil. I might do some work on the Punto, but don't feel like it. I've done a bit on the 205, but don't much enjoy it. It's mostly to save #2 son some money, as he doesn't have any (no job and no benefit for the last 6 months or so).

[kerryg]

[QUOTE=vifferman]Fiat (actually F.I.A.T.)
QUOTE]


F.I A T.= Fix It Again Tony :rofl:

[vifferman]

Fiat (actually F.I.A.T.)



F.I A T.= Fix It Again Tony :rofl:
That would have to be "Fix It Again Tonio", surely?

We call Fiats "Farts" in our household, because with the extractors, the 132 sounded kinda farty. The Punto on the other hand is way too quiet and inoffensive (unlike the 205GTi...)

[Ixion]

Pitchers,we need pitchers to know what this thing is.
.

This. 2001 GTV 3000 coupe. 3 litre quad cam V6. 60000k. NZ new.

[Pixie]

According to Marion's Grandad, Italian tanks were so good during WW2 that they could go as fast backwards as they could forwards - now THAT has to be a plus in some circumstances??

---- just trying to be helpful here --- :rofl:
Let's lay this bullshit to rest.The british Ferret scout car also had as many reverse gears as it had forward :devil2: :rofl:

[vifferman]

This. 2001 GTV 3000 coupe. 3 litre quad cam V6. 60000k. NZ new.
Oh, nice!! Very, very nice!!:woohoo:

[Lou Girardin]

There's nothing wrong with Italian engineering and design, it's the ancilliaries that let them down. Pasta for wiring and rust while you watch bodywork.
The lateish stuff is OK though, find a Alfa specialist mechanic and give him your firstborn.
You'll be right.

[TerminalAddict]

I've just sold my '89 75 twin spark.

Great car to drive, but a bitch to own.
I always said to people "you own an Alfa to drive, not to be legal"
The pasta for wiring comment is spot on ;)

Parts are crap to find, but since yours is far more recent than mine, I don't think you'll have that problem for another 10 years.

Pity its front wheel drive aye ? :)

The 105's are the money shot, but are pushing $10k now :(

[idb]

I used to own a Fiat Bambina.
I don't know how it ran cos when you opened the bonnet there was no engine, and it only needed water added when the windscreen washers stopped working.
It gave no problems at all over about three years and I think is still going 15 or 16 years later.

I have owned the Darmah for about eight years and despite showing no respect for its age it has never let me down.
Mind you the maintenance regime is a bit more onerous than a Japper but I think that connects you to the bike and makes it that much more interesting to own.
Because of that I wouldn't own a Duke to commute on but I suspect that your Alfa is going to be used as a toy as well.

[Ixion]

There's nothing wrong with Italian engineering and design, it's the ancilliaries that let them down. Pasta for wiring and rust while you watch bodywork.
The lateish stuff is OK though, find a Alfa specialist mechanic and give him your firstborn.
You'll be right.

I think they've sorted the rust problems now. In fairness to the Italians EVERYBODY had rust issues in the 60s and 70s.

[Paul in NZ]

Let's lay this bullshit to rest.The british Ferret scout car also had as many reverse gears as it had forward :devil2: :rofl:

I know. I used to own one... Farking funny watching peoples faces as you change up in reverse going back down their driveway!

Forward / reverse was managed by a big lever hooked up to a seperate box. Had a big lever to pull in to shift it.

It also had a 5 speed preselector 'box so 5 forward and 5 reverse... Brilliant..

[Motu]

One place I worked we had a Glouschester drill with a Bedford truck gearbox,you could work the gearlever from the table.It had auto feed and there was nothing like a blunt drill going to stop it going through a piece if 1/2 plate.Those Poms can make some scary machinery.

[myvice]

Own a little Alfa 33, love my little car! Never let’s me down and I don’t do a thing to it!
Ideals beautifully on 3 cylinders (goes to 4 after 1500rpm) brakes are a joke, no power steering making it one of the hardest cars to park and backing is a mission as you cant see anything!
Cost me $500 3 years ago and Iv spent about $100 on it in that time.
Will be my son’s learner car, doesn’t want to own one, but has to know how to drive, wants MY bike!!! Maybe, ‘Tis a good first/learner model.
Cheep on gas as 40lts goes over 500k's, and no speed cut-out so it’s FASTER than Jax's tru bro Subaru! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Timber020]

The old alfa's were far worse than anything else I can think of for rust. They were rusty when they landed in NZ new. They made late 70's subarus left by the sea seem like deloreans. Great driving cars and sound great.

Italians, who has ever won anything meaningful having them on there side?

[Lou Girardin]

at.

Italians, who has ever won anything meaningful having them on there side?

World War 1?

[scumdog]

I used to own a Fiat Bambina.
I don't know how it ran cos when you opened the bonnet there was no engine, and it only needed water added when the windscreen washers stopped working.
It gave no problems at all over about three years and I think is still going 15 or 16 years later.

I have owned the Darmah for about eight years and despite showing no respect for its age it has never let me down.
Mind you the maintenance regime is a bit more onerous than a Japper but I think that connects you to the bike and makes it that much more interesting to own.
Because of that I wouldn't own a Duke to commute on but I suspect that your Alfa is going to be used as a toy as well.

Had a Bambina too!
Only instrument it had was the speedo!
If you sat on a rolled up sleeping bag you coud drive with your head sticking out through the sunroof.
Went o.k. until it dropped a valve.
Only electric problem I had was that the lights went off when you turned off the ignition ( on the face of it a damn good battery saving idea) but it was easy to 'bump' the ignition key while getting something from the 'glove-box' and turn off the ignition, ergo no lights. Made for some scary moment on windy gravel roads in the country!!!

[Lou Girardin]

Years ago, one of my neighbours did an Abarth conversion on a Bambina. It took it out to 700cc's using VW pistons and barrels (from memory). This little thing would climb our hill in third, most other cars needed first. Torque for Africa. He even drove the thing to Wellington when they moved down there.