Handlebar vibration? [Archive]

pete-blen

26th March 2013, 22:10

Prob not the right forum here... But this is where most of the
big vibey singles hang out...
How the hell do yer cure it....
I have the feeling I may have "CTS"carpal tunnel syndrome & any
vibration sets it of..20 mins on the XT hands are numb can't feel
the levers..In fact they are sore..
" the XR 250 is vibration free & I don't get the prob"
I'm finding I have to wined the XT up where I can so I let it coast
and take my hand of the bars and exercise it... On the week end in
the lees valley I was able to short shift it to keep the revs
below the vibey area of the rev range... can't always do that...
It's getting to the stage I have to stop every 15mins or so...
Ever tryed useing the front brake when yer can't feel the lever
almost had a couple of good offs locking up the front on gravel...
Have to slow down well before the corners on gravel so i can
get away with just the rear brake...

So any & all idea's how to cure the vibration.. or at least reduce it...

nzspokes

26th March 2013, 22:24

Fill the handlebars with sand. Thank me later.

Worked well on my CBX250rs single.

pete-blen

26th March 2013, 22:38

Fill the handlebars with sand. Thank me later.

Worked well on my CBX250rs single.

kool...thats already on my list...
along with...
bars that don't have alot of sweep...so wrist stay straighter..less pull on the nerve..
interal vibration weights to change the harmonic frequency & bar end weights...

??????????????????????????????????

FJRider

26th March 2013, 22:42

Try Bar end weights.

hayd3n

26th March 2013, 22:56

also check wheel bearings and steering bearings :yes:

Frodo

27th March 2013, 05:45

I have a Pegaso with the same motor, which I find is pretty smooth for a big single. I have the standard bar end weights fitted. You could try foam grips. Engine mounts all tight? And something different: I find that running 91 octane, rather than the recommended 95, makes it run smoother.

Trade_nancy

27th March 2013, 07:53

I agree with FJRider - bar end weights are designed to alleviate this. I had a similar issue on a road bike - after fitting newer and better bars I would get a buzzing and ticklish tingle....(don't say it). I removed the weight inserts from old bars and made them fit in the new bars and all became well.

Paul in NZ

27th March 2013, 08:01

Or sometimes removing the weights works as well. Its all about resonant frequency .... I think....

Night Falcon

27th March 2013, 12:06

As you will know vibes can come from the engines but also suspension set up, wheel balance, tires etc which on their own or if combined can be a real problem and tend to get worse on a big thumper. So maybe theres something there you could look at to help reduce the vibes through the bars?

KTM have an aftermaket handle bar damping kit for the 990/950/690 but don't know if they fit anything else. Ive had the same issues from time to time on long rides and found adjusting the position of the clutch and break levers helped a bit as well as tire pressure.

good luck getting it sorted

pete376403

27th March 2013, 12:35

steel bars or aluminium?

The standard steel bars on the KLR were not too bad with the standard bar end weights fitted, but I'm convinced the Renthal fatbars are better. Still got the standard end weights installed.

All the other obvious things - engine state of tune, motor mount bolts tight, engine balancer system (if it has one) operating correctly have been checked?

JimmyC

27th March 2013, 12:56

I bought some Grip Puppies ($32 on TradeMe) a couple of weeks ago, rigid foam grips that go over your existing grips. They've helped in a couple of areas actually, vibration is one but overall it's made riding in general a lot more comfortable for me.

NordieBoy

27th March 2013, 15:42

Vibrinators.

First ride on the TT350 over to Mot and my hands hurt.
Now, the bars still vibe but just not in sync with anything (Tonic vibration reflex).

Woodman

27th March 2013, 16:35

Vibrinators.

First ride on the TT350 over to Mot and my hands hurt.
Now, the bars still vibe but just not in sync with anything (Tonic vibration reflex).

Yup, got em and they work. They sorta like a bar end weight but inside the bars not touching the inside of the bar itself. Google it . Ricor vibranators.

pete-blen

27th March 2013, 17:05

Thanks..will be trying the lot...
the vibes have got worse since I put alloy fat bars on..
back to a set of old steel bars I think...
fill with sand in the lower section...vibanators..bar end weights... vibe reduceing grips..
if that don't do it... a set of ROX vibration mounts..the XT has rubber mounted handle
bar clamps so that would give 2 sets..
Maybe try diffrent grades of rubber in the XT handle bar mounts..I have
a few diffrent grades of urethane bar I could turn some bushs out of..

Any way it's makeing the bike almost un-rideable for me as it is...
so off to build the trickest set of bars known to the motorcycleing world...:gob:

NordieBoy

27th March 2013, 17:47

so off to build the trickest set of bars known to the motorcycleing world...:gob:

Here's your start point for trickness...
http://www.fasstco.com/shop/flexx-handlebars-mx

Vibranators may be easier to copy though...
<img width=640 src=http://sports.nelson.geek.nz/motorsport/mybikes/20091203%20Vibranators/slides/20091203-093401-0003.jpg>

pete-blen

27th March 2013, 21:34

these... over $200nz by the time they get here... worth it if they work..
would give 2 sets of rubber mounts with the XTs ones...
http://www.roxspeedfx.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/av2se_2_560x560.jpg

barrie

31st March 2013, 14:19

I have had the same thing with every bike I've owned, now on a r100gs which does'nt really suffer vibes at highway speeds. I've put it down to bad circulation, pretty keen to try some of the tips as like yourself not being able to use the front brake is a worry, funny but right hand is always the worst thought it might be the angle of your wrist on the throttle. Cheers

dino3310

31st March 2013, 15:27

im using pillow grips on the bars now and the've cut some of the vibes from the XR plus i find the grip 10 times better than any other ive tried

NordieBoy

31st March 2013, 16:05

im using pillow grips on the bars now and the've cut some of the vibes from the XR plus i find the grip 10 times better than any other ive tried

What are pillow grips?

tri boy

31st March 2013, 16:30

What are pillow grips?

He learnt the technique at a piano bar, from a bloke called Juan.:buggerd::dodge:

pete-blen

31st March 2013, 16:44

What are pillow grips?

Pro tapper Pillow Grips... === > http://www.motosport.com/dirtbike/PRO-TAPER-PILLOW-TOP-GRIPS-TWIST-THROTTLE

dino3310

31st March 2013, 21:32

He learnt the technique at a piano bar, from a bloke called Juan.:buggerd::dodge:

well i was drunk and he said it was a common technique amongst Triump riders like a secret hand shake type deal, he was going to show me more involving whipped cream and a rolling pin but as i didnt ride a Daytona he said i didnt qualify for that ritual, but since i rode an XR he gave me his wallet and his 18yr old sister for the night.:woohoo:

ADVGD

31st March 2013, 21:59

these... over $200nz by the time they get here... worth it if they work..
would give 2 sets of rubber mounts with the XTs ones...
http://www.roxspeedfx.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/av2se_2_560x560.jpg

Any way it's makeing the bike almost un-rideable for me as it is...
so off to build the trickest set of bars known to the motorcycleing world...:gob:

Reducing bar vibe to combat carpel tunnel is going to have a short window of success, if any at all. Carpel tunnel is treatable these days mate, I'd be seeing you doc and have him refer you to a specialist. There is downtime, but, you'll sort it completely and be riding worry free in no time.

dino3310

31st March 2013, 22:01

Pro tapper Pillow Grips... === > http://www.motosport.com/dirtbike/PRO-TAPER-PILLOW-TOP-GRIPS-TWIST-THROTTLE

was looking at these types also. figured i'd start at the cheap end before looking at the bars and mounts.
http://www.adventure-spec.com/default/handlebar-progrip-foam-rally-grips.html
http://www.motoone.co.nz/pro-grip-737-gel-rally-grips.html

NordieBoy

1st April 2013, 07:45

was looking at these types also. figured i'd start at the cheap end before looking at the bars and mounts.

Been trying to get some ProGrip 786's for years.
The rep said if I would take half a box, he'd wear the other half as they would take years to sell.
But I didn't want 12 pairs :(
The smallest order they can put in is a box full...
Can't even get them in Oz.

pete-blen

1st April 2013, 09:02

Reducing bar vibe to combat carpel tunnel is going to have a short window of success, if any at all. Carpel tunnel is treatable these days mate,

correct..but from what I have read it's a short term fix..3 or 4 years..
It involves opening up the carpel tunnel to reduce the tention on the nerve
but the tunnel grows back/closes up again..
It's still best not to agravate the nerve in the first place.. I can ride the XR
hour after hour with no probs..

Bar vibes are real bad since I have put the fat bars on the XT...

Transalper

1st April 2013, 09:13

these... over $200nz by the time they get here... worth it if they work..
would give 2 sets of rubber mounts with the XTs ones...
http://www.roxspeedfx.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/av2se_2_560x560.jpg

That system is a lot like the Transalp has built in to it's top trippleclamp, worked well. Mine was old and squishy so i solid mounted the bars now but that has introduced vibes.

If the fat bar has made things worse then might you be better trying a different model. Bit of a bugger bars aren't exactly the cheapest things to buy just to try.

I'd also heard filling the bars with lead shot maybe cleaner than sand and/or adding bar end weights can make a difference. Guess it's a bit like windscreens and helmet noise. What works for one messes up another.
Another issue I have with adding weight inside the bars is after all the talk and efforts people go to to reduce bike weight then go do that.

I intend doing something to reduce the WR handlebar vibes sometime but it's partly just that getting round to it thing and $$ holding me back.

pete-blen

1st April 2013, 09:28

That system is a lot like the Transalp has built in to it's top trippleclamp, worked well. Mine was old and squishy so i solid mounted the bars now but that has introduced vibes.

If the fat bar has made things worse then might you be better trying a different model. Bit of a bugger bars aren't exactly the cheapest things to buy just to try.

I'd also heard filling the bars with lead shot maybe cleaner than sand and/or adding bar end weights can make a difference. Guess it's a bit like windscreens and helmet noise. What works for one messes up another.
Another issue I have with adding weight inside the bars is after all the talk efforts to reduce bike weight then go do that.

I intend doing something to reduce the WR handlebar vibes sometime but it's partly just that getting round to it thing and $$ holding me back.

If yer said... Could have made yer a set of internal & end weights..
I was in Blen the other day..have made a set of internal vibe reduceing weight thingys &
a couple of heavy end weight from stainless... Put steel bars back on with the lower section
filled with sand... A pair of vibe reduceing grips maybe vibe reduceing sleeves over them..

dino3310

1st April 2013, 09:44

Been trying to get some ProGrip 786's for years.
The rep said if I would take half a box, he'd wear the other half as they would take years to sell.
But I didn't want 12 pairs :(
The smallest order they can put in is a box full...
Can't even get them in Oz.

Hard to get alrite.... found this pair http://www.powersportjunkie.com/Pro-Grip-786-p/tr-170761.htm

what about buy the 12 and sell 11 on here, i'll have a pair..... just a thought

ADVGD

1st April 2013, 09:55

correct..but from what I have read it's a short term fix..3 or 4 years..
It involves opening up the carpel tunnel to reduce the tention on the nerve
but the tunnel grows back/closes up again..

There is a lot of mixed reviews out there, especially since older methods were not that successful. I know a couple of people without issue after having both wrists done. 10+ years no issues and going strong

I can ride the XR
hour after hour with no probs..

Well that's good news mate, reducing vibes could be the go. I am sure with your engineering ingenuity you'll come up with something that will work, even if it means installing a steering wheel with a sheepskin cover :p

94ZZR1100

1st April 2013, 11:51

Are you wheel bearings in good shape? When did you last check you PSI? Or is this just a normal thing for you bike?

pete-blen

1st April 2013, 13:02

Are you wheel bearings in good shape? When did you last check you PSI? Or is this just a normal thing for you bike?

The XT660 is quite vibey at around 4000rpm area... thats 100kph..
Wheel bearings..well theres no play in them.. Other than replaceing them to find
out if thats part of the issue.. It's done 38,000k so it wouldn't hurt to replace them..

But the front end is in the process of replacement with a set of Showa USD forks plus
clamps/wheel etc.. so we will see..

george formby

1st April 2013, 13:20

I suffer from white finger caused by years of freezing hands leading to nerve damage & circulation issues. Could be a worse colour I guess. Anyhoo, I get tingling like extreme pins & needles which eventually leads to my right hand just turning into a claw if I don't take heed & give it a break. May have CTS too, my wrists are fooked & very weak. Years of gripping things..... No sniggering at the back.

Finding the right bar height & position eases it for me. I've toyed with the idea of a bar snake in the past to try & beat vibes on an XT. Bit of rubber tube filled with small ball bearings, lubed & slipped into the bars then the end weights refitted. Sold the bike before I tried it but apparently it was a common & effective fix in the days of yore. The ball bearings vibrate but the bars don't.

pete-blen

1st April 2013, 17:22

might try a pair of these aswell........... http://www.activesafety.co.nz/nz-safety-shop/gloves/youngstown-anti-vibe-gloves
with a XT logo on them..they have to be good:laugh:

Frodo

1st April 2013, 21:30

The XT660 is quite vibey at around 4000rpm area... thats 100kph..

Pete, as I said earlier in this thread, my Pegaso has the same (or similar) motor and is quite smooth and to my knowledge does not have rubber in the bar mounts. I have the stock steel bars with end weights. I've just come back from a weekend through the Molesworth and Rainbow and sat on 100-110kmh on the open road and do not consider it to be particularly vibey. I think nothing about riding 500km to my olds in Tauranga. And my bike's done 99,000km.

The latch the covers the fuel cap and glove box vibrated at just over 3000rpm until I shimmed it, but I don't feel that in the bars.

Did your problem arise when you fitted new bars? Are there other XT riders here who can comment? Everyone knows that KTM640s vibrate, but these motors are not that bad.

vegeman

2nd April 2013, 12:03

Hi,
While the ktm 690 engine is pretty smooth, I put these risers because I needed the extra height first...and then thought I'd get the anti-vibe version.

http://www.roxspeedfx.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/av2se_2_144x144.jpg

I've had them for awhile and can't honestly remember what it was like with out them, but I did think this morning how well they must be working, as I can actually use/view objects in the mirrors , as normally rear mirrors on handles bars are so shakey you can't see out of them. In fact the OEM mirrors would vibrate themselves to death and fall off (i now run the ktm 990 folding mirrors instead)

pete-blen

2nd April 2013, 16:10

Are there other XT riders here who can comment? Everyone knows that KTM640s vibrate, but these motors are not that bad.

it's not uncommon with them... but since i put the alloy fat bars on it seems worse...
http://www.xt660.com/site/node/78

Padmei

2nd April 2013, 20:15

Hey pete. I can't help you with your vibe issue however can testify that my huckery homemade cruise control does wonders for giving the throttle hand a rest for a shake etc. it'd be good to get it sorted properly instead

chasio

4th April 2013, 20:09

pete-blen

4th April 2013, 20:36

I'd be happy to send you a set of Vibranators to try out for a month or two, if you like. They're the MX version so would only suit without bar-end weights or bark busters. (I ordered both types to try, but have gone with handguards; so these are spare.)

Thanks... I will keep the offer in mined...
I have made a set that can be used with bark busters & end weights...
Made them & the weights from stainless... Don't know if the martrial
has a bearing on how well they work.... guess I will fined out...
Got a set of Spider M1 anti vibe grips comeing aswell..

chasio

5th April 2013, 09:19

Thanks... I will keep the offer in mined...
I have made a set that can be used with bark busters & end weights...
Made them & the weights from stainless... Don't know if the martrial
has a bearing on how well they work.... guess I will fined out...
Got a set of Spider M1 anti vibe grips comeing aswell..

Nice one. You could probably adapt mine to work with BB's to do a comparison if you wanted. Just let me know as I'm happy to send them down.

Padmei

11th May 2013, 18:48

How'd you get on pete?

pete-blen

11th May 2013, 19:00

How'd you get on pete?

If I had to put a number on it , I would say 75% sorted
steel bars..
vibanators... made myself so how good they work I don't know''
bar end weights .. big stainless buggers..
lower section of the bars packed with sand up 2 the 2nd bend..
spider anti vibe grips..

Now the bike is rideable for more than 15mins at a time..

Padmei

11th May 2013, 19:13

If I had to put a number on it , I would say 75% sorted
steel bars..
vibanators... made myself so how good they work I don't know''
bar end weights .. big stainless buggers..
lower section of the bars packed with sand up 2 the 2nd bend..
spider anti vibe grips..

Now the bike is rideable for more than 15mins at a time..

Did you try the solutions one by one or all at the same time? it would be interesting to know which one is the more effective.

pete-blen

11th May 2013, 19:45

Did you try the solutions one by one or all at the same time? it would be interesting to know which one is the more effective.

I done them all in one hit... I,m going to go back to the alloy fat bars... might try adding
each on it own to see what ones are working better..

Padmei

9th January 2014, 20:46

I'm gonna have to follow up on some of your ideas pete. During the last few rides my right ring finger has turned white & numb- kinda weird & creepy when you look at it - sorta like someone has attached their finger to your hand.

I feel the vibes mostly on the RHS of the bar strangely enough - the left feels ok. The bar is bent after a drop (off a cliff) so I'm wondering if the bar is a bit cracked. Anyway I have a spare bar end weight floating around so may give that a try.
The bike isn't also running as well as it should so the carbs being out of synch may be affecting it.

pete-blen

9th January 2014, 21:02

Woodman

10th January 2014, 05:38

NordieBoy

10th January 2014, 06:55

I'm still trying to find some Progrip foam rallye grips...

Padmei

22nd September 2014, 07:57

Bump to see how you're going with the solutions Pete. Did a bit of research for my white finger thing & determined to make it go away.

http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/diseases/raynaud.html

Crim

22nd September 2014, 08:16

pete-blen

22nd September 2014, 17:37

Bump to see how you're going with the solutions Pete. Did a bit of research for my white finger thing & determined to make it go away.

http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/diseases/raynaud.html

the ROX anti vibe riser have more than halfed the vibs...
There is now 2 sets of anti vibe rubbers... the standard set
in the top clamp plus the Rox set...

Transalper

22nd September 2014, 19:21

NordieBoy

22nd September 2014, 19:44

Took the Vibranators out of the TT for a ride a while ago to see if they were actually working. Put them back in as soon as I got home. Can't stand the vibes without them.

pete-blen

22nd September 2014, 20:06

Took the Vibranators out of the TT for a ride a while ago to see if they were actually working. Put them back in as soon as I got home. Can't stand the vibes without them.

O thats right..got vibanators in there aswell... forgot they are even in there... unseen out of sight...

Got a set of "grip puppy's" to try... a soft foam sleeve that goes over the grips...

pete-blen

22nd September 2014, 20:16

I'll take a look at those for the WR.
I feel the vibes on highway sections.

anti vibe risers don't work with the standard anti vibe system with out a
little mod... the handle bars move but the wheel stays still....
If you get them.. give me a yell..i will turn you up the "special mod [TM]" that sorts it out...

Transalper

23rd September 2014, 16:08

...the handle bars move but the wheel stays still......

Curious to know what you mean. Is it that the bar twists a bit in the rubber before actually steering the bike? The Transalp does that with it's well aged rubber cushoning setup. Wonder if your mod would help that?

The ROX anti vib risers that Crim has are for fat bars, they do not fit the WR250R with it's 7/8" clamp and I'd need longer throttle cables. I'd have jumped on them otherwise.
ROX do do a 7/8" version but for me maybe another day as I have other things I want first.

pete-blen

23rd September 2014, 17:30

Curious to know what you mean. Is it that the bar twists a bit in the rubber before actually steering the bike?

No not a bit.... A lot... almost lock to lock with out the wheel moving....

Next time have a look at my XT... you will see the mod

Padmei

23rd September 2014, 19:01

got a set of these in the shed, reckon they'll help, mate? - welcome to try them if they work you can pay what they cost me? (don't need them on the Tiger)

http://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/rox-anti-vibration-elite-2-pivot-risers

Thanks Crim. I think I might try the revinators or whatever they're called. Those that have them - can you use them with the bark busters as the holding bolt thing?
Which ones have you guys got from this page?

http://www.vibranator.com/dirt_bikes_s/22.htm

Padmei

25th September 2014, 07:35

Bump for answer to above question. Did you guys buy A or B?

A
http://www.vibranator.com/v/vspfiles/photos/S06-S10-S11-M01-T150-2T.jpg

or B

http://www.vibranator.com/v/vspfiles/photos/S05-B01-R04-N02-M02-T125-2T.jpg

NordieBoy

25th September 2014, 07:40

A. .

Transalper

25th September 2014, 15:29

The one that said it is for "All Steel and Aluminium Handlebars with Removable Hand Guard Anchors" which is what my Handguards are.
Used the longer bolt but cut it down to just long enough to anchor the handguard with enough threads to loosen it again for removal and then have the Vibranator attached to the extra extra threads after that.
Mine is showing some corrosion on it when I last had the handguard off. Ignored it and put it back in the handlebar.

pete-blen

25th September 2014, 17:25

I use "C"... the home made version...

Woodman

25th September 2014, 18:49

A.

They are on the KLR, if you wanna try them out you are welcome.

2smokes

25th September 2014, 19:09

An addition to most of my bikes is a "cramp buster". It's a plastic do-dad on the throttle grip so you use the ball of your hand to operate rather than a "grip and twist" It has become a must have for me. I can ride at a constant speed and still wiggle the digits to help with circulation.

NordieBoy

25th September 2014, 20:08

Hey poo bum, you can borrow a cramp buster and give it a go if you want. I've got a spare in the Emporium...

Padmei

25th September 2014, 20:35

Thanks gents for taking the time.
I will order some.

I have a very good homemade cruise control thing that I use a lot to let the right hand rest in my lap so won't need the crampbuster.

Silly question but where would I get some lead shot or loose ball bearings to fill up my handlebars from?

NordieBoy

26th September 2014, 07:23

I injected silicon into the Nordie's bars. Not a good idea if there's holes to locate the instruments :doh:

kiwibul

26th September 2014, 07:26

for the ball bearings try Saecowilson (Wilson bros) Forests road Tahuna, and lead shot at Hunting and Fishing.

cs363

26th September 2014, 07:36

I don't think Hunting & Fishing/Gun City etc., have small amounts (read: well priced) lead shot (expect to pay around $150 for 10Kg) but I have found a guy on trademe selling 25lb bags for $65: http://www.trademe.co.nz/sports/hunting-shooting/ammunition/other/auction-784031690.htm

Enough for a few bikes....

I suppose you could also buy a few packets of .177 slugs to achieve the same goal.

Padmei

26th September 2014, 17:35

Ok cheers
may go down to tahuna with a spade...

pete-blen

26th September 2014, 19:00

I suppose you could also buy a few packets of .177 slugs to achieve the same goal.

Gamo .177 lead BBs..

chasio

27th September 2014, 12:23

Bump for answer to above question. Did you guys buy A or B?

A and B. I wasn't sure which would work and they were on special :)

I use B with my Zeta handguards (bar style). So the A's are spare but may find their way into the cheapo GN250 in the garage if Mrs Chasio starts riding, as she says she may. I'd have thought A would be hard to get out with any kind of clamp outside them, as they'd be so far in.

cs363

27th September 2014, 12:33

Gamo .177 lead BBs..

There you go. Wasn't sure if you could still buy lead BB's, thanks for that.

Padmei

26th October 2014, 14:58

Ever had the feeling you've just been had?
I had that feeling as I opened up the package from the Vibronator man. Hmmm a hundy bucks for 4 bloody screws & 50mm of brass rod...

I fitted them wondering how I seem to get suckered into these kind of purchases.
Started the bike & Hmmmm actually it does feel different.

Went for a 10min ride & although there still is vibration it didn't seem as bad as it was. A long ride should let me know.
Next step will be to fill the bars with pellets.