Difficulty with gravel driveway for a learner?

[raitho]

Hey guys

I am pretty interested in sitting my learners and getting my first bike but I had a slight concern about my driveway. It is a fairly long uphill gravel driveway with grass in the middle. It often gets deep holes in it from cars going down and digging them out. I'm wondering if I will have much issue with this as a learner? Here is a picture of the driveway:

http://i.imgur.com/H5wrVRl.jpg

Behind me in this picture is then a steeper concreted driveway which goes into the garage.

While making a topic I figured I would also ask about what bike I should get. I have done some searches through these forums and online but I seem to get varying answers. I am 6ft 2 and weigh about 75kg.

I started off looking at a GN250, my understanding is they are cheap to run and maintain and they are a great leaners bike. However I would do a fair amount of motorway and open road riding so would this be an issue on a GN250?

I then started looking at the Suzuki Bandit 250 as it seemed to have a bit more grunt but after looking around it appears they have an issue with their carbs which can cost a bit to repair.

I next started looking at a Honda VTR 250 or Suzuki Hornet 250 however the price on these jumps a bit from the GN250 and Bandit and there are not many in my area.

Are there any other bikes I am overlooking?

Thanks for the help :)

[Ocean1]

Bikes I can't help you with much, except to suggest you look at Yamaha Scorpios although at that height a lot of the classic learners bikes might be a tad small.

The driveway looks easy enough, certainly pay to practice with any new machine on it slowly though. Can you navigate it OK on a pushbike? Does the concrete get green snot on it in winter?

[Oakie]

Driveway looks OK. To be honest you'll probably have more difficulty coming down rather than going up.

[BMWST?]

at 6 2 most learner bikes will be a bit small physically but learners are now allowed a list of bikes up to 600 or 650 or so ,based on a allowable power to weight ratio.The secret to that drive is to keep as straight and steady as possible going up and coming down,just go real easy on the front brake,it may be that engine braking alone will keep you at a good speed.Trail type bikes are physically bigger .

[EJK]

Driveway looks OK. To be honest you'll probably have more difficulty coming down rather than going up.

+1

Be cautious with the front brakes coming down. Utilise rear brakes more.

[sketch]

mate of mines driveway was alot worse than that, first time i went up and down it it was terrible, now (couple of weeks later) i scoot up it like the ninjas a dirtbike, ul be right:niceone:

[raitho]

Bikes I can't help you with much, except to suggest you look at Yamaha Scorpios although at that height a lot of the classic learners bikes might be a tad small.

The driveway looks easy enough, certainly pay to practice with any new machine on it slowly though. Can you navigate it OK on a pushbike? Does the concrete get green snot on it in winter?

Not really any green snot during the winter although it usually gets water blasted once a year so I'd imagine that stops it. Going up on a pushbike is fine, a bit bumpy, occasionally back wheel will spin when I put to much weight on a pedal.


mate of mines driveway was alot worse than that, first time i went up and down it it was terrible, now (couple of weeks later) i scoot up it like the ninjas a dirtbike, ul be right:niceone:

This gives me confidence :D Just have to get used to it I take?

[DrunkenMistake]

Ask Hayd3n for a photo of his pain in the ass driveway,
Once you get used to it, you will be sweet as pie.

As suggestion above, utilise the rear brake and take it easy on the way down

[sketch]

and as for a gn........ well its not a bike that id have myself but plenty of ppl get along on the highway ok on em, talk to bosslady she takes hers to the track and take a look at this thread for a "whats possible" aspect

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/158200-Travelling-through-Waikato-Bay-of-Plenty-Gisborne-25-28-April?p=1130537941#post1130537941

[hayd3n]

Ask Hayd3n for a photo of his pain in the ass driveway,
Once you get used to it, you will be sweet as pie.

As suggestion above, utilise the rear brake and take it easy on the way down

who needs a pic when i have a video :)
<http://s642.photobucket.com/user/hayd33n/media/SDC10868.mp4.html
the old yzf600 , ahh i still miss that bike

[hayd3n]

i find on MY driveway , in ice/snow , moss no brakes is the best option , even my neighbour cant get the holden out of his driveway but the ol hornet no troubles

after some practice i can roll/throttle in and out of my driveway without needing brakes, until im at the top of either end

[DrunkenMistake]

i find on MY driveway , in ice/snow , moss no brakes is the best option , even my neighbour cant get the holden out of his driveway but the ol hornet no troubles

after some practice i can roll/throttle in and out of my driveway without needing brakes, until im at the top of either end

didnt you almost over shoot the end of the driveway heading back to the house one time? or was that someone else?

[hayd3n]

didnt you almost over shoot the end of the driveway heading back to the house one time? or was that someone else?

i think i managed 50 /60kph and ended up hitting the concrete wall albeit slightly

[bosslady]

and as for a gn........ well its not a bike that id have myself but plenty of ppl get along on the highway ok on em, talk to bosslady she takes hers to the track and take a look at this thread for a "whats possible" aspect

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/158200-Travelling-through-Waikato-Bay-of-Plenty-Gisborne-25-28-April?p=1130537941#post1130537941

If it's a sole commuter you'd be alright, not the best considering your height but if you're wanting cheap and cheerful this is it? if you're wanting it for fun, maybe not so much. Cheap to buy, cheap to run, cheap n easy to maintain, sold. If you want it for any other reason then you'll be S out of luck, as for the driveway, no idea! as for open road speeds I am only 9 or so kg lighter than you and it gets up and goes 100kmh just fine.

[pjpnz]

Riding in gravel... always watch where you WANT TO GO. Do not look at the grass strip, cos that's where you'll head. Seems elementary, but real important.

[Drew]

I would get a bike round there and have a hoon.

The absolute BIGGEST thing to remember, is to watch where you want to go. Not down at where the front wheel is. Remember/practice that, and your new bike will stay nice and shiny.

[strandedinnz]

I went on the ProRider gravel course, big eye opener on how to ride on the stuff ... good fun too! :-)

At 6'2" and 75kg you seem to be a lanky streak of .... ;-) Maybe go for something tall like a dirt bike or motard (I've a DR-Z400SM which is a great machine .. cheap to keep and LAMs approved) I'd skip the Scorpio 225's they are aweful to ride! A friend of mine has a Honda CB250 Hornet, very comfy machine but servicing costs more as it's a 4 cylinder.

[strandedinnz]

Be cautious with the front brakes coming down. Utilise rear brakes more.

I used to think that was the case when on gravel, but I went on a riding course and the rules for brakes on gravel are the same as on the road, more front brake than back .. too much rear brake and you lock it and then the stones roll around under the wheel making you go faster not slower.

[raitho]

I went on the ProRider gravel course, big eye opener on how to ride on the stuff ... good fun too! :-)

At 6'2" and 75kg you seem to be a lanky streak of .... ;-) Maybe go for something tall like a dirt bike or motard (I've a DR-Z400SM which is a great machine .. cheap to keep and LAMs approved) I'd skip the Scorpio 225's they are aweful to ride! A friend of mine has a Honda CB250 Hornet, very comfy machine but servicing costs more as it's a 4 cylinder.

Checked out the DR-Z400SM and it looks awesome but well out of my price range from looking on TradeMe :( Is it hard to get a dirt bike road legal?

[HenryDorsetCase]

Hey guys

I am pretty interested in sitting my learners and getting my first bike but I had a slight concern about my driveway. It is a fairly long uphill gravel driveway with grass in the middle. It often gets deep holes in it from cars going down and digging them out. I'm wondering if I will have much issue with this as a learner? Here is a picture of the driveway:

http://i.imgur.com/H5wrVRl.jpg

Behind me in this picture is then a steeper concreted driveway which goes into the garage.

While making a topic I figured I would also ask about what bike I should get. I have done some searches through these forums and online but I seem to get varying answers. I am 6ft 2 and weigh about 75kg.

I started off looking at a GN250, my understanding is they are cheap to run and maintain and they are a great leaners bike. However I would do a fair amount of motorway and open road riding so would this be an issue on a GN250?

I then started looking at the Suzuki Bandit 250 as it seemed to have a bit more grunt but after looking around it appears they have an issue with their carbs which can cost a bit to repair.

I next started looking at a Honda VTR 250 or Suzuki Hornet 250 however the price on these jumps a bit from the GN250 and Bandit and there are not many in my area.

Are there any other bikes I am overlooking?

Thanks for the help :)

First up, you have to pay to play. Look up the LAMS list (gooooooooogle) to see what is available to you as a learner i.e. what is learner legal.

My recommendation is one of the dirt bike based Motards. being dirt bike based they love a good falling over and are tall. plus they should handle the dirt path (oooh errr) pretty well.

[strandedinnz]

Checked out the DR-Z400SM and it looks awesome but well out of my price range from looking on TradeMe :( Is it hard to get a dirt bike road legal?

It is :-) But not as pricey as you think .. what is your budget ? My 2010 DR-Z400SM cost me $6500 and was barely used by the previous owner, I've run up an extra 10000km in the past 9 months of having it. But loads of road-legal dirt bikes out there, if you like the DR-Z, look at the Kawasaki KLX400 it's the exact same bike just in Kawasaki green :-)
Standard dirt-bikes can usually be converted to motard with only a little effort, but the dirt bikes handle the gravel even betterer (21" skinny wheel on the front works better on gravel than 17" road wheels)

Go to a dealer and have some test sit ons and rides see what feels nicest to you ... being tall you will probably be looking dirt/motard or tourer ... unless you enjoy the hunchback look you'll develop from a sports bike :-)

[MarkW]

With your height and weight any of the street legal 250 trail based bikes will be fine - I'm 5'8'' and have a DRZ250 Suzuki. 28,000km travelled on this bike, oil and filter changes plus a set of front brake pads have been the only work needed so far. I run dual purpose tyres and care is required on wet slippery sealed surfaces. My $86 rear lasts about 6000km and the $70 front over 10,000km. This bike has been from Kaitaia to Queenstown and back twice so far. Motards are generally more expensive than a trail bike as they have more bling. Kawasaki, Yamaha and Suzuki all have sensible 250 road registered trail bikes available and have had for years. A very good 250 single will be far cheaper than a 20 year old 4 cylinder 250 street bike to run - but it won't be as fast! Or look as flash.

[Wayz]

I'm 6 2 and around 97kg, I have a little CBF250 that I nip around on, bike takes it like a champ! Even around the 100kph it handles well......if I were you though I would start on a dirt bike, I think it should almost be compulsory for every biker! :shifty:

[Drew]

if I were you though I would start on a dirt bike, I think it should almost be compulsory for every biker! :shifty:This has been said by quite a few people, it makes no sense to me at all.

[BuzzardNZ]

You could take a look at a Hyosung 250. They are a reasonable large bike for a 250 and might be a better fit for you given your height.

[Ocean1]

This has been said by quite a few people, it makes no sense to me at all.

Makes sense to me. Learning anything is about pushing limits, and while a dirt bike's no better at that than any other sort the dirt itself is a helava lot softer than chipseal. Most novices chuck their machines away several times in the first months and I can't see how doing that on a dirt track isn't a better idea.

Sure, there's slightly different techniques required on the road, on a road bike, but at least in the dirt they get the basics right without loosing too much skin, eh?

[sels1]

Makes sense to me.
And me.
Particulaly in this situation

[HenryDorsetCase]

This has been said by quite a few people, it makes no sense to me at all.

Riding a dirt bike off road is a good way to work out traction sense, braking, how to make the thing go, top and turn without having to deal with asphalt, concrete, other vehicles and road users and also higher speeds. All I can offer is my own learner experience from 14 through 17 and learning to ride on my TS125 and impaling myself and the poor wee bike into the scenery all over the show. Plus when I started there was no such thing as organised training or stepped licences: I got a motorbike licence and that was it. the test consisted of the local cop watching me do a few figure 8's in a carpark and riding round the block.

Maybe today and particularly if you want to ride on road, all you neeed is road based training, but I personally think that dirt bike experience is still valuable. Hell of a lot of fun, too, lets not forget that. :)

[Ocean1]

the test consisted of the local cop watching me do a few figure 8's in a carpark and riding round the block.

The bastard! Mine just put his beer down long enough to look out the door make sure I had a bike there.

[Wayz]

Haha funny stuff! Yeah dirt is more forgiving than road! I have seen some terrible sights on the road, poor buggers learning to ride on the road. I like to think my dirt bike experience gave me a huge advantage over most road learners....

[pete-blen]

I got a motorbike licence and that was it. the test consisted of the local cop watching me do a few figure 8's in a carpark and riding round the block.




I have car & bike licence... never sat a driveing test in my life..:shit:
the local :Police: at Wakefeild all those years ago got sick of giveing me tickets
for rideing & driveing with no licence.. he draged me down to his house/cop shop
sat me at his desk stood behind me & pretty much told me what boxes to tick on
the test form... didn't even take me for a ride or drive..he had been handing me tickets
for the best part of 2 years... he new I could ride/drive...
But anyway this qute little book thing turned up about 2 weeks later..and he even delivered it
to my door...

Old Doug Jansion was one of the good old school copers..


And as far as gravel goes i have never had any difficulty with it.... easyest stuff yer can find to fall off on... easy-peasy..

[Dangsta]

The driveways a shocker from a new rider perspective so I can appreciate the concern. You'll be fine eventually. Going up will be no problem but coming down may be tricky depending on the weather. Again, I'm writing this from the perspective of a brand new rider on his learners. Don't let it put you off but be careful.

Also, fuck all this GN250 nonsense. Yes I'm sure they get to 100kph no problem (just like any bike above 150cc) but you're a big guy and you'll look silly. Plus try stopping from 100kph in an emergency situation and you may have a bit of trouble.

Now that LAMS has kicked in, you've got a whole range of bikes to choose from in all different shapes and sizes. Take a few test rides, see what you're comfortable on and what style suits you. Forget all the bullshit about what's cheap, sensible and easy to get parts for. Go with what puts a huge smile on your face when you see it and a bigger one when you take it for a ride.

Best of luck
D

[Drew]

Get a DR650. Rode one yesterday, what a bloody HOOT!

LAMs legal, great for a tall bloke, and gravel driveways become something to look forward to!

[breakaway]

Jesus H. Christ, I am shocked at the amount of people here that apparently have trouble with riding gravel.

I have ridden a RG150 up to a GSXR1000 and most things inbetween and I never had any trouble negotiating gravel (bar those times when I was doing stupid shit).

[2SMOK]

I'm 6'2" and my first bike was a 1990 GSF250 Bandit. That was comfortable for me. I wouldn't have wanted to be any taller though.

[Wayz]

[QUOTE=breakaway;1130558766]Jesus H. Christ, I am shocked at the amount of people here that apparently have trouble with riding gravel.

I hear you mate, this supports my case that dirt bikes are where all newbies should start, I mean riding a dirt bike is at times like riding a bucking bronco, if you can control that then your going to piss all over a road bike.....heck, worked wonders for me :yes:

[russd7]

to many damned pussy's out there scared of riding gravel, not hard, just relax, i have an 800mtr gravel drive that has pot holes from the blasted silage trucks and i still scoot up and down at 60 or 70 km on both the zzr and the goldwing. just relax and let the bike do the work.
as far as a bike with your stretch, forget the GN as has already been said you would look awkward on it, go for the big trailies, you will have much more fun

[unstuck]

Get a DR650. Rode one yesterday, what a bloody HOOT!

LAMs legal, great for a tall bloke, and gravel driveways become something to look forward to!

Been looking at one of those myself.:yes:

[motox]

Hey guys

I am pretty interested in sitting my learners and getting my first bike but I had a slight concern about my driveway. It is a fairly long uphill gravel driveway with grass in the middle. It often gets deep holes in it from cars going down and digging them out.

Easy............ Stand up, hang on with your knees and pin it!

[swbarnett]

Jesus H. Christ, I am shocked at the amount of people here that apparently have trouble with riding gravel.

I have ridden a RG150 up to a GSXR1000 and most things inbetween and I never had any trouble negotiating gravel (bar those times when I was doing stupid shit).
This is exactly what's wrong with the western world. People that believe we are all carbon copies of each other. Just because you're a wiz on gravel doesn't mean that the rest of us can be expected to be. We haven't all had the same exposure to gravel that you obviously have.

[nerrrd]

This is exactly what's wrong with the western world. People that believe we are all carbon copies of each other. Just because you're a wiz on gravel doesn't mean that the rest of us can be expected to be. We haven't all had the same exposure to gravel that you obviously have.

I've been reading a few gravel riding threads for tips, the consensus seems to be the more practice you get the more relaxed you'll be and the easier you'll find it. I guess most of us don't come across gravel these days on a regular basis except for the occasional road works (I don't anyway).

I'm going to look for some gravel roads around Auckland and give it a go (weather permitting) at some stage. If I don't pussy out, that is. Don't appear to be any specific 'how to ride your road bike on gravel' courses around - probably not worth the effort.

[Drew]

Here's a great way to fuck a weekend.

Go down to Taumaranui, vai Te Kuiti. It's a great ride as soon as you turn off from highway one coming from Aukland.

Do that on a Friday arvo, and get a motel. Saturday morning, once the hangover wears off from drinking with the local losers there, hit the forgotten highway! Gravel bit is pretty long, but well kept, and the tarmac from there to Stratford is the best piece of road I have ever ridden.

[swbarnett]

I've been reading a few gravel riding threads for tips, the consensus seems to be the more practice you get the more relaxed you'll be and the easier you'll find it. I guess most of us don't come across gravel these days on a regular basis except for the occasional road works (I don't anyway).
Indeed. I used to be fine on gravel until I didn't hit any for 20 years or so.


I'm going to look for some gravel roads around Auckland and give it a go (weather permitting) at some stage. If I don't pussy out, that is.
If you find youself down our way there's a 13km stretch of gravel south of Por Waikato that's not too challenging.

[Mom]

Indeed. I used to be fine on gravel until I didn't hit any for 20 years or so.


If you find youself down our way there's a 13km stretch of gravel south of Por Waikato that's not too challenging.

I feel I little ride coming on. There is also a really easy stretch of gravel up this way. Well, easy unless the grader has just been through. Perhaps that is when I should plan it :devil2:

A bit of gravel riding is good to have under your belt. Makes those pesky roadworks "fun times".

[nzspokes]

Indeed. I used to be fine on gravel until I didn't hit any for 20 years or so.


If you find youself down our way there's a 13km stretch of gravel south of Por Waikato that's not too challenging.

I had wondered about that bit of road. May give it a try sometime.

Waved to you on the southern a while back, I pulled off before Bombay. Im on a Hornet now.

[nerrrd]

If you find youself down our way there's a 13km stretch of gravel south of Por Waikato that's not too challenging.


I feel I little ride coming on. There is also a really easy stretch of gravel up this way. Well, easy unless the grader has just been through. Perhaps that is when I should plan it :devil2:

Cheers I really have no idea where to go, so I need someone to tell me :yes:. I think the AA maps still show which bits are gravel? Couldn't find anything online.

Say, Mom, maybe I could tag along if you do? That way there'd be someone else there if I end up in a ditch...ha ha not funny.

[swbarnett]

Cheers I really have no idea where to go, so I need someone to tell me :yes:. I think the AA maps still show which bits are gravel? Couldn't find anything online.

Say, Mom, maybe I could tag along if you do? That way there'd be someone else there if I end up in a ditch...ha ha not funny.
Another good area of gravel for those of a north Auckland persuasion is inland from Waiwera. Turn in to Waiwera off the old SH1 and hang a right to go under where you just came from.

Or head north from Matakana.

I find these days I'm fine on gravel (if a bit slow) except for steep banked corners. I find myself going too slow and expecting to slide down to the apex.

[Mom]

That way there'd be someone else there if I end up in a ditch...ha ha not funny.

Wasn't funny, but I did actually LOL.


Another good area of gravel for those of a north Auckland persuasion is inland from Waiwera. Turn in to Waiwera off the old SH1 and hang a right to go under where you just came from.

Or head north from Matakana.

I find these days I'm fine on gravel (if a bit slow) except for steep banked corners. I find myself going too slow and expecting to slide down to the apex.

Yeah, might have to organise a little local ride for some people to get up some experience on gravel. Back in the day Mark and I went exploring on our bikes. The weather was foul :pinch: was lovely when we left home but utterly chucking it down as we progressed. We came to the top of the Leigh hill and were pondering if the road was sealed. Mark insisted it was so off we went. Well, what can I say, not only was it gravel, but in large patches it was just clay, slick clay, winding, downhill roads in the pissing rain. Made for slow going and some slippery moments but we got there. Looked like we had been at a moto cross when we got to Wellsford :lol:

Nothing beats a bit of adventure. We have Muck Off now so cleaning up will be a breeze :D

[unstuck]

From the top of the leigh hill to the end of the seal in the whangaripo valley and then back over the matakana hill is an awesome bit of gravel, or just keep on going trough tomarata and te-ari to mangawhai.:Punk:

[Mom]

From the top of the leigh hill to the end of the seal in the whangaripo valley and then back over the matakana hill is an awesome bit of gravel, or just keep on going trough tomarata and te-ari to mangawhai.:Punk:

You know it! I really think I will organise a ride out over that way, so many people have not ridden the gravel and have an unnatural fear of it. Lunch at Mangawhai Tavern.

[unstuck]

You know it! I really think I will organise a ride out over that way, so many people have not ridden the gravel and have an unnatural fear of it. Lunch at Mangawhai Tavern.

Know it, I miss it just about every day. Used to live at pakiri and work out kaipara flats way, and quite often I would go home via magawahi and the coast road. The road between kaipara and leigh is boring as anything on an XR600, gotta have gravel.:Punk:

[Mom]

Know it, I miss it just about every day. Used to live at pakiri and work out kaipara flats way, and quite often I would go home via magawahi and the coast road. The road between kaipara and leigh is boring as anything on an XR600, gotta have gravel.:Punk:

Small world. I used to live on Kaipara Flats Road :lol:

[raitho]

Figured I would update this thread instead of making a new one.

Over the weekend I went out and bought my first bike, a 2009 Yamaha Scorpio :D

Have gone on two rides so far and while I have been avoiding areas with traffic I've been loving it. Managed to slowly putt my way down to Makara beach and back. Filled her up and couldn't believe how cheap it was to run.

Next up I need to find an empty carpark to practise some of the basic stopping and starting as I'm not very quick to get off the line or stop.

[DrunkenMistake]

Figured I would update this thread instead of making a new one.

Over the weekend I went out and bought my first bike, a 2009 Yamaha Scorpio :D

Have gone on two rides so far and while I have been avoiding areas with traffic I've been loving it. Managed to slowly putt my way down to Makara beach and back. Filled her up and couldn't believe how cheap it was to run.

Next up I need to find an empty carpark to practise some of the basic stopping and starting as I'm not very quick to get off the line or stop.

Good to hear! I found it easier to learn getting in amongst the traffic, takes a bit to get your head around but dont worry about the guy behind you at the lights honking if you still trying to go on the green,
Its all part of the process

[russd7]

Figured I would update this thread instead of making a new one.

Over the weekend I went out and bought my first bike, a 2009 Yamaha Scorpio :D

Have gone on two rides so far and while I have been avoiding areas with traffic I've been loving it. Managed to slowly putt my way down to Makara beach and back. Filled her up and couldn't believe how cheap it was to run.

Next up I need to find an empty carpark to practise some of the basic stopping and starting as I'm not very quick to get off the line or stop.

on ya dude:niceone: scorps are good solid learner bikes, well balanced, good idea to practice in a car park or go find a local dairy farm and get the cows in for the cocky (best to use his bike tho, cowshit is terrible to get off), best way to learn balance and slow maneuvering