Things I learned from the accident scene

[iYRe]

I had the misfortune of being at the scene of a mates accident (he was following me), but a couple of things I learned, and would do differently are:

1. make the scene safe, call 111, make sure everyone is comfy and then take pics ASAP before ANYTHING changes.. it takes 30 secs.. you have your phone in hand.. its worth it.

2. DO NOT TALK ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED! Especially if there is another party involved. In this case, the driver of the other vehicle was yabbering on to everyone, and by the time the police had arrived, he was on his 5th or 6th iteration of what happened, each one more in his favour. In this case, there was not much evidence either way, but his initial impressions of what happened were FAR more accurate than the last.

3. St Johns are freakin awesome.

4. The Police are awesome.

5. MotorCycle Recovery Services (yo Kevin) is also awesome. If you're in Auckland and use someone else's services you need your butt whupped.

I got my mate out from under his bike, got him safe, made sure the other driver was safe, secured the scene so it was safe for others to pass. I didnt take pics till I had done that and this was not such a good idea. I should have grabbed a few before I moved even the smallest bit of wreckage.

[speeding_ant]

Bugger - that's never good.

Great advice, hope I never have to use it.

[AllanB]

Good call.

I highly recommend punching the shit out of anyone who knocks you off your bike as soon as you can - they are then less likely to start telling lies to anyone else!






The writer takes no responsibility for the results of trying the above .....

[BMWST?]

Good call.

I highly recommend punching the shit out of anyone who knocks you off your bike as soon as you can - they are then less likely to start telling lies to anyone else!






The writer takes no responsibility for the results of trying the above .....

except about the fact who punched him

[AllanB]

except about the fact who punched him

Darn..........

I'd claim the drivers injuries were are result of their accident ........ you know their face must have hit the wheel officer.

[iYRe]

This chap was 89, and trapped in his impossibly large Landcruiser on a very narrow road.. just left him alone - more worried about getting the mate, and his bike, safe.

[cheshirecat]

Also add as an insurance and legal point - never admit liability

[MIXONE]

Hope your mate is ok.

[iYRe]

Also add as an insurance and legal point - never admit liability

yup, they drummed that into us back in the NZPO days (before Telecom) - never admit liability


Hope your mate is ok.

Broken Ankle, 2 Broken ribs and a tear in the kidney.. we were doing 30-40kmh - way slower than any of the other bikes on twilight rd.. idiots.

[Katman]

6. Blame someone else.

[iYRe]

6. Blame someone else.


No, dont blame anyone.. just STFU and let the police sort it out. Give em rational, calm, detailed explanations - they'll soon be on your side.

Out of the 5 Officers i spoke to that day.. only one didnt ride.

[Katman]

Give em rational, calm, detailed explanations - they'll soon be on your side.


Ok, change point 6 to - Lie about it.

[iYRe]

heh, right, cuz that'll win you friends :P

[Katman]

heh, right, cuz that'll win you friends :P

It's always been a winner on here.

[iYRe]

It's always been a winner on here.


so has Azkle, right?

[BigAl]

we were doing 30-40kmh - way slower than any of the other bikes on twilight rd.. idiots.

Yeah but they didn't get hit did they?

Perhaps you should have been faster and therefore avoiding an incident.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Well that didnt take long. Hope your mate heals ok

[nzspokes]

Yeah but they didn't get hit did they?

Perhaps you should have been faster and therefore avoiding an incident.

Fucked if I would go faster than that up Twilight. The road is shit.

[slowpoke]

I got my mate out from under his bike, got him safe, made sure the other driver was safe, secured the scene so it was safe for others to pass. I didnt take pics till I had done that and this was not such a good idea. I should have grabbed a few before I moved even the smallest bit of wreckage.

I disagree with your highlighted statement. The last thing you want is another accident caused by the first accident, so securing the scene always takes precedence. Documenting the scene comes well down the list of priorities.

[iYRe]

Yeah but they didn't get hit did they?

Perhaps you should have been faster and therefore avoiding an incident.

No, they didnt.. and no they shouldnt.


I disagree with your highlighted statement. The last thing you want is another accident caused by the first accident, so securing the scene always takes precedence. Documenting the scene comes well down the list of priorities.

I highlighted "secure the scene", then once everyone is safe, take a quick snap. There was someone else there to help by that stage so they could have stopped any cars for the few secs it would have taken to snap a couple of pics.

[Tigadee]

Also add as an insurance and legal point - never admit liability

Isn't that why there's SMIDSY? Everytime I hear "Sorry mate I didn't see you", I think it's just the driver's way of escaping responsibility/liability even if they'd seen you...

To my mind, that makes it even more important to wear high-vis... Not because it works, but because you can tell the judge "How can he not have seen me? I looked like a strip bar sign on two wheels!"

[Maha]

so has Azkle, right?

Self appointed winners ...are just that.

[iYRe]

Isn't that why there's SMIDSY? Everytime I hear "Sorry mate I didn't see you", I think it's just the driver's way of escaping responsibility/liability even if they'd seen you...

To my mind, that makes it even more important to wear high-vis... Not because it works, but because you can tell the judge "How can he not have seen me? I looked like a strip bar sign on two wheels!"

"I had a high viz vest, and an aircraft search light flashing at 100 pulses per second and he still didnt see me..."

[Tigadee]

"I had a high viz vest, and an aircraft search light flashing at 100 pulses per second and he still didnt see me..."

Precisely, and who is the cop/judge going to believe? :blip: :laugh:

[iYRe]

yeah, ah well.. life sucks.

In this case I even said to the officer: I moved him from his side of the white line to the oncoming car's side to get him out from the bike .. the officer said to the guy in teh vehicle: obviously you were on the right side of the road.. *sigh*

Motorcycle Officer too.. even! ah well.. if only I had stopped for a sec to take a pic..

[Verzent]

Just had an accident too and going through the process, thank fuck that I have insurance though because the cager who is liable would definitely not have paid a cent and conned me around otherwise. The police officer in charge also told me that the other was at fault and to claim on their insurance but sadly they had given the cop a false insurance company. THIS IS WHY it's imperative to have insurance because they will do all the dealings with other parties for you, saving you valuable hair follicles.

[scumdog]

1. make the scene safe, call 111, make sure everyone is comfy and then take pics ASAP before ANYTHING changes.. it takes 30 secs.. you have your phone in hand.. its worth it.

I didnt take pics till I had done that and this was not such a good idea. I should have grabbed a few before I moved even the smallest bit of wreckage.

True, don't want to compound thing by having other vehicles ploughing into the scene...

And Leave Everything in situ, move nothing cos:

(a) - more accurate info for investigators

(b) - no chance of being accused of trying to destroy/hide the evidence and/or orchestrate the evidence to suit your version of events.

[iYRe]

True, don't want to compound thing by having other vehicles ploughing into the scene...

And Leave Everything in situ, move nothing cos:

(a) - more accurate info for investigators

(b) - no chance of being accused of trying to destroy/hide the evidence and/or orchestrate the evidence to suit your version of events.

20/20 hindsight in my case.. Unfortunately the ambo and police took more than 20 mins to get there, and we were blocking two lanes.. the car and mate in one, and the bike in the other.. blind corner, so though it safest to move the bike.. shoulda got that pic before moving it though

[Kiwi675]

yup, they drummed that into us back in the NZPO days (before Telecom) - never admit liability



Broken Ankle, 2 Broken ribs and a tear in the kidney.. we were doing 30-40kmh - way slower than any of the other bikes on twilight rd.. idiots.

Someone was going quicker than you and didn't crash, they must be very lucky............they were probably wearing all the gear apart from the high vis and flashing lights...................bloody lucky buggers!

[nzspokes]

Someone was going quicker than you and didn't crash, they must be very lucky............they were probably wearing all the gear apart from the high vis and flashing lights...................bloody lucky buggers!

Twilight Road is a stupid one to try to go fast on. I dont care what you ride. There is no line of site up any of the corners going up or down the hill. And its often covered in clay/moss.

[Kiwi675]

Twilight Road is a stupid one to try to go fast on. I dont care what you ride. There is no line of site up any of the corners going up or down the hill. And its often covered in clay/moss.

Who said anyone was trying to go fast? You're right covered in crap at the moment, cyclists on the corners, chooks on chicken corner and a bit of loose gravel......perfect. But someone's idea of safe may not be the same as someone's else's, especially when taking into account the equipment being used......just saying.......

[nzspokes]

But someone's idea of safe may not be the same as someone's else's, especially when taking into account the equipment being used......just saying.......

Well unless the riders have some way of seeing through the hillside I dont care if they are on MotoGP bikes, its still a stupid road to go fast on.

[R650R]

I wouldn't worry about the need to preserve the scene if moving stuff means making the victim safer. As long as you inform the plod at earliest opportunity and don't lie about it then its not a problem. The initial impact point/marks is what they mostly interested anyway.
One tip another truckie gave to me after a head on crash was to write down somewhere what happened for your own personal use and tuck it away as over time the mind can play tricks on you as you worry about what might have been etc, what else could you have done etc. Damn good advice that.
As for the other person changing their story, yep had that one two. The cop kept on ringing me up (while I was at work driving a truck laden with Hazardous goods) asking me to make another statement, question me again etc. Told her no I'd already given them a statement, my story hasn't changed only the other persons. In the end she got stroppy and said investigation was over as our accounts differed so much! This was despite clear evidence from me as to the light phases and time for 44T to roll from a standing start that not only had the other person ran into the back of me (which is 99.99% always that persons fault) that she had run a red light to do it. Also the destination of the other drivers workplace 100m up the road clearly indicated that she'd intended to overtake at speed to get to the driveway before me, which is where I had to chase her to for details after she fled the scene without stopping!
I made that office post me out a letter also that the matter was concluded as the other person was in a profession where they knew all the dirty tricks to obfuscate a crash situation...
Back to bike stuff, keep an eye in your mirror as to where you last saw your mate. One of our group went down just out of Clevedon once, came round the corner to find other mate parked in middle of road frantic as to where the other rider was. Due to speed he had stopped some 200m past crash scene. Steep ditches and thick scrub made it hard to find rider. While we were at the hospital the cops went out there and they couldn't even find the where the scene had been or the bike that was still down bank!
Bear in mind on a bike even the smallest amount of gravel is an official cause for loss of control, not speed xxx in to xx corner!

[iYRe]

R650R - the only marks at the scene in this was was where I lifted the bike off my mate, and pulled it away and put it down again. He was pretty much leaning on the vehicle he hit. Otherwise pretty good advice :)

In hindsight, the guy has cut across the apex of the corner. Talking to my mate after he got out of hospital, he says "i wasnt going fast, but when I saw him I hit the brakes, and thought I had slid into him". There were no skid marks, nothing, so what I think happened was they both jammed on the brakes and stopped.. the 4x4 coming down the hill, crossing the white line, and being 90 yrs old reacted a bit slower and collected the bike.

Total impact speed was probably less than 40kmh (total of both vehicles). The damage done to the bike was so minimal.. fairing, screen, brake lever.. even so, broken ankle, 2 broken ribs, and a kidney tear is hard to get over.

[GDOBSSOR]

Darn..........

I'd claim the drivers injuries were are result of their accident ........ you know their face must have hit the wheel officer.

Well... I have an eighty year old uncle, much like the driver in this accident. Up until recently, he was allowed to drive, and I was quite worried at the thought of him hitting a motorcyclist. However, I'd have also been quite upset if he'd been hit in the face in retaliation at his age.

[GDOBSSOR]

R650R - the only marks at the scene in this was was where I lifted the bike off my mate, and pulled it away and put it down again. He was pretty much leaning on the vehicle he hit. Otherwise pretty good advice :)

In hindsight, the guy has cut across the apex of the corner. Talking to my mate after he got out of hospital, he says "i wasnt going fast, but when I saw him I hit the brakes, and thought I had slid into him". There were no skid marks, nothing, so what I think happened was they both jammed on the brakes and stopped.. the 4x4 coming down the hill, crossing the white line, and being 90 yrs old reacted a bit slower and collected the bike.

Total impact speed was probably less than 40kmh (total of both vehicles). The damage done to the bike was so minimal.. fairing, screen, brake lever.. even so, broken ankle, 2 broken ribs, and a kidney tear is hard to get over.

Good to hear the bike's ok. Pretty sad to hear your mate won't be riding for a while from the sound of it. I hope he has a speedy recovery.

[iYRe]

Good to hear the bike's ok. Pretty sad to hear your mate won't be riding for a while from the sound of it. I hope he has a speedy recovery.

thanks..

I am assuming the impact was slow enough there was no other damage.. only the visible.. but.. I guess the insurance guys will have to figure that out.