Question for sparkies

[Paul in NZ]

Just a clarification of a rumour please....

One of the girls has some used light fittings she was going to get her sparky mate to put up in her place. Apparently thats a no no unless the appliance / device comes with the original handbook / instructions etc. Apparently to do with liability re insurance etc....

Why do I care? Well I loves me gurls but miss Vicki has her eyes on a night store heater on trademe. Our house was built with a night store outlet / twin meters etc etc back in the day and its just a case of hooking one up BUT...... Not such a bargain if it can't be legally installed.

[scissorhands]

I used to be a sparky... as long as an earth wire is there if the light fittings are a metal fitting, is probably the important issue

Second hand fittings are legal to sell and buy so.....

I could be wrong as I'm out of the game now

[saxet]

If I remember correctly this comes in on the 1st July.
Any equipment connected to the mains needs a certificate that it is compliant with NZ standards OR a link on the C.O.C. to a website that states the compliance.
I think this only applies to equipment connected permanently to the power.
The heater you mention is an appliance so does not require a C.O.C. in the first place.

Even so any electrical equipment must comply with NZ standards to be sold.
Most appliances are therefore compliant as the original seller (shop) has ensured this, Bunnings or Mitre10 have got into trouble over this.

As a very general guide, if it's a known brand it's pretty safe.

[mashman]

If he's a sparky, get him to put it in. If it goes tits for some exceptionally obscure reason (he's a professional, a light fitting isn't a complicated mechanism), deal with it then. I'm surprised all of our houses haven't burned to the ground before now.

[blackdog]

Why do I care? Well I loves me gurls but miss Vicki has her eyes on a night store heater on trademe. Our house was built with a night store outlet / twin meters etc etc back in the day and its just a case of hooking one up BUT...... Not such a bargain if it can't be legally installed.

Although the power is cheaper the nightstores were power gobblers iirc. (Edit: Maybe technology has moved on since.)


If I remember correctly this comes in on the 1st July.
Any equipment connected to the mains needs a certificate that it is compliant with NZ standards OR a link on the C.O.C. to a website that states the compliance.
I think this only applies to equipment connected permanently to the power.
The heater you mention is an appliance so does not require a C.O.C. in the first place.



I think they are usually hardwired? (no 3 point plug)

[Paul in NZ]

Although the power is cheaper the nightstores were power gobblers iirc. (Edit: Maybe technology has moved on since.)
I think they are usually hardwired? (no 3 point plug)

It was just a cheap option for a hallway where heat pump was 'difficult' and not used that much but you are correct. Night stores are generally hard wired therefore from 1st July it would likely be a nono

[James Deuce]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_T-YHZmqNS5A/TREn2BXN7SI/AAAAAAAAABc/-rH0SE8QHoI/s1600/Sparkies+Espacio.jpg

[neels]

It's an appliance if it connects to a power source with a 3 pin plug, it's an installation if it's fixed.

Appliances need to come tested to AS/NZS3760 if they're sold ready to plug in unless they are brand new, otherwise clearly stated as untested and not usable. Installations are tested when complete, and need to be certified by a sparky.

Can't say I've ever heard of needing to have the original instructions, all that is needed is the appropriate safety testing before use.

[blackdog]

It was just a cheap option for a hallway where heat pump was 'difficult' and not used that much but you are correct. Night stores are generally hard wired therefore from 1st July it would likely be a nono

We put a 3 pin in the space and plugged in a night light for the kids. Shhh ;).

[Coldrider]

From 1st July ya need a Code of Compliance, Electrical Safety Certificate, a Declaration of Conformity and any manufactures connection instructions specific to the appliance. If the hard wired outlet already exists you won't need the Coc.

[neels]

We put a 3 pin in the space and plugged in a night light for the kids. Shhh ;).
As long as the fuse/breaker is the right rating, can't see why that's not legal. My brother did the same and plugged in an oil column heater with a timer in the winter to warm the hallway up on night rate power.

Night store heaters existed before heat pumps were cheap, to store heat on cheap night rate power, a bit redundant now. We just ripped out the night store in our house, at $1k for a 3kW heat pump it's a much cheaper option to run.


From 1st July ya need a Code of Compliance, Electrical Safety Certificate, a Declaration of Conformity and any manufactures connection instructions specific to the appliance. If the hard wired outlet already exists you won't need the Coc.
Sounds like I should be reading some of that crap the EWRB keep sending me in the mail.....

[blackdog]

As long as the fuse/breaker is the right rating, can't see why that's not legal. My brother did the same and plugged in an oil column heater with a timer in the winter to warm the hallway up on night rate power.

Night store heaters existed before heat pumps were cheap, to store heat on cheap night rate power, a bit redundant now. We just ripped out the night store in our house, at $1k for a 3kW heat pump it's a much cheaper option to run.


Sounds like I should be reading some of that crap the EWRB keep sending me in the mail.....

Erm, pretty sure it's not Kosher running anything from a second meter if it wasn't wired in for that purpose.

Meh, I've been wrong before.

[blackdog]

From 1st July ya need a Code of Compliance, Electrical Safety Certificate, a Declaration of Conformity and any manufactures connection instructions specific to the appliance. If the hard wired outlet already exists you won't need the Coc.

Schweeet. Go for it Paul!

Edit... Why not run the genny and compressor from it ;)

[Daffyd]

It's an appliance if it connects to a power source with a 3 pin plug, it's an installation if it's fixed.



Not quite correct... If it has a 3 pin plug it is a PORTABLE appliance. If it is wired direct it is a FIXED appliance.

[pete376403]

From 1st July ya need a Code of Compliance, Electrical Safety Certificate, a Declaration of Conformity and any manufactures connection instructions specific to the appliance. If the hard wired outlet already exists you won't need the Coc.

This is going to pretty much kill the market for second hand appliances - who keeps manufacturers installation /connection instructions?

[Virago]

This is going to pretty much kill the market for second hand appliances - who keeps manufacturers installation /connection instructions?

Me. Although finding where I put the bloody things is the real clincher...

[Coldrider]

This is going to pretty much kill the market for second hand appliances - who keeps manufacturers installation /connection instructions?going to have to, for seven years.

[Grumph]

Just a clarification of a rumour please....

One of the girls has some used light fittings she was going to get her sparky mate to put up in her place. Apparently thats a no no unless the appliance / device comes with the original handbook / instructions etc. Apparently to do with liability re insurance etc....

Why do I care? Well I loves me gurls but miss Vicki has her eyes on a night store heater on trademe. Our house was built with a night store outlet / twin meters etc etc back in the day and its just a case of hooking one up BUT...... Not such a bargain if it can't be legally installed.

Others have covered the new regs - it's going to be hardwired so the sparky installing will issue a coc.

i used to work for a specialist in nightstores. Set up right they're not a power gobbler. If you're buying a s/hand ask if it was moved complete or dismantled first. moving complete unless you know what you're doing roots the insulation....which if available is bloody expensive. We used to answer ads & I'd go out and dismantle,bring back and recon in house then sell and install with a warranty. Good business....
Oh, and anchor it to the wall VERY well....ours upstairs made a break for freedom in the Sept quake and nearly got out the front door.....

[jellywrestler]

If I remember correctly this comes in on the 1st July.
Any equipment connected to the mains needs a certificate that it is compliant with NZ standards OR a link on the C.O.C. to a website that states the compliance.
I think this only applies to equipment connected permanently to the power.
The heater you mention is an appliance so does not require a C.O.C. in the first place.

Even so any electrical equipment must comply with NZ standards to be sold.
Most appliances are therefore compliant as the original seller (shop) has ensured this, Bunnings or Mitre10 have got into trouble over this.

As a very general guide, if it's a known brand it's pretty safe. absolutely not, all downlight fittings must carry a CA rating from may 2012 and the ca rating sticker will tell you what you need to know in terms of insulation spacing.
the ca rating will not tell you the SCB and HCB, side and height clearance which the side can vary from 25mm-175mm
if it's a known brand then you could contact the suppliers to give you a data sheet.
of interest current pink batts have no heat rating and must be at least 200mm from any downlight.

[jellywrestler]

I used to be a sparky... as long as an earth wire is there if the light fittings are a metal fitting, is probably the important issue

Second hand fittings are legal to sell and buy so.....

I could be wrong as I'm out of the game now

wrong, don't need an earth if over a certain height

[jellywrestler]

This is going to pretty much kill the market for second hand appliances - who keeps manufacturers installation /connection instructions?

i think you'll find that sparkies will still connect known products, all they are doing is making us the policeman so shit doesn't get wired in, fact is fuck all is changing, the COC's for years have had to state that the appliances are legal to connect to the mains.
now a COC is required for installations, after 1st july you'll need a cert for every electrical job done by a sparky, be it change a lite switch or plug or hw element!!!!
fucking nazis

[jellywrestler]

contains fittings which are safe to connect to a power supply


relies on supplier’s Declaration of Conformity (attach or reference1 )


relies on manufacturer’s instructions (attach or reference1)


this is from the new form so a sparky can tick any or all of these lines. the top means me as a sparky can assess a fitting and connect if I see fit, then of course the onus is on me that'll depend on your sparky whether they want to connect it.
i'm available to do work in the kapiti coast when travelling through fro the hutt valley

[Paul in NZ]

Thanks for all the good info guys...

I would appear that a used nightstore heater just isnt worth the potential drama...