Making helmets quieter?

[Juniper]

Anyone got tips on how to make my LS2 quieter?

My ears are stuffed and super sensitive. I even have custom made ear plugs. But I've heard that my helmet isn't the quietest one out there. (Which is what I asked for when I was buying hmmmmm :nono: )

Please?

[unstuck]

I wear a balaclava under my helmet, works for me.:niceone:

[haydes55]

Anyone got tips on how to make my LS2 quieter?

My ears are stuffed and super sensitive. I even have custom made ear plugs. But I've heard that my helmet isn't the quietest one out there. (Which is what I asked for when I was buying hmmmmm :nono: )

Please?


One of them chin curtain things can stop some wind noise

[nzspokes]

One of them chin curtain things can stop some wind noise

My LS2 has one and is still a bit loud.

Ear plugs are the only way. Thats for any helmet brand. You dont grow hearing back.

[nzspokes]

I wear a balaclava under my helmet, works for me.:niceone:

Good for random bank robbery's? :lol:

[unstuck]

Good for random bank robbery's? :lol:

284926:2thumbsup:2thumbsup

[yod]

just basic ear plugs, I don't bother if I'm just heading to work or round town but if I'm out on the open road for any length of time I always wear them

[Moi]

I wear ear plugs - those foam ones - whenever I ride.

Also, check out this site: http://www.webbikeworld.com for their reviews of helmets. You might find you need to replace yours with a quieter helmet.

[Juniper]

I wear a balaclava under my helmet, works for me.:niceone:

Got one of those, doesnt overly help. Keeps my chin warm though.


My LS2 has one and is still a bit loud.

Ear plugs are the only way. Thats for any helmet brand. You dont grow hearing back.

Yeah my hearing is super important to me. I've already got irreparable hearing damage from stupidity in my youth and choosing 2 not very forgiving passions.

I've got custom made 'hear savers' $160 and worth every bit!! But still is not enough. I have to stop all the time if 1 comes loose, generally cause if I'm concentrating I open my mouth and stick out my tongue lol.

I've gone and grabbed some foam and am going to padd it out.

Yes it will be a new helmet soon.

[Jantar]

The main cause of wind noise in any helmet is turbulent air flow. This occurs at any point where the airflow is forced to break away from a smooth path, and is particulaly noticeable wherever there are gaps. As no helmet can ever form a perfect seal between helmet and head around the neck area the best way to make your helmet quieter is to somehow seal up those gaps, Try wearing a thick scarf or similar and see if that helps.

Otherwise its a matter of trying on different helmet types and see which one is the quietest for you when you are riding.

[nerrrd]

There's this kind-of-crazy-looking thing, attaches to the outside of the helmet:

http://www.amazon.com/health-personal-care/dp/B003FHLNVK

Mostly positive reviews but YMMV.

[caspernz]

Try out a few helmets before selecting your new one.

But before you buy a new helmet....consider that sometimes it's as simple as not having your head tilted up far enough, the vents on most helmets seem to make lots of noise when your head is tilted down too low, at least that's what I've found...

As for earplugs, any safety shop will have a big enough selection, the custom made ones are OTT :rolleyes:

If all that fails, it's Toyota Corolla time :laugh:

[nzspokes]

There's this kind-of-crazy-looking thing, attaches to the outside of the helmet:

http://www.amazon.com/health-personal-care/dp/B003FHLNVK

Mostly positive reviews but YMMV.

I had one. It turns your helmet into a sauna.

[Fern]

do you get the same problem on other bikes? Why I ask is that sometimes the noise can be to do with the height or lack of windshield..

[EJK]

Double bubble screen? Maybe?

[nzspokes]

Stand up while riding, that will tell you if the helmet is the cause or the screen or lack there of.

[Juniper]

The main cause of wind noise in any helmet is turbulent air flow. This occurs at any point where the airflow is forced to break away from a smooth path, and is particulaly noticeable wherever there are gaps. As no helmet can ever form a perfect seal between helmet and head around the neck area the best way to make your helmet quieter is to somehow seal up those gaps, Try wearing a thick scarf or similar and see if that helps.

Otherwise its a matter of trying on different helmet types and see which one is the quietest for you when you are riding.

Errr they let you try before you buy on helmets??? Wearing someone else's helmet would just seem..... Wrong? Gross? Just not right?

I've worn scarfs before and often do, but that's because it's cold!! Never noticed any noise change though.


do you get the same problem on other bikes? Why I ask is that sometimes the noise can be to do with the height or lack of windshield..

Yea on all. I've been pillion on a few bikes and then riding my own as well. I think riding myself is better, but that could also be I'm not thinking abou my hearing more concentrating on the road... Then notice it after!!

So I've added in the padding. Works to a degree. I seem to have made a wind gap somewhere so will try and move it around or what not. Trial and error. I did manage to wire up headphones in too!! :p a gimmick I think I will get quickly bored of.

One should not think that one is smarter than the people paid to design this stuff. :p

I love my customs. No messing around rolling them around to fit in and then them wiggling out all the time. The only draw back is that I have to keep them in gel so that they seal perfectly in my ear.

[Juniper]

There's this kind-of-crazy-looking thing, attaches to the outside of the helmet:

http://www.amazon.com/health-personal-care/dp/B003FHLNVK

Mostly positive reviews but YMMV.

Looks interesting. I think I could make one. Hmmmm.





If all that fails, it's Toyota Corolla time :laugh:

Snap Toyota Corsa for me lol.

[Juniper]

Stand up while riding, that will tell you if the helmet is the cause or the screen or lack there of.

Haha not too sure that's safe for me to do so at those speeds lol. I do lie down tho and that makes things quieter.

Tbh I think a big part of it is engine noise that hurts. Mine isn't exactly quiet.

[Angel_of_Metal]

Haha not too sure that's safe for me to do so at those speeds lol. I do lie down tho and that makes things quieter.

Tbh I think a big part of it is engine noise that hurts. Mine isn't exactly quiet.

Mmmmmm I wonder if that is part of it - With my hearing protection it's pretty quiet for me so an not ever bothered or uncomfortable at any speed, however whe riding behind you and you accelerate... *that* hurts! :banana:

But methinks it will always be somewhat noisy, and that is just a part of riding

[BMWST?]

any motorcycle helmet is noisy enough to cause permanent hearing damage.so all are noisy ,relativelyThe screen on my ol gs makes it worse,i keep meaning to take it off to see how much difference it makes.I know even if i sit really straight and tall(er) i get into quiter air.If the removal works i am gonna try it back on but shorten it

[Mushu]

I'd say you could shop around and find a quieter helmet, my LS2 is seriously loud, far louder than my old HJC. (and it produces lift, it tries to pull my head off my shoulders at over 200) Although as far as I know no shops will let you actually take a helmet out on a test ride so maybe look around the internet at reviews.
I use in ear type head phones, they tend to block enough of the noise while still allowing me to hear my bike, and some music too.

[Juniper]

I'd say you could shop around and find a quieter helmet, my LS2 is seriously loud, far louder than my old HJC. (and it produces lift, it tries to pull my head off my shoulders at over 200) Although as far as I know no shops will let you actually take a helmet out on a test ride so maybe look around the internet at reviews.
I use in ear type head phones, they tend to block enough of the noise while still allowing me to hear my bike, and some music too.

I'm going to have a look at those blutooth things. I wired in a set of headphones and really enjoyed listening to music. I'm not sure my bike will go over 200.....or will even get to 200, so I think I'm good with that one :P

The padding worked a little, but I didn't take into account wearing glasses lol......back to the kitchen table.

[Maha]

Considered a whisper kit? → http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/66539-Helmet-whisper-kits?highlight=helmet+whisper+kits

[granstar]

Probably my 2c of no help to topic other than if you find something that does reduce wind noise, remember to wear it.

Continuously ridden motorcycles 40 years (20 open face), played drums in a band for 40 years, work in industrial areas , and bit of shot gunning, so i'm fckd ( even with wearing protection).

I ride with screens mainly to reduce wind buffet from my neck ( another story) and with visor cracked open slightly. The noise that gets me the most is with the visor right up or half way down ( even with plugs in). Put up with it as I enjoy the wind in my face, engine noise I enjoy and doesn't annoy sort of acts as a white noise. The tinnitus when the bike is off is the worst part of hearing damage that creeps in over time.

So what model Toyota has wind down front windows :wacko: aye!!

[Juniper]

Considered a whisper kit? → http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/66539-Helmet-whisper-kits?highlight=helmet+whisper+kits

I've already got a chin thingy, but the neck bit could be interesting. I'll look more where to buy them (MM site is down....they are open on Sundays though!!) I'll also ask about the price of a good (better than LS2) quiet helmet.

Any suggestions on a new one?

[T.W.R]

:lol: just think years ago helmets were an option

whispers kits, ear plugs, scarfs :wacko:

just toughen up... one day being able to hear things might just save your life :argh:

[Juniper]

:lol: just think years ago helmets were an option

whispers kits, ear plugs, scarfs :wacko:

just toughen up... one day being able to hear things might just save your life :argh:

One day, with the amount of hearing damage I'll have, I wont be able to hear a thing.

[unstuck]

You need smaller ears, talk to mike tyson about getting them customized:niceone:.

[T.W.R]

One day, with the amount of hearing damage I'll have, I wont be able to hear a thing.

:rolleyes: don't get obsessed with isolating yourself from whats happening around you on a bike..... you aren't in a car any more :nono: just a decent set of plugs is all thats needed

[Maha]

I've already got a chin thingy, but the neck bit could be interesting. I'll look more where to buy them (MM site is down....they are open on Sundays though!!) I'll also ask about the price of a good (better than LS2) quiet helmet.

Any suggestions on a new one?

Yes they're open today, get over there and take a look at the options, there are a couple of real knowledgeable employees there, explain your predicament. A thread of this nature can just confuse the issue, everyone has their idea of what is the best solution. Personally, I like to hear what is going on around me.

[Juniper]

Yes they're open today, get over there and take a look at the options, there are a couple of real knowledgeable employees there, explain your predicament. A thread of this nature can just confuse the issue, everyone has their idea of what is the best solution. Personally, I like to hear what is going on around me.

Treads first, just cause they are closer, and the MM.

I can see the sense in hearing what's around you. But when its causing irreparable damage to already damaged and sensitive ears its not really an option. Not only looking out for my older years, but even now the excruciating pain for days if I go for a ride without my ears in or 1 comes loose and I don't fix it.

The world doesn't go entirely mute, it's just all the engine and wind noise.

[AllanB]

All helmets have noise. Even a quite helmet on your bike may be noisy on another bike due to different buffeting.

Couple things to try.

Throw a sheepskin or something on your seat to raise you up a fraction - does the noise reduce?
Duct tape a 2-3 inch piece of strong card or plastic to the top of your screen to see if it can redirect the airflow and reduce noise. Tape it on well - nothing worse that it flying into your face at 100 ......

Also - having read all your thread - you appear to have a loud bike (pipe?) and ride with the visor open. There are two things right there to play with immediately - close the visor and stick a noise reducer up the muffler!

[Geeen]

Errr they let you try before you buy on helmets???


..... Although as far as I know no shops will let you actually take a helmet out on a test ride ...

Some Arai dealers have BRIGHT yellow test helmets for you to test ride in, my local shop does so I am assuming some in the bustling metropolis that is d'Auckland should have some dealers that will

[Juniper]

All helmets have noise. Even a quite helmet on your bike may be noisy on another bike due to different buffeting.

Couple things to try.

Throw a sheepskin or something on your seat to raise you up a fraction - does the noise reduce?
Duct tape a 2-3 inch piece of strong card or plastic to the top of your screen to see if it can redirect the airflow and reduce noise. Tape it on well - nothing worse that it flying into your face at 100 ......

Also - having read all your thread - you appear to have a loud bike (pipe?) and ride with the visor open. There are two things right there to play with immediately - close the visor and stick a noise reducer up the muffler!

Duct Tape fixes everything!! Will try that this week.

I only ride with the visor open when It fogs up (I'm currently working on different anti-fog ideas), and then its only just a crack. I prefer riding with it down when/if possible. Though I've been told being able to see the road is important???? :scratch:

I've wanted to make her a bit more quiet, but everyone keeps telling me that "noise saves lives" and not to change it. "Better to be seen AND heard"


:wacko:

[AllanB]

Experiment with a decibel killer up the back of your muffler if it is really loud. If you play around with the insert you can reduce the overall loudness of the pipe but keep a nice deep tone that you hear when riding.

[nzspokes]

If your fogging up get a stick on Visor insert.

http://www.fastbikegear.co.nz/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=786&zenid=4ae054a37ab0fa760d3fa4cab3326192

I have the pinlock version. Same system. Brilliant. Never fog up again. I use it every day to work.

[Juniper]

If your fogging up get a stick on Visor insert.

http://www.fastbikegear.co.nz/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=786&zenid=4ae054a37ab0fa760d3fa4cab3326192

I have the pinlock version. Same system. Brilliant. Never fog up again. I use it every day to work.

Sweet, have saved it to watch list. (last thing I got from them I got $5 cheaper by bidding on TM!!)

Have you got the tinting version?

[Juniper]

See if I take out the fog, then I can close the lid and that, along with my added padding, takes out most of the noise.

[nzspokes]

Sweet, have saved it to watch list. (last thing I got from them I got $5 cheaper by bidding on TM!!)

Have you got the tinting version?

No, I use a clear. In winter you will be riding at night and the tinted ones stop you seeing on unlit roads. As I help take riders out on Sass on unlit roads it pays I can see where Im going.

In summer yes tinted.

[Juniper]

No, I use a clear. In winter you will be riding at night and the tinted ones stop you seeing on unlit roads. As I help take riders out on Sass on unlit roads it pays I can see where Im going.

In summer yes tinted.

Sorry I meant their transition one.

[Hoon]

I'd say you could shop around and find a quieter helmet, my LS2 is seriously loud, far louder than my old HJC.

+1. You get what you pay for. I had a Suomy race helmet I used for years until the lining started to degrade. Went into a bike shop and picked up a $150 RJay helmet. Couldn't believe how much noisier it was. It drowns out the sound of my motorbike on the motorway now.

So yeah - more expensive option is buy a better helmet.

[Juniper]

+1. You get what you pay for. I had a Suomy race helmet I used for years until the lining started to degrade. Went into a bike shop and picked up a $150 RJay helmet. Couldn't believe how much noisier it was. It drowns out the sound of my motorbike on the motorway now.

So yeah - more expensive option is buy a better helmet.

I've go my eye on a Schuberth. Oh it feels so nice on the inside.

[Maha]

Sorry I meant their transition one.

Wow that's cool innit though? might have to get me one of them, being a posser 'n all :rockon:

[nzspokes]

Sorry I meant their transition one.

Ok, yes that what I have but they dont go completely clear. So thats what I use in summer.

[Juniper]

Wow that's cool innit though? might have to get me one of them, being a posser 'n all :rockon:

But if you do that you have to have the full turborider/ghostrider blacked out look.

[Juniper]

All helmets have noise. Even a quite helmet on your bike may be noisy on another bike due to different buffeting.

Couple things to try.

Throw a sheepskin or something on your seat to raise you up a fraction - does the noise reduce?
Duct tape a 2-3 inch piece of strong card or plastic to the top of your screen to see if it can redirect the airflow and reduce noise. Tape it on well - nothing worse that it flying into your face at 100 ......

Also - having read all your thread - you appear to have a loud bike (pipe?) and ride with the visor open. There are two things right there to play with immediately - close the visor and stick a noise reducer up the muffler!

So I was riding along on the motorway and put my hand up where I would put the piece of card. It made things REALLY noisy.
Looks like my normal riding position is the quietest.

New helmet eventually. For now the padding will do. And will get that anti fog thing ASAP.

[Maha]

So I was riding along on the motorway and put my hand up where I would put the piece of card. It made things REALLY noisy.
Looks like my normal riding position is the quietest.

New helmet eventually. For now the padding will do. And will get that anti fog thing ASAP.

Is your visor pinlock (the anti fog thing) ready?
The padding in my helmet has an Air Pump system... I should actually use it more, it can be quite effective.

[Juniper]

Is your visor pinlock (the anti fog thing) ready?
The padding in my helmet has an Air Pump system... I should actually use it more, it can be quite effective.

Yep mines got the pin lock.

Going to buy and hopefully pick up tonight.

Thanks for reminding me lol. I'd totally forgotten. :facepalm:

[swbarnett]

I've been using my Pinlock insert for the last couple of weeks (brand new helmet) and I've found it next to useless. This moirning, although the left eye had a fairly clear view the right was looking through a 1.5cm strip. Turns out there was no fogging inside the double glazing but there was a lot of water build up on the outside of the pinlock (inside the helmet). I might try the InVision one. It seems to be better thought out.

[Juniper]

I've been using my Pinlock insert for the last couple of weeks (brand new helmet) and I've found it next to useless. This moirning, although the left eye had a fairly clear view the right was looking through a 1.5cm strip. Turns out there was no fogging inside the double glazing but there was a lot of water build up on the outside of the pinlock (inside the helmet). I might try the InVision one. It seems to be better thought out.

Nah I've got one of those. The stick in ones. Shit too. I'd say maybe a 5-10% improvment in visibility.

[Juniper]

The dish washing soap liquid thing worked for a bit.

Hey what's good for making the rain bead off?

[BuzzardNZ]

Hey what's good for making the rain bead off?

Sun ;) .....

[Juniper]

Sun ;) .....

So I'll have a talk to the weather god or will you?

[swbarnett]

Nah I've got one of those. The stick in ones. Shit too. I'd say maybe a 5-10% improvment in visibility.
Bummer! They looked so promising.

[Juniper]

Bummer! They looked so promising.

Try taking the chin thing out of your helmet. I found that to work a lot better. The breath guard thing just funnelled the hot air to my glasses which was doubly bad.

[swbarnett]

Try taking the chin thing out of your helmet. I found that to work a lot better. The breath guard thing just funnelled the hot air to my glasses which was doubly bad.
I don't have a breath guard if that's what you mean. I do have an insert that goes under the chin that stops so much cold air coming in though.

[Juniper]

I don't have a breath guard if that's what you mean. I do have an insert that goes under the chin that stops so much cold air coming in though.

Try taking the chin thing out. I found that it did work. Just replaced the wind block by wearing a scarf but still let's the wind in to clear the visor.


I took the breath guard out while riding because it fogged up everything so bad I couldn't see to pull over.

[nzspokes]

I've been using my Pinlock insert for the last couple of weeks (brand new helmet) and I've found it next to useless. This moirning, although the left eye had a fairly clear view the right was looking through a 1.5cm strip. Turns out there was no fogging inside the double glazing but there was a lot of water build up on the outside of the pinlock (inside the helmet). I might try the InVision one. It seems to be better thought out.

Its not sealing properly then so installed wrong. You may find the pinlock pegs can turn to tighten up the fit. I had to do that when I just changed to a clear one. Which works perfectly now. They have to seal well or no worky.....

[Mushu]

Hey what's good for making the rain bead off?

Pledge seems too help.

[Juniper]

Pledge seems too help.

The wood polish stuff?

[swbarnett]

Its not sealing properly then so installed wrong. You may find the pinlock pegs can turn to tighten up the fit. I had to do that when I just changed to a clear one. Which works perfectly now. They have to seal well or no worky.....
I have progressively turned the pegs to the point that the pinlock is as tight as it can get. I rode like that this morning. The thing is that I think the seal is fine (although I'm not certain) but the buildup is on the outside (inside the helmet).

[Juniper]

I have progressively turned the pegs to the point that the pinlock is as tight as it can get. I rode like that this morning. The thing is that I think the seal is fine (although I'm not certain) but the buildup is on the outside (inside the helmet).

Stop breathing? I often do if I'm lane splitting...... Does hinder the living and thinking thing, but no fog!!

[Morcs]

A properly fitted and properly adjusted proper pinlock in a proper helmet works properly.

A badly fitted and badly adjusted knock-off pinlock in a cheap helmet works poorly.

[Morcs]

I have progressively turned the pegs to the point that the pinlock is as tight as it can get. I rode like that this morning. The thing is that I think the seal is fine (although I'm not certain) but the buildup is on the outside (inside the helmet).

there must be a problem there. if its seals it should work great. If you helmet fits well, doesnt have a leaky visor or vent seals, and fits snugly around the neck will always give you fogging problems unless you have a pinlock installed - hence top manufacturers bundle in a pinlock insert in the box.

Is it a genuine pinlock? have you had it in and out a few times already? when adjusting the pin cams you want to back them off slightly from supertight too, otherwise you end up creating gaps.

Is your visor adjusted correctly?

[Maha]

Those new Teflon visors seem to work well by all accounts. Bugs don't even stick so rain has not a show.

[swbarnett]

there must be a problem there. if its seals it should work great. If you helmet fits well, doesnt have a leaky visor or vent seals, and fits snugly around the neck will always give you fogging problems unless you have a pinlock installed - hence top manufacturers bundle in a pinlock insert in the box.

Is it a genuine pinlock? have you had it in and out a few times already? when adjusting the pin cams you want to back them off slightly from supertight too, otherwise you end up creating gaps.

Is your visor adjusted correctly?
Brand new (2 weeks) Shoei Qwest. Pinlock came with the helmet (yes, it's genuine). I've had the pinlock out only twice since I first put it in. Now that I've got it tight it seems to not be fogging on the inside i.e. I don't think there are gaps. The problem seems to be condensation on the outside (inside the helmet). After I got home today I could wipe it off and all good. Seems to defeat it's purpose. Like Juniper said I may try taking the chin wind stopper out.

[Maha]

Brand new (2 weeks) Shoei Qwest. Pinlock came with the helmet (yes, it's genuine). I've had the pinlock out only twice since I first put it in. Now that I've got it tight it seems to not be fogging on the inside i.e. I don't think there are gaps. The problem seems to be condensation on the outside (inside the helmet). After I got home today I could wipe it off and all good. Seems to defeat it's purpose. Like Juniper said I may try taking the chin wind stopper out.

Anne has a Shoei, and the chin wind stopperer was taken out the day she bought it, the same day the pinlock was put it.

[nzspokes]

Anne has a Shoei, and the chin wind stopperer was taken out the day she bought it, the same day the pinlock was put it.

I run both in my peasant class LS2 and it works great.

[Maha]

I run both in my peasant class LS2 and it works great.


I also have one on my helmet, makes no odds to me, it's just a part of the helmet.
I think the reason Anne doesn't use the chin thing is because of that closed in feeling..
Hers works fine without it, my works fine with it, your works fine with both, what does tell you?

[haydes55]

Brand new (2 weeks) Shoei Qwest. Pinlock came with the helmet (yes, it's genuine). I've had the pinlock out only twice since I first put it in. Now that I've got it tight it seems to not be fogging on the inside i.e. I don't think there are gaps. The problem seems to be condensation on the outside (inside the helmet). After I got home today I could wipe it off and all good. Seems to defeat it's purpose. Like Juniper said I may try taking the chin wind stopper out.


My helmet came with pinlock, installed it day 1 and haven't had it fog up ever. I tested it very thoroughly. I put my helmet over a hot bowl of soup, I put the helmet on, blocked the gap to my chin and went for a run and it still didn't fog up.

Have you made sure you installed it the right way around? Should be: visor, then a gap sealed by the insert, then the inner screen. From memory this had a film on it that you have to take off once it's installed.

If you've tightened the pins too tight that would push the seals up in areas and let air in. It mightn't fog up the inside, but it's the temperature differences that creates the condensation.

[Maha]

Get an open face helmet, problem solved.:rolleyes:

[nzspokes]

My helmet came with pinlock, installed it day 1 and haven't had it fog up ever. I tested it very thoroughly. I put my helmet over a hot bowl of soup, I put the helmet on, blocked the gap to my chin and went for a run and it still didn't fog up.


Were you bored one day?

[nzspokes]

Pledge seems too help.

+1. Works great. I Pledge mine every morning before leaving for work.

[haydes55]

Were you bored one day?

Very! People should give me other stuff to test. Motorbikes, safety gear, condoms Etc.

[Mushu]

The wood polish stuff?

Yep. Does nothing to stop fogging but it makes the water bead up better in the rain and it takes the bugs off good.

[Juniper]

I run both in my peasant class LS2 and it works great.

I've got one of those and neither work :( different face shapes maybe?

[Juniper]

Yep. Does nothing to stop fogging but it makes the water bead up better in the rain and it takes the bugs off good.

Oooooooook off to the supermarket it is then. Any particular type?

[swbarnett]

My helmet came with pinlock, installed it day 1 and haven't had it fog up ever. I tested it very thoroughly. I put my helmet over a hot bowl of soup, I put the helmet on, blocked the gap to my chin and went for a run and it still didn't fog up.

Have you made sure you installed it the right way around? Should be: visor, then a gap sealed by the insert, then the inner screen. From memory this had a film on it that you have to take off once it's installed.

If you've tightened the pins too tight that would push the seals up in areas and let air in. It mightn't fog up the inside, but it's the temperature differences that creates the condensation.
I installed it exactly as per the instructions. I know I've probably done something wrong but I can't think what. My previous helmet also had a pinlock (same helmet in fact). It worked for about a month then I chucked it out of frustration; I'd rather not do that again as I now have a much longer commute.

Yes, it is installed the right way round with the film removed etc. etc.

I first had it at the loosest setting. Then half way in. now it's at its tighest.

One thing that occurs to me is that it says to push the visor flat to install the pinlock. I pushed it as flat as I dared for fear of breaking the visor but still had to flex the pinlock slightly to get it on the pins. Do you think that maybe I didn't flatten the visor enough in the first place?

[swbarnett]

Anne has a Shoei, and the chin wind stopperer was taken out the day she bought it, the same day the pinlock was put it.
I didn't use the chin piece for a long time. It's only now that I commute 40minutes at 6 in the morning (or earlier) that I felf the need to keep the winter air out of the helmet.

[swbarnett]

Oooooooook off to the supermarket it is then. Any particular type?
The unscented one.

[nerrrd]

The proper pinlock on my cheapish full face helmet works great for me.

The stick-on pinlocks I've used on my flip up commuting helmet can be real SOBs to get on properly (I'm on about my fourth one of these, one of which may have ended up screwed up and flung across the room :innocent:) and don't seem to last all that long.

Sposed to be made from a special moisture-absorbing plastic, maybe there's a shelf life on that?

[swbarnett]

one of which may have ended up screwed up and flung across the room :innocent:)
I did that to my first pinlock and the second one may well end up going the same way.

It's definiately installed properly. I just checked it and there are no detectable gaps. Layed the visor out flat again to "reseat" it just in case. I'll se how it goes tomorrow.

[haydes55]

One thing that occurs to me is that it says to push the visor flat to install the pinlock. I pushed it as flat as I dared for fear of breaking the visor but still had to flex the pinlock slightly to get it on the pins. Do you think that maybe I didn't flatten the visor enough in the first place?

Na I remember having the same dilemma. I installed it the day I got the helmet (my b'day 11-05-2012). I've left it in and has never fogged up. I've only had vision issues with the helmet when riding through fog the condensation builds up on the outside like rain. I can turn my head to the side and it beads off in the wind.

Have you tried swearing and yelling abuse at it?

[swbarnett]

Na I remember having the same dilemma. I installed it the day I got the helmet (my b'day 11-05-2012). I've left it in and has never fogged up. I've only had vision issues with the helmet when riding through fog the condensation builds up on the outside like rain. I can turn my head to the side and it beads off in the wind.
Rain-off overgloves are great for this too. My problem is inside the helmet.


Have you tried swearing and yelling abuse at it?
Been there...

[Berries]

Nah I've got one of those. The stick in ones. Shit too. I'd say maybe a 5-10% improvment in visibility.
Fog City insert? Odd. I got my first one many years ago and was so impressed that I stuck the stickers that came with it on my visor. I figured that it was so very very rare that something did what it said on the tin.

Replaced my helmet a couple of years ago. Stuck a Fog City insert in the clear visor, upside down by mistake, but it works. Also got a tinted visor with Pinlock and I use that all year round except for a few weeks around the shortest day. A couple of times it fogged up and I noticed a gap between the insert and the visor. I don't understand why you need the adjustment on something that does not wear? Just stick the bastard in there. Also can't work out why they design something that is meant to improve your view yet restricts it by having the 'join' in your field of vision. Even so, it is so much better than just a visor unless you want to ride with it half open or while trying to purse your lips and exhale down your shirt.

[Juniper]

Fog City insert? Odd. I got my first one many years ago and was so impressed that I stuck the stickers that came with it on my visor. I figured that it was so very very rare that something did what it said on the tin.

Replaced my helmet a couple of years ago. Stuck a Fog City insert in the clear visor, upside down by mistake, but it works. Also got a tinted visor with Pinlock and I use that all year round except for a few weeks around the shortest day. A couple of times it fogged up and I noticed a gap between the insert and the visor. I don't understand why you need the adjustment on something that does not wear? Just stick the bastard in there. Also can't work out why they design something that is meant to improve your view yet restricts it by having the 'join' in your field of vision. Even so, it is so much better than just a visor unless you want to ride with it half open or while trying to purse your lips and exhale down your shirt.

Nah I got this one: http://www.fastbikegear.co.nz/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=786&products_id=1266 and tbh I'm not liking it. It had marks on the plastic which I had to wipe off very carefully as to not ruin any special stuff that may be on there. The line gets in the way of my vision and it's distorted it a bit which considering I have bad vision to begin with it's not overly helpful. And the anti-fog part I can't seem to see the results at all.

Bit disappointed :( but oh-well.

[swbarnett]

Well, got in this morning and after a 40min commute the right side was completely fogged over and the left isn't much better. After much dramatics it's now in the bin. All I can say is I'm glad I didn't pay for it. What a piece of crap. I don't care that "most" people seem to have no problem with them, from my experience they are extremely easy to fuck up.

Back to doing what I did for 20 years before I even knew pinlock existed - open the visor and enjoy the rush of fresh air. And if I ever get another helmet that comes with a pinlock it's going straight in the bin. The agro just isn't worth it.

[BuzzardNZ]

Back to doing what I did for 20 years before I even knew pinlock existed - open the visor and enjoy the rush of fresh air.

Seems the standard simple proven method is always best. I never knew there was any other way until I stumbled across this thread.

When it's raining, I always leave my visor slightly ajar, no great hassle.

Sounds like pinlock is trying to solve a pretty much non-existent problem.

[swbarnett]

Seems the standard simple proven method is always best. I never knew there was any other way until I stumbled across this thread.

When it's raining, I always leave my visor slightly ajar, no great hassle.

Sounds like pinlock is trying to solve a pretty much non-existent problem.
The reason I love the idea of a working pinlock is that it greatly extends the lower temperatures that one can ride in. Now that I'm nearing 50 and my hair is, shall we say, shorter than it used to be, I find that a cold blast through the helmet at 6 in the morning can be "bracing" to say the least. Oh, well, I'm off to buy a balaclava.

[Mushu]

Oooooooook off to the supermarket it is then. Any particular type?

I don't think it matters, I just use whatevers around I think I have lemon pledge but I use whatever friends have if I stop in on a ride.


One thing that occurs to me is that it says to push the visor flat to install the pinlock. I pushed it as flat as I dared for fear of breaking the visor but still had to flex the pinlock slightly to get it on the pins. Do you think that maybe I didn't flatten the visor enough in the first place?

I wouldn't worry about breaking the visor you can bend them way past flat, mythbusters showed that they can withstand a point blank shotgun blast, I gave my old mirror visor to the kids and now it takes all types of abuse.

I was going to buy a pinlock because my LS2 came with the pins on the original visor but I had a fog off mask which keeps me warm too so I didn't bother. I just ride with the visor half open and never seem to have any problems anyway.

[nerrrd]

Well, got in this morning and after a 40min commute the right side was completely fogged over and the left isn't much better. After much dramatics it's now in the bin. All I can say is I'm glad I didn't pay for it. What a piece of crap. I don't care that "most" people seem to have no problem with them, from my experience they are extremely easy to fuck up.

Back to doing what I did for 20 years before I even knew pinlock existed - open the visor and enjoy the rush of fresh air. And if I ever get another helmet that comes with a pinlock it's going straight in the bin. The agro just isn't worth it.

I wonder if the shop would install one if asked? Might save on the agro.

Could maybe make a complaint to Shoei as well if you can be bothered, it's a five year warranty I think? They might want to help, it's a premium brand, would be good customer relations.

[Juniper]

I don't think it matters, I just use whatevers around I think I have lemon pledge but I use whatever friends have if I stop in on a ride.



I was going to buy a pinlock because my LS2 came with the pins on the original visor but I had a fog off mask which keeps me warm too so I didn't bother. I just ride with the visor half open and never seem to have any problems anyway.

What's a fog off mask?


So I must say the anti fog thing I put in works when going 100kph in freezing cold at night. Not sure if that's because my core temperature was below 0 or if it just takes a while for the correct temperatures inside v's outside the helmet to do their thing. It's the only time I've noticed it work.

Also re the quiet thing. I found keeping my neck up makes it quieter then tilting it down. Which is good kinda cause I have my neck up most of the time so I can see, but man does that hurt after a while!!!

[BMWST?]

back to the noise thing.I am gonna try a short ride withthe visor completely taped over the edges.I have a whipser kit icl the chin curtain and its still bloody noisy.I have to wear earplugs.I am almost certain its actually the screen causing the noise

[Mushu]

What's a fog off mask?


So I must say the anti fog thing I put in works when going 100kph in freezing cold at night. Not sure if that's because my core temperature was below 0 or if it just takes a while for the correct temperatures inside v's outside the helmet to do their thing. It's the only time I've noticed it work.

Also re the quiet thing. I found keeping my neck up makes it quieter then tilting it down. Which is good kinda cause I have my neck up most of the time so I can see, but man does that hurt after a while!!!

This is a fog off mask:http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/26/e5ape3ys.jpg they don't work for every one and they take a while to get used to but I find mine works quite well and keeps my neck warm

It sounds like your anti fog thing isn't doing anything, if I'm not wearing the fog off thing I can close my visor more if I ride faster, and if all the vents in the helmet are open I can completely close it at around 100 on a really cold night

[Mushu]

back to the noise thing.I am gonna try a short ride withthe visor completely taped over the edges.I have a whipser kit icl the chin curtain and its still bloody noisy.I have to wear earplugs.I am almost certain its actually the screen causing the noise

Doesn't everyone wear earplugs? There isn't a helmet out there that stops all noise afaik.

[BuzzardNZ]

Doesn't everyone wear earplugs?

No .........

[Mushu]

No .........

I should amend my post to say: doesn't everyone who's worried about noise wear earplugs. (I don't actually wear earplugs myself, I have those in ear head phones which reduce most of the noise and give me music to ride with but still allow me to hear my bike or a nearby horn)

So do you have a helmet that is really good for noise or do you just not care about your hearing?

[Maha]

What's a fog off mask?


So I must say the anti fog thing I put in works when going 100kph in freezing cold at night. Not sure if that's because my core temperature was below 0 or if it just takes a while for the correct temperatures inside v's outside the helmet to do their thing. It's the only time I've noticed it work.

Also re the quiet thing. I found keeping my neck up makes it quieter then tilting it down. Which is good kinda cause I have my neck up most of the time so I can see, but man does that hurt after a while!!!

I wear a beanie with the top cut off as a neck warmer, it tucks up into the helmet. Closing the vent may stop a bit of noise also.
Beanie? check/ Jar lid? check/ Insulation tape? check...I'm good.

[nzspokes]

Well, got in this morning and after a 40min commute the right side was completely fogged over and the left isn't much better. After much dramatics it's now in the bin. All I can say is I'm glad I didn't pay for it. What a piece of crap. I don't care that "most" people seem to have no problem with them, from my experience they are extremely easy to fuck up.

Back to doing what I did for 20 years before I even knew pinlock existed - open the visor and enjoy the rush of fresh air. And if I ever get another helmet that comes with a pinlock it's going straight in the bin. The agro just isn't worth it.

Your doing it wrong:kick:

Mine and a good few mates have them and love em. Maybe a contact to Shoei would be worth it. Really they are great things.

[BuzzardNZ]

I should amend my post to say: doesn't everyone who's worried about noise wear earplugs. (I don't actually wear earplugs myself, I have those in ear head phones which reduce most of the noise and give me music to ride with but still allow me to hear my bike or a nearby horn)

So do you have a helmet that is really good for noise or do you just not care about your hearing?

I have a Shoei which doesn't seem that great for noise prevention, plus I have a very loud exhaust. I only ride once every 2 weeks, so I actually enjoy hearing the bike. If I rode it every day I would probably consider ear plugs.

[Maha]

Your doing it wrong:kick:

Mine and a good few mates have them and love em. Maybe a contact to Shoei would be worth it. Really they are great things.

That's you're....:rolleyes:

[swbarnett]

Your doing it wrong:kick:

Mine and a good few mates have them and love em. Maybe a contact to Shoei would be worth it. Really they are great things.
If I ever get another one I'll come and see you before I even take it out of the packing. Maybe then I'll find out what I'm doing wrong (my previous one didn't work that well either).

[Juniper]

This is a fog off mask:http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/26/e5ape3ys.jpg they don't work for every one and they take a while to get used to but I find mine works quite well and keeps my neck warm

It sounds like your anti fog thing isn't doing anything, if I'm not wearing the fog off thing I can close my visor more if I ride faster, and if all the vents in the helmet are open I can completely close it at around 100 on a really cold night

Looks like the beginnings of a gimp mask........

I'd get a little creeped out by that, I don't overly like being smothered.

[Maha]

Looks like the beginnings of a gimp mask........

I'd get a little creeped out by that, I don't overly like being smothered.

They are disgusting to have on, I bought one in haste one rainy day and wondered why moments later (for the reasons you state) never worn it since.

[Mushu]

They are disgusting to have on, I bought one in haste one rainy day and wondered why moments later (for the reasons you state) never worn it since.

It takes some time to get used to, I hated it at first and even now I won't wear it unless I'm really cold and can't see but when you pull over, put it on and get back on the bike it's the greatest thing ever.

[Maha]

It takes some time to get used to, I hated it at first and even now I won't wear it unless I'm really cold and can't see but when you pull over, put it on and get back on the bike it's the greatest thing ever.

Apart from the feeling on enclosure, it also impeded on my lower eye area...not for me I'm afraid, I have actually thrown it out.
If I were really concerned about it I would go the balaclava way.. each to their own I guess when it comes to the finer creature comforts on what goes on inside ones helmet (apart from the little voices that is)

[Juniper]

Apart from the feeling on enclosure, it also impeded on my lower eye area...not for me I'm afraid, I have actually thrown it out.
If I were really concerned about it I would go the balaclava way.. each to their own I guess when it comes to the finer creature comforts on what goes on inside ones helmet (apart from the little voices that is)

I know the voices in my head aren't real, but man do they come up with some great ideas!!!


Ok so after going for a 6hr ride I am getting a new helmet asap. Ear plugs, music and scarf up the helmet and padding my throat and my ears are still ringing. Was going to save up for it but stuff it I can't do another long ride like that. Credit card it is.

[Maha]

I know the voices in my head aren't real, but man do they come up with some great ideas!!!


Ok so after going for a 6hr ride I am getting a new helmet asap. Ear plugs, music and scarf up the helmet and padding my throat and my ears are still ringing. Was going to save up for it but stuff it I can't do another long ride like that. Credit card it is.

No getting away from a really noisy helmet, you can try a lot of things but, it's the same as painting over rust, ok for a while but then that annoying shit reappears.
Make sure the padding is tight'ish when trying on a new helmet, the padding will give, over time. But that firm feeling around your cheeks is paramount in my book.
I wore on particular brand over a number of year (KBC) but changed with my latest helmet because of the features in had...

[Erelyes]

I've been using my Pinlock insert for the last couple of weeks (brand new helmet) and I've found it next to useless. This moirning, although the left eye had a fairly clear view the right was looking through a 1.5cm strip. Turns out there was no fogging inside the double glazing but there was a lot of water build up on the outside of the pinlock (inside the helmet). I might try the InVision one. It seems to be better thought out.

Odd, I have a new helmet with one and have even ridden in a snowshower when it was maybe 1 degree outside, and still been able to see fine (although I had to wipe the OUTSIDE of my visor fairly often...)

Is yours a 'genuine' pinlock or a stick-in one? I'd take the helmet back to the place of purchase.

Edit: fuck, that'll teach me for not reading the whole thread, I see you've binned it. Ah well perhaps glad I got my current lid rather than a Shoei then!

[Padmei]

back to the noise thing.I am gonna try a short ride withthe visor completely taped over the edges.I have a whipser kit icl the chin curtain and its still bloody noisy.I have to wear earplugs.I am almost certain its actually the screen causing the noise

I found my GS had the screen pushing air up into my helmet. I took it off.
Noise is a bugger alright.
I ride now with an open face & find the wind noise almost less than in my LS.

[bosslady]

I know the voices in my head aren't real, but man do they come up with some great ideas!!!


Ok so after going for a 6hr ride I am getting a new helmet asap. Ear plugs, music and scarf up the helmet and padding my throat and my ears are still ringing. Was going to save up for it but stuff it I can't do another long ride like that. Credit card it is.
Not related, but as a learner I'd probably not recommend listening to music whilst riding, it's a distraction and probably not the greatest idea for a really green rider, just saying. Hope your new helmet does you wonders!

[swbarnett]

Odd, I have a new helmet with one and have even ridden in a snowshower when it was maybe 1 degree outside, and still been able to see fine (although I had to wipe the OUTSIDE of my visor fairly often...)

Is yours a 'genuine' pinlock or a stick-in one? I'd take the helmet back to the place of purchase.

Edit: fuck, that'll teach me for not reading the whole thread, I see you've binned it. Ah well perhaps glad I got my current lid rather than a Shoei then!
I know it's something I did wrong but just couldn't get my head around it (which is very unusual for me, I can work most things out). My previous helmet was exactly the same, including pinlock (yes, genuine). It worked for a couple of months of daily use before it died and I gave up on it as it was getting into summer anyway.

I've found what, for me, is a better solution anyway. I like to have my visor open (I didn't know how much I'd missed that over the last couple of weeks until I binned the pinlock) so I've bought myself an Icebreaker balaclava - thin and warm and fits fine in the helmet. Should be toasty and fog free with the visor open a finger.

[Juniper]

Ok so have bought a whisper kit thing because that helmet I want is only due end of August. So will install and let you all know if it works.

[BMWST?]

Ok so have bought a whisper kit thing because that helmet I want is only due end of August. So will install and let you all know if it works.

Mine definetly decreased the noise with the chin curtain it fogs up easier than before

sent from the tag

[Morcs]

I know it's something I did wrong but just couldn't get my head around it (which is very unusual for me, I can work most things out). My previous helmet was exactly the same, including pinlock (yes, genuine). It worked for a couple of months of daily use before it died and I gave up on it as it was getting into summer anyway.

I've found what, for me, is a better solution anyway. I like to have my visor open (I didn't know how much I'd missed that over the last couple of weeks until I binned the pinlock) so I've bought myself an Icebreaker balaclava - thin and warm and fits fine in the helmet. Should be toasty and fog free with the visor open a finger.

On the Qwest, the visor lock system on the left hand side has a setting to 'crack' the visor open a touch - push the lever to its most downward position. I would maybe suggest trying that whenever you get some condensation on the inside.

If you were local i would offer to install a pinlock for you as ive done what feels like hundreds :)

[swbarnett]

On the Qwest, the visor lock system on the left hand side has a setting to 'crack' the visor open a touch - push the lever to its most downward position. I would maybe suggest trying that whenever you get some condensation on the inside.
Even opening the visor fully didn't get rid of the condensation.

I've used the visor lock before, in other helmet as well as the Qwest. It helps but doesn't quite do the job.


If you were local i would offer to install a pinlock for you as ive done what feels like hundreds :)
I might take you up on that next time I end up with a pinlock. I still work in the Auckland CBD and I'm not against a little jaunt to get the job done right.

[Juniper]

Whisper kit + extra extra padding works well. Just have to play with the padding position and were a go! But still getting the new one.

I found adding a scarf to the mix worked wonderfully well but wow did my visor fog up. Inside and out so bad that is was dangerous even with it cracked it didn't work. And riding with only glasses on hurts like mad in that cold.

The music helps my riding a lot. Because then I don't hear the ringing inky ears as much so I can stop worrying about it and focus on riding. It also helps me to focus my focus on things rather than that monologue in the back of my head wondering what's for dinner.

[Juniper]

Ok so the soap trick works wonders!! No fog!!

[swbarnett]

Ok so the soap trick works wonders!! No fog!!
Details please...

[Juniper]

Details please...

Get washing up liquid and lightly smear it on the inside of your visor just enough that it gets cloudy and dries. Let it dry and then lightly buff it off, lightly as you don't want to wipe it all off. Its taken me a few times to get the nack of it. But it's great. I did it on top of the insert which I still have in.

The big test will be Monday morning.

[Maha]

Ok so the soap trick works wonders!! No fog!!

Ever seen swimmers/divers spit into the goggles before entering the water?... same principle applies.

[Juniper]

Ever seen swimmers/divers spit into the goggles before entering the water?... same principle applies.

I'm not slobbering over my visor every morning lol. The soap thing last about 2 weeks a go.

[Maha]

I'm not slobbering over my visor every morning lol. The soap thing last about 2 weeks a go.

Is the whisper kit still a good investment?

[Juniper]

Is the whisper kit still a good investment?

Yes! For $30 it does a good $30 job. I definitely notice the change. It does hurt a little when putting on and taking off, catches the ears and pulls the hair a bit. Nightmare on the makeup lol.

Cycletreads said hopefully my new helmet should arrive on the 20th!! 4 days to spare!!

[Juniper]

Anti-fogging visor with soap trick works great........ Dosent help though when the glasses fog up. Doh!

[DanielM8]

Or instead of making your helmet quieter, you could make that awful muffler quieter :killingme

[Juniper]

Or instead of making your helmet quieter, you could make that awful muffler quieter :killingme

You're just jealous!!
It's better to be seen AND heard.

That and she just wouldn't be the same. It's Mao that's who she is and what she's known for.

[DanielM8]

You're just jealous!!
It's better to be seen AND heard.

That and she just wouldn't be the same. It's Mao that's who she is and what she's known for.

jealous?? I love my... (how do you say pile of shit in Cantonese?) nah.... Mao purrs like a beauty

[awa355]

Well, got in this morning and after a 40min commute the right side was completely fogged over and the left isn't much better. After much dramatics it's now in the bin. All I can say is I'm glad I didn't pay for it. What a piece of crap. I don't care that "most" people seem to have no problem with them, from my experience they are extremely easy to fuck up.

Back to doing what I did for 20 years before I even knew pinlock existed - open the visor and enjoy the rush of fresh air. And if I ever get another helmet that comes with a pinlock it's going straight in the bin. The agro just isn't worth it.

I had the same problem with a brand new HJC helmet that had a pinlock as part of the visor. It never sealed properly from day one, I could slip a pad paper inbetween the pinlock and the visor. Left it off for months. Re fitted it yesterday and tried a modification. I smeared a very light film of marine silicone gasket around the raised beading on the inside of the pinlock visor. Worked this morning coming home, but will try it over several days before coming to any conclusions.

Like you, I went for years ( 43 in my case) without ever needing a pinlock.

[manxkiwi]

I had the same problem with a brand new HJC helmet that had a pinlock as part of the visor. It never sealed properly from day one, I could slip a pad paper inbetween the pinlock and the visor. Left it off for months. Re fitted it yesterday and tried a modification. I smeared a very light film of marine silicone gasket around the raised beading on the inside of the pinlock visor. Worked this morning coming home, but will try it over several days before coming to any conclusions.

Like you, I went for years ( 43 in my case) without ever needing a pinlock.


I presume you and other people know that the pins on pin lock visors are cams? You wind them out to fit the insert, then wind back in to achieve the sealed fit. You should find a screwdriver slot on the inside of the pin.

Having said that, it can still be fiddly to fit.

Hope this is useful to someone/anyone?

[Fern]

Pledge seems too help.

Has to be the pledge without the added furniture wax in it or else you will ruin the lid for ever!!

Best to get the cheapie cheap supermarket brand

[varminter]

If you ride out of town (i.e. over 50kph) and don't use earplugs you're going to fuck up your hearing. Ask me how I know, but speak up!

[Juniper]

If you ride out of town (i.e. over 50kph) and don't use earplugs you're going to fuck up your hearing. Ask me how I know, but speak up!

Sorry, what you say? Just let me take my ear plugs out.

:) I swear I say that at least 2-3 times every trip.

Custom made ear plugs. Worth their weight in gold.

[2smokes]

I work for a eerr...large company that has a monopoly in the food industry. We have to wear safety glasses everywhere and they can fog up becoming unsafety glasses. We now get supplied "anti-fog wipes". These are friggin awsome for the visor. Anti-fog wipe on the inside, rainex on the outside= perfect vis. Wipes are supplied by the safety shops.

[BMWST?]

took my visor off last night to give it a good clean.When i out it back on i adjusted it to be slightly further back and harder against the rubber strips around the opening.It was def quieter today,still not quiet enough.That screen is coming off

[Juniper]

took my visor off last night to give it a good clean.When i out it back on i adjusted it to be slightly further back and harder against the rubber strips around the opening.It was def quieter today,still not quiet enough.That screen is coming off

Hmmmmm I don't think I can sit mine back any further. What kind do you have?
I have noticed that mine sits on a lip that sticks out.

Eh new one on its way.


Oh btw Pledge is freaking awesome. Went for a ride and took some with, cause I knew it was going to down pour, for everyone to use and thy also said was very cool!!!