Human behaviour?

[oldrider]

Watching the news items concerning the animal testing of "legal high' drugs protests, this thought crossed my mind.

How many of those protesters support abortion on demand?

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

I.E. On the one hand, outraged about discriminate animal suffering but quite happy to indiscriminately kill perfectly healthy human beings!

I have no preconceived opinions on either subject but do wonder about the consistency of human behaviour at these times. :confused: Just wondering?

[unstuck]

http://woodgatesview.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/stupid-people.jpg

[MisterD]

I.E. On the one hand, outraged about discriminate animal suffering but quite happy to indiscriminately kill perfectly healthy human beings!

Whatever abortion on demand may be, it isn't indiscriminate...unless I missed the bit where Min of Health officials were raiding antenatal classes and picking random expectant mothers to abort?

[scissorhands]

Its not the same really

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legalized_abortion_and_crime_effect

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Impact_of_Legalized_Abortion_on_Crime

bringing an unwanted child into the world, or burdening an already struggling mother likely creates an undesirable citizen in the long run

animals suffering because stuff like real cannabis is unpatentable to big business is a whole different kettle of fish

fish do not belong in kettles:msn-wink:

[unstuck]

fish do not belong in kettles:msn-wink:

Agreed, they belong in frying pans.:devil2:

[mashman]

It's human nature.

[SMOKEU]

bringing an unwanted child into the world, or burdening an already struggling mother likely creates an undesirable citizen in the long run



Exactly. Since some "species" tend to breed like rabbits, we don't want them having more kids that are going to be raised on dole money and contribute to the crime rate.

[BOGAR]

Why can we not just test the drugs on the people who actually want to take it??? problem solved.
Just sign your life away for free drugs and hope for the best.

[HenryDorsetCase]

Whatever abortion on demand may be, it isn't indiscriminate...unless I missed the bit where Min of Health officials were raiding antenatal classes and picking random expectant mothers to abort?

I want that job.

YOU, You and YOU: up against the wall.

[Edbear]

http://

"You must spread.." :laugh:


Why can we not just test the drugs on the people who actually want to take it??? problem solved.
Just sign your life away for free drugs and hope for the best.

Now that is the way it SHOULD be! Bet they'd get plenty of vounteers, too! :yes:

[puddytat]

Over 150 people have registered interest in taking part in Trials. But the Law as such states that animal testing is a forerunner to Humans.
Considering Humans are used to playing God to all things on the Planet (Qualified by Biblical quotes) whats the big deal ....

[Fergus]

Considering Humans are used to playing God to all things on the Planet (Qualified by Biblical quotes) whats the big deal ....
+1
People are illogical.

The majority, being meat eaters, clearly support large scale animal suffering (factory farming) for something as arbitrary as 'it tastes good'.
And as most cosmetics are tested on animals the majority clearly support small scale suffering (animal testing) for something as arbitrary 'it looks good'.


It'd be logical to assume the majority would support small scale suffering for something equally as arbitrary as 'it feels good'...but apparently they don't.



I know I'd much rather small scale, short term suffering (animal testing) to improve safety and er..enjoyment of life for other humans than large scale, long term suffering (lifetime in a sow crate/battery cage) for the sake of big-macs, KFC, steak etc.

[caspernz]

Why can we not just test the drugs on the people who actually want to take it??? problem solved.
Just sign your life away for free drugs and hope for the best.

C'mon now bucko, common sense on KB needs prior approval from at least one mod!!:laugh::bleh:

[oldrider]

True!

Basically it probably all comes down to how "hungry" (read with circumstances in mind) the person is at the time of the decision making! :mellow:

[imdying]

Why can we not just test the drugs on the people who actually want to take it???Because perfectly good dogs are available?

[Banditbandit]

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.



Have you only just worked out that human beings are hypocritical ??? Where you been all your life ???

[Banditbandit]

Because perfectly good dogs are available?

Oh yeah .. I'm sure .. "Excuse me Fido, how does this subtance make you feel? Are you high yet? Do you feel a little light headed? Do you feel sick? is it better or worse than cannabis?"

Canines are the PERFECT test subject for psycho-active substances .. Yeah Right !!!

[imdying]

Oh yeah .. I'm sure .. "Excuse me Fido, how does this subtance make you feel? Are you high yet? Do you feel a little light headed? Do you feel sick? is it better or worse than cannabis?"

Canines are the PERFECT test subject for psycho-active substances .. Yeah Right !!!Their physiological makeup is adequate for the purpose... it's not ideal, but then they didn't make ideal astronauts either.

[Katman]

Their physiological makeup is adequate for the purpose... it's not ideal, but then they didn't make ideal astronauts either.

There are in vitro tests available that produce far more accurate results than any testing done on animals.

In today's age there is no need for animals to be used.

[Drew]

It's human nature.We are all hypocrites and liars. But I don't think it's natural.


+1
People are illogical.

The majority, being meat eaters, clearly support large scale animal suffering (factory farming) for something as arbitrary as 'it tastes good'. It's not just about taste. We are omnivorous by design/evolution. Veges and meat are what our bodies are supposed to use for sustenance.

And as most cosmetics are tested on animals the majority clearly support small scale suffering (animal testing) for something as arbitrary 'it looks good'.


It'd be logical to assume the majority would support small scale suffering for something equally as arbitrary as 'it feels good'...but apparently they don't.It gets ignored more than accepted I think. Goes back to the hypocrisy.




I know I'd much rather small scale, short term suffering (animal testing) to improve safety and er..enjoyment of life for other humans than large scale, long term suffering (lifetime in a sow crate/battery cage) for the sake of big-macs, KFC, steak etc.But that's not the only foods meat is used for is it? I'd prolly miss the odd feed from those retailers for a month or so, but would likely move on without too much worry if they ceased to be. If I couldn't get any meet products to eat at all, I'd scream blue fucken murder!


True!

Basically it probably all comes down to how "hungry" (read with circumstances in mind) the person is at the time of the decision making! :mellow:Interesting ethical dilemma that one. If someone is 'jonesing', they're agreeing to the waiver is essentially under duress. The only way it could be legal, is if the drug manufacturers signed people with no history of taking drugs...Which they could then be liable for a shit load of addicts, and in even deeper shit still.

[Thaeos]

Watching the news items concerning the animal testing of "legal high' drugs protests, this thought crossed my mind.

How many of those protesters support abortion on demand?

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

I.E. On the one hand, outraged about discriminate animal suffering but quite happy to indiscriminately kill perfectly healthy human beings!

I have no preconceived opinions on either subject but do wonder about the consistency of human behaviour at these times. :confused: Just wondering?

Except that a foetus is not a perfectly healthy human being?

[mashman]

We are all hypocrites and liars. But I don't think it's natural.

There's also no such thing as human nature.

[oldrider]

Except that a foetus is not a perfectly healthy human being?

You quoted it but then ignored it.

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

[Mushu]

+1
People are illogical.

The majority, being meat eaters, clearly support large scale animal suffering (factory farming) for something as arbitrary as 'it tastes good'.
And as most cosmetics are tested on animals the majority clearly support small scale suffering (animal testing) for something as arbitrary 'it looks good'.


It'd be logical to assume the majority would support small scale suffering for something equally as arbitrary as 'it feels good'...but apparently they don't.



I know I'd much rather small scale, short term suffering (animal testing) to improve safety and er..enjoyment of life for other humans than large scale, long term suffering (lifetime in a sow crate/battery cage) for the sake of big-macs, KFC, steak etc.

So you're a vegan then? Fuck that, I love KFC, eggs, bacon and pork, and I'm not rich enough to warrant paying extra for "free range", more battery hens, more sow crates I say and if animal testing is necessary then by all means, go ahead.
The issue here is if cannabis were legal there would be no market for these drugs anyway and no matter how much they test it I doubt they can make it safer than pot is known to be.

[oldrider]

Have you only just worked out that human beings are hypocritical ??? Where you been all your life ???

I sometimes wonder, especially lately, AGE is taking it's toll. :rolleyes:

[Thaeos]

You quoted it but then ignored it.

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

Well that's my point. You have that disclaimer, then say you have no preconceived notion about the topic, and then give a preconceived notion about it.

To suggest that these people are hypocritical, you suggest that abortion is the ending of the life of a perfectly healthy human being. Which it's not.

So, where's the hypocrisy?

[Ender EnZed]

Why can we not just test the drugs on the people who actually want to take it??? problem solved.


That's exactly what was happening before Peter Dunne got involved.

[ducatilover]

The issue here is if cannabis were legal there would be no market for these drugs anyway and no matter how much they test it I doubt they can make it safer than pot is known to be.

I wouldn't go as far as saying that. They're two different things entirely


Humans are impossibly stupid.

[Mushu]

I wouldn't go as far as saying that. They're two different things entirely


Humans are impossibly stupid.

I mean the issue with the specific case of testing legal highs on animals, in my experience the only reason people smoke K2 and stuff like that is because they either can't get weed or they expect to be drug tested in the near future

[Drew]

I mean the issue with the specific case of testing legal highs on animals, in my experience the only reason people smoke K2 and stuff like that is because they either can't get weed or they expect to be drug tested in the near futureDrug testing being the fuckin stupid system that it is, I almost wish I smoked weed sometimes.

[Mom]

You quoted it but then ignored it.

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

Hypocrites have existed since time immemorial though. And not just on these sort of issues.

I try really hard to live as I say, but I am hypocrite too. I think it is all part of the human frailty myself.

Do as I say, not as I do...

PS: apparently I have to spread myself around...

This being a direct do as they say, not as I want :sunny:

[unstuck]

I think we are all hypocrites at times, I think it is part of the human ego. Being aware of it and honest about it is a step in the right direction to doing something about it though.:Punk::Punk:

[oldrider]

Well that's my point. You have that disclaimer, then say you have no preconceived notion about the topic, and then give a preconceived notion about it.

To suggest that these people are hypocritical, you suggest that abortion is the ending of the life of a perfectly healthy human being. Which it's not.

So, where's the hypocrisy?

Don't really care, maybe it's in your own head! Whatever.

[ducatilover]

I think we are all hypocrites at times, I think it is part of the human ego. Being aware of it and honest about it is a step in the right direction to doing something about it though.:Punk::Punk:
Depends...
Who sets what is right, or what your moral compass should act like? Everybody has different ideologies and whatnot. Hypocrisy is something humans will always do, be it for small reasons or not (often it comes down to asserting dominance or something of teh sort)

I dunno :crazy: stupid sinus drugs.
Anyhoo, better do more reading on swing arms, for my motorbuysickle :oi-grr:

[Kickaha]

I almost wish I smoked weed sometimes.
You're fucking dumb enough without it

[Road kill]

Advice offered on the basis of hard learn't lessons is not hypocrisy if the person offering said advice is no longer doing the same themselves,but a lot of people "young people" will cry hypocrisy in their efforts to defend their right to fuck up for themselves.

People eat meat that has come from animal concentration camps called farms an then whinge about a few puppys getting used for something other than "their" interest,,,like all the other shit they use that has been tested on "other puppys" .

Yeah people are odd fuckers all right !

[Road kill]

I think we are all hypocrites at times, I think it is part of the human ego. Being aware of it and honest about it is a step in the right direction to doing something about it though.:Punk::Punk:

Why the fuck would you want to do anything about it ?

The fact everybody accepts it in one way or another gives you a shit load of lea way,,,,in some area's.:shifty:

[unstuck]

Why the fuck would you want to do anything about it ?

The fact everybody accepts it in one way or another gives you a shit load of lea way,,,,in some area's.:shifty:

Because I can.:msn-wink:

[Crasherfromwayback]

Watching the news items concerning the animal testing of "legal high' drugs protests, this thought crossed my mind.

How many of those protesters support abortion on demand?

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

I.E. On the one hand, outraged about discriminate animal suffering but quite happy to indiscriminately kill perfectly healthy human beings!

I have no preconceived opinions on either subject but do wonder about the consistency of human behaviour at these times. :confused: Just wondering?

For it to be *hypocrisy*, they'd have to be exactly the same thing. Which they are not. Not even close. Argument FAIL.

[avgas]

In a balanced society - 50% of people are below average.

In human nature - your talking about an unbalanced society.

Why do you think we had to invent Christianity? You really think we would have made is this far without inventing religions?

[oldrider]

Advice offered on the basis of hard learn't lessons is not hypocrisy if the person offering said advice is no longer doing the same themselves,but a lot of people "young people" will cry hypocrisy in their efforts to defend their right to fuck up for themselves.

People eat meat that has come from animal concentration camps called farms an then whinge about a few puppys getting used for something other than "their" interest,,,like all the other shit they use that has been tested on "other puppys" .

Yeah people are odd fuckers all right !


For it to be *hypocrisy*, they'd have to be exactly the same thing. Which they are not. Not even close. Argument FAIL.

Road kill got it closer to what I was trying to portray, I was not trying to argue the merits of the subjects I used in the OP.

Most people today only see the meat on the supermarket shelves but they never see the killing sheds where it comes from etc.

When it's all boiled down to basics the real world is a very cruel and violent place!

We hide it as much as we can and people grow up and may never ever experience life as it really is and have very distorted impressions of the facts of life.

So are they going on these protest rallies for real informed and consistent reasons?

Just asking the question rather than saying how it should be!

[Katman]

Most people today only see the meat on the supermarket shelves but they never see the killing sheds where it comes from etc.


Nature is quite cruel itself actually.

Ever seen a wildlife program where a lion start ripping an antelope apart while it's still alive?

It doesn't give us the excuse to inflict pain and suffering on animals simply so that people can get out of it.

[Katman]

By the way, yes Katman has a new crusade.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Road kill got it closer to what I was trying to portray, I was not trying to argue the merits of the subjects I used in the OP.

Most people today only see the meat on the supermarket shelves but they never see the killing sheds where it comes from etc.

When it's all boiled down to basics the real world is a very cruel and violent place!

We hide it as much as we can and people grow up and may never ever experience life as it really is and have very distorted impressions of the facts of life.

So are they going on these protest rallies for real informed and consistent reasons?

Just asking the question rather than saying how it should be!

Look...I hear what you're trying to say. Just think it was a crap comparison sorry.

[awa355]

Just friends.

285572

[Dangsta]

Watching the news items concerning the animal testing of "legal high' drugs protests, this thought crossed my mind.

How many of those protesters support abortion on demand?

This thread is not about either of those subjects but about the hypocrisy of human behaviour.

I.E. On the one hand, outraged about discriminate animal suffering but quite happy to indiscriminately kill perfectly healthy human beings!

I have no preconceived opinions on either subject but do wonder about the consistency of human behaviour at these times. :confused: Just wondering?

Very dangerous subject my friend as regardless of your caveat, you're sure to get some whacko's responding with their pro-life or pro-choice sound bytes. However, I do agree with you regarding how hypocritical as a species we are. I work in a political environment and some of the things I witness on a day to day basis leave me wanting to bang my head against a wall....hang on..:brick:

[Dangsta]

Hey...we could always not do the abortions and then test the synthetic drugs on the unwanted babies...just sayin'. I'm pretty sure I've solved this one and we can now officially close this thread. You're welcome. :drinknsin

[ducatilover]

Hey...we could always not do the abortions and then test the synthetic drugs on the unwanted babies...just sayin'. I'm pretty sure I've solved this one and we can now officially close this thread. You're welcome. :drinknsin

Then feed the munted unwanted babies to the starving!

[Ender EnZed]

Then feed the munted unwanted babies to the starving!

After harvesting their stem cells.

[imdying]

There are in vitro tests available that produce far more accurate results than any testing done on animals.

In today's age there is no need for animals to be used.Waste of money, dogs are far cheaper.

[Katman]

Waste of money, dogs are far cheaper.

It's not the tax-payer's money that will be paying for these tests.

[imdying]

What about this, can we do this? http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/162678-harvard-creates-brain-to-brain-interface-allows-humans-to-control-other-animals-with-thoughts-alone

[Katman]

By giving the legal high manufacturers access to cheaper (and far less accurate) testing methods the government is simply helping to maximise the manufacturers profits.

The government had the opportunity to set the bar as high as they possibly could for the manufacturers to get their products back on the market. Instead they have simply made it easier for the manufacturers to continue causing considerable harm to New Zealand communities.

[ducatilover]

Gotta love ethics eh? Can make an animal do meth, but it's not ethical to test meth on humans.

Just ban the shit, a revenue stream from sales of this crap is not worth the lives that are getting fucked up :no:

[Crasherfromwayback]

Gotta love ethics eh? Can make an animal do meth, but it's not ethical to test meth on humans.

Just ban the shit, a revenue stream from sales of this crap is not worth the lives that are getting fucked up :no:

Last time I checked...Meth was illegal. Doesn't stop people using it though.

[Katman]

What about this, can we do this? http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/162678-harvard-creates-brain-to-brain-interface-allows-humans-to-control-other-animals-with-thoughts-alone

Quite aside from the animal welfare issue do you really want others to have the ability to control your actions against your will?

[ducatilover]

Last time I checked...Meth was illegal. Doesn't stop people using it though.
Silly sausage, I was meaning the synthetic drugs that are still legal.

Somebody on here suggested once to make weed legal because legislation doesn't work.
So we may as well not make anything illegal.

Humans are funny. I'm going back to my planet now.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Silly sausage, I was meaning the synthetic drugs that are still legal.

Somebody on here suggested once to make weed legal because legislation doesn't work.
So we may as well not make anything illegal.

Humans are funny. I'm going back to my planet now.

lol. I've always thought speeding should be legal...

[Katman]

Silly sausage, I was meaning the synthetic drugs that are still legal.

Somebody on here suggested once to make weed legal because legislation doesn't work.
So we may as well not make anything illegal.

Humans are funny. I'm going back to my planet now.

I firmly believe that it is the prohibition of cannabis that has led people to formulate products that can be passed as a legal alternative.

The fact that these synthetic alternatives are undoubtedly causing considerable harm to New Zealand communities both in the short term and the long term makes the continuing prohibition of cannabis even more bewildering.

[ducatilover]

lol. I've always thought speeding should be legal...
I agree, will sort the men from the masses! (although I have proven I suck at it, even though I have never had a ticket)

I firmly believe that it is the prohibition of cannabis that has led people to formulate products that can be passed as a legal alternative.

The fact that these synthetic alternatives are undoubtedly causing considerable harm to New Zealand communities both in the short term and the long term makes the continuing prohibition of cannabis even more bewildering.

Yay I started another one of these!
Not that I've worked with the left overs from the less wonderful side of pot, but according to most it's perfect, it's harmless. And then the paranoia comes out... and the depression, the dependency... :bleh:
But, we should ban the synth shit, it's incredibly dangerous.

BAN IT ALL, LIVE ON OATCAKES!

[imdying]

Quite aside from the animal welfare issue do you really want others to have the ability to control your actions against your will?

Some people don't want niggers or jews moving in next door, but you don't get everything in life you want.

[unstuck]

Decriminalize cannabis and spend the money trying to fight its use, on addiction education and life skills education. IMO.:innocent:

[ducatilover]

Decriminalize cannabis and spend the money trying to fight its use, on addiction education and life skills education. IMO.:innocent:

Or spend the money on capital punishment. And bring back public punishment, I want to watch some prick get stoned :bleh:

[unstuck]

Or spend the money on capital punishment. And bring back public punishment, I want to watch some prick get stoned :bleh:

You get the weed, I will smoke it for you. Then you can watch me get stoned.:devil2:

[Katman]

Some people don't want niggers or jews moving in next door, but you don't get everything in life you want.

That's not what I asked though.

Do you really want others to be able to control your actions against your will?

[ducatilover]

You get the weed, I will smoke it for you. Then you can watch me get stoned.:devil2:

Sorry bro, it irritates my sinusitis :laugh:

[unstuck]

Sorry bro, it irritates my sinusitis :laugh:

Bummer, amyl nitrate before buttsex instead then is it?:shifty:

[ducatilover]

Bummer, amyl nitrate before buttsex instead then is it?:shifty:

:confused: Don't tell.

[imdying]

That's not what I asked though.Hey man, you took off on a tangent without answering my question... turn about is fair play...

[Mushu]

Decriminalize cannabis and spend the money trying to fight its use, on addiction education and life skills education. IMO.:innocent:

Why do things half way, legalize it, regulate it, road side saliva tests to stop people driving under the influence and sell it at pubs or something taxed. This would deprive gangs of income, provide a huge income source for the government and completely kill the synthetic pot industry.

In regard to the OP, the controversy from animal testing comes from the fact they use cute, fuzzy animals would people be worried at all if they tested on ants, flies or cockroaches, I seriously doubt it. (unfortunately we need to test on mammals to get results that are useful)

Why don't we eat dog or horse in our country? The exact same reason, they are seen as pets. I wouldn't eat a dog but would happily eat horse, but in certain cultures eating those animals is common.

[Katman]

(unfortunately we need to test on mammals to get results that are useful)


Once upon a time that might have been the case.

Science has advanced somewhat since then.

[Drew]

Last time I checked...Meth was illegal. Doesn't stop people using it though.Fuck, I'll be stoked if it's not anymore.


lol. I've always thought speeding should be legal...I love speed!:cool:


I agree, will sort the men from the masses! (although I have proven I suck at it, even though I have never had a ticket)


I don't know if you guys are talking about the same thing.

[Crasherfromwayback]

I don't know if you guys are talking about the same thing.

lol. Obviously not!