Wanted: Book about motorcycle suspension

[p.dath]

I've been avoiding learning about suspension because it all seems like a black art to me. Some kind of magic, something that you go to a magician to have adjusted.

But I feel like it's time I started trying to understand it. To that end, I wouldn't mind getting a book (as opposed to an online resource) about motorcycle suspension.

Does anyone have a book they would care to recommend?

[Drew]

Robert might be able to point you in the direction of some good resources.

How they work is pretty simple (the mechanics of it) all things considered, so if that's what you want to understand you shouldn't struggle.

Should you be looking to learn how to spec a shim stack and tune suspension, then you start moving into the world of art rather than science.

[AllanB]

Crack out the card and order either of these. The Racetech one covers everything from simple tweaking to work way beyond the common man!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Suspension-Tuning-/190878777040?pt=AU_Non_Fiction_Books_2&hash=item2c7142fed0

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Race-Techs-Motorcycle-Suspension-Bible-Dirt-Street-and-Track-Parks-Lee-The-/231017862441?pt=AU_Non_Fiction_Books_2&hash=item35c9bcd529

[Robert Taylor]

No need to buy offshore and put money into the pockets of people who put nothing back into our local economy. We have the Race Tech book in stock and its an excellent publication. Call me during the week 0830 to 1730 hours incl, 06 7512100. Or e-mail

[caspernz]

I've been avoiding learning about suspension because it all seems like a black art to me. Some kind of magic, something that you go to a magician to have adjusted.

But I feel like it's time I started trying to understand it. To that end, I wouldn't mind getting a book (as opposed to an online resource) about motorcycle suspension.

Does anyone have a book they would care to recommend?

Instead of buying the book from Dr Robert Taylor...why not take a trip to New Plymouth with your bike? The result will surprise you :niceone:

[p.dath]

Robert might be able to point you in the direction of some good resources.

How they work is pretty simple (the mechanics of it) all things considered, so if that's what you want to understand you shouldn't struggle.

Should you be looking to learn how to spec a shim stack and tune suspension, then you start moving into the world of art rather than science.

Negative, I don't want to be touching shims. Correct, I want to understand the terms, and what the adjustments actually do.


No need to buy offshore and put money into the pockets of people who put nothing back into our local economy. We have the Race Tech book in stock and its an excellent publication. Call me during the week 0830 to 1730 hours incl, 06 7512100. Or e-mail

I'll flick you a PM shortly.


Instead of buying the book from Dr Robert Taylor...why not take a trip to New Plymouth with your bike? The result will surprise you :niceone:

Now you see, Robert would probably want to know what I felt was wrong with my current suspension, and I would have to say it feels great to me (with my limited knowledge), and the conversation would probably end. It's hard to ask someone to fix a problem that you don't know exists. :)
I don't have a suspension problem that I want to solve. I just want to understand it better.

[gwigs]

http://www.gostar-racing.com/information/motorcycle_suspension_set-up.htm

Some good info on how suspension works and how to set up..:niceone:

You can download a pdf from the site.

[Maha]

I've been avoiding learning about suspension because it all seems like a black art to me. Some kind of magic, something that you go to a magician to have adjusted.

But I feel like it's time I started trying to understand it. To that end, I wouldn't mind getting a book (as opposed to an online resource) about motorcycle suspension.

Does anyone have a book they would care to recommend?

I sat and had a coffee with Graeme Crosby a few years and asked him to explain the workings of suspension, this was when I had the CB. He drew a graph type thing on a pad, explained it all in great detail but did it sink in? no not really , nice coffee though, thanks Mrs C.
It shouldn't be as technically confusing as some try to make it out to be.

[Drew]

I sat and had a coffee with Graeme Crosby a few years and asked him to explain the workings of suspension, this was when I had the CB. He drew a graph type thing on a pad, explained it all in great detail but did it sink in? no not really , nice coffee though, thanks Mrs C.
It shouldn't be as technically confusing as some try top make it to be.

Wait. You have had things explained in detail enough to require a graph, and you think it's simple still after not bloody getting it?

If it's so simple, can you give me a spring weight requirement for a direct mount shock, 25% of the way down a 570mm swingarm. 15 degrees off vertical, and 25 degrees relative to swingarm at static. Combined bike and rider weigh 180kgs.

That'd be super.

[Maha]

Wait. You have had things explained in detail enough to require a graph, and you think it's simple still after not bloody getting it?

If it's so simple, can you give me a spring weight requirement for a direct mount shock, 25% of the way down a 570mm swingarm. 15 degrees off vertical, and 25 degrees relative to swingarm at static. Combined bike and rider weigh 180kgs.

That'd be super.

Where did I say it was simple? I said ''It shouldn't be as technically confusing''
I haven't even looked at the rear shock on my bike as yet. All I need to know (and I suspect many others do also) is the adjustment needed on preload and rebound when adding an extra 90kgs (or there abouts) to the bike with gear and pillion.

[Drew]

Where did I say it was simple? I said ''It shouldn't be as technically confusing''
I haven't even looked at the rear shock on my bike as yet. All I need to know (and I suspect many others do also) is the adjustment needed on preload and rebound when adding an extra 90kgs (or there abouts) to the bike with gear and pillion.

Add as much preload as ya like, it won't change that it's undersprung and damped for the extra weight.

It is very technical, to set up for a massive change like what you have described. Like, owning two rear shocks because the only thing they share is the housings.

[p.dath]

I sat and had a coffee with Graeme Crosby a few years and asked him to explain the workings of suspension, this was when I had the CB. He drew a graph type thing on a pad, explained it all in great detail but did it sink in? no not really , nice coffee though, thanks Mrs C.
It shouldn't be as technically confusing as some try to make it out to be.

I've had people explain it to me before as well, and it didn't sink in. That's why I'm going for a book this time. Something I can go back to and refer to a few times. Then I don't have to take it all in, in one session.

[Maha]

I've had people explain it to me before as well, and it didn't sink in. That's why I'm going for a book this time. Something I can go back to and refer to a few times. Then I don't have to take it all in, in one session.

That Race Tech book spoken of earlier might just be what you're after, you do track days :yes:

[Fergus]

Wait. You have had things explained in detail enough to require a graph, and you think it's simple still after not bloody getting it?

If it's so simple, can you give me a spring weight requirement for a direct mount shock, 25% of the way down a 570mm swingarm. 15 degrees off vertical, and 25 degrees relative to swingarm at static. Combined bike and rider weigh 180kgs.

That'd be super.

No one could. ;)

With that information the force the spring must exert at static equilibrium (ie swingarm is still relative to bike) could be calculated but that force could be achieved with any spring as you dont specify spring displacement.

(Assuming 'spring weight requirement' means spring constant eg N/m or kg/mm etc)





It shouldn't be as technically confusing as some try to make it out to be.

Suspension is a really fucking complex dynamic system, if you want to a (very basic) understanding of how to set up a bike read the link gwigs posted. If you want a thorough understanding of how it works you'll need a PhD in Physics (or Mechanical engineering) :crazy:

[Drew]

No one could. ;) you dont specify spring displacement.

(Assuming 'spring weight requirement' means spring constant eg N/m or kg/mm etc)
Yes, 'spring constant' is what I was after. I just say 'weight' because everyone sorta understands it. eg, "You need a heavier/lighter spring".

Spring displacement could have been worked out, if I'd given a shock and a stroke length...(I think). I left it off the list to see if anyone would try and give an answer.

[Maha]

Suspension is a really fucking complex dynamic system, if you want to a (very basic) understanding of how to set up a bike read the link gwigs posted. If you want a thorough understanding of how it works you'll need a PhD in Physics (or Mechanical engineering) :crazy:

That is a good read indeed, and for the average rider, probably all that is required. Very easy to understand from the first sentence. I will take the time and print it out.

''I tried suspension setting from motorcycle newspapers, sports bike magazine, top racing websites and forums and they were all crap. In fact two sources never recommended the same setting for my bike and no one adequately explained how they got those settings. I felt I had to find my own suspension settings for my bike. In order to do so, I had to understand how it worked and this article will attempt to explain how I set up my bike and how you can too.''

[Fergus]

Yes, 'spring constant' is what I was after. I just say 'weight' because everyone sorta understands it. eg, "You need a heavier/lighter spring".

Spring displacement could have been worked out, if I'd given a shock and a stroke length...(I think).

Nope..

Stroke length only tells us the maximum displacement for a given spring, it gives no information about how hard or soft the spring may be...

If the shock uses fluid friction (as 99.9% of them do) it has no effect on static equilibrium...


To calculate the spring constant 'k', you need a spring displacement for a given force:

k = -F/x (hookes law) where F is force (in newtons) and x is the displacement in metres (the change in spring length that 'F' caused)


So if you had said "the spring is compressed 20mm in this position" or whatever then a 'k' value could be calculated.

[Drew]

Nope..

Stroke length only tells us the maximum displacement for a given spring, it gives no information about how hard or soft the spring may be...

If the shock uses fluid friction (as 99.9% of them do) it has no effect on static equilibrium...


To calculate the spring constant 'k', you need a spring displacement for a given force:

k = -F/x (hookes law) where F is force (in newtons) and x is the displacement in metres (the change in spring length that 'F' caused)


So if you had said "the spring is compressed 20mm in this position" or whatever then a 'k' value could be calculated.I'm pretty sure, that all of that can he worked out from the information I supplied.

I don't see how giving you nothing but a sag figure, is the way to determine what spring I need. There is no sag figure to give, because the bike is custom made and has nothing in place where the shock will be.

[nosebleed]

I've been avoiding learning about suspension because it all seems like a black art to me. Some kind of magic, something that you go to a magician to have adjusted.

But I feel like it's time I started trying to understand it. To that end, I wouldn't mind getting a book (as opposed to an online resource) about motorcycle suspension.

Does anyone have a book they would care to recommend?

Try "Sportbike Suspension Tuning" by Andrew Trevitt
ISBN-13: 978 1 893618 45 9
ISBN-10: 1 893618 45 5

I've got a copy here and it's an "easy" read. Still takes a few passes to get thing to sink in tho'

[Fergus]

I'm pretty sure, that all of that can he worked out from the information I supplied.

I don't see how giving you nothing but a sag figure, is the way to determine what spring I need. There is no sag figure to give, because the bike is custom made and has nothing in place where the shock will be.

:facepalm: Ok, here we go..;)




If it's so simple, can you give me a spring weight requirement for a direct mount shock, 25% of the way down a 570mm swingarm. 15 degrees off vertical, and 25 degrees relative to swingarm at static. Combined bike and rider weigh 180kgs.

That'd be super.

Assumption: weight distribution is 50:50 (ie 90kg/wheel)


Static Equilibrium => summing moments about any point in space will equal zero. I will choose the swing arm hinge as my point of reference.


Moment due to weight = opposing moment due to spring

cos(50)(.570m)(90kg) = sin(25)(0.1425m)(spring weight force)

Spring weight force = (cos(50)(.570m)(90kg)) / (sin(25)(0.1425m)) = 547.5kg


So the spring must withstand 547.5kg (or 5371N)

Hookes law:
F = kx

We have F and we have two unknowns; k and x, we have used all the given information, we are stuck.. without knowing either k or x we cannot calculate the other and we have no information at all about k or x...


We can plug some random figures in:
if we say k is 15kg/mm:
x = F/k = (547.5kg)/ (15kg/mm) = 36.5mm (of spring compression)


If we say x is 20mm
k = F/x k = (547.5kg)/(20mm) = 27.4kg/mm (spring constant)


Your spring rate is the least of your problems though, your swing arm is closer to being vertical than it is to horizontal (50 degrees from horizontal!!) :eek5:

[Drew]

:facepalm: Ok, here we go..;)



Assumption: weight distribution is 50:50 (ie 90kg/wheel)


Static Equilibrium => summing moments about any point in space will equal zero. I will choose the swing arm hinge as my point of reference.


Moment due to weight = opposing moment due to spring

cos(50)(.570m)(90kg) = sin(25)(0.1425m)(spring weight force)

Spring weight force = (cos(50)(.570m)(90kg)) / (sin(25)(0.1425m)) = 547.5kg


So the spring must withstand 547.5kg (or 5371N)

Hookes law:
F = kx

We have F and we have two unknowns; k and x, we have used all the given information, we are stuck.. without knowing either k or x we cannot calculate the other and we have no information at all about k or x...


We can plug some random figures in:
if we say k is 15kg/mm:
x = F/k = (547.5kg)/ (15kg/mm) = 36.5mm (of spring compression)


If we say x is 20mm
k = F/x k = (547.5kg)/(20mm) = 27.4kg/mm (spring constant)


Your spring rate is the least of your problems though, your swing arm is closer to being vertical than it is to horizontal (50 degrees from horizontal!!) :eek5:Swing arm is at an angle of 10° from horizontal. Where did 50° come from?

The random figure you put in there, should be the average optimum sag a suspension tuner uses as a starting point.

Sooooo, from the information I supplied it is possible to give me a starting point with a spring that will be pretty bloody close to right...Assuming 50/50 weight distribution.

Now that we can work that out, it's time to dream up the shim stacks. The rate of change in piston speed relative to a constant swingarm movement is pretty minimal because of the shock geometry, so unfortunately it needs to start quite aggressively or have so much travel the bike would hold it's own on a motoX track...

Discuss.

[p.dath]

http://www.gostar-racing.com/information/motorcycle_suspension_set-up.htm

Some good info on how suspension works and how to set up..:niceone:

You can download a pdf from the site.

I guess this is why I want a book. I downloaded the PDF and printed it out, got to the bit about static and rider sag, and though that just doesn't sound correct. I then when looked at the web page version, and it defines it differently from the PDF. So now I have one site with two different definitions for the same thing.

[Maha]

I guess this is why I want a book. I downloaded the PDF and printed it out, got to the bit about static and rider sag, and though that just doesn't sound correct. I then when looked at the web page version, and it defines it differently from the PDF. So now I have one site with two different definitions for the same thing.

I printed out the web page version, and will go by that...like I said earlier, it needn't be technically confusing...right down to ''that funny looking spanner thing''.
The longer this thread goes, the theories and the rights/wrongs about the subject matter, will become even more so.
What works for you ...is right.

[Robert Taylor]

Swing arm is at an angle of 10° from horizontal. Where did 50° come from?

The random figure you put in there, should be the average optimum sag a suspension tuner uses as a starting point.

Sooooo, from the information I supplied it is possible to give me a starting point with a spring that will be pretty bloody close to right...Assuming 50/50 weight distribution.

Now that we can work that out, it's time to dream up the shim stacks. The rate of change in piston speed relative to a constant swingarm movement is pretty minimal because of the shock geometry, so unfortunately it needs to start quite aggressively or have so much travel the bike would hold it's own on a motoX track...

Discuss.

Id beg to differ that the spring rate may be close. There are LOTS of other dynamic factors happening. The maths only gets you so far, the rest is real world testing. Especially with damping changes

[Fergus]

Swing arm is at an angle of 10° from horizontal. Where did 50° come from?



a direct mount shock, 25% of the way down a 570mm swingarm. 15 degrees off vertical, and 25 degrees relative to swingarm at static. .
shock is 15 degrees from vertical, swing arm is 25 degrees from shock. so swing arm is (15 + 25 =) 40 degrees from vertical =50 degrees from horizontal.


The random figure you put in there, should be the average optimum sag a suspension tuner uses as a starting point.

Sooooo, from the information I supplied it is possible to give me a starting point with a spring that will be pretty bloody close to right...Assuming 50/50 weight distribution.

So from the information you supplied.....and knowledge of 'optimum sag' from a suspension tuner :rolleyes:

I'd guess 'optimum sag' is dependent on not just the swingarm geometry you've given, the tuner would probably want details like whether you intend to ride on sand dunes or drag strips or to the dairy and back:msn-wink:...More information is required.

Either way, it's a highschool physics problem and doesn't really belong in this thread, I don't know anything about suspension, I just don't like it when people say something like:


If it's so simple, can you give me a spring weight requirement for a direct mount shock, 25% of the way down....

You gave a problem with no solution and it's clear now you have no idea how to do the problem yourself:niceone:

[Smifffy]

I'm looking forward to the complete suspension primer that P.Dath will post within 6 months of reading his book. Then we'll get the answer to this puzzle. :2thumbsup

[BuzzardNZ]

Id beg to differ that the spring rate may be close. There are LOTS of other dynamic factors happening. The maths only gets you so far, the rest is real world testing. Especially with damping changes

Robert, It's too bad that you don't do the occasional tour around the country sorting out suspenders for those interested in getting their bikes setup by someone who really knows what they are doing. I don't have time to come up to New Plymouth to get mine done and I realize tools and other gear would be a pain to transport. I've had a well known bike shop in Wgtn try and set it up, but I've never been happy with the results.
I'm happy with everything about the SV , except the bloody suspension.

If you ever toured the country ( kinda like a traveling peddler/gypsy ) I'd buy your wares!

[Drew]

shock is 15 degrees from vertical, swing arm is 25 degrees from shock. so swing arm is (15 + 25 =) 40 degrees from vertical =50 degrees from horizontal. The shock leans forward 15° from vertical. The swingarm tilts down 10° from horizontal. 25° angle between shock and swing arm.



So from the information you supplied.....and knowledge of 'optimum sag' from a suspension tuner :rolleyes:

I'd guess 'optimum sag' is dependent on not just the swingarm geometry you've given, the tuner would probably want details like whether you intend to ride on sand dunes or drag strips or to the dairy and back:msn-wink:...More information is required.Most people know I'm a road racer, but I should have pointed out the shock is for a track bike.

Swingarm angle was given to indicate the rartes of change. The sag will be inside a certain small window almost always, untill track testing starts.


Either way, it's a highschool physics problem and doesn't really belong in this thread, I don't know anything about suspension, I just don't like it when people say something like:It was an example, of how technical suspension is. A poor one perhaps, but it clearly illustrates that there is no non technical way to work on it.



You gave a problem with no solution and it's clear now you have no idea how to do the problem yourself:niceone:Of course I don't know holw to get the answer myself. Why the fuck do you think I asked? I can make small sety up changes on a bike after Robert sets it up, and usually get positive results. Building the shit, is WAY above my head!

[Drew]

Robert, It's too bad that you don't do the occasional tour around the country sorting out suspenders for those interested in getting their bikes setup by someone who really knows what they are doing. I don't have time to come up to New Plymouth to get mine done and I realize tools and other gear would be a pain to transport. I've had a well known bike shop in Wgtn try and set it up, but I've never been happy with the results.
I'm happy with everything about the SV , except the bloody suspension.

If you ever toured the country ( kinda like a traveling peddler/gypsy ) I'd buy your wares!He's done at least one day in Wellington, doing exactly what you're talking about.

Think he's done a couple of 'workshops' too.

[Drew]

Id beg to differ that the spring rate may be close. There are LOTS of other dynamic factors happening. The maths only gets you so far, the rest is real world testing. Especially with damping changes

Gets the bike rolling though. That's the goal to start with, and a known set of variables to get that starting point will be invaluable when the rubber hits the tarmac, no?

[pritch]

Try "Sportbike Suspension Tuning" by Andrew Trevitt
ISBN-13: 978 1 893618 45 9
ISBN-10: 1 893618 45 5


I'll second that.

Wish I'd seen this post before I went hunting for the book. At least I have the book handy now.

"Sportbike Suspension Tuning" contains a handy trouble shooting guide (but I haven't had to use that since Robert did the suspension : )

From memory, although I can't locate it quickly, there is a suggested training session at the end of which you should understand the effect each of the adjusters will have. I always intended to spend a morning on that but never have. Now that I'm retired?

This book is a good first suspension book and I think would suit the OP. Once read and understood you'll be ready to delve into the more technical manuals.

[pritch]

Robert, It's too bad that you don't do the occasional tour around the country sorting out suspenders for those interested in getting their bikes setup by someone who really knows what they are doing. I don't have time to come up to New Plymouth to get mine done and I realize tools and other gear would be a pain to transport. I've had a well known bike shop in Wgtn try and set it up, but I've never been happy with the results.
I'm happy with everything about the SV , except the bloody suspension.

If you ever toured the country ( kinda like a traveling peddler/gypsy ) I'd buy your wares!

He does. Every summer. Week after week. When he gets home his wife and kids wonder who this strange bloke is.

[Robert Taylor]

Robert, It's too bad that you don't do the occasional tour around the country sorting out suspenders for those interested in getting their bikes setup by someone who really knows what they are doing. I don't have time to come up to New Plymouth to get mine done and I realize tools and other gear would be a pain to transport. I've had a well known bike shop in Wgtn try and set it up, but I've never been happy with the results.
I'm happy with everything about the SV , except the bloody suspension.

If you ever toured the country ( kinda like a traveling peddler/gypsy ) I'd buy your wares!

Look for some initiatives in the future. BUT, this is all about TIME ( OR LACK THEREOF )and very real COSTS. The hours that we put in are just insane. ''Live to work''

Fortunately Im not at the stage where Id either threaten to top myself ( due to the taxing nature of what we do ) or have a need to be assessed for my mental stability ( or instability ). Thats a good thing ( being mentally stable ) if you are a suspension tuner, as you are dealing with stuff that affects safety .

Dont be led to believe by any ill informed keyboard warriors that the SV can be sorted out with just external adjusters. For pretty much everyone the front forks are just dire. They have progressively wound springs in them that are too light in start rate, so they blow through their stroke and get too progressive too quick. If nothing else a set of linear springs that are correctly preloaded and careful selection of oil viscosity and height will yield a very decent improvement at affordable cost. The rear shock isnt as bad and can be successfully revalved, plus resprung if neccessary. The link ratio is very aggressive so preload and ride height needs to be on the money so that the shock does its best or most of its work in the more supple part of travel, before it even ''arrives'' at the more accelerative / aggressive part of the link curve.

[Robert Taylor]

He does. Every summer. Week after week. When he gets home his wife and kids wonder who this strange bloke is.

Thatcher is dead, peace to her soul. And Enoch was so right

[Ocean1]

Robert, It's too bad that you don't do the occasional tour around the country sorting out suspenders for those interested in getting their bikes setup by someone who really knows what they are doing.


He does.

I was talking to Robert about a wee job on the Buell a couple of days ago. And one's own workshop simply can't be beat for getting things done, so p'raps we should organise a trailerload of Wellington area work for him.

[Drew]

I was talking to Robert about a wee job on the Buell a couple of days ago. And one's own workshop simply can't be beat for getting things done, so p'raps we should organise a trailerload of Wellington area work for him.I own a truck, we could keep him busy for months.

[Robert Taylor]

I own a truck, we could keep him busy for months.

Frankly, working out the back of a truck just doesnt cut the mustard if you are running a proffessional operation. Of course we have a workshop trailer and also a portable kit of benches and a finite amount of equipment if we decide to not tow the trailer. But that is for going to race meetings / events where you are principally working with pre-prepared kit. You know the limitations of what is possible. Here at our base in New Plymouth we have a properly laid out workshop with machining facilities, spring testing equipment, vacuum bleeding equipment,all parts, special tools and service info to hand and a three phase suspension dyno etc etc ad infinitum.

[Smifffy]

Frankly, working out the back of a truck just doesnt cut the mustard if you are running a proffessional operation. Of course we have a workshop trailer and also a portable kit of benches and a finite amount of equipment if we decide to not tow the trailer. But that is for going to race meetings / events where you are principally working with pre-prepared kit. You know the limitations of what is possible. Here at our base in New Plymouth we have a properly laid out workshop with machining facilities, spring testing equipment, vacuum bleeding equipment,all parts, special tools and service info to hand and a three phase suspension dyno etc etc ad infinitum.

I think he was proposing to bring up a truckload vs the suggested trailer load...

[Robert Taylor]

I think he was proposing to bring up a truckload vs the suggested trailer load...

That would be more ideal yes, nonetheless I think it important to have expressed the limitations of working away from ''full facilities''

[Drew]

I think he was proposing to bring up a truckload vs the suggested trailer load...


That would be more ideal yes, nonetheless I think it important to have expressed the limitations of working away from ''full facilities''Say it together now. COMMISSION!

[BuzzardNZ]

Say it together now. COMMISSION!

I was thinking more along the lines of BULK DISCOUNT.

[Robert Taylor]

I was thinking more along the lines of BULK DISCOUNT.

VALUE is a much better expression. As in all trades there are people that sell stuff cheap, thats usually tantamount to cutting corners and delivering a lesser job.

[Ocean1]

I think he was proposing to bring up a truckload vs the suggested trailer load...

Aye. We could block out a solid few days worth of shop time, send the bikes up one weekend for a return trip later that week.

'Course, it'd mean we wouldn't get to ride 'em home...

[BuzzardNZ]

VALUE is a much better expression. As in all trades there are people that sell stuff cheap, thats usually tantamount to cutting corners and delivering a lesser job.

Fair point and I agree.

When you do travel to other places ( i.e. Wellington ), I presume you 'rent' out a workshop in the locale you're in for the duration of your working stay?

[Robert Taylor]

Fair point and I agree.

When you do travel to other places ( i.e. Wellington ), I presume you 'rent' out a workshop in the locale you're in for the duration of your working stay?

As eluded to we much much prefer to work under our own roof where we have EVERYTHING to hand and can therefore also do the job much more quickly. The logistics of doing off site are just not so easy