Stupid Temptation

[Gremlin]

I seem to always get a bike itch, the GSA is the longest I've actually ever owned a bike. Previous was the KTM 990SM at 27.5 months. I've owned the GSA for 31 months. For the last few months I've been wondering... what if?

Last year I did a lot more adventure riding, which certainly paid off in handling skills (ie, I don't drop the bike as much), but this year, with the boss on long leave and more focussed on IAM stuff (passed the full membership test earlier this year, and now continuing on to be a Trainee Observer) I find myself doing much less adv stuff and a lot more road stuff. Couple that with increasing escort/marshalling riding with charity rides and cycling events and adv riding is even further away. I still like having the potential to do that stuff, but wonder if I need it. Last adv riding was my annual trip to the South Island in Feb/Mar. Being able to explore any road is really neat.

I find myself wondering if a sports tourer would be more suited, and once again feel the lure of more power. Commonsense tells me I'd just get into more trouble (which I really can't afford)... but... mmm that power. :drool: Doesn't help one of the IAM guys rides a K1300R, which really grabs me like a little school boy. I had the same debate back when looking to replace the KTM. ST1300, Concours 14, R1200RT. Would I like it more? Rule out Yamaha (don't know a good dealer), Triumph (all things Beckhaus are never to be considered in NZ) and minor brands. Loving the work of Botany Honda, but the ST1300 is long in the tooth and a bit boring with not a lot of punch and odd ball tyre sizes. VFR1200R tank is too small - been spoilt by a 36-38L capacity, so anything is a step down, but it's gotta be mid 20s me thinks, to survive.

I consider the Concours, what an engine, straight from the ZX14. But lack of cruise control spoils it. Apparently the revised screen isn't the best... the little things are letting it down, even though the '10+ is much improved over old. The R1200RT is one of the lightest available and excellent balance at low speed, the police use it, good police crash bars, maybe a few extra lights, possibly a custom spec from factory to get the authority edition transmission and oil cooler kit for low speed work. :whistle: Yes, I could see it working...

But then there's the guys in the US that switch from an RT to a GSA (sure, some go the other way), as it's a better all round touring platform. Better for big guys too. Big fuel capacity, ooh, and if I wanted it, I could do gravel and other adv riding, if I wanted... would save a bike change if I had an RT or C14... The GSA also sports the lower transmission and has plenty of practical space.

Oh fuck it. :wacko:

I've gone around in this stupid cycle 3 times this year... I think I've found the perfect bike?

[nzspokes]

Dont the Rts overheat a bit?

[insomnia01]

Was out numbered big time on the SCRR this year by BMW ( over 50% ) attendance, ST's @ 1/2 doz the guys where chewing up the gravel ( EC lighthouse ) roads good road handling to boot

[Hitcher]

BMW styling and looks, build quality, reliability and cost are the four things that would put me off owning one.

I know an Upper Hutt rider desperately in love with a sky-hooked MTS...

[Gremlin]

ST's @ 1/2 doz the guys where chewing up the gravel ( EC lighthouse ) roads good road handling to boot
KoroJ tried out some fording with the ST... after almost busting a hernia getting it back upright, I don't think he's keen to try again. Btw, I've ridden a Blackbird... makes power with no effort... only speeding ticket I've ever had... nasty bike. :innocent:


BMW styling and looks, build quality, reliability and cost are the four things that would put me off owning one.

I know an Upper Hutt rider desperately in love with a sky-hooked MTS...
Looks are always subjective. I don't like the GS, but I do like the GSA... I dunno. Build quality/reliability, I've had less issues with the BMW, and pushed it far harder than the KTM. Still, I've had issues. I reckon that too many load the crap out of them, then bounce down rough roads and wonder why it breaks. I suspect lesser bikes would simply break sooner. Cost... uh, no contest. Again cheaper than the KTM, but no, they're no japper. Servicing every 10k is handy when doing longer trips.

Boss is currently riding his MTS in Europe, guess I'll have a spin when it comes back here later this year or early next. Toto and I both went into Haldanes, when they were the Duc dealers, separately, and asked them about the MTS. We wanted crash bars and protection, they wanted us to have carbon fibre bits... :blink: Two different purposes. Btw, hankered for your Z1000, but never ridden one... small tank means I don't see much point in testing one. Excellent value for money, but the newer one is ugly...

[Gremlin]

Dont the Rts overheat a bit?
That story will go worldwide (has sort of already). Only one or two other BMWs I know of, that have burnt down. When you consider how many authority edition of the RT are out there in service, it's a lot of bikes with very few issues...

[Hitcher]

hankered for your Z1000, but never ridden one... small tank means I don't see much point in testing one. Excellent value for money, but the newer one is ugly...

The newer model Z is indeed ugly, and its tank is 3 litres smaller than what's on mine too. Hitting fumes at less than 300km isn't quite what I look for in a bike, so the latest Z isn't on my to-buy list. I often wonder what purpose motorcycle designers think people use their machines for. Going for longish rides clearly isn't what's intended.

I'm a bit like you when it comes to deciding what's next. Money no object and Triumph NZ issues notwithstanding, I'm seriously smitten with the new Caponord. I suspect that this will be in the MTS pricing band whenever it arrives and I don't think that the Beckhauses will contract out of the manufacturer's warranty for a significant price discount. By then my business may be making serious amounts of coin and I may be able to broaden my price point. Or not.

[Blackbird]

Alan,
I'm simply writing to express my profound jealousy at the way you change bikes like I change clothes - clearly no thumbprint on your forehead (but there are compensations :whistle:)Yeah, Andy's 1300 is a beast and Rog's 1200 s is pretty nice too. Got time to change bikes before your Observer training? :laugh:

Ignoring whatever shortcomings the Beckhaus empire have, I have nothing but praise for Hamilton Motorcycle Centre where I bought my Triumph from. Their customer service is beyond reproach and they sorted out my 2 warranty issues with no problem whatsoever.

[Gremlin]

I often wonder what purpose motorcycle designers think people use their machines for. Going for longish rides clearly isn't what's intended.
Seriously cross country travel... yep, not many bikes. Most expect you to ride for 50-100km then have a break. May as well fill with gas at the same time. On the other side though, you need to design a bike for such a big tank. It will also affect handling. The GSA with a full tank is 35kg heavier than an empty tank. You can feel the suspension response changing from full to empty. Bit soft full, bit harsh empty. Sweet spot somewhere in the middle. And back to range, manufacturers think that if they make it more economical, they can decrease the tank volume :facepalm: I guess in Europe/North America/Asia gas stations are in plentiful supply.


I'm a bit like you when it comes to deciding what's next. Money no object and Triumph NZ issues notwithstanding, I'm seriously smitten with the new Caponord.
Sexy looking bike... Definitely an MTS competitor to a point, runs on normal street tyres, but a better tank range. Aprilia definitely know how to make a nice motor. Other option in that category would probably be a Tiger Sport. Money no object I'd need a very large garage to house all the bikes I want ;)

Oh, even the F800GS Adventure could be tempting, but more on the adventure end, and not nearly as good for 2up marshalling stuff... the 1200GSA really is pretty handy at so many things.

[Maha]

Yip and wound on, it sounds like an Air force Andover ...:gob:
Yet to see Rogers K1300 in the flesh, I love those things also. It's a hard road finding the perfect bike... even when you think you have, over time that first thought can change. Seems like you have smashed the dilemma that a lot of us face.

[Gremlin]

Yip and wound on, it sounds like an Air force Andover ...:gob:
Yet to see Rogers K1300 in the flesh, I love those things also. It's a hard road finding the perfect bike... even when you think you have, over time that first thought can change. Seems like you have smashed the dilemma that a lot of us face.
Thought changes normally because your needs change. Also, having a certain bike can change your viewpoint, or lift your standards of what you'll expect from other bikes (or lower your standard :lol:) The K1300 sounds really good when it has the quickshift, where it handles the ignition cut and you only have to change the gear. A short bup like a loud backfire... sounds gorgeous when accelerating hard through the gears :scooter:.

Definitely a hard road finding the perfect bike... as long as it's filled with a few fords I don't mind :yes: The GSA isn't perfect, but it's closer than anything else I've found.

[nzspokes]

it's a lot of bikes with very few issues...

But catching fire in such a way would be considered a fairly important issue. :killingme

[banditrider]

Everyone needs a Connie. :headbang:

[haydes55]

So your bike is perfect for you in every way except it is missing excitement? Or excitement of being a new bike?

Are you going to the Ohura ride?

[nzspokes]

Keep the GSA. :cool:

[Smifffy]

If cost isn't really an issue - ongoings included - could you not forgo the loss you would make on selling the GSA, keep it and get something like a Z, bandit, hornet, speed triple, busa for around town roadie fun, and use the GSA for the epic endurance rides and adv stuff? Even 2nd hand, you could probably get a good 2nd bike for the price of what you would lose on the GSA.

[Gremlin]

So your bike is perfect for you in every way except it is missing excitement? Or excitement of being a new bike?

Are you going to the Ohura ride?
Probably excitement of being a new bike. Don't really need to fit any accessories either, as they're all done :( Just that niggling wonder of something being better, and while something would be better in one or two areas, it wouldn't be better in everything, and a lot worse in some. Hence, going in circles and still concluding that the GSA is best, buggrit. Not that the bike is disappointing, as it's good fun to ride. Yes, I'll be on the ride on Saturday.


If cost isn't really an issue - ongoings included - could you not forgo the loss you would make on selling the GSA, keep it and get something like a Z, bandit, hornet, speed triple, busa for around town roadie fun, and use the GSA for the epic endurance rides and adv stuff? Even 2nd hand, you could probably get a good 2nd bike for the price of what you would lose on the GSA.
Actually have a CB900 for around town, and it's perfect for it, so yes, the GSA is basically kept for anything outside of town work. Yes, I would lose big time if I traded/sold, well aware of that (mileage is at 79,000km for a 2010 bike). GSA is definitely not the right bike for commuting around Auckland.

Just venting I guess... and wondering if others were thinking the same way... :scratch:

[Smifffy]

Probably excitement of being a new bike. Don't really need to fit any accessories either, as they're all done :( Just that niggling wonder of something being better, and while something would be better in one or two areas, it wouldn't be better in everything, and a lot worse in some. Hence, going in circles and still concluding that the GSA is best, buggrit. Not that the bike is disappointing, as it's good fun to ride. Yes, I'll be on the ride on Saturday.


Actually have a CB900 for around town, and it's perfect for it, so yes, the GSA is basically kept for anything outside of town work. Yes, I would lose big time if I traded/sold, well aware of that (mileage is at 79,000km for a 2010 bike). GSA is definitely not the right bike for commuting around Auckland.

Just venting I guess... and wondering if others were thinking the same way... :scratch:

Maybe swap the 900 for a ZXR?

[DMNTD]

Just buy an extra bike that will satisfy the other urges/requirements.
Have had a couple of bikes and have yet to find a bike that will do everything I want, however the current wee cruiser seems to do most...for me.

[caspernz]

Just venting I guess... and wondering if others were thinking the same way... :scratch:

Haha, kinda relieved to see you're just like most bikers...always thinking of the next bike!

Now apart from the desire to add the occasional offroad excursion to my rides, I've recently worked my way thru this dilemma...what to get next? In days gone by I've had more than one bike, but in recent years it's been one bike and one car.

So my list included bikes such as the Concours, new FJR1300, ST1300, R1200RT, K1300S, VFR1200, ZX14, Busa, Bandit, HD Road King, V-Strom...and ended up with a Busa after dismissing, for various reasons, the rest.

How long before I start pondering what next? Mmmm, maybe once we get a Yamaha dealer in Welly I'd add an FJR1300 :innocent:

So yes I can understand your dilemma :brick:

Maybe the solution is to find a wee lass that will put her thumb on your forehead? :nya:

[Gremlin]

Maybe the solution is to find a wee lass that will put her thumb on your forehead? :nya:
:eek: Being single, I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing? ;)

The cunning salesman at my favourite local dealer has spied this thread. He's convinced that when the weather improves and they put an ST1300 on the road, I need to have a ride. They're only $22k currently for a brand new one! :eek5: Never ridden one...

I think I'd be tempted by it's replacement model... as the current is missing things like factory heated grips (not extra) and cruise control etc. Only problem is, who knows when that will happen.

[caspernz]

:eek: Being single, I'm not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing? ;)

The cunning salesman at my favourite local dealer has spied this thread. He's convinced that when the weather improves and they put an ST1300 on the road, I need to have a ride. They're only $22k currently for a brand new one! :eek5: Never ridden one...

I think I'd be tempted by it's replacement model... as the current is missing things like factory heated grips (not extra) and cruise control etc. Only problem is, who knows when that will happen.

Nothing wrong with the right woman...you'll spend the same amount of time in the saddle, just the bike won't clock up the kays as quickly :innocent: :love:

ST1300 is a bit dated and I don't like the oddball tyre sizes. Cool bike though, just not a long term prospect for me, it just seems overdue for an update. And yes the Busa I bought is a dinosaur as well :facepalm: but it's a colour that the wifey liked...and I told her it's speed limited :innocent:

[Gremlin]

ST1300 is a bit dated and I don't like the oddball tyre sizes.
100% agreed on those points as well...

...and I told her it's speed limited :innocent:
I don't think you told her the limit is 299? :rolleyes:

[caspernz]

100% agreed on those points as well...

I don't think you told her the limit is 299? :rolleyes:

Yes she knew the 299 limiter before I ordered the Busa. Mind you, the fact my life insurance policy is quite healthy makes me think there might be an ulterior motive :blink:

Be interesting to hear what bike you end up with though...my bet is you'll find keeping the GSA for a bit longer the best short term option :sunny:

[Gremlin]

Checking the BMW into the shop for the 80k service today, instead of being given the usual F650CS tractor, this time I was treated to a 2013 F800GT with 660km on the clock. Granted, it's a middleweight, but one thing I've been reminded of... road bike suspension doesn't have enough travel... Otherwise it's a nice bike to enjoy. The smaller middleweights are lighter to move around (except the indicator on the right bar seems to have disappeared :rolleyes: )

Anyone with a Concours 14, R1200RT, ST1300 etc feel free to chime in about suspension travel...

[Devil]

Did I tell you a rode a K1600GT the other day? It's hilarious. A turbine with two wheels.
A little on the porky side, but that'd make it a good match for you.
Muahahahaa *runs for cover*

[banditrider]

Anyone with a Concours 14, R1200RT, ST1300 etc feel free to chime in about suspension travel...

Suspension works...you can get bounced out of the seat if say for example you might have been in a bit of a hurry over some bumpy road around the East Cape one fine October evening...otherwise I've no complaints.

A guy asked me the other day how the Connie compared to the DL - well, you can't compare it...fairly...

[Gremlin]

Did I tell you a rode a K1600GT the other day? It's hilarious. A turbine with two wheels.
A little on the porky side, but that'd make it a good match for you.
Muahahahaa *runs for cover*
har har. I ain't paying $46k or whatever the price is for one :weird: Primarily because I don't have $46k. Still, I do want it's headlight. No, you didn't tell me you'd ridden one.

Thanks banditrider...

[LankyBastard]

There is a low mileage one on TM with all the fruit for 33k.......

[Gremlin]

There is a low mileage one on TM with all the fruit for 33k.......
I'm worried you know that... actually, welcome to the family :shifty: Wonder if it's had it's gearbox replaced, 2012s have issues...

Temptation, but I don't have 33k either. :eek:

[LankyBastard]

Oh trust me I'm definitely tempted.... But the Tiger is perfectly fine...must keep telling myself that.....

[KoroJ]

KoroJ tried out some fording with the ST... after almost busting a hernia getting it back upright, I don't think he's keen to try again....

What you talkin' 'bout!!?? :shifty:



........... He's convinced that when the weather improves and they put an ST1300 on the road, I need to have a ride. They're only $22k currently for a brand new one! :eek5: Never ridden one...

I think I'd be tempted by it's replacement model... as the current is missing things like factory heated grips (not extra) and cruise control etc. Only problem is, who knows when that will happen.

ST's don't need heated grips 'cos the mirrors divert the breeze and ones hands don't get cold.....and I always try to cruise in a controlled manner.:shifty:

You do not like ST's, So you say.
Try them! Try them! and you may.
Try them and you may, I say.

[ratast]

Hi Alan, How are you. Just returned from Alaska. You would have enjoyed it if you love rocks, gravel and ice.
Perfect for you.
Cheers Ken

[ducatilover]

Why do you need a near 40L tank and cruise control though? I understand range is nice. But I cannot think of stretch of road in NZ that'll limit your options to an uber tank and cruise control. Mind you, I'm just a homo with a GN.

[Gremlin]

Hi Alan, How are you. Just returned from Alaska. You would have enjoyed it if you love rocks, gravel and ice.
Jealous Ken, very jealous...


Why do you need a near 40L tank and cruise control though? I understand range is nice. But I cannot think of stretch of road in NZ that'll limit your options to an uber tank and cruise control. Mind you, I'm just a homo with a GN.
I don't need 40L, but 20L won't cut it either. Gotta be a good 3-400km minimum as filling every 200km is very irritating. I've also needed 400km in some sections of NZ, especially getting through at night. For the gravel exploration stuff (not that you'd try that on an ST, Concours etc) having a full days gas is brilliant and stress free, allowing you to explore without needing to come out for gas.

Cruise control... I've lost my licence once, incredibly stressful, expensive in fines etc. Last thing I want is tickets for 115kph, and very easy to do. Couple that with high mileage and the fines are annoying, but it's the demerits that really nail you. Dial in the speed and forget. Choice :niceone: I have it in the ute and constantly use it.

In reality, I think casper is correct. There is no other bike that meets all my needs, currently on the market. Not quite sure why I want something else, but then, that was the stupid thought process that kept going around in my mind. I guess I'd like a bit more road performance, but also know it would mean more tyres and more speed :rolleyes: Brains are stupid sometimes...

[ducatilover]

Ah riding at night.
I forgot that the light goes away and gas stations close :facepalm:
My shitheap ZX6 will manage 300km with a bit to spare with a bit of sillyness on its silly 18l tank. I'll sell ya that.
As for cruise control, stop riding such comfy cushy bikes :bleh: Cruise control is nice in a car, I use it in the Alfa GTA when I'm allowed in it because I have absolutely no self control :crazy:

[Bass]

I seem to always get a bike itch, the GSA is the longest I've actually ever owned a bike. Previous was the KTM 990SM at 27.5 months. I've owned the GSA for 31 months. For the last few months I've been wondering... what if?
Oh fuck it. :wacko:

I've gone around in this stupid cycle 3 times this year... I think I've found the perfect bike?

How long ago was it when I first said to you that I saw knobblies in your future? You didn't believe me as I recall.
You have had a taste but you haven't really felt the full effect yet. They are still waiting.

When they do catch up to you, the attraction is hard to dismiss. As your bike associated activities and your comments about licence retention indicate, you are becoming more sedate and there's nothing at all wrong with that. In my opinion, there's a strong element of wisdom and maturity involved.

Sadly, (for the wallet at least) it takes more than one bike to cover the bases.
In my case, the plan is for another 6 weeks in the Oz outback next year, then a visit to the 75th anniversary of Sturgis in 2015, followed by lotsa playtime 2 up, in the Rockies and other non flat territory afterwards. Now, there is no single bike out there that adequately covers that range of activities. The US trip will involve buying a bike over there and bringing it back. I want something that is happy and capable on the seal, 2 up with luggage, but doesn't mind too much when the seal runs out.
It could well be a GS or GSA don't you think?

[NZsarge]

I know where there's a 2010 Concours in great nick lowish k's for around the $15k mark, ideal for "another" bike, keep the GSA. I like the new FJR too, it's got cruise which is nice and there is an electronically adjustable suspension version coming out soon I understand.

[Gremlin]

It could well be a GS or GSA don't you think?
I think your physical size would preclude a GSA, but I do have a small amount of experience.

The GS style bike is a brilliant all terrain tourer, with trade offs obviously, but otherwise only limited by your skill and tyre choice. :niceone: I should probably add stupidity as well. No one in their right mind would take the bike some places I have. :confused:

[JimmyC]

Oh, even the F800GS Adventure could be tempting, but more on the adventure end, and not nearly as good for 2up marshalling stuff... the 1200GSA really is pretty handy at so many things.

Is this bike even coming to NZ do you know? Been out for quite a while but haven't seen any here yet. There's only around 15kg's difference between that and a 1200GS anyway so I wonder about its place.

[Gremlin]

Is this bike even coming to NZ do you know? Been out for quite a while but haven't seen any here yet. There's only around 15kg's difference between that and a 1200GS anyway so I wonder about its place.
No idea, not really a bike on my interest list. I would say the difference is a bit biased. That's a 12GS vs 8GSA, and an 8GS would be lighter. Still, that's that. A review said the F800GSA is around 226kg, fueled etc, whereas the R1200GSA is around 256kg I think? from literature I read a while ago.

The 12GSA is also too big for your average sized person, hell, even at 6'3, on rough roads, keeping it upright during U-turns etc it's a handful, so there's definitely a market for most of the same features, while able to be handled by more people. The electrical output is only 400W though, I reckon that's pathetic. The 12GS/12GSA are 720W.

[JimmyC]

You mentioned the 800 Adv could be tempting in your earlier post hence my bringing it up is all. Both the 800 and 1200 Adv models have the same seat height too @ 890mm.

Wet weights:
F800GS - 210kg's
F800GSA - 228kg's
1200GS - 239kg's
1200GSA - 256kg's

[Gremlin]

You mentioned the 800 Adv could be tempting in your earlier post hence my bringing it up is all. Both the 800 and 1200 Adv models have the same seat height too @ 890mm.
Fairy muff, except lots of bikes are tempting... can only afford to have 1 or 2 <_< A garage housing a fleet might get expensive.

Good facts, and silly to have both bikes at 890mm seat. I know the R12 seat is adjustable between two height settings. The 800 is certainly more off road biased, 21 inch front etc. However, it also means it's tyre options are more limited for road stuff...

[JimmyC]

Does shaft vs chain factor into your internal debate for the 'perfect' bike?

[Gremlin]

Does shaft vs chain factor into your internal debate for the 'perfect' bike?
Probably... since having a shaft I do bugger all maintenance to chain driven bikes :o Even filling a scottoiler is a little hard, as the mechanics keep reminding me... :sweatdrop

Much easier to tell the shop to replace the fluid while they are servicing other things... so yes, I like shafts, but they has to be reliable (and yes, mine has been faultless) ;)

[Gremlin]

Can't help it... it's turning into a favourite past time :facepalm:

Came across an very interesting shootout for this year: http://www.ridermagazine.com/manufacturer/bmw/five-fast-fellows-2013-sport-touring-shootout.htm/ (while uh, reading the Concourse Owners Group forum)

BMWs on top, then Triumph, then Yamaha and Kawasaki tied at the bottom.

So (in case anyone is actually seriously considering options), here are my thoughts.

Kawasaki Concours 14
Looks bloody sexy in my opinion, stonking motor, heat issues have been addressed. Let down by a small fuel capacity, no cruise control, handling may be dubious. The last can be fixed obviously, then again, at those dollars so could the cruise control. Factory fitted cruise would require a shift to fly by wire I believe, first gen of that may not be executed too well. The next release could be interesting.

Honda ST1300
Oldest of the group, no heated grips, cruise control, traction control (debatable if required) and basically showing it's age all round. Price is fantastic however, reflected in lack of features but the large fuel tank keeps it at arms length (or is that a long walk :msn-wink:) from its competitors. Oddball tyres limit options for someone who is picky about their tyres. Plenty of people are waiting to see it's replacement.

Yamaha FJR1300
Brand new for this year, packing quite a punch in features, cruise control, heated grips, adjustable seat height and a decent tank capacity of 25L. I don't like how it looks, the wind protection is a little lacking and I'm not sure about a suitable dealer, as most Yamaha reps in Auckland at least, have closed down over the last few years. Dealer support and relationship is crucial for me and I'll rule a bike out on dealer alone. Apparently Yamaha advises panniers OR top box, as both might exceed weight limits... uh... that's damn stupid.

BMW R1200RT
An old favourite for reviews, puzzling how on paper it shouldn't beat its competitors and yet almost always does. All the fruit like cruise control, heated grips etc plus electronic suspension it's one of the lightest options with excellent balance and low speed handling as well as handling in general. Its long term maintenance costs are its achilles heal, including the cops (clutch jobs are inevitable for them and expensive). The likes of Kawasaki focus on these aspects as they fight for their cut of the police bike market. The biggest issue for me is... what does the RT offer over the GSA? Cruise control would be one of the biggest, but you lose features from the GSA instead. As mentioned, this is what shuts down the comparison every time. I'm also interested in the new model which should launch in the next year or two (and spy shots have been published already).

BMW K1600GT
I'd always ruled out on cost alone, but they've come down in price and 2nd hand ones are hitting the market. However, these have suffered some teething issues (who buys a year one BMW anyway) around gearbox and jerky throttle. It's also the biggest heaviest bike of the options, but just look at the videos of Chris Pfeiffer stunting it... The bike is capable alright. I want it's headlight (and maybe the RT replacement will have it). Like the other BMW, it's a BMW so maintenance isn't cheap, but then the GSA, while more costly than a jap has also been rock solid when I've done stupid things that would have broken other bikes...

So uh... once again, got a GSA :laugh:

[Hitcher]

Nice summary.

We differ in that I can't stand BMWs. Uglier than ugly things, although that seems to be encouraged by their "designers". Even the supersports model looks like Colonel Klink. I don't like telelink suspension, or oil-burning boxer engines, or shaft-drives that go squiffy, or turning indicators that require three switches to activate, or unreliable skyhook suspension. For starters. Then there's the price of the unreliable things.

The K1600 is lunacy at $45,000. That's the same as two NEW ST1300s, and the ST1300s would never need a warranty claim.

Yamaha has always had that rear loading nonsense about panniers or topbox on the FJR. I've done many thousands of kilometres with all three loaded, and a pillion on board. They're that well made that the warranty is irrelevant, unlike a BMW.

The worst feature about the ST1300 is riding one in a big cross-wind. Fuck. Me. And the whining cams. That's my job.

The Concours looks bloody silly with the standard muffler on. Standard suspension leaves a bit to be desired, as does fuel range. However with some suspension mods, these are hard to beat.

[Gremlin]

Good points Hitch, some notes.

BMW
The Telelever suspension is something you have to get used to and trust. I remember switching from normal forks to the BMW and thinking what the hell is going on, but now it feels natural. Switch blocks are in the process of... switching... over. The new GS has a conventional layout. Issues are also being reported with their switch blocks however. Doesn't look like the 1600 is $46k (for the GT at least) any more, so lets hope the price returns to a more sane level. Still, its competitor is a Goldwing, and that puts it into perspective... I don't want one of those! Sportsbikes are supposed to be pretty, so no idea why it's so ugly with mismatched headlights.

The ST1300 does have some well known issues, but there is a lot less going on, and fixes are a lot cheaper. Good point on the whine, I forgot to mention it. Last weekend on an IAM social run, 3 of us had comms, one on an ST1300, and we had a intercom call running between all of us. Whine was present throughout the call, fark, imagine being on top of it.

Standard muffler on the Concours is definitely silly. Too long. For me however, stuff like event riding does need a quieter bike, so any aftermarket option would need a removable baffle so I could quieten as required. Too many want to be loud or louder. Still have the stock can on the GSA and I'd only really aim to replace for weight reduction.

Also for event riding, I need to look at gear ratios. A low first is almost necessary to preserve the clutch. Some of the guys have had to pull out of regular events as the clutch is complaining (and they were STs I think). I can drop to about 12kph on the GSA before I need the clutch to smooth things out. It does depend on the rider of course, and how they handle their machine.

[Devil]

Re: K1600.
Having ridden one, i'd have one. Turbine with wheels.

The gearbox, I dont think it's broken, I think it has been designed like that. Rushing a shift will result in a clonk and shudder. If you relax and put your head into cruise mode it's as smooth as silk. But that's kinda counter-intuitive when you've got that engine beneath you. and WHAT an engine. Nom nom nom.

New GSA looks mean ;)

[Gremlin]

New GSA looks mean ;)
Has a smaller tank :facepalm: I imagine they reckon it will be more fuel efficient, so lets decrease the tank size.

I didn't like the old GS, but loved the GSA, sorta looked purposeful. Both new ones are pretty ugly...

[Devil]

They look AWESOME.
The only details i've seen about the new Adv is comparing it to the current GS. I want to see compared to the old Adv.
How bike in litres is the new tank?

[JimmyC]

30 litres for the new GSA, 20 in the new GS.

[Devil]

Hmm, I wonder what the actual volume is.

Using my '06 GSA as an example - specs say 33L, but you can get 36L in there if you pull the rubber bung out of the top...

[Gremlin]

Hmm, I wonder what the actual volume is.

Using my '06 GSA as an example - specs say 33L, but you can get 36L in there if you pull the rubber bung out of the top...
The newer GSA (not waterhead) couldn't be modified in the same way, so I'm thinking (depending on what the new GS is like) it probably can't be modified much.

That said, fill right into the neck if you're riding immediately, and it's somewhere between 36 - 38L. Sure makes the counter guy look twice :innocent:

[gunnyrob]

the new f800 gsa has good reviews in Aussie

[gijoe1313]

I've always wondered what bike ol'Gremlin would get next after this current ride goes kablooey! I guess he can just keep riding his until it does! :devil2:

[BMWST?]

i wish they still made the st1200 or a modern version of the r1150 rs.With a biggish tank (the st had a 25 l tank i think) would be a more road oriented gs

[mossy1200]

Touring zx14r. 400km range per tank. Sports touring perfection.

Optional rear luggage and tank purse.:banana:

[Gremlin]

I've always wondered what bike ol'Gremlin would get next after this current ride goes kablooey! I guess he can just keep riding his until it does! :devil2:
I have never "kablooey'd" a bike thank you very much :oi-grr: The cost of the GSA (and select market for one) does mean I'm likely to continue riding it for quite some time. Most buyers would run a mile when they find out a 2010 bike has 80k+ on it (and it basically sat still for the first year).

i wish they still made the st1200 or a modern version of the r1150 rs.
ST1200?

Touring zx14r.
That's not a sentence that makes any sense, how can two such opposite words co-exist? ;)

The Concours does appeal looks wise, but needs some kit like cruise control, better fuel economy and bigger tank. That sort of stuff can't be easily added. Suspension is easily replaced to improve handling etc. The next Concours I think will be one to watch, as it should receive the new updates from the zx14, and if Kawasaki continues to listen to customers, the aforementioned bits are the biggest gripes and will hopefully be sorted.

[BMWST?]

Sorry r1200st

[nzspokes]

Touring zx14r. 400km range per tank. Sports touring perfection.

Optional rear luggage and tank purse.:banana:

So whats it like to sit on the trailer at 200? Thats got to be worth a giggle. :lol:

[nzspokes]

Cruise control, I have one of these. http://www.fastbikegear.co.nz/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=485&products_id=867

Fooking brilliant. Not as flash as a proper speed controlling system but for $26 its cool.

[Gremlin]

So whats it like to sit on the trailer at 200? Thats got to be worth a giggle. :lol:
How could he know? He can only do 90kph when towing. 40kph if the trailer + load is more than half the weight of the bike... ;)


Cruise control, I have one of these.
Not perfect, can slip etc... easier to have the manufacturer install a proper one. There are aftermarket solutions, but they're 4 figures :crazy:

[nzspokes]

Not perfect, can slip etc... easier to have the manufacturer install a proper one. There are aftermarket solutions, but they're 4 figures :crazy:

Agreed. Mine doesnt slip. They come with a black rubber band that you can put under to help hold if needed. But mine stays put without for 10 mins. But for the price well worth it.

[mossy1200]

So whats it like to sit on the trailer at 200? Thats got to be worth a giggle. :lol:

The guestamation says still stable at 240 and wheelies could occur at 180.
90 is a sensible speed to travel at.:brick:

Idd rate it as more comfortable than my blackbird was.

[10bikekid]

I gona throw a Goldwing spanner into the works, mainly cause they can do 200.000ks without even a whimper so might last you 4 years then you can sell it at the low milliage of 160k leaving plenty for the next rider :wacko:

PS, would also agree with what one of the other guys said about having multiple bike, I generally ride one for a while till I get a bit bored and then switch to another, you soon start to pine again for the features of one of the others and swap around again. Rode Honda CB1000 Big last weekend, swapped to YZ this weekend and was on DR750 2 weeks before that (KTM is my main ride but am giving it a rest and cant be bothered changing near worn out rear tire yet :oi-grr:)

Will fire up Aprilia in a few weeks but its not very good for your License as per example in pic (by the way that's not me officer:Police:)
<a href="http://s603.photobucket.com/user/800rider/media/3d118835-0aaa-403d-be8b-9df2bd0aae83_zps490e7b91.jpg.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt119/800rider/3d118835-0aaa-403d-be8b-9df2bd0aae83_zps490e7b91.jpg" border="0" alt=" photo 3d118835-0aaa-403d-be8b-9df2bd0aae83_zps490e7b91.jpg"/></a>

[Gremlin]

I gona throw a Goldwing spanner into the works, mainly cause they can do 200.000ks without even a whimper so might last you 4 years then you can sell it at the low milliage of 160k leaving plenty for the next rider :wacko:
Wash your mouth out... nah, in all seriousness, the bike has to be more nimble than a Goldwing, it's simply too large for some of the stuff I do. I know they're good for their size in the right hands, but it's still not good enough (ie, 2up u-turns in 3 standard lanes etc.

So I had a ride on a mate's K1300R today, always hankered after them based on performance, sound etc. We swapped after some lunch in Wellsford and headed down SH16, agreeing to swap back at Woodcocks intersection. Funnily enough, neither of us wanted to swap back yet, so carried on to Kaukapakapa. The turbine like power of the K is incredible, gears are really only there to change the sound of the exhaust, as it pulls well in any gear (this probably means tyre life would be ... compromised) and once I used the quickshift properly (after so many normal gear changes, it was really hard to not automatically back off on each change) it was quite the giggle.

Summing up though, it would be a fun additional bike, the long wheelbase makes it super stable, but it wouldn't replace the GSA. Normally, the danger of riding another bike is you realise how great it is and want one. Fortunately in this case, it actually made me love the GSA even more, with the wide bars and Ohlins suspension I've really got it good. After a lot of time and money I've got the bike exactly how I want it. Awesome.

Don't ask me to explain why I keep looking at other bikes then... I think it's just being a biker :msn-wink:

[10bikekid]

Wash your mouth out... nah, in all seriousness, the bike has to be more nimble than a Goldwing, it's simply too large for some of the stuff I do. I know they're good for their size in the right hands, but it's still not good enough (ie, 2up u-turns in 3 standard lanes etc.

So I had a ride on a mate's K1300R today, always hankered after them based on performance, sound etc. We swapped after some lunch in Wellsford and headed down SH16, agreeing to swap back at Woodcocks intersection. Funnily enough, neither of us wanted to swap back yet, so carried on to Kaukapakapa. The turbine like power of the K is incredible, gears are really only there to change the sound of the exhaust, as it pulls well in any gear (this probably means tyre life would be ... compromised) and once I used the quickshift properly (after so many normal gear changes, it was really hard to not automatically back off on each change) it was quite the giggle.

Summing up though, it would be a fun additional bike, the long wheelbase makes it super stable, but it wouldn't replace the GSA. Normally, the danger of riding another bike is you realise how great it is and want one. Fortunately in this case, it actually made me love the GSA even more, with the wide bars and Ohlins suspension I've really got it good. After a lot of time and money I've got the bike exactly how I want it. Awesome.

Don't ask me to explain why I keep looking at other bikes then... I think it's just being a biker :msn-wink:

Us Bikers all have similar problems and I rarely take a ride on a bike I don't own, unless I intend to buy it :confused:

New watercooled GS might be worth a ride though :yes:

[Gremlin]

New watercooled GS might be worth a ride though :yes:
Only the GSA would suit, only gets launched next year. Never own a Year 1 BMW I reckon. Plus they've made the fuel tank smaller...

So I'm at least a couple of years away from interested, plus they're a fortune brand new... So maybe 3 years. With a bit of effort, I could be halfway to putting this one round the clock a second time (sitting at 81k now).

[shafty]

Gremlin,

Have you RIDDEN a 'Wing?

Shafty

[misterO]

I've put some miles on an RT and I can't see much room for improvement. I've ridden to the edge of the tyres and nothing hard has ever touched down. A dang nice ride- not the best at anything but better than most at everything. For the life of me, I don't understand how anybody out there could say that the GS is a better road bike. With so few long stretches of motorway in NZ I don't consider cruise control all that advantageous but I understand that opinions vary. Just to throw out an unexpected option: the new VFR is looking pretty sweet (been a long time since I could say that). The tank holds 21.5 litres so range won't be a problem. It is another one of those precious few bikes that does everything really well, and when you link a good pipe to the V4 anything it may lack is forgiven.

http://www.visordown.com/motorcycle-news-new-bikes/2014-honda-vfr800f/23894.html

[Superboss]

I'll chime in here.

I was in the market for a sports tourer and will summarize the ones I was considering it quite simply.

Bike Sport/touring%
----------------------------
FJR. 50/50
ST13. 40/60
C14. 60/40

If you want more of a tourer get the honda, boring but then who cares, it's for touring.
If you want a sportier ride and have more fun with the ability to tour get the kawasaki
If you want the middle ground option and have a more balanced bike get the yamaha.

I went the kawasaki C14 route. The one and only negative is the fuel tank size. But when using economy mode I can easy get 300km a tank while still enjoying spirited riding. It is so much fun to ride, honestly. The performance is a daily delight. Lack of cruise control is not a problem, well for me anyway.

I think though the FJR is the most balanced of those sports tourers, but the main reason I couldn't consider it is that some test riders complained about the lack of ground clearance around corners and for me that was a huge issue. I love the twisties.

My choice is definitely the kawasaki

The BMW's are amazing, and would love to upgrade one day, but don't think the extra cash is justifiable.

Hope I helped in some way




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[10bikekid]

where are the pictures to prove your claims :corn:

[Superboss]

where are the pictures to prove your claims :corn:

Lol, incoming.

289852
289853


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[10bikekid]

Nice, and since your bike is real I'm out for a morning run tomorrow leaving NSH about 830 heading North up 22 returning home about 2 if your free :cool:

Txt, me in the morning if you see this and are keen in case I forget to check back here