Jeans with armour

[Waipukbiker]

After losing bucket loads of sweat last summer with the textile pants which were supposed to be breathable (yes I did wash them with liquid detergent) Ive been looking at some of the Jeans on offer, There a three main types of liner available, Kevlar, Dyneema and Covec. How good the kevlar is as a pants liner I dont know, Dyneema Im more familiar with as Winch ropes are now available made from this, Dyneema has a higher working load limit than steel for the same diameter. Ive done a lot of winching in one of the Jobs Ive had in the past and my first thought was that statement would look good on a Tui billboard but after talking with some people in the industry, Its true so there ya go. Covec which is what Bull-it use is the only one to pass CE EN 13595-1 Level 2.
I pinched the below statement from a write up of that particular standard.

Test method: Several tests are made, including resistance against abrasion and impact, but also burst strength. In the abrasion tests, the clothing is simply held against a rotating grinder and the time that the material will hold out measured. Normal textile fabric is gone in less than half a second. For „Level 1“ zones 1 and 2 (the most endangered on the body) must hold out 4 seconds. For „Level 2“ zones 1 und 2 must hold 7 seconds! This about corresponds to the time the rider glides on the ground after a fall at 110 km/h. How deep the tip of a knife with a certain force can penetrate the material is measured with the penetration resistance. The clothing is stretched to measure the burst strength, until material, zipper or its seams tear apart. A certain pressure monitors the indicated limit.

Hmmmmm, I wonder how long your arse would hold together on our course chip seal, Anyway, they are also available with pockets for extra knee and hip Armour so going to have a look at some in Palmy on Sat.

[Gremlin]

Chip seal is much more abrasive than hot mix... simple as that.

[That looks like fun]

I have a pair of Draggon jeans I wear in the summer. I had a fairly major off where I ended up sliding down the tarseal on my back for about 10 metres. Still had all my skin at the end of the slide and remarkably the jeans look undamaged :2thumbsup
Only gripe I have with them is, when wearing them for touring in excess of three days it starts to feel like you are sitting on a hunk of sandpaper :sick:

[Erelyes]

I got 2nd hand Draggins for $50 and they're reasonably good.

Would get Bull-its if I was buying new.

Armourwise, I'm shortly going to buy some motox style knee armour which straps on.

[Waipukbiker]

Yeah, still thinking about strap on external knee armour but will check out the fit with pocket armour, Ive heard in some cases where the knee armour dousnt always sit correctly over the knee when sitting so will check all that out.

[mikemike104]

I wear a pair of Kevlar lined DriRider jeans that I use at least 5 days a week for at least half an hour a day, they've been through the washing machine once and I've owned them for almost two years with the with the same use since day one. I paid $149 new and I've had a few decent off's while offroad (mud, hard packed dirt, light gravel etc), they're pretty heavy when wet and covered in mud.. . I keep feeling like I should wear those MX velcro on knee pads onroad but haven't got around to buying any yet.

[Waipukbiker]

A couple of other things that came to light while I was researching the different linings was that : With Kevlar and Dyneema, their strength degrades when wet and both will transfer friction heat, both of these materials are called "Aramids".
Covec does not degrade when wet and it will not transmit friction heat.

The thing about the "Grinder test" , I wonder how much force is exerted against the grinding wheel, ie, The heavier the body weight thats sliding down the road, the more force is applied to the material but then you will probably stop sooner. So I wonder what body weight the grinder test is supposed to replicate. As Billy T used to say, Bucketifino.
You will be alright Robyn, you will just skip like a stone over water :laugh:

[JATZ]

Yeah, still thinking about strap on external knee armour .

Best $40 I've ever spent on safety gear. I always wear them on anything more than a quick ride to the shops. They've saved my knees a number of times. There was some lovely bruises from the straps around the back of my legs after the last good off, but it could've been a lot worse.
. I wear thermals under them in the winter and rugby socks in the summer otherwise they can chaffe

[HenryDorsetCase]

I have Draggins (in fact wore them to work this morning) and they are a very non fashionable cut so I can fit my 661 kneepads under them. way more comfy than over the top.

When they are knackered I will look at bull its but they are >5 years old and still going . Bit tatty but still going.

[R650R]

A couple of other things that came to light while I was researching the different linings was that : With Kevlar and Dyneema, their strength degrades when wet and both will transfer friction heat, both of these materials are called "Aramids".
Covec does not degrade when wet and it will not transmit friction heat.

The thing about the "Grinder test" , I wonder how much force is exerted against the grinding wheel, ie, The heavier the body weight thats sliding down the road, the more force is applied to the material but then you will probably stop sooner. So I wonder what body weight the grinder test is supposed to replicate. As Billy T used to say, Bucketifino.
You will be alright Robyn, you will just skip like a stone over water :laugh:

Yeah I'd be much more interested to hear about peoples real world crashes compared to manufacturer tests as like you say up against grinder instead of real world conditions. Have we any resident crashers that have done a high speed off in these as opposed to a traffic light spill where even ordinary jeans can hold up ok. Like leathers you'd want a nice slippery liner inside also.
Remember reading up years ago when playing around with this stuff about the pros and cons. Kevlar is very strong in surface loadings like yacht sail etc but does rip easy once it starts off somewhere. Bit like carbon fibre, very strong in certain directions but once the laminate is compromised its goodbye.

[Night Falcon]

I had a set of Neo pants and jacket once that were destroyed sliding 4-5m down a sealed road (Devils elbow Napier-Wairoa) They basically melted the fabric but the built in CE armour saved my skin - literally! Thought about some Draggins but yeah nah...dunno :scratch: the reason for wearing protective clothing is for the protection more than comfort - don't mind being hot if it saves a skin graft when ya need it - good for peace of mind when riding round town for a mockachino though :cool:

[thepom]

I.ve a pair of teknics and think they are alot better than some of the cheaper makes....quality of style and zips and rivet fastener and if your foot catches the armour flapping around the inside when putting on or taking them off...but beware they dont stretch so if they are a bit tight when you have your wallet and key s iin the your pocket it can be uncomfortable after even a short ride.....

[fridayflash]

there these things on aliexpress..althoughyou have to be an anaemic 18 year old to fit into 'em:devil2:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Motorcycle-racing-Jeans-Pants-Komine-New-arrival-Men/1294219536.html

[Night Falcon]

there these things on aliexpress..althoughyou have to be an anaemic 18 year old to fit into 'em:devil2:

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Motorcycle-racing-Jeans-Pants-Komine-New-arrival-Men/1294219536.html

.....that bag of walnuts down the crotch look never goes out of style dose it :facepalm:

[nzspokes]

I have a pair of Revit mesh pants. They are brilliant. I get very hot very fast. These things are like riding naked. Think they are called Mistrals or something.

Or you could try trail bike pants as some have venting. I wouldnt ride jeans on gravel.

[Waipukbiker]

There is far less abrasive resistance on gravel than on a sealed surface, On seal, the surface is pure chip with sharp edges that are fixed to the road, The top course or running course on gravel is a mix of smooth stone and chip, the chip size is bigger than seal, (Normal for a top course its 20mm, Also the stone on gravel will move along with you to some extent which is why braking distance is a lot further on gravel than seal.

If the liner in a pair of Jeans is tested to hold together for certain time at 110 kmh on seal as claimed then it will be a lot longer on gravel, I think technology has moved along with some materials such as Dyneema being stronger than steel for a given diameter in a winch cable. A pair of lined Jeans with the same Hip and Knee Armour in pockets as textiles to me now has to be right up there for protection.

I was brought up old school but with my trade and in the industry I work in Ive had to accept modern technology, there is some pretty amazing stuff around now.

But as with everything, It boils down to personal choice.

[fridayflash]

.....that bag of walnuts down the crotch look never goes out of style dose it :facepalm:

yes...channeling robert plant eh :headbang:

[clint640]

Yeah, still thinking about strap on external knee armour but will check out the fit with pocket armour, Ive heard in some cases where the knee armour dousnt always sit correctly over the knee when sitting so will check all that out.

My $35 Fox MX knee guards have saved my knees quite a few times & are quite comfortable. Hugely more protective than pocket armour IMHO. MX pants are obviously cut to allow for these & they are what I find best for most summer riding, cooler to ride in & not so much of a PITA if they get wet. The std hip armour in my MX pants was quite thin so Rosie made me some better pads for there. My draggin jeans usually only come out for cruisy rides to the cafe & suchlike.

I think good armour in the right place is way more critical than the finer points of the difference between abrasion resistant textiles.


I have a pair of Draggon jeans I wear in the summer. I had a fairly major off where I ended up sliding down the tarseal on my back for about 10 metres. Still had all my skin at the end of the slide and remarkably the jeans look undamaged :2thumbsup
Only gripe I have with them is, when wearing them for touring in excess of three days it starts to feel like you are sitting on a hunk of sandpaper :sick:

Yep, the kevlar can get a bit scratchy, I find mine not too bad if I wear cycle shorts underneath.

Cheers
Clint

[dino3310]

in summer for trail and not much gravel 'like gravel on the way to the trail' i use cargo pants with knee and shin protection underneath, am hopeing to pick up a set of these at some stage to give more hip protection http://www.vitalmtb.com/product/guide/Body-Armor,54/Alpinestars/Bionic-MX-Freeride-Shorts,6660#product-specs

[gwynfryn]

in summer for trail and not much gravel 'like gravel on the way to the trail' i use cargo pants with knee and shin protection underneath, am hopeing to pick up a set of these at some stage to give more hip protection http://www.vitalmtb.com/product/guide/Body-Armor,54/Alpinestars/Bionic-MX-Freeride-Shorts,6660#product-specs

Very sexy!