Video camera seizure, What are our rights? [Archive]

Onetap

30th October 2013, 12:01

Was involved in a crash over the long weekend, I arrived shortly after the crash so didn't witness it however the police seized my GoPro's.

Was wondering what is the law on that? Do they have the right to take them or can they only request the footage rather than seize it?

Anyone done any reading up on it? sources etc?

EJK

30th October 2013, 12:22

Awwwww shiiiiieeeet!!!!! :eek: Buckle up, this is gonna be good :corn:

strandedinnz

30th October 2013, 12:26

EJK

30th October 2013, 12:30

This is just a rumor but I've heard swallowing Micro SD cards to destroy "evidence" against prosecution.

Onetap

30th October 2013, 12:31

I'd love to know the answer to this as well, here is an NZ based website (http://techliberty.org.nz/can-you-photograph-or-video-the-police-in-new-zealand/) which sort of asks what you are wanting to know.

Great! thanks! very interesting! however I wasn't filming the police, They requested the footage which consisted of me arriving at the crash.

Can they or can they not seize my cameras?

p.dath

30th October 2013, 12:35

Was involved in a crash over the long weekend, I arrived shortly after the crash so didn't witness it however the police seized my GoPro's....

I am intrigued how you can both be involved in a crash, but did not arrive till shortly after the crash. Perhaps you did a superman?

I would think the Police could seize anything that could be evidence, but I don''t know this for a fact - it just seems reasonable with regard to evidence collection.

p.dath

30th October 2013, 12:36

They requested the footage which consisted of me arriving at the crash....

That's even more compelling, if they asked for the video and you supplied it.

Onetap

30th October 2013, 12:38

I am intrigued how you can both be involved in a crash, but did not arrive till shortly after the crash. Perhaps you did a superman?

I would think the Police could seize anything that could be evidence, but I don''t know this for a fact - it just seems reasonable with regard to evidence collection.

"Involved" as in I was the first on the scene.

ellipsis

30th October 2013, 12:48

Onetap

30th October 2013, 12:53

...Im sure they took your details and you will get it back...all information the police can get or derive from any source goes a way to helping them sort out what happened...all cameras were asked for at a fatal accident at a race track following the incident from anyone who was there at the time...you would like the cops to figure out what happened without surmising the facts, I'm sure...relax...

That's all fair and well, but does not answer my question. I don't have an issue with them taking it besides the face i have to drive out to Pukekohe to collect them, However im intrigued to know whether they can legally take them or not, thats all.

R650R

30th October 2013, 12:56

I'm assuming this might probably be the serious twilight rd crash... or similar.
In such case they treat it akin to a murder/manslaughter level investigation and seize whatever they deem relevant.
In the case of Heavy trucks I know they will look at EVERYTHING that driver has done in his life in the preceding two weeks including at home, imagine bikes no different.
They will also be looking at your facebook, emails and KB postings too now they have your name and address etc... ohhh and youtube account...
Firstly they will just be looking for info on how the other people were riding before they crashed if you captured that, then if you were part of group or 'street racing' etc...
BTW if you have a GPS enabled cellphone turned on that is just as incriminating as video footage...

Onetap

30th October 2013, 13:11

Ender EnZed

30th October 2013, 13:25

What happens if the footage that they seize shows nothing of relevance to the investigation but does show the camera bike travelling at significantly illegal speed?

ellipsis

30th October 2013, 13:29

...I must have forgotten to add...the law can do whatever it wants...or have you not noticed...rights we all have, but whether they are observed is a different matter...the law probably defends it's rights also in this case...not hassling your question...

SMOKEU

30th October 2013, 13:36

They can't do fuck all without a search warrant, unless there's more to the story than you're telling us. You shouldn't have handed them the camera in the first place. Lesson learnt I hope.

cynna

30th October 2013, 13:43

i hvew been asked for my sd card on my camera before and they did ask if there was anything on there I did not want them to see - not sure what would happen if I said there was

Bald Eagle

30th October 2013, 13:54

They can't do fuck all without a search warrant, unless there's more to the story than you're telling us. You shouldn't have handed them the camera in the first place. Lesson learnt I hope.

If they ask politely and you give it to them no problem. If you refuse theyd either have to seize it incidental to your arrest for something , or get a search warrant. They have no statutory authority otherwise.

Sent from my LG-P768 using Tapatalk

Onetap

30th October 2013, 13:59

If they ask politely and you give it to them no problem. If you refuse theyd either have to seize it incidental to your arrest for something , or get a search warrant. They have no statutory authority otherwise.

Sent from my LG-P768 using Tapatalk

Yeah they did ask politely, weren't nasty at all and of course I gave it right over, Was just wondering.

Onetap

30th October 2013, 14:01

HenryDorsetCase

30th October 2013, 14:19

Great! thanks! very interesting! however I wasn't filming the police, They requested the footage which consisted of me arriving at the crash.

Can they or can they not seize my cameras?

1. Get a lawyer.

2. Get a lawyer.

3. Get a lawyer.

4. When the nice pleecemin asked you for your camera did you ask him why he wanted it? If it was seized did you ask pursuant to what statutory authority it had been seized? Did you get a receipt at least? Were there other punters about who might provide evidence?

5. Get a goddamn lawyer.

HenryDorsetCase

30th October 2013, 14:22

If they ask politely and you give it to them no problem. If you refuse theyd either have to seize it incidental to your arrest for something , or get a search warrant. They have no statutory authority otherwise.

I was wondering the same thing. Just because a nice pleecemin asks you for something you dont necessarily have to give it to them. A blowjob, f'rinstance. We all like them (well I know I do) but not so much if I am the giver, and the receiver is a pleecemin. ....

ellipsis

30th October 2013, 14:29

....<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/vEB0l6OqLR4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>............

Onetap

30th October 2013, 14:38

1. Get a lawyer.

2. Get a lawyer.

3. Get a lawyer.

4. When the nice pleecemin asked you for your camera did you ask him why he wanted it? If it was seized did you ask pursuant to what statutory authority it had been seized? Did you get a receipt at least? Were there other punters about who might provide evidence?

5. Get a goddamn lawyer.

ha ha!

He told me why, He said it would help determine how the crash happened regardless of me saying I didn't actually see the crash. said I would get them back by friday and gave me his card with number etc.

HenryDorsetCase

30th October 2013, 14:55

this guy is the best lawyer I have ever seen or heard of:

http://www.bettercallsaul.com/

Onetap

30th October 2013, 15:02

this guy is the best lawyer I have ever seen or heard of:

http://www.bettercallsaul.com/

This is actually amazing. This guy is Baws!

G4L4XY

30th October 2013, 15:14

I hope you deleted your ametuer movies beforehand!

Bikemad

30th October 2013, 15:16

A blowjob, f'rinstance. We all like them (well I know I do) but not so much if I am the giver, and the receiver is a pleecemin. ....
you might want to rephrase that henry

Onetap

30th October 2013, 15:17

I hope you deleted your ametuer movies beforehand!

That's no way to talk about your mother.

The Reibz

30th October 2013, 15:24

Cop just got 2 free gopros

Onetap

30th October 2013, 15:30

Cop just got 2 free gopros

Na man, 4. MicroSD cards.

The Reibz

30th October 2013, 15:45

Na man, 4. MicroSD cards.

Were you filming the next triple A blockbuster or someshit? Seriously cunt, 4 cameras strapped to your bike? Are you the KB version of ghost rider?
Cop has already flicked off your cameras at dollar dealers and used it to buy smokes.

Onetap

30th October 2013, 16:07

Were you filming the next triple A blockbuster or someshit? Seriously cunt, 4 cameras strapped to your bike? Are you the KB version of ghost rider?
Cop has already flicked off your cameras at dollar dealers and used it to buy smokes.

Yeah G. For sure.

G4L4XY

30th October 2013, 16:41

Cop has already flicked off your cameras at dollar dealers and used it to buy smokes.

Pies*

Doughnuts**

scumdog

30th October 2013, 17:19

1. Get a lawyer.

2. Get a lawyer.

3. Get a lawyer.

4. When the nice pleecemin asked you for your camera did you ask him why he wanted it? If it was seized did you ask pursuant to what statutory authority it had been seized? Did you get a receipt at least? Were there other punters about who might provide evidence?

5. Get a goddamn lawyer.

Uh, is he in some sort of trouble that I can't think of???:scratch:

Robbo

30th October 2013, 17:36

Perhaps he's got some dodgy pics of Bevan Chuang on the SD card that loose Len Brown wants back..:msn-wink:

HenryDorsetCase

30th October 2013, 17:53

Uh, is he in some sort of trouble that I can't think of???:scratch:

apart from the fact that the filth nicked his cameras you mean?

scumdog

30th October 2013, 17:55

apart from the fact that the filth nicked his cameras you mean?

'nicked'?

'borrowed' was what I thought....:msn-wink:

HenryDorsetCase

30th October 2013, 18:13

'nicked'?

'borrowed' was what I thought....:msn-wink:

he hasn't got it back yet has he? no colour of right that I can see.

Better Call Saul!

Mo NZ

31st October 2013, 05:56

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the Search and Surveillance Act 2012.

If the cop believes there may be evidence relating to the crash I think he may take and examine the footage,
and use the images as evidence should charges be laid.

Onetap

31st October 2013, 09:16

he hasn't got it back yet has he? no colour of right that I can see.

Better Call Saul!

Called Saul, Woke him up. should totally put the recording up.

Onetap

31st October 2013, 09:17

'nicked'?

'borrowed' was what I thought....:msn-wink:

Getting them back today at 12, thank god for that!

Banditbandit

31st October 2013, 09:19

However im intrigued to know whether they can legally take them or not, thats all.

Yeah ... they can ...

(and after reading the rest) .. if you don't hand it over they can get a search warrant and seize it - and they can charge you with withholding evidence .. and maybe obstructing police .. however, it would be a very nasty cop who tried all that ...

Even the news media is not exempt - even if they like to think they are ...

Onetap

31st October 2013, 09:44

Yeah ... they can ...

(and after reading the rest) .. if you don't hand it over they can get a search warrant and seize it - and they can charge you with withholding evidence .. and maybe obstructing police .. however, it would be a very nasty cop who tried all that ...

Even the news media is not exempt - even if they like to think they are ...

Cheers mate,

Figured it would be like that, if they want something bad enough they can get it regardless.

Onetap

31st October 2013, 11:54

Got my Cards back, safe and sound. Hope it helps with their investigation

Tazz

31st October 2013, 12:09

Man if I'm ever looking for an instant lynch mob I know where to come :yes:

Interesting topic though. I'm sure a search warrant would take a bit of time so if you were ever worried about handing any gear or cards over you could probably safely go home, chop out the relevant footage and throw it to them as soon as you can to help out.
Got to remember though if you've come across or film a fatal crash you could mainly be helping out the families get a bit of closure on what happened, not just the to Police see who they want to charge or what not.

But hey if you're dumb enough to film yourself doing something really stupid and/or illegal it's probably only a matter of time until it falls into the wrong hands anyway XD

Onetap

31st October 2013, 12:22

rustyrobot

31st October 2013, 12:26

I'm sure a search warrant would take a bit of time so if you were ever worried about handing any gear or cards over you could probably safely go home, chop out the relevant footage and throw it to them as soon as you can to help out.

I'm pretty sure that if you did that they would be able to tell and you'd be up for a tampering charge. Also - most people cannot delete as well as the police techs can retrieve. Don't be fooled into thinking that it's the beat plod who has his sticky fingers in your technology.

I agree with what you say about filming though - if you record footage of yourself or friends riding illegally, don't be surprised if it comes back to bite you on the arse. Which is a pity because I do like the idea of recording rides, and also dodgy drivers.

Onetap

31st October 2013, 12:31

I'm pretty sure that if you did that they would be able to tell and you'd be up for a tampering charge. Also - most people cannot delete as well as the police techs can retrieve. Don't be fooled into thinking that it's the beat plod who has his sticky fingers in your technology.

I agree with what you say about filming though - if you record footage of yourself or friends riding illegally, don't be surprised if it comes back to bite you on the arse. Which is a pity because I do like the idea of recording rides, and also dodgy drivers.

I know for a fact what sort of technology they have for retrieving files, no point running home and copying off what is "bad"

Only way to seriously beat them is to re-format, that being said I hope you enjoy a tampering charge.

Just gotta be smart!

EJK

31st October 2013, 12:33

I know for a fact what sort of technology they have for retrieving files, no point running home and copying off what is "bad"

Only way to seriously beat them is to re-format, that being said I hope you enjoy a tampering charge.

Just gotta be smart!

Again, like I said, there isn't much stomach acid can't melt! Micro SD cards are small enough to swallow.

Tazz

31st October 2013, 12:33

I'm pretty sure that if you did that they would be able to tell and you'd be up for a tampering charge. Also - most people cannot delete as well as the police techs can retrieve. Don't be fooled into thinking that it's the beat plod who has his sticky fingers in your technology.

I agree with what you say about filming though - if you record footage of yourself or friends riding illegally, don't be surprised if it comes back to bite you on the arse. Which is a pity because I do like the idea of having recording rides, and also dodgy drivers.

So long as you show the relevant footage in its entirety there shouldn't be a problem, but meh, depends on the situation I guess.

You can get cameras that are always recording but overwrite, so say something happens and you want to keep the footage you press a button and it will save the last 5mins of footage, or whatever time frame you set it to. Pretty sure it is quite a common feature. Think how many hours a day trucks are on the road and the size that footage would be to have it in a resolution you can actually read number plates from.

HenryDorsetCase

31st October 2013, 12:47

I know for a fact what sort of technology they have for retrieving files, no point running home and copying off what is "bad"

Only way to seriously beat them is to re-format, that being said I hope you enjoy a tampering charge.

Just gotta be smart!

like, frinstance, not taking video of yourself or others doing illegal stuffs? that might be a start?

Onetap

31st October 2013, 13:06

like, frinstance, not taking video of yourself or others doing illegal stuffs? that might be a start?

10 points!

Onetap

31st October 2013, 13:07

Again, like I said, there isn't much stomach acid can't melt! Micro SD cards are small enough to swallow.

Not very tasty though ;)

Onetap

31st October 2013, 13:09

So long as you show the relevant footage in its entirety there shouldn't be a problem, but meh, depends on the situation I guess.

You can get cameras that are always recording but overwrite, so say something happens and you want to keep the footage you press a button and it will save the last 5mins of footage, or whatever time frame you set it to. Pretty sure it is quite a common feature. Think how many hours a day trucks are on the road and the size that footage would be to have it in a resolution you can actually read number plates from.

That would be legit!

iYRe

31st October 2013, 13:19

I know for a fact what sort of technology they have for retrieving files, no point running home and copying off what is "bad"

Only way to seriously beat them is to re-format, that being said I hope you enjoy a tampering charge.

Just gotta be smart!

That same (or similar) technology can also restore data from formatted and damaged cards/drives. The only way they _cant_ get the data - because enough money can fix almost anything - is to prevent them from getting the cards..

EJK

31st October 2013, 13:20

like, frinstance, not taking video of yourself or others doing illegal stuffs? that might be a start?

But what if it's a home made pron with 4 GoPros?

Onetap

31st October 2013, 13:28

But what if it's a home made pron with 4 GoPros?

If by pron you mean porn then yes, Deliciously wide angle too

Tazz

31st October 2013, 13:45

But what if it's a home made pron with 4 GoPros?

People might be thinking a bit highly of themselves if they reckon others would enjoy watching that XD

Akzle

31st October 2013, 14:04

'nicked'?

'borrowed' was what I thought....:msn-wink:
seizure= theft. (legally) ("to forcibly take possession of")

i'd say that's closer to nicked.

I'm pretty sure that if you did that they would be able to tell and you'd be up for a tampering charge. Also - most people cannot delete as well as the police techs can retrieve. Don't be fooled into thinking that it's the beat plod who has his sticky fingers in your technology.
they could possibly tell that there's large blocks that have been deleted, zerod or randomd, but couldn't do fuckall about it.

That same (or similar) technology can also restore data from formatted and damaged cards/drives. The only way they _cant_ get the data - because enough money can fix almost anything - is to prevent them from getting the cards..
no. no it can't. trust me, i've fucked up disks (intentionally and otherwise) that are foreniscally impossible to retrieve any shit from. as above, if you write zeros or urandom to the blocks the data is on... it's gone.

dd is your friend.

as for the topic at hand. they only have the authority you give them. (or they beat out of you). practice saying "i do not consent" and "with protest and under duress", these should basically be all you say to the bob.

Hoon

31st October 2013, 14:14

Again, like I said, there isn't much stomach acid can't melt! Micro SD cards are small enough to swallow.

Bad advice. Stomach acid can't dissolve an obstructing the course of justice (http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/pilot-ate-memory-card-stand-trial-4939117) charge. And you'll have to stay in the police cells until it "turns up".

scumdog

31st October 2013, 15:30

seizure= theft. (legally) ("to forcibly take possession of")

i'd say that's closer to nicked.

[/COLOR]

Stop trolling (poorly) - where was the 'forcibly' bit?:rolleyes:

scumdog

31st October 2013, 15:32

Getting them back today at 12, thank god for that!

Awww..now you've gone and ruined potential for some rabid ranting by the KB nincompoop team...

On second thoughts, they'll do that anyway<_<

Akzle

31st October 2013, 19:01

Stop trolling (poorly) - where was the 'forcibly' bit?:rolleyes:

if it was legally seized, then legally, it was forcibly taken. by definition. mumpty.

funnily when you ask pigs to seal a radar as evidence, they look at you funny and carry on with their bullshit.

swbarnett

31st October 2013, 20:03

I know for a fact what sort of technology they have for retrieving files, no point running home and copying off what is "bad"

Only way to seriously beat them is to re-format,
Easier way is to copy the bits the cops want to see onto a band new card and give them that.

that being said I hope you enjoy a tampering charge.
Surely it's not tampering if they get all the footage they're asking for?

scumdog

31st October 2013, 20:05

if it was legally seized, then legally, it was forcibly taken. by definition. mumpty.

funnily when you ask pigs to seal a radar as evidence, they look at you funny and carry on with their bullshit.

Forcibly. 'With force' or something like that. Apparently...

Numpty...:bleh:

And seal a radar???? Is that like ottering oaths...

ellipsis

31st October 2013, 22:01

....<iframe width="420" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/Gq1kqzqhPzY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>..........

Muppet

1st November 2013, 14:41

if it was legally seized, then legally, it was forcibly taken. by definition. mumpty.

funnily when you ask pigs to seal a radar as evidence, they look at you funny and carry on with their bullshit.

I'm curious..:corn:..what do you do for a crust exactly..:corn:...?

SMOKEU

1st November 2013, 14:56

I'm pretty sure that if you did that they would be able to tell and you'd be up for a tampering charge. Also - most people cannot delete as well as the police techs can retrieve. Don't be fooled into thinking that it's the beat plod who has his sticky fingers in your technology.

I know for a fact what sort of technology they have for retrieving files, no point running home and copying off what is "bad"

Only way to seriously beat them is to re-format, that being said I hope you enjoy a tampering charge.

Just gotta be smart!

Formatting the drive won't do fuck all, except for slowing them down by a few minutes while they recover the data.

I'm pretty sure that dd if=/dev/urandom of=/media/* or shred /media/* -f -v -z --iterations=10 will work*

Replace the * with the mount point and you're done, otherwise just overwrite the data by recording over the old footage. Better yet, physically destroy the (micro)SD card. They're not that expensive to replace usually. How could you get charged with tampering data by deleting data on your own device?

imdying

1st November 2013, 15:04

Need the SD card equivalent of a boot n nuke disc :D

Akzle

1st November 2013, 20:06

scumpuppy made a pun funny :)
and i thought harley riders were fucking homos 24/7

I'm curious..:corn:..what do you do for a crust exactly..:corn:...?
a crust? i bake my bread.. it's a function of breadmaking that there is crust.

I'm pretty sure that dd if=/dev/urandom of=/media/* will work* pretty much.

Need the SD card equivalent of a boot n nuke disc :D
:

I'm pretty sure that dd if=/dev/urandom of=/media/* will work*

Akzle

1st November 2013, 20:09

Muppet

1st November 2013, 20:51

i'll expand on that for those interested.
formatting a drive re-writes the MBR and frees up the FS space for writing over, without actually deleting anything, just telling the drive "you may write between 513 and 20 billlion.." while your shit is actually still between 513 and 20 billion.

you can buy windows "undelete" programs for this. or, if you're not a fucking moron. get linux and do it for free.

Um, we're not interested, that's why no one asked.......:tugger:

Akzle

1st November 2013, 21:32

Um, we're not interested, that's why no one asked.......:tugger:

you're...a fucking moron.

. .

Berries

1st November 2013, 21:59

formatting a drive re-writes the MBR and frees up the FS space for writing over, without actually deleting anything, just telling the drive "you may write between 513 and 20 billlion.." while your shit is actually still between 513 and 20 billion.
Has the nerd thread been merged with this one?

Akzle

2nd November 2013, 05:08

Has the nerd thread been merged with this one?

it came up in conversation. So did morons, and now that youre both here...

unstuck

2nd November 2013, 05:16

We need a thread where someones getting beaten down with batons, or pepper sprayed then tazered, or visa virsa. This shits lame.:shifty:

Kickaha

2nd November 2013, 05:44

We need a thread where someones getting beaten down with batons, or pepper sprayed then tazered, or visa virsa. This shits lame.:shifty:

And bitten by dogs

swbarnett

2nd November 2013, 05:55

i'll expand on that for those interested.
formatting a drive re-writes the MBR and frees up the FS space for writing over, without actually deleting anything, just telling the drive "you may write between 513 and 20 billlion.." while your shit is actually still between 513 and 20 billion.

you can buy windows "undelete" programs for this. or, if you're not a fucking moron. get linux and do it for free.

You can also get programs that will do a proper job of formatting every bit of the drive. Or, as I said before, forget all the stress of reformatting and copy the bits you want to release on to a new one. Much simpler.

Dave-

2nd November 2013, 14:37

If you're dumb enough to record yourself doing something illegal.....

Tazz

2nd November 2013, 14:46

You can also get programs that will do a proper job of formatting every bit of the drive. Or, as I said before, forget all the stress of reformatting and copy the bits you want to release on to a new one. Much simpler.

Or, here's a little trick I prepared earlier:

Crtl + Alt + cover it in gas and set it on fire.

Zedder

2nd November 2013, 15:31

Or, here's a little trick I prepared earlier:

Crtl + Alt + cover it in gas and set it on fire.

I'd go with the not recording yourself doing something illegal option.

Tazz

2nd November 2013, 16:41

I'd go with the not recording yourself doing something illegal option.

Aww come on, live a little, could invite a few friends around an make a BBQ of it. If you have a healthy go pro addiction grafted to your bike you might even have enough fuel there to spitroast one of these suicidal birds that keep attacking peoples helmets.

Zedder

2nd November 2013, 16:52

Aww come on, live a little, could invite a few friends around an make a BBQ of it. If you have a healthy go pro addiction grafted to your bike you might even have enough fuel there to spitroast one of these suicidal birds that keep attacking peoples helmets.

Lol, do they come with special bbq sauce?

c4.

2nd November 2013, 17:01

simpletons, keep the appropriate number of BLANK or "safe" cards in your pocket, fumble handover.
Or is that too easy????:sleep:

AllanB

2nd November 2013, 17:07

Another good reason not to have those darn things. Who watches the footage post ride - I'd rather be riding that watching .......

Only value is if someone knocks you off ....... and denies it.

Zedder

2nd November 2013, 17:19

simpletons, keep the appropriate number of BLANK or "safe" cards in your pocket, fumble handover.
Or is that too easy????:sleep:

Heh, the OP had four cameras so that would have been interesting to see.

c4.

2nd November 2013, 17:23

how hard?
walk away, tell HP just gonna get all the cards out.
Yep, these are them.
job done

Zedder

2nd November 2013, 18:08

how hard?
walk away, tell HP just gonna get all the cards out.
Yep, these are them.
job done

I came here for an argument not a time and motion study...

scumdog

2nd November 2013, 18:09

And bitten by dogs

And shot now and then...

craigdek

3rd November 2013, 08:12

Wish I had footage of my high side yesterday. Then again ribs are still a bit too sore for too much laughing.

Sent from my ZTE R22 using Tapatalk

Kickaha

3rd November 2013, 10:54

And shot now and then...

Not with rubber bullets either

FJRider

3rd November 2013, 16:08

And shot now and then...

With Police accuracy in the past being well documented/commented on ... the safest place to be is front of the cop ...

apparently ... :innocent:

FJRider

3rd November 2013, 16:10

We need a thread where someones getting beaten down with batons, or pepper sprayed then tazered, or visa virsa. This shits lame.:shifty:

YOU first ... :killingme

Old Steve

4th November 2013, 22:09

i hvew been asked for my sd card on my camera before and they did ask if there was anything on there I did not want them to see - not sure what would happen if I said there was

I love to say, "Yeah, please don't look at the child pornography."

Bet you'd see the wheels within wheels turning behind their eyes as they figured that one out. Does he really have child pornography on there? Having asked if there is anything he doesn't want me to look at, can I look at it anyway? Is there anything on there that I don't already have in my collection at hole?

Onetap

13th November 2013, 10:09

That same (or similar) technology can also restore data from formatted and damaged cards/drives. The only way they _cant_ get the data - because enough money can fix almost anything - is to prevent them from getting the cards..

Not if you re-format the Card, write over the data then re-format it again for good measure ;)

Onetap

13th November 2013, 10:13

i'll expand on that for those interested.
formatting a drive re-writes the MBR and frees up the FS space for writing over, without actually deleting anything, just telling the drive "you may write between 513 and 20 billlion.." while your shit is actually still between 513 and 20 billion.

you can buy windows "undelete" programs for this. or, if you're not a fucking moron. get linux and do it for free.

Yeah mate, for sure! I do this on a daily basis for work, There are plenty of ways to Eliminate data entirely if need be.

iYRe

13th November 2013, 10:38

Not if you re-format the Card, write over the data then re-format it again for good measure ;)

That will defeat the average techie. But no, its not enough to protect all your super secret stuff.

Mo NZ

13th November 2013, 15:54

Ya-all going to do all this with the cop standing in front of you having made the request ( demand ) " search and surveillance etc.' .
See o/p question
yeah Nah Bro .. I don't buy that . In ya dreams.

varminter

13th November 2013, 20:03

Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not out to get you.:rolleyes:

Dave-

13th November 2013, 21:29

That will defeat the average techie. But no, its not enough to protect all your super secret stuff.

What principle does this work on? Do you have a link to more info?

swbarnett

14th November 2013, 04:40

What principle does this work on?
When we decommission a storage system the disks have to be scrubbed to protect commercially sensitive data. Rule of thumb for military grade scrubbing of data is at least a seven pass write with random data or zeros.

Akzle

14th November 2013, 05:32

What principle does this work on? Do you have a link to more info?
read my earlier post.

When we decommission a storage system the disks have to be scrubbed to protect commercially sensitive data. Rule of thumb for military grade scrubbing of data is at least a seven pass write with random data or zeros.

yeah, thats not so much a thing anymore. Urandom data after 1 pass will make anything unrecognisable. Basically, even destroying the file headers hex makes shit tricky.
7 pass 0s stems from the age of magnetic drives and tapes, the ghost in the machine, where even if data was written over (0 or not) the residual underneath could still be plucked for a time. Them were the days when data had a tendency to corrupt a lot more than now. A horseshoe magnet could have been more effective.

Dave-

14th November 2013, 06:48

read my earlier post.

yeah, thats not so much a thing anymore. Urandom data after 1 pass will make anything unrecognisable. Basically, even destroying the file headers hex makes shit tricky.
7 pass 0s stems from the age of magnetic drives and tapes, the ghost in the machine, where even if data was written over (0 or not) the residual underneath could still be plucked for a time. Them were the days when data had a tendency to corrupt a lot more than now. A horseshoe magnet could have been more effective.

No I understand the code side of it well enough (right down to block allocation on a disk - I had an exam on this last week - I nailed the exam btw)

I wondered if there was a physical phenomena where the preceding bit change can be statistically decided.

Take any memory, is there some physical property that is based on the number of read/writes? does the semiconducting material in the transistor 'degrade'? If so you might be able to recover some data, but given the uncontrollable parameters (manufacturing, heat, life, noise) I don't know how you could stand up in front of a judge and say for certain that this was the data originally in the memory.

Seems to me if you're clever enough to stay a step ahead of the cops, giving you the opportunity to do something like this, you're generally not the sort of person who records themselves doing illegal shit....

swbarnett

14th November 2013, 07:46

7 pass 0s stems from the age of magnetic drives and tapes,
Even now most drives are still magnetic spinning disk. SDs are only now becoming popular but even then it's only for the highest performance requirements (they're still too expensive for most applications). Small flash drives being the exception of course.

A horseshoe magnet could have been more effective.
I once wiped a floppy disk by pinning it to the in/out board with a magenet.

Swoop

14th November 2013, 09:27

Not very tasty though ;)
This is why you should always carry a piece of bacon to wrap around it.
Everything tastes better with bacon!

Banditbandit

14th November 2013, 12:34

imdying

14th November 2013, 15:13

I wondered if there was a physical phenomena where the preceding bit change can be statistically decided.Yes, there is... some molecular level crap that I do not understand or remember. But, I can tell you that is why things like bootandnuke will change each bit 7 times to break that.

Of course, the tech required for that sort of analysis is well beyond the $$$$ the NZ Police would ever spend.

It doesn't apply to SSDs either, they have no magnetic bits on platters. I'm not sure if they have a similar effect that can be utilised by forensics though.