Casey Stoner book

[Shaun Harris]

Thanks to Pritch, I read it yesterday. I was really impressed with his lack of slagging others in it, a very healthy way to write your own book. 95% of it I was aware off due to living in Adelaide a couple of years ago and knowing people there that knew the family personally. I have always said he is an incredable talent which I still say, and as pritch said to me, his life style as a child ie, him mum dad and sister then home schooling and travelling europe as a kid would not have been a great way to teach you life/people skills, so I guess that does explain the way he comes accross a bit.

The thing that stood out to me the most was the conviction of his family and the way there methods grew him into a total believer in himself, some thing that is required to win races at the top of the game which he sure did.

To use him as a example of why we should NOT be just focusing on bikes with trick suspension parts and hot rod motors in the early years of starting, 1st you have too learn how to ride a bike 250 Production, NO MUCKING with suspension, just learn how to ride and deal with problems that may effect you.

Jason Mcewan is a prime example of this style, he could ride anything fast even with square wheels, and this is a very special skill to have as Casey has proven.

The main thing I have retained about his history, is the part about the Junior racing association NOT giving him clearance to race when he was at the legal age too do so, this is bloody typical of the shit that Motorcycling australia get up too, look at the demise of there OFFICUAL championship years later on, it is falling apart big time with bullshit management, I wonder how many more Aussies have lost out due to there miss management.







The Moral of the story to me is, go get any god dam motorbike, make it legally safe, and go and have
a go at being CS or MM or who ever, just give it a go and see where it leads you.






FATHERS PAY ATTENTION ( Edited) and team owner bike builders.

How you act and behave your self around the race scenes has a Major reflection back on your sons future re sponsors and attitude required to make it, there are some out here in NZ that really need to calm down before the damage is to great to repair.

[wharfy]

FATHERS PAY ATTENTION

How you act and behave your self around the race scenes has a Major reflection back on your sons future re sponsors and attitude required to make it, there are some out here in NZ that really need to calm down before the damage is to great to repair.

Indeed - this should apply to EVERYONE involved in the sport - Set a good example !!

[steveyb]

C'mon now Shaun, you got someone else to write that for you didn't you.

A really considered, clear and positive post. Who woulda thunk it ay?

Gotta totally agree about the closed family environment not teaching good social skills and the father behaviour around the circuits.

Totally agree also about the learning to ride anything anyhow, but there does come a time when a rider needs to be able to explain to his crew what the bike is doing, not just go hell for leather all the time.

I think young riders should be on as many bikes in a day as they can possibly be on. I recall being told about Colin Edwards III turning up at race meetings when he was young with 3 or 4 different bikes to race. Did it do him any harm?

Cheers.

[Shaun Harris]

C'mon now Shaun, you got someone else to write that for you didn't you.

A really considered, clear and positive post. Who woulda thunk it ay?

Gotta totally agree about the closed family environment not teaching good social skills and the father behaviour around the circuits.

Totally agree also about the learning to ride anything anyhow, but there does come a time when a rider needs to be able to explain to his crew what the bike is doing, not just go hell for leather all the time.

I think young riders should be on as many bikes in a day as they can possibly be on. I recall being told about Colin Edwards III turning up at race meetings when he was young with 3 or 4 different bikes to race. Did it do him any harm?

Cheers.






steve, the only thing a rider really needs to know, is how to ride a motor bike, after that, they need to able to talk using there body language describing what the bike is doing like you see in most pit shots of the big boys. They are not telling there team what to do, they are telling them with a little bit of language and mainly body language.

I learned this big time living in Japan racing in there top class, when no one in the team spoke english and my japanese was still crap at that stage

to many young riders think they need to know how to set up suspension, but it the communication process that they really need to learn.

setting extrenall suspension is a piece of piss, giving good feed back to the crew is the harder of the 2 and must be learned and self documented for the future

[steveyb]

Yep, that is what I was getting at.

There are a couple of schools of thought around it though.

One is that the rider should know what has been done with the bike, the other is that the rider need not know, only communicate what he/she thinks/feels is going on (however they can do that), and leave changes up to the team.

Some people believe that the rider should be more and more comfortable, some think that the rider should be on the edge.

At the end of the day, as you imply, it comes down to each rider and the whole team learning about each other and what working style they each have, just like any other workplace.
I fully believe that is why some riders don't perform well, because they and the team simply can't work each other out, but when they change teams they improve.

[Shaun Harris]

True that. The rider should always be told what has been done and why.

Every rider I have ever helped with bike set up comes down to the use of body language, I stress to them to NOT try and explain to me technically what is going on ( Apart of this nature comes from reading to much shit on web sites and quoting it back thinking they really do understand)

The rider needs to stretch the cables as far as they can from the first lap of practice to last lap of there races, they need to draw maps of the track and in each corner make notes re reference points for breaks on and OFF!!!!! Breaks off reference point is a rearity for 95% of the riders. A fraction of a second on a 10 turn course soon adds up in your favour after 15 laps.

I would always criticise myself as the rider first, ie, what I could be doing better as the rider in the turns, then the bike last, some times a bike with square wheels just needs riding. I would then give myself a time fraction per turn for the rider errors, and the same for the bike, then come up with what I thought would be my ideal lap, Steve Weyden my ex helper was always blown away by this, as time after time after time, I achieved my ideal after the racing had finished.

The rider should sit down after every session and write them self a little story, ( Before they even talk to the helpers, as helpers tend to put words in there mind that change the real facts, and busy suspension technicians can be a major problem with this, as they are technicall people and often the problem is not technical-nothing pearsonall just facts again) this may take about 15 minutes of quiet time on there own whilst the team is doing basic maintanence, they should write just as they would tell the details to there mates etc, ie simple plain language with no tech input, just hard cold facts of rider and bike behavour, I used to leave tracks with pages and pages of notes, it turned out that when I had issue's I could not find the awnser too, the awnser was already recorded in notes from a different time and track, DATA is important in tis game if you want to be fast. I found this technique the best way, even when I was managing a world grand prix 250 team years ago. You do not lie or miss lead your self when writing to your self normally, so after the helpers have read the story you can then have a verbal de brief and confirm what the rider has written and said adds up, often you find a missing link in the writing or the wording, and this is often the key to going forward.

The key to learning is trial and era and lots of track time, Robert used to hate me i am sure with all the changes I had him doing for me when in my prime here, but together we learned a lot in the early years especially with developing the first Ohlins shocks ever built for the GSXR range when it first came out in New zealand. Ohlins released there first shocks world wide with 1 extra rebound shim in it from seat of the pants riding and feed back and good work from the technician Robert only at the time, we would spend hours together after work at his shop in Hawera talking it all through ( Thanks Robert)

I would like to be able to set up a class room scenario to give this type of advise to racers, where i had access to white boards etc to fully explain in detail some of the tricks I have learned over the years as a rider, test rider, and team manager.

I guess I will see soon if I can get inside a riders head properly to there advantage, as I will be giving some advice to a very fast top rider in the very near future after a discussion we had via type communication yesterday about what I thought about his riding style and technique and area;s that he over commits too.

PS Steve, I really did type all this myself haha and fuck the spell check shit

[codgyoleracer]

Yep,, writing your thoughts down on a notebook pretty much straight after coming in, In your own from of "engrish" is important also from a learning capcity. Seems that transferring info from mental thoughts to written thoughts make you analyze and then use better the information as well.

The stopwatch is also a very important factor on cause and effect, when making setup changes - as often what " feels" smooth and fast unfortunaltely sometimes is simply not the case (can be abitter pill to swallow that one !).

The other thing I see riders often doing is "chasing their tail" on set up issues - and not realising that its a reality sometimes to take a step backwards in the handling of the bike in certain sectors of a track to gain an overall lap time....... Again thats another tough one sometimes to accept and try keep in mind that its the bigger picture thats more important.

Another interesting point - is the facination with tyre wear, - I have ridden some sweet handling bikes that simply wreck tyres, - its really easy to fix (put another tyre on......). I understand of course that tyre wear is still a strong pointer for bike set up, but i am just saying its not the holy grail that some might suggest it is.

2c worth

[roogazza]

Yep,, writing your thoughts down on a notebook pretty much straight after coming in, In your own from of "engrish" is important also from a learning capcity. Seems that transferring info from mental thoughts to written thoughts make you analyze and then use better the information as well.

The stopwatch is also a very important factor on cause and effect, when making setup changes - as often what " feels" smooth and fast unfortunaltely sometimes is simply not the case (can be abitter pill to swallow that one !).

The other thing I see riders often doing is "chasing their tail" on set up issues - and not realising that its a reality sometimes to take a step backwards in the handling of the bike in certain sectors of a track to gain an overall lap time....... Again thats another tough one sometimes to accept and try keep in mind that its the bigger picture thats more important.

Another interesting point - is the facination with tyre wear, - I have ridden some sweet handling bikes that simply wreck tyres, - its really easy to fix (put another tyre on......). I understand of course that tyre wear is still a strong pointer for bike set up, but i am just saying its not the holy grail that some might suggest it is.

2c worth
yes agree,
You mean, "give me ground clearance,HP and I'll do the rest" doesn't work any more ?
Life used to be so simple. <_< lol.

ps up your way again tomorrow, looking at another pad.

[Shaun Harris]

Yep,, writing your thoughts down on a notebook pretty much straight after coming in, In your own from of "engrish" is important also from a learning capcity. Seems that transferring info from mental thoughts to written thoughts make you analyze and then use better the information as well.

The stopwatch is also a very important factor on cause and effect, when making setup changes - as often what " feels" smooth and fast unfortunaltely sometimes is simply not the case (can be abitter pill to swallow that one !).

The other thing I see riders often doing is "chasing their tail" on set up issues - and not realising that its a reality sometimes to take a step backwards in the handling of the bike in certain sectors of a track to gain an overall lap time....... Again thats another tough one sometimes to accept and try keep in mind that its the bigger picture thats more important.

Another interesting point - is the facination with tyre wear, - I have ridden some sweet handling bikes that simply wreck tyres, - its really easy to fix (put another tyre on......). I understand of course that tyre wear is still a strong pointer for bike set up, but i am just saying its not the holy grail that some might suggest it is.

2c worth










and a great 2c worth glen.

Re accepting a bad part of handling, that is where you learn how to become a better rider just like casey did. Example of this is the Iom TT course, I used 3 corners only out of over 250 to set my bike up on, if it worked how I wanted it too in those 3 corners, it was the best all round package I could ask for on that course.

Another thing to do is, focus on ONE turn at a time for changes and look at your stop watch ( as you said) if you leave all bar one turn exactually the same, you will see factually if you have gained or lost time

[codgyoleracer]

yes agree,
You mean, "give me ground clearance,HP and I'll do the rest" doesn't work any more ?
Life used to be so simple. <_< lol.

ps up your way again tomorrow, looking at another pad.


I think that might still apply Gazza !
Am stuck at work all day, so call in if passing, no new toyes (yet) to show off though

[roogazza]

I think that might still apply Gazza !
Am stuck at work all day, so call in if passing, no new toyes (yet) to show off though
Oh yeah,that's ok maybe next time. I'm thinking we'll be doing contracts and stuff anyway?
My minds on 'Rideons' at the mo. lol

[Robert Taylor]

Just like Labour party manifestos such a book would work well as a fire starter!!!!

[Shaun Harris]

Just like Labour party manifestos such a book would work well as a fire starter!!!!










you know I like your humour when you are enjoying yourself DR, but this time you are wrong mate, there are some very good points in his book for current and future riders, as well as technicians and team owners

[merv]

Just like Labour party manifestos such a book would work well as a fire starter!!!!

Whatcha griping about Doc, Casey won his last title on Ohlins didn't he and he was a straight talker just like Margaret Thatcher?

[cowpoos]

Thanks to Pritch, I read it yesterday.

you can read? thought you could only ride bikes?

I think Stoner is give a hard time for being straight up. His talent is phenomenal, shame he's not there now because of all the rossi loving whingers that he got sick of...Motogp should be a talent and engineering contest...not a fucking popularity contest with associated name calling nasty bullshit.

[cowpoos]

Just like Labour party manifestos such a book would work well as a fire starter!!!!

while I agree with your analogy with burning labour manifestos. I think you would like casey as a client. even if the bike wasn't handling right he was a very very good chance of a win.

I mean just ask Biggles...he thinks he's as fast as Lorenzo...he just blames your suspension!

[_Shrek_]

Thanks to Pritch, I read it yesterday. I was really impressed with his lack of slagging others in it, a very healthy way to write your own book. 95% of it I was aware off due to living in Adelaide a couple of years ago and knowing people there that knew the family personally. I have always said he is an incredable talent which I still say, and as pritch said to me, his life style as a child ie, him mum dad and sister then home schooling and travelling europe as a kid would not have been a great way to teach you life/people skills, so I guess that does explain the way he comes accross a bit.

The thing that stood out to me the most was the conviction of his family and the way there methods grew him into a total believer in himself, some thing that is required to win races at the top of the game which he sure did.

To use him as a example of why we should NOT be just focusing on bikes with trick suspension parts and hot rod motors in the early years of starting, 1st you have too learn how to ride a bike 250 Production, NO MUCKING with suspension, just learn how to ride and deal with problems that may effect you.

Jason Mcewan is a prime example of this style, he could ride anything fast even with square wheels, and this is a very special skill to have as Casey has proven.

The main thing I have retained about his history, is the part about the Junior racing association NOT giving him clearance to race when he was at the legal age too do so, this is bloody typical of the shit that Motorcycling australia get up too, look at the demise of there OFFICUAL championship years later on, it is falling apart big time with bullshit management, I wonder how many more Aussies have lost out due to there miss management.







The Moral of the story to me is, go get any god dam motorbike, make it legally safe, and go and have
a go at being CS or MM or who ever, just give it a go and see where it leads you.






FATHERS PAY ATTENTION ( Edited) and team owner bike builders.

How you act and behave your self around the race scenes has a Major reflection back on your sons future re sponsors and attitude required to make it, there are some out here in NZ that really need to calm down before the damage is to great to repair.

while I agree with most of what you said M-D.... but the bold bit about his life style I'd say :bs: ....we brought up most of our kids on home school, as we moved around a lot following the work & they learnt how to interact with people of all ages & life styles & finished way ahead of their peers.....

[Shaun Harris]

while I agree with most of what you said M-D.... but the bold bit about his life style I'd say :bs: ....we brought up most of our kids on home school, as we moved around a lot following the work & they learnt how to interact with people of all ages & life styles & finished way ahead of their peers.....






Fair cool man an maness

[skippa1]

Fair cool man an maness
Wtf?????????

[Robert Taylor]

while I agree with your analogy with burning labour manifestos. I think you would like casey as a client. even if the bike wasn't handling right he was a very very good chance of a win.

I mean just ask Biggles...he thinks he's as fast as Lorenzo...he just blames your suspension!

He tried the other guy but got sick of waiting for him to appear after his covert F16 operations.

[cowpoos]

He tried the other guy but got sick of waiting for him to appear after his covert F16 operations.

heh...lol...how about cunliff :rolleyes:

[pritch]

Yep,, writing your thoughts down on a notebook pretty much straight after coming in, In your own from of "engrish"

Or Spanish? I have read that #93 does this. He is reputedly a bright boy and quite quick for his age.

[pritch]

while I agree with most of what you said M-D.... but the bold bit about his life style I'd say :bs: .....

It may have worked for your kids, but it didn't work for Stoner. His whoie life revolved around his parents, his sister, and a motorbike. When he started high school he could not get on with other kids so his parents removed him.

In a recent Motopod interview, after commenting on this section of the book Wayne Gardener pointed out that his own kids have music lessons and and are encouraged to have interests other than motorcycles, so as to avoid the pitfall of too narrow an upbringing.

You really need to read the book to understand just how extreme was Stoner's isolation, and his raection to it.