PDA

View Full Version : Build a Radar detector screamer for under $10



Jantar
3rd September 2005, 10:03
Skip to the last paragraph if all you want is the instructions on how to make your own screamer.

After fitting an Escort Radar detector to the GS1200SS, I was disappointed with all the hassle of plugging and unplugging an earpiece, and it was only on the second ride that the very flimsy wiring decided to break. I rode a couple of times with just the detectors built in sounder for a warning, but at anything over 110 kmh it was next to useless, and at completely legal speeds who needs a radar detector anyway? The solution was to fit a screamer.

US$99.95 (from http://www.cyclegadgets.com/Products/product.asp?Item=RADSCR ) seemed a bit expensive for what is little more than a piezo and a triggering circuit, so I decided to build my own. The actual Piezo alarm is available from Dick Smith for a little over $8.00 so I was very confident that I could design a trigger that would work off the earplug outlet from the escort. However, while I was sketching out a possible circuit diagram I happened to glance at some junkmail from The Warehouse, and there it was: A smoke detector alarm for $7.49. So here in one package was a piezo, a triggering circuit, and a case.

I took a quick ride to the nearest Red Shed and soon found their smoke detectors; $7.49 each (battery included) or a pack of 2 for $15.49. Hello Warehouse, Do your maths a bit better if you want to sell the twin pack to anyone.

Back home, and I quickly had the smoke detector case disassembled so I could track the circuitry. This was the first disappointment. The trigger circuit was all encased inside the ionisation chamber, and I couldn't tell from looking at the circuit board whether it was triggered by a low voltage input, or by a change in resistance.

But the GOOD part was that under the circuit board was a pair of test pins, and these pins were lined up with a hole in the case that was covered by a paper label. I set my multimeter on the diode setting and touched the pins with the probes. Instant noise, and much louder than the radar detector's sound level. I then reversed the polarity of the probes to the test pins. for no response. I also checked to see if there was any voltage generated across the test pins at any stage, and as far as I could tell there was virtually none. This meant that there was very little chance of any signal being sent back from the smoke alarm to the radar detector. So from this little experiment I determined that a very weak signal can be used to set off the piezo in the smoke alarm, but that the signal must be DC and the correct polarity.

Next I had to determine how the output from the Escort could be used as a signal. As the remote output is designed for an earplug which has a very high impedance and almost no current drain, I suspected that the output voltage would be very small, and probably AC. However to be safe I made the first reading with the meter set at the 0 - 20 V DC scale. I was very suprised to get a reading of +6.3 V DC. I switched the meter to 0 - 20 VC AC, and got an almost identical reading. This suggests that the output is close to a square wave with the peaks at full battery voltage when there is no load. I dont know what internal protection there is in the Escort, but I would suggest that users be very careful to avoid a short circuit in the audio output.

The internal audio in the Escort is not loud. but I would suspect that as long as the output is limited to less that 1/16 W (5 mA) no damage would be caused to the internals. I therefore decided that a 3.3 K resistor in the line from detector to the smoke alarm would be most suitable. But first I wanted to test much higher values of resistor to see just what signal would be the weakest that would work. I started with a 33 K, but that wouldn't trigger the smoke alarm. Then I tried a 10 K, still with no result. Next I wanted to try a 4.7 K, but despite having 100's of resistors in my parts box, that was one value I didn't have. So straight on to the 3.3 K that was my original estimate, and YES. It triggered perfectly.

I therefore made up a lead to go from the radar detector to the smoke alarm test pins with the 3.3 K resistor wired into the positive lead. I painted the smoke alarm black to match the bike (ignoring the Do Not Paint label on the smoke alarm), and attached it to the bike with Velcro strips. Riding to work this morning I pressed the battery check button at various speeds and could very clearly hear the 85 db alarm at every stage.


Parts list:

General purpose smoke alarm (The Warehouse) $7.49
3.5 mm mono plug. $0.45
3.3 K 1/16 W resistor $0.20
Dual pin socket (for test pin fitting) $0.20
Shielded audio cable. 0.2 m $0.50
Consumables: Solder, velcro, paint. $1.00

Make up a lead using the shielded audio cable, using a 3.3 K resistor in line with the center pin of the 3.5 mm mono plug. Connect a dual pin socket to the other end of the lead.

Underneath the smoke alarm, peel back the paper label to reveal the test pins. These are not labeled as to polarity, so you will need to test the system and determine which way around the socket will go. Connect the lead from the Radar Detector and power up. If there is no audio signal, reverse the socket and try again.

edit: For spelling mistakes

Ixion
3rd September 2005, 10:32
Nice one!. Thanks for that.

Printed out, and trip to the Warehouse scheduled

Now Mrs Ixion has approved the purchase of a radar detector for the alfatoy, I just need to surrepticiously add the componentry necessary for bike fitting. Like this.

(Still think I'll keep using the trusty old Eyeball Mk1 too, though. Don't too much trust detectors, Mr Plod is sneaky these days and doesn't play fair)

Bren_chch
3rd September 2005, 11:54
nice one thanks for sharing!

Silage
3rd September 2005, 13:46
... and it will be reallly handy if something gets smokey in your gargre when the bike is in there.

I take it that smoke detector output is around 85dB. This sounds like heaps for what you need, but if you need more I found one of those personal attack pocket alarms with 130dB output at Dick Smiff, and it runs off a 12V battery. I am still getting around to wiring it to a mercury switch as a very cheap thief deterrant ie when the bike is on the side stand (and the unit is on) it doesn't sound but if it is put upright then mercury flows and wallah lots of noise. It cost around $30 and is verrrry (++) loud.

Silage
3rd September 2005, 13:49
ps regarding your circuit - is there a reason you did not put a diode in the circuit or would it just be unnecessary? Could act as a little more protection to the radar unit.

Jantar
3rd September 2005, 14:05
ps regarding your circuit - is there a reason you did not put a diode in the circuit or would it just be unnecessary? Could act as a little more protection to the radar unit.

I had expected that it would need one, but as the output was already simply a switched DC to give a square wave no diode was neccessary. A 3.3 K resistor, even if it somehow had a full 14 V DC applied across it would still allow a maximum current of less than 4 mA. This is far too small a value to harm an audio output stage.

Blackbird
12th September 2005, 22:05
Hi Malcolm

I was really slow in picking up this post - bugger, I was in Dick Smith's in Rotorua on Saturday; now I'll have to make another trip! Masterful job and well done. Have you a means of switching it off if you don't want it to sound off in town other than fiddling with the detector? I presume that it will make the same tone irrespective of whether it's a laser or Ka band as there's no modulation?

Cheers

Geoff

cowboyz
12th September 2005, 22:10
never used a radar detector myself but when your pushing limits and presumably concentrating on what youre doing, don't you shit yourself when it does off?

Blackbird
13th September 2005, 07:24
Not exactly shit yourself but it certainly wakes you up in a hurry, which is exactly what it's supposed to do :Punk:

Jantar
13th September 2005, 07:45
Hi Malcolm

I was really slow in picking up this post - bugger, I was in Dick Smith's in Rotorua on Saturday; now I'll have to make another trip! Masterful job and well done. Have you a means of switching it off if you don't want it to sound off in town other than fiddling with the detector? I presume that it will make the same tone irrespective of whether it's a laser or Ka band as there's no modulation?

Cheers

Geoff

To mute it it is still neccessary to press the mute button on the detector, and yes it does make the same sound for both Ka and Laser. I discovered the Laser sound on Saturday in the middle of no-where on the way to the West Coast.

Blackbird
13th September 2005, 07:47
Well come on then, don't be coy :psst: Did you also discover the immense fine that went with it? :rofl:

Jantar
13th September 2005, 07:49
Well come on then, don't be coy :psst: Did you also discover the immense fine that went with it? :rofl:

Nope, I was leading a small group of less experienced riders, and travelling at very close to 100 kmh or maybe only slightly over.

MrMelon
21st December 2006, 15:25
Is this still working fine for you? Have you made any improvements since the initial model? I've got to set up a screamer over the next couple of days so I'll give this one a go. Not really to keen to pay $175 for a screamer from radardirect.

crashe
21st December 2006, 15:39
Nice one!. Thanks for that.

Printed out, and trip to the Warehouse scheduled

Now Mrs Ixion has approved the purchase of a radar detector for the alfatoy, I just need to surrepticiously add the componentry necessary for bike fitting. Like this.

(Still think I'll keep using the trusty old Eyeball Mk1 too, though. Don't too much trust detectors, Mr Plod is sneaky these days and doesn't play fair)

Did you make yours as well...... did it work?

MrMelon
21st December 2006, 16:05
Just been down to dick smith in search of parts. They didn't have the right resistor (the closest was a 3.6k 0.6W) but I noticed they had this car reversing beeper. http://www.dse.co.nz/cgi-bin/dse.storefront/458a0782008555982742c0a87f3306b5/Product/View/L7060

Would this work as a screamer without having to use a smoke alarm?

Jantar
21st December 2006, 16:40
Is this still working fine for you? Have you made any improvements since the initial model? I've got to set up a screamer over the next couple of days so I'll give this one a go. Not really to keen to pay $175 for a screamer from radardirect.

Yes, its still working perfectly. I did find one issue when I changed from a GS1200ss to the VStrom. Make sure that it is mounted out of the air flow, otherwise it will detect fog, pollen, fine dust etc as smoke and give a false alarm.


Just been down to dick smith in search of parts. They didn't have the right resistor (the closest was a 3.6k 0.6W) but I noticed they had this car reversing beeper. http://www.dse.co.nz/cgi-bin/dse.sto...uct/View/L7060

Would this work as a screamer without having to use a smoke alarm?

It probably would, but you would still need to find a method of triggering it from the radar detector. The earplug output would not be suffient on its own and may damage the detector.

MrMelon
21st December 2006, 16:57
Sweet, off to jaycar in the morning to get the necessary bits then. Where's the best place to take the feed for the radar detector power too?

Cheers

MrMelon
22nd December 2006, 13:23
The smallest 3k3 resistor I could get at jaycar or dick smith was 0.5W. Will this harm the detector in any way?

k14
22nd December 2006, 13:29
It shouldn't. iirc, that is the max power it can dissapate. So having one over rated for the job shouldn't cause any issues.

MrMelon
23rd December 2006, 19:57
Well I made a cable up with the 3k3 0.5w resistor inline with the middle pin but I can't get the detector to set the smoke alarm off properly. When it's plugged into the headphone jack and I connect the wires to both sides of the test switch on the smoke alarm it'll set the smoke alarm off constantly when the wires are one way around, and not at all when they're reversed. The detector powering on doesn't set it off.

Any ideas? Does it make a difference where the volume is set on the detector? It's an escort passport 8500.

Jantar
23rd December 2006, 21:51
I'm using a passport X50, it it seems to work fine. If the wires are the wrong way around it wont work at all, but the correct way it only works when the detector is sending a signal.

You may be using a different model smoke detector to the one I'm using, so here's something to try. With the radar detector disconected just short out the pins on the detector and see if it screams. If it does then you have one that doesn't need a signal, just a short. In this case you will need a diode as well to prevent a back feed from the smoke detector through the radar detector.

Try using an electronic multimeter to see what current is required to set it off, you may need to change the value of the resistor to suit.

MrMelon
23rd December 2006, 22:16
Yeah I got this detector from dick smith so it might be a different model. It goes off when the test pins are shorted. Where would the diode need to go? Should I use any one in particular?

My freaking multimeter's in a box somewhere in storage at the moment so I can't do any proper testing.

Do you know what brand your smoke alarm was? I might head off to the warehouse tomorrow and see if I can find one if it'd be easier.

Jantar
23rd December 2006, 22:35
Ok, The fact that the smoke detector goes off when the pins are shorted tells us that there is a voltage across the test pins. You need to determine which is positive and which is negative, then insert a diode to block the current flow. There is a risk that doing this may also block the signal from the radar detector.

I'm not sure of your level of electronics knowledge, but if I was doing this with a detector that required a direct short across the test pins to activate, then I'd be more inclide to use a switching transistor with the emitter and collector across the test pins and the Base and emitter leading back to the radar detector. The 3k3 resistor would be between the collector and the smoke detector, and another 3k3 resistor between the base and the radar detector. I would also put a 47pF capacitor in parrallell with the transistor between the base and the emitter.

I guess I was lucky in finding one from the Warehouse that required a volage rather than just a completed circuit.

StoneChucker
24th December 2006, 02:01
Since I haven't read all of the main post, or the replies, please excuse if I am repeating something...

Be careful while opening up the smioke detector! There are a couple of types and one (maybe all, can't remember) has a radioactive compound between two metal plates (again, I think it's between plates). From memory, the most common type uses a small amount of radiation from the tiny source between the plates to detect smoke. It does this by a method which I do know, but for the moment can't remember.

What I do remember, is the the info I had said never to expose the radioactive material, as there is a chance of ingesting it (breathed in or via hands), which would prove dangerous at best, fatal at worst. Obviously it's safe when in the unit, and even safe to be next to the unit, but not when taken apart. (btw, I don't mean it's dangerous to open them up, it's not. I'm specifically referring to the radioactive component within.)

Dave.

kevie
24th December 2006, 09:11
what Id like to make is a little unit that will activate the radar detectors hahhaha will slow you buggers down thinking its a cop nearby eh

Lou Girardin
24th December 2006, 09:41
what Id like to make is a little unit that will activate the radar detectors hahhaha will slow you buggers down thinking its a cop nearby eh

Jaycar sell them. Might be K band though, so it won't work on good detectors.

k14
24th December 2006, 10:06
Since I haven't read all of the main post, or the replies, please excuse if I am repeating something...

Be careful while opening up the smioke detector! There are a couple of types and one (maybe all, can't remember) has a radioactive compound between two metal plates (again, I think it's between plates). From memory, the most common type uses a small amount of radiation from the tiny source between the plates to detect smoke. It does this by a method which I do know, but for the moment can't remember.

What I do remember, is the the info I had said never to expose the radioactive material, as there is a chance of ingesting it (breathed in or via hands), which would prove dangerous at best, fatal at worst. Obviously it's safe when in the unit, and even safe to be next to the unit, but not when taken apart. (btw, I don't mean it's dangerous to open them up, it's not. I'm specifically referring to the radioactive component within.)

Dave.
Dont worry. All they are using is the speaker part. Removing the smoke detector bit (the bit with the radioactive material in it) and instead using the radar detector to trigger the sound buzzer.

The way it works is that one side has the radioactive substance emitting alpha rays at a fairly high rate towards a detector. So long as the detector keeps sensing the rays its fine. If however smoke gets between the source and detector then the buzzer will go off. Pretty simple really. Alpha rays are very weak and normally don't even penetrate a piece of paper. Just being around the substance is also not of any consequence, it is hazardous if you ingest it however. Will be very bad indeed.

Jantar
24th December 2006, 10:13
Just being around the substance is also not of any consequence, it is hazardous if you ingest it however. Will be very bad indeed. Quite correct, and that is why I wasn't prepared to open the ionization chamber to see what type of triggering circuit it used.

Steam
24th December 2006, 10:17
Hey can you guys please save the ionisation chamber bit for me, I'm collecting Americium. I need about 80kgs of it, it's going to take a while to collect but it's my only option as you need a license to get Uranium 235.
Thanks!

k14
24th December 2006, 10:26
Hey can you guys please save the ionisation chamber bit for me, I'm collecting Americium. I need about 80kgs of it, it's going to take a while to collect but it's my only option as you need a license to get Uranium 235.
Thanks!
Just enroll as a physics student at a uni, they have access to heaps. Will take a while to get 80kg of it. Maybe go and ask the iranians?