Back tyre briefly lost grip on straight road

[zmlam]

Hi all,

Just wanted to get some ideas of what happened, as it gave me quite a scare..

Was driving back in a rainy night a few weeks ago, driving at 100km/hr, straight road (or perhaps a very slight bend), and all of a sudden I feel the back tyre just loose control and it slides to the left and right a few times (maybe by few inches each way). All happened within a second (which felt like a long time), and fortunately I probably didn't have to react to it, and it all came right by itself while I steered straight ahead.

There is a possibility I could have ridden over something I didn't see, could I have hit some oil slick or something similar - possible?

Bike serviced a few months ago, both tyres are also brand new during time of service.

Thanks in advance!

[russd7]

have had this happen on a few occasions in wet conditions when riding over tar bleed, worst one was while passing a stock truck and a car appeared in the distance so i gave the throttle a bit more of a twist :sweatdrop , most times in one day was while riding along the desert road in torrential rain. Not really to much to worry about as long as you don't panic.

[jellywrestler]

Hi all,

Just wanted to get some ideas of what happened, as it gave me quite a scare..

Was driving back in a rainy night a few weeks ago, driving at 100km/hr,

1st of all, your ride a motorcycle, if your description of how you control it is driving then you need to learn a lot. did you think about going and have a look to see what it was, and then checking to see whether there were any warning signs you may not have picked up that may help you in the future? if it's deisle then the road often has a rainbow effect and you can smell it...

[russd7]

1st of all, your ride a motorcycle, if your description of how you control it is driving then you need to learn a lot..

actually a lot of people refer to operating a motorcycle as driving, a discussion that has been done to death and not really very helpfull to a noob asking for advice, the second part of your statement was what could be considered helpfull:2thumbsup

[FJRider]

It happens all the time with my FJ ... from 6500 rpm up past 9500 rpm ... usually in second ... and sometimes in third gear ... :scratch:

[AllanB]

What condition is your rear tyre in? No trying to squeeze the last few hundred kms out of it are you?

[Ocean1]

could I have hit some oil slick or something similar - possible?

May be other contributing factors, the bike, the tyre, but most likely the primary cause would be oil. There's a lot of it out there where it shouldn't orta be.

[oneofsix]

Like what jelly said, go back and have a look. It is possible that in the dry you wont see it but still a look better than guessing with the help of people who don't know the road or even remember the OP correctly. :rolleyes: Russd7's suggestion of tar bleed would be a good starter as it is hard to spot on a rainy night, deseasil will probably have been washed away.

[Ribit]

If i had to guess it would be tar bleed. Ive had the same effect while riding in the wet due to tar bleed.

[G4L4XY]

Bike serviced a few months ago, both tyres are also brand new during time of service.


What condition is your rear tyre in? No trying to squeeze the last few hundred kms out of it are you?

Highly unlikely.

Possible tar bleed. You weren't riding/driving on the center line? Possible urine leakage, not sure how slippery that is though ;)

[zmlam]

Awesome - thanks for the responses.

Didn't think to stop to turn back actually - at the time I didn't know at all what happened, I thought perhaps this is what a flat tyre may have felt like. First time its happened to me from over the 3+ years of riding, though I don't have much night riding experience.

Tyres - only have put in about 1000kms in from brand new, so certainly didn't think it was lack of tyre thread.

Thanks again! Always much to learn!

[skippa1]

Tar bleed, happens at the same spot just up the road from me every time it rains.

[zmlam]

Highly unlikely.

Possible tar bleed. You weren't riding/driving on the center line? Possible urine leakage, not sure how slippery that is though ;)

Ha! Am certain I wasn't riding on the center line - I'm putting it down to some slippery surface for now, and not some malfunction in the bike and/or parts..

[jellywrestler]

actually a lot of people refer to operating a motorcycle as driving, maybe maybe not, it may be semantics but it also maybe indicative of their attitude towards their new vechile, and they may not be aware. I'd rather point it out then there's a chance the penny may drop and improve their concept. It wasn't an insult etc in my eyes.

[Oakie]

If i had to guess it would be tar bleed. Ive had the same effect while riding in the wet due to tar bleed.

That was my first reaction.

[scumdog]

What condition is your rear tyre in? No trying to squeeze the last few hundred kms out of it are you?

X2

I've been to crashes where a 'nearly worn out back tyre' on a wet road was the culprit.

[george formby]

If your tires are good then it was most likely spooge of some sort, tar bleed, diesel, oil from an old ute, cow shit etc. Had a few wee slippys on the road.

In Belgium they have repaired huge swathes of motorway with pure tar, like our tar bleed or over banding where cracks in the road are sealed with tar. Bizarre feeling watching the revs go up & the speedo go down in heavy traffic. A quick life saver made the bike fish tail.

If it was a one off & the bike is good, bearings (wheel, swing arm, shock etc), tires are good, head bearings are good etc then I would not sweat it.
Loss of traction. It happens.

[TLJimmy]

I had a similar experience on a corner last week, except I slid sideways a half lane width. Thank fuck for modern tires - the old skinny tires on the GSX1100E I had as a teenager woulda had me on my arse - reparing the ignition cover...again:laugh: I went back to see what had caused it - and found a patch of tar bleed that was almost invisible with the light in the direction I was traveling. Going the other way it stuck out like dogs balls.....Buggers can sneak up and bite you, even if you are looking out for them...it's all part of riding on our shite roads in the rain.

[Akzle]

1st of all, your ride a motorcycle, if your description of how you control it is driving then you need to learn a lot. did you think about going and have a look to see what it was, and then checking to see whether there were any warning signs you may not have picked up that may help you in the future? if it's deisle then the road often has a rainbow effect and you can smell it...

no more beersies for you bro.

[R650R]

Just part of riding, you did ok to ride it out and obviously didn't do anything stupid like shut the throttle or brake.
Our roads are crap and then lots of crap gets dropped/spilled on them all the time.
Even in loaded 44+Ton b-train wheelspin in straight line on flat or tractor unit sledging in corners happens more than you'd expect.

You should make sure your seat cover is clean afterwards so you don't slide up on the tank next time you brake ;p

[Flip]

Involved in an (3 bike group) accident a few years ago when the front and back bike went down on a relatively straight road. The road was a bleedy POS but also the seal was broken up like crazy paving and covering a soft patch of mud. It was just that the water had hydrauliced the fines out of the hard fill.

The front bike went down and the back bike went down and mine went well well basically balistic but I did get the scoot between the front rider and the front bike without hitting either as they were sliding down the road. Then spent 8 hours in the rain on the side of the road looking after two HD's waiting for a tow truck after the riders were taken to hospital.

A bit of trail bike riding really pays dividents when these low traction "brown moments" happen. Even for fuckers on Harleys. The only thing that saved me was I didnt touch the brakes when I felt the the bike slipping side ways.

It was just before the Hamner turn off.

[Big Dog]

First half hour of rain shine is the worst. It brings out all the shit that was baked in. On good seal this runs off. On tar bleed it just hangs around like snot. Middle o winter is good because cars and trucks have broken the snot down and all the passing aqua treads have dispersed it, hopefully on to good seal.

There is a hill on the way home that almost anytime it has started raining the back wheel spins up on anything. 350, 1300. Etc. Even done it once in the bighorn. Now I know it is there it is sometimes more frightening. Anticipation. Etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SMOKEU]

Even in loaded 44+Ton b-train wheelspin in straight line on flat or tractor unit sledging in corners happens more than you'd expect.



I didn't think it would really be possible to skid up a big truck like that. Do a proper skid!

[pritch]

If i had to guess it would be tar bleed. Ive had the same effect while riding in the wet due to tar bleed.

Yeah my guess too. Those tar patches can be exciting on a corner, hopefully the sliding is over before I start to "correct" and really fuck things up. :whistle:

On one memorable trip in seriously wet weather on a near new VFR both wheels were sliding on the tar patches - on the straights. When I got home I gave the OE Bridgestones the heave and fitted Metzeler Z6s. Problem solved.

Happened to me in a bend on a Goldwing once. It was only a little slide but even a little slide is impressive on a Goldwing.

[Brett]

Yep. Sounds like tar bleed to me. It's a bitch in the wet. Very slippery.

[quickbuck]

I remember once when I pulled out into a passing lane to overtake a car in the wet. I was on my 98 GSX 600 Teapot. Opened the throttle a little and revs increased, speed reduced... Lost so much ground doing the rolling burnout I nearly run out of passing lane by the time I found traction again.
I would say it was tar bleed in my case too.....

As stated, keep the Gyro spinning. Don't touch anything. Most important, keep your head and eyes up.

Sent from my Nokia using Tapa talk.

[400sm]

Yep, tar bleed for sure. I thort my clutch had gone!
The goverment should be held accountable for this type of road maintenance negligence, which creates this dangerous environment.

[Big Dog]

Yep, tar bleed for sure. I thort my clutch had gone!
The goverment should be held accountable for this type of road maintenance negligence, which creates this dangerous environment.

The govt don't pave our roads.
They supplement the local council and other agencies who manage it.
Those agencies and local bodies subcontract the work to the best tender. Often they will subcontract as well. Result is one of the roads between home an the motorway was skimmed and reseated last year. And again this year. It was fine a few months ago barring a little over banding. Now it is a rutted mess with lots o chunks missing. And the over banding is still there. And we now have tar bleeding where there was none before.

Worse? There is about 100m away a 100m section where both tyre tracks are pure tar bleed.


I miss the Ministry of Works. They might have had a few employees whose main job was to prop up a shovel, on a really busy day count clouds as they lay hidden in the long grass but the road when they were finished was fit for use.

Being fair to current roadies:
I could not do a better job.
Something like 40% more of our roads are paved.
The govt contribution is significantly lower per km travelled.
There are more barriers.
There was only a fraction of the road users in particular, trucks. Largely because govt protections on rail came off at the same time.


Mayhaps I wear the rose tinted glasses as I gaze upon the yesteryear of my youth?


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[avgas]

First time its happened to me from over the 3+ years of riding
Now don't take this the wrong way - but it sounds to me like your 3 years of experience have not really been in figuring out how to ride your bike.
Knowing its limits, knowing what causes what, seeing how it acts and reacts.

This is all being part of a rider. You are there for the ride, so you really need to know what your bike is likely to do in situations. Don't be scared to find out what its limits are (which ironically have little to do with speed), in a safe environment.

As someone eloquently put it too me in the past...
"30 seconds in a skid pan overwrites 20 years worth on a highway".

We are all learning - regardless of how long we have been riding.

[skippa1]

Mayhaps I wear the rose tinted glasses as I gaze upon the yesteryear of my youth?


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.
You're spot on.........

[quickbuck]

Now don't take this the wrong way - but it sounds to me like your 3 years of experience have not really been in figuring out how to ride your bike.
Knowing its limits, knowing what causes what, seeing how it acts and reacts.

This is all being part of a rider. You are there for the ride, so you really need to know what your bike is likely to do in situations. Don't be scared to find out what its limits are (which ironically have little to do with speed), in a safe environment.

As someone eloquently put it too me in the past...
"30 seconds in a skid pan overwrites 20 years worth on a highway".

We are all learning - regardless of how long we have been riding.
+1 for this.

OP is welcome to come out to Manfeild next track day and find me (or some other helpful person) to give him a few hints and tips.....

did we ever find out what bike he is riding??

[ellipsis]

...a roading contractor friend did tell me that the cheaper tar/pitch they use is diabolical stuff...what was a few odd patches in our area have turned into what seems like 20% of the entire highway...I am very surprised these days if I have not had the back step out on the shit, a few times on a ride...just keep on moving forward...if you shit and button off, you are in more shit...

[Ocean1]

As someone eloquently put it too me in the past...
"30 seconds in a skid pan overwrites 20 years worth on a highway".

Aye, a few hours on a dirt bike never did anyone much harm either.


Well...

[400sm]

The govt don't pave our roads.
They supplement the local council and other agencies who manage it.
Those agencies and local bodies subcontract the work to the best tender. Often they will subcontract as well. Result is one of the roads between home an the motorway was skimmed and reseated last year. And again this year. It was fine a few months ago barring a little over banding. Now it is a rutted mess with lots o chunks missing. And the over banding is still there. And we now have tar bleeding where there was none before.

Worse? There is about 100m away a 100m section where both tyre tracks are pure tar bleed.


I miss the Ministry of Works. They might have had a few employees whose main job was to prop up a shovel, on a really busy day count clouds as they lay hidden in the long grass but the road when they were finished was fit for use.

Being fair to current roadies:
I could not do a better job.
Something like 40% more of our roads are paved.
The govt contribution is significantly lower per km travelled.
There are more barriers.
There was only a fraction of the road users in particular, trucks. Largely because govt protections on rail came off at the same time.


Mayhaps I wear the rose tinted glasses as I gaze upon the yesteryear of my youth?


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

As you pointed out, it all back-tracks to the govt. You are an apologist for incompetence. Who is accountable then . . . . No one ,?

[400sm]

Hi all,

Just wanted to get some ideas of what happened, as it gave me quite a scare..

Was driving back in a rainy night a few weeks ago, driving at 100km/hr, straight road (or perhaps a very slight bend), and all of a sudden I feel the back tyre just loose control and it slides to the left and right a few times (maybe by few inches each way). All happened within a second (which felt like a long time), and fortunately I probably didn't have to react to it, and it all came right by itself while I steered straight ahead.

There is a possibility I could have ridden over something I didn't see, could I have hit some oil slick or something similar - possible?

Bike serviced a few months ago, both tyres are also brand new during time of service.

Thanks in advance!

There is nothing wrong with your riding. You struck the equivalent of ice in the dark. It's the road that was faulty.

[Ocean1]

As you pointed out, it all back-tracks to the govt. You are an apologist for incompetence. Who is accountable then . . . . No one ,?

Actually, it back tracks to the taxpayer.

You tight cunt.

[Madness]

As you pointed out, it all back-tracks to the govt. You are an apologist for incompetence. Who is accountable then . . . . No one ,?

Umm...


The govt don't pave our roads.
They supplement the local council and other agencies who manage it.

:facepalm:

[400sm]

Who is accountable ???

[400sm]

Actually, it back tracks to the taxpayer.

You tight cunt.

The Govt takes the taxpayers' money.
The govt is ultimately responsible for our roads.


...not quite understanding you, re the "tight" reference.....

[400sm]

Umm...



:facepalm:

Local "council" = Local "GOVERMENT"..... don't you agree.....

"other agencies" = GOVERMENT agencies.

......the roads aint private are they ???

[Madness]

Local "council" = Local "GOVERMENT"..... don't you agree.....

"other agencies" = GOVERMENT agencies.

......the roads aint private are they ???

Well that's not no-one is it, Einstein? You could always run for public office you know, except you won't as it's easier to just sit back & whinge like a pom with pms.

Is there a full moon this week? It seems the level of retardation has gone past full-retard of late.

[Ocean1]

The Govt takes the taxpayers' money.
The govt is ultimately responsible for our roads.


...not quite understanding you, re the "tight" reference.....

Have some numbers: http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/9789264185715-en/02/03/index.html;jsessionid=1ao2crcmrikfc.x-oecd-live-02?contentType=&itemId=%2Fcontent%2Fchapter%2F9789264185715-20-en&mimeType=text%2Fhtml&containerItemId=%2Fcontent%2Fbook%2F9789264185715-en&accessItemIds=%2Fcontent%2Fbook%2F9789264185715-en

Taken with a modicum of intelligence they'll relieve you of the fantasy that we can afford perfect roads.

[400sm]

Well that's not no-one is it, Einstein? You could always run for public office you know, except you won't as it's easier to just sit back & whinge like a pom with pms.

Is there a full moon this week? It seems the level of retardation has gone past full-retard of late.

I have phoned the correct govt officialls many times and pointed out problems with the roads. Most times they were fixed soon after.

What have you done . . . spoken to the man on the spade ?

[400sm]

Have some numbers: http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/9789264185715-en/02/03/index.html;jsessionid=1ao2crcmrikfc.x-oecd-live-02?contentType=&itemId=%2Fcontent%2Fchapter%2F9789264185715-20-en&mimeType=text%2Fhtml&containerItemId=%2Fcontent%2Fbook%2F9789264185715-en&accessItemIds=%2Fcontent%2Fbook%2F9789264185715-en

Taken with a modicum of intelligence they'll relieve you of the fantasy that we can afford perfect roads.

What's the tight reference mean ?

[Madness]

I have phoned the correct govt officialls many times and pointed out problems with the roads. Most times they were fixed soon after.

What have you done . . . spoken to the man on the spade ?

So you've phoned the correct government officials many times yet you still had to ask on here who is accountable?

I've spoken to nobody, I'm not the one here with a problem. Try Tampax, my Mrs. swears by them :niceone:

[400sm]

Now don't take this the wrong way - but it sounds to me like your 3 years of experience have not really been in figuring out how to ride your bike.
Knowing its limits, knowing what causes what, seeing how it acts and reacts.

This is all being part of a rider. You are there for the ride, so you really need to know what your bike is likely to do in situations. Don't be scared to find out what its limits are (which ironically have little to do with speed), in a safe environment.

As someone eloquently put it too me in the past...
"30 seconds in a skid pan overwrites 20 years worth on a highway".

We are all learning - regardless of how long we have been riding.

Total horse shit.
The OP is not at fault here.

[Katman]

X2

I've been to crashes where a 'nearly worn out back tyre' on a wet road was the culprit.

Just as well you're not a detective.

[Big Dog]

As you pointed out, it all back-tracks to the govt. You are an apologist for incompetence. Who is accountable then . . . . No one ,?

Local body govt for roads.
Nzta for motorways and highways.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Big Dog]

Local body government is divorced from national government. Each council or other duly elected local body decides the standard of their roads within the framework of legislation provided by the government.

Are you keeping up?

Due to restructuring in the 80s an 90s the government department responsible on a national scale was slashed and pi in charge of only interjurisdicttional roadways. Each local body decides how to spend their money. Some councils do fundraising or own profitable businesses. Some subcontract some own road in companies.



Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Big Dog]

Total horse shit.
The OP is not at fault here.

Doesn't sound like blame to me. To me it sounds more like a veteran telling a less experienced rider to get used to the fact that the road is not perfect. That the tight mental attitude and the right knowledge can make his ride far safer and far more fun than ringing the council every 100 metres.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[avgas]

Total horse shit.
The OP is not at fault here.
There is no fault here princess. Only ways we move forward with a better plan on not dying.

When you get a big boy bike, you might learn some big boy lessons.

[scumdog]

Just as well you're not a detective.


Don't be pedantic - it demeans you...

[FJRider]

Local body govt for Provincial roads.
Nzta for motorways and State highways.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

There .. fixed it for you ..

[Big Dog]

There .. fixed it for you ..

Thanks. I knew what I meant.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Brett]

Now don't take this the wrong way - but it sounds to me like your 3 years of experience have not really been in figuring out how to ride your bike.
Knowing its limits, knowing what causes what, seeing how it acts and reacts.

This is all being part of a rider. You are there for the ride, so you really need to know what your bike is likely to do in situations. Don't be scared to find out what its limits are (which ironically have little to do with speed), in a safe environment.

As someone eloquently put it too me in the past...
"30 seconds in a skid pan overwrites 20 years worth on a highway".

We are all learning - regardless of how long we have been riding.

Maybe a small jot of truth...but on a race track you're in a heightened state of awareness, knowingly pushing your bike to the limit. Cruising along the open road on a nice straight piece of road for that matter, you're much less likely to be expecting the rear to let go. That said, where the track like experience comes in, is that even of caught off-guard, it is much less likely to scare the shit out of you and you're more likely to react appropriately.

[scumdog]

Maybe a small jot of truth...but on a race track you're in a heightened state of awareness, knowingly pushing your bike to the limit. Cruising along the open road on a nice straight piece of road for that matter, you're much less likely to be expecting the rear to let go. That said, where the track like experience comes in, is that even of caught off-guard, it is much less likely to scare the shit out of you and you're more likely to react appropriately.

And on your racetrack you don't need to keep up that level of concentration for several hours in changing scenery/roads/conditions.

[pete-blen]

yer tire slid around a wee bit on yer did it.... thats a real shame..:rolleyes:

I remeber when the tyres were so crappy yer exspected that 1/2 doz times every time yer
thow a leg over a bike... the dirt/adv tyres these days grip better on the seal than some of the road tyres
we use to have..

[400sm]

There is no fault here princess. Only ways we move forward with a better plan on not dying.

When you get a big boy bike, you might learn some big boy lessons.


betcha ive had bigger bikes than you, girlie

[400sm]

:lol:
Doesn't sound like blame to me. To me it sounds more like a veteran telling a less experienced rider to get used to the fact that the road is not perfect. That the tight mental attitude and the right knowledge can make his ride far safer and far more fun than ringing the council every 100 metres.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.


Im a veteran.
he is just patronising the op.
op has at least 3 years experience.
thats heaps.

his experience seems to be 6500 posts on kb, which makes him only half as right as those with 13,000...

So, in your opinion, dont fix roads, send everyone to rider school to learn that some roads is bad...:lol:

[Big Dog]

:lol:


Im a veteran.
he is just patronising the op.
op has at least 3 years experience.
thats heaps.

his experience seems to be 6500 posts on kb, which makes him only half as right as those with 13,000...

So, in your opinion, dont fix roads, send everyone to rider school to learn that some roads is bad...:lol:

No, in my opinion if your going to wait at home for the perfect weather and perfect roads you won't get much experience over 20 years. You might have a mighty high post count though.
Years licensed and post count don't mean shit compare to kms ridden and survived.

What I mean is if there is a particular safety hazard report it, but FFS if you encounter a new hazard you don't know how to deal with, learn.

Life is not a dress rehearsal, work out what you need to learn to have fun in any weather on any road.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Big Dog]

In the last 1/2 million kms about half was in good weather. I'd be surprised if any was on hazard free roads.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[400sm]

No, in my opinion if your going to wait at home for the perfect weather and perfect roads you won't get much experience over 20 years. You might have a mighty high post count though.
Years licensed and post count don't mean shit compare to kms ridden and survived.

What I mean is if there is a particular safety hazard report it, but FFS if you encounter a new hazard you don't know how to deal with, learn.

Life is not a dress rehearsal, work out what you need to learn to have fun in any weather on any road.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.


True.
But I think he was being too negative towards the op.

[avgas]

:lol:


Im a veteran.
he is just patronising the op.
op has at least 3 years experience.
thats heaps.

his experience seems to be 6500 posts on kb, which makes him only half as right as those with 13,000...

So, in your opinion, dont fix roads, send everyone to rider school to learn that some roads is bad...:lol:
I've motarded at 120 hp / 120 nm (dynoed rear wheel). FYI it's fucking scary at that grunt.
So I will let you think about what I don't slide around corners.

But I am not as young and dumb as I used to be - so now I am happy just pootling around on sub-50hp toys that I can throw around and have a bit of fun.

Fixing the roads means that more ladies like you will think its ok to act like and ass, and it's someone else's fault when you come off.

So ask yourself, if your such a seasoned pro, who can stop on a dime. Why does a little tar slick scare you?

[avgas]

yer tire slid around a wee bit on yer did it.... thats a real shame..:rolleyes:

I remeber when the tyres were so crappy yer exspected that 1/2 doz times every time yer
thow a leg over a bike... the dirt/adv tyres these days grip better on the seal than some of the road tyres
we use to have..
Still do.
I love my Shinko's and ChengShins. They make the sliding easier at low speed and low hp.

[400sm]

I've motarded at 120 hp / 120 nm (dynoed rear wheel). FYI it's fucking scary at that grunt.
So I will let you think about what I don't slide around corners.

But I am not as young and dumb as I used to be - so now I am happy just pootling around on sub-50hp toys that I can throw around and have a bit of fun.

Fixing the roads means that more ladies like you will think its ok to act like and ass, and it's someone else's fault when you come off.

So ask yourself, if your such a seasoned pro, who can stop on a dime. Why does a little tar slick scare you?

What motard was that!!!

The OP struck an unseen wet hazard because it was dark and raining.
It wd be like striking ice or oil in similar circumstances.
One cannot control a bike in those conditions, if the hazards are unseen.

I hate mud and ruts BTW