No cut in motorcycle ACC levies

[thepom]

See the cars are getting a cut in the levies but sadly for us bike riders we get nothing......:no:

[imdying]

See the cars are getting a cut in the levies but sadly for us bike riders we get nothing......:no:It's cheaper to put your whole fleet on hold and just drive around, I thought all motorcyclists were aware of this by now? You'll have to get stopped a fair few times to pay for the WOF/rego on a car and 2 bikes.

[Katman]

It's cheaper to put your whole fleet on hold and just drive around, I thought all motorcyclists were aware of this by now? You'll have to get stopped a fair few times to pay for the WOF/rego on a car and 2 bikes.

Only trouble with that is that the wording is already in place in legislation that you can be fined up to $1000 for operating a vehicle with no rego but the fine is currently set at $200.

If TPTB start seeing more and more bikes being used without rego they can simply increase the fine up to the maximum, overnight, without even raising a sweat.

[Mike.Gayner]

It's cheaper to put your whole fleet on hold and just drive around, I thought all motorcyclists were aware of this by now? You'll have to get stopped a fair few times to pay for the WOF/rego on a car and 2 bikes.

Not sure why anyone would be paying for rego on a bike these days. Not worth the silly expense. Like you said, if you do the maths you're almost always better off taking your chances.

[bogan]

Yeh I still get wofs, and sometimes a few months rego over summer, but they've got a lot less from me since they raised the levies that is for sure!

[xen]

It's cheaper to put your whole fleet on hold and just drive around, I thought all motorcyclists were aware of this by now? You'll have to get stopped a fair few times to pay for the WOF/rego on a car and 2 bikes.

Except for the 20 demerits you get as well, doesn't take many to lose your licence :no:

[imdying]

If TPTB start seeing more and more bikes being used without rego they can simply increase the fine up to the maximum, overnight, without even raising a sweat.That hasn't happened yet ;) Besides which, there simply aren't very many police in Christchurch. I understand the North Island is quite a lot further on in being policed like a Nazi state, but we're still relatively free down here. The officers themselves seem quite relaxed too... if you're being a cunt they'll nick you, but they don't seem to spend much time going out of their way to piss the populace off. YMMV


Not sure why anyone would be paying for rego on a bike these days. Not worth the silly expense. Like you said, if you do the maths you're almost always better off taking your chances.Pretty much...


Except for the 20 demerits you get as well, doesn't take many to lose your licence :no:That's being caught 5 times though isn't it? It's becomes a financial barrier well before then.

I must admit I do try to keep a WOF on my bike though. Actually, I think it might even be registered too at the moment.

[Erelyes]

See the cars are getting a cut in the levies but sadly for us bike riders we get nothing......:no:

All the more reason to make use of the ACC subsidised rider training courses :niceone:

[xen]

That's being caught 5 times though isn't it? It's becomes a financial barrier well before then.

I must admit I do try to keep a WOF on my bike though. Actually, I think it might even be registered too at the moment.

Yea true and if you're at minimal points it does make sense, but when you get past 50 with 2 years to drop them off you tend to get a bit cautious lol

[The Reibz]

People Register and Warrent motorcycles? This is news to me.

[cynna]

See the cars are getting a cut in the levies but sadly for us bike riders we get nothing......:no:


thats because you keep crashing. before you got here our reg was about $150

[cynna]

It's cheaper to put your whole fleet on hold and just drive around, I thought all motorcyclists were aware of this by now? You'll have to get stopped a fair few times to pay for the WOF/rego on a car and 2 bikes.


do you ever get out? i get stopped about once a fortnight

[cynna]

and isnt the fine darer if you reg is on hold?

[The Reibz]

and isnt the fine darer if you reg is on hold?

Negative. $100 = 15 demerits.
Worth the risk

[bogan]

do you ever get out? i get stopped about once a fortnight

How fucking sifty do you look? I haven't been stopped for years...

[imdying]

How fucking sifty do you look? I haven't been stopped for years...That was my thought... do you look like a gang member?

[BuzzardNZ]

I reckon you're more likely to get pinged from a parking warden than a cop for no rego ( well in Wellington at least ).

[bogan]

I reckon you're more likely to get pinged from a parking warden than a cop for no rego ( well in Wellington at least ).

Exactly, that is why my shopping trolley stays rego'd and my bike doesn't.

[Voltaire]

I wonder if the same people who don't pay rego are the same ones who expect some one elses insurance to cover them in an accident :rolleyes:
...and whine on KB.

[bogan]

I wonder if the same people who don't pay rego are the same ones who expect some one elses insurance to cover them in an accident :rolleyes:
...and whine on KB.

What has rego got to do with insurance?

[Trade_nancy]

I wonder if the same people who don't pay rego are the same ones who expect some one elses insurance to cover them in an accident :rolleyes:
...and whine on KB.

Might be - more likely they are the ones who already pay ACC cover on their car, their wife's car, at their place of work and on their small home based business...and others. Much like push bikers...

[p.dath]

See the cars are getting a cut in the levies but sadly for us bike riders we get nothing......:no:

While they aren't cutting the direct levy on motorcycles, they are looking to cut the levy on petrol ... so there is a proposed reduction.

[Ulsterkiwi]

......I understand the North Island is quite a lot further on in being policed like a Nazi state, but we're still relatively free down here......

You don't think that's a tad hyperbolic? I dont think people are being shipped off in cattle trucks to the next country along to be gassed and then burned to a cinder.
I have to smile when NZ is described in terms of being a police state, I find it very naive. I guess the fact that people have the freedom to say such things without the fear of disappearing the next day is lost on those who subscribe to that line of thought.

ACC is far from perfect. You think those police officers who have private vehicles enjoy paying the ACC levy any more than you do? Sure there are popos who are complete arseholes. Show me a place of work devoid of arseholes. Its election year, when your local candidates come knocking ask them about their stance on this. Police do not make the laws they enforce legislation made by MPs. If you are going to get snotty with anyone let it be the politicians, at least that wont result in fines or demerits.

[imdying]

You don't think that's a tad hyperbolic? I dont think people are being shipped off in cattle trucks to the next country along to be gassed and then burned to a cinder.
I have to smile when NZ is described in terms of being a police state, I find it very naive. I guess the fact that people have the freedom to say such things without the fear of disappearing the next day is lost on those who subscribe to that line of thought.God you're a boring twat, enjoy some rep.

[Ulsterkiwi]

God you're a boring twat, enjoy some rep.

why thank you :rolleyes:

would rather be boring that a complete ignoramus who doesnt know how good he has it. Take your juvenile, 'the world owes me a living' attitude and shove it where the sun doesnt shine.

Is that better? :niceone:

[imdying]

Is this the first time you've come across somebody who doesn't give a fuck what you're saying, or should I give you further instruction? Perhaps you'd just like to preach some more dribble, cause I'm cool with that too

[Trade_nancy]

why thank you :rolleyes:

would rather be boring that a complete ignoramus who doesnt know how good he has it. Take your juvenile, 'the world owes me a living' attitude and shove it where the sun doesnt shine.

Is that better? :niceone:

I think it was

[TheDemonLord]

there simply aren't very many police in Christchurch. I understand the North Island is quite a lot further on in being policed like a Nazi state,

I call Godwin

</thread>

[imdying]

I call GodwinProbably fair if I'd called you a Nazi for your post, but in reality it's just some off topic old fool wanting to wax lyrical about young whipper snappers, and how when he was a boy during the troubles he knew what a real police state was wah wah :rolleyes:

[merv]

Well who thinks their insurance will cover them if they ride on an expired or on hold rego? That is the connection Mr Bogan.

[bogan]

Well who thinks their insurance will cover them if they ride on an expired or on hold rego? That is the connection.

Of course they will, rego status has nothing to do with vehicle roadworthyness or risk of accident.

[Ulsterkiwi]

Is there a correlation between vehicles with no WOF or Rego also not having insurance? I really dont know, I am curious.

I see Bogan's point but are insurance companies not infamous for finding reasons to avoid paying out? (or is that another urban myth?)

[Ulsterkiwi]

Probably fair if I'd called you a Nazi for your post, but in reality it's just some off topic old fool wanting to wax lyrical about young whipper snappers, and how when he was a boy during the troubles he knew what a real police state was wah wah :rolleyes:

Nope, wrong again.

[Oakie]

Not sure why anyone would be paying for rego on a bike these days. Not worth the silly expense. Like you said, if you do the maths you're almost always better off taking your chances.

I pay without breaking a sweat because:
A) it's my legal responsiblity to do so (just as it's my legal responsibility not to kick some people in the nuts even though they richly deserve it)
and
B) then I don't have to get nervous whenever a cop happens to be driving behind me

I just regard the ACC levy as medical insurance and income insurance wrapped into one and then it doesn't seem so bad.

[biketimus_prime]

I asked kiwibike about insurance and not having rego. They said it doesn't matter if you don't have registration as it's the road worthiness of the bike that matters. They did say though that even if you have a WOF, if the bike was unsafe at the time of the crash, and they deem that unsafe thing was partly or fully the cause of the accident, then that's an issue.


The person on the phone may have also said they have no registration on their bikes and rides them around all the time. Because the costs are BS, especially when you have multiple bikes.


I myself am notorious for letting my rego expire for a month or so at most, mainly because I'm a broke student. I always do pay up eventually though because I'm trying to keep a clean driving record since my boy racer days :whistle:
Easier to talk a cop out of at ticket for a few weeks of lapsed rego than a year's worth!

[strumpet]

Having no rego or WOF doesn't mean you won't be paid out by your insurance company,
in the event of an accident. Its whether your vehicle was roadworthy or not. If not, you're no chance of a payout. Google IAG's website and that'll confirm it. Its in the small print somewhere!

[motobob]

I pay without breaking a sweat because:
A) it's my legal responsiblity to do so (just as it's my legal responsibility not to kick some people in the nuts even though they richly deserve it)
and
B) then I don't have to get nervous whenever a cop happens to be driving behind me

I just regard the ACC levy as medical insurance and income insurance wrapped into one and then it doesn't seem so bad.

It is Insurance. Actually you don't realise the benefit of ACC until you need it. When I was in the Spinal unit there were 3 of us there. We sure appreciate the LOW cost of the ACC levy. Like tax it hurts to pay it but you do appreciate the benefits when they occur.

Still complaining definitely keeps the levy lower and so does not falling off your motorcycle.

[Mike.Gayner]

It is Insurance. Actually you don't realise the benefit of ACC until you need it. When I was in the Spinal unit there were 3 of us there. We sure appreciate the LOW cost of the ACC levy. Like tax it hurts to pay it but you do appreciate the benefits when they occur.

Still complaining definitely keeps the levy lower and so does not falling off your motorcycle.

Those who defend ACC levies, please explain why I need to pay them on my car AND my main motorbike AND my other motorbike. I get use them all at once - why wouldn't I just pay the highest levy and be done with it?

They can fuck themselves, frankly.

[Katman]

Those who defend ACC levies.....

I don't think that anyone is trying to defend the current ACC levies. I mean, no-one in their right mind would buy the theory that a DR650 is more deserving of a higher levy than a GSXR600.

What many of us accept though is that, regardless of the unfairness of it, the reality is that we have brought these increases upon ourselves.

If we stopped seeing ourselves as Mad Max road warriors we might gain a more favourable ear from TPTB.

[hayd3n]

last no reg i got was $100 and 35 demerits

[Ocean1]

Those who defend ACC levies, please explain why I need to pay them on my car AND my main motorbike AND my other motorbike. I get use them all at once - why wouldn't I just pay the highest levy and be done with it?

They can fuck themselves, frankly.

Yup. Looking at my business levy invoice atm too, adding that to a rough estimate for total cost across all accounts for this one miserable body produces a figure somewhere north of $7k.

Have you any idea how tempting it is to c/p the text from their letter declining cover for treatment for my torn ACL on the basis that it was a "pre existing" condition directly into their pro-forma remittance advice note along with a cheque for "fuck all" and bunging the lot in the mail?

Along with, possibly some medical texts Describing the likelihood of tearing ligaments progressively over several years...

[Voltaire]

Be keen to hear from anyone who got an insurance pay out with no rego or wof :jerry:
or maybe its a KB urban myth.
I think ACC charging levies on multiple vehicles sucks, it forces me to buy pre 1975 bikes.

[Ocean1]

If we stopped seeing ourselves as Mad Max road warriors we might gain a more favourable ear from TPTB.

Yeah right, along with all those rabidly delinquent diesel van drivers who have to pay well over the odds.

[Ocean1]

Be keen to hear from anyone who got an insurance pay out with no rego or wof :jerry:
or maybe its a KB urban myth.

Can't help you personally, but I know of a few unregistered vehicle claims that've been paid without question.

And one perfectly legal vehicle that was declined because the front tyres were unwarrantable.

[Mike.Gayner]

Be keen to hear from anyone who got an insurance pay out with no rego or wof :jerry:
or maybe its a KB urban myth.
I think ACC charging levies on multiple vehicles sucks, it forces me to buy pre 1975 bikes.

A few years ago I got into an accident in my car - some dick head backed out in front of me. He disputed liability so off to disputes we went. I had no WOF and that was his key defence. He lost, the adjudicator didn't want to know anything about it. The assessors had already photographed my (good) tyres and noted the car as road worthy. My insurance paid me, he didn't have insurance so presumably my insurance chased him for the bill. No excess either as I wasn't at fault.

[Katman]

Yeah right, along with all those rabidly delinquent diesel van drivers who have to pay well over the odds.

Hey, I don't claim to understand what the government's beef with diesel van drivers is but considering my immersion in the motorcycling culture of New Zealand, I can quite easily see why they believe they can crucify us with impunity.

[Ocean1]

Hey, I don't claim to understand what the government's beef with diesel van drivers is but considering my immersion in the motorcycling culture of New Zealand, I can quite easily see why they believe they can crucify us with impunity.

Exactly the same reason: both target groups have money.

And that's about the only reason. No fucking point in taxing poor fuckers, innit?

[Oakie]

Those who defend ACC levies, please explain why I need to pay them on my car AND my main motorbike AND my other motorbike. I get use them all at once - why wouldn't I just pay the highest levy and be done with it?

They can fuck themselves, frankly.

I'll go and fuck myself shortly after I explain - basically:

Assume 'they' have to collect $10,000,000 to cover our bike accidents
Also assume there are 40,000 motorbikes owned by 25,000 owners

If ACC levy was per bike then it's $10mil div by 40,000 = $250 per bike
If ACC levy was per owner then it's $10mil div by 25,000 = $400 per owner

So the result is that the majority of bike owners (who we assume have just one bike) would have to pay a lot more than they already do. ARGHHH! Possibly the one levy per person is arguable but with the poor people who can only afford one vehicle having their levies increased substantially to cover the levies from those of us who are better off and have perhaps a couple of cars, a bike for each day of the week and a cement mixer ... it would never fly. If you really want to go there, can you imagine the administrative nightmare sorting out who has to pay what given the different classes have different levy rates.. The costs invloved in that would be lumped in as an admin fee so we'd be even worse off.

Okay, off to fuck myself now. :rolleyes:

[Katman]

Exactly the same reason: both target groups have money.


Diesel van drivers are wealthy, are they?

What fucking planet are you on?

[Ocean1]

Diesel van drivers are wealthy, are they?

What fucking planet are you on?

The same planet where a comfortable majority of diesel vans are registered as company vehicles.

[Oakie]

What fucking planet are you on?

Ha ha ... reminds me of David Cunliffe on TV earlier this week ... "I don't know what planet John Key is on but it's sure not NZ". Rejoice ... Aotearoa has been promoted to 'planet' status!

[neels]

I'll go and fuck myself shortly after I explain - basically:

Assume 'they' have to collect $10,000,000 to cover our bike accidents
Also assume there are 40,000 motorbikes owned by 25,000 owners

If ACC levy was per bike then it's $10mil div by 40,000 = $250 per bike
If ACC levy was per owner then it's $10mil div by 25,000 = $400 per owner

So the result is that the majority of bike owners (who we assume have just one bike) would have to pay a lot more than they already do. ARGHHH! Possibly the one levy per person is arguable but with the poor people who can only afford one vehicle having their levies increased substantially to cover the levies from those of us who are better off and have perhaps a couple of cars, a bike for each day of the week and a cement mixer ... it would never fly. If you really want to go there, can you imagine the administrative nightmare sorting out who has to pay what given the different classes have different levy rates.. The costs invloved in that would be lumped in as an admin fee so we'd be even worse off.

Okay, off to fuck myself now. :rolleyes:
Make sure you make a good fist of it.

Still can't see the logic of paying the ACC levy for the motorcycle that is sitting in my garage while I'm out riding the other one. Can't be in 2 places at once. Same goes for 4 cars in a household of 3 drivers.

More logic would be to charge your motorcycle licence with an ACC levy, if not paid and you get caught then you get fined. If you don't intend to ride a motorcycle, put the levy on hold for a year, makes sense to me a there appears to be no relation in the current system between use and amount paid.

[Ocean1]

I'll go and fuck myself shortly after I explain - basically:

Assume 'they' have to collect $10,000,000 to cover our bike accidents
Also assume there are 40,000 motorbikes owned by 25,000 owners

If ACC levy was per bike then it's $10mil div by 40,000 = $250 per bike
If ACC levy was per owner then it's $10mil div by 25,000 = $400 per owner

So the result is that the majority of bike owners (who we assume have just one bike) would have to pay a lot more than they already do. ARGHHH! Possibly the one levy per person is arguable but with the poor people who can only afford one vehicle having their levies increased substantially to cover the levies from those of us who are better off and have perhaps a couple of cars, a bike for each day of the week and a cement mixer ... it would never fly. If you really want to go there, can you imagine the administrative nightmare sorting out who has to pay what given the different classes have different levy rates.. The costs invloved in that would be lumped in as an admin fee so we'd be even worse off.

Okay, off to fuck myself now. :rolleyes:

When you're done...

So all of those supposedly wealthy multiple vehicle owners cop it coming with the progressive income tax and then get stung going by being required to pay several times for the same product they subsidised in the first place?

One or t'other I could take.

[AllanB]

The main problem with the don't pay people is that they still complain. Shutup - you are not paying anything so stop bitching :bleh:

Myself on the other hand with a registered bike - I can bitch as it has actually cost me :banana:


Here's a good proposition for government, stop fining for not having registration - ACC covers medial payments - so if you don't register your vehicle and have a accident no free cover. Push the risk back to the vehicle owner - worth it?

[Katman]

The same planet where a comfortable majority of diesel vans are registered as company vehicles.

Why does that automatically equate to wealth?

[Katman]

Here's a good proposition for government, stop fining for not having registration - ACC covers medial payments - so if you don't register your vehicle and have a accident no free cover. Push the risk back to the vehicle owner - worth it?

Sounds fair to me.

[Ocean1]

Why does that automatically equate to wealth?

Because while there's plenty of private owners that can't afford higher rego costs there's no such thing as a business that can't afford them, they've simply got to either wear it or go under.

You only discover you've been taxing the "productive sector" too much when your economy starts shrinking... Oh, wait.

[Ocean1]

Here's a good proposition for government, stop fining for not having registration - ACC covers medial payments - so if you don't register your vehicle and have a accident no free cover. Push the risk back to the vehicle owner - worth it?

Here's a better one: give those that are charged more than most for a service what they fucking paid for.

[Voltaire]

Interesting that insurance companies are happy to pay out with no rego or wof if its not your fault, thought they would take the no rego or wof should not have been on the road in the first place view.
Annoys me the price of rego on my private diesel van more than bike rego, Commando and R90s are only $115 a year each, must be safer with those awesome 70's brakes :killingme

[AllanB]

Here's a better one: give those that are charged more than most for a service what they fucking paid for.

Ah - see the theory with high motorcycle ACC costs is that we are spending a disproportionally high amount on medical costs, thus get charged more. Fall off less ACC goes down......... in theory.

[neels]

Here's a better one: give those that are charged more than most for a service what they fucking paid for.
Yes please.

User pays, I pay more than others, get me to the front of the queue. Sadly even for a National government that's too anti-socialist.

[Ocean1]

Yes please.

User pays, I pay more than others, get me to the front of the queue. Sadly even for a National government that's too anti-socialist.

Probably. I'm just sick of paying for shit several times and then when I have need of the system I'm not eligible because I earn too much.

Think I'll tell the boss fuck.

Edit: And I'm not demanding special treatment, quite the reverse. I don't want to jump queues, I just want to be in them, same as all dem poor people.

[Ocean1]

Ah - see the theory with high motorcycle ACC costs is that we are spending a disproportionally high amount on medical costs, thus get charged more. Fall off less ACC goes down......... in theory.

It'll come as a bit of a shock to you but it's a theory that a small minority hold no truck with.

As I said if you want to understand the reasons behind tax structures look at the income profile of the particular tax target in question...

[Mike.Gayner]

I think it does void your insurance cover which may be worth the risk if you ride once a month or less but certainly not if you ride everyday.

Wrong. Shut up please.

[Voltaire]

If you only WOF your bike don't you run the risk of being chased for back registration as they record your odometer reading or do they accept you only rode off road if they ask to explain. The NZTA that is as I am sure the WOF guy would not care.

You could ring up, find out and report back to us :woohoo:
That way we don't have to read pages of " I heard" , " a mate said" etc.:niceone:

[bogan]

My particular policy does void the insurance if its unregistered so not all do then according to you? And no I will not shut up!!

Unregistered completely, or just rego on hold? What insurance are you with and what is the policy wording. Would hate for anybody to think you were just making shit up again right?

[Big Dog]

Those who defend ACC levies, please explain why I need to pay them on my car AND my main motorbike AND my other motorbike. I get use them all at once - why wouldn't I just pay the highest levy and be done with it?

They can fuck themselves, frankly.

Because that would be next to impossible to police and very easy to evade. Next thing all the cars at one house would belong to one driver.

Nothing that depends on the integrity of the owner will ever come to be as long as people go out of their way to avoid paying their fair share.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Ocean1]

Unregistered completely, or just rego on hold? What insurance are you with and what is the policy wording. Would hate for anybody to think you were just making shit up again right?

Also, I'd hate to let the opportunity pass for the insurance company to see their sales plummet when it becomes common knowledge they're imposing terms that have nothing to do with their clients risk profiles.

I'd actually heard that at least one company included that exclusion in their contract but, I mean, who's the fucking customer here? Change insurers for fuxache.

[AllanB]

Fair call re policy - read it - all of it as when you come to claim it will be that contract you have entered into that they reference.

I suspect it is not that far away from reality in NZ that there will be cameras scanning your rego sticker and auto billing you if it has expired. Or similar. Auckland's northern motorway runs a plate reading system for that toll road.

Each rego sticker has a barcode thing printed on it.......why?

[Berries]

It matches the one you were stamped with when you were born.

They're not stupid.

[Big Dog]

Fair call re policy - read it - all of it as when you come to claim it will be that contract you have entered into that they reference.

I suspect it is not that far away from reality in NZ that there will be cameras scanning your rego sticker and auto billing you if it has expired. Or similar. Auckland's northern motorway runs a plate reading system for that toll road.

Each rego sticker has a barcode thing printed on it.......why?

If I recall from a business course I did in the nineties, they were implemented to future proof for a proposed system that would allow for automated roadside tolling on the harbour bridge etc. via specialised scanners.
This was supposed to fund the construction of the northern ring route and other regional construction. Cars that failed to scan would have their photo taken at the next gantry and a person would manually send a slightly higher invoice. The toll plus processing fee.

A group of civil libertarians protested, they obviously had more pull than the current mob. A multi million dollar project was consigned to history over fears that the system was a little too 1984 and the data could be abused. There are still empty gantries around the motorways although many have been repurposed and some will be utilised for the new license plate recognition systems.

Because the system was canned the northern ring route was too and assorted off ramps sat incomplete. This plan was resurrected in the mid 2000s and the price of the civil liberty to not have our registration tracked has been we instead borrowed billions to do what would only have cost 1/2 a billion 20 years ago.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Voltaire]

Grates that 'they' add GST on.....how is rego and a ACC a goods or service.

[Ocean1]

Grates that 'they' add GST on.....how is rego and a ACC a goods or service.

As does IRD's insistence on calling me a "client".

[Trade_nancy]

Be keen to hear from anyone who got an insurance pay out with no rego or wof :jerry:
or maybe its a KB urban myth.
I think ACC charging levies on multiple vehicles sucks, it forces me to buy pre 1975 bikes.

Yep me. But on a cage accident. My wife ran up the date of a scooter at an intersection..rider stalled and the missus didn't stop in time. She was to blame. Car had expired WOF and rego..but only a couple of weeks to a month from memory. When I spoke to the insurer - TOWER on the phone - I told the girl - shit..just realised that my WOF and rego are out-of-date. She said - no matter we don't care about that unless your vehicle has a fault that caused the accident.

Be aware - if you DO have a WOF and have paid your rego..and you have a smash with another vehicle - you may not get insurance if your vehicle is found to have a defect such as bald tyres.

[Trade_nancy]

My particular policy does void the insurance if its unregistered so not all do then according to you? And no I will not shut up!!

What insurance company is that?

[imdying]

If you only WOF your bike don't you run the risk of being chased for back registration as they record your odometer reading or do they accept you only rode off road if they ask to explain. The NZTA that is as I am sure the WOF guy would not care.You can still WOF a bike that is on hold. I've had cars that went from 95,000km to 1,800km (rolled over a 5 digit odometer), so if the system can't even stomp that sort of mistake out, it seems unlikely they'll get their act together sufficiently to allow revenue chasing through that avenue.

[Swoop]

Here's a good proposition for government, stop fining for not having registration - ACC covers medial payments - so if you don't register your vehicle and have a accident no free cover. Push the risk back to the vehicle owner - worth it?

Perfectly fine... so long as those who have private insurance + medical cover are NOT asked to pay anything toward the gubbinment's system.

Likelihood of that happening: the same as Sue Badford winning the Miss World pageant.

[Erelyes]

My particular policy does void the insurance if its unregistered so not all do then according to you? And no I will not shut up!!

I presume you mean 'unlicenced' rather than 'unregistered'. Cos if you get pulled over by the Police in an unregistered vehicle you'll probably get more than $100/35. And be required to surrender your plates.

Now can you please back your shit up with facts and post your insurer's policy.

State's motorbike policy (http://www.state.co.nz/Policies/State_Motorcycle_Comprehensive_(SI1054-2)_0511.pdf) for example is silent on the WOF or Licence being expired. It does talk about roadworthiness.


Grates that 'they' add GST on.....how is rego and a ACC a goods or service.

If some poor nurse wiping Johnny Biker's arse for him when he's broken both his arms isn't a fucking service, then I don't know what is.

[AllanB]

Under the Clark Govt a decade back a election promise was to not add any taxes for their term in office. They got in and starting taxing away under the pretense of calling them 'levies' .......

ACC levy is the term. GST cannot be added on a tax as a tax by nature is not a service (even if the income derived is used to fund services) but a levy ...................

Tricky buggers those Government types.

[Voltaire]

If some poor nurse wiping Johnny Biker's arse for him when he's broken both his arms isn't a fucking service, then I don't know what is.

Well ACC don't fucking see it as a service. Its a tax. Do you get a bill with GST added when you go to the hospital?

Maybe they should charge drunks who turn up ?

http://www.acc.co.nz/about-acc/levies/

[Oakie]

Well ACC don't fucking see it as a service. Its a tax. Do you get a bill with GST added when you go to the hospital? http://www.acc.co.nz/about-acc/levies/

If it's a private hospital ... sure!

[awayatc]

User pays....?

I wish.

I wish I had a choice..

acc or private insurance

I be a bloody good risk

and would save a small fortune

pay for abuser more like it

[Akzle]

User pays....?

I wish.

I wish I had a choice..

acc or private insurance

I be a bloody good risk

and would save a small fortune

pay for abuser more like it

its like haiku

[Akzle]

i trust that the leaders i elect will make the correct economic decisions for the benefit of all. If, in their omnipotency, they have decided that motorcycle licensing should not be separate from ACC levy,
suck it up you gullible fucking morons.

[awayatc]

for whatever its worth
was riding along extremely well restrained,
cop tagged along behind me,
electronic gizzmos told him rego was out,
christmas lights came on,
and voila 1 more happy cop.

The name of the game...
I know

[awayatc]

i trust that the leaders i elect will make the correct economic decisions .

you trust the leaders you elect............?

that is so wrong on so many levels

funny though

[Nausea]

My particular policy does void the insurance if its unregistered so not all do then according to you?

You cannot void a policy or deny a claim because the registration is expired and even if it is written in your policy; it is illegal to do so under Section 11 of the Insurance Law Reform Act 1977.

the insured shall not be disentitled to be indemnified by the insurer by reason only of such provisions of the contract of insurance if the insured proves on the balance of probability that the loss in respect of which the insured seeks to be indemnified was not caused or contributed to by the happening of such events or the existence of such circumstances.

An expired registration alone cannot cause or contribute to a loss so the exclusion would not stand up if challenged. I have never encountered such an exclusion and it would be a very amateurishly written policy wording that included such a noob mistake. You sure you haven't confused it with road-worthiness?

Now this is different to misstatements made; or information withheld when taking out a policy but that is a different story and is about forming of the insurance contract itself.... but I can't be bothered getting into that right now haha.

[yevjenko]

For those of you that don't rego your bikes, be aware that the police are using auto plate recognition camera's in their cars these days that are programmed to alert the poppo that the plate is not rego'd

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[yevjenko]

User pays....?

I don't think it works like that... The crazy arse cyclists that get injured don't pay acc levies, neither do the social sports players, the hikers, the boaties etc.

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[yevjenko]

If you only WOF your bike don't you run the risk of being chased for back registration as they record your odometer reading or do they accept you only rode off road if they ask to explain. The NZTA that is as I am sure the WOF guy would not care.

You'll only be chased for outstanding rego if you don't register your bike off road. But be aware of the auto plate recognition camera's in police cars.

Also if you don't register the vehicle off road (or register it as a farm vehicle) then your registration will lapse after a year resulting in the vehicle needing to be complied to be able to be re-registered again, which can be expensive and will reduce the resale value of the bike.

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[yevjenko]

Wrong. Shut up please.

Fuck me you're a charming old bastard aren't ya...

At least you said please I suppose

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[Voltaire]

I don't think it works like that... The crazy arse cyclists that get injured don't pay acc levies, neither do the social sports players, the hikers, the boaties etc.

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I don't think there are many " crazy arse cyclists" who don't own a car, and if they don't that's one less vehicle on the road.
ACC say its a " No Fault" scheme, therefore everyone should pay the same.
I'd cycle more but for the 'crazy arse vehicles" driven by the inattentive, the amount of car and worse truck drivers I see on the phone is frightening.
They should fit some sort of blocker to vehicles so you just can't use the fucking phone.
rant over :woohoo:

[haydes55]

If you own more than one bike, say you lost the plates of one of the bikes, get as many extra plates as you need reproduced, rego that one bike, put the same plate on all of your bikes. Put the other regos on hold. 90% of cops won't know the difference, and just say you've been modifying it if you get a smart cop.

Of find a similar bike to yours in town parked outside of the pub, steal their number plate, they can get a new one, then slap the plate on your bike, use the random bikes rego.

I could see akzle doing that....

[Akzle]

I could see akzle doing that....

what is this, gang up on akzle week or something?

i wouldn't, because that would fuck up someone elses day, and i just dont claim that right. i would, however, not register shit and tell cops to gtfo.

[The Reibz]

For those of you that don't rego your bikes, be aware that the police are using auto plate recognition camera's in their cars these days that are programmed to alert the poppo that the plate is not rego'd

sent from my phone (so scuze auto correct typos)

Mount plate on angle or use infrared number plate bulbs. Problem solved.

[Voltaire]

http://images.sunfrogshirts.com/Work-Harder--Buy-a-Car.jpg

[vifferman]

User pays
But IS IT, though? I'd imagine (because I don't know what the facts are, and can't be bothered digging for them) that an awful lot of sportspersons have an awful lot of physio for strains, sprains, bruising, etc. How much ACC do they pay? Is it proportionate to the claims / costs/ risks?
I've been riding a motorbike for over 40 years, and I reckon my ACC claim costs for injuries received would be a fraction of the fees I've paid. On the other hand, I had over nine months of physio for a 'medical misadventure' that is bound to have recurring costs for years (possibly forever), because my shoulder's still fukt.

[Bassmatt]

But IS IT, though? I'd imagine (because I don't know what the facts are, and can't be bothered digging for them) that an awful lot of sportspersons have an awful lot of physio for strains, sprains, bruising, etc. How much ACC do they pay?

They pay ACC on their car rego.[/cyclist mode]

[Voltaire]

They pay ACC on their car rego.[/cyclist mode]

True, but thinking about it are not the risks of a bicycle higher than a car?.

I just read a article/rant in the Vintage Car mag saying cyclists should have rear vision mirrors instead of relying on the motorist.

seemed reasonable to me.

[Erelyes]

t an awful lot of sportspersons have an awful lot of physio for strains, sprains, bruising, etc. How much ACC do they pay?

1.45% of their income up to a threshold ($118k) then nothing more after that (http://www.ird.govt.nz/income-tax-individual/different-income-taxed/salaries-wages/acc/)

[Murray]

Question??? If all bike riders paid registration would there be a decrease in levies as the Fund would be more than sufficient?

If so are all these so called rebels costing us people that are registering?

[tri boy]

I despair that riders are actually debating this.
they, ( the powers that be) are fucking you up the arse, and yet, you debate it.
Just ride, wether you can afford a paper slip or not.

[yevjenko]

If you own more than one bike, say you lost the plates of one of the bikes, get as many extra plates as you need reproduced, rego that one bike, put the same plate on all of your bikes. Put the other regos on hold. 90% of cops won't know the difference, and just say you've been modifying it if you get a smart cop.


You can't get replacement plates as such. They cancel that number combination and give you a new one

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[quickbuck]

And one perfectly legal vehicle that was declined because the front tyres were unwarrantable.
Well, the second part of that sentence contradicts the first part...... So, they were quite within their rights not to pay out.

[Akzle]

If so are all these so called rebels costing us people that are registering?

no. YOU are costing you. By choosing to purchase it.

[Voltaire]

Question??? If all bike riders paid registration would there be a decrease in levies as the Fund would be more than sufficient?

If so are all these so called rebels costing us people that are registering?

They are just the same ones who moan about everything, KB ( Keyboard Basher) is mostly about wingeing more the motorcycles.

I used to register 3+ bikes all year, now I just do the one I'm using for 3 months. That's what most multiple bike owners are doing.

could swap plates around but I can't really be arsed for a few hundy a year.

[yevjenko]

I don't think there are many " crazy arse cyclists" who don't own a car, and if they don't that's one less vehicle on the road.

True, but that is the exact opposite the bike situation. They could be using the bike while someone else using their car and only one acc 'contribution' is being made



ACC say its a " No Fault" scheme, therefore everyone should pay the same.

Yeah right. Cos we pay the same a car drivers and the same social sports players




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[yevjenko]

i would, however, not register shit...

This would work... I remember one of the poppo on here saying the auto plate system is only keyed for rego on hold or over due rego not cancelled rego


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[yevjenko]

They pay ACC on their car rego.[/cyclist mode]

But not proportional to the claims. And how does that work for one car families?

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[yevjenko]

Question??? If all bike riders paid registration would there be a decrease in levies as the Fund would be more than sufficient?

If so are all these so called rebels costing us people that are registering?

In an ideal world maybe, but as we're not a big enough and consistent enough demographic to swing any votes so why would they risk the income stream

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[yevjenko]

I despair that riders are actually debating this.
they, ( the powers that be) are fucking you up the arse, and yet, you debate it.
Just ride, wether you can afford a paper slip or not.

Fine for you country boys... But when you're dealing with poppo's, unmarked's and over-fucking-zealous traffic wardens who ticket you for four hundy at 8am on a Sunday morning outside your house... fuckers...

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[Ocean1]

Well, the second part of that sentence contradicts the first part...... So, they were quite within their rights not to pay out.

No it doesn't, the car had a warrant but the tyres were just under minimum tread depth at the time of the accident.

As to whether they were within their rights to decline the claim, their assessor claimed the tyre's condition contributed to the accident. I claimed they didn't, because it was bone dry and traction wasn't really an issue in the accident.

I won.

[nerrrd]

User pays....?

I don't get this. I'm paying $500 a year to insure my bike for 10 grand, wouldn't I have to pay that for 20 years to cover the cost of writing it off under user pays? So all the other people paying into the same insurance company are subsidising me if have a crash.

Same with ACC - if a car driver is paying $200 a year in levies, then over 20 years they've only paid $4000. That's a drop in the bucket if they have any kind of serious injury (even a minor one these days), so they're being heavily subsidised by every other car driver as well.

You could never afford to cover your own costs either way.

[Katman]

No it doesn't, the car had a warrant but the tyres were just under minimum tread depth at the time of the accident.


Then it wasn't legally allowed to be operated on the road.

[yevjenko]

I don't get this. I'm paying $500 a year to insure my bike for 10 grand, wouldn't I have to pay that for 20 years to cover the cost of writing it off under user pays? So all the other people paying into the same insurance company are subsidising me if have a crash.

Same with ACC - if a car driver is paying $200 a year in levies, then over 20 years they've only paid $4000. That's a drop in the bucket if they have any kind of serious injury (even a minor one these days), so they're being heavily subsidised by every other car driver as well.

You could never afford to cover your own costs either way.

It doesn't work like that. It's two different operating models - the insurance company is there to make money for their shareholders and acc is there to pay bills. you're also assuming that everyone is expected to have an accident that will cost acc a fortune

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[Akzle]

This would work... I remember one of the poppo on here saying the auto plate system is only keyed for rego on hold or over due rego not cancelled rego


sent from my phone (so scuze auto correct typos)

iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii know. (well, i don't know about NPR, but i do know about driving an unregistered thingamebob.
interestingly, while the cops can't touch it, the council can tow it if you litter public land with it.

to register is to abandon.
if you abandon (title to) "your" vehicle to the state, then they can impose all manner of conditions when they lend it back to you. like how fast you can use it, and where and when. etcetera.

[Berries]

At the moment our levies are subsidising these car drivers.
Classic.

...

[Ocean1]

Then it wasn't legally allowed to be operated on the road.

Which is true of most vehicles over 5 years old currently on the road.

It also has nothing to do with the contract with my insurance company.

[Murray]

For car drivers that hit bikers if its their fault and they were fined more there would also be a decrease in levies by your logic too?

Well your logic has me totally confused. This must rate as one of your dumber posts!!

Car drivers being fined more would decrease ACC levies how?? Oh we put the fines into the ACC fund - brilliant!!

I restate my question in BASIC terms so you can understand. If all bike riders currently not paying registration, when they should be, (not bikes on hold etc), were to pay their registration would the ACC fund be increased to a level that there could be a reduction in ACC levies charged?

[yevjenko]

At the moment our levies are subsidising these car drivers.

Errr no. You're just making an assumption. ACC deliberately fudges the figures so you can't see the actual claims of motor cyclists vs the revenue generated.

And for those people saying user pays, how does something like a klr650 without the power to pull the skin off a rice pudding use more acc claim funds than an cbr600rr?

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[yevjenko]

If all bike riders currently not paying registration, when they should be, (not bikes on hold etc), were to pay their registration would the ACC fund be increased to a level that there could be a reduction in ACC levies charged?

Probably not. The normal state affairs is to invest surplus



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[Akzle]

And for those people saying user pays, how does something like a klr650 without the power to pull the skin off a rice pudding use more acc claim funds than an cbr600rr?

on my many and varied visits to medical facilities, i have never, NEVER seen a motorcycle in one.
so, who uses more ACC, people with big brass ones? or lawbiding n00bs on a 250?

which brings me squarely to the point of 'disincentive' tax on cigarettes... i've never seen a motorcycle smoke a cigarette, nor have i seen a cigarette ride a motorcycle, phucken gews.

[bogan]

Well your logic has me totally confused. This must rate as one of your dumber posts!!

Car drivers being fined more would decrease ACC levies how?? Oh we put the fines into the ACC fund - brilliant!!

I restate my question in BASIC terms so you can understand. If all bike riders currently not paying registration, when they should be, (not bikes on hold etc), were to pay their registration would the ACC fund be increased to a level that there could be a reduction in ACC levies charged?

Nah, cos it is not related to separate funds. They added a risk factor ages ago to make bikes more than cars by said factor, then were like oh well we'll actually just be 'nice' and not charge that much after all. So now that they are lowering car costs, they are still 'justified' not lowering bike costs because we already pay less than they think we should be.


Your post is just as dumb because if that was the case the reason for the announced drop in registration for cars would be because of more people now registering their cars when the truth would be more likely a drop in expensive accident claims or the National Party wanting to get votes.

Don't be fucking stupid (may be a difficult ask I know). His post was perfectly reasonable, the drop in car rego is because full funding is coming in at a decent rate, might be coincidence that it is occuring this year (almost certainly isn't) but it is dropped because the MVA has less 'shortfall' now than it did a year or two ago, and less shortfall means they can charge less.

[bogan]

Don't be so fucken stupid yourself based on your belief they are cutting reg for cars due to the much greater volume of them being registered each year and not so many bikes being registered. So there will always be more ACC money coming from car owners than bike owners Lets hope gas goes up high enough then to get a big enough number of people getting bikes so registration for bike owners goes down then by you and the other posters theory then eh. I think for you and him to get what I am on about you would need to have an accident where the car driver is at fault and then you would understand the unjust imbalance in fees and bike riders nearly always come off far worse than car drivers when they hit us.

Wat? of course there will be more cars and more money from cars, there are also more car payouts you douche-canoe.

[bogan]

The pay out per car v car accident would be far less in most cases compared to bikes and this would be their logic for making bikes pay more. How they consider a diesel 4WD just as dangerous in an accident as a big bike is a mystery but maybe like bikes they have to pay more as there is not so many on the road as petrol cars and 4WDs.

Actually it was about the same on average. That is not their logic for making bikes pay more. As I've already said, their logic is based on a calculated risk factor, not on new vehicle regos or whatever the fuck you're babbling on about.

[bogan]

It was the other poster that you agreed with that felt registration would be lower if more people owned registerable bikes and it goes to reason that if fewer people owned cars car registration would go up based on his logic does it not?

That was a quite reasonable question he asked, to which I answered (in disagreement btw, you illiterate fucksickle) since you decided it was a dumb question. You read too much into other people's logic for someone with such a loose grasp of the concept yourself. I mean logically you could also say if fewer people owned cars there would be fewer accidents too :rolleyes:

[Katman]

.....nor have i seen a cigarette ride a motorcycle.....

What about a fag on a Honda?

[thepom]

fag on a Honda.......ha ha that's good.....god I,m laughing my head off ......also wish I had not started the post cos its turned into a bitch fight...

[caspernz]

What about a fag on a Honda?

At least he'd be out riding, instead of waging a war of words like many tin soldiers on here...