Staying warm without getting bulky?

[Mike.Gayner]

As a soft fair-weather rider looking to lengthen my riding season, I'm seeking ways to stave off the cold. I don't want to buy big bulky touring gear, and I won't be riding in extreme cold or wet.

Presently I ride in my jeans and a summer jacket that has a thermal liner. That's not quite enough now so I'm adding thermal base layers top and bottom and a balaclava, but I'm still getting a bit cold. Is there anything else I can do without replacing my gear with heavy stuff? Does anyone recommend any particular thermal base layers? I'm presently using polyprop and have some cheap wool stuff that doesn't quite fit me right.

[Erelyes]

As a soft fair-weather rider looking to lengthen my riding season, I'm seeking ways to stave off the cold. I don't want to buy big bulky touring gear, and I won't be riding in extreme cold or wet.

Presently I ride in my jeans and a summer jacket that has a thermal liner. That's not quite enough now so I'm adding thermal base layers top and bottom and a balaclava, but I'm still getting a bit cold. Is there anything else I can do without replacing my gear with heavy stuff? Does anyone recommend any particular thermal base layers? I'm presently using polyprop and have some cheap wool stuff that doesn't quite fit me right.

Polyprop is shit. :sick: You wanna go merino man, trust me. Same or better thermal performance, except they won't stink after wearing them for two hours. Infact they won't stink after wearing em for two days :)

I got some merino thermals from the Warehouse, they do the trick. If you have the money I would recommend investing in Icebreaker though. Expensive but very good.

Beyond that, you also need something to block the wind. Some rainsuits will do a good job of this. Jeans won't!

[haydes55]

Get a new set of textile pants. Wind gets through denim/kevlar, it won't get through decent textiles.

[Ulsterkiwi]

what he said. try the outdoorsy places for deals on merino, icebreaker is heinous. Keeping the wind off is important. You could try for windproof thermals to wear under the jeans. Heated grips? warm hands make a hell of a difference.

[jellywrestler]

As a soft fair-weather rider looking to lengthen my riding season, I'm seeking ways to stave off the cold. I don't want to buy big bulky touring gear, and I won't be riding in extreme cold or wet.

Presently I ride in my jeans and a summer jacket that has a thermal liner. That's not quite enough now so I'm adding thermal base layers top and bottom and a balaclava, but I'm still getting a bit cold. Is there anything else I can do without replacing my gear with heavy stuff? Does anyone recommend any particular thermal base layers? I'm presently using polyprop and have some cheap wool stuff that doesn't quite fit me right.

quite simple, a heated jacket, wear the same shit as in summer and the jacket does the rest

[Stirts]

The Oxford Chill Out stuff is a pretty good wind blocker (not rear end wind of course) ...expensive but good quality and works.

297255

I believe Bayride have this stuff in stock.

[Hitcher]

People with 3XL heads can't wear balaclavas or neck warmers. Even a helmet that size only has enough room for a head. Neck warmers seal up the gap around the bottom of the helmet, exacerbating visor and eyeware fogging.

Even if you have textile riding pants (or leather for that matter) a decent pair of rain-proof overtrou will help keep your legs and nethers warm. I recommend the stuff that Macpac sells. It packs up nice and small and fits well over baggy biker gear. Ditto for Macpac's jackets, although the collars containing a parka hood can be a bit snug between shoulders and helmet.

[Mike.Gayner]

I have the benefit of a small head being a short-ass. I just bought this top from the local Suzi dealer: http://www.rst-moto.com/rst-thermal-wind-barrier-long-sleeve
It has a really nice fit and feel - if it's as good on the road as I hope then I will get the pants too.

[Gremlin]

No way will jeans keep you warm, even Draggin jeans keep you warmer, but none will match textile gear.

For keeping it lightweight, drop the thermals from the textiles. They're more bulky and not as good as proper thermals (as referenced above).

If that doesn't work, heated garments, although I tend to keep that for riding around zero degrees.

[iYRe]

++ merino.

As a cyclist and a motorcyclist I prefer it. I can cycle one hour into work, stink like a pigsty on a hot summers day, then at the end of the day put them back on with no stink.

I was given a cashmere sweater by a guy at work... works a bit like merino, but its warm.. and thin.. very warm, and very thin. Its also slightly water repellent, should any get inside your jacket.

also ++textiles

[AllanB]

What the heck does a XXXL head look like!

The Oxford stuff is good at blocking wind.

[nzspokes]

I read somewhere that Kevlar jeans dont work when wet. This could be BS but wherever I read it they sounding convincing.

But textiles are the go. They work well.

Worst comes to the worst, cut 3 holes in a rubbish bag and wear that.

[kevfromcoro]

Worst comes to the worst, cut 3 holes in a rubbish bag and wear that.[/QUOTE]

Done that before,,,

Also newspaper stuffed down your jacket.

Keeps the wind out.

2 million park drunks cant be wrong...

[gjm]

Several thin layers.
Look at the clothing worn by serious cyclists.

[AllanB]

Look at the clothing worn by serious cyclists.

He wants to be warm - not GAY

[oneofsix]

Several thin layers.
Look at the clothing worn by serious cyclists.

only if they are female :drool: They generate their own heat and raise my temp at the same time :msn-wink:

[Erelyes]

only if they are female :drool: They generate their own heat and raise my temp at the same time :msn-wink:

Google image search 'hot cyclists'. Sausagefest.

[GrayWolf]

As a soft fair-weather rider looking to lengthen my riding season, I'm seeking ways to stave off the cold. I don't want to buy big bulky touring gear, and I won't be riding in extreme cold or wet.

Presently I ride in my jeans and a summer jacket that has a thermal liner. That's not quite enough now so I'm adding thermal base layers top and bottom and a balaclava, but I'm still getting a bit cold. Is there anything else I can do without replacing my gear with heavy stuff? Does anyone recommend any particular thermal base layers? I'm presently using polyprop and have some cheap wool stuff that doesn't quite fit me right.

There's good advice here, I rode for 9 years in UK Winters,,
Thin layers, several of them. Merino, (we even used to steal the girlfriend/wife's tights in days of old). Layering traps warm air and slows down air loss/movement around the body.
Or if you want an alternative (but bloody expensive) Damart thermal gear, it's used by Everest and Arctic expeditions.

Gloves, Silk lining, or thermal under gloves. You cannot keep hands warm with shitty cheapo/thin gloves in cold weather. Also Over gloves/mitten's will help to keep hands dry and warm.

[ducatilover]

Get fit. Seems to work extremely well

[gjm]

He wants to be warm - not GAY

I said serious, not flamboyant! Lol
Besides, no-one is going to see it under the top-layer protective clothing.

[Urano]

if it's just a "bit" cold you're still feelin', a smart tip could be using the rainproof suit (even if it's not raining...)
it seals you from the freezing air.

normally, in winter i'll go for cotton tshirt, technical underwear (yes, OVER the tshirt...), long sleeve/high neck thick cotton shirt (the ones used under ski-suit), wind-proof polartech jacket, bike jacket.
then i'll keep up the shirt neck, put balaclava over it and close the pile over again.
it's not so bulky 'cause every layer is pretty thin.

for the lower part i use tech underwear and tech pants with alu thermal layer.

with this configuration i'm fine with outside temperatures as low as 0°.

using more layers permits you to add or take away stuff to center your needs.

[Erelyes]

normally, in winter i'll go for cotton tshirt, technical underwear (yes, OVER the tshirt...), long sleeve/high neck thick cotton shirt (the ones used under ski-suit), wind-proof polartech jacket, bike jacket.

I've heard of some commuters that want to go leather, so dress like...
> Work clothes
> Leather jacket/pants
> 'technical' rainproof/windproof insulated jacket and wateproof pants (ala macpac) over the top.

Thoughts, all?

[Nat]

quite simple, a heated jacket, wear the same shit as in summer and the jacket does the rest

Any specific recommendations for these? I'm saving up for one of these http://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/powerlet-rapidfire-jacket-liner-with-dual-wireless-controller-package at the moment, but a bit wary about buying any gear online seeing as I can't try it on or try it out.

Otherwise for the OP: my experience basically backs up what others have said - wool is best, jeans are rubbish at keeping the wind out, and many thin layers are better than one thick layer. I also highly recommend my rev'it wind stopper neck warmer thing that I got from motomail last year: http://www.motomail.co.nz/estore/style/rewincolfreeze.aspx

Also, fully faired bikes stop the wind much better and are therefore slightly warmer than naked ones! (True story)

[Ulsterkiwi]

if it's just a "bit" cold you're still feelin', a smart tip could be using the rainproof suit (even if it's not raining...)
it seals you from the freezing air.

normally, in winter i'll go for cotton tshirt, technical underwear (yes, OVER the tshirt...), long sleeve/high neck thick cotton shirt (the ones used under ski-suit), wind-proof polartech jacket, bike jacket.
then i'll keep up the shirt neck, put balaclava over it and close the pile over again.
it's not so bulky 'cause every layer is pretty thin.

for the lower part i use tech underwear and tech pants with alu thermal layer.

with this configuration i'm fine with outside temperatures as low as 0°.

using more layers permits you to add or take away stuff to center your needs.

I am always wary of cotton. I SCUBA dive using a drysuit. The adage there is 'cotton kills', the reason being if cotton gets wet (likely underwater) then its thermal qualities rapidly go into reverse, it actually draws heat away.
Given that the best of wet gear will fail at some point I would always suggest steer clear of cotton.
Polyprops are good, Merino is king. Even if damp or wet will retain heat.

[R650R]

Merino base layer is the only real option if your going to do it halfway without proper gear.
And you get what you pay for there are various weights of merino items out there. And some kind of windproof outlayer.
I often keep a polar fleece stuffed under back seat of GSXR as a last ditch outer layer over racesuit, makes just enough difference to be worthwhile but no sub for proper gear.
Soon as you make one part warmer you then realise how crap your boots or gloves are next...

[Big Dog]

Polyprop is shit. :sick: You wanna go merino man, trust me. Same or better thermal performance, except they won't stink after wearing them for two hours. Infact they won't stink after wearing em for two days :)

I got some merino thermals from the Warehouse, they do the trick. If you have the money I would recommend investing in Icebreaker though. Expensive but very good.

Beyond that, you also need something to block the wind. Some rainsuits will do a good job of this. Jeans won't!

In theory at least they have better thermal properties the more you wear them. I can confirm they are noticibly warmer in day 2. Very noticibly I you go on tramp and wear them for 5 days was them then wear them for another 2. The first day after a wash It is like you are only wearing poly props.

Poly props are only effective if you are moving. Merino due to their pour ours nature are effective as long as there is no wind or you have a wind breaker layer.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Big Dog]

I would also suggest if only slightly cold wearing a vest. Wool is best but micro fleece works. Theory here being if your core is warmer than your arms your blood flow will slow as your body is designed to do, this means your arms that are out in the wind lose less of your body heat.

I find this super effective.

And when really cold I wear a snug or similar loose around the neck. The uneven surface breaks up the airflow and stops you losing body heat out your neck. The size o my head prevents me wearing over my face but when I had a custom helmet I found ok silk scarves from the Salvation Army shop very effective.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Mike.Gayner]

Heaps of good info here, thanks.

[Urano]

I am always wary of cotton.
[...]
Given that the best of wet gear will fail at some point I would always suggest steer clear of cotton.
Polyprops are good, Merino is king. Even if damp or wet will retain heat.

i understand your position on cotton.
in my opinion though, unless you are going to ride in a monsoon for hours, it is pretty unlikely that water would soak you through the rainsuit (which you should put on as soon as it starts raining), the technical jacket, AND the windproof polartech.
on the other side, if i use synthetic tech underwear directly on the skin i'll smell like a merino sheep after 30 secs...

merino is good. really.
i tend not to use it thoroughly only because a) it's normally thicker than others material (even if not dramatically...), b) it suffers repeated washing and c) it's pretty expensive.
beside these points i can totally endorse its use... :niceone:

[husaberg]

Best i say Layers and merino.....



What the heck does a XXXL head look like!
below i think they are in season too approach with caution.......

[ducatilover]

My Norsewear thermals made from stuff keep me warm when it is really cold. But I usually don't get cold under my leathers, or very wet at all.

[Ocean1]

I've heard of some commuters that want to go leather, so dress like...
> Work clothes
> Leather jacket/pants
> 'technical' rainproof/windproof insulated jacket and wateproof pants (ala macpac) over the top.

Thoughts, all?

Works well, as long as the leather fits, which it won't for both wearing over work stuff and not.

Personally I use a perforated leather jacket in summer and Buffalo Endurance composite jacket in the winter: http://bigbikemad.com/buffalo-endurance-4-season-leather--textile-suit.html

That, and a polyurethane rain suit that lives under the seat is all it takes.

[BMWGSER]

Merino base layers then a soft shell jacket . Beyond brand 3layer from Torpedo7 $39.90 very light and water proof so far. Kathmandu long cycle pants are very comfy and warm and breathe.
Get rid of the jeans and go for Goretex top brand riding pants /jacket, check out trade Me some bargains pop up there from time to time . No such thing as bad whether just bad riding gear.

[Mike.Gayner]

Thanks to the advice in the thread I've been able to fine tune my gear for warmth. I got out to test my new set-up this weekend, but the weather was surprisingly warm so it wasn't a very good test. Still I think I've got myself sorted. Most importantly, I re-discovered the (removable) waterproof liner for my jacket, which blocks virtually all of the wind for my top half. I also purchased this weekend a pair of Macpac tights in special - these are insanely warm and make an EXCELLENT base layer, or mid over merino. These are the ones: http://www.macpac.co.nz/mens/mens-pants-and-shorts/mens-performance-tights.html

My new gettup in the picture below, from the top-left is:

Jacket
Jacket waterproof liner
Jacket thermal liner
Thermal/wind resistant mid layer
Merino base layer


And the bottom layer:

Jeans
Really awesome Macpac tights
Merino base layer
Thick wool socks


And of course my leather boots and balaclava to finish off. The weak point by far now is my gloves.

http://i.imgur.com/bbRgXdu.jpg

[pritch]

A balaclave is not a great idea, they compress the helmet liner so when you wear the hat sans liner it is loose. Might not happen over night but it will happen.
Even if using the Zegna silk version.

I tend to use the "Buff" type of thing over the lower part of my face. Not if it's raining though the water will wick down the material and end up inside the jacket.

[Motu]

So if you let your hair grow a bit long between cuts your helmet is fucked ?

[pritch]

So if you let your hair grow a bit long between cuts your helmet is fucked ?

I haven't got that much hair. Someone with a do like the late Simoncelli may have experienced that problem.

[R650R]

I bought one of those oxford balaclava helmet liner type things.
He's right it does massively tighten helmet fit, so much that if I went that route again I'd have a separate winter helmet.
Also over time it seems to have compressed the liner fabric to point where its not that warm as when first bought it.
Since then I've got a shoei XR1100 and with vents closed seems warmer in winter than the xr1000 was for some reason.
I can be lazy in the haircut dept and find doesn't really affect helmet fit but the balaclava thing sure did, hair on its own seems to deform off into vent gaps etc to some degree where the balaclava thing instantly expands the whole diameter every which way.
Good core warmth and a scarf of some description takes care of the head.

[Mike.Gayner]

I'm not too worried around the balaclava because this helmet has a slightly loose fit anyway - fits much better with the balaclava. I will be getting a new helmet in spring and this one will become my "winter helmet" as R500R suggests.

[Motu]

I've gone from long hair and a ponytail to bald with a No1, with or without balaclava my helmets all fit the same.

[Urano]

A balaclave is not a great idea, they compress the helmet liner so when you wear the hat sans liner it is loose.

actually it would be a better idea to always wear a balaclava...
when i buy an helmet i try it on with my balaclava, so i get the right fit.
in winter is a must, as in your neck run a lot of huge vessels and you can loose a lot of heat if you don't wear a good protection.
on the other hand, in summertime i wear a bandana under my helmet, partly for hygienic reasons (ya, there are fully detachable inner liner, but an helmet gets HOT and i sweat a lot: i can throw the bandana in the washer once every three or four day, if i strip down the helmet and wash it every three days it'll disintegrate in a month...) and partly because, opposite to the wintertime, it's pretty easy to damp it to get refreshment...

my suggestion is to always wear something between your head and the helmet.
(by the way... 85% of the bikers has an helmet too large or incorrectly fitted for his head... :psst: )

[Erelyes]

my suggestion is to always wear something between your head and the helmet.

I agree. I wear an Icebreaker merino neck tube unless I'm wearing balaclava (similar thickness).

Advantage of the neck tube is that when it's farkin hot you can wet the thing down a bit and hey presto, it acts to cool you :cool:

After all, that's what your sweat is trying to do....

[Juniper]

As a soft fair-weather rider looking to lengthen my riding season, I'm seeking ways to stave off the cold. I don't want to buy big bulky touring gear, and I won't be riding in extreme cold or wet.

Presently I ride in my jeans and a summer jacket that has a thermal liner. That's not quite enough now so I'm adding thermal base layers top and bottom and a balaclava, but I'm still getting a bit cold. Is there anything else I can do without replacing my gear with heavy stuff? Does anyone recommend any particular thermal base layers? I'm presently using polyprop and have some cheap wool stuff that doesn't quite fit me right.

I have found the best mix!!! As a chick I don't want bulk either (that and my leathers wont take much more bulk......I'll have to lose weight next!!)

200+ denier stockings and a pair of merino leggings. Cheaper than those expensive skins you can buy. Stockings are about $15 from supermarket.

Ive found the trick is layers not thickness. The above are basically skin tight with no bulk but leave you heaps of room to move.

[GrayWolf]

I have found the best mix!!! As a chick I don't want bulk either (that and my leathers wont take much more bulk......I'll have to lose weight next!!)

200+ denier stockings and a pair of merino leggings. Cheaper than those expensive skins you can buy. Stockings are about $15 from supermarket.

Ive found the trick is layers not thickness. The above are basically skin tight with no bulk but leave you heaps of room to move.

Stockings??
Welcome to what we 'knew' 40-50yrs ago.... Stockings are good Winter shit!!! (Suspender belt and garter are optional) :innocent:

[Theantidote]

All really good ideas...but as far as doing it on a budget head to the op shop and hunt out some really good merino shit...got some good branded awesome shite for next to nothing...junichick thingo is right stockings work well but look shit unless you shave your legs and beyond...wife wont let me wear hers coz i leave narly hairs in hers....

[St_Gabriel]

Another good tip if you have a few spare beanies, cut the top out of one and voila, instant neck warmer. :D

[Paul in NZ]

May a well add my 2cents..

Don't stress about being bulky. I'm happy to look like a sack of lumpy shit as long as I'm warm. But I'm old and value warmth above the admiration of others.

As long as your outer layer is wind proof and your inner layer is warm a bit of an air gap is no problem, too tight and you get cold.

Ditto the kathmanu cycle tights. Lycra and merino - they are awesome beyond awesome and worth every penny. I look like a over stuffed sausage on my mtb but even without an outer layer I have NEVER been cold with these. FUCKIN amazing things. Also my Japanese friend sent me these weird skivvy things for Vicki and me... Holy crp - wish they were not made of recycled whales...

Heated grips.... Fuck me.... how did I live without these things...

[neels]

My winter get up is a silk balaclava, thermal base layer, light polar fleece under wind proof jacket and leather jacket, textile pants and if its really cold wind proof over pants. Haven't found really good glove liners yet, and toes still get cold :-(

Sent from my electric telephone

[Maha]

Get a new set of textile pants. Wind gets through denim/kevlar, it won't get through decent textiles.

Textile pants coupled with an wool lined Oilskin vest (which I have for sale) over your jacket, you can go for a ride anywhere in the south island (or in Auckland for that matter) today, and not feel the cold.

[Juniper]

All really good ideas...but as far as doing it on a budget head to the op shop and hunt out some really good merino shit...got some good branded awesome shite for next to nothing...junichick thingo is right stockings work well but look shit unless you shave your legs and beyond...wife wont let me wear hers coz i leave narly hairs in hers....

200 Denier stockings are more like legings/skins just cheaper lol!!!!


FUCKIN amazing things. Also my Japanese friend sent me these weird skivvy things for Vicki and me... Holy crp - wish they were not made of recycled whales...

Heated grips.... Fuck me.... how did I live without these things...

That reminds me!!! My old flatmate gets this stuff from Taiwan that he swears by, for the life of me I cannot remember what they are!!


Wish I had heated grips on today. Even with the winter gloves on they were ouchy cold.

[Mike.Gayner]

Had my first properly chilly ride to work this morning (on the A7) using my new gettup (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/167024-Staying-warm-without-getting-bulky?p=1130724521#post1130724521). Legs held up fine, torso and head were toasty and holy hell my hands were solid blocks of painful ice. Yup, time for winter gloves.

That was in frosty Tauranga. Estimated temperature range 4-8 degrees I guess.

[george formby]

Not sure if it's been mentioned and I'm not going to read the whole thread but on a nut shrivelling morning like today a huge steaming bowl of porridge will keep you warm from the inside for ages. True story.

[Big Dog]

A guy I used to go to poly tech with used to swear by a hot water bottle. Too much effort if you ask me. Being in leather, bib and brace, Brando jacket and Johnny Reb boots with warehouse rain covers where appropriate and a silk scarf, jumping jacks once I was suited up to get the blood flowing and store some body heat in the leather. Riding through some of the valleys was sub zero. Often my gloves would freeze onto the grips.

I used to get to poly tech, pry my gloves off, by the time I made it up the stairs I was all set to sit in class in a sleeveless t.
The first year not so fortunate as I was only in jeans. Sometimes wondered if I would ever see my balls again. And if so would they work? 5 kids later I guess so.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[HenryDorsetCase]

if it's just a "bit" cold you're still feelin', a smart tip could be using the rainproof suit (even if it's not raining...)
it seals you from the freezing air.

normally, in winter i'll go for cotton tshirt, technical underwear (yes, OVER the tshirt...), long sleeve/high neck thick cotton shirt (the ones used under ski-suit), wind-proof polartech jacket, bike jacket.
then i'll keep up the shirt neck, put balaclava over it and close the pile over again.
it's not so bulky 'cause every layer is pretty thin.

for the lower part i use tech underwear and tech pants with alu thermal layer.

with this configuration i'm fine with outside temperatures as low as 0°.

using more layers permits you to add or take away stuff to center your needs.

cotton is the worst fabric you can have next to your skin. If you are allergic to wool (some ar) then a better option is some of the technical man made fibres

[tippersv]

Wish I had heated grips on today.
I will not own a bike without them again............