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george formby
16th June 2014, 16:23
Talk about muddying the waters. The subject of this article & the potential consequences shits me more than the slim risk of an oil spill.

https://nz.finance.yahoo.com/news/zealand-may-kick-start-race-mine-ocean-floor-211229873--finance.html

If there is an existing thread on this, mods, my apologies. Make them one.

awa355
16th June 2014, 16:44
Do we want NZ to lead the way in possibly destorying the last natural resource on the planet? Seems like it is going to happen anyway.

Corporate greed is likely to continue untill there is nothing left. :(

george formby
16th June 2014, 16:50
Do we want NZ to lead the way in possibly destorying the last natural resource on the planet? Seems like it is going to happen anyway.

Corporate greed is likely to continue untill there is nothing left. :(

Decision to be made on Wednesday oy tink. Loads of time for the nation to discuss pros & cons. How very public minded.

oldrider
16th June 2014, 17:06
Do we want NZ to lead the way in possibly destorying the last natural resource on the planet? Seems like it is going to happen anyway.

Corporate greed is likely to continue untill there is nothing left. :(

What do you suggest we do ... leave all the natural resources where they are and starve to death in the darkness and cold! :confused:

Corporate greed is generally in response to consumer need ... have you no needs what so ever! :mellow:

mashman
16th June 2014, 17:06
($1 = 1.1562 New Zealand Dollars)

Akzle
16th June 2014, 17:49
i hope they pay their taniwha tax, then its all G.


...G for gew. that is.

fuck, some old white guys just need to be shot.

Robert Taylor
16th June 2014, 18:23
What do you suggest we do ... leave all the natural resources where they are and starve to death in the darkness and cold! :confused:

Corporate greed is generally in response to consumer need ... have you no needs what so ever! :mellow:

Corporate greed is very real but there are many companies that also have a responsible ethic. What all of these people bleating from their socialist households forget is that the tax take generated largely by business and the employees of those businesses is what funds our safety nets ( and beyond safety nets ) of welfare and constantly revisited / topped up treaty settlements.

Nothing is perfect but you dont shut down the means of earning tax dollars and employing people

Robert Taylor
16th June 2014, 18:30
i hope they pay their taniwha tax, then its all G.


...G for gew. that is.

fuck, some old white guys just need to be shot.

Yes and your lot were very good at killing each other, killing more of each other than the white man ever did. Your hypocrisy is breathtaking.

If the white man is so bad ( and doubtless part of your own bloodstream ) I suggest you go back to your leaky flax huts and huddle around your smoky fires. Its attitudes such as yours that really rile the many mixed race people of this country who just want to get on with life and be New Zealanders. They dont want to hear all of this divisive racial bullshit that you are mindlessly espousing.

And if your white blood that you will have a percentage of is so bad might I suggest suicide as an option?

Katman
16th June 2014, 18:42
What all of these people bleating from their socialist households forget is that the tax take generated largely by business and the employees of those businesses is what funds our safety nets ( and beyond safety nets ) of welfare and constantly revisited / topped up treaty settlements.


Lets not forget about the billions of tax dollars that many of the largest New Zealand companies are masters at evading.

Robert Taylor
16th June 2014, 18:46
Lets not forget about the billions of tax dollars that many of the largest New Zealand companies are masters at evading.

And the employment they provide ( but Im not justifying tax evasion which happens at ALL levels of society )

awa355
16th June 2014, 18:51
What do you suggest we do ... leave all the natural resources where they are and starve to death in the darkness and cold! :confused:

Corporate greed is generally in response to consumer need ... have you no needs what so ever! :mellow:

Well, we have managed not to starve to death so far without sea bed mining.

The so called ' consumer need ' is generated by the very same corporations that want the excuse to mine the sea bed. There's a big difference between needs and wants.

Laava
16th June 2014, 18:52
Yes and your lot were very good at killing each other, killing more of each other than the white man ever did. Your hypocrisy is breathtaking.

If the white man is so bad ( and doubtless part of your own bloodstream ) I suggest you go back to your leaky flax huts and huddle around your smoky fires. Its attitudes such as yours that really rile the many mixed race people of this country who just want to get on with life and be New Zealanders. They dont want to hear all of this divisive racial bullshit that you are mindlessly espousing.

And if your white blood that you will have a percentage of is so bad might I suggest suicide as an option?

Haha classic! Bet he's whiter than you are and mid thirties at a guess. About right Rob?(axle, not you robert)

Maha
16th June 2014, 19:04
And if your white blood that you will have a percentage of is so bad might I suggest suicide as an option?

Blood is red, it is a pigment called melanin that determines skin colour, not blood.

mashman
16th June 2014, 19:08
Well, we have managed not to starve to death so far without sea bed mining.

The so called ' consumer need ' is generated by the very same corporations that want the excuse to mine the sea bed. There's a big difference between needs and wants.

I see truth in them thar hills... yet the force is strong with the gods of marketing and advertising.

Paul in NZ
16th June 2014, 19:20
Bottom trawling has pretty well rooted most of it anyway.... Why not...

bluninja
16th June 2014, 19:24
Blood is red, it is a pigment called melanin determines skin colour.

erythrocytes (red blood cells) are red when oxygenated and give blood it's red colour. Plasma is a yellow straw coloured liquid, platelets are creamy coloured. Not sure what colour white blood cells are :eek5: So 55% of blood is yellowish.....so how come blood doesn't look orange?

puddytat
16th June 2014, 19:47
Some ( well most) people react negatively when challenged, in that they can sound like Luddites.
More often than not though, they are the very ones who usually lay that kind of shit on others who want to change the World.
It is them that stop, any kind of rational , ethical & moral advancement caused by all the shit we're doing.
They are denying change.

Meanwhile....
We are being short changed.
There are those amongst us who do not agree with the present course, & want a sustainable future. But they are seen as the Luddites, whereas if the truth be known, it is their accusers that are holding us back.

oldrider
16th June 2014, 19:48
Well, we have managed not to starve to death so far without sea bed mining.

The so called ' consumer need ' is generated by the very same corporations that want the excuse to mine the sea bed. There's a big difference between needs and wants.

Like all the unemployed that "want" jobs to help them tend to their "needs"! ... What goes round comes round.

To take away all the corporations would be like taking the oxygen out of the air ... these things are what they are for a reason! :shifty:

Agree that there still have to be checks and ballances to keep things transparent honest and tidy but to condemn every corporation as evil is a bit OTT isn't it? :confused:

Ocean1
16th June 2014, 19:51
Do we want NZ to lead the way in possibly destorying the last natural resource on the planet? Seems like it is going to happen anyway.

Corporate greed is likely to continue untill there is nothing left. :(

And you're completely innocent of consuming anything requiring the resources in question, eh?


Lets not forget about the billions of tax dollars that many of the largest New Zealand companies are masters at evading.

Got references showing all that tax evasion?

Only, it's the sort of thing the feds would be extremely interested in knowing about.

mashman
16th June 2014, 20:07
Got references showing all that tax evasion?

Here's (http://asiancorrespondent.com/3095/westpac-loses-nz-tax-avoidance-case/) 1 of 'em, technically more than 1 but hey, I doubt there would be more, or they'd have been caught because there are no loopholes right?

mashman
16th June 2014, 20:07
Some ( well most) people react negatively when challenged, in that they can sound like Luddites.
More often than not though, they are the very ones who usually lay that kind of shit on others who want to change the World.
It is them that stop, any kind of rational , ethical & moral advancement caused by all the shit we're doing.
They are denying change.

Meanwhile....
We are being short changed.
There are those amongst us who do not agree with the present course, & want a sustainable future. But they are seen as the Luddites, whereas if the truth be known, it is their accusers that are holding us back.

OMG truth overload, truuuuuuuuuuuth overloooooaaaaadddddd

Katman
16th June 2014, 20:13
Got references showing all that tax evasion?

Only, it's the sort of thing the feds would be extremely interested in knowing about.

Go do some searching for yourself.

It's generally accepted that tax evasion is costing the country somewhere in the region of 6 billion dollars.

Ocean1
16th June 2014, 20:26
Here's (http://asiancorrespondent.com/3095/westpac-loses-nz-tax-avoidance-case/) 1 of 'em, technically more than 1 but hey, I doubt there would be more, or they'd have been caught because there are no loopholes right?

Yes. Not a NZ company in sight.

Nor have they avoided the tax in question, apparently.

Ocean1
16th June 2014, 20:28
Go do some searching for yourself.

It's generally accepted that tax evasion is costing the country somewhere in the region of 6 billion dollars.

You're the one claiming NZ companies evade billions in tax, you fucking research it.

You never know, you might even learn something.

Katman
16th June 2014, 21:10
You're the one claiming NZ companies evade billions in tax, you fucking research it.

You never know, you might even learn something.

I suppose it shouldn't come as any surprise to me that you consider yourself smarter than those at Victoria University who conducted a study on tax evasion in New Zealand.

Ocean1
16th June 2014, 21:19
I suppose it shouldn't come as any surprise to me that you consider yourself smarter than those at Victoria University who conducted a study on tax evasion in New Zealand.

Imagine my shock at your failure to deliver. :yawn:

Akzle
16th June 2014, 21:19
Corporate greed is very real but there are many companies that also have a responsible ethic. What all of these people bleating from their socialist households forget is that the tax take generated largely by business and the employees of those businesses is what funds our safety nets ( and beyond safety nets ) of welfare and constantly revisited / topped up treaty settlements.

Nothing is perfect but you dont shut down the means of earning tax dollars and employing people
by christ. i hope you work 365.
you know the weekend is just qa socialist labour -party driven con, for all those lazy mooching so-and-so's, you're completely right, white guys should fuck the whole earth for money. great fucking idea.

Yes and your lot were very good at killing each other, killing more of each other than the white man ever did. Your hypocrisy is breathtaking.

If the white man is so bad ( and doubtless part of your own bloodstream ) I suggest you go back to your leaky flax huts and huddle around your smoky fires. Its attitudes such as yours that really rile the many mixed race people of this country who just want to get on with life and be New Zealanders. They dont want to hear all of this divisive racial bullshit that you are mindlessly espousing.

And if your white blood that you will have a percentage of is so bad might I suggest suicide as an option?
my lot? you don't have a fucking clue, and all this counter-intelligent, shit you spout about whites being a more advanced/civilised society?? back under your rock, knuckledragger.
and the dis-ingenious argument twice debunked already, that all modernity should be forsaken because "white guys brung it"... fuck sake.

Winston001
16th June 2014, 21:25
Do we want NZ to lead the way in possibly destorying the last natural resource on the planet? Seems like it is going to happen anyway.

Corporate greed is likely to continue untill there is nothing left. :(

Disagree about "corporate greed" - it's just business which is what enables you and I to ride motorcycles and tap away on extraordinary pieces of plastic and metal.

I do however agree that some business managers are amoral (or neutral) regarding any responsibilities to cherish the environment, pay taxes, and be fair employers. I lay the blame at the feet of the Harvard Business School and their Master of Business Administration (MBA) degree which has spread throughout the world. Selfishness 101.

Katman
16th June 2014, 21:25
Imagine my shock at your failure to deliver. :yawn:

Probably on par with my shock at your failure to do any research of your own.

Akzle
16th June 2014, 21:33
nah you


nah you


nah you


nah you


nah you


nah you


nah you


nah you


nah you



:girlfight:
fuckoff, dicks.

mashman
17th June 2014, 08:00
Yes. Not a NZ company in sight.

Nor have they avoided the tax in question, apparently.

Cool... that means that that sort of shit doesn't happen... I'll sleep so much better tonight.

Robert Taylor
17th June 2014, 08:37
by christ. i hope you work 365.
you know the weekend is just qa socialist labour -party driven con, for all those lazy mooching so-and-so's, you're completely right, white guys should fuck the whole earth for money. great fucking idea.

my lot? you don't have a fucking clue, and all this counter-intelligent, shit you spout about whites being a more advanced/civilised society?? back under your rock, knuckledragger.
and the dis-ingenious argument twice debunked already, that all modernity should be forsaken because "white guys brung it"... fuck sake.

And unlike your rantings I've got the courage to be up front about who I am. The racism is happening from your corner.

There are plenty of crocodiles in the swamp chomping at taxpayer dollars, instead of just fending off those that approach the boat maybe the swamp should be drained

Ocean1
17th June 2014, 11:34
Cool... that means that that sort of shit doesn't happen... I'll sleep so much better tonight.

What sort of shit? Tax avoidance? I indulge as heavily as possible at every opportunity I get, the fuckers get far more from me than is reasonable.

Tax evasion, not so much.

When you grow up someone might explain the difference.

Tazz
17th June 2014, 11:40
We don't even know the half of what's down there and we want to drag some dredges through it. Typical.


The racism is happening from your corner.

Might be that it just seems so normal to you to splash a bit of racism around that you don't even notice you're doing it...ignorance is bliss as they say.

george formby
17th June 2014, 11:57
We don't even know the half off what's down there and we want to drag some dredges through it. Typical.
.


Godzilla!

Yeah but na. An industry & technology in it's infancy targeting isolated impoverished island nations with promises of wealth and no collateral damage.
No really big mining corps behind it yet. Possibly waiting to learn how not to do it first. What could possibly go wrong extracting vast quantities of rock & sediment from around volcanoes on the ocean floor?

I'm not a hat knitting, tree hugging, beardie. I like flicking a switch and having light, hot showers are nice, too. Common sense, transparency & responsibility are all I ask.

I am confused as to why this decision is being made with no obvious discussion when there is a huge furore over oil & gas exploration. Established & regulated (ish) industries.

Underwater diggers? Sound bloody cool, wonder if they will be yellow?

mashman
17th June 2014, 12:24
What sort of shit? Tax avoidance? I indulge as heavily as possible at every opportunity I get, the fuckers get far more from me than is reasonable.

Tax evasion, not so much.

When you grow up someone might explain the difference.

I know you do.

Bottom line tax avoidance and tax evasion are both morally desperate acts that the entitlement brigade avail themselves of in order to feel as though they are getting what they deserve. Kind of sad really, but then I guess a parent's love only go so far.

mashman
17th June 2014, 13:52
What sort of shit? Tax avoidance? I indulge as heavily as possible at every opportunity I get, the fuckers get far more from me than is reasonable.

Tax evasion, not so much.

When you grow up someone might explain the difference.

And have some more companies "avoiding tax" (https://nz.finance.yahoo.com/news/hirepool-settles-tax-dispute-ahead-224900720.html)... funny how tax avoidance is legal yet these guys had to settle. Bunch of selfish white muthafuckas sucking NZ dry under their entitlement complex as an excuse to do so. So very pathetic.

Akzle
17th June 2014, 14:37
And have some more companies "avoiding tax" (https://nz.finance.yahoo.com/news/hirepool-settles-tax-dispute-ahead-224900720.html)... funny how tax avoidance is legal yet these guys had to settle. Bunch of selfish white muthafuckas sucking NZ dry under their entitlement complex as an excuse to do so. So very pathetic.

:Oi: fuckup, it's dem negro beneficiaries who are a drain on society's monies doncha know

Robert Taylor
17th June 2014, 16:05
We don't even know the half off what's down there and we want to drag some dredges through it. Typical.



Might be that it just seems so normal to you to splash a bit of racism around that you don't even notice you're doing it...ignorance is bliss as they say.

If being one of the enormous number of hard working New Zealanders ( of many blood streams not just ''white guys'' ) that are sick to death of the rort from revision of history and constant unjustifiable handouts then yes Ill happily be called a racist. But realist is a more appropriate term.

As for tax evasion its clear that there are a few here that are smoking some ''good stuff''. Are you paying tax on that?

It seems there are a few people living in glass houses

mashman
17th June 2014, 16:11
:Oi: fuckup, it's dem negro beneficiaries who are a drain on society's monies doncha know

Ahhhhhh but most of their cash, if not all, goes straight back into the local economy.

oldrider
17th June 2014, 16:26
Ahhhhhh but most of their cash, if not all, goes straight back into the local economy.

True! It's designed that way too! :yes:

Winston001
17th June 2014, 16:29
Yeah but na. An industry & technology in it's infancy targeting isolated impoverished island nations with promises of wealth and no collateral damage.

What could possibly go wrong extracting vast quantities of rock & sediment from around volcanoes on the ocean floor?

I'm not a hat knitting, tree hugging, beardie...Common sense, transparency & responsibility are all I ask.

I am confused as to why this decision is being made with no obvious discussion when there is a huge furore over oil & gas exploration. Established & regulated (ish) industries.


I'm with you George. This proposal has been under way for a while but as you say, appears to have been ignored by the general public.

Iron is one of the most common elements in the earth's crust so we aren't going to run out of it any time soon but concentrated deposits are obviously the most valuable. Its a bit of a worry though digging into the sea floor and pretending everything will be fine. Humans don't have a great record when it comes to mining.

Winston001
17th June 2014, 16:33
The other thing which annoys me is here we have a raw resource - iron sand and what do we do? Sell it to be shipped off to other countries where they smelt and manufacture the steel. What a wasted opportunity.

Crasherfromwayback
17th June 2014, 16:40
The other thing which annoys me is here we have a raw resource - iron sand and what do we do? Sell it to be shipped off to other countries where they smelt and manufacture the steel. What a wasted opportunity.

With you there 100%.

awa355
17th June 2014, 16:59
First half of this article explains just how little we know of the seafloor.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11275817

The area that is being looked at for mining, would that be on the conternental shelves, or deep deep ocean floors?

Akzle
17th June 2014, 17:10
If being one of the enormous number of hard working New Zealanders ( of many blood streams not just ''white guys'' ) that are sick to death of the rort from revision of history and constant unjustifiable handouts then yes Ill happily be called a racist. But realist is a more appropriate term.

As for tax evasion its clear that there are a few here that are smoking some ''good stuff''. Are you paying tax on that?

It seems there are a few people living in glass houses

you never clarified, that you don't make use of that lazy lefty idea of weekends....
you had better not, because that would make you a hypocrite, to add to your list of "old white git"-isms

and, being what cash is, any cash transaction has already been taxed (with regards to cannabis), whether cashies are declared and offset against GST is entirely up to the trader.

i would love to live in a glass house... then i could grow some mad coca.... mangoes, avocadoes, chillies,... it'd be neat.

(i think we should melt gews into oil to use as fuel)

mashman
17th June 2014, 18:09
True! It's designed that way too! :yes:

Hush your mouth... next you'll be telling me that people vote to keep it that way.

R650R
17th June 2014, 18:10
It's generally accepted that tax evasion is costing the country somewhere in the region of 6 billion dollars.

It's not costing the country, its costing the govt who are experts in wasting whatever they rake in anyway.
Most tax avoidance is the official play by the rules kind thanks to the complexities of accounting law etc... To me it seems to be designed to suck as much money out of joe blow public as you can but let business and corporates pay SFA thanks to all the various write offs available.
I have a small business operation and the accountants fee is well worth it for what he claims back on my behalf. It seems wrong that when I make a loss I can claim back $$$$ refund but poor Joe Blow down the road at ordinary salary/wages job cant claim nothing back. Even the official tax purposes depreciation rate for my equipment is well above the real world resale value...
Then there's certain items below $500 that are definitely capital tools used in process of making stuff that take ages to wear out but are a complete loss/writeoff for tax purposes...

http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/Fy4pkz9iDus/0.jpg

mashman
17th June 2014, 18:15
It seems wrong that when I make a loss I can claim back $$$$ refund but poor Joe Blow down the road at ordinary salary/wages job cant claim nothing back.

Of course they do... probably why the tax system never seems to calculate ones tax correctly and I either end up owing them or they end up owing me... usually the latter ;)

Robert Taylor
17th June 2014, 18:22
you never clarified, that you don't make use of that lazy lefty idea of weekends....
you had better not, because that would make you a hypocrite, to add to your list of "old white git"-isms

and, being what cash is, any cash transaction has already been taxed (with regards to cannabis), whether cashies are declared and offset against GST is entirely up to the trader.

i would love to live in a glass house... then i could grow some mad coca.... mangoes, avocadoes, chillies,... it'd be neat.

(i think we should melt gews into oil to use as fuel)

Can I have some of that tax exempt and illegal stuff you are smoking? Its clearly giving you devastating clarity.

I dont understand that working an enormous amount of hours per week and seldom having holidays ( like many small businessmen ) is in some way endemic of hypocrisy.

Better that than frying my brain. Its a pity we still dont have an Air Strike Force and a stockpile of napalm to fry the cash crops.

mashman
17th June 2014, 18:42
Can I have some of that tax exempt and illegal stuff you are smoking? Its clearly giving you devastating clarity.

I dont understand that working an enormous amount of hours per week and seldom having holidays ( like many small businessmen ) is in some way endemic of hypocrisy.

Better that than frying my brain.

Made sense to me. Perhaps one doesn't speak street?

Coz only small businessmen work long hours eh.

Are you going to have a party when you have it reinstalled?

Maha
17th June 2014, 18:49
erythrocytes (red blood cells) are red when oxygenated and give blood it's red colour. Plasma is a yellow straw coloured liquid, platelets are creamy coloured. Not sure what colour white blood cells are :eek5: So 55% of blood is yellowish.....so how come blood doesn't look orange?

....yeah but but....:girlfight:

Katman
17th June 2014, 18:49
It's not costing the country, its costing the govt who are experts in wasting whatever they rake in anyway.


It is most certainly costing the country.

puddytat
17th June 2014, 18:54
Nek minnit.... Nathan Guy allows prospecting inside a Marine Reserve....

well he probably knows where this one is, when he granted consent at least....unlike the Forest Park near us where he signed the consent without even knowing where it was.
I predict that if National gets in again then in that term there will be people taking things into their own hands.


As an aside to the Iron sand mining, usually when there's Iron sand there is other stuff like Gold.

The outfit that got the mineral lease for pretty much most of the West Coast is Chinese. I don't hold that against them . What does annoy me is that for an area of 25 million square kilometres of Ocean floor they pay a lease of only 5 mill a year .

Akzle
17th June 2014, 18:55
Can I have some of that tax exempt and illegal stuff you are smoking?

tax only applies to jewgold. Dont use jewgold, no tax involved.
Any flat currency ('legal tender' or 'money') has been taxed at source, and is taxed again when spent.
And yes, you may absolutely have some of this :doobey:

but its gonna cost you.





Five dollas (coins, not that jewcurrency paper shit) and a bag of chips.

pritch
17th June 2014, 18:59
The other thing which annoys me is here we have a raw resource - iron sand and what do we do? Sell it to be shipped off to other countries where they smelt and manufacture the steel. What a wasted opportunity.

You would be properly pissed off if you could see the constant procession of tankers sailing away with the methanol etc from NZs oil exploration programmes.

Robert Taylor
17th June 2014, 19:00
Made sense to me. Perhaps one doesn't speak street?

Coz only small businessmen work long hours eh.

Are you going to have a party when you have it reinstalled?

I apologise if you interpreted that only small businessmen work long hours. Of course its not only small businessmen that do so. But those that do work long and hard would mostly be united in condemning those from ALL sectors of society that think everything should be handed to them on a plate, with the least possible effort or contribution on their part. Irrespective of whether they are capitalists socialists or inbetween.

That is one of the most major flaws of your preferred society, it rewards those that are deliberately improvident. And I'm not condemning the genuinely needy in saying that, before you spout your toxic and implacable socialist mindset.

I

Robert Taylor
17th June 2014, 19:01
tax only applies to jewgold. Dont use jewgold, no tax involved.
Any flat currency ('legal tender' or 'money') has been taxed at source, and is taxed again when spent.
And yes, you may absolutely have some of this :doobey:

but its gonna cost you.





Five dollas (coins, not that jewcurrency paper shit) and a bag of chips.

You dirty filthy tax avoiding capitalist!

Akzle
17th June 2014, 19:13
You dirty filthy tax avoiding capitalist!

oh bobby! I appreciate the ironing. :rofl:
Ill bling you tomorow if im not too stoned :)
but i have a far, far greater grasp of the situation than you.

I'll do it for free. Just vote green OK? lol ;)

Ocean1
17th June 2014, 19:24
I know you do.

Bottom line tax avoidance and tax evasion are both morally desperate acts that the entitlement brigade avail themselves of in order to feel as though they are getting what they deserve. Kind of sad really, but then I guess a parent's love only go so far.

You're awfully concerned about who gets slices of my earnings for someone who doesn't believe in them. As you're significantly challenged wrt financial issues I'll explain: avoiding tax you're not required to pay is neither illegal or immoral you ignorant fuckwit.

All clear?

Ocean1
17th June 2014, 19:31
And have some more companies "avoiding tax" (https://nz.finance.yahoo.com/news/hirepool-settles-tax-dispute-ahead-224900720.html)... funny how tax avoidance is legal yet these guys had to settle. Bunch of selfish white muthafuckas sucking NZ dry under their entitlement complex as an excuse to do so. So very pathetic.

Yet another not NZ company not avoiding tax, if it was tax avoidance then by definition it would be legal.

Allow me to save you the trouble: there are people, *gasp* who evade the taxes they're supposed to pay. Considering we're talking about money they earned I tend to view them favourably compared to people who earn fuck all and whine like a stuck pig about income "inequality".

Now fuck off and play somewhere dangerous. A long way away.

Ocean1
17th June 2014, 19:34
It seems wrong that when I make a loss I can claim back $$$$ refund but poor Joe Blow down the road at ordinary salary/wages job cant claim nothing back.

Possibly because he never makes a loss?

R650R
17th June 2014, 20:47
Of course they do... probably why the tax system never seems to calculate ones tax correctly and I either end up owing them or they end up owing me... usually the latter ;)

I think its only a token amount and mostly people who for whatever reason didn't work a whole tax year.
Would be interesting to see how many people have an "Ohh F^%& it" moment instead of a Wahoo.
Note the average joe has to request a Summary of earnings to properly check if they haven't kept their own payslip records etc and once that's done if tax to pay you have to.
Another one of the games govt plays so the public thinking their getting a fair deal. But really atax refund for average joe is a bit like a country gettings its prisoners of war back after most of the other soldiers were slaughtered on battlefield.
I'm still waiting for the moment when the 'user pays' 'right wing' nats stop interfering with society and get the govt out of business that private business could be doing and let taxpayers just pay for quality services they actually want.
I equate govts role to same as wedding planners type role. Really they are like an event management company that puts on a crap event with leaky marquees, rubbish food and entertainment and still expects payment.

mashman
17th June 2014, 20:49
You're awfully concerned about who gets slices of my earnings for someone who doesn't believe in them. As you're significantly challenged wrt financial issues I'll explain: avoiding tax you're not required to pay is neither illegal or immoral you ignorant fuckwit.

All clear?

You are, of course, entitled to excuse anything you like on any grounds that you deem fit.

It would seem not... in fact not even remotely.

Ocean1
17th June 2014, 21:07
You are, of course, entitled to excuse anything you like on any grounds that you deem fit.

It would seem not... in fact not even remotely.

Correct. As I said I don't excuse whining freeloaders anywhere near the same good grace.

And I had not even the slightest hint of any expectation that anything whatsoever would ever be anything approaching clear to what I can only call your meagre intelligence.

mashman
17th June 2014, 21:07
I apologise if you interpreted that only small businessmen work long hours. Of course its not only small businessmen that do so. But those that do work long and hard would mostly be united in condemning those from ALL sectors of society that think everything should be handed to them on a plate, with the least possible effort or contribution on their part. Irrespective of whether they are capitalists socialists or inbetween.

That is one of the most major flaws of your preferred society, it rewards those that are deliberately improvident. And I'm not condemning the genuinely needy in saying that, before you spout your toxic and implacable socialist mindset.

I

lol, I don't have you pegged that way. Oh really? I don't condemn those that you deem unworthy, I accept that they exist and always will. The main reason I question your assertion that most would condemn it, is that that situation currently exists. Yes people are getting pissed off with it, but not at the rate of those who are starting to see the financial system for what it is and the travesty that it facilitates. Once you've asked the other 4.x million other in NZ, then you can clam most.

It rewards everyone irrespective of effort. Would you quit doing suspension just because you could? You don't enjoy it at all? :rofl:@toxic socialist mindset... I don't see the point in letting the existence "lazy" people dictate the pace of our economic evolution, amongst other things.

mashman
17th June 2014, 21:10
Correct. As I said I don't excuse whining freeloaders anywhere near the same good grace.

And I had not even the slightest hint of any expectation that anything whatsoever would ever be anything approaching clear to what I can only call your meagre intelligence.

You should, it'll make you more cuddleable.

:yawn:

mashman
17th June 2014, 21:13
Yet another not NZ company not avoiding tax, if it was tax avoidance then by definition it would be legal.

Allow me to save you the trouble: there are people, *gasp* who evade the taxes they're supposed to pay. Considering we're talking about money they earned I tend to view them favourably compared to people who earn fuck all and whine like a stuck pig about income "inequality".

Now fuck off and play somewhere dangerous. A long way away.

Referring to the dictionary definitions and the law eh. Sweet move bro.

Of course you do, you know no better.

No chance!

Winston001
17th June 2014, 21:13
The area that is being looked at for mining, would that be on the conternental shelves, or deep deep ocean floors?

Seems to be littoral mining at shallow depths - down to 100m. Mining off the shelf is a different kettle of fish entirely.

I guess while we are the topic, there is another proposed operation to mine phosphate off the Chatham Rise. That also happens to be where one of our best fishing grounds is.

http://www.rockphosphate.co.nz/the-project/

Winston001
17th June 2014, 21:18
The outfit that got the mineral lease for pretty much most of the West Coast is Chinese. I don't hold that against them . What does annoy me is that for an area of 25 million square kilometres of Ocean floor they pay a lease of only 5 mill a year .

That sounds like the annual charge for the mining permit. The Crown owns all minerals and levies a royalty on extraction. That is usually where the big money is.

mashman
17th June 2014, 21:20
I think its only a token amount and mostly people who for whatever reason didn't work a whole tax year.
Would be interesting to see how many people have an "Ohh F^%& it" moment instead of a Wahoo.
Note the average joe has to request a Summary of earnings to properly check if they haven't kept their own payslip records etc and once that's done if tax to pay you have to.
Another one of the games govt plays so the public thinking their getting a fair deal. But really atax refund for average joe is a bit like a country gettings its prisoners of war back after most of the other soldiers were slaughtered on battlefield.
I'm still waiting for the moment when the 'user pays' 'right wing' nats stop interfering with society and get the govt out of business that private business could be doing and let taxpayers just pay for quality services they actually want.
I equate govts role to same as wedding planners type role. Really they are like an event management company that puts on a crap event with leaky marquees, rubbish food and entertainment and still expects payment.

:killingme you sher paint a purdy picture.

The ooops moments only ever seem to happen when they put in a new system... the rest of the time it's Wahoo, or so it seems. I guess a return is all relative depending on whether you need to pay the electricity bill or pay for the new lambo.

The interference is required, as I can't see the private sector keeping as many jobs as the govt currently provides. Meh, govt, no govt, tis pointless if they both achieve not much more than the status quo.

Shadowjack
17th June 2014, 21:27
Godzilla!...
Underwater diggers? Sound bloody cool, wonder if they will be yellow?
Godzilla?
Big yellow materiel handling machinery, you say?

"Get away from her, you bitch!'

george formby
17th June 2014, 21:30
Seems to be littoral mining at shallow depths - down to 100m. Mining off the shelf is a different kettle of fish entirely.

I guess while we are the topic, there is another proposed operation to mine phosphate off the Chatham Rise. That also happens to be where one of our best fishing grounds is.

http://www.rockphosphate.co.nz/the-project/

I know that the consequence of dredging ports & rivers in Europe has turned vast areas of what was productive inshore fisheries into aquatic car parks.

To be viable the scale of a mining operation would have to be huge, 24/7. The consequences possibly even bigger. Worst part is nobody can see what is being done.

george formby
17th June 2014, 21:35
Godzilla?
Big yellow materiel handling machinery, you say?

"Get away from her, you bitch!'

:killingme Very well done. Ripley. Believe it or not.

Shadowjack
17th June 2014, 21:37
Seriously for a minute - just glancing thru the thread, am I right in seeing that the places this is planned to happen are smaller nations with GDP's less than a smallish multinational legal firm, thus allowing for experimentation with the process, with little blowback for cock-ups?

Shadowjack
17th June 2014, 21:45
:killingme Very well done. Ripley. Believe it or not.
Something to lighten the ambience - s'been a busy and nerve-wracking day here in Churchur -
Time for a Scotch....

awa355
17th June 2014, 21:47
Godzilla?
Big yellow materiel handling machinery, you say?

"Get away from her, you bitch!'

Dunno about big yellow diggers?? More like the Mexican draglines of old.:scratch:


http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w420/awa355/Untitledpicture-19.png

george formby
17th June 2014, 21:48
Seriously for a minute - just glancing thru the thread, am I right in seeing that the places this is planned to happen are smaller nations with GDP's less than a smallish multinational legal firm, thus allowing for experimentation with the process, with little blowback for cock-ups?

I kind of read it like that, too. Bit like the Japanese destroying Pacific island fisheries in return for a hospital & couple of schools. They're not going to replace the fish the people depend on for protein.
Out of sight, out of mind.

I have no doubt that this industry will surge forward in our lifetimes. Manganese & Iron is one thing, what would be the consequences of ocean floor Uranium mining?
Glow in the dark fish suppers.

puddytat
17th June 2014, 21:50
Don't worry, Shame Jones has got the job off looking after small Pacific Islands fi$hing ground$ & intere$t$

george formby
17th June 2014, 21:53
Don't worry, Shame Jones has got the job off looking after small Pacific Islands fi$hing ground$ & intere$t$

I'm putting in a trout & yabbie pond. No worries here.

I thought the tugger had resigned & was off the books?

puddytat
17th June 2014, 21:58
Doing this.....

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11263877

george formby
17th June 2014, 22:08
Doing this.....

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11263877


Crikey! What a nice job. No responsibility, lots of money coming through, plenty of big feeds & nice places to visit for free.

I bet he danced on the stereo, with his Honorable Member exposed, the night he heard the news.

:scratch:

Winston001
17th June 2014, 23:12
Seriously for a minute - just glancing thru the thread, am I right in seeing that the places this is planned to happen are smaller nations with GDP's less than a smallish multinational legal firm, thus allowing for experimentation with the process, with little blowback for cock-ups?


I kind of read it like that, too. Bit like the Japanese destroying Pacific island fisheries in return for a hospital & couple of schools.

Occurred to me too but maybe we are overthinking it.

Islands have tiny land areas but by contrast have enormous Exclusive Economic Zones.

For example New Zealand (which is just a set of biggish islands) has the 9th largest EEZ in the world. But how about virtually unknown Kiribati - 14th largest EEZ in the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exclusive_economic_zone#Rankings_by_area


I have no doubt that this industry will surge forward in our lifetimes. Manganese & Iron is one thing, what would be the consequences of ocean floor Uranium mining?
Glow in the dark fish suppers.

Relax. Our mates across the ditch have more uranium on land than any other country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_uranium_reserves

Robert Taylor
18th June 2014, 08:46
oh bobby! I appreciate the ironing. :rofl:
Ill bling you tomorow if im not too stoned :)
but i have a far, far greater grasp of the situation than you.

I'll do it for free. Just vote green OK? lol ;)

When hell freezes over, not even then

Robert Taylor
18th June 2014, 08:51
lol, I don't have you pegged that way. Oh really? I don't condemn those that you deem unworthy, I accept that they exist and always will. The main reason I question your assertion that most would condemn it, is that that situation currently exists. Yes people are getting pissed off with it, but not at the rate of those who are starting to see the financial system for what it is and the travesty that it facilitates. Once you've asked the other 4.x million other in NZ, then you can clam most.

It rewards everyone irrespective of effort. Would you quit doing suspension just because you could? You don't enjoy it at all? :rofl:@toxic socialist mindset... I don't see the point in letting the existence "lazy" people dictate the pace of our economic evolution, amongst other things.

I accept that the financial system we have is far from perfect, I also accept that things like fat bonuses for already highly overpaid CEOs etc is just not right. It all needs a thorough shakeup and injection of fairness, but certainly not wholesale replacement.

Everyone should pull their weight, that is my main point.

mashman
18th June 2014, 10:40
I accept that the financial system we have is far from perfect, I also accept that things like fat bonuses for already highly overpaid CEOs etc is just not right. It all needs a thorough shakeup and injection of fairness, but certainly not wholesale replacement.

Everyone should pull their weight, that is my main point.

Fair enough... I see nothing more than a wholesale replacement addressing the issues that society has. Take seabed mining, what are the minerals going to be used for? Not to put a too finer point on it, it's to make money. The end product is not a consideration and given half of the crap that has and is being produced, I still don't see that consideration being applied. That consideration isn't only the end result, it also covers how things are designed and built etc... we live in a throw away culture and that allows for tragedy beyond compare. It's all about the economy, not really about what's needed and certainly limited thought goes into the production of stuff because it's too expensive to perform proper R&D. A wholesale replacement isn't a cure, but it would allow for that which the financial system currently constrains.

I agree that everyone should pull their weight, but not everyone will and it's a poor excuse given that the "lazy" are a tiny percentage of the population... so again, I don't see the point in letting the existence of "lazy" people dictate the pace of our economic evolution... something that the financial system is unable to cope with.

oldrider
18th June 2014, 13:16
Fair enough... I see nothing more than a wholesale replacement addressing the issues that society has. Take seabed mining, what are the minerals going to be used for? Not to put a too finer point on it, it's to make money. The end product is not a consideration and given half of the crap that has and is being produced, I still don't see that consideration being applied. That consideration isn't only the end result, it also covers how things are designed and built etc... we live in a throw away culture and that allows for tragedy beyond compare. It's all about the economy, not really about what's needed and certainly limited thought goes into the production of stuff because it's too expensive to perform proper R&D. A wholesale replacement isn't a cure, but it would allow for that which the financial system currently constrains.

I agree that everyone should pull their weight, but not everyone will and it's a poor excuse given that the "lazy" are a tiny percentage of the population... so again, I don't see the point in letting the existence of "lazy" people dictate the pace of our economic evolution... something that the financial system is unable to cope with.

If lazy people want to be "lazy" that is their business - their choice - as long as the rewards they receive are equivalent!

I.E. not stolen from others and inflated into a "living wage" equalling benefit!

The sole aim of production is consumption!

A financial systems sole aim should be to assist production and consumption of goods and services to happen! ... Nothing else! :oi-grr:

mashman
18th June 2014, 13:27
If lazy people want to be "lazy" that is their business - their choice - as long as the rewards they receive are equivalent!

I.E. not stolen from others and inflated into a "living wage" equalling benefit!

The sole aim of production is consumption!

A financial systems sole aim should be to assist production and consumption of goods and services to happen! ... Nothing else! :oi-grr:

lol, there is no choice but to support the "lazy", it's what benefits etc... are for. Who decides who is "lazy" is another thing entirely and I still giggle when it's claimed that the "lazy" provide nothing to the economy, coz they do, they put all of their money back into the economy. That the "lazy" punish the rest of society for their lack of production is small biccies given the number of people who claim assistance from the govt because they are paid shit wages... which too leads to the low paid worker being denigrated by the entitlement complex brigade, but also is a display of supreme ignorance given the position (financial) of those who are required to do that work. Pay better or shut the fuck up would be my advice ;).

At the moment I agree although it shouldn't be, it should be to serve a purpose.

It should, but it doesn't, it never has... primarily due to the white muthafuckas bringing in some form of warped tiering system to measure output. Fortunately for said white muthafuckas, the country is full of ignorant attitudes and the financial systems gets to weave its magic.

puddytat
18th June 2014, 14:02
Well that's cool......they've been declined consent due to environmental concerns.

bogan
18th June 2014, 14:08
Well that's cool......they've been declined consent due to environmental concerns.

Neat! Almost enough to make you think the system works... :shifty:

Katman
18th June 2014, 14:09
Well that's cool......they've been declined consent due to environmental concerns.

It's definitely good news but I imagine it will only apply within our territorial waters.

Unfortunately we rely heavily on the health and well-being of the whole Pacific Ocean.

Hopefully the smaller island nations will take a similar stand.

(That may well depend on how many dollars are waved in their faces though).

george formby
18th June 2014, 14:22
It's definitely good news but I imagine it will only apply within our territorial waters.

Unfortunately we rely heavily on the health and well-being of the whole Pacific Ocean.

Hopefully the smaller island nations will take a similar stand.

(That may well depend on how many dollars are waved in their faces though).

The EPA news (http://www.miningaustralia.com.au/news/nz-epa-refuses-consent-for-undersea-iron-sands-min)


Some google input. HERE (http://web.mit.edu/12.000/www/m2016/finalwebsite/solutions/oceans.html)

The case study in PNG is pertinent.

puddytat
18th June 2014, 16:07
Im sure the Aussies'll be pissed at that report.

mashman
18th June 2014, 16:11
Well that's cool......they've been declined consent due to environmental concerns.

Offset by doing something stupid elsewhere mebee. (http://www.scoop.co.nz/multimedia/tv/national/93762.html)

Ocean1
18th June 2014, 19:16
Neat! Almost enough to make you think the system works... :shifty:

Steady on, you'll devalue the aluminium foil market aspects of my portfolio.

puddytat
19th June 2014, 13:21
Neat! Almost enough to make you think the system works... :shifty:

Well maybe up to when we sign the TPPA.......

puddytat
19th June 2014, 13:26
Steady on, you'll devalue the aluminium foil market aspects of my portfolio.

Nah, never happen....Tin foil hats are seen as a necessity in todays society & growth is picked to skyrocket.

They come in 2 colours nowadays & you have a choice of left brain or right brain shielding or the standard one which suits everyone.