Question

[Magua]

Gareth came around to take my bike for a spin today (different story), and the bastard wont start, at all. My power what so ever, no lights on the dash, no clicking of the fuel pump, NOTHING. It's not the battery, tried jump starting that, then we tried starting it, his battery connected to my bike, nothing. Opened up the umm box thingy that the kill switch is in, looks fine to me (not that I know what I'm looking at). Gareth found this loose wire "What the fuck is this?", pics below. Where should I go from here?

God damn, this is like thread gazillion about this bike.

[Mr Skid]

God damn, this is like thread gazillion about this bike.Really? I must have missed the others..

What's the problem? Did you buy a piece of crap bike that you don't have the skills to fix or something?

[Magua]

What's the problem? Did you buy a piece of crap bike that you don't have the skills to fix or something?

BINGO! First try. Yep, I bought this piece of shit about September last year and I've regretted it ever since.

[Mr Skid]

BINGO! First try. Yep, I bought this piece of shit about September last year and I've regretted it ever since.Then sell it and put us out of our misery.

[Magua]

Dude, if it was that easy, it'd be gone. If you don't have any advice on the problem at hand, stay out of my thread.

[Ixion]

Check earthy terminal of battery is continuous to earthy engine. Check fuse (DOH). Lights work? Doubt the loose wire is relevant unless there's another lose bit that plugs into it.. No clicky starter solenoid, almost certainly no power at all HAVE YOU CHECKED THE KILL SWITCH POSITION? Power at the kill switch terminals.


If that all checks out, tank off and follow the cabling. I'd look for a broken earth terminator first m'self.

[Magua]

Firstly, is this the fuse box? If so, how the hell do you open it? :slap:

[Groins_NZ]

Do you have a multi-meter/voltmeter?

If so you do, test the electrical circuit by putting the positive side of the meter on the battery + terminal and negative side onto the frame somewhere to test the earth connection. You should get some reading, if not then there's a wiring fault/break somewhere. Check the main fuse (maybe an inline fuse holder running off the positive wire off the battery). Check connectors for oxidisation and if scummy or dirty looking break out the sandpaper and give the contacts a brush up.

[Magua]

Under your pillion seat is a master reset switch like a breaker type of thing. Reset this and try again.

Not that I can see, do these pictures confirm otherwise? (I loves my camera, yes I does).

[crashe]

Gareth came around to take my bike for a spin today (different story), and the bastard wont start, at all.

Didn't this happen the last time Gareth_D came around to your place to ride your bike or both of you were going for a ride... see any connection here....
:rofl: :rofl:

[Magua]

Lol! I never made the connection! Last time he was around, the bike developed a hell of a knock (false alarm, thank god). I'll have to have some words with him . :rofl:


Would that be the fzr400 manual speedmedic?

[Magua]

And the hunt continues. I found two little boxes next to the flasher relay, possibly fuses? If so, they don't look to be blown. I had a hunt for the fuses on this bike about 6 months ago last time I had problems with it, our searches were fruitless.

Yes, I know. The shots of the supposed fuses are focused on my knee.

[k14]

Pretty sure most of the things you took pics of are relays, not fuses. But one of them could have blown/broken (they do have moving parts so can just break from old age) but it could be any other of infinite possibilities. Checked the kill switch??

[Ixion]

Pretty sure most of the things you took pics of are relays, not fuses. But one of them could have blown/broken (they do have moving parts so can just break from old age) but it could be any other of infinite possibilities. Checked the kill switch??

Yeah, them is relays/flasher units. Just follow the hot wire from battery, t'will go to the fuses soon enough.

have you checked the kill switch position?

[Magua]

Yeah, them is relays/flasher units. Just follow the hot wire from battery, t'will go to the fuses soon enough.

have you checked the kill switch position?

I wouldn't think it would be the killswitch as the headlights are not working either. I'm going to try and scrounge a multimeter to have a play though.

[Magua]

Do either of these look like fuses boxes? In an awkward place they be.

[Ixion]

Nope. BUT -- I found a hint that some (not all apparently) of the Yami FZR250s (is what we are talking about, yes) , have the same setup as my SRX250. No fuses at all , instead a little circuit breaker . When it pops it turns off ALL current. To reset it you just push down on the top. It will be a wee box about 1 cm long , half a centre wide and high, with a squashy plastic top. Usually under the seat (well, that's where mine is anyway)

I don't like it myself, because it has to handle ALL current (except starter motor) it has to be quite heavily rated, which means that light weight circuits are not adequately protected. I've put in line fuses in mine.

Anyway , look for the CB

EDIT. Sorry, Should read the whole thread. I see Mr Speedmedic already said this.

[Magua]

I've had a thorough search and yes I managed to find one fuse, all alone on itself. It checks out fine though. I see the circuit breaker box, put pushing down on the box doesn't do much as it's hard on top.

[Ixion]

I've had a thorough search and yes I managed to find one fuse, all alone on itself. It checks out fine though. I see the circuit breaker box, put pushing down on the box doesn't do much as it's hard on top.

Little button on it somewhrere maybe

[Magua]

Little button on it somewhrere maybe


Not that I can see....can you? On another note I went over the bike with a multimeter and it's reading 12V. Kill switch seems to be fine.

[erik]

Have you had a look at the alternator cover that got damaged when the bike fell over?
I dunno if it's possible, but maybe it's damaged the electrics in some way (damaged wires or something)?

[Magua]

The bike wasn't going before I dropped it. But I'll have a look at it tommorow.

[bungbung]

I wouldn't think it would be the killswitch as the headlights are not working either. I'm going to try and scrounge a multimeter to have a play though.

Are you certain that your battery is good? yes?

As your battery is disconnected via your ignition switch, I would have a look at the cable entry to the connector blocks on the underside of the ig switch, looking for frayed/broken wires.

[Ixion]

Not that I can see....can you? On another note I went over the bike with a multimeter and it's reading 12V. Kill switch seems to be fine.

Eh - Do you mean that you have 12V at the kill switch . If so , it can't be the circuit breaker, cos that cuts power way before the kills switch

[bungbung]

So you have 12V at the kill switch, but no headlights/horn/indicators/brake lights activity at all?

[Groins_NZ]

Keep on with the multimeter.....

Check the main connections using your multimeter, i.e. stick the red/positive side from the multimeter into one of the connections (normally there is a red wire leading in to the connector, or red + another colour signifying positive side of the circuit ). Again, put the negative end on a good frame grounding to check you have a circuit.

Of course you'll need to have a little idea of what circuit your testing. It might be that the ignition switch is faulty i.e. your key is in the ignition and turned on but the ignition circuit is failing. You might have to pull off the front headlight etc to get at the wiring to test it with your meter.

[Magua]

So you have 12V at the kill switch, but no headlights/horn/indicators/brake lights activity at all?

I believe so. I wasn't using the multimeter a friend was, but he says it all checks out.

I think this is getting a little over my head. I'll try the multimeter again tommorow, but I think I'm going to have to drop the bike into the shop again. :violin: :wait:

[Ixion]

Keep on with the multimeter.....

Check the main connections using your multimeter, i.e. stick the red/positive side from the multimeter into one of the connections (normally there is a red wire leading in to the connector, or red + another colour signifying positive side of the circuit ). Again, put the negative end on a good frame grounding to check you have a circuit.

Of course you'll need to have a little idea of what circuit your testing. It might be that the ignition switch is faulty i.e. your key is in the ignition and turned on but the ignition circuit is failing. You might have to pull off the front headlight etc to get at the wiring to test it with your meter.

This could be . Li'l Ratty karked his ignition switch. The terminals inside the switch are very poor quality, the wires are not mechanically secured, just held on by the solder (like most Jap bikes - at least Mr Lucas did screw his wires in). The solder blob holding the main feed into the switch fell off, which killed everything , just like yours is. The lights are fed through the ignition (ie they go off when you turn the ignition off) so that killed ignition and lights.

I disassembled the switch and resoldered the connection. Was a bit fiddly cos there is very little tolerance on the size and position of the blob. Hardest bit was removing the light and mini fairing to get at it. The mountings are a bit of a pain, also

Find the wires going to and from the ignition switch. Find where they plug into. One set will be power in the other power out. See if there is power FROM the switch, in any key position. If so, it's not that . If no power, see if the wires they plug INTO have power. If they do it's a dud switch

[k14]

I'm wondering if there is a problem at the ignition, he's turning the key but it isn't turning the bike on. Maybe one of the wires there has fallen off or rusted out etc, have a look under where u put the key in.

**Edit** lol, should refresh a thread after its been there for a few hours.

[The Pastor]

Anyone who doesnt know what a fuse is shouldn't own a bike..........

Nice pictures.

Bring your bike round, I have heaps of stuff to play around with at my place... oh wait you cant bring it round.....

[John]

that first wire looked like the brake switch relay trip... I really couldnt deciper the rest so take it to someone if i was closer I'd give ye a hand.

[Magua]

Ok, looking for offers of help. 6 weeks until I go back to full time work and I'd rather have the bike going sooner than later.

Renegade, come get your multimeter.

[Ixion]

OK. This may not be totally correct. It's sort of generic Yamaha, cos I can't find much info on the FXR250. But the small Yammies seem to be fairly similar so I think it will be reasonably close.

I suspect your igniton switch is fucked. That will kill all power to everything.

Its easy to check. Take the tank off. Now squizz up under the fairing at where the underneath of your ignition switch is. Coming out under the ignition switch will be a bunch of wires wrapped in black plastic (or in a black plastic tube). Wiggle it a bit and follow where it goes round the steering head. It will end up in a white square plug thing under the tank.The wires from the ignition switch will be connected into one half of the plug, the other half will be connected to the main wiring loom.Probably with 4 "prongs" inside the plug.

One of the wires will be red , one brown, one blue - and maybe a blue and white one.

The important ones are the brown and red ones. Should be a brown wire and a red wire on each side of the plug.

Get a bit of wire. Bare the ends . Connect one bare end to the EARTH terminal (black wire) of the battery . Call this wire A. Get another shorter length , wire B. Bare both ends. Get a light bulb, 12V - make sure it's a good one. Hold one terminal of the light bulb against the battery non-earth terminal (the one with the red wire). Hold the free end of wire A against the other bulb terminal. The bulb should light up . This is just to test the battery and bulb.

Now. Pull the two parts of that square plug apart (there's a little clip holds it together). Now , take the half of the square plug above that does NOT go to the ignition switch. The half that is connected into the main loom. There should be a brown wire and a red wire attached to it (maybe others also)

Take the shorter length of wire , wire B. Poke one end into the plug above where the RED wire is attached , so it contacts the copper bits in the plug. Poke the other end of wire B into the plug above where the BROWN wire is attached . Do you now have neutral light on (check it's in neutral), indicators work etc. If you do try the starter button. If these all work, you're ignition switch is rooted you need another one.

If stuff doesn't work when you do this, take the long wire, wire A. Hold the free , bared end against one contact of the light bulb. Leave one end of wire B poked into the plug , above the RED wire. Hold the other end of wire B (take it out of the plug, it was poked in above the brown wire) against the other contact of the light bulb.

No light, your main fuse is gone, or you have a wire broken.

If the bulb DOES light, your main fuse is OK, your ignition switch is OK. You have a defective sidestand switch, oil pressure switch kill switch, or a broken wire. If you get to this point post the results here and we'll move to the next stage.

[Magua]

Been going over the whole top half of the bike with a multimeter and OMFG I'M CONFUSED........and i'm not even doing the work. More to come later.

[Ixion]

Been going over the whole top half of the bike with a multimeter and OMFG I'M CONFUSED........and i'm not even doing the work. More to come later.

If you have a multimeter just check for voltage between the red wire that I mentioned in my oher post (the one where the plug goes into the loom). And turn the key on and check that there is continuity between the brown and red wires that go to the ignition switch (the other half of that plug). If both of those test out OK (voltage on teh red wire, and continuity between red and balck on the switch ) it's one of the protective circuits - sidestand , clutch , oil pressure . You'll need to test/disable them one by one

[Magua]

Resistance on the ignition part of the circuit
When key is off | When Key is on
RED and BROWN = infinite resistance | No resistance
Blue and Blue/red = infinite resitance | No resistance


Resistances on the ingitionc onnector (battery is disconnected)
RED AND BROWN = around 28000/30000 (Starter motor or something maybe)
Blue and Blue/red = Zero or very small

Posted by friend.

[Ixion]

Resistance on the ignition part of the circuit
When key is off | When Key is on
RED and BROWN = infinite resistance | No resistance
Blue and Blue/red = infinite resitance | No resistance




OK. Sounds like the ignition switch Is OK. With battery connected is tehre voltage between earth and the red wire on the ignition circuit (use the DC volatge setting of the nmeter , on test lead on earth (make sure it is earthy, motor is not always) and other on the wire connction.

If there is it's time to look at the isolator relay

If my info is correct (it's actually for a FZR400) there's an isolator relay after teh ignition switch. Feeds to therelay are from the various safety switches. You need to find this. It'll have a red/white , a blue/yellow, a black, and a black/white wire coming into it. Check that you have voltage (ignition on, kill switch to run) on teh red white wire. If that's OK check for connectionbetween the blue and yellow wire and earth (connetivity = bad, safety ciruit switch stuck) ; and connectivity beteen the black/white wire and the black wire (should not be , also indicates stuck safety switch) . ry disconnecting the red/white wire from this.

[FROSTY]

mate ive skipped through the thread but that red wire at the start--its the power wire for the bike--the other end of it looks like its tucked away beside the battery.Plug it in and the bike will go
actually one thing to try-trace the thick red wire from the battery down to where it ends -itll end in a round pot thing with two brass looking bolts sticking out of it.On the side of it you may find a small fuse holder--check that fuse.As part of the elimination process take a big screwdriver and lay it across the two brass bolts.--make certain the bike is in neutral before ya do
can ya get the little rat bike to my place in massey?
gimme a yell if ya can --0210354615

[eliot-ness]

On the first pic showing the loose red wire. Above and left of that wire is a connector block with tape around it. Take off the tape and you may find the other half of your missing connection.

[Magua]

As part of the elimination process take a big screwdriver and lay it across the two brass bolts.--make certain the bike is in neutral before ya do
can ya get the little rat bike to my place in massey?
gimme a yell if ya can --0210354615

Praise Allah it turned over!

I placed a screwdriver over those two bolts, a few sparks and the bike turned over! So what does this mean? The thingy in question is screwed?

[Indiana_Jones]

Praise Allah it turned over!

*insert a Somalian war 'ahlalalalalala' in here*
*Ak's fire into the air*

-Indy

[Ixion]

Praise Allah it turned over!

I placed a screwdriver over those two bolts, a few sparks and the bike turned over! So what does this mean? The thingy in question is screwed?

It means your starter motor works. You connected the starter direct to the battery, bypassing all the other electrics on the bike .Trouble is that you have no ignition power (or starter relay power)

[FROSTY]

It means your starter motor works. You connected the starter direct to the battery, bypassing all the other electrics on the bike .Trouble is that you have no ignition power (or starter relay power)
It proves bike aint seized as well.
Ok guts is ya aint gettin power to the bike but there is power available.
have ya tried tracing the wires from the bottom of the .....
Ahh shit this typing BS takes longer than friggin fixing the thing--get it to my place and ill sort it out.
take the fairing and sidecovers off and leave the seat with it

[Ixion]

It proves bike aint seized as well.
Ok guts is ya aint gettin power to the bike but there is power available.
have ya tried tracing the wires from the bottom of the .....
Ahh shit this typing BS takes longer than friggin fixing the thing--get it to my place and ill sort it out.
take the fairing and sidecovers off and leave the seat with it

True. And that the battery is not stuffed,a nd that the battery is earthed . All good stuff. I suspect (new suspicion) one of those stupid flipping safety switchs. Sidestand maybe?

[FROSTY]

True. And that the battery is not stuffed,a nd that the battery is earthed . All good stuff. I suspect (new suspicion) one of those stupid flipping safety switchs. Sidestand maybe?
nope matey --no juice at all remember-Its a broken or unplugged wire in the ignition line somewhere -ignition switch or battery lead--shouldnt take a shit load of figuring out.

[riffer]

nope matey --no juice at all remember-Its a broken or unplugged wire in the ignition line somewhere -ignition switch or battery lead--shouldnt take a shit load of figuring out.

I seem to recall last time you said this we spent three quarters of an hour outside a cemetary with a bike in pieces ... ;)

[FROSTY]

Do ya really wanna recall that incident mr "yea yea the fuse is fine"
let ya long suffering buddy take the entire bike to pieces

[Magua]

Do ya really wanna recall that incident mr "yea yea the fuse is fine"
let ya long suffering buddy take the entire bike to pieces

Just got back from frosty's, anything he tells you about a fuse is a BLATENT LIE! :eek:

[FROSTY]

Time to post on Kiwibiker for advice and tips-45 days
Time to cart bike to semi competant mechanic -45 minutes
Timefor mechanic to effect repair and have bike running 45 seconds
The sound in the owners voice as he hears said semi competant mechanic revving the nuts out of his "dead" bike -FUCKING PRICELESS
HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHHEEHEHEHHE4HEHEHHEHEHEEHHEEEE
oHH AND TOTAL COST of parts --$50C
You do the math

[Shade]

Nice one frosty!!

[FROSTY]

ohh and Maqua--fess up or I will tell all :doh:

[Magua]

Yes yes, one of the fuses was blown :bash:

I went over those! I had two friends look at them too. It appears we are all inept! :doh:
What do I owe you for your 15 seconds of work? :D

[R6_kid]

fuck up magua - you told me the thing had no fuses, i didnt believe you, just couldnt bothered with your bike anymore :lol:

[riffer]

Welcome to the inept fuse checkers club Magua. You're in good company. All of us have done it.

Now go thrash the nuts off that fizzer.

[FROSTY]

Welcome to the inept fuse checkers club Magua. You're in good company. All of us have done it.

Now go thrash the nuts off that fizzer.
Yea at least with the lil yam it was warm and safe in my gargre
UNLIKE--a certain RF900 owner who swore black and blue he'd checked the fuses on his bike leaving half a dozen mates to ripp the electrics of his bike to little biddy pieces outside a bloody cemetry.
I'm sure I heard Flyin laughing his head off at ya riffer

[Indiana_Jones]

Well it least his bike is going, I need a spark plug and some gas for mine, but I can't get them atm :crazy:

-Indy

[riffer]

Yea at least with the lil yam it was warm and safe in my gargre
UNLIKE--a certain RF900 owner who swore black and blue he'd checked the fuses on his bike leaving half a dozen mates to ripp the electrics of his bike to little biddy pieces outside a bloody cemetry.
I'm sure I heard Flyin laughing his head off at ya riffer

Yeah, laugh now matey - you weren't at the time.

Oh - I texted you too but you never got back to me.

I've got some lovely virginal SIDI verts at my place - do you want them run in for you?

[FROSTY]

no mate but Im hoping a travelling Welly KBer could bring em up this way