Cook Strait ferries debacle

[Winston001]

This has nothing to do with tie-downs and sailing times.

Kiwirail have decided to lease full-time the Stena Alegra which is the ship they borrowed in a hurry when the Arahura had problems. The Arahura is now being retired and the Stena Alegra (which has its own problems) is its replacement.

So they are keeping it.

Spare me days. The Stena Alegra is not a road-rail ferry. In order to load it, rail wagons must first be unloaded and freight trucked onto the Stena, and at the other end the same procedure takes place in reverse. The ship is not passenger friendly either so people have to queue and wait to get on and get off.

Any ship-wise people who can explain this banana republic decision?

[Gremlin]

Probably cheaper than the right ferry.

Hopefully the more reliable option (well, why else would they make the decision).

[F5 Dave]

We need Winston Peters to save us.

[yokel]

When I heard that the ferry was coming from Poland I lol'd

[awayatc]

Aratere was not the best ferry.....
Then Kiwirail in its infinite wisdom had same Aratere lengthened in Singapore at enormous expense...
Then disastrous decision making accumulated to almost farcical magnitudes....
Thus the budget got blown on this gigantic white elephant....(somebody's ill advised wet dream..)
Revenue down....cost up (aratere with smaller prop has lower speed and cant make the required amount of crossings anymore )
What do you do...?
You desperately and quickly grab whatever you can get with the money you haven't got....
Incompetence at a larger scale.....

[Berries]

Alegra is Maori for drowning.

Strange but true.

[mashman]

Second hand stuff is always cheaper than new stuff. It's an expensive business if you're not making enough money to be able to buy new ferries... or aren't saving for that rainy day. Who's the local ship builder on these islands?

[Murray]

Aren't they leasing it??

To expesive to build another one.

[amberzfire]

Alegra is Maori for drowning.

Strange but true.

bro .. there's no 'L' in the Maori alphabet .. but flip to Spanish and Alegra borderlines -happy, cheerful, pleasing- lol then again if it's a Polish Vessel then hmm I don't know .. my Polish isn't very good (at all).. as long as it's not Irish with the name Titanic I suppose .. :facepalm:

[IkieBikie]

The ferry would be chartered for five years and would undergo a significant upgrade before arriving in New Zealand. It would also be renamed before being put into service in mid-2015.

The Stena Alegra is currently moored off the Indonesian side of Singapore Strait awaiting propeller and other repairs.

The 21,000 tonne Spanish-built Stena Alegra was chartered by InterIslander as a six month replacement vessel earlier this year for the Aratere, which lost a propeller last November when a shaft broke.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/63976932/stena-alegra-ferry-to-replace-arahura

Public reaction from the feedback is not positive!!!!

[Kickaha]

I dont care what boat it is, so long as there is a boat and it gets across in a reasonable time,

Fuck them for not doing Grassmere and running fast ferries though

[R650R]

There was a story in the news couple months back about kiwi rail ditching the whole rail via ferry thing saying the whole process was uneconomic and the numbers didn't justify it etc for the time and logistics involved.
Maybe this was legit or they were buttering up the nation for the loss of the interisland rail link.

Sadly we are a borderline third world nation economically, its only thanks to mother England originally buying so much meat and wool off us that we have what we have already or else half the countries roads would still be gravel.
I predict we will have another Wahine style disaster in our lifetimes due to one of these aging boats failing including the alegra....
Lets not forget we have a private company, straight shipping operating a successful business alongside the govt... maybe they are positing to ditch the ferries altogether and sell it off to them...

Its only luck that the prop and engine failures have occurred in fine weather close to land....

[scumdog]

bro .. there's no 'L' in the Maori alphabet ..

Hmm, just off the cuff there's Wangaloa and Waihola down here:pinch:

[R650R]

in related news....

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11373711

[James Deuce]

Any ship-wise people who can explain this banana republic decision?

Nothing to do with ships. Everything to do with the all powerful Road Transport Forum. The biggest issue I see with the Stena Alegra is the amount of oil it spews out each crossing. Doesn't have a functioning mechanical seal anywhere on that boat and nothing short of a full refit including completely new motive power bits and probably new hull plates is going to fix it.

And what Kickaha said.

[Tazz]

Bugger the Interislander, pretend it doesn't exist and use Bluebridge.

Let the Interislander and its moronic management sink. It should have been left as a private enterprise to ensure it is run efficiently unlike how it is now with their gross incompetence and bully tactics against any competition.


I dont care what boat it is, so long as there is a boat and it gets across in a reasonable time,

Fuck them for not doing Grassmere and running fast ferries though

Considering they can't even run things from ports that don't need constant dredging and get sand blasted badly by high winds, that decision would have ensured even more hilarity.

[oldrider]

Word is that they are seeking a replacement ferry leased from Tonga! :whistle:

[thehovel]

Bugger the Interislander, pretend it doesn't exist and use Bluebridge.

Let the Interislander and its moronic management sink. It should have been left as a private enterprise to ensure it is run efficiently unlike how it is now with their gross incompetence and bully tactics against any competition.



Considering they can't even run things from ports that don't need constant dredging and get sand blasted badly by high winds, that decision would have ensured even more hilarity.

Finally a good idea.

[Kickaha]

Bugger the Interislander, pretend it doesn't exist and use Bluebridge.
I use whatever has the most convenient sailing time for whatever event I am heading north for, I don't give a shit who runs it as it's just a few hours wasted in my life each way

Considering they can't even run things from ports that don't need constant dredging and get sand blasted badly by high winds, that decision would have ensured even more hilarity.
Shorter travel time on the road to it and shorter sail time on the water is all I cared about

[jasonu]

Nothing to do with ships. The biggest issue I see with the Stena Alegra is the amount of oil it spews out each crossing. Doesn't have a functioning mechanical seal anywhere on that boat and nothing short of a full refit including completely new motive power bits and probably new hull plates is going to fix i.

That is very interesting. How do you know about it?

[Tazz]

Shorter travel time on the road to it and shorter sail time on the water is all I cared about

There would be more days that would not be sailable due to weather than the way it is now I heard due to that wind (waves/tide wouldn't probably be a problem there for the size of the ships I'd guess?) and the need to stick to the channel, so the shorter drive and sail time becomes a bit redundant if the ship isn't going anywhere.

It was something that was 'politically' looked at over and over since the 20's and never implemented because it was never an option once the politics were brushed aside (and reality kicked in...).

Would have been good for Picton in the long term too if it went and against all odds was successful but oh well.

[Voltaire]

Sadly we are a borderline third world nation economically,
....

I wish they would stop going on about NZ being a 'Rock Star Economy" ....or may they are referring to Jim, Jimmy,Janis, Kurt , Ian, etc

[R650R]

Nothing to do with ships. Everything to do with the all powerful Road Transport Forum...

While this tired old sound bite keeps getting trotted out by the green party and co it bears little resemblance to any real life relationship between the govt and road transport industry.
Owner drivers and company shareholders would just love to see evidence of any benefits/concessions/tax breaks/special treatment handed out cause it sure a shell doesn't happen.
Just because the Labour party decided to cripple the govts balance sheet knowing they would lose next election and saddle the Nats with a giant hospital pass it doesn't mean National is pro truck just because they don't want to waste more money on our haphazard aging rail network.
If you knew anything about Road transport at all you'd know that Several of the top major companies LOVE sending freight by rail where it makes economic sense and fits in with customer timelines. Transport companies are about making money, yes some have a family history and love for trucks but at the end of the day they will use whatever method makes the most money.

[James Deuce]

That is very interesting. How do you know about it?

It's not a conspiracy. That's the trucking lobby group. They've been lobbying for a non-rail Ferry for decades. They're quite open about it and are largely responsible for ensuring that rail can't ever return to a profitable efficiency.50 tonne trucks on NZ roads are idiocy. But not to them hence the fact that they now roam free.

[James Deuce]

While this tired old sound bite keeps getting trotted out by the green party and co it bears little resemblance to any real life relationship between the govt and road transport industry.
Owner drivers and company shareholders would just love to see evidence of any benefits/concessions/tax breaks/special treatment handed out cause it sure a shell doesn't happen.
Just because the Labour party decided to cripple the govts balance sheet knowing they would lose next election and saddle the Nats with a giant hospital pass it doesn't mean National is pro truck just because they don't want to waste more money on our haphazard aging rail network.
If you knew anything about Road transport at all you'd know that Several of the top major companies LOVE sending freight by rail where it makes economic sense and fits in with customer timelines. Transport companies are about making money, yes some have a family history and love for trucks but at the end of the day they will use whatever method makes the most money.
Yeah, nah. They've refused to service rail heads for decades. If they were interested in integrating rail and road they'd actively invest in rail. They don't. End of story.

Oh, and I didn't mention National or Labour. This is a commerical issue and reflects the attitudes of corporates to helping develop a sustainable long term efficient, multi-faceted transport network that would benefit all of NZ. Can't do that because the balance sheet would suffer for a decade or more.

[R650R]

Yeah, nah. They've refused to service rail heads for decades. If they were interested in integrating rail and road they'd actively invest in rail. They don't. End of story.

Oh, and I didn't mention National or Labour. This is a commerical issue and reflects the attitudes of corporates to helping develop a sustainable long term efficient, multi-faceted transport network that would benefit all of NZ. Can't do that because the balance sheet would suffer for a decade or more.

Well its just that everyone else thinks the Nats are "pro truck" despite them making the biggest hikes in RUC...
Agree about corporate CEO only looking at the short term results for their bonus pays... But on a day to day basis whether freight travels by road or rail is purely a $ issue if not time sensitive freight.
I interviewed a manager at smaller company, he has it down to last cent on truck vs rail and they own nearly a thousand of their own containers. He uses rail when it works out better based on $ and time. Nothing to do with a grand conspiracy to get rid of ferries...



It's not a conspiracy. That's the trucking lobby group. They've been lobbying for a non-rail Ferry for decades. They're quite open about it and are largely responsible for ensuring that rail can't ever return to a profitable efficiency.50 tonne trucks on NZ roads are idiocy. But not to them hence the fact that they now roam free.

50 tonne trucks are just business as usual. Everyone's been running around 'fat' since time immeroial, even the cops knew, they just turned a blind eye to those running the good gear and used it as a carrot for partial compliance of laws, much like how the vice squad only busts the low level drug dealers and not those at the top.
The only reason we had the new 50max arrangements come in is because NZTA started putting in too many "weigh in motion" scales on major state highways and realised the level of 'offending'. Then of course someone had to cover their butt and set up an official system.
There was mass hysteria of course on talkback radio when it was announced, people saying the road would collapse, no one would be able to overtake safely etc.... Joe Blow public could prob not even tell the difference today.

[jasonu]

It's not a conspiracy. That's the trucking lobby group. They've been lobbying for a non-rail Ferry for decades. They're quite open about it and are largely responsible for ensuring that rail can't ever return to a profitable efficiency.50 tonne trucks on NZ roads are idiocy. But not to them hence the fact that they now roam free.

I was referring to the oil you say it spews into the ocean. I spent time working on cruise ships and letting anything let alone oil into the sea is a huge big no no.

[Swoop]

Any ship-wise people who can explain this banana republic decision?
*Looks upwards toward my "location"*
Weeellllllll... we do live in the republic!

Interesting to note about the Alega: It is going to require a refit, included in which is the fitment of stabilisers!
IF these are active stabs. then the cost will be verging on the ridiculous and worthy of a new-build vessel.
If just a bolt-on bilge keel affair, much cheaper (and nastier).

Really nothing much more than we have come to know from the famously bad way to do shipping in NZ.

[Maha]

The Arahura was at Devonport a few months undergoing a refurbishment.

[buggerit]

I wish they would stop going on about NZ being a 'Rock Star Economy" ....or may they are referring to Jim, Jimmy,Janis, Kurt , Ian, etc

Fred and Barney I think you will find:yes::rofl:

[R650R]

http://wellington.scoop.co.nz/?p=73768

For about what we spend weekly on welfare the govt could buy a brand new ship...

[jonbuoy]

Nothing to do with ships. Everything to do with the all powerful Road Transport Forum. The biggest issue I see with the Stena Alegra is the amount of oil it spews out each crossing. Doesn't have a functioning mechanical seal anywhere on that boat and nothing short of a full refit including completely new motive power bits and probably new hull plates is going to fix it.

And what Kickaha said.

Eh?? That's more likely an "operator" problem - pumping oil contaminated bilge water over board which is highly illegal. Only seals that have oil behind them would be the shaft seals- and if that much oil was leaking out chances are the shaft bearing lube oil would be contaminated by seawater and stuffed quick smart. They have to do regular oil analysis of the shaft lube oil - Classification society and Port state would be down on them like a ton of bricks.

[awayatc]

Fwiw......simplex style shaftseals work on inside oil pressure being higher then outside seawater pressure.....
So when seal ages or fails it leaks oil to the outside, not seawater to the inside.
Newer systems available now on freshwater rather then oil.....

[jonbuoy]

Fwiw......simplex style shaftseals work on inside oil pressure being higher then outside seawater pressure.....
So when seal ages or fails it leaks oil to the outside, not seawater to the inside.
Newer systems available now on freshwater rather then oil.....

I guess that's assuming they keep the circulation pumps running all the time - even during lay up. No idea what seals they have but hard to imagine a Kiwi crew would just keep topping the tanks up if it was dropping by enough to be a pollution hazard.

[awayatc]

Haha...... yes they get topped up, regardless how much it leaks....untill drydock/slip fixes it.

no circulation pump needed....header tank

[jonbuoy]

Haha...... yes they get topped up, regardless how much it leaks....untill drydock/slip fixes it.

no circulation pump needed....header tank

We have circulation pumps that start when engines do. I know we have regular oil tests - regardless of oil level in the tanks.

[awayatc]

Yes you are talking about the sterntube oil....
vast amounts of it.
between sterntube and the big blue ocean however you have a seal.
If that seal leaks your stern tube oil gets contaminated.
That seal itself is oilfilled...
So that if it leaks, oil goes to outside, rather then seawater gets to inside..

[jonbuoy]

Yes you are talking about the sterntube oil....
vast amounts of it.
between sterntube and the big blue ocean however you have a seal.
If that seal leaks your stern tube oil gets contaminated.
That seal itself is oilfilled...
So that if it leaks, oil goes to outside, rather then seawater gets to inside..

Yes your right my mistake - we were in drydock recently getting new seals and I had to help the shaft seal guy by getting the pumps running to bleed the air without the engines runnning - I assumed it was the same oil for the seal - clearly not!

[5150]

When I heard that the ferry was coming from Poland I lol'd

Care to elaborate on that statement?

[R650R]

Haha...... yes they get topped up, regardless how much it leaks....untill drydock/slip fixes it.

no circulation pump needed....header tank

The marine industry sounds just like the trucking industry, as long as the wheels turn keep the air/oil leaking/bleeding/spilling til the freight gets there...

[Ulsterkiwi]

as long as it's not Irish with the name Titanic I suppose .. :facepalm:


hoi! it was alright when it left Belfast! :motu: driving it into an iceberg was the unhelpful bit.:facepalm:

[imdying]

Its only luck that the prop and engine failures have occurred in fine weather close to land....Where did the Wahine come a cropper again? :o

[oldrider]

hoi! it was alright when it left Belfast! :motu: driving it into an iceberg was the unhelpful bit.:facepalm:

Why should it dodge icebergs ... it was after all unsinkable! :rolleyes:

[amberzfire]

hoi! it was alright when it left Belfast! :motu: driving it into an iceberg was the unhelpful bit.:facepalm:

Yes, you are correct. My apologies for upsetting you.

[Ulsterkiwi]

Yes, you are correct. My apologies for upsetting you.

lol, you should see me when I am upset :cool:

[amberzfire]

lol, you should see me when I am upset :cool:

Well I'll steer clear of references to the Titanic in the future that's for sure :weep:

[yevjenko]

Speaking of Ireland, the Alegra used to be run by Irish ferries, on both Dublin and Rosslare routes

[Ulsterkiwi]

the fact they no longer operate this vessel should tell you something.....

[yevjenko]

the fact they no longer operate this vessel should tell you something.....
Both times they shifted it on they did so for bigger ships

[R650R]

Where did the Wahine come a cropper again? :o

I'd rather be on the rocks than out in cook straight with no propulsion in a seven metre swell with no chance of rescue....

[Swoop]

The marine industry sounds just like the trucking industry, as long as the wheels turn keep the air/oil leaking/bleeding/spilling til the freight gets there...
I laughed at the trucking industry today. All the BS over cattle trucks and their effluent holding tanks being so effective now...

The truck was pouring shit all over the road.

As we crossed over the Newmarket viaduct!

[Winston001]

Excellent replies guys, thanks. Nobody seems to have a strong explanation for the Stena Alegra choice apart from the reality that we already have it, and a new ferry is very expensive. $250 million.

Air New Zealand is buying Dreamliners at US$200 million each. Air is still majority government owned.

Kiwi Rail is 100% government owned. If the govt can go along with $200 million (list price US$270 million) aircraft, then $250 for purpose built ferry sounds reasonable.

On the other hand Bluebridge do a good job as a private company and they won't get taxpayer money for new ferries. So putting more money into Kiwi Rail to compete with Bluebridge just doesn't seem right.

There are plenty of Ro-Ro ferries for purchase/lease around the globe - google ship brokers. Big suckers too ex-Japan.

Road-Rail ferries are fewer but are available.

One limitation is Cook Strait can be like the open ocean. Most ferries around the world operate in shallow stable seas close to large land masses. Those ferries don't need to be ocean going ships, so that's a significant limitation.

To the best of my knowledge the NZ Rail ferries have always been a profitable operation for decades - they have a near monopoly.

[R650R]

I laughed at the trucking industry today. All the BS over cattle trucks and their effluent holding tanks being so effective now...

The truck was pouring shit all over the road.

As we crossed over the Newmarket viaduct!

There's been a major improvement from previous years. I can guarantee about a dozen remuera tractors would have *555 him and he would have been ticketed at the bridge base.
In recent years transit has actually built some new dumping stations ironically they cost a fortune as they have to comply with all the govts own regulations and resource consents for sewerage etc...
Prob less shit on the road though than what certain foreign tourists leave in rest areas these days when freedom camping....

[Tazz]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/marlborough-express/news/64038607/Night-time-noises-to-be-fixed-in-ferry-refit

They discovered the source of the noise was the engine room and cargo fans...wonder how much someone got paid to 'investigate' that :facepalm:

It's annoying by comparison, but not that bad. I don't know where the guy lives but he should possibly try a few nights in Lyttelton.

[Gremlin]

They discovered the source of the noise was the engine room and cargo fans...wonder how much someone got paid to 'investigate' that :facepalm:
Thought immediately of some jokes...

http://hajokes.com/view/Pilot-Engineer-humor

[pete376403]

Aaaand, the Aratanic is, once again, broken down, sailings cancelled. Usual performace.

http://www.3news.co.nz/nznews/aratere-hit-by-electrical-fault-2014121716#axzz3M8vukbIv

[Winston001]

Yeah Pete, noticed that. What a debacle.

How about this: the govt invests $200 million in Bluebridge for a 75% shareholding which helps fund a brand new ferry. Maybe just a ro-ro, no rail.

That way the existing underdog competitor gets a hand up but not a subsidy and the existing govt Kiwirail has to sort itself out or lose the Cook Strait work. Win win for transport, passengers, and taxpayers.

[awayatc]

For the money spend on lengthening Aratare a new ferry could have been bought.

lots of people at the time advised against the venture....

some people dont listen to common sense advise

chances are they still dont......

[BMWST?]

While this tired old sound bite keeps getting trotted out by the green party and co it bears little resemblance to any real life relationship between the govt and road transport industry.
Owner drivers and company shareholders would just love to see evidence of any benefits/concessions/tax breaks/special treatment handed out cause it sure a shell doesn't happen.
Just because the Labour party decided to cripple the govts balance sheet knowing they would lose next election and saddle the Nats with a giant hospital pass it doesn't mean National is pro truck just because they don't want to waste more money on our haphazard aging rail network.
If you knew anything about Road transport at all you'd know that Several of the top major companies LOVE sending freight by rail where it makes economic sense and fits in with customer timelines. Transport companies are about making money, yes some have a family history and love for trucks but at the end of the day they will use whatever method makes the most money.
they didnt have pay for the roads to be built or the maintenance theof....i know they pay through the nose, but if the true cost of that investment was actually paid for by the freight industry ......

[awayatc]

New plymouth is a port....
I can tell, coz there is this big puddle in the back....
As a port New Plymouth is capable of handling cargo by sea...
as we used to....
now however we get fuel being trucked in.....
not kidding....
the fuel comes all the way from a port on the other side of this island,
to this side of island by TRUCK......

Now dont misunderstand me, on a personal level, I like most truckies,
Salt of the earth......
But to clog up our costly roading system with heavy trucks,
while we got a maintenance free wet backyard?
( we are an island remember......we got almost no ships left,
but an island we are....)
I seriously wonder who fuckes , bribes or threathens who ......?
coz common sense is so far out of the window, people barely remember we once had some....

[Big Dog]

What happened to the BP tank farm?

All the brands used to ship their fuel there and sell it to BP and buy it back with the local additives mixed in. Much as they do from Wiri in Auckland.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Big Dog]

My ex was counting on that farm needing to expand one day as a retirement plan.

Needing to buy her land.



Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[oldrider]

New plymouth is a port....
I can tell, coz there is this big puddle in the back....
As a port New Plymouth is capable of handling cargo by sea...
as we used to....
now however we get fuel being trucked in.....
not kidding....
the fuel comes all the way from a port on the other side of this island,
to this side of island by TRUCK......

Now dont misunderstand me, on a personal level, I like most truckies,
Salt of the earth......
But to clog up our costly roading system with heavy trucks,
while we got a maintenance free wet backyard?
( we are an island remember......we got almost no ships left,
but an island we are....)
I seriously wonder who fuckes , bribes or threathens who ......?
coz common sense is so far out of the window, people barely remember we once had some....

As I remember the unions - seaman's and officers guild's milked the system dry, offshore got got the work and our shipping lines dried up! :sick:

I too look at that empty sea and the empty rails and count the trucks and wonder is it all because of multiple handling and exorbitant labour costs? :scratch:

Or is there something a little more sinister beneath it all? :confused:

[Swoop]

How about this: the govt invests $200 million in Bluebridge for a 75% shareholding which helps fund a brand new ferry.
I wondered the same, but decided against.

Bluebridge provides a good service and stands by itself. Imagine if the gubbinment became involved... More bullshit that would sink a ship, let alone a shipping line!
I have looked down on the Bluebridge terminal, from a building nearby, and thought how much of a challenge they faced to get up and running to the stage they are now. Good work folks! Transitioning from freight-only, to passenger is a big change.

Comparing the "we've always done it this way" approach of the Interislander line.

The private enterprise Vs the State. I'm sure a few of those on here will hate that comparison...

[awayatc]

My ex was counting on that farm needing to expand one day as a retirement plan.

Needing to buy her land.



Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

one of the farms is empty....
for sale...

the other one has got at times not enough for us to bunker......
( i am serious.....)
I hope you got a plan B....

[awayatc]

As I remember the unions - seaman's and officers guild's milked the system dry, offshore got got the work and our shipping lines dried up! :sick:

I too look at that empty sea and the empty rails and count the trucks and wonder is it all because of multiple handling and exorbitant labour costs? :scratch:

Or is there something a little more sinister beneath it all? :confused:


Not sure what or why.....
as far as milking dry goes....
I don't know, I was fishing back in the day,
am not into politics or games,
am a simple sailor trying to make a living....

bad apples everywhere....
Can sort them out, dont have to burn all the orchards....

[Big Dog]

one of the farms is empty....
for sale...

the other one has got at times not enough for us to bunker......
( i am serious.....)
I hope you got a plan B....

Not my plan. Silly cow turned them down when they offered to buy her land for over 10 x what she paid. Reckoned it was worth another half mill if they really wanted it.
They didn't.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[Big Dog]

Not sure what or why.....
as far as milking dry goes....
I don't know, I was fishing back in the day,
am not into politics or games,
am a simple sailor trying to make a living....

bad apples everywhere....
Can sort them out, dont have to burn all the orchards....

I don't think it was the sailors so much as the dock unions. Certainly when I was at school. Striking every other week.


Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

[awayatc]

Big dog...
tankfarms or not.....
prime land there really.
Always worth money..
who knows what future will hold?
Good luck

[awa355]

Meanwhile, back in Wellyrail, I understand they are looking at some asian designs for a new ferry. .

http://i1074.photobucket.com/albums/w420/awa355/asiaferry.png

[Winston001]

The lack of tank farms is news to me: you used to see them in every port.

I'd take a guess and say that the tanker ships don't want to muck around calling into every port for small off-loads.

But it seems stupid to truck tiny amounts when a ship can deliver a months supply.

Are the shipping lines only interested in one or two places of delivery, load new cargo and bugger off?

I have no idea how that can be changed.

[oldrider]

The lack of tank farms is news to me: you used to see them in every port.

I'd take a guess and say that the tanker ships don't want to muck around calling into every port for small off-loads.

But it seems stupid to truck tiny amounts when a ship can deliver a months supply.

Are the shipping lines only interested in one or two places of delivery, load new cargo and bugger off?

I have no idea how that can be changed.

It comes back to a question of scale: One truck - one driver - time on the road etc. The scale changes dramatically with shipping!

Gisborne's isolation and it's railway/road/sea/air situation must be getting some interesting freight figures chucked about these days! :corn:

[BMWST?]

It comes back to a question of scale: One truck - one driver - time on the road etc. The scale changes dramatically with shipping!

Gisborne's isolation and it's railway/road/sea/air situation must be getting some interesting freight figures chucked about these days! :corn:
Yes and rail and shipping can have scale.
We gonna need those rail links soon too