What are the rules for "motorcycle lanes"?

[Bassmatt]

We have a few of the double broken white centre lines about a meter apart, around here.
I know what they are trying to achieve (poorly implemented imho).
A quick google tells me nothing, and I haven't noticed anything in the media about them, so whats the deal legally?

There are no markings between the lines to suggest you aren't supposed to ride or drive in them.
I have been using them as my own private lane as no one else seems interested in using them, nobody driving in either direction has shown any sign of being unhappy with me doing it, of course I haven't met the popo while doing it yet.
I think the lines should be solid white or dashed or solid yellow (if your trying to keep cars apart why allow passing into an oncoming stream?),
and I can't imagine that the idea is for them to be used, but the way the are marked suggests otherwise.
Anybody able to enlighten me?

[Rhys]

They are intender to keep traffic apart, normally used in places were there is no room or no funding for crash barriers, and general used if there have been a number of head on crashes

[Berries]

Wot he said - wide centreline trial. (http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/wide-centreline-trial/)

You have stumbled on a bit of an issue though, they are not intended as motorcycle lanes, obviously, and if you were overtaking with oncoming traffic I would imagine you would get pulled. You are going to see a shit load more of these appearing in 2015 so it won't be long before someone posts about their ticket.

[Scuba_Steve]

While it's not specifically defined using them is fine as all other criteria is met i.e. not yellow lines, passing on right, not median strip etc
Just use em [sensibly]

[R650R]

This is a typical govt F up... just make shit up and don't inform the public about it.

For one you are allowed to overtake on them as they are NOT a painted median strip and they are dotted white lines not solid (few NZ drivers realise its illegal to move across a solid white line at intersections (eg last minute lane change).
The ones we have here have overtaking allowed when safe at the hastings end but no signage at napier part.

If they are a 'wide' centreline then legally you wont have crossed it until you break out of the right hand side marking. Eg it would be the same legally as someone pulling left like a tractor and you passing while staying in your lane or your wheels just touching the left edge of normal centreline.

The only good thing I can see is you would be able to hang out there to see if its safe to pass when your following a centreline hugger...

Its only a matter of time though before some elderly or drug impaired driver thinks its a lane and has massive head on crash as result.

I haven't been using them as a bike lane but I reckon a good lawyer could get you off the charge as all they technically represent is a lane less than the normal width.

[BlackSheepLogic]

If I chose to ride in the right of the lane I typically don't stray out of position 3 in the lane unless I'm looking to overtake. Being in-between these lines put you in closer proximity of oncoming traffic which increases risks.

[Bassmatt]

This is a typical govt F up... just make shit up and don't inform the public about it.

For one you are allowed to overtake on them as they are NOT a painted median strip and they are dotted white lines not solid (few NZ drivers realise its illegal to move across a solid white line at intersections (eg last minute lane change).
The ones we have here have overtaking allowed when safe at the hastings end but no signage at napier part.

If they are a 'wide' centreline then legally you wont have crossed it until you break out of the right hand side marking. Eg it would be the same legally as someone pulling left like a tractor and you passing while staying in your lane or your wheels just touching the left edge of normal centreline.

The only good thing I can see is you would be able to hang out there to see if its safe to pass when your following a centreline hugger...

Its only a matter of time though before some elderly or drug impaired driver thinks its a lane and has massive head on crash as result.

I haven't been using them as a bike lane but I reckon a good lawyer could get you off the charge as all they technically represent is a lane less than the normal width.

Thats pretty much my line of thinking.

[Bassmatt]

Wot he said - wide centreline trial. (http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/wide-centreline-trial/)

You have stumbled on a bit of an issue though, they are not intended as motorcycle lanes, obviously, and if you were overtaking with oncoming traffic I would imagine you would get pulled. You are going to see a shit load more of these appearing in 2015 so it won't be long before someone posts about their ticket.

Lots of info in that link, brilliant, thanks NZTA!

I would expect to be pulled over too but what offence will I be ticketed for? The way the lines are currently marked I dont think I would be breaking any road rules.

[neels]

I'd always assumed it was meant to be a motorcycle lane and used it accordingly, dashed white line, no flush median markings = lane available for use.

[rustyrobot]

So if Bassmatt and neels are both using the lane and going in opposite directions... who gives way? :innocent:

[haydes55]

So if Bassmatt and neels are both using the lane and going in opposite directions... who gives way? :innocent:


Some countries have implemented 2+1 roads, where a road is 3 lanes wide, you stay left unless you want to overtake, the central lane is for either direction to overtake. From what I've seen, first in first served in the lane, you need the usual visible clear distance ahead. Apparently reduced road toll by reducing overtaking in risky situations.

Treat the center lane as an oncoming lane at all times. If it is clear, and you have 100m clear sight (or 20m on a thou) then use it.

It's marked as a separate lane, treat it as such

[TLDV8]

I followed the posted link and it says it is to put a increased gap between oncoming traffic but is still a centreline.

Who uses a conventional narrow centreline as a lane, based on some of the posts, if a conventional broken centreline had the painted portions done so they were a metre wide (of solid paint) it would then become a lane for motorcycles.
Maybe the trial is sponsored by 'Tui.

Ironically if they did paint one metre wide solid dashes it would probably remove any confusion.

[swbarnett]

So if Bassmatt and neels are both using the lane and going in opposite directions... who gives way? :innocent:
Both. Don't use it unless you are absolutely certain that it's clear.

[Bassmatt]

I followed the posted link and it says it is to put a increased gap between oncoming traffic but is still a centreline.

Who uses a conventional narrow centreline as a lane, based on some of the posts, if a conventional broken centreline had the painted portions done so they were a metre wide (of solid paint) it would then become a lane for motorcycles.

Maybe the trial is sponsored by 'Tui.

Ironically if they did paint one metre wide solid dashes it would probably remove any confusion.

No, a metre wide strip of solid paint is not the same at all. AFAIK there isn't a roading system anywhere in the world that paints the whole lane but most systems use broken lines with an area of road between them to denote a lane, which is exactly the situation we have here.
I agree that a one metre solid painted line would probably remove any confusion. So would painting the lines yellow or have yellow cross markings between the lines. But they haven't done this so.....

[p.dath]

I had a think about this.
http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2004/0427/latest/whole.html

This defines a centre line as:


centre line,—
(a) in relation to any portion of a roadway not marked with a flush median, means 1 or more broken or solid lines of paint or raised studs (or any combination of those lines and studs) intended to separate opposing traffic:
(b) in relation to any portion of a roadway marked with a flush median, means the longitudinal white line that forms the left side of the flush median as viewed by a driver facing forward

So a centre line is defined as one or more broken or solid lines. You should stay to the left of them.

[TLDV8]

No, a metre wide strip of solid paint is not the same at all.

Same thing.
It seems hard to believe anyone would regard that separated version even if it was 10 feet wide as a lane for anything that might fit into it.
It does give some clarity to why we need the MOT/Police out there though.


307701307702

[bogan]

Ironically if they did paint one metre wide solid dashes it would probably remove any confusion.

With the paint we get it would certainly stop bikers from using it...


... for long anyway.

[swbarnett]

With the paint we get it would certainly stop bikers from using it...


... for long anyway.
Even crossing it would be treacherous.

[Bassmatt]

I had a think about this.
http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2004/0427/latest/whole.html

This defines a centre line as:


So a centre line is defined as one or more broken or solid lines. You should stay to the left of them.

You are allowed to cross the center line under certain circumstances, unless its a solid yellow line. Why should i stay to the left of these ones?

[Bassmatt]

Same thing.
It seems hard to believe anyone would regard that separated version even if it was 10 feet wide as a lane for anything that might fit into it.
It does give some clarity to why we need the MOT/Police out there though.


307701307702

The ones I have seen look further apart than that.
What about cycle lanes then, they are only a few feet wide are they a lane or not.

Look my point really is they could have made it 100% clear if they had used different markings.
FFS one of these is on a road that previously had a passing lane on it. The passing lane has been removed, there is obviously a problem with head on crashes on this stretch of road even with the passing lane. They then "separate" the oncoming streams of traffic with white broken lines as the markings, which you are entitled to cross. Are they trying to prevent head on collisions on this stretch of road or not. It's madness.

[willytheekid]

Why are you all arguing over MY private road?:confused:

...its MINE!:bleh:* (twas my Xmas prezzy from Rastuscat, Scumdog & Berg...honest!:innocent:)

Mind you...this was there first effort!:facepalm:

http://rs2img.memecdn.com/road-fail_o_1759781.jpg
...still, its the thought that counts:yes:



PS * you can all use it:yes::love:...but you have to do the KB wave to identify yourself :laugh:

pps...Ride safe KBers...and please stay on YOUR side of the road (As the above IS a piss take post...YES! it has to be said, sadly<_<)

[TLDV8]

The internets has no point but I like that thinking, the bicycle lane replacing the centreline is ingenious.

[p.dath]

You are allowed to cross the center line under certain circumstances, unless its a solid yellow line. Why should i stay to the left of these ones?

For the same reason you stay to the left of a single centreline.

[Swoop]

You are allowed to cross the center line under certain circumstances, unless its a solid yellow line. Why should i stay to the left of these ones?
A yellow line is meant to denote a particularly dangerous area where overtaking should not happen.
Sadly the "Yellow Paint Monster" (tm) has vomited in areas that make no sense.

[bogan]

A yellow line is meant to denote a particularly dangerous area where overtaking should not happen.
Sadly the "Yellow Paint Monster" (tm) has vomited in areas that make no sense.

My 'favorite' one are where they stop the yellow paint just as it gets far too dangerous to pass. Like, 'nobody will try passing here cos it's too dangerous, we'll just leave it and save on paint costs" :facepalm:

[Swoop]

My 'favorite' one are where they stop the yellow paint just as it gets far too dangerous to pass. Like, 'nobody will try passing here cos it's too dangerous, we'll just leave it and save on paint costs" :facepalm:

Looking at the fact sheet from nzta, regarding the wide centre-line trial...

It's appearing that instead of dealing with the problem1 they are applying a Band-Aid as a solution.



1: Poor driving skills.

[Scuba_Steve]

It's appearing that instead of dealing with the problem1 they are applying a Band-Aid as a solution.


The NZTA :shit: No, never; who would've expected that :shutup:

[Berries]

Some countries have implemented 2+1 roads, where a road is 3 lanes wide, you stay left unless you want to overtake, the central lane is for either direction to overtake. From what I've seen, first in first served in the lane, you need the usual visible clear distance ahead. Apparently reduced road toll by reducing overtaking in risky situations.
Years ago my hometown had this, it was great but in the end there were just too many big head on crashes so they got rid of it. The modern 2+1 roads you are thinking of are three lanes wide but only allow overtaking in one direction at a time, so two lanes in one direction and one in the other, generally separated by a wire rope which will then move over a lane so it is two in the other direction.

[Erelyes]

This is a typical govt F up... just make shit up and don't inform the public about it.

Wow... just... wow. NZTA is introducing something to actually try and make roads safer here. And how is copying a good idea that has demonstrably reduced crashes overseas 'making shit up'. Hop off the soapbox cunt.

First off, what do you propose we would gain by informing the public? Seems to me they are designed to passively influence crash statistics. They're not exactly teaching drivers anything here or even changing the road rules.


If they are a 'wide' centreline then legally you wont have crossed it until you break out of the right hand side marking. Eg it would be the same legally as someone pulling left like a tractor and you passing while staying in your lane or your wheels just touching the left edge of normal centreline.

Wait. Are you suggesting that both directions of traffic have 'right of way' in the no-mans-land between? Or that both lanes of traffic coexist in that space at the same time?

But to touch on the relevant point, if the divided centerline on your side of the road is yellow, and you cross it, you are passing illegaly. Doesn't matter if that is a divided centerline or not.

Should that line be broken white, I'm gonna do what I keep doing tbh.


Its only a matter of time though before some elderly or drug impaired driver thinks its a lane and has massive head on crash as result.

Oh! And people having massive head-on crashes everywhere will be such a change from status quo!

The NZTA factsheet posted earlier, cited sources showing a 55% reduction in head-on crashes in the states. Did you both reading the factsheet before you opened your whore mouth?


I'd always assumed it was meant to be a motorcycle lane and used it accordingly, dashed white line, no flush median markings = lane available for use.

So what happens when a biker comnig the other way thinks exactly the same thing? You end up bashing into each other because you made an assumption. You assumed that NZTA was introducing it so motorcycles could pass vehicles irrespective of oncoming traffic. No offense but that's a fucking dangerous assumption for a motorcyclist to be making.

[Ocean1]

Some countries have implemented 2+1 roads, where a road is 3 lanes wide, you stay left unless you want to overtake, the central lane is for either direction to overtake. From what I've seen, first in first served in the lane, you need the usual visible clear distance ahead. Apparently reduced road toll by reducing overtaking in risky situations.

Suicide lanes. Used to be a few up Orks way. They seemed to work OK when peak traffic meant seeing a car come the other way once every 10 minutes.

[buggerit]

The middle lane is the tourist lane, and they can use it when travelling in either direction:shit::whistle:This is so they are not confused on which
side of the road they should be on:not:

[Berries]

Given that most tourist crashes involve people who drive on the same side of the road that we do it is probably best to leave the middle bit for locals who don't know their own road rules.