Yamaha MT-07? [Archive] - Kiwi Biker forums

pritch

12th January 2015, 11:02

OK here's what passes for quick research. The "normal" version is 689cc, 75bhp, 125mph. *

The Yamaha NZ web site says, "The 655cc parallel twin has been purpose built in Japan to suit our learner market requirements. With heaps of instant torque and the same class leading light weight as the much heralded European MT-07, the Kiwi version is designed to appeal to experts and new riders alike."

Yamaha may be a tad optimistic, their low power NZ version certainly doesn't appeal to me, so it is crossed off my list. A pity.

* OK checked a print copy of BIKE, the 75bhp figure is "claimed", the 125mph is "estimated". Probably no need to worry about either of those with our special-for-you-Kiwi-low-power LAMS compliant version sadly.

Scubbo

12th January 2015, 11:28

DRZ is great on long rides, just stand on the pegs for a few mins and wait for your butt to reset :headbang:

BlackSheepLogic

13th January 2015, 11:33

Yamaha may be a tad optimistic, their low power NZ version certainly doesn't appeal to me, so it is crossed off my list. A pity.

Honda did the same thing with the CBR650F. It was a pity because I was quite interested in picking one up since the old CBR600Fi's don't come up for sale.

Phil.T.Tipp

13th January 2015, 15:24

LOL the tank range is thankfully miniscule - however, unfortunately it's still slightly longer than my arse range. What the DRZ-SM requires is fuckloads more CCs so you get where you're going faster, in less time, therefore with less numb bum. :yes:

Paulusgnome

14th January 2015, 16:50

GrayWolf

15th January 2015, 00:46

I asked at my Yamaha dealer (Trevor Pierce Motorcycles) about the power restriction, they said that there is a restriction in the throttle that can be removed for "full" ( ie LAMS plus) horsepower. However, if its a different engine to what is being sold elsewhere in the world then the suspicion would be that they have castrated it to make it learner-friendly. Damn, I quite liked the look of it up to now. I wonder if it is possible to import a fully-powered one from the US or the like?

From what I've read, the lam's version has been specifically done to retain the torque and 'feel' of the 'full power' 700cc version. Doesnt sound like it's castrated....

James Deuce

15th January 2015, 08:09

From what I've read, the lam's version has been specifically done to retain the torque and 'feel' of the 'full power' 700cc version. Doesnt sound like it's castrated....

Needs a side-by-side comparison. I sincerely doubt that a smaller capacity engine would have the same torque figures, because Physics. I would suggest that a lot of work has gone into mimicking the torque curve of the larger capacity bike. I was mildly interesting in one of these because it looked like value for money, but because I'm old, crusty, and bigoted, I don't feel that wasting money on a knobbled-learner-Girl's-bike feels like value. As much as that label is rooted in misogyny, it's a subtly subconscious effect, because most of us buy a bike because of how it makes us look and feel, as well as all the other benefits.

All my mates (the 3 or so of them left) would look at me more oddly if I bought a LAMS MT-07 rather than a non-LAMS Hyosung GT650. Actually, they probably wouldn't, but that's what I think, in my strictly Cartesian sceptic's perception. My experience is the only thing that is important, and a LAMS MT-07 would be a disquieting purchase.

Krayy

15th January 2015, 10:08

I asked at my Yamaha dealer (Trevor Pierce Motorcycles) about the power restriction, they said that there is a restriction in the throttle that can be removed for "full" ( ie LAMS plus) horsepower. However, if its a different engine to what is being sold elsewhere in the world then the suspicion would be that they have castrated it to make it learner-friendly. Damn, I quite liked the look of it up to now. I wonder if it is possible to import a fully-powered one from the US or the like?

I seriously hope that LAMS restrictions are a little more advanced than a bit of plastic to stop full throttle rotation. Wouldn't take much to circumvent. i thought the rectrictions needed to be in the ECU, throttle bodies etc.

James Deuce

15th January 2015, 10:13

I seriously hope that LAMS restrictions are a little more advanced than a bit of plastic to stop full throttle rotation. Wouldn't take much to circumvent. i thought the rectrictions needed to be in the ECU, throttle bodies etc.

It actually has a different cc rating to the full noise one sold overseas. You can't "Un-LAMS" it without an engine swap.

MT-07 LAMS: 38.8kW and 655cc
MT-07: 55kW and 689cc

cfxjason

15th January 2015, 10:46

I talked to yamaha and it just has a larger throttle stop so it only givs u half so they said to make it non lams the just grind down the throttle stop :-)

James Deuce

15th January 2015, 11:19

I talked to yamaha and it just has a larger throttle stop so it only givs u half so they said to make it non lams the just grind down the throttle stop :-)

Nope. You've been given duff information there. It's not just a throttle stop.

Pickle

16th January 2015, 17:03

Went for a ride on an Aussie LAM's approved MT07 and came away fairly impressed with the power, for a learner bike it has a lot of go certainly more than any Hyosung GT650 I have ridden ( restricted & full power), nicer ride than the hyo's as well. They are one of the biggest selling road bikes in Aussie at the moment

pritch

17th January 2015, 08:39

I talked to yamaha and it just has a larger throttle stop so it only givs u half so they said to make it non lams the just grind down the throttle stop :-)

Bollocks!!

Mike.Gayner

17th January 2015, 09:33

Trying to find out more about this bike, but it's bloody hard. As best I can tell the only differences between the restricted and the restricted and unrestricted versions are a 2mm bore reduction and a mechanical throttle stop. Here's the difference in throttle stops between the restricted and unrestricted versions:

http://imgur.com/a/ohX42

Nothing a grinder couldn't solve in a few seconds.

edit: Actually it looks like there are ECU differences. Some good info here:
http://www.motorcycle-talk.net/forum/mt-07-fz-07-general-discussion/601-restricted-mt-07-a.html

James Deuce

17th January 2015, 12:20

The version we get is built specifically for the Australian and NZ markets. To remove the restrictions and match the U.S. and Euro version requires a new engine and ECU. If you read Yamaha NZ's marketing bumpf on their web page they point out the LAMS MT07 is specific to the NZ and Aus markets. It certainly would be pointless and expensive to remedy. Therefore the MT07 is fundamentally crippled and its primary purpose is to get you to buy a bigger and "better" Yamaha when you get a "real" license.

I think the way the LAMS MT07 has been implemented is as cynical a dick move as the LAMS Street Cripple. Suzuki got it right with the GSX650FU. That is an honest attempt to sell a learner something that has long term value and will build customer loyalty. Yamaha and Triumph want to sell you a $15k bike so you'll spend $35k. Suzuki NZ would prefer long term customer loyalty.

BlackSheepLogic

17th January 2015, 13:44

The version we get is built specifically for the Australian and NZ markets. To remove the restrictions and match the U.S. and Euro version requires a new engine and ECU. If you read Yamaha NZ's marketing bumpf on their web page they point out the LAMS MT07 is specific to the NZ and Aus markets. It certainly would be pointless and expensive to remedy. Therefore the MT07 is fundamentally crippled and its primary purpose is to get you to buy a bigger and "better" Yamaha when you get a "real" license.

New engine unlikely. It's just not a big enough market to warrant the manufacturing cost let alone R&D costs to do it. Maybe some minor changes in the engine but most of the crippling will be ECU related.

Ocean1

17th January 2015, 14:01

New engine unlikely. It's just not a big enough market to warrant the manufacturing cost let alone R&D costs to do it. Maybe some minor changes in the engine but most of the crippling will be ECU related.

The bore is smaller. That's not the problem, and it could be said that Yamaha have refrained from a quick and dirty approach to re-engineering one of their existing line to meet what must be for them a small market.

The problem is that the heads are unchanged. Which means the compression is down. Which means that while it may be a more complete engineering solution for the LAMS market than some it's also a complete re-engineer to change it to EU/US spec's.

In the meantime, you'll notice that the torque figures are near identical, which in the real world means that only track day flyboys would possibly notice the difference.

I'm finding it deliciously ironic that the cream of the LAMS crop are turning out to be torque heavy thumpers that just happen to be light on revs, and therefore HP.

BlackSheepLogic

17th January 2015, 15:25

The problem is that the heads are unchanged. Which means the compression is down. Which means that while it may be a more complete engineering solution for the LAMS market than some it's also a complete re-engineer to change it to EU/US spec's

Wow, I'm shocked they went to that effort. Hope it doesn't hurt them long term by making it a less popular LAMs bike.

James Deuce

17th January 2015, 16:29

New engine unlikely. It's just not a big enough market to warrant the manufacturing cost let alone R&D costs to do it. Maybe some minor changes in the engine but most of the crippling will be ECU related.

It's a different bore for goodness sake! It doesn't have pressed in liners from what I can find. So it is a special run. What you guys forget is the the ENTIRE run of bikes over 500cc is a tiny fraction of every Japanese manufacturers output. The NZ and Aus LAMS market is worthwhile capturing.

The LAMS model is 655cc. The full noise one is 689cc. How do I make it any clearer?

pritch

17th January 2015, 20:35

Wow, I'm shocked they went to that effort. Hope it doesn't hurt them long term by making it a less popular LAMs bike.

You shouldn't be shocked, it had pretty much all been mentioned in the thread already. :whistle:

mossy1200

17th January 2015, 23:15

I'm finding it deliciously ironic that the cream of the LAMS crop are turning out to be torque heavy thumpers that just happen to be light on revs, and therefore HP.

Agree. If you ever get a chance ride a Honda revere (slight adaption to bros 650) which is on the Lams list. You wouldn't think it would be on the list because it feels grunty and 2 much pull to be there.

Ocean1

18th January 2015, 08:30

Agree. If you ever get a chance ride a Honda revere (slight adaption to bros 650) which is on the Lams list. You wouldn't think it would be on the list because it feels grunty and 2 much pull to be there.

Never seen one, but when the boy was looking for a bike I suggested a 650 Bros. As usual as soon as you want something they all went to ground, wasn't a tidy one on TM for months.

He ended up with an XT660X, which also has plenty enough grunt, (even two up passing is no problem) is probably more suitable for taller guys and just happens to sneak in under the hp/kg limit. I was touring with his cousin on an identical bike a couple of months ago and he managed just fine.

BlackSheepLogic

18th January 2015, 09:00

You shouldn't be shocked, it had pretty much all been mentioned in the thread already. :whistle:

It's difficult to get my head around the fact a Jap manufacture did it the right way not the cheap way like everyone else. I hope it works out for them.

Personally, I'm looking for a light bike in the 600 class but anything non-lams requires a Contortionists body position of lacks fairings. With an ECU limited bike it's less expensive to "fix" than putting in a new top end.

GrayWolf

18th January 2015, 10:12

It's a different bore for goodness sake! It doesn't have pressed in liners from what I can find. So it is a special run. What you guys forget is the the ENTIRE run of bikes over 500cc is a tiny fraction of every Japanese manufacturers output. The NZ and Aus LAMS market is worthwhile capturing.

The LAMS model is 655cc. The full noise one is 689cc. How do I make it any clearer?

Hello, Yamaha have a good track record for different bore versions of the same bike, the RD 250/350's for a kick off. Plus all the Japanese manufacturers made 700cc version of their 750's to meet the USA market. This is nothing 'new' to them, in fact if the bike is as Yamaha say, the torque is as high as the 'full noise' MT-07, it will be a damn good LAM's machine.
Lets not get into the Torque vs HP performance argument James, you know where I sit (so does Ocean I think) on that score.....

horsepower = how fast you hit the wall :cool:
Toruque = how far you take the wall with you. :devil2:

mossy1200

18th January 2015, 10:35

Hello, Yamaha have a good track record for different bore versions of the same bike, the RD 250/350's for a kick off. Plus all the Japanese manufacturers made 700cc version of their 750's to meet the USA market. This is nothing 'new' to them, in fact if the bike is as Yamaha say, the torque is as high as the 'full noise' MT-07, it will be a damn good LAM's machine.
Lets not get into the Torque vs HP performance argument James, you know where I sit (so does Ocean I think) on that score.....

horsepower = how fast you hit the wall :cool:
Toruque = how far you take the wall with you. :devil2:

Its hard to explain a bike that doesn't have high hp but has torque in the whole rev range. Its an unusual feeling to be sitting at road legal speeds but already be near max torque when you accelerate.

tri boy

18th January 2015, 11:52

Its hard to explain a bike that doesn't have high hp but has torque in the whole rev range. Its an usual feeling to be sitting at road legal speeds but already be near max torque when you accelerate.

Torquey bikes rule.
I got a 95Daytona triple with the old "steamer" engine.
Fatty, the scrambler,
Xr650L

None of them will win any races, but they sure are lovely engines. MHO

Ive got a semi woody for the MT 07.
Waiting to see the other incantations in the pipeline.(rumoured to be an adventure bike etc)

GrayWolf

19th January 2015, 13:33

Its hard to explain a bike that doesn't have high hp but has torque in the whole rev range. Its an unusual feeling to be sitting at road legal speeds but already be near max torque when you accelerate.

Yes I suppose it is, unless like yourself, the other person has owned such a machine :niceone: So many are too used to the 'rev it to get power' motors we have today.

Pickle

19th January 2015, 13:58

DamianW

19th January 2015, 14:34

Having seen one up close IMO it's a lovely looking bike. Also great to see even more choice for riders.

Pickle

19th January 2015, 14:41

cfxjason as per your original question the MT07 would be fine for doing longer rides on, its comfortable has enough room for 2 up if required & has enough power / torque to carry a load for those weekends away

BlackSheepLogic

19th January 2015, 15:28

Its big enough & has enough power / torque to tour easily - definitely has more roll on power than any of the current 4 cylinder 600s incl any of the supersport 600s that need to be revved to make them go. I think everyone is talking crap about wanting more power unless you are a straight line cowboy

You sir should stick to riding scooters and leave riding the big scary bikes to those of us with a greater claim to manhood.

Pickle

19th January 2015, 15:44

Maybe Blacksheep should know what he/she is talking about before commenting & if the best you got is implying I ride scooters then you got nothing

BlackSheepLogic

19th January 2015, 17:04

Maybe Blacksheep should know what he/she is talking about before commenting & if the best you got is implying I ride scooters then you got nothing

Not at all, you have a very large ego claiming after a ride that it has enough power that only cowboys would need more. For you maybe, for the rest of us it might or might not.

cfxjason

19th January 2015, 19:39

Well people i have bought one and i love it its leaps and bounds better than my drz for what i want

Very happy :-)

Pickle

19th January 2015, 20:34

Well done hope you enjoy

Pickle

19th January 2015, 20:37

Not at all, you have a very large ego claiming after a ride that it has enough power that only cowboys would need more. For you maybe, for the rest of us it might or might not.

Where did I say that only cowboys would need more, I stated it has good power & torque - it is a LAMS bike not a full horsepower bike like your GSX1300 or my KTM V Twin

GrayWolf

20th January 2015, 00:23

Not at all, you have a very large ego claiming after a ride that it has enough power that only cowboys would need more. For you maybe, for the rest of us it might or might not.

Ferchissake, back in the 1970's the Z1 was considered overpowered, at 87bhp. This constant 'lust' for BHP is absolutely pointless, I've owned the fastest bikes on the road, (for the time) last being a ZZR1100, which is still a formidable weapon 24yrs on. If most riders could use a 600cc to it's potential, they would all be extremely good riders, to use a 1000cc to it's fullest potential, we would all be called Andrew Stroud. 99.9% of us are not THAT good.
To have a bike that is capable of overtaking quickly and effectively for the style of riding you do, is all you need.. 2 up touring? then a big motor that can pull weight is required.... On straight lines or if going really quick on very tight stuff, I accept I'll be slower than, but most of the general riding I do in a group, I am certainly 'up with the play'... on a low horsepower, high torque machine.
Any EGO is only really when the rider HAS to have the latest whizzbang GBX1000 super duper crotch exciter; just because it's got more power than anyone else. most cant handle what they already have.

BlackSheepLogic

20th January 2015, 08:02

Ferchissake, back in the 1970's the Z1 was considered overpowered, at 87bhp. This constant 'lust' for BHP is absolutely pointless, I've owned the fastest bikes on the road, (for the time) last being a ZZR1100, which is still a formidable weapon 24yrs on. If most riders could use a 600cc to it's potential, they would all be extremely good riders, to use a 1000cc to it's fullest potential, we would all be called Andrew Stroud. 99.9% of us are not THAT good.
To have a bike that is capable of overtaking quickly and effectively for the style of riding you do, is all you need.. 2 up touring? then a big motor that can pull weight is required.... On straight lines or if going really quick on very tight stuff, I accept I'll be slower than, but most of the general riding I do in a group, I am certainly 'up with the play'... on a low horsepower, high torque machine.

A bikes like your ZZR1100, a ZX14R or a Busa are not track bikes and they not sold as track bikes. Any argument about the bike & riders abilities to ride like a maniac misses the point of these bikes. The top sped of these bikes tends to colorize perceptions about the bike & riders which is unfortunate.

Any EGO is only really when the rider HAS to have the latest whizzbang GBX1000 super duper crotch exciter; just because it's got more power than anyone else. most cant handle what they already have.

The EGO is in defining a bike/rider based on your personal bike needs/sensibilities. Someone with a GSX1000R clearly has a different need to you or I. If it meets their needs and pushes the right buttons for them it's none of my of your business if they can ride it within an inch of it's life or not, nor should you care. A part of riding is the enjoyment of the ride which will always influence a riders choice of bike.

pritch

20th January 2015, 08:11

And unless you have actually ridden the bike I don't see how any of you can make a statement on what any bike needs

Again, bollocks. I was interested in an MT-07 following reading the road tests in overseas magazines. This is not the MT-07 I read about and I'm not interested. Simple.

BlackSheepLogic

20th January 2015, 08:26

Where did I say that only cowboys would need more, I stated it has good power & torque - it is a LAMS bike not a full horsepower bike like your GSX1300 or my KTM V Twin

I read your post I guess differently to that intended.

I've known learners who have started out on +1000cc bikes along with learners who started off on the "more sensible" smaller bikes. Learners who I have known who started off on the bigger bikes developed better riding skills, kept the bike longer, and got a lot more enjoyment from the bike. They also had less accidents.

This is why I feel learner bikes are a misnomer. The right power & bike is whatever is right for the individual ridder.

GrayWolf

21st January 2015, 09:41

A bikes like your ZZR1100, a ZX14R or a Busa are not track bikes and they not sold as track bikes. Any argument about the bike & riders abilities to ride like a maniac misses the point of these bikes. The top sped of these bikes tends to colorize perceptions about the bike & riders which is unfortunate.

yes the top speed of these bikes does 'colour' perceptions. Many buy them for nothing other than the exact reason, they ARE the fastest machines on the road. ZZR/ZXR/'busa/etc are all designed as 'intercontinental missiles' to travel 1000miles a day, every day. So where in NZ do we have those roads? There are those who I have ridden with, who can ride these bikes quite 'hard', and I have no issue with that at all.

The EGO is in defining a bike/rider based on your personal bike needs/sensibilities. Someone with a GSX1000R clearly has a different need to you or I. If it meets their needs and pushes the right buttons for them it's none of my of your business if they can ride it within an inch of it's life or not, nor should you care. A part of riding is the enjoyment of the ride which will always influence a riders choice of bike.

The EGO I'm referring to, and you know full well, is not the 'what floats my boat for looks etc', but the 'I want it, because I want the bragging rights' EGO. Bikes like the new Kwaka really concern me, not because I think that like their original namesakes H1/H2, they will become 'widowmakers', but this constant producing of more powerful cars and bikes can only end one way, Govt' intervention on a global scale. If you think it cant happen, Just research Germany's and the European regulations. Germany had a 'self imposed 100bhp limit' for many years. Any modification parts for a bike must be 'type approved' for that particular model, so if a new better tyre is produced and not 'type approved'? Tough shit, it's illegal to fit it, even handlebars and aftermarket footrests are subject to this draconian regulation. Once Govt's start on this route, it will only end one way, 'type approved'.
I'll reiterate, I have no issue with people buying exotic/mega powerful machinery, as long as they are ACTUALLY competent to use it. Porsche (Europe) used to (may still) organise instruction for new purchasers of the 911's because of the 'arse heavy' handling characteristics. We could end up with a similar license system to Europe? Stepped, where you have to prove experience, or take approved training to go 'up' in power/cc...
The reason I dont use the ZZR, is personal choice, the bike doesnt produce its 'real power' till 6k rpm, which in top gear is 150kph, up to that point my old FJ1200 was actually a 'better' ride for engine flexibility.

BlackSheepLogic

21st January 2015, 12:39

yes the top speed of these bikes does 'colour' perceptions. Many buy them for nothing other than the exact reason, they ARE the fastest machines on the road. ZZR/ZXR/'busa/etc are all designed as 'intercontinental missiles' to travel 1000miles a day, every day. So where in NZ do we have those roads? There are those who I have ridden with, who can ride these bikes quite 'hard', and I have no issue with that at all.yes the top speed of these bikes does 'colour' perceptions. Many buy them for nothing other than the exact reason, they ARE the fastest machines on the road. ZZR/ZXR/'busa/etc are all designed as 'intercontinental missiles' to travel 1000miles a day, every day. So where in NZ do we have those roads? There are those who I have ridden with, who can ride these bikes quite 'hard', and I have no issue with that at all.

I use mine as a sport tourer, there are plenty of nice roads in NZ to ride all day no matter the reason. It's a responsive bike pretty much in any gear loaded or unloaded. One of the nicest well mannered bikes I've owned and comfortable to ride all day. In the early years of the Busa I'm sure some were bought for the top speed but riders looking for that nowadays don't buy a Busa.

The EGO I'm referring to, and you know full well, is not the 'what floats my boat for looks etc', but the 'I want it, because I want the bragging rights' EGO. Bikes like the new Kwaka really concern me, not because I think that like their original namesakes H1/H2, they will become 'widowmakers', but this constant producing of more powerful cars and bikes can only end one way, Govt' intervention on a global scale. If you think it cant happen, Just research Germany's and the European regulations. Germany had a 'self imposed 100bhp limit' for many years. Any modification parts for a bike must be 'type approved' for that particular model, so if a new better tyre is produced and not 'type approved'? Tough shit, it's illegal to fit it, even handlebars and aftermarket footrests are subject to this draconian regulation. Once Govt's start on this route, it will only end one way, 'type approved'.
I'll reiterate, I have no issue with people buying exotic/mega powerful machinery, as long as they are ACTUALLY competent to use it. Porsche (Europe) used to (may still) organise instruction for new purchasers of the 911's because of the 'arse heavy' handling characteristics. We could end up with a similar license system to Europe? Stepped, where you have to prove experience, or take approved training to go 'up' in power/cc...
The reason I dont use the ZZR, is personal choice, the bike doesnt produce its 'real power' till 6k rpm, which in top gear is 150kph, up to that point my old FJ1200 was actually a 'better' ride for engine flexibility.

Fair point.

frisken

21st January 2015, 13:44

Again, bollocks. I was interested in an MT-07 following reading the road tests in overseas magazines. This is not the MT-07 I read about and I'm not interested. Simple.

So you read about a bike, found out the bike you were interested in wasn't the same bike you read about, so wrote it off instead of actually taking it out for a test ride? I fail to see the logic here ...

Longest story in the world short: Go and take one for a ride. See for yourself what it's like. People have different perceptions and expectations of power (depending on many factors). You should know what you want, and if the MT-07 feels right then it probably is. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with the bike, so if you like what you see/feel/experience, then you will like the bike. Easy as that.

BlackSheepLogic

21st January 2015, 14:31

So you read about a bike, found out the bike you were interested in wasn't the same bike you read about, so wrote it off instead of actually taking it out for a test ride? I fail to see the logic here ....

I usually narrow down the perspective bikes before test riding. Can't take every bike out before I make my decision. Like pritch
after doing a little research & looking at the specs if ithe bike don't interest me I move on.

pritch

21st January 2015, 15:17

I usually narrow down the perspective bikes before test riding. Can't take every bike out before I make my decision. Like pritch
after doing a little research & looking at the specs if ithe bike don't interest me I move on.

Thank you - a good explanation. I have explained the logic elsewhere on KB so I won't repeat myself (on this occasion anyway). I have a basic, if somewhat nebulous, specification in mind and in part it does involve a minimum horsepower figure below which I have no wish to go. The full power MT-07 exceeds that figure - just. The smaller LAMS version falls way short. Simple.

I don't need to ride a 250 to know I don't want one of them either. Maybe when I'm 80?

James Deuce

21st January 2015, 21:02

All this talk about the MT07 not producing any power & de-restricting the bike YET No One here has actually ridden one except ME, as far as LAMs approved bikes go this thing is great, most learners who actually buy one & ride it wont need to have more power for a long time. Its big enough & has enough power / torque to tour easily - definitely has more roll on power than any of the current 4 cylinder 600s incl any of the supersport 600s that need to be revved to make them go. I think everyone is talking crap about wanting more power unless you are a straight line cowboy remember this bike is meant to be a LAMs bike, if you want more power go buy something FULL POWER
And unless you have actually ridden the bike I don't see how any of you can make a statement on what any bike needs

You've utterly missed the point. I'm not asking for more power. I don't want to buy a deliberately crippled version of a what is shaping up to be the closest thing to a modern LC, made specifically to comply with LAMS regs in NZ and Australia because I don't want to. I'm not interested in it purely from an ego perspective, which if everyone was honest, is where 90% of the decision about what bike to buy comes from. Therefore I'm not even vaguely interested in entertaining the thought of riding one. I also think it's just a cynical marketing ploy designed to move MT07 buyers "up" the capacity chain ASAP. Much the same as the LAMS Street Cripple.

The bike purchase prior to my last was one made entirely devoid of ego and completely done from the head. How to combine the power of a 600cc sportsbike and the utility of a CB400F. It was the biggest mistake I ever made. I was stuck with that Z750 for years and despite hurling money at suspension and brakes the only thing that had character was the engine. It was let down by finish, assembly quality, suspension quality (fixed) brake feel (partially fixed) and comfort. Seat like a plank, standard suspension made of under damped rocks. Then after reading the press one found out it was a good learner's bike or girl's bike. Despite being hugely popular in France, the rest of the world went , "Meh", and said, "Good Girl's Bike bro".

So never again. A bike is a passion purchase. It's meant to make you feel good and impress your mates. Or at least give them something to talk about without sniggering. If it does that for a learner, that's great.

frisken

22nd January 2015, 07:33

So never again. A bike is a passion purchase. It's meant to make you feel good and impress your mates. Or at least give them something to talk about without sniggering. If it does that for a learner, that's great.

I don't mean to judge. But fuck me we have different reasons for buying a bike ... I like to enjoy riding mine!

James Deuce

22nd January 2015, 07:43

I don't mean to judge. But fuck me we have different reasons for buying a bike ... I like to enjoy riding mine!

That's certainly part of the equation. But you have to like it to enjoy riding it. There is nothing worse than buying something and then loathing it and not being in a position to sell it because no one else wants to buy it (like a Z750 for instance) or you can't fund the cavernous gulf between trade in and what you actually want. That sucks a great deal of enjoyment out of a owning and riding a bike.

Also, I don't think you're being even 10% honest with yourself if you don't think you're riding a bike because it will get you laid and make you look cool. It does neither, but it's important that it makes you FEEL that way.

pritch

22nd January 2015, 07:50

I don't mean to judge. But fuck me we have different reasons for buying a bike ... I like to enjoy riding mine!

There are two reasons people buy something: the reason they tell you, and the real reason. James is being honest.

In twenty first century New Zealand nobody needs a motorbike. We buy them because we want one, and we make our choice according to a whole range of emotional and practical criteria. Not hard to envisage when you look at extremes like a Ducati Panigale and a Harley Fat Bob. The respective purchasers of those two models would be looking for very different things in a motorcycle. Just as James, blacksheeplogic and I are looking for something different to what you are looking for and to each other.

May you continue to enjoy riding your bike, but it isn't valid to assume that others don't.

You aren't related to Cassina by any chance?:sherlock:

Mike.Gayner

22nd January 2015, 09:22

James Deuce it's extremely refreshing to see someone being so honest about why we ride and why we buy the bikes we buy. You are, of course, 100% correct.

GrayWolf

22nd January 2015, 09:28

Also, I don't think you're being even 10% honest with yourself if you don't think you're riding a bike because it will get you laid and make you look cool. It does neither, but it's important that it makes you FEEL that way.

Didnt work did it James?? :facepalm::facepalm:

That is the biggest lot of truth & bollox I can think of, probably accurate in many cases, and those SHOULD'NT be let near a friggin motorcycle. Buy a bike to look cool and get laid? :facepalm::facepalm: I've NEVER bought a bike for that reason, even when a sprog; becuase they were fast, yes, because I liked the look, yes, even because in the case of the H1 they were fast and owning one was almost a 'oooooo he has a H1, and still alive'. :gob: I've never bought a fucking bike to 'get laid'.... So I aint being 10% honest?? :whistle:

James Deuce

22nd January 2015, 09:32

So I aint being 10% honest?? http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/images/smilies/whistling.gif

Correct, you just THINK that you're above all that. ;)

Oh, and it doesn't work. In the end all you're left with is enjoying the ride, but if you don't enjoy the ride it just makes you English or grumpy.

Mike.Gayner

22nd January 2015, 10:02

Graywolf I think you're deliberately misunderstanding what James is saying. No one here rides because it makes them look cool or because it gets them laid - we all ride for the love of it. But to say the cool factor doesn't factor into why we chose the particular bikes we buy - I agree with James, you're not being honest with yourself.

BlackSheepLogic

22nd January 2015, 15:38

In the end all you're left with is enjoying the ride, but if you don't enjoy the ride it just makes you English or grumpy.

It's why I have two bikes. I need the UZ125 for a daily 10K commute. I want a bike to ride & enjoy (that's currently my busa).

DamianW

22nd January 2015, 20:03

My Daytona 675 has only ever been about the ride, simple. Do I care whether other people think it's cool or not? Nope. A few guys who I occasionally ride with (zx10r, blade, and cbr600rr) do not show these so called Ego's either in their personality or riding style. I just don't accept the assertion that 9/10 riders put cool factor at the top of their list of needs.

pzkpfw

22nd January 2015, 22:29

I bought mine largely cos' JD convinced me. It wasn't because he's cool.

Big Dog

23rd January 2015, 00:10

Image plays a bigger part than most of us would admit.
I doubt I would have bought any of my bikes had they been pink with tassels.
Basic sales psych: if the mark can't see themselves in / on it they won't buy it. If they can and they don't like what they see they won't. If they can and like what they see all the specs or requirements in the world won't stop them.

Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

"D" FZ1

23rd January 2015, 13:11

James Deuce

23rd January 2015, 13:39

I never said they were "bad".

Not once.

I said I'm not interested in the LAMS version.

So when are we going to get a Yamaha dealer in the Wellington region who stocks road bikes so I CAN take one for a ride?

pritch

23rd January 2015, 16:09

I have got a Demo MT-07 at Motorcycle Central Yamaha in Barrys Point Road, Takapuna if anyone wants to ride it and make your own mind up instead of reading all of the crap on here.

In the three months that they have been out I have sold 20 of them so they can't be that bad!!!

Perhaps you need to work on your reading and comprehension skills? Nobody has rubbished it, we made the point that it's a shame a nice bike has been crippled to make it learner legal. The Yamaha blurb that says the MT-07 suits learners and experienced riders is overly optimistic. Pity they didn't do what Triumph have done and import both versions. And I have told my local Yamaha dealer that. Whoever thought I'd have ever been singing the praises of the Triumph importer?

Does your boss know you insult potential customers?

Big Dog

23rd January 2015, 16:18

Big Dog

23rd January 2015, 16:20

It would be an honest review. Warts and all.

Stupid phone / Tapatalk, apologies in advance.

GrayWolf

24th January 2015, 06:51

Perhaps you need to work on your reading and comprehension skills? Nobody has rubbished it, we made the point that it's a shame a nice bike has been crippled to make it learner legal. The Yamaha blurb that says the MT-07 suits learners and experienced riders is overly optimistic. Pity they didn't do what Triumph have done and import both versions. And I have told my local Yamaha dealer that. Whoever thought I'd have ever been singing the praises of the Triumph importer?

Does your boss know you insult potential customers?

I think the point that has also been made, is, that if as Yamaha state, the torque figures are the same a the 'full size' MT-07, it isnt going to be 'crippled'.. Just like some here who tested the MT-01 it gt 'bagged' (for running out of rev's, being breathless, oh and vibrites like a bastard, was one comment.... yup, throbbing is 'designed in', runs out of revs? yup, redline of 5.5k rpm)... tested by crotchrocket riders, with no idea how to ride a high torque, low HP bike. So my guess is the MT-07 (lams) will receive a similar 'fate'... high torque will give it good overtaking at normal road speeds, just likely the top speed will be lower than the full chat MT-07.... you dont NEED 'full chat' 600cc multi cylinder bikes as a learner.

pritch

24th January 2015, 08:43

[QUOTE=GrayWolf;1130821592] Just like some here who tested the MT-01 it gt 'bagged' (for running out of rev's, being breathless, oh and vibrites like a bastard, was one comment.... yup, throbbing is 'designed in', runs out of revs? yup, redline of 5.5k rpm)... tested by crotchrocket riders, with no idea how to ride a high torque, low HP bike. So my guess is the MT-07 (lams) will receive a similar 'fate'... /QUOTE]

Even the magazine road tests have to be studied with a supply of salt handy. Some use former racers as testers. Despite their fevered imaginings most riders will not be riding like the ex racer. BIKE magazine use a variety of riders and roads and I have found their tests to be informative.

My "favourite" test concerned Jim's beloved LC2. The guy jumped on it, set out from England, rode across Europe and back. Among the other details his "test " reported that the tank range was poor and that the bike wasn't very comfortable. I don't know what they paid him for that, but whatever it was it was too much.

ruaphu

1st February 2015, 13:47

Check out the latest Australian road rider mag, they have a decent write up on the LAM's MT07

Mike.Gayner

1st February 2015, 14:02

you dont NEED 'full chat' 600cc multi cylinder bikes as a learner.

And this doesn't NEED to be a learner bike, either.

Is it so hard to understand why some people would like to have access to the full fat version of this bike?

Bonkievan

19th February 2015, 20:42

casualsonic

20th March 2015, 15:52

I have an Mt-07 and it fits my riding capabilities perfectly at present, most probably far to much performance for my ability if I'm honest.

However, i can certainly understand what other posters here are getting at regarding 'Why should i buy it with it being watered down' for them to seriously consider it. Kind of like being told to buy a restricted Racing Kart rather than the 'full blown', because someone said "its all you'll need" "and "goes just as well" etc etc. Crap analogy but you know what i mean ;-)

Even if Yamaha NZ imported the MT-07 5to1 in favour of the LAMs version, over the bigger bore Euro, I'm sure they wouldn't have any problem shifting units and give those that can, want, or to test ride the 'full' MT-07 the option to do so.

Good on ya bro!!!
I've got one too.... Absolutely love the thing... This is my 4th bike and although I'm still on my restricted and I wanted a bike to ride legally and suit me enough to move into my full, it suits me perfect.

Great around town to commute to work, plenty of guts to cruise on the open road and pass without a blink of an eyelid... I come from a Harley family and been for a few rides with them (tagging along at the back) and although they don't tend to speed I've pottered along behind them nicely (only getting bored on the corners as they scrape and carry on lol).

Like I said, this bike checked all my boxes at the time of purchase and will keep me happy for a few years to come.

I guess it come down to what the rider wants the bike for... And for many learners out there... It's a bike which will see us through our learning stages and into our full for a few years. It'll keep us legal and allow us to move onto a bigger bike when ready.

In saying that... The statement on the Yamaha's website about 'being fun for the most experienced rider' isn't all that bad of a lie either... My father and uncle and grandfather had fun when they went for a blast on the MT-07... I wouldn't expect them to sell their Harley's and Honda CBthou's for one though!

Those comments about wanting a full powered MT-07.... Why not try the MT-09????

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

george formby

20th March 2015, 22:53

Been watching a load of online reviews of the bike lately, I like. It's 50kg, approx, lighter than my current bike, same engine layout, same crossplane crank (mine was made in 1998...), has more torque, revs higher and makes the same power. Crikey!
LAMS is great, that was the design brief, but I want full fat, preferably sit up like the Tracer and an Akrapovic pipe. 19" front wheel would be perfect.
Yeah, na. Brilliant bike, NZ needs both.
I'm awaiting a comparison from a Duke 690 owner after a MT 07 test ride in the UK.

cxy

3rd April 2015, 12:04

ducatilover

3rd April 2015, 18:51

Nope. You've been given duff information there. It's not just a throttle stop.

Yes it is. :yes:
Just a smaller motor that gets no throttle.
About SV650 pace when you take the stop off
So, slow as fuck either way

Mike.Gayner

2nd August 2015, 16:31

Well the good news is NZ dealers are now getting the "High Output" version - the full-fat non-neutered bike. At $11,995 it's incredibly good value and I think I'll have to head down to Bayride and have a test ride. Still less powerful than I was hoping for my next bike, but I can't think of anything better in the new market for that price.

James Deuce

2nd August 2015, 16:37

easy....Big Mac @ Maistone

OK then, a Yamaha dealer that has some bikes in the shop.

James Deuce

2nd August 2015, 16:37

mossy1200

2nd August 2015, 17:32

wayne

2nd August 2015, 17:40

anyone racing one in protwins ?

mossy1200

2nd August 2015, 17:55

anyone racing one in protwins ?

Likely haven't been available long enough for that yet.

Mike.Gayner

2nd August 2015, 17:55

For 1k less and 110hp z800

Until they run out - that is a super-limited offer, and yes a very good one.

For 1k more a mt09 triple 115hp

Well, $2k more, and they're quite a different class of bike. But I get your point - I'd probably stretch and get the 09 myself.

mossy1200

2nd August 2015, 18:00

Well, $2k more, and they're quite a different class of bike. But I get your point - I'd probably stretch and get the 09 myself.

I think they are 1k more at the moment. The mt07 full power is dearer than the lams version and the mt09 is reduced price.

george formby

2nd August 2015, 18:48

Full fat? Good news. I'm gonna hang out for the MT07 Tracer, though. The replacement for my TDM need not have more power but must have less weight.

pritch

2nd August 2015, 19:46

For 1k less and 110hp z800

I would be somewhat guarded about the z800. It's better than the z750 but that was unviversally decreed to ba a dog in the dead tree world.

It is good news that the full phat MT-07 is available - another option.

James Deuce

2nd August 2015, 21:53

For 1k less and 110hp z800
For 1k more a mt09 triple 115hp

Not sure the mt07 full hp bike at 70hp is all that attractive. The issue would be the lams version will retain good value for resale but the full power version maybe not such a good resale.

They look good though.

I think they are 1k more at the moment. The mt07 full power is dearer than the lams version and the mt09 is reduced price.

The MT-09 is hugely compromised so I'm not surprised the price has dropped. It's stellar reviews are largely down to the shock that Yamaha did something innovative by copying a British bike and installing crap suspension and terrible fueling but a bigger engine to try and hide the deficit. However you're still left spending $3-4k to fix suspension and fueling, so the apparent price difference is much higher between the 09 and 07. The Tracer addresses most of those issues (apparently) but is more expensive again.

I quite like the Z800 but having had to spend stupid amounts of money on my Z750 to make it handle and breathe and then realise that is was still fat and ugly, puts me off "cheap" Kawasakis. The Versys is at least silly, ugly, fun, and will wheelie in the bottom two gears with a little provocation where the Z750 needed to be strangled and spanked at the same time to make it stand up and it still wouldn't make eggs in the morning or iron your shirt.

The MT-07 is like the Versys. More than the sum of its parts. Expectations are low for the Versys, as they probably are for the MT-07, so exceeding those expectations is a very happy moment indeed.