Minutes from BRONZ meeting with ACC minister on safety and levy reduction

[davebullet]

BRONZ representatives met with ACC minister Nikki Kaye, ACC and MBIE delegates on 17/6/15 about how to work towards improving motorcycle safety and transparency around levy setting and reduction goals.

The meeting was a productive first session where ACC and MBIE will meet with BRONZ over the coming months before reviewing again with The Minister in three months time.

BRONZ also invited the minister to observe the required Basic Handling Skills test required for a learner license and following Competency Based Training Assessment (CBTA). The CBTA is a relatively recent system introduced for improving a motorcyclists skills and also reducing the time required per license stage. A further press release will advise date, time and location for The Minister's observation session.

SUMMARY OF POINTS / IDEAS THUS FAR:
1. Any powered two wheeler must have motorcycle (not car) license class (ie. class 6) - or allocate scooter crashes to car statistics
2. Levy the rider - but linked to bike on hold registration
3. Discounts for accredited training
4. Discounts for appropriate riding gear
5. Study relationship between motorcycle power/rider experience and crashes
6. Discounts for bikes with safety features (eg. traction control, ABS, electronic suspension.... )




A copy of the meeting minutes is below:



http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=313380&d=1435911817
http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=313379&d=1435911817

[98tls]

To be blunt he simply doesnt give a fuck about Bronz or motorcycle levy reductions,meeting with you does at best fill in some time,applaud your intentions but will carry on doing just as i did today and put the bikes rego on hold.

[Katman]

To be blunt he simply doesnt give a fuck about Bronz or motorcycle levy reductions

Except he's a she these days.

[98tls]

Except he's a she these days.

There you go eh,hard to tell these days.Either way they dont give a fuck or even show the smallest intention of doing so.

[mossy1200]

Where are the meetings minutes?
Looks like it was a couple of minutes of meeting.

[98tls]

Where are the meetings minutes?
Looks like it was a couple of minutes of meeting.

What part of he/she doesnt give a fuck didnt you get M?

[Katman]

There you go eh,hard to tell these days.

Seriously, if you can't tell the difference between Nikki Kaye and Nick Smith your eyes need checking.

And your pulse.

[mossy1200]

What part of he/she doesnt give a fuck didnt you get M?

All I can make out is try again in 3months and ill let some office junior talk to you next time.

[Moi]

I think you will get more sense out of Nikki Kaye than you'd ever get out of Nick "we're building houses" Smith...

[Katman]

Actually I feel like staging a coup at MSAC just so I can be the one to sit and gaze across a table at her.

[Katman]

I'd get her and Jacinda Adern working together on something.

[FJRider]

I'd get her and Jacinda Adern working together on something.

Each other ... maybe ... <_<

[Katman]

And I'd have Mojo Mathers keeping minutes.

[Katman]

Each other ... maybe ... <_<

Why do you have to sully such a beautiful story?

[FJRider]

Seriously, if you can't tell the difference between Nikki Kaye and Nick Smith your eyes need checking.

And your pulse.

I prefer to judge MP's on results ... not their gender.


If the talk (and results) are the same from both ... does it matter the sex ... ??

[FJRider]

Why do you have to sully such a beautiful story?

It's what I do ... apparently ... :innocent:



You however ... just keep bleating on ... :facepalm:

[Berries]

Seriously, if you can't tell the difference between Nikki Kaye and Nick Smith your eyes need checking..
To be fair, in Auckland and Wellington Nikki could be a blokes name.

[98tls]

To be fair, in Auckland and Wellington Nikki could be a blokes name.

To be fair in Auckland or Wellington Nikki could indeed be accepted as a man.....

[98tls]

Seriously, if you can't tell the difference between Nikki Kaye and Nick Smith your eyes need checking.

And your pulse.

As per my last post.

[98tls]

I think you will get more sense out of Nikki Kaye than you'd ever get out of Nick "we're building houses" Smith...

Possibly but what you wont get is any interest in motorcycles or the levys attached to them.

[GTRMAN]

Possibly but what you wont get is any interest in motorcycles or the levys attached to them.
You may be right, or you may be wrong. But from my perspective sitting in the meeting there was actual interest from Nikki.

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

[MadDuck]

All I can make out is try again in 3months and ill let some office junior talk to you next time.

Despite a huge effort from the BRONZ team over the last 6 months this kind of sums it up. It is not easy and if we think this has changed anything whatsoever then for lack of words .... :bleh:

[Voltaire]

Would not ACC look at riding gear other than the mandatory helmet?
Is there a relationship between motorcycle power/rider experience and crashes?

[jellywrestler]

Would not ACC look at riding gear other than the mandatory helmet?
Is there a relationship between motorcycle power/rider experience and crashes?

how would you apply that to a bike, they are registered, not the rider....

[mossy1200]

Still maintain Levy the licence not each bike since the cover is for injury of the person. Do that and the lower risk riders will consume more bikes leaving the inexperienced part timers less cheap bikes to buy. Before you argue this makes as much sense as anything else being tried and I just want to own a lot more bikes without insuring myself more often. :shutup:

[local]

Still maintain Levy the licence not each bike since the cover is for injury of the person. Do that and the lower risk riders will consume more bikes leaving the inexperienced part timers less cheap bikes to buy. Before you argue this makes as much sense as anything else being tried and I just want to own a lot more bikes without insuring myself more often. :shutup:

As long as you can put your class 6 licence on hold when you have no bikes or are not riding them for >3 months this could work.

[Rhys]

Are scooter crashes added to motorcycle or car statistics ? As they are ride on a car license it would make sense to be added to car statistics

[Voltaire]

how would you apply that to a bike, they are registered, not the rider....

Don't know, it makes me cringe when I see riders with no gloves or office attire.

Currently its either make it the law and you get fined for non compliance or education.

Sliding across the track at Taupo a few weeks ago showed me the value of gloves and leathers.

Talking to the guy at Star Insurance last week whilst looking at his basement of crash damaged bikes I asked about what the common crashes were.

Front end sliding out seemed to be a common one, in his opinion riders were going in to a corner too hot, then throttling off, unsettling the bike and off the road.

These were bikes with ABS and Traction Control.

If I was ACC I'd give a discount on the ACC portion of the rego for attendance at The California Superbike School or similar rider training.

More training and education and better riding gear.

[tri boy]

I don't give a fuck what conditions that are required BEFORE ACC will CONSIDER changes to the levy system.
I don't give a fuck about many things...............

[davebullet]

how would you apply that to a bike, they are registered, not the rider....

You make an application on change of ownership also supplying your drivers license.

When the bike sells, the ACC levy reverts to the highest level for the risk class of bike. You apply (on buying) to reduce based on rider criteria.

[davebullet]

I don't give a fuck what conditions that are required BEFORE ACC will CONSIDER changes to the levy system.
I don't give a fuck about many things...............

So why are you here?

[Swoop]

Are scooter crashes added to motorcycle or car statistics ? As they are ride on a car license it would make sense to be added to car statistics

That should be one of the first points to work on, as well as getting farm bikes removed from statistics even remotely involving road registered bikes.

[Moi]

That should be one of the first points to work on, as well as getting farm bikes removed from statistics even remotely involving road registered bikes.

I'd like to see this "it's under 50cc so you can ride it on a car licence" [and now 125cc Yamaha Tricity] abolished... if it is a PTW [powered two wheeler] then you have the appropriate licence...

However, this may require a total rethink of how licences are structured and may require people being taught how to ride or drive...

[GTRMAN]

I'd like to see this "it's under 50cc so you can ride it on a car licence" [and now 125cc Yamaha Tricity] abolished... if it is a PTW [powered two wheeler] then you have the appropriate licence...

However, this may require a total rethink of how licences are structured and may require people being taught how to ride or drive...
Fair point, it may also require talking to the Ministry of Transport who own the licensing system. There is a review later this year.

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

[tri boy]

So why are you here?

To stir the pot.
Yours?

[James Deuce]

I really don't want to be represented by BRONZ in any way. Can I pay double the ACC levy instead please?

[davebullet]

To stir the pot.
Yours?

Please sir bump this post! For me to save a life and money. I'll take my knighthood next year

[davebullet]

I really don't want to be represented by BRONZ in any way. Can I pay double the ACC levy instead please?

I'll make sure not to mention your name Jim.

[mossy1200]

I'll make sure not to mention your name Jim.

Tell them if I am going to be treated like the object of an insurance policy I want to only pay my policy once as I cant crash 2 bikes at the same time and I don't want to cover 280k licenced riders when there is not 280k registered motorcycles in the country. You can mention my name if you like.

[Moi]

Fair point, it may also require talking to the Ministry of Transport who own the licensing system. There is a review later this year.

Sent from my SM-G900I using Tapatalk

That's interesting. Do you know when? Have looked at the MoT website and not found anything...

[BMWST?]

Tell them if I am going to be treated like the object of an insurance policy I want to only pay my policy once as I cant crash 2 bikes at the same time and I don't want to cover 280k licenced riders when there is not 280k registered motorcycles in the country. You can mention my name if you like.
you cant apply the levy to a license.many many licensed driver and riders dont own a vehicle.

[bogan]

you cant apply the levy to a license.many many licensed driver and riders dont own a vehicle.

And does this prevent them from being able to crash one they borrow?

[mossy1200]

you cant apply the levy to a license.many many licensed driver and riders dont own a vehicle.

Then they can put their licence on hold. Pay a photo fee to get another when they want it renewed. That's easier than crashing more than one bike at the same time.
The road tax side of the rego can stay the same and you need be licenced ACC holder to register your bike.

[FJRider]

you cant apply the levy to a license.many many licensed driver and riders dont own a vehicle.

And many many licensed drivers and riders have more than one vehicle.

With an ACC rating based solely on YOUR driving record (ie: traffic convictions/infringements/insurance rating/record) ... :yes:

I'm betting NZ'rs base driving standard would THEN improve ... substantially ... ;)

[mossy1200]

And many many licensed drivers and riders have more than one vehicle.

With an ACC rating based solely on YOUR driving record (ie: traffic convictions/infringements/insurance rating/record) ... :yes:

I'm betting NZ'rs base driving standard would THEN improve ... substantially ... ;)

Also you could have a re entry course for those that have been on hold longer than 2 years to ensure the midlife crisis riders are ready to start riding again. Small discounts for those that have attended the new ride safe courses bronze/ silver/ gold and urban. There seems to be more effort getting revenue to cover accidents than being imaginative enough to reduce accidents at the same time.

Bonus is you could create a punishment for riding unlicensed that would put people off more like loss of all licence types and still retain the road user side of registration without ACC content on the vehicle itself.

[James Deuce]

I'll make sure not to mention your name Jim.

Cheers. I owe you a beer.

[FJRider]

Also you could have a re entry course for those that have been on hold longer than 2 years to ensure the midlife crisis riders are ready to start riding again. Small discounts for those that have attended the new ride safe courses bronze/ silver/ gold and urban. There seems to be more effort getting revenue to cover accidents than being imaginative enough to reduce accidents at the same time.

Bonus is you could create a punishment for riding unlicensed that would put people off more like loss of all licence types and still retain the road user side of registration without ACC content on the vehicle itself.

How about ... if you have FULL health insurance cover ... you need not pay any ACC levy ... as you OWN provider will cover your medical costs after an accident ... :whistle:

[James Deuce]

How about ... if you have FULL health insurance cover ... you need not pay any ACC levy ... as you OWN provider will cover your medical costs after an accident ... :whistle:

They won't. They never have. Premiums would have to go up significantly to support that idea and to levels that would require a greater level of income than enjoyed by 70% of people in NZ.

[Ocean1]

They won't. They never have. Premiums would have to go up significantly to support that idea and to levels that would require a greater level of income than enjoyed by 70% of people in NZ.

Which simply demonstrates what a good deal ACC is, generally. Sure, some of us pay more than others, particularly in road licencing fees, and in a lot of cases that's not fair, but even the most hard done by levy payer get's a fucking good deal from ACC.

It's just a pity we don't have the option of paying a tad more to make ACC's petty claim denial tactics for the more mundane injuries go away.

[Robbo]

How about ... if you have FULL health insurance cover ... you need not pay any ACC levy ... as you OWN provider will cover your medical costs after an accident ... :whistle:

Yep, and that's what I used to have, including loss of income cover etc. until ACC was introduced and forced on me and the tax deductions on my premiums were removed. Premiums were calculated on your risk factors at the time and your expected income.
You signed a declaration pertaining to your risk factors and could modify these at any time and your premiums could be re assessed accordingly. This was a fair and just system.
ACC are just a bunch of thieving cunts. For quite a long time I was paying levies on my annual income, my work vehicle, my private vehicle and four motorbikes. That is SEVEN times I am being charged for the one cover on myself. If I could do my job whilst driving both vehicles and riding all four bikes at the same time then I could accept paying seven times. If I had tried to run my business on the same format as ACC I would have been done for fraud.
Motorcycle owners are subsidising cyclists, joggers, sports players, etc who only pay ONCE on their annual income.
It's method of levey payments is a total rhort and was obviously dreamed up by a total fuckwit and has continued to be carried out by similar fuckwits ever since. :angry2::angry2:

[mossy1200]

So unless they are able to see a bigger picture nothing will change.

There is a bigger picture?

[James Deuce]

While handling skills courses may prevent riders from coming to grief as a result of their own actions they offer no gurantee of avoiding coming to grief as a result of the actions of others but ACC expects us riders to pay for the screwups of others as well which the formal correspondance from poster 1 says nothing about. So unless they are able to see a bigger picture nothing will change.

Handling Skills courses provide no guarantees of preventing your own screw ups either. They're simply a feel good exercise that the current Government is cynically manipulating to be able to say, "Look! We helped, but they still crashed their brains out!"

I took a lot of grief from people on here about my accident in 2010. I was hurt badly and I sure as hell didn't get sympathy or help from people on KB. Instead I just got reminded that I was a useless fuck up, ruining the ACC stats for everyone else. My head injury was bad enough that I've only been able to start enjoying reading and sit still for more than an hour in the last 12 months. But of course it's my own fault for:

A. Riding a motorcycle.
B. Not anticipating flying sheep.

Nothing is going to change. Most Governments worldwide in developed countries have already painted motorcyclists as irresponsible, greedy, violent, medical resource hogging, grief-causing villains and will only record data and present a picture that leads to motorcycling being banned altogether. In the UK, announcing to a judge in a court hearing post-accident that you're an IAM Observer, or you've done your RoSPA Gold badge is likely to increase your sentence and/or reduce the %age of the awarded compensation as the court system there apportions blame between parties.

The days of personal vehicles are numbered and motorcycles will be the first to go.

Just enjoy it while you can. If you can bring yourself to go around a corner without coming to a complete stop before the apex, because as you've said before, that's the only way to be safe while cornering.

[nzspokes]

Handling Skills courses provide no guarantees of preventing your own screw ups either. They're simply a feel good exercise that the current Government is cynically manipulating to be able to say, "Look! We helped, but they still crashed their brains out!"

I took a lot of grief from people on here about my accident in 2010. I was hurt badly and I sure as hell didn't get sympathy or help from people on KB. Instead I just got reminded that I was a useless fuck up, ruining the ACC stats for everyone else. My head injury was bad enough that I've only been able to start enjoying reading and sit still for more than an hour in the last 12 months. But of course it's my own fault for:

A. Riding a motorcycle.
B. Not anticipating flying sheep.

Nothing is going to change. Most Governments worldwide in developed countries have already painted motorcyclists as irresponsible, greedy, violent, medical resource hogging, grief-causing villains and will only record data and present a picture that leads to motorcycling being banned altogether. In the UK, announcing to a judge in a court hearing post-accident that you're an IAM Observer, or you've done your RoSPA Gold badge is likely to increase your sentence and/or reduce the %age of the awarded compensation as the court system there apportions blame between parties.

The days of personal vehicles are numbered and motorcycles will be the first to go.

Just enjoy it while you can. If you can bring yourself to go around a corner without coming to a complete stop before the apex, because as you've said before, that's the only way to be safe while cornering.

I believe you are correct. I suspect we will be one of the last generations to have motorcycles in common use.

[RDJ]

In the UK, announcing to a judge in a court hearing post-accident that you're an IAM Observer, or you've done your RoSPA Gold badge is likely to increase your sentence and/or reduce the %age of the awarded compensation as the court system there apportions blame between parties.

there is similar "judicial activism" evident in Arizona. There is no helmet law in Arizona. But the judges there on the basis of a precedent set a few years ago, will disallow damages for head injuries if the rider was not wearing a helmet, on the basis that he could have avoided the injury but chose not to. Of course, judges there and elsewhere never apply the same logic to rugby players, bicycle riders, people falling off balconies etc... I guess the only solution is for more motorcyclists to become judges! ;)

[Berries]

If I was ACC I'd give a discount on the ACC portion of the rego for attendance at The California Superbike School or similar rider training.
If I was ACC I would just ban the bloody death traps and sod the lunatic minority that insists on riding around on them.

[RDJ]

if I was ACC I would stick with the original intent of the Woodhouse report and the subsequent legislation... = No fault compensation.

[Voltaire]

I believe you are correct. I suspect we will be one of the last generations to have motorcycles in common use.

Dang might have to move to Vietnam where there are 60 million of them :laugh:

Will motorcycles become like horses....you see them being ridden in paddocks and sometimes on the Tele?

[davebullet]

if I was ACC I would stick with the original intent of the Woodhouse report and the subsequent legislation... = No fault compensation.

Are people thinking no fault compensation means we all pay the same? To me they are completely different. One is a risk rating meaning you pay more than another group. This happens across all 3 levy accounts. The no fault means on an injury claim no blame or legal recourse will apply , suing etc..

[davebullet]

I believe you are correct. I suspect we will be one of the last generations to have motorcycles in common use.

Tobacco is the lead here. Good news is we still have time. Bad news the pricing squeeze could continue unless we clean up our act. They gray area is the 30% of accidents where the cause was not the motorcyclist.

[RDJ]

Are people thinking no fault compensation means we all pay the same? To me they are completely different. One is a risk rating meaning you pay more than another group. This happens across all 3 levy accounts. The no fault means on an injury claim no blame or legal recourse will apply , suing etc..

in terms of the original report and legislation, no-fault included the concept of contributory negligence (contributed to by the injured person) being ignored so that was it not just "it was not your fault", it was also "it was not my fault either." In the early years this resulted in some really strange payouts, for example criminals who broke a leg escaping over the prison wall got compensated, a man who blew off his own 2 feet and claimed some strangers did it to him, (not a joke) got a lifetime disability payout etc.

The present thinking by ACC is that motorcyclists have contributed to our injuries by being careless about our self protection, by riding a two-wheeled vehicle with no cage protection... it's not a matter of risk, because although many motorcyclists contribute to our own accidents, a simple majority of accidents are the result of car drivers, road surfaces etc.

From a philosophical point of view, if every potential recipient of ACC payouts was made to pay contributory risk levies, that wouldn't be the intent of the original legislation but it would be what we claim we always want, a level playing field. Instead, ACC have (for the present) singled out particular occupational and recreational groups for increased levies, whereas other groups get away with paying literally nothing. The most egregious examples of these are in my mind, i.e. based on all the injuries I see coming through the doors, rugby players and cyclists. Compounded by the most recent risk assessment stupidity, that of using flawed (being charitable, the data are actually crap) data from an Australian university (Monash) to assess vehicle risk ratings. Of course in this matter I am definitely biased... paying levies for multiple bikes but riding just one at a time (like many of y'all).

:mad:

a fascinating insight into the bureaucratic mind, I think unintended by the group who put it together
http://www.dol.govt.nz/initiatives/workplace/acc/levies/2015/ris-acc-levies-2014-15.pdf

[Voltaire]

From the ACC Website:


Workplace Safety Discount (WSD) application overview
WSD is aimed at self-employed or small businesses (those with 10 or less employees). It starts with a self-assessment and application process, which includes you providing documents as evidence of your health and safety practices, followed by an audit of these by an ACC-approved auditor.

If the auditor concludes that your health and safety systems and practices meet the Workplace Safety Discount audit standards, your business will receive a 10% work cover levy reduction.

The 10% reduction to your work cover levy applies for three years, with declarations required at the end of the first and second years to confirm the business is still eligible and meets the required standards.


I like how companies can get a discount with 10 or less employees, should apply to 10 or less bikes too, discrimination at work I say.:innocent:


More on the ACC Site

Who’d swap the adrenalin, fun and freedom of riding a motorcycle with being cooped up in a boring old car? Not many riders, that’s for sure. However, over the last year, more than 3,500 motorcycle riders were injured while riding their bikes on New Zealand’s roads. Whatever the cause, there’s a lot you can do to improve your safety when you’re on the road, without having to swap two wheels for four!

On this page
How safe are you?
Ride Forever
Scooter riders
How safe are you?
Motorcycle riders are 22 times more likely than any other road user to be involved in a crash, and they’re far more likely to be seriously injured. While one of the top two causes of those crashes is the motorcyclist losing control, the other cause is a motorist simply not seeing the rider. Riders need to be constantly monitoring their own riding ability and to be super aware of what’s happening around them.


A bit patronising me thinks...

[Ulsterkiwi]

.....A bit patronising me thinks...

probably.

That said, with respect to our abiliities as motorcyclists, it is a significant challenge to all of us to stand back, reflect and ask ourselves "am I nearly as good, as I think I am" or more importantly "is there anything I can do to make myself better?"
The bottom line is, no matter how fair or unfair we believe things to be, we make a choice when get on a bike and that choice means risk. So, how can I stack the odds in my favour, how can I take responsibilty and some control of that risk?
My other interests see me jumping off perfectly good boats and into water with kilos of lead strapped to my person, on the face of it, a risky undertaking. A few times I have done this jumping into water where 30-40 2m plus sharks are circling. They were there because steps were taken to attract them. If it all went pear shaped, well that would be just too bad. I made a choice and paid a lot of money for the privilege of doing so. Again, my choice. But I took steps to stack the odds in my favour. Mostly I waited on the boat to see if anyone else would get eaten before jumping in.....:rolleyes:

I believe ACC to be an intrinsicaly good idea and a preferable option to what I have experinced in other jurisdictions. Its not perfect but what is?

[oneblackflag]

On thing that surprised me some months back when I raised this topic on here was the number of riders who would rather pay what we are paying now than have higher ACC charged to those who cause crashes and those that dont pay less. Maybe those who rubbished my idea of having those who cause crashes paying a higher premium were the ones who such a policy would negativly affect.

I wouldnt be pushing for that if were you... You'll go broke.

[bogan]

If you read my post again I said those that cause accidents should be paying more. You assume incorrectly if you think I have caused all the accidents I have been in.

Why the "All" qualifier? :laugh:
You about 7 for 33 or something like that?

[Usarka]

You may be right, or you may be wrong. But from my perspective sitting in the meeting there was actual interest from Nikki.

That's the core skill of a politician, to sound like they care regardless of whether they do or not.


On thing that surprised me some months back when I raised this topic on here was the number of riders who would rather pay what we are paying now than have higher ACC charged to those who cause crashes and those that dont pay less.

See the next quote below. The statistics they use the justify the registration costs are grossly misleading. Even if your suggestion was a good idea any decision they make needs to be based on correct information and where it should start.


Are scooter crashes added to motorcycle or car statistics ? As they are ride on a car license it would make sense to be added to car statistics
+1. Swoop said also remove farm bikes, but I'd also add off road bikes.


Numb nut arse biscuit politicians.

[mossy1200]

+1. Swoop said also remove farm bikes, but I'd also add off road bikes.


Numb nut arse biscuit politicians.

They claim accidents lodged as not on road on the ACC claim form are not included in the figures.
The form filled out when you file has tick box area for location of accident being on public road or not.

[James Deuce]

If they are able to determine who is at fault in a crash they have the correct information to charge more do they not? Plus it may actually serve as motivation to improve road safety.

At the moment there is very little effort put into establishing culpability in road accidents, especially relative to the UK. Your idea would require a visit to court for every accident prior to beginning ACC pay outs and establishing individual risk profiles for future ACC contributions. Or are you happy having the decision left to people who don't necessarily document the correct sequence of events at accidents or even worse, having an ACC claims clerk decide who is at fault?

[James Deuce]

They claim accidents lodged as not on road on the ACC claim form are not included in the figures.
The form filled out when you file has tick box area for location of accident being on public road or not.

Charlie Lamb already proved in 2009 that that tick box was completely ignored. If the accident said "motorcycle, farm bike, dirt bike, quad bike, scooter, or motorbike" it just went into the overall stats. No one has attempted to prove that things have changed since 2009, largely because it is a pointless exercise. What the ACC Minister says, goes.

[Night Falcon]

If they are able to determine who is at fault in a crash they have the correct information to charge more do they not? Plus it may actually serve as motivation to improve road safety.

I had a sheep run into me, the cops said it was his fault and Larry wasn't denying it.....mainly cos he was dead mutton but still, I couldn't get a cent out him. ACC tried to get something from his estate but in the end it turned out to be a lot of bleating for nothing, bit of a dagg really. Eventually they agreed to give it the chop. Wool that help motivate improved road safety....that's a tail for another day. I say baaaaaa to it.

[haydes55]

My favorite part of these ACC statistics is, 30% of motorcross and farm bike accidents are caused by a car driver not seeing them. Motorcross bikes should all have headlights and hi vis to improve their visibility, so a car won't run into them.

#logic

(Do we do hash tags on here?)

#yolo

[Fatt Max]

MAG are doing a big protest ride on 18th July for every biker that wants to have their voice heard so if you want to go along you will find all the details on Facebook

[Reckless]

My favorite part of these ACC statistics is, 30% of motorcross and farm bike accidents are caused by a car driver not seeing them. Motorcross bikes should all have headlights and hi vis to improve their visibility, so a car won't run into them.

#logic

(Do we do hash tags on here?)

#yolo

Oh FFS REALLY???? Now that just makes a complete mockery of the whole fucken SHAM!!!

Just Registered the car today for 6 months $88 bucks, the bike for 6 months $268 bucks fucken disgrace for a no fault system?

[mossy1200]

My favorite part of these ACC statistics is, 30% of motorcross and farm bike accidents are caused by a car driver not seeing them. Motorcross bikes should all have headlights and hi vis to improve their visibility, so a car won't run into them.





75% of rugby accidents happen in the workplace and could have been prevented by high viz jackets.

[RDJ]

Every now and then it is actually liberating to realise / reconfirm that politicians and career bureaucrats do not care about logic, facts, truth, moral outcomes, ethics and common sense.

I remind myself of this on a regular basis.

[willytheekid]

https://kompster-web.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/swimming-cat-lucy.jpg

This is the face I make when we talk about AC FUCKIN C! blatantly ripping us off

YES!...its beyond rage!:angry:


(Hence, I have now put the rego on hold for the rest of winter...fuck em!, I give the greedy pricks NOTHING over winter now)

[RDJ]

They are thieves. They cloak their theft with socialist principles. They are the political equivalent of what the Toilet Duck was designed to remove from the Bowl of Society.

[Voltaire]

MAG are doing a big protest ride on 18th July for every biker that wants to have their voice heard so if you want to go along you will find all the details on Facebook

Pinching Tui's add and disrupting people going about their business....:first:


What we will be doing in the Event will be legal, but will disruptive. We need to get noticed and show we are not happy with the unfair ACC levy towards motorcyclists.
So come along and join us.

What next...Golfers complaining about green fees.....

[rastuscat]

I'd get her and Jacinda Adern working together on something.

Marks out of ten? I'd give them both 1.

[RDJ]

I would take them out of the equation entirely, based on both the extreme unlikelihood that they could produce a result positive in terms of global utility, and because there are some combinations that are just two vomitious to contemplate. And I freely admit, this is an ad hominem (more accurately, ad feminem) argument. Yet despite being so, not entirely inaccurate.

[98tls]

No idea what MAG is to be honest,was going to search but then saw the Facebook thing and well...:sleep:

[Moi]

No idea what MAG is to be honest,was going to search but then saw the Facebook thing and well...:sleep:

That is just not the attitude we expect from a bloke of your maturity and sensibility - you should have become very excited and, possibly, emotional at the very thought that you had to interact with a FaceBook account... :whistle:

quick, someone pass me the puking bucket... :sick:

MAG = Mount Albert Grammar

[Berries]

Facebook can fuck off. Sorry Fat Max, I like you as a pork pie brother from the mother country, but I don't Facebook so I have no idea what the protest is about. if you come on here tell us about it, or post a link, but don't tell us that the info is on FB because you might as well not bother.



Here's one I made earier..........

[jasonu]

MAG = Mount Albert Grammar

It is MAGS
Mt Albert Grammar School.

Did you go there?
I did in the early 1980's and this guy was my 3rd form maths teacher.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11475429

[Fatt Max]

Facebook can fuck off. Sorry Fat Max, I like you as a pork pie brother from the mother country, but I don't Facebook so I have no idea what the protest is about. if you come on here tell us about it, or post a link, but don't tell us that the info is on FB because you might as well not bother.



Here's one I made earier..........

That pie has given me the horn...

[Fatt Max]

This is what MAG have put on the Facebook page:

Get off your arse, and help us to help you fight for fair ACC levies. We have a major event up our sleeves, Auckland based, and WE NEED YOU TO MAKE AN IMPACT!

What we will be doing in the Event will be legal, but will disruptive. We need to get noticed and show we are not happy with the unfair ACC levy towards motorcyclists.
So come along and join us.


Any questions, please message MAG committee via our page or email us on info@magnz.org, or phone / text us 022 649 6917.

I suppose a text or email will tell you time and location but as far as I know its the 18th July.

Looks like they are really stepping up, good on em I reckon :niceone::niceone::niceone:

[Mom]

Looks like they are really stepping up, good on em I reckon :niceone::niceone::niceone:

Hey matey, good on you for doing this! However, I feel flogging a dead horse might apply when you see the response to this post.

I actually did a hunt earlier today, looked at both the "OMFG We dont DO IDIOTBOOK" Facebook page, and the MAG website. Nowhere does it state what is planned, nor what MAG is trying to achieve. I dont want to knock them, but asking someone to email them for information about a protest is always going to be a fail in my book.

Sad. Rego on hold here...

[Fatt Max]

Just getting the word out

[Voltaire]

Yes, agree with Mom, I'm not a Facebook fan but that's the platform some of the bike crowds I like are on.....

Instead of lots of splinter bike groups one large one would be better. Bureaucrats have all day every day paid to say no, everyone else does it in their spare time.


Jumping up and down and making noise is good for a day but not for the long haul.

But hey, have fun, but don't expect Niki Kaye to say " you guys are right, lets drop the ACC component to the same as cars"

Disclaimer: I wear a suit and tie some days and am over 30 ...so can't be trusted:rolleyes:

[nzspokes]

If we want our bike reg to be lowered to the price of cars all we need to do is sell them and buy one of those 3 wheel Yamaha Scooters and we will then be as safe as being in a car having 3 wheels or maybe attaching a side car would qualify for car reg too.

Gawd your posts are hard to read. Is Engrish a second language?

[Voltaire]

If we want our bike reg to be lowered to the price of cars all we need to do is sell them and buy one of those 3 wheel Yamaha Scooters and we will then be as safe as being in a car having 3 wheels or maybe attaching a side car would qualify for car reg too.

in 7 more years you CB 750 turns 40 and automatically becomes safer to ride as the Rego will be about $80 in todays money. My Norton Commando has safety features like mostly sitting in the garage, and anti lock decelerators :woohoo:

[Supermac Jr]

Don't know, it makes me cringe when I see riders with no gloves or office attire.

If I was ACC I'd give a discount on the ACC portion of the rego for attendance at The California Superbike School or similar rider training.

.

as above!!!!!!

[Swoop]

75% of rugby accidents happen in the workplace...
It used to be very predictable on Monday morning, how many fit chaps would "suddenly" injure themselves at work.

It certainly couldn't have occurred in a game of rugby over the weekend however. - :Insert Tui advert here:

[Ocean1]

It used to be very predictable on Monday morning, how many fit chaps would "suddenly" injure themselves at work.

It certainly couldn't have occurred in a game of rugby over the weekend however. - :Insert Tui advert here:

I once worked at a brewery in London. One Monday morning a couple of guys carried a mate in through the workshop doors, clocked him in and put him carefully at the bottom of the concrete steps into the workshop itself.

He'd had an encounter with one of the local mobsters and his mates had kept him iced up since the small hrs of Sunday morning. Fuck he was a mess.