How safe is your workplace?

[R650R]

Reflecting on the China blasts it seems odd in the modern developed world we keep having workplace accidents and disasters.
And its not just the Chinese doing silly stuff, even in the highly litigated world of America there are still disasters and accidents happening.
Been watching vids here https://www.youtube.com/user/USCSB/videos
Don't be put off by the dry opening tone, most of the vids watched so far are quite interesting with relevant technical detail.

[Mike.Gayner]

I almost took my eye out with a paperclip the other day. Accountancy offices can be hazardous places. We even have a warning label on the hot water tap, in case it's mistaken for cold water.

[tri boy]

Our workplace is fecking scary, until I've downed my 1st bottle of whiskey, then all is calm:drinkup:

[Ocean1]

Meh. Bunch of pussies.

[caspernz]

It all went downhill when I was informed I could only bring one spare mag for my Glock...:innocent::shutup:

[ellipsis]

...................

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/7Hw_0-fRR4Q" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


.....safe as...

[Akzle]

hahahahaha. Work.

[Woodman]

You forget the human factor. Their are always going to be accidents. You can legislate and litigate all you want, shit is still going to happen.

[Kickaha]

You forget the human factor. Their are always going to be accidents. You can legislate and litigate all you want, shit is still going to happen.

You can minimise "shit happening"

Some humans are dumber than others, you dont need or want the dumb ones working for you

[R650R]

You can minimise "shit happening"

Some humans are dumber than others, you dont need or want the dumb ones working for you

Exactly. And its interesting watching some of the vids how known hazards to most normal people are still ignored. Eg the dust explosion situations seem to feature in a few of the vids, 100% preventable.

[Big Dog]

You can minimise "shit happening"

Some humans are dumber than others, you dont need or want the dumb ones working for you
Yet the dumb ones are never short a job for long because there is always an employer who wants to pay add little as possible.

Sent via tapatalk.

[nzspokes]

hahahahaha. Work.

Yeah work, You know the thing that helps you buy motorcycles that run?

[Mike.Gayner]

Just watched a bunch of those videos - surprisingly addictive.

[awayatc]

hahahahaha. Work.

Guess where free handouts come from......

some of us work, so that the ones who are unemployable dont starve.....

not expecting any thank you's...

But will fuckin well enforce some respect for my efforts......

[Voltaire]

Guess where free handouts come from......

some of us work, so that the ones who are unemployable dont starve.....

not expecting any thank you's...

But will fuckin well enforce some respect for my efforts......

he just winding you up, currently he is working for Mitsubishi testing out the 1990 model.


Akzle added 2 fuel-ups to their 1990 Mitsubishi Magna.

[Oakie]

Our workplace is reasonably safe although I have to say that ... I'm the Health and Safety guy. We've averaged an accident every 23 days over the past 8 years for a staff of about 90. Nothing worse than a broken bone in a foot, a couple of broken toes and a cracked rib though. Slips and trips account for a bit over 30% of our accidents.

[R650R]

Just watched a bunch of those videos - surprisingly addictive.

Yes they are despite the monotone Yank voiceover...

My views and well liked/enjoyed all of them, learnt something etc... are in no particular order;

Filling blind, Dangers of hot work (that poor crane driver), the ammonia one, several of the major dust explosions ones, several of refinery jobs, fireworks disposal (what numpties).

[Laava]

Our workplace is reasonably safe although I have to say that ... I'm the Health and Safety guy. We've averaged an accident every 23 days over the past 8 years for a staff of about 90. Nothing worse than a broken bone in a foot, a couple of broken toes and a cracked rib though. Slips and trips account for a bit over 30% of our accidents.

I guess there is no chance of getting a clothing snag!

[R650R]

Also of interest and how I found the other vids was watching these others first.
Got googling bridge collapses after talking to the engineers do a job at work in between their work on Mohaka bridge....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjsL4miMKPQ

Also of interest:

more bad maintanaince/design than workplace accident though

Manius bridge https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UenU6EzHbTw

And Schiharie creek https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOwi2tilFKo

And why you don't smoke/weld why tanker is in port. this disaster was pivotal moment in maritime shipping safety regs changing...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNr0In-a1c0

[Banditbandit]

Our workplace is physically pretty safe ...

Mentally - It's a massive risk .. causes insanity ...

[awa355]

We no longer have any risk of swine flu, cause all the zillions of posters about washing hands have now faded to white. The walls are now plastered with posters about 'Gossip can be harmful' in the work place and how this site is now a 'gossip free' workplace. This in a place of 400+ staff facing redundancies and restructuring? :brick::brick::brick:

[Tazz]

Safe as.


You should store acids with cyanide aye?

:laugh:

[Tazz]

We no longer have any risk of swine flu, cause all the zillions of posters about washing hands have now faded to white. The walls are now plastered with posters about 'Gossip can be harmful' in the work place and how this site is now a 'gossip free' workplace. This in a place of 400+ staff facing redundancies and restructuring? :brick::brick::brick:

I see where they're heading. No need for redundancies if a bunch of you get swine flu ;)

[jonbuoy]

Familiarity breeds contempt. People will be on edge and do things by the letter when they first start working in a potentially lethal environment but after a few years its possible to become a bit jaded and cut corners or be careless - skip the double/triple checks, sign off permits to work without physically checking everything off - all in the interests of getting the job done quickly.

Look how newly qualified drivers do things by the book - after even just a few months of driving they start to pick up bad habits. You don´t even notice yourself the risks you and nearly every other driver takes until your in the passenger seat.

Sometimes things have been done "incorrectly" for years and its been sheer luck that nothing bad has happened. One day the wheel of chance spins and everything lines up.

[Ocean1]

Familiarity breeds contempt. People will be on edge and do things by the letter when they first start working in a potentially lethal environment but after a few years its possible to become a bit jaded and cut corners or be careless - skip the double/triple checks, sign off permits to work without physically checking everything off - all in the interests of getting the job done quickly.

Look how newly qualified drivers do things by the book - after even just a few months of driving they start to pick up bad habits. You don´t even notice yourself the risks you and nearly every other driver takes until your in the passenger seat.

Sometimes things have been done "incorrectly" for years and its been sheer luck that nothing bad has happened. One day the wheel of chance spins and everything lines up.

Risk. Homeostasis. Rules.

[mossy1200]

Did working at heights full day training today and then found out it doesn't include harness inspection anymore. That's an advanced course now with an extra days training required. Tomorrow I have a full day training for mobile platforms. In 2 weeks time I have a full days training for confined spaces.
Three weeks ago I had a half day induction for a site. Last week another induction for the same site under a different service provider plus a 3hr online induction course. A while ago I had an electrical registration refresher course to renew my practising licence and then a site safe first aid course plus cpr.
We had a half day toolbox meeting about the changes and workplace NZ ability to send blame and fines up the food chain.

I was thinking of trying something new soon. A SOLID DAYS WORK to pay for these courses which are normally around $250 each and lose a days productivity to teach me the slowest way possible to carry out work and spend a huge amount on the latest gear to do it.

Im ticking all the boxes though.

[Ocean1]

Im ticking all the boxes though.

:facepalm:

And people wonder why shit costs so much more nowadays...

[trustme]

Did working at heights full day training today and then found out it doesn't include harness inspection anymore. That's an advanced course now with an extra days training required. Tomorrow I have a full day training for mobile platforms. In 2 weeks time I have a full days training for confined spaces.
Three weeks ago I had a half day induction for a site. Last week another induction for the same site under a different service provider plus a 3hr online induction course. A while ago I had an electrical registration refresher course to renew my practising licence and then a site safe first aid course plus cpr.
We had a half day toolbox meeting about the changes and workplace NZ ability to send blame and fines up the food chain.

I was thinking of trying something new soon. A SOLID DAYS WORK to pay for these courses which are normally around $250 each and lose a days productivity to teach me the slowest way possible to carry out work and spend a huge amount on the latest gear to do it.

Im ticking all the boxes though.

+1 . We work all over the country , our work is potentially extremely dangerous, you mess up there is a good chance you will die. One of our largest clients had a fatal last year, the guy stuffed up , it is being blamed on a lack of training. We now have safety meetings, process & paperwork for africa , courses for this & courses for that. The loss in productivity is difficult to recover but will be reflected in increased charges, something the clients is not happy about.

So much of it seems to be an exercise in arse covering with improved safety being a by product.

I get the shits when the Safety Doris does an audit, she ticks all the boxes on her clip board , she would not have a bloody clue about what is really going on , just checks all the test tags , snivels about access ways & trip hazards . When the really dangerous shit is happening they will always be noticeable by their absence, so that they can distance themselves from any thing that goes wrong & maintain deniability.

[TheDemonLord]

One day at work, I ordered a Hot Chocolate, but instead I got a coffee of some sort.

It was a close one, but thanks to our internal procedures I managed to avert disaster.

[R650R]

Did working at heights full day training today and then found out it doesn't include harness inspection anymore. That's an advanced course now with an extra days training required. Tomorrow I have a full day training for mobile platforms. In 2 weeks time I have a full days training for confined spaces.


And both of those things still kill and maim people far too often.
I've been working at a large site where one of the businesses competitive edges is we are safer than our competitors. A work colleague of mine was injured a long time ago in the good old no-osh days and it has hampered his life ever since. He is now back at same site and doing different job but if was doing same stuff the same accident would be lot less likely due to our modern protocols.
The thing is outside contractors keep on proving themselves to be the most dangerous things on site despite clear warnings about certain procedures and access protocols. So you cant blame these companies for making people prove their competency before giving the a chance to interrupt your productivity.
The second day I was onsite a major incident occurred due to plant failure, no one was killed or injured precisely due to the previously considered silly rules. The operator was highly experienced but it really drove home for me why we have these protocols and regimes. A procedure was slightly amended afterwards also but it was the rules that prevented a tragedy.
I've seen the other side of the coin, frustrated by a largely American student workforce operating forklifts to the nth degree of safety taking too long to unload my truck (eg doing the osh handbrake thing at every move) and done my own corner cutting from time to time but you have to respect someone saying this is how you do the job at our place/site.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_nTLIuk6Hk

[awa355]

We have a page in the Hazard's folder that is supposed to be filled out for 'near miss', or potential accidents. I mean, where do you draw the line. :no:

[R650R]

We have a page in the Hazard's folder that is supposed to be filled out for 'near miss', or potential accidents. I mean, where do you draw the line. :no:

Its anything that could cause death, serious injury or permanent disability, pretty simple.

[Akzle]

One day at work, I ordered a Hot Chocolate, but instead I got a coffee of some sort.

It was a close one, but thanks to our internal procedures I managed to avert disaster.
you went upside that bitches head?

We have a page in the Hazard's folder that is supposed to be filled out for 'near miss', or potential accidents. I mean, where do you draw the line. :no:
:nono:

they're near-hits. which expresses more apropriately just how dangerous they is...

[caspernz]

The English language is funny, the term near-miss is in my thinking an accident, for one nearly missed...thus it signifies a hit?!

Only issue I have is with the ever increasing H & S focus, actual productivity keeps declining, tasks take longer and yet in some firms workers are expected to perform the job just as fast as in the olden days.

And in this ever more PC world, ensuring a safe environment to work in leaves little wiggle room for creative interpretation. Quite some years back I had a numpty who wanted to keep smoking on a forecourt while I was delivering a load of fuel. In my defense I did ask him politely to cease and desist, ie fuck off, but only once. He thought I'd ask twice, but instead I just hogtied him and left him on the lawn next to the shop for Mr Plod to collect. Yeah, it helped that I knew a couple of the local boys in blue who were always up for some harmless fun...

I'm all for health and safety in the workplace, yet in practical terms I'm always amused when someone who has never done my job tells me how to do it safer...:brick:

[mossy1200]

And both of those .......... do the job at our place/site.



I work with a very safe bunch and we do everything possible to keep everything under control. Nobody is afraid to say stop work if conditions change and what we do is at the top end of caution required.

BUT

The issue is we do this and the NZ Safety rep for the main contractor will look at a safety plan following the latest workplace safety preferred method to access an area by machinery and refuse the method claiming a ladder is safer because of a risk that machinery hydraulic failure will leave us stranded 5metres up. I am sure I see a ladder as being the least desired method of notifiable height access possible on Workplace NZ standards. Big conflict of interests going on.

[Big Dog]

Did working at heights full day training today and then found out it doesn't include harness inspection anymore. That's an advanced course now with an extra days training required. Tomorrow I have a full day training for mobile platforms. In 2 weeks time I have a full days training for confined spaces.
Three weeks ago I had a half day induction for a site. Last week another induction for the same site under a different service provider plus a 3hr online induction course. A while ago I had an electrical registration refresher course to renew my practising licence and then a site safe first aid course plus cpr.
We had a half day toolbox meeting about the changes and workplace NZ ability to send blame and fines up the food chain.

I was thinking of trying something new soon. A SOLID DAYS WORK to pay for these courses which are normally around $250 each and lose a days productivity to teach me the slowest way possible to carry out work and spend a huge amount on the latest gear to do it.

Im ticking all the boxes though.

So you are now qualified to have a shocking time in a small box while tied up and suspended?
What exactly do you do?

[mossy1200]

So you are now qualified to have a shocking time in a small box while tied up and suspended?
What exactly do you do?

Covert operations at the 4th highest level. God:first:, satellites:second: and aircraft:third: are the top 3. Lots more boxes to tick before I am the big boss:first:

[caspernz]

So you are now qualified to have a shocking time in a small box while tied up and suspended?
What exactly do you do?

There is an S & M club in Petone that broadly fits the description of activities Mossy mentions...:drool:

[mossy1200]

There is an S & M club in Petone that broadly fits the description of activities Mossy mentions...:drool:

Be a lot of paperwork filling a JSA out in that profession.
Wonder what their injury register looks like.

[caspernz]

Be a lot of paperwork filling a JSA out in that profession.
Wonder what their injury register looks like.

Meh, it all happens behind closed doors. No hi-viz and no hot work permits needed, although plenty of hot stuff goes down there...or so I've been told :innocent::innocent:

[mossy1200]

Meh, it all happens behind closed doors. No hi-viz and no hot work permits needed, although plenty of hot stuff goes down there...or so I've been told :innocent::innocent:

A Workplace NZ visit would be amusing. Just about all the equipment would be banned ( I would expect).:killingme

[Voltaire]

Are some of those Safety Training companies milking it...?
I did a Site Safe course a couple of years back and it was pretty dumbed down, and if you see a plonker standing on the top step of a ladder you could be blamed if there is an accident....give me a break.

[Oakie]

Oh boy. I'm an HSE Coordinator but I like to think I'm not an arse about it. Anyway ...


Did working at heights full day training today ... . A SOLID DAYS WORK to pay for these courses which are normally around $250 each and lose a days productivity to teach me the slowest way possible to carry out work and spend a huge amount on the latest gear to do it. Buit if it saves you a couple of days off work you're ahead ...


Im ticking all the boxes though.. Yep, I used to be a box ticker. Thought I was doing great until I came face to face with a guy in a huge amount of pain from a steam burn. Now I'm a problem fixer and if I tick a few boxes along the way ... all the better


So much of it seems to be an exercise in arse covering with improved safety being a by product. Agreed unfortunatley. As above, should be improved safety which covers your arse as a by-product. [/QUOTE]


I get the shits when the Safety Doris does an audit, she ticks all the boxes on her clip board , she would not have a bloody clue about what is really going on , just checks all the test tags , snivels about access ways & trip hazards. You are quite right. The problem we HSE dicks have is getting the people who do know what is really going on interested enough to do that audit stuff or to show a genuine interest. I find that waiting until one of their colleagues gets seriously injured can help.


I've been working at a large site where one of the businesses competitive edges is we are safer than our competitors. And that is important in a world where the principal can be fined a butt load of money if a contractor screws up on site. In the last year I've been both hellishly nervous over the way one contractor did his thing on our site and majorly impressed by the steps another took. The latter may charge a little more but I know who is getting our future business.


We have a page in the Hazard's folder that is supposed to be filled out for 'near miss', or potential accidents. I mean, where do you draw the line. :no: To me, a near miss can pretty much only be caused by a hazard or a hazardous situation so 'near miss' is valid given that we ask for hazards to be reported (even though near miss reporting is an utter pain in the arse). Guy killed at Lyttleton recently because his colleagues did not report repeated near misses in one piece of machinery.


The English language is funny, the term near-miss is in my thinking an accident, for one nearly missed...thus it signifies a hit?! I'm thinking "that was near ... but it was a miss"


I'm all for health and safety in the workplace, yet in practical terms I'm always amused when someone who has never done my job tells me how to do it safer...:brick: Yes I struggle with telling people how to do a job that I don't do. What I've found can work is "So Mark, this is the hazard ... how do you reckon we can fix it?"


... and the NZ Safety rep for the main contractor will look at a safety plan following the latest workplace safety preferred method to access an area by machinery and refuse the method claiming a ladder is safer because of a risk that machinery hydraulic failure will leave us stranded 5metres up. I am sure I see a ladder as being the least desired method of notifiable height access possible on Workplace NZ standards. Big conflict of interests going on. Should have just said if the hydraulics fail you can stick a ladder up for them to come down on. Yeah ... one large contractor has banned ladders completely on their sites. Everything is by scissor-lift or scaffolding.

Whew. Done. Have at it guys.

[mossy1200]

Are some of those Safety Training companies milking it...?
I did a Site Safe course a couple of years back and it was pretty dumbed down, and if you see a plonker standing on the top step of a ladder you could be blamed if there is an accident....give me a break.

I think they have created far to many 1day courses at $250 per head per course. Its not only the cost but the days of lost productivity. Our small company has 36 days worth of courses in total booked in a 3 weeks period. 12 guys 3 days each and that's just heights, confined and working platforms and its every 2 years each ticket. Its money that the customer ends up absorbing. The practical assessment side of the 3 could be done in 5 hrs total and the rest could have been done online. I have had to relearn putting a harness and checking its condition 3 times one for each course. Today I didn't need adjust it as I remembered where I hung it up yesterday.

[caspernz]

A Workplace NZ visit would be amusing. Just about all the equipment would be banned ( I would expect).:killingme

Haha, yeah I do recall thinking along similar lines. Imagine the wording on the waiver :drool::rolleyes:

But hey, in all seriousness, the focus on H & S only works if the whole bureaucracy within an organisation buys into the "safety first" ethos that comes about from putting the focus on H & S in the workplace. In my industry we have a few serious issues, that keep getting shoved into file 13 because the real world solution requires a rethink of the approach. By this I mean the real solution would cost real money in terms of a one off capital investment. Business structures have evolved over time and it now becomes a hot potato as to who actually fronts up with the dosh to solve some of these said problems.

Then I'll be blunt and admit that a good portion of these H & S initiatives don't get any traction because the "guys who've been on the job for a long time" take too long to adapt to the new and improved ways of doing things. The reasons can be varied, and I'm not defending anyone here, but the old adage of "we've done it like this for 30 years" comes to the fore and then the old chestnut of peer pressure rears its ugly head. So if I change my ways and work the new way, the weird thing is there will be talk behind my back. The crew ends up being divided in their thinking...

The long and the short of it is simple, my workplace is as safe as myself and my fellow workers make it. The weakest link in the chain comes to mind...

[trustme]

Site Safe is owned by the major construction companies. Nice little earner, you can't go on their sites until you have lined their back pocket with $250. Reminds me of the back handers given to Ray Bianchi to get on the labourers union riggers register.

[AllanB]

More mental and emotional H&S at my work.

[awa355]

At my work we get bi-annual refreshers in 1st aid, fire fighting, suicide awareness, hostage taking, de-escalation tactics, working with other cultures etc.
and man, you can tell the facilitators who have done the job and those who are simply para-phrasing the text book.

Re fire fighting, I must've watched the Bradford stadium burn down 20 times.Still a terrible sight. Have to admit the Fire safety videos showing how fast a house can go up really hits home how little time you have to get out.

[trustme]

The long and the short of it is simple, my workplace is as safe as myself and my fellow workers make it. The weakest link in the chain comes to mind...

Pretty much sums it up for me. We work as teams , we look out for each other. We have had very few serious lost time injuries in my 35 years in the industry. Safety has undoubtedly improved, PPE is accepted where as it used to be resisted , industry & the private sector has lifted it's game. The public sector has become a nightmare , councils , universities etc totally bogged down in BS. We recently flagged one job,the hoops were too onerous , we could not be bothered . The client is not thrilled because the replacement contractor is dearer than us & a lot slower. They understand it was not worth the hassle for us to be turned inside out trying to comply with stupid demands from dickheads.

[Tazz]

At my work we get bi-annual refreshers in 1st aid, fire fighting, suicide awareness, hostage taking, de-escalation tactics, working with other cultures etc.
and man, you can tell the facilitators who have done the job and those who are simply para-phrasing the text book.

Re fire fighting, I must've watched the Bradford stadium burn down 20 times.Still a terrible sight. Have to admit the Fire safety videos showing how fast a house can go up really hits home how little time you have to get out.
And cars! Unreal eh. Fire extinguishered up to the eyeballs at home and work but a waste of time if you're off the pace pulling em out.

[Voltaire]

Pretty much sums it up for me. We work as teams , we look out for each other. We have had very few serious lost time injuries in my 35 years in the industry. Safety has undoubtedly improved, PPE is accepted where as it used to be resisted , industry & the private sector has lifted it's game. The public sector has become a nightmare , councils , universities etc totally bogged down in BS. We recently flagged one job,the hoops were too onerous , we could not be bothered . The client is not thrilled because the replacement contractor is dearer than us & a lot slower. They understand it was not worth the hassle for us to be turned inside out trying to comply with stupid demands from dickheads.

Your right about it adding costs. $650 to disconnect a heater from an AC unit that's 3 metres high..... needs two guys,$70 an hour for a ladder holder :rolleyes:
To repair it requires a scaffold..... I'm not saying its a bad thing, but pretty hard to explain to the client. " oh $3000 for the new heater in the meeting room"

[trustme]

$3000 buys a lot of cardies .;)

[R650R]

I work with a very safe bunch and we do everything possible to keep everything under control. Nobody is afraid to say stop work if conditions change and what we do is at the top end of caution required.

BUT

The issue is we do this and the NZ Safety rep for the main contractor will look at a safety plan following the latest workplace safety preferred method to access an area by machinery and refuse the method claiming a ladder is safer because of a risk that machinery hydraulic failure will leave us stranded 5metres up. I am sure I see a ladder as being the least desired method of notifiable height access possible on Workplace NZ standards. Big conflict of interests going on.

I agree with you that the situation described sounds wrong, like as if they think it will be cheaper for you to use ladder etc or quieter. Doesn't sound like a plausible reason to exclude machinery. Should ask them if they would ever have a crane on site for a job then....

[R650R]

Your right about it adding costs. $650 to disconnect a heater from an AC unit that's 3 metres high..... needs two guys,$70 an hour for a ladder holder :rolleyes:
To repair it requires a scaffold..... I'm not saying its a bad thing, but pretty hard to explain to the client. " oh $3000 for the new heater in the meeting room"

Even at home I wont go higher on a ladder by myself if the height is further than what I want to fall from, eg feet above 2m say.... Most AC units would have fair bit of weight even the small ones.
Just tell em how expensive it will be to have their workplace closed for a whole day or more while an accident is investigated. The other things is no matter how good or competent you are, if your using something a lot sooner or later you will have a slip up by the law of averages, and that one moment is when having the right procedures in place matters.
Bit like truck drivers having to wear seatbelts, we go millions of km's without serious accident but when that moment comes that you need it, well it better be on...

[R650R]

And cars! Unreal eh. Fire extinguishered up to the eyeballs at home and work but a waste of time if you're off the pace pulling em out.

Had a driveshaft knuckle joint catch fire once, by the time I got it out from under all the other crap in side locker the fire burnt itself out lol

[caspernz]

And cars! Unreal eh. Fire extinguishered up to the eyeballs at home and work but a waste of time if you're off the pace pulling em out.

Here's a funny one for you then. I've been hauling fuel for a little while, sometime back we were having issues with fire extinguishers coming loose and sometimes falling off. Cue a redesigned extinguisher holder. This one had 3 clips/straps/thingemeebobs :angry2: that needed releasing before you could even get the bugger off the truck/trailer. This new design didn't enter service :brick::2thumbsup

[Smifffy]

I work with a very safe bunch and we do everything possible to keep everything under control. Nobody is afraid to say stop work if conditions change and what we do is at the top end of caution required.

BUT

The issue is we do this and the NZ Safety rep for the main contractor will look at a safety plan following the latest workplace safety preferred method to access an area by machinery and refuse the method claiming a ladder is safer because of a risk that machinery hydraulic failure will leave us stranded 5metres up. I am sure I see a ladder as being the least desired method of notifiable height access possible on Workplace NZ standards. Big conflict of interests going on.

Actually, it doesn't matter if you are stuck up there for a bit, in the event of hydraulic failure, as long as there is a rescue plan (go get the ladder now), and you are not at risk of falling or being suspended.

[Voltaire]

Even at home I wont go higher on a ladder by myself if the height is further than what I want to fall from, eg feet above 2m say.... Most AC units would have fair bit of weight even the small ones.
Just tell em how expensive it will be to have their workplace closed for a whole day or more while an accident is investigated. The other things is no matter how good or competent you are, if your using something a lot sooner or later you will have a slip up by the law of averages, and that one moment is when having the right procedures in place matters.
Bit like truck drivers having to wear seatbelts, we go millions of km's without serious accident but when that moment comes that you need it, well it better be on...

Must make riding a motorcycle interesting :msn-wink:

[Woodman]

So much of it seems to be an exercise in arse covering with improved safety being a by product.



Never a truer word spoken:brick::brick:

[mossy1200]

Actually, it doesn't matter if you are stuck up there for a bit, in the event of hydraulic failure, as long as there is a rescue plan (go get the ladder now), and you are not at risk of falling or being suspended.

Exactly when there is a guy at the bottom and every one has got radios plus a scissor lift onsite and an emergency recovery system on the boom. Now all you need do is convince the suit that only leaves the ground in a plane you have the correct plan.

We were asked if we wanted a team building exercise involving both companies.
Go Carts is out because it involves racing.
Quad biking is out because it involves vehicles.
Paint ball is out because its firearm related.

What they came up with was visiting a rescue helicopter and looking at it from a distance and donating our own money towards the cause. Nice idea but didn't seem to take off.

We decided to do our own team bonding exercise. Involved getting very drunk and a strip show.

[awa355]

A local primary school went out to a stream to learn about the eco side of things. They had a water fight at the end. Water bombs were deemed to dangerous but they could throw wet sponges at each other. :eek::eek:

[Oakie]

And cars! Unreal eh. Fire extinguishered up to the eyeballs at home and work but a waste of time if you're off the pace pulling em out.

Re fire extinguishers ... something I've noticed a lot is that many are installed with the plastic tie that stops the pin accidentally being removed still attached. This means that when it's time to fight a fire, the pin is unable to be removed and you'll burn to a crispy pile on the floor. Go and check some extinguishers. You will be surprised.

[Gremlin]

Ah the joys of a small company... A lot of other useful people would be employed before an H&S person was annoying us.

That said, we have clients which require the full protocols and we have to sign away our lives* as contractors. The risk is real (including one client having an appearance on one of those medical shows as a staff member was injured) but hey, that's someone else's problem ;)

* Ok, we don't actually sign away our lives, we're informed where the kettle is, as it's dangerous :wacko:

[Oakie]

The public sector has become a nightmare , councils , universities etc totally bogged down in BS. Yep. Universities are shocking. I was creating some new policies a few years ago and researched what other people had done. Universities seem to approach it as an academic exercise and produce very long, comprehensive documents ... but there's so much extraneous crap in them that it's to imagine anyone actually reading them.

[Woodman]

One site I know of requires visitors to have long sleeves so you don't get sunburn:weird::weird:

[Oakie]

One site I know of requires visitors to have long sleeves so you don't get sunburn:weird::weird:

The sun?

10 chars

[Edbear]

Re fire extinguishers ... something I've noticed a lot is that many are installed with the plastic tie that stops the pin accidentally being removed still attached. This means that when it's time to fight a fire, the pin is unable to be removed and you'll burn to a crispy pile on the floor. Go and check some extinguishers. You will be surprised.

It should be easy to snap the plastic tie by twisting the pin as you pull it out. I came across someone who had snipped it off and the pin fell out. You could perhaps replace the tie with a rubber band, I suppose.

[Akzle]

Re fire extinguishers ... something I've noticed a lot is that many are installed with the plastic tie that stops the pin accidentally being removed still attached. This means that when it's time to fight a fire, the pin is unable to be removed and you'll burn to a crispy pile on the floor. Go and check some extinguishers. You will be surprised.

learn how to use a fire extinguisher cunt. Twist it and the fucken thing snaps off. Theyre there as tamper-evident seals so office tards cant hit the fucken nos on their swivel chairs down the hall.

[unstuck]

Workplace. :nya::nya::nya: Slaves, the lot of ya.:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[trustme]

One site I know of requires visitors to have long sleeves so you don't get sunburn:weird::weird: Auckland Transport come to mind , now there are a bunch of total fucking morons. They are so full of their own importance with an ounce of luck they will disappear up their own arse. One of my pet hates, total , total , fucktards.

[trustme]

Some of you have no idea what a dangerous environment means until you get there and start getting your hands dirty

That is why so many of us have so little regard for the work safe regime. A one size fits all regime created by shiney arses in parliament most of whom have never got dirty in their lives, &, adminstered by more shiney arses who would not have a clue.. I tried to get answers from work safe recently . Does a forklift require a Rops cert ?? Might as well have talked to the wall. They don't by the way, Fletchers bullshit again.

[ellipsis]

...not really...wanna job?...

[vifferman]

Yep. Universities are shocking. I was creating some new policies a few years ago and researched what other people had done. Universities seem to approach it as an academic exercise and produce very long, comprehensive documents ... but there's so much extraneous crap in them that it's to imagine anyone actually reading them.
Not in Ye Olde Dayes.
When I was doing my MSc, we were using some truly gnarsty chemicals to separate and wash minerals: tetrabromoethane and washed with carbon tetrachloride. The samples were dried in cabinet clothes dryers, venting directly into the lab. Smelled really SWEEEET, so we didn't worry about it too much. Then (after weeks of that) came the report that several guys in the US had died from the same procedure. So, the dryers were thereafter vented into the fume cabinets. Then there was the time someone dropped a full bottle of some organic solvent (can't remember offhand - possibly due to chemical exposure - what it was), but to clean it up in a hurry, it was a quick mop-up with paper towels.
Happy days!:laugh:

Oh - worked in a lab for 9 years after that - no problems, as everything was set up properly, with the main lab room set up with automatic isolation, showers, etc. (apart from fumecupboards that vented straight to the atmosphere). We used lots of ether though - good for a quick buzz. Probably part of the reason I had to fire one of the technicians (who was a bit of a recreational druggie).

That reminds me of my (not so) dear departed Dad. Many decades ago, he went to Auckland uni. One day, he was working in a lab that had a view of the street. They were watching a guy riding past on a motorbike; his trench coat was flapping around, and suddenly got caught in the back wheel. It winched him off the back of the bike, which so startled the girl next to my dad that she dropped the flask she was holding. It smashed the rest of the glassware, and showered her with chemicals, so they bunged her under the emergency shower, which made some of her clothes disintegrate.
The topper was they had to pay for all the broken glassware.

[trustme]

...not really...wanna job?...

Wot ,, working for some cranky old ginga !!! Hi Neil :wavey::wavey:

[Oakie]

It should be easy to snap the plastic tie by twisting the pin as you pull it out. I came across someone who had snipped it off and the pin fell out. You could perhaps replace the tie with a rubber band, I suppose.


learn how to use a fire extinguisher cunt. Twist it and the fucken thing snaps off. Theyre there as tamper-evident seals so office tards cant hit the fucken nos on their swivel chairs down the hall.

Funny how two responses that give the same answer can be delivered so differently.

I'll twist one of those bands tomorrow on a spare extinguisher I have by my desk and see what happens. If it works then I've learned something. Nevertheless, I'll still be cutting the plastic when extinguishers are installed. I ambushed a colleague one day, gave him a small extinguisher and told him he had 10 seconds to get it ready to use. A couple of seconds to look at it, a couple of seconds to try and pull the pin out and then the rest of the time trying to break the plastic security band. Unsuccesfully.

[Voltaire]

have adminstered by more shiney arses who would not have a clue.. as well have talked to the wall.

That's me that is.
Turn up on my site and its:
Safety Video
Site induction
Quiz
Photo for security
SWMS
Permit to Work
and that's just for the " 5 minute jobs"

and if you don't like I do the " Contactors van inspection"

After 4 years the first aid kit has yet to be used....touch SWMS:innocent:

[trustme]

Funny how two responses that give the same answer can be delivered so differently.

I'll twist one of those bands tomorrow on a spare extinguisher I have by my desk and see what happens. If it works then I've learned something. Nevertheless, I'll still be cutting the plastic when extinguishers are installed. I ambushed a colleague one day, gave him a small extinguisher and told him he had 10 seconds to get it ready to use. A couple of seconds to look at it, a couple of seconds to try and pull the pin out and then the rest of the time trying to break the plastic security band. Unsuccesfully.

Clearly a lack of suitable training ! The employer has been totally negligent & deserves a right royal boot up the arse , he should be burned art the stake for placing his workers at risk . The safety person if he had an ounce of integrity would just fall on his sword .
I'm not having a crack at you Oakie, just the cynic in me rising.

[trustme]

SWMS , music to my ears. We have just done a job where we had to sign the RED FOLDER prepared by the Safety Doris that contained all the generic swms that were relevant to our job. Not one of them was relevent to our task, we did our own task analysis. Doris has started to develop more encompassing swm, 28 pages so far.

Who the hell will read that!!!! Where is the page at the end that we all sign & let's get on with it . Futile bollocks.

[Oakie]

Clearly a lack of suitable training ! The employer has been totally negligent & deserves a right royal boot up the arse , he should be burned art the stake for placing his workers at risk . The safety person if he had an ounce of integrity would just fall on his sword .
I'm not having a crack at you Oakie, just the cynic in me rising.

Stop right there! Burning at the stake and falling on my sword would not comply with HSE regs!

[Oakie]

Doris has started to develop more encompassing swm, 28 pages so far.

Who the hell will read that!!!! Where is the page at the end that we all sign & let's get on with it . Futile bollocks. Agreed. Our sister organisation's Contractor Induction document is 30 pages long. The one I developed for our place is 3 pages of speaking points ... and that 3 pages is the maximum. It can be reduced depending on location worked in and length of time estimated on site. Looking at somewhere between 2 minutes for say a new locksmith coming to change one lock through to about 25 minutes perhaps for the full monty version for a significant project (which I'm still waiting to do one for).

[Smifffy]

Interesting thread, dismissing the dumb fuck comments ( Akzle)

I work at a major port, driving a straddle and working on a ship occasionally when required, often in the middle of the night when it's cold and pissing down.

Most of you have no idea what a dangerous environment means until you get up on the ship and start getting your hands dirty.

Ya reckon?

[Akzle]

Funny how two responses that give the same answer can be delivered so differently.

I'll twist one of those bands tomorrow on a spare extinguisher I have by my desk and see what happens. If it works then I've learned something. Nevertheless, I'll still be cutting the plastic when extinguishers are installed. I ambushed a colleague one day, gave him a small extinguisher and told him he had 10 seconds to get it ready to use. A couple of seconds to look at it, a couple of seconds to try and pull the pin out and then the rest of the time trying to break the plastic security band. Unsuccesfully.

youre a fycken hazard and your work mate's a moron.

Maybe you need to do some fire extinguisher training :laugh:

[unstuck]

https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpt1/v/t1.0-9/10432093_10152649716402313_7077642057373710403_n.j pg?oh=f8cf16a8818a8811d6c4665a3a2e546c&oe=56841E5C

[Edbear]

Ya reckon?

Working with your wife in the office..? :rolleyes:

[Big Dog]

Ax is not too far from the mark here.
If you are subject to building wofs and your inspector actually checks you fail if less than 2/3 of your approved fire extinguishers display correct servicing info and said plastic seal. Otherwise how is anyone to know that timmy already used the extinguisher on the fire he didn't report?

They should also carry labelling in at least English and pictures showing how to remove the seal.


Sent via tapatalk.

[Big Dog]

Men generally don't read instructions during an event which is what makes training so important.

Sent via tapatalk.

[Grumph]

Had to laugh last night at the oversight which has left the "other livestock" in the new act. We've been pedigree cat breeders for decades but if that section stays in one of us is going to have to go on a course at the gov'ts expense....
The wife has selflessly volounteered to go.

Could have been worse, we could have raised worm farms...

[Waihou Thumper]

Did working at heights full day training today and then found out it doesn't include harness inspection anymore. That's an advanced course now with an extra days training required.

I work for a training organisation and have done for over 5 and a half years.
Unit standard 17600 and 16757 require Harness/Lanyard inspections and for the advanced height safety, not only do you have to inspect, you have to be able to recognise faults. I wonder who you trained with? :wacko:

[Waihou Thumper]

Our workplace is reasonably safe although I have to say that ... I'm the Health and Safety guy. We've averaged an accident every 23 days over the past 8 years for a staff of about 90. Nothing worse than a broken bone in a foot, a couple of broken toes and a cracked rib though. Slips and trips account for a bit over 30% of our accidents.

Are you taking the piss? :) reasonably safe?

[TheDemonLord]

Relephant:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPpxjWT-b1U

[mossy1200]

I work for a training organisation and have done for over 5 and a half years.
Unit standard 17600 and 16757 require Harness/Lanyard inspections and for the advanced height safety, not only do you have to inspect, you have to be able to recognise faults. I wonder who you trained with? :wacko:

Pre Use Inspection is included but we cant fill out the 6month logbook anymore to certify the equipment. We need advanced height training additional day. Safety n Action
I likely worded that incorrectly.

[unstuck]

Men generally don't read instructions

Yeah, I didn't read the instructions before assembling a table saw last weekend.:weird:

Who would have guessed they would have surrounded the motor in polystyrene and cardboard. :facepalm:

[Swoop]

Who the hell will read that!!!! Where is the page at the end that we all sign & let's get on with it...

M. Mouse.
A. Hitler.
R. McDonald
...


OSH. Designed to keep retards employed since ages ago (in america).

[caspernz]

The funny thing in the civilian world is we're almost completed buttoned up in cotton wool and bubble wrap, hi-viz style of course!

The dumb thing is that there are times I feel more ill at ease with my workmates, due to some of the actions, than I was when surrounded by comrades in arms on peacekeeping missions.

But hey, my perspective isn't unique in that regard I'd guess :rolleyes:

[Voltaire]

I was thinking about taking up worm farming but according to Worksafe its pretty dangerous :innocent:, closely followed by mini golf :eek:

[Oakie]

Are you taking the piss? :) reasonably safe?


Not taking the piss at all. Our staff report their accidents even if they are minor. We've only had one that involved the Labour Inspector and that was because one of the people we support cracked the rib of his support person. Not hazard related. We do not have the same potential for injury that many have as we have no heavy machinery. Yes, reasonably safe compared to many.

[mossy1200]

Not taking the piss at all. Our staff report their accidents even if they are minor. We've only had one that involved the Labour Inspector and that was because one of the people we support cracked the rib of his support person. Not hazard related. We do not have the same potential for injury that many have as we have no heavy machinery. Yes, reasonably safe compared to many.

Nobody at my work would dare take a plaster from the first aid kit. We all have our own first aid kits.:corn:
The last cut finger causing a half day off work escalated into a Guy coming over from America to investigate the incident.

[ellipsis]

...fuck this...I'm not getting up tomorrow, it's just too fucking dangerous... mark my words, if you get up tomorrow someone, somewhere will die... you should stay in bed too...in fact we should all have a fucking, World Safety Day, in bed...or would that be fucking dangerous too... pwobibly...

[mossy1200]

...fuck this...I'm not getting up tomorrow, it's just too fucking dangerous... mark my words, if you get up tomorrow someone, somewhere will die... you should stay in bed too...in fact we should all have a fucking, World Safety Day, in bed...or would that be fucking dangerous too... pwobibly...

I been married 14 years. I stare death in the face and laugh but I am not going to be the one that uses a plaster from the first aid kit.

[Oakie]

...fuck this...I'm not getting up tomorrow, it's just too fucking dangerous... mark my words, if you get up tomorrow someone, somewhere will die... you should stay in bed too...in fact we should all have a fucking, World Safety Day, in bed...or would that be fucking dangerous too... pwobibly...

Bed sores.

[Banditbandit]

Well, apparently our Government thinks that working in a tertiary educational institute is not as safe as working in the agricultural/horticultural sector, planting demolition exploives ...

It is a dangerous as working in a worm farm or a butterfly farm ..

[haydes55]

I work in customers roof cavities, alone. I work in very confined spaces (I once had to tape ducting to my leg and pull my body through a 6m cavity because there wasn't enough room for me to lie and have ducting beside me), I have no confined working training at all.

I work on ladders up to 5m high. No working at heights training, no ladder safety videos, nothing. Here's a ladder, lean it against that, climb. Training done.

I work in extreme temperatures, as cold as -5, highest was 66 degrees (+/-4 degrees accuracy if our temp probes). My training consists of the boss supplying squincher to add to our water. I had to do an induction to the company, questions of how to install, how to service etc. And a section on how to recognize heat stroke and how to prevent it. We had an installation manual which had the answers to every question, but I couldn't find the answers to what they wanted to know about heat stroke, so I guessed an answer. I got the second highest score in the franchise for the entire induction.

Never done a first aid course, yet I work with knives, power tools and in dangerous places.

I spend about 2-3 hours a day driving, no driver training (my contract specifically says I'm not allowed to race any work vehicle).

I'm due to die soon, surely.

[awa355]

I'm due to die soon, surely.

If you do, can I have your bike ???????:shutup::shutup: I dont want your helmet, someone else can have that, but the bike would be nice.

[FJRider]

I work in customers roof cavities, alone. I work in very confined spaces (I once had to tape ducting to my leg and pull my body through a 6m cavity because there wasn't enough room for me to lie and have ducting beside me), I have no confined working training at all.

I work on ladders up to 5m high. No working at heights training, no ladder safety videos, nothing. Here's a ladder, lean it against that, climb. Training done.

I work in extreme temperatures, as cold as -5, highest was 66 degrees (+/-4 degrees accuracy if our temp probes). My training consists of the boss supplying squincher to add to our water. I had to do an induction to the company, questions of how to install, how to service etc. And a section on how to recognize heat stroke and how to prevent it. We had an installation manual which had the answers to every question, but I couldn't find the answers to what they wanted to know about heat stroke, so I guessed an answer. I got the second highest score in the franchise for the entire induction.

Never done a first aid course, yet I work with knives, power tools and in dangerous places.

I spend about 2-3 hours a day driving, no driver training (my contract specifically says I'm not allowed to race any work vehicle).

I'm due to die soon, surely.

Put your concerns / questions / issues ... in writing ... and E.mail it to your employer.

[Grumph]

...fuck this...I'm not getting up tomorrow, it's just too fucking dangerous... mark my words, if you get up tomorrow someone, somewhere will die... you should stay in bed too...in fact we should all have a fucking, World Safety Day, in bed...or would that be fucking dangerous too... pwobibly...

I seen to remember you reporting your wife being thrown out of bed in the first quake, chased round the room by the bed, and then given a good kicking by said bed....
Do you really want to risk that again ? Obviously going to bed is far too dangerous - look at the numbers who die there...

[haydes55]

Put your concerns / questions / issues ... in writing ... and E.mail it to your employer.
Then if have to sit through boring courses, spend double as long at each job going through health and safety shit and get issue less (commission).

I did a site safe course once. If anyone needs to be told the shit they talked about, they deserve to die. It was about as helpful as telling a sparky to not lick a live wire... The sparky shouldn't be dumb enough to do it in the first place.

[ellipsis]

I seen to remember you reporting your wife being thrown out of bed in the first quake, chased round the room by the bed, and then given a good kicking by said bed....
Do you really want to risk that again ? Obviously going to bed is far too dangerous - look at the numbers who die there...


...she will be safe, she'll be working...someone has to pay the bills...I'll take the risk, unless it's a good day, then I may just get up at lunch time and go for a ride...

[Kickaha]

then I may just get up at lunch time
Fucking lazy cunt

[Voltaire]

Best " Site Safe" course I ever did was on London Underground, got to walk over Live tracks, and use fire extinguishers on a real petrol fire.:woohoo:, that was about 1991.
The site I manage has loads of fire extinguishers but the policy is get out of the building and don't be a hero.

[Headbanger]

I work in customers roof cavities, alone. I work in very confined spaces (I once had to tape ducting to my leg and pull my body through a 6m cavity because there wasn't enough room for me to lie and have ducting beside me), I have no confined working training at all.

I work on ladders up to 5m high. No working at heights training, no ladder safety videos, nothing. Here's a ladder, lean it against that, climb. Training done.

I work in extreme temperatures, as cold as -5, highest was 66 degrees (+/-4 degrees accuracy if our temp probes). My training consists of the boss supplying squincher to add to our water. I had to do an induction to the company, questions of how to install, how to service etc. And a section on how to recognize heat stroke and how to prevent it. We had an installation manual which had the answers to every question, but I couldn't find the answers to what they wanted to know about heat stroke, so I guessed an answer. I got the second highest score in the franchise for the entire induction.

Never done a first aid course, yet I work with knives, power tools and in dangerous places.

I spend about 2-3 hours a day driving, no driver training (my contract specifically says I'm not allowed to race any work vehicle).

I'm due to die soon, surely.

Most likely,Though luck rather then skill will be on your side right to the end....as to when the end will be?

for me, in a likely similar situation, I had no concept of how much of an ignorant dumb fuck I was even after many years on the job until I attended some training and woke the fuck up.

[Headbanger]

Then if have to sit through boring courses, spend double as long at each job going through health and safety shit and get issue less (commission).

I did a site safe course once. If anyone needs to be told the shit they talked about, they deserve to die. It was about as helpful as telling a sparky to not lick a live wire... The sparky shouldn't be dumb enough to do it in the first place.

How much an hour is death worth?

Sure, Its a fucking retarded question.

I see people doing shit that's likely to kill them or ruin their ability to earn a living for $20 bucks an hour. One wrong move and they will never work again, and they were fucked enough to do it for a $20?


Don't get me wrong, I don't know you, Dont give a fuck if you cause your own death through your own stupidity, But the concept of taking a small amount of cash for a large risk just doesn't sit well, More so when some young cunt doesn't know any better, or when the employer is banking coin based on the stupidity of their workers.

[Headbanger]

Best " Site Safe" course I ever did was on London Underground, got to walk over Live tracks, and use fire extinguishers on a real petrol fire.:woohoo:, that was about 1991.
The site I manage has loads of fire extinguishers but the policy is get out of the building and don't be a hero.

Similar situation, all our sites, mobile plant and vehicles have extinguishers, we put emergency plans in place for every foreseeable event, we train people as wardens, chief wardens, emergency controllers and in the use of fire extinguishers as per current legislation. We run regular evac drills based on multiple scenarios which we document and analyze so we can improve our response.

Then we tell everyone, fuck that shit, do not put yourself at risk, let the cunt burn and get the fuck out.

[Headbanger]

Pre Use Inspection is included but we cant fill out the 6month logbook anymore to certify the equipment. We need advanced height training additional day. Safety n Action
I likely worded that incorrectly.

That's a good thing, Results are always more legit when undertaken by a third party with no vested interest in keeping the gear in play.

Better off having a procedure in place where the gear is taken offsite to be inspected and tagged by a separate entity, Not only for real world safety but also for covering your arse in the event of a fuck up.

[Headbanger]

I get the shits when the Safety Doris does an audit, she ticks all the boxes on her clip board , she would not have a bloody clue about what is really going on ,

Whose fault is that?

Granted I don't believe in putting someone in place who doesn't understand the job being undertaken or what steps are likely to take place to just get it done, But everyone from the directors, to the company officers, supervisors and the workers have a responsibility to be aware of and work to the systems in place.

If shit is going on behind the safety persons back then the culture is to blame at every level that is aware of it, The problem isn't the safety person.

Unless of course they are useless and or don't give a fuck.

Still, That hasn't held me back.

[Headbanger]

We have a page in the Hazard's folder that is supposed to be filled out for 'near miss', or potential accidents. I mean, where do you draw the line. :no:

The definition of a near miss is an unplanned event that had the potential to cause injury or damage but did not result in injury or damage.

[trustme]

Whose fault is that?

Granted I don't believe in putting someone in place who doesn't understand the job being undertaken or what steps are likely to take place to just get it done, But everyone from the directors, to the company officers, supervisors and the workers have a responsibility to be aware of and work to the systems in place.

If shit is going on behind the safety persons back then the culture is to blame at every level that is aware of it, The problem isn't the safety person.

Unless of course they are useless and or don't give a fuck.

Still, That hasn't held me back.

I shift heavy industrial machinery. people often comment that some of what we do is nuts or ask how the hell did we do that. We have very few accidents because we are careful & quite conservative in the way we rig stuff. The problem comes when the Safety Doris or Denis wants to put their 5 cents worth in when they would have absolutely no idea of how to do the job. We end a up with some generic piece of garbage SWM & a check of tags & compliance . Mostly we prefer to do our own TA's, at least they are relevant .

A few years ago we were to do a swap out of plant at a large factory over a weekend. We got a big lecture from The Doris about working in an unsafe manner & how we must stop if there were uncontrolled hazards. We got there at 4pm on Friday to work all night, [ production was to stop at 2.00pm ] Everything is still running , operators still on the machines , forklifts everywhere, broken glass , water all over the place . They were going to work till 10pm to make up for lost production.

' Cool , we'll go home & come back tomorrow once all the hazards are removed '
' You can't we have to be running Monday morning & that will wreck the whole program '
'But I can't work with all these hazards, do you want me to work in an unsafe environment'
Silence & shuffling of feet ' You wouldn't would you '
' There's one condition , the Safety Doris has the weekend off '

Today I would pull the pin , so I guess attitudes have changed.

[R650R]

Relephant:



I just choked on my toast laughing at that, hilarious !!! :)

[R650R]

I work in customers roof cavities, alone. I work in very confined spaces (I once had to tape ducting to my leg and pull my body through a 6m cavity because there wasn't enough room for me to lie and have ducting beside me), I have no confined working training at all.

I work on ladders up to 5m high. No working at heights training, no ladder safety videos, nothing. Here's a ladder, lean it against that, climb. Training done.



Although a ladder is a simple tool a fall from 5m is easily fatal. Do you isolate the area where the ladder is so people cant walk into it or hit with mobile plants/machinery/forklifts etc???
I can guarantee there will be dozens if not hundreds of people around the country who will have thought like you in similar roles but are now dead or disabled as a result of unforeseen circumstances. I've done similar work to you in my younger days installing alarm systems, prob thought the same as you back then too. Looking back I was lucky not to have ever fallen or made mistake, only did job for few months before changing to something else.

brief follow up to the crane incident...

http://www.heavyliftnews.com/news/alphen-incident-aftermath?cu=58

[Headbanger]

I shift heavy industrial machinery. people often comment that some of what we do is nuts or ask how the hell did we do that. We have very few accidents because we are careful & quite conservative in the way we rig stuff. The problem comes when the Safety Doris or Denis wants to put their 5 cents worth in when they would have absolutely no idea of how to do the job. We end a up with some generic piece of garbage SWM & a check of tags & compliance . Mostly we prefer to do our own TA's, at least they are relevant .

A few years ago we were to do a swap out of plant at a large factory over a weekend. We got a big lecture from The Doris about working in an unsafe manner & how we must stop if there were uncontrolled hazards. We got there at 4pm on Friday to work all night, [ production was to stop at 2.00pm ] Everything is still running , operators still on the machines , forklifts everywhere, broken glass , water all over the place . They were going to work till 10pm to make up for lost production.


There is a lot to be said for bringing in the experts and then just getting the hell out of their way.

[trustme]

Exactly. By all means check that the contractor has systems in place but don't try to micromanage the job.

[Ocean1]

There is a lot to be said for bringing in the experts and then just getting the hell out of their way.

And fuck all intelligent to be said for anything else.

[Headbanger]

And fuck all intelligent to be said for anything else.

The issue being that the Australian legislation nominates contractors and their subcontractors to be treated in the same manner as employees and that the PCBU engaging them are to be held responsible for a fuck up.

Granted I don't know the exact form of the Australian legislation that is being adopted in NZ but it seems this line of thinking will be maintained in the legislation.

This means that you can have a strong engagement process, a strong induction and hazard management/reporting system, But if you're not monitoring the works and in a position to to stop an unsafe practice that could or does cause an injury or incident then you can and will be held responsible.

To get a contractor on site you need to review all their systems against legislation, and then monitor their works in the form of documented task observations.

One of the case studies involves a factory that engaged a contractor to repair a section of damaged roof, The contractor submitted a tender with all required documentation and won the job. The contractor then rang his mate harry and got him to do it instead.

Harry was inducted into the workplace, had a swms, started the work. The safety adviser from the factory inspected the works after setup was completed and noted that he was wearing his ppe, that a fall arrest system was in place that consisted of netting.

3 hours later Harry was picked up off the floor below and taken to hospital. The investigation found that Harry had slipped off his work boots at some stage and put on his trainers, then to get to the flashing he had removed the safety net from where it was fitted. While doing so he had slipped and fallen head first to the ground below.

The factory copped the prosecution and all three parties were fined heavily. It was proven that the factory was negligent in failing to ensure that the works were monitored and undertaken safely.

[Big Dog]

That sounds like a real head ache.

Sent via tapatalk.

[trustme]

NZ pretty much follows Aussie, so I expect our new legislation is very close to Oz. I struggle with the company being liable in Headbangers case study. Sure the contractor & his mate are in the gun , but if the employing company checked everything & then numb nuts works outside the agreed method then it is his problem, he fucked up .

Seems to me that if there is a serious accident or death the main employer is always wrong even if he has tried to do everything right. You can't win.

As an aside how did replacing work boots with trainers contribute. It used to be that structural steel riggers wore trainers rather than steel caps because they were considered safer. If you have ever clambered around on structural steel you will understand the arguement .

[Headbanger]

The removal of the work boots was evidence that the works weren't being monitored leading up to the fall.

The reports I have read is that NZ is adopting the Aussie H&S act and regulations pretty much in its entirety.

Its more then a head ache, Where I work we have around 100 employees, another 50 or so labour hire on site on any given day, and approx 100 subcontractors on the books, who also have their own subbies. we have to have competencies documented for every task they undertake, systems for all works, records of daily, weekly and monthly audits and inspections, and a selection of task observations (I ask the foreman to do 3 each a week, My safety advisers 5 or 7)

On top of all this the developer spends 4 hours a week on site going over every single document and process, right down to the service history of a generator.

Then we have a quarterly 2 day audit, where they smash us to fuck.

Fun times.

All hail the safety gods, here to rescue us from ourselves.

To take it back to the guy who previously posted about confined spaces, In the event he dies at work without a procedure in place for high risk works, and without following that procedure then whoever is paying him the commission will get it in the neck. The intended result is that they will stop their subies from taking these risks.


But, not much will change, those that have to might, those that don't give a fuck simply won't. You can look over the fence from one of our sites and its a whole different world.

[Headbanger]

I spent a number of years clambering around on steel work, The steelworkers are fools to themselves, They have at one point or another rejected pretty much all systems systems as being more dangerous even when the numbers prove them 100 percent incorrect.

Some people would rather just be hero's and die.


But again, Personally I don't give a rats what people as individuals want to do, I get employed to do what needs to be done for a company.

[Voltaire]

No one wants accidents at work ( or anytime really) but do they really think they can legislate it enough to stop them entirely.
I was traveling with an Aussie guy last year and he said one plus of using Contractors back in the day was less paperwork, now he said you may as well just get employees.
I had a painter here a couple of years back, job needed a elevating platform, couple of days later its stuck up at 5+ metres with his mate on it and he had climbed down the side of it..... had not charged it as did not have a tagged lead and did not want to ask for one.
( could not drop it down either as was over some pipework)
He could have just rung someone.....:brick:

[Grumph]

The issue being that the Australian legislation nominates contractors and their subcontractors to be treated in the same manner as employees and that the PCBU engaging them are to be held responsible for a fuck up.

Granted I don't know the exact form of the Australian legislation that is being adopted in NZ but it seems this line of thinking will be maintained in the legislation.

This means that you can have a strong engagement process, a strong induction and hazard management/reporting system, But if you're not monitoring the works and in a position to to stop an unsafe practice that could or does cause an injury or incident then you can and will be held responsible.

To get a contractor on site you need to review all their systems against legislation, and then monitor their works in the form of documented task observations.

The factory copped the prosecution and all three parties were fined heavily. It was proven that the factory was negligent in failing to ensure that the works were monitored and undertaken safely.

Observing the ChCh rebuild - where Fletchers in particular have managed the undercap jobs for EQC - by engaging subbies...who then engaged subbies...
It's been pretty apparent that poor work practices have been pretty much the norm. Poor and substandard work which is coming to light now - and many instances previously - are having to be rectified by the "prime" subbie of Fletchers - if they can find them...
Fletchers are simply distancing themselves - although they were supposed to have day to day oversight
They seem to be adamant that the subbies were not employees....
I can't see any legislation getting through here which would look like the Aussie setup.

[Headbanger]

I can't see any legislation getting through here which would look like the Aussie setup.

We wont know until its finilised

but...

http://www.business.govt.nz/worksafe/about/reform


Did you know?

Our new health and safety law is based on Australia’s. They’ve seen a 16 per cent reduction in work-related deaths since 2012 and just reported the lowest number of work-related deaths in 11 years.





The responsibilities listed down the left side of that page as far as I can see word for word Aussie legislation

[Headbanger]

For those that are preparing for the change/work in safety this will be of interest.

http://www.mangolive.com/blog-mango/new-zealand-workplace-health-safety-webinar-recording-2

[Headbanger]

fuck me, 12 minutes into that webinar and I want to kill myself.

fuck that.

[trustme]

Observing the ChCh rebuild - where Fletchers in particular have managed the undercap jobs for EQC - by engaging subbies...who then engaged subbies...
It's been pretty apparent that poor work practices have been pretty much the norm. Poor and substandard work which is coming to light now - and many instances previously - are having to be rectified by the "prime" subbie of Fletchers - if they can find them...
Fletchers are simply distancing themselves - although they were supposed to have day to day oversight
They seem to be adamant that the subbies were not employees....
I can't see any legislation getting through here which would look like the Aussie setup.

Good luck with Fletchers. There were 2 construction companies we point blank refuse to work for. One of them was Mainzeal, the other , guess who ??. We do work on their sites if employed directly by a supplier, no way will we expose ourselves to them directly. Just finished a job on one of their sites, a months work that started in March & has just finished , might as well not have bothered.

Yes, the legislation is coming. Yes it will probably mirror Oz.

[Grumph]

Good luck with Fletchers. There were 2 construction companies we point blank refuse to work for. One of them was Mainzeal, the other , guess who ??. We do work on their sites if employed directly by a supplier, no way will we expose ourselves to them directly. Just finished a job on one of their sites, a months work that started in March & has just finished , might as well not have bothered.

Yes, the legislation is coming. Yes it will probably mirror Oz.

Personally, i hope it does. But seriously, once the government realises their exposure through Fletchers to the risks inherent in the current method of dealing with subbies, either the rebuild will be excepted or that part of the proposed laws will be watered down.

And at the time it was deal with fletchers or opt out. In the early days opting out didn't look like the way to go - but once we'd seen just what was happening I advised several to opt out. It was Sydney or the bush, make your best guess and see...

[eldog]

I struggle with the company being liable in Headbangers case study. Sure the contractor & his mate are in the gun , but if the employing company checked everything & then numb nuts works outside the agreed method then it is his problem, he fucked up .

Seems to me that if there is a serious accident or death the main employer is always wrong even if he has tried to do everything right. You can't win.

As an aside how did replacing work boots with trainers contribute. It used to be that structural steel riggers wore trainers rather than steel caps because they were considered safer. If you have ever clambered around on structural steel you will understand the arguement .

I tend to agree with you. Seen it happen here at work.
No matter what you have in place, someone will always find a way to shortcut something or do something dumb.
Generally they make an error, because they are so involved in the work they are doing they don't see the obvious.

One site I worked on they had banned ladders.
We used cherry pickers etc and scaffolding except in one case where it was impossible to do so.
So we used a ladder after discussing it with the head contractor and getting approval for that one instance and taking all reasonable precautions.
(It was far safer than trying to get scaffolding or the cheery picker in)

Its a matter of making things as safe as possible.
Its also a case of people taking responsibility and ownership of what they are doing.
We all make mistakes... sometime.
Riding a mbike its just the same thing, make self responsible. Take all practical precautions.
If you take a risk, its upto you.
Its the unknown that catches most of us noobs out.

[trustme]

Last week I was slinging 2.5 tonne loads at a height of 200 metres. Just another common garden construction site .
Speaking of boats , nip down to the maritime museum & check out the Rapaki , I've used that . ' Just a common garden construction worker , what would I know '.
Look what you have done , you've made me grumpy now.:baby:

[ellipsis]

Speaking of boats , nip down to the maritime museum & check out the Rapaki , I've used that . ' '.

...I was crew on that on quite a few occasions...was terribly fucked off when she steamed out of the moles for the last time...

[trustme]

I think we had to give 3 days notice so they could build of a head of steam , or maybe that was so they could have time to drag the crew out of the pub & sober them up. Not you though eh Neil!!!. She was a beauty.

[Grumph]

...I was crew on that on quite a few occasions...was terribly fucked off when she steamed out of the moles for the last time...

I had lunch on board a few times, one of my neighbours was a harbour board engineer, a good friend from the bike world was another who worked on her.

[Ocean1]

The issue being that the Australian legislation nominates contractors and their subcontractors to be treated in the same manner as employees and that the PCBU engaging them are to be held responsible for a fuck up.

Granted I don't know the exact form of the Australian legislation that is being adopted in NZ but it seems this line of thinking will be maintained in the legislation.

This means that you can have a strong engagement process, a strong induction and hazard management/reporting system, But if you're not monitoring the works and in a position to to stop an unsafe practice that could or does cause an injury or incident then you can and will be held responsible.

To get a contractor on site you need to review all their systems against legislation, and then monitor their works in the form of documented task observations.

One of the case studies involves a factory that engaged a contractor to repair a section of damaged roof, The contractor submitted a tender with all required documentation and won the job. The contractor then rang his mate harry and got him to do it instead.

Harry was inducted into the workplace, had a swms, started the work. The safety adviser from the factory inspected the works after setup was completed and noted that he was wearing his ppe, that a fall arrest system was in place that consisted of netting.

3 hours later Harry was picked up off the floor below and taken to hospital. The investigation found that Harry had slipped off his work boots at some stage and put on his trainers, then to get to the flashing he had removed the safety net from where it was fitted. While doing so he had slipped and fallen head first to the ground below.

The factory copped the prosecution and all three parties were fined heavily. It was proven that the factory was negligent in failing to ensure that the works were monitored and undertaken safely.

Like I said, fuck all intelligent.

[Grubber]

We are currently going through all the H&S systems at my work.
We now have a segment for driving in the wind. As in if it's too windy we have to pull over and tie the curtains of our trailer up.
One has to do a weather check prior to departure each time to ensure the conditions are ok to travel.
Not sure what you do when you head over the hill and find the wind has crept up to a significant level. Guess we will write up a safety page for that too.
Might as well just stay at home.

[trustme]

I would imagine that a lot of farms are a husband / wife partnership. In this brave new world I suspect if Farmer Brown stuffs up & kills himself , his widow as a co director of the business will then be prosecuted. If she wasn't stuffed before she certainly will be when Work Safe have finished. Already happened with the widow of the bloke whose fishing boat sank at Bluff.

Is that really justice being served ??

[Voltaire]

I would imagine that a lot of farms are a husband / wife partnership. In this brave new world I suspect if Farmer Brown stuffs up & kills himself , his widow as a co director of the business will then be prosecuted. If she wasn't stuffed before she certainly will be when Work Safe have finished. Already happened with the widow of the bloke whose fishing boat sank at Bluff.

Is that really justice being served ??


The Company I work for is based in Chicago, how does that work I wonder?
The local Director here sees me at the Xmas party and has no idea what I do.....as we are run out of Sydney.
Should I put all my stuff in a trust ?

[trustme]

A company we work for is a multinational, the NZ division is run out of OZ. When they had the fatal last year, 4 senior managers received a letter, ' Lawyer up you are on your own '.
2 of those guys have since gone, one who had been there over 20 years was told leave & you get entitlements , stay & be sacked & get nothing. He knew nothing about the job , he did not know it was happening ,had never been to the site , never knew the bloke who was killed .
He now works as Mr Fixit on Vineyard in the Wairarapa, happy as a sand boy & glad to be out.

[Pixie]

I've got a worm farm.Obviously,I'm going to die at any moment.
I think I'll move into explosives for the safety aspect.

[Pixie]

I was thinking about taking up worm farming but according to Worksafe its pretty dangerous :innocent:, closely followed by mini golf :eek:
You may joke,but a large proportion of all the human beings that ever existed were eaten by worms.

[R650R]

We are currently going through all the H&S systems at my work.
We now have a segment for driving in the wind. As in if it's too windy we have to pull over and tie the curtains of our trailer up.
One has to do a weather check prior to departure each time to ensure the conditions are ok to travel.
Not sure what you do when you head over the hill and find the wind has crept up to a significant level. Guess we will write up a safety page for that too.
Might as well just stay at home.

I saw those pics from Matamau.... that spot takes out a couple of trucks a year on average. Had a couple of seat cover moments there myself.
A real headache to do anything officially about safety wise. It can be quite uncomfortable for the driver on a windy night but in terms of a unit actually being lifted/rolled its one of those freak gusts that does the damage and you cant plan for that.
Tranist now how signs up telling drivers to report 'windy conditions' but what scares a car driver might not even rate on truck scale.... waiting for the day when cops close the roads for wind....
While Matamau keeps taking its toll there are lots of other places where wind is scarey but trucks never come to grief or extremly rarely, trees or terrain deflects the wind just enough.
I would love to hear what the cops/insurance company/osh/transit define as unsafe winds to travel if something like that ever got to court level????
Then there's the likes of the bottom of Titiokoura in the mornings where the wind absolutely howls through regardless of the forecast at a certain time in the early morning, a local phenomenon due to air temp change as sun rises etc...
Good luck with you exercise in writing up a plan for this, especially the part about how it will be safe for a lone driver to safely open a curtainside in extreme winds for the exercise in tying them back, exposing to a new separate risk there!!!

[Grubber]

You see my dilemma.

Sent from my GT-I9300T using Tapatalk

[awa355]

Some take this 'Mini Golf' seriously.

A brief run down of some of the hazards from a UK site.

Here's some of the things to look out for:

Moss
Bird droppings
Overgrown plants round edges (Some advice on planting.)
Check paths to and from the hole aren't slippery
Plants between tee border and path
Plants on fairway and in hole itself
Loose bricks
Damage to playing surface
Damage to obstacles
Identify and clean any drainage points (NB ensure all drainage holes in cup are clear)

All holes visible to passers-by or enquirers should be particularly clean and well kept.



http://www.miniaturegolfer.com/miniature%20golf%20risk%20assessment.html

[TheDemonLord]

All holes visible to passers-by or enquirers should be particularly clean and well kept.


isn't that part of the White House's H&S policy too? :laugh::laugh::laugh:

[Kickaha]

While Matamau keeps taking its toll there are lots of other places where wind is scarey but trucks never come to grief or extremly rarely, trees or terrain deflects the wind just enough.

I remember heading through to Pukekohe one year and about 5-10km north of Kaikoura seeing an 8x4 truck + 4 axle trailer on it's side having been blown off the road, a couple of Km before that there was a destroyed caravan, the road (SH1) had been closed the night before due to wind

I've seen a few caravans over the years but that's the only truck

[Oakie]

Mini-golf is classed as 'dangerous' because many years ago it was classed as an 'adventure sport' for some reason. That's all. Perhapas years ago someone classed worms in the same group as snakes?

[Headbanger]

<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings> <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings> </xml><![endif]--> Work crew came across a venomous snake today.


Tell them fucks all the time, don’t try and catch the snakes.


Amateur snake hunter now in hospital.

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[R650R]

You'd never see a fine like this in a NZ court..... bit more expensive than fixing the brakes and retarder....

http://www.heavyliftnews.com/news/baldwins-hit-for--900-000?cu=58

[Waihou Thumper]

You'd never see a fine like this in a NZ court..... bit more expensive than fixing the brakes and retarder....

http://www.heavyliftnews.com/news/baldwins-hit-for--900-000?cu=58


Come April 6th next year. Going forward you might!

[R650R]

We don't know how lucky we are in NZ...

Crazy Chinese forgers.... although in NZ this would be called a 'managed risk'....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r41dcYUvNLk

[trustme]

We don't know how lucky we are in NZ...

Crazy Chinese forgers.... although in NZ this would be called a 'managed risk'....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r41dcYUvNLk

Bugger Me. hope they were wearing sun screen, at least SPF30

[Katman]

Old skool skills.

[Dadpole]

If it wasn't for people like that we wouldn't have Pyramids.

[Voltaire]

Very orange looking, are they making Donald Trump masks?

[Swoop]

Are they absolutely insane?????????????


Not a hi-viz faggotry vest or orange cone ANYWHERE!
Total madness.

[bogan]

Are they absolutely insane?????????????


Not a hi-viz faggotry vest or orange cone ANYWHERE!
Total madness.

But the hazard itself was a glowing orange, is this not the logical extension of the current system, once all things are high viz, none of them are; so the dangerous thing must become more high vis... conversely, the not dangerous things should become less high vis. So really, it's more crazy like a fox, than insane.

[R650R]

Bugger being a train driver... gets interesting at 2min mark, cameras on both trains...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhraoVIJ1OE