What can I say?

[rastuscat]

http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/369241/riding-live-two-wheels-and-50cc

[ellipsis]

You could scream it from the rooftops Pete, only those who want to hear will listen. Don't forget they are all bulletproof and after all, they are only riding scooters. What could go wrong?.

[AllanB]

. .

[Moi]

Nice to see some positive publicity about riding...

[F5 Dave]

I'd say you could break you neck in a minor tumble with your helmet opened like that.

[scumdog]

Nice one Pete:niceone:

Yeah, Dunners is full of scarfies riding mopeds & scooters and haphazard manner, weaving all over the place,often going too fast for the circumstance due to lacking in grunt i.e. the rider doesn't want to lose the momentum they have spent 10 minutes building up.

And a heap of those scooters have an acre of duct-tape holding the platic bits together (or said bits are missing altogether) so they've been down once or twice, maybe they just fell over, othertimes grinding their way down the road.

But ya still see hawt sheilas riding them while wearing shorts, tank-top and jandals - and only wearing a helmet 'cos the law sez they have to.:facepalm:

[nerrrd]

Nice to see some positive publicity about riding...

Ditto, I've done two silvers and they've been great; funnily enough each time they suggested I should do another silver before going for gold :whistle:, so i might do a bronze soon for a change.

Kudos to all the trainers out there :niceone:.

Just got my rego in the mail, thanks ACC! Definitely doing one or more now.

[nzspokes]

I'd say you could break you neck in a minor tumble with your helmet opened like that.

Was thinking the same thing. :whistle:

[buggerit]

http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/369241/riding-live-two-wheels-and-50cc

Shawn McAvinue? , Brazilian by any chance?:D

[Gremlin]

I'd say you could break you neck in a minor tumble with your helmet opened like that.
Unfortunately I have the experience to say no. Highsided at 30-40kph with my flip open and no issue (well, for my neck, the helmet was obviously fucked).

[Big Dog]

. .

I have no issue with these types of images where the stand is down... and when the models are this hot...

Sent via tapatalk.

[EJK]

Good on you!

[RDJ]

http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/369241/riding-live-two-wheels-and-50cc

What do you say about lycra-clad cyclists? If we are interested in consistency.

Personally I'm a believer in ATGATT, but... when riding around the town I see cyclists moving just as fast as I am.

[F5 Dave]

Unfortunately I have the experience to say no. Highsided at 30-40kph with my flip open and no issue (well, for my neck, the helmet was obviously fucked).
You performed every accident scenario in this crash? That was very thorough of you.

[rastuscat]

What do you say about lycra-clad cyclists? If we are interested in consistency.

Personally I'm a believer in ATGATT, but... when riding around the town I see cyclists moving just as fast as I am.

I cant even rationalise that myself.

I always wear ATGATT on my moped and motorbikes, but when I'm road cycling I'm happy to go downhill at 70 kmh in lycra.

Can't even figure that one myself.

[rastuscat]

I'd say you could break you neck in a minor tumble with your helmet opened like that.

Hearing ya.

For the record, that photo was taken in the St Johns carpark, blazing along at 5 - 8 kmh. It was staged, so the photographer could head of for his morning coffee.

[nzspokes]

I cant even rationalise that myself.

I always wear ATGATT on my moped and motorbikes, but when I'm road cycling I'm happy to go downhill at 70 kmh in lycra.

Can't even figure that one myself.

I think riding up hill on a hot day at 15kph answers the question.

[rastuscat]

I think riding up hill on a hot day at 15kph answers the question.

One day I hope to be able to maintain 15 kmh on a 12 percent hill.

Sigh.

[rastuscat]

. .

Neither of those had keys for the bikes, so happy to see them

[PistonBlown]

When I got my first motorbike at 17 the local cop shop was offering a training course. All you had to do was turn up on a Sunday morning for 2 hours over 8 weeks - there was the practical test at the end and hopefully you'd have your full license. The big attraction for us was getting a full license sorted quickly but of course the cops motivation was that us arrogant idiots would actually be taught how to be better/safer riders.

After a number of polite reminders about gear, one Sunday morning we were shown a slideshow of photos from the local A&E of what happens when you don't wear it...by the second slide the jokes had stopped and the room was silent. The following Sunday everyone was kitted out.

[rambaldi]

I cant even rationalise that myself.

I always wear ATGATT on my moped and motorbikes, but when I'm road cycling I'm happy to go downhill at 70 kmh in lycra.

Can't even figure that one myself.

And do you even fight vehemently against all those that suggest you have to wear a helmet while cycling? Saying That they just discourage people from cycling so you shouldn't wear em? I guess if you are going to die from the de-gloving whether your noggin survives or not is immaterial.

[AllanB]

I'm on record over the years on KB that if you are not wearing reasonable protective gear then I resent you having access to ACC funds I have contributed to. But the freedom brigade will appear stating I am proposing to remove their right to wear what they like (aside from a helmet), bla bla bla.

And those fuckers who get so pissed they end up at A&E should have to pay a big charge for their stupidly.


Back to the gear, would it not be a great incentive to gear up on your bike if the Govt subsidized the purchase of such gear? They are very happy to load up our Rego fees, how about putting some of that money into something that could prevent serious injury?

[RDJ]

Allan - your proposition is IMO too commonsensical to be adopted by either career ACC troughing-bureaucrats or transient elected politico-thieves. Call me cynical... I am.

[rastuscat]

And do you even fight vehemently against all those that suggest you have to wear a helmet while cycling? Saying That they just discourage people from cycling so you shouldn't wear em? I guess if you are going to die from the de-gloving whether your noggin survives or not is immaterial.

I've actually campaigned against cycle helmets. That didn't go so well when I wore a blue suit.

[Oakie]

One day I hope to be able to maintain 15 kmh on a 12 percent hill.

Sigh.

Mrs Oakie got passed on her 250 by a cyclist coming down Dyers Pass Road once.

[rambaldi]

I've actually campaigned against cycle helmets. That didn't go so well when I wore a blue suit.

What were your reasons for that stance? I can understand that most falls on a push bike are going to be reasonably low speed etc. but it is still your head and what not.

[Gremlin]

Mrs Oakie got passed on her 250 by a cyclist coming down Dyers Pass Road once.
Make no mistake, the good cyclists can show an excellent turn of speed, including a higher cornering speed.

[eldog]

Back to the gear, would it not be a great incentive to gear up on your bike if the Govt subsidized the purchase of such gear? They are very happy to load up our Rego fees, how about putting some of that money into something that could prevent serious injury?

Maybe GST free? Careful of shops hiking up the price to take over the GST.
Some sort of 'bonus' if you have an accident and are wearing some gear. Most of that though will be the lower amount of damage sustained.

Some sort of register on gear and accidents, how it protects/survives maybe available to bikers to show accidents with/without gear.

Would agree most people who would turn up at a training event would get gear if they saw what can happen..... Everyone else who didn't or couldn't, wouldn't care anyway.

[eldog]

Make no mistake, the good cyclists can show an excellent turn of speed, including a higher cornering speed.

Saw what happened to 2 friends on cycles
1 broken thigh SMIDSY low speed, affects him all his life
1 grazed hands, cut to head/shoulder, legs etc, He was going at least the speed limit when a car pulled out in front of him. Over he went onto the bonnet and then road, very lucky.

[AllanB]

Shit man even the incentive to book and pay for a training session and when you turn up you are given a voucher to redeem a free .... set of gloves, boots, or something. Government could easily arrange a bulk purchase/rebate scheme with a major importer and if you had to go to your local bike shop to redeem and order the gear it may have spin-off benefits for the shop by nature of additional gear purchases or parts/consumables by the punter.

[rastuscat]

What were your reasons for that stance? I can understand that most falls on a push bike are going to be reasonably low speed etc. but it is still your head and what not.

Now you're for it.

When cycling helmets became compulsory head injuries decreased. The zealots were thrilled, the neurosurgeons equally so.

What nobody really noticed was that the introduction of helmets also saw a significant down turn in the number of people cycling. Some as a result of not wanting to wear helmets.

Wind the clock forward to 2016 and ponder why the obesity rate has increased significantly. As the population gets into their cars for journeys less than 3 km which used to be taken by bicycle.

And look at the number of parents who drive their kids to school, instead of cycling. They will tell you that it's far too dangerous for their kids to cycle. A view partly caused by the legislation of helmets, which imply that it must be unsafe.

So now, cycling is a risk which many will not take, or allow their kids to take. When if they had managed the risk the kids would have developed a better understanding of the roads, making them safer, even in later life.

Now I'm on a roll.

I reckon compulsory helmets for sports cycling (anyone riding in excess of 25 kmh) and for under 18s. The idea of wearing a helmet when riding 400 metres to buy milk is a nonsense.

I await all the stats about most crashes being close to home etc, and all the comments about my silly views.

But I'm allowed those silly views as much as anyone is on here.

Personal responsibility. And I know ACC pays for head injuries I suffer when riding my bike but I sort of feel entitled when I'm paying ACC levies on two bikes, two cars and a trailer, which are parked in my drive when I'm out cycling.

All that said, the only time I've ridden with no helmet was uphill in the French Alps, before donning my helmet at the peak of the Galibier, Telegraphe, Alpe de HueZ etc.

It's a challenging life in the blue suit when you don't agree with the rules you are expected to enforce.

[JimO]

my 3 boys rode their bikes to intermediate school the bike racks were chockka, when they started highschool they stopped riding as it wasnt cool, the bike racks there were mainly empty

[rastuscat]

my 3 boys rode their bikes to intermediate school the bike racks were chockka, when they started highschool they stopped riding as it wasnt cool, the bike racks there were mainly empty

Helmets aren't cool. That's part of what drives people away.

As does laziness.

[RGVforme]

Now you're for it.

When cycling helmets became compulsory head injuries decreased. The zealots were thrilled, the neurosurgeons equally so.

What nobody really noticed was that the introduction of helmets also saw a significant down turn in the number of people cycling. Some as a result of not wanting to wear helmets.

Wind the clock forward to 2016 and ponder why the obesity rate has increased significantly. As the population gets into their cars for journeys less than 3 km which used to be taken by bicycle.

And look at the number of parents who drive their kids to school, instead of cycling. They will tell you that it's far too dangerous for their kids to cycle. A view partly caused by the legislation of helmets, which imply that it must be unsafe.

So now, cycling is a risk which many will not take, or allow their kids to take. When if they had managed the risk the kids would have developed a better understanding of the roads, making them safer, even in later life.

Now I'm on a roll.

I reckon compulsory helmets for sports cycling (anyone riding in excess of 25 kmh) and for under 18s. The idea of wearing a helmet when riding 400 metres to buy milk is a nonsense.

I await all the stats about most crashes being close to home etc, and all the comments about my silly views.

But I'm allowed those silly views as much as anyone is on here.

Personal responsibility. And I know ACC pays for head injuries I suffer when riding my bike but I sort of feel entitled when I'm paying ACC levies on two bikes, two cars and a trailer, which are parked in my drive when I'm out cycling.

All that said, the only time I've ridden with no helmet was uphill in the French Alps, before donning my helmet at the peak of the Galibier, Telegraphe, Alpe de HueZ etc.

It's a challenging life in the blue suit when you don't agree with the rules you are expected to enforce.

Cheers for that little hint at the end about your past profession.Would not have guessed that at all lol.:spanking:

[oneofsix]

I cant even rationalise that myself.

I always wear ATGATT on my moped and motorbikes, but when I'm road cycling I'm happy to go downhill at 70 kmh in lycra.

Can't even figure that one myself.

Force verses velocity. The pushie only adds grams to your weight and therefore adds little impact force, a motorcycle adds a couple of hundred of kilograms. A push bike is a fraction of my weight whereas my motorcycle is over twice. Falling off your pushie at 70k is a bit like falling off the rope swing or flying fox but try that with a couple of hundred kilos propelling you on.

[caspernz]

Helmets aren't cool. That's part of what drives people away.

As does laziness.

The reduced number of cyclists on the road makes those who do ride more vulnerable, becomes a catch 22.

Back home in Holland I'd ride my pushie here there and everywhere, feels more like Russian roulette over here :mad:

[WristTwister]

In Wellington there are 3 types of scooter riders.
:scooter:

The first lot ride scooters because they are cheap to run, they don't have the cash to spend on gear or don't want the inconvenience - they just use the scooter to get to class or visit friends around town anyway.
The second are hipsters, riding a scooter is like a statement, they have the little pastel coloured Italian piazza with coffee cup holders, wearing gear isn't cool and the helmet has to be open faced so their beards can be free.
The third are the risk takers, they get a scooter because it gives them mobility on a learners licence, they don't maintain their scooters or wear gear, they weave through traffic because they can, they wear shorts and singlets because "YOLO", and their scooters sound like they're stuck in first gear.



There is a rumour that there is a fourth group, who ride maxis and wear all the gear and hi-vis vests.

[Big Dog]

The reduced number of cyclists on the road makes those who do ride more vulnerable, becomes a catch 22.

Back home in Holland I'd ride my pushie here there and everywhere, feels more like Russian roulette over here :mad:
Multiply that by the negative views road users tend to carry about minorities...
You'd be surprised how many people have told me that that have tried to knock a rider of before. Or that all cyclists should die.



Sent via tapatalk.

[rastuscat]

Cheers for that little hint at the end about your past profession.Would not have guessed that at all lol.:spanking:

Got me. I was Chief Chocolate-Fish Filleter at the MoTaRD

(Ministry of Time and Regal Dysfunctionality)

[nzspokes]

Now you're for it.

When cycling helmets became compulsory head injuries decreased. The zealots were thrilled, the neurosurgeons equally so.

What nobody really noticed was that the introduction of helmets also saw a significant down turn in the number of people cycling. Some as a result of not wanting to wear helmets.

Wind the clock forward to 2016 and ponder why the obesity rate has increased significantly. As the population gets into their cars for journeys less than 3 km which used to be taken by bicycle.

And look at the number of parents who drive their kids to school, instead of cycling. They will tell you that it's far too dangerous for their kids to cycle. A view partly caused by the legislation of helmets, which imply that it must be unsafe.

So now, cycling is a risk which many will not take, or allow their kids to take. When if they had managed the risk the kids would have developed a better understanding of the roads, making them safer, even in later life.

Now I'm on a roll.

I reckon compulsory helmets for sports cycling (anyone riding in excess of 25 kmh) and for under 18s. The idea of wearing a helmet when riding 400 metres to buy milk is a nonsense.

I await all the stats about most crashes being close to home etc, and all the comments about my silly views.

But I'm allowed those silly views as much as anyone is on here.

Personal responsibility. And I know ACC pays for head injuries I suffer when riding my bike but I sort of feel entitled when I'm paying ACC levies on two bikes, two cars and a trailer, which are parked in my drive when I'm out cycling.

All that said, the only time I've ridden with no helmet was uphill in the French Alps, before donning my helmet at the peak of the Galibier, Telegraphe, Alpe de HueZ etc.

It's a challenging life in the blue suit when you don't agree with the rules you are expected to enforce.

Nice argument. But you couldnt be more wrong. Helmets are not the reason for your stats showing there are less bicycle riders.

Your stats are wrong is the problem.

[lokhor]

One of the problems is that moped riders don't need to do any particular riding courses, they can ride them on a learner car license. It's a bit naff that we end up paying additional registration costs/ACC levies because of moped riders.

[Berries]

Helmets are not the reason for your stats showing there are less bicycle riders.
They are the one and only reason I have never ridden a pushbike in NZ yet frequently commuted on one overseas. They are why I do not own a push bike and why my seven and eight year olds have no on-road riding skills and therefore won't be going to school on their bikes.

[nzspokes]

They are the one and only reason I have never ridden a pushbike in NZ yet frequently commuted on one overseas. They are why I do not own a push bike and why my seven and eight year olds have no on-road riding skills and therefore won't be going to school on their bikes.

No thats because you dont want to ride, not because you would have to wear a helmet.

A helmet is an excuse, not the reason.

[Berries]

Sorry, but you are wrong in this case. I am well aware that cycling would improve my fitness after giving up smoking a couple of years ago, shit, I even took up swimming again, but I am not wearing a poxy helmet when I managed the first 20 years of my life safely without one. Not sure what the stats are and don't particularly care, but that is the result of the 100% survey of me, myself and I.

[willytheekid]

I think all road users should start on a moped or motorcycle before being able to obtain a car license :laugh:...might open a few eyes in-regards to over confidence matched with poor skill sets that result in dangerous driving & fatalities.(BIG difference between panel damage and crippling yourself!)

PS...whats your view on peddlys and mirrors Ras?...seeing as EVERY other form of road going vehicle is legally required to have them, and EVERY driver training course etc HAMMERS the use of mirrors to ensure safety...yet cyclists?? (Riding around Half fuckin blind!, or twisting in there seat to "glance behind them"...while drifting into traffic in the process...and the stats PROVE this blind spot is killing them!...over 70% of fatalities = hit from behind!!...go figure eh<_<)

[Ocean1]

Nice argument. But you couldnt be more wrong. Helmets are not the reason for your stats showing there are less bicycle riders.

Your stats are wrong is the problem.


Sorry, but you are wrong in this case. I am well aware that cycling would improve my fitness after giving up smoking a couple of years ago, shit, I even took up swimming again, but I am not wearing a poxy helmet when I managed the first 20 years of my life safely without one. Not sure what the stats are and don't particularly care, but that is the result of the 100% survey of me, myself and I.

Same. Also, the drop in head injuries post-helmet legislation was less than the drop in the cyclist population it caused. Think about that for a minute.

At the time it was introduced there was plenty of off-shore evidence that also indicated that helmets made less difference than the statistical margin of error.

Just another case of Auntie knowing best, and being completely wrong.

[nzspokes]

Sorry, but you are wrong in this case. I am well aware that cycling would improve my fitness after giving up smoking a couple of years ago, shit, I even took up swimming again, but I am not wearing a poxy helmet when I managed the first 20 years of my life safely without one. Not sure what the stats are and don't particularly care, but that is the result of the 100% survey of me, myself and I.

Do you wear one when riding a motorcycle?

Do your children wear them if not riding on the road?

[nzspokes]

Same. Also, the drop in head injuries post-helmet legislation was less than the drop in the cyclist population it caused. Think about that for a minute.

At the time it was introduced there was plenty of off-shore evidence that also indicated that helmets made less difference than the statistical margin of error.

Just another case of Auntie knowing best, and being completely wrong.

There are more bicycles being sold new than ever before by a large margin. Along with that there is many times more helmets being sold.

To back that up, there are many more units going through workshops than ever before. To the point its hard to get mechanics currently.

[chasio]

No thats because you dont want to ride, not because you would have to wear a helmet.

A helmet is an excuse, not the reason.

First off: I always wear a bike helmet on the pushy - partly because if I ride, I try to keep my speed up. I also did this in the UK years ago, where helmets are optional.

But I actually don't think what I am doing makes sense and here's why: unlike say seatbelts or airbags in cars and motorbike helmets, bike helmets are not statistically proven to work, to the best of my knowledge (Example (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1410838/)). I'd be happy if you could point me at research that proves that they are beneficial.

So we are in the realms of opinion with regard to their efficacy. At least one neurosurgeon thinks they are too flimsy to have a material benefit. (This guy here. (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10866273/Cycle-helmets-are-useless-says-brain-surgeon.html)). And in Canada (http://www.bmj.com/content/346/bmj.f3817) there is no evidence compulsory helmets had a material effect on head injuries.

However there is research that shows:

1) The more cyclists are on the road, the safer all cyclists become through habituation (an argument that we sometimes employ as motorcyclists). (PDF (http://www.ctc.org.uk/sites/default/files/ctc_safety_in_numbers_0.pdf))
2) There are health benefits in cycling as a cardiovascular exercise and it also helps with weight control. These reduce a multitude of other risk factors and dissuading people from cycling reduces those benefits. (Example (http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/fitness/Pages/Cycling.aspx))
3) People are dissuaded (http://ipa.org.au/publications/2019/australia's-helmet-law-disaster) from cycling by mandatory helmets, which does not help either point 1 or 2.
4) Motorists tend to pass cyclists wearing helmets more closely (http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/strange-but-true-helmets-attract-cars-to-cyclists/) than those not wearing them (perceived risk is lower, perhaps), thus increasing the risk of impact by a passing vehicle.

Getting hit from behind is not a good scenario for broken bones and organ damage which of course can be severe. Neither is it good for the head, injuries to which may be even more devastating. But if helmets are actually too flimsy to help, why make them compulsory? You could really put people off cycling by making motorbike helmets the requirement. At least there is statistical evidence that they help. Multiple compound fractures, blood loss and organ damage may well kill me instead.

My personal experience cycling in Auckland is that in the end the Russian Roulette aspect got me off the treadly. I started out believing that it was unlikely that I'd get hit and ended up believing it was only a matter of time, due to the frequency with which I found myself a gnat's whisker from being hit from behind. I was also once cycling uphill when I was punched in the kidneys by a passing hoon, I also had beer bottles thrown at me on many occasions and was "shaved" with the horn blaring "for a laugh" very frequently. I hasten to add that I was always in "good" suburbs, cycling alone and keeping left (not being a bloody-minded obstacle). It wasn't helmet law that put me off, it was the mindless aggression.

I also rather believe that the more friends and family we have who we know ride bikes, the less aggressive we will be towards strangers on bikes. That's just an opinion, but to me it seems logical.

So I'd like the helmet law repealed and to see more people on bikes. I think that would be a good thing, for the reasons stated above.

Cheers - Chasio

[Berries]

Do you wear one when riding a motorcycle?
I do. I am likely to travel in excess of 100km/h every time I get on one and therefore my risk assessment is that if I come off it will be at a relatively high speed and I would like to protect my head, same reason I wear gloves on a motorbike.

On a push bike speeds are so much slower that my risk assessment comes to a different conclusion. A multitude of unpowered two wheeler crashes support my conclusion.


Do your children wear them if not riding on the road?
Depends if Mum is around or not, but I am talking about me not them.

[Big Dog]

There are more bicycles being sold new than ever before by a large margin. Along with that there is many times more helmets being sold.

To back that up, there are many more units going through workshops than ever before. To the point its hard to get mechanics currently.
A small stick in the spokes of that argument... bikes don't last as long as they used to, require more maintenance and the average rider is less competent at maintaining them.


Sent via tapatalk.

[Ocean1]

There are more bicycles being sold new than ever before by a large margin. Along with that there is many times more helmets being sold.

To back that up, there are many more units going through workshops than ever before. To the point its hard to get mechanics currently.

All of which says more about population growth and cycle/helmet quality than any supposed safety benefits of helmets.

Seriously, how much protection do you expect of a flimsy piece of unreinforced styrene perched on top of the head? As a safety device it probably saves about as much in head damage as it causes in choking damage.

They're a piece of cost neutral PC bullshit, like most officially mandated "safety" measures.

Edit: And if 'Er majesty's finest were serious about motorcycle safety there would be a fucking sight fewer posts and barriers scattered around the side of our roads.

[scumdog]

Multiply that by the negative views road users tend to carry about minorities...
You'd be surprised how many people have told me that that have tried to knock a rider of before. Or that all cyclists should die.



Sent via tapatalk.

Shee-it but you must know some right retards!:facepalm:

[Big Dog]

What can I say. I work in Auckland.


Some otherwise super intelligent people driven to madness by other Aucklanders seek a common enemy in any perceived minority.

Sent via tapatalk.

[Big Dog]

If I was in charge "for a day" I would decentralise business so we are not all heading into the same 16km radius at the same time on the same days.
Giving the people back hours of their lives and families back parents who spend the equivalent of a work day each week or more sitting in traffic.

Sent via tapatalk.

[Big Dog]

Shee-it but you must know some right retards!:facepalm:
Always fun to see the colour drain from their faces when I tell them I ride a push when I can.

Sent via tapatalk.

[nzspokes]

A small stick in the spokes of that argument... bikes don't last as long as they used to, require more maintenance and the average rider is less competent at maintaining them.


Sent via tapatalk.

No thats very wrong. Bicycles are made to much higher standards today. And people were rubbish at looking after them in the old days as well.

[nzspokes]

First off: I always wear a bike helmet on the pushy - partly because if I ride, I try to keep my speed up. I also did this in the UK years ago, where helmets are optional.

But I actually don't think what I am doing makes sense and here's why: unlike say seatbelts or airbags in cars and motorbike helmets, bike helmets are not statistically proven to work, to the best of my knowledge (Example (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1410838/)). I'd be happy if you could point me at research that proves that they are beneficial.

So we are in the realms of opinion with regard to their efficacy. At least one neurosurgeon thinks they are too flimsy to have a material benefit. (This guy here. (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/10866273/Cycle-helmets-are-useless-says-brain-surgeon.html)). And in Canada (http://www.bmj.com/content/346/bmj.f3817) there is no evidence compulsory helmets had a material effect on head injuries.

However there is research that shows:

1) The more cyclists are on the road, the safer all cyclists become through habituation (an argument that we sometimes employ as motorcyclists). (PDF (http://www.ctc.org.uk/sites/default/files/ctc_safety_in_numbers_0.pdf))
2) There are health benefits in cycling as a cardiovascular exercise and it also helps with weight control. These reduce a multitude of other risk factors and dissuading people from cycling reduces those benefits. (Example (http://www.nhs.uk/Livewell/fitness/Pages/Cycling.aspx))
3) People are dissuaded (http://ipa.org.au/publications/2019/australia's-helmet-law-disaster) from cycling by mandatory helmets, which does not help either point 1 or 2.
4) Motorists tend to pass cyclists wearing helmets more closely (http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/strange-but-true-helmets-attract-cars-to-cyclists/) than those not wearing them (perceived risk is lower, perhaps), thus increasing the risk of impact by a passing vehicle.

Getting hit from behind is not a good scenario for broken bones and organ damage which of course can be severe. Neither is it good for the head, injuries to which may be even more devastating. But if helmets are actually too flimsy to help, why make them compulsory? You could really put people off cycling by making motorbike helmets the requirement. At least there is statistical evidence that they help. Multiple compound fractures, blood loss and organ damage may well kill me instead.

My personal experience cycling in Auckland is that in the end the Russian Roulette aspect got me off the treadly. I started out believing that it was unlikely that I'd get hit and ended up believing it was only a matter of time, due to the frequency with which I found myself a gnat's whisker from being hit from behind. I was also once cycling uphill when I was punched in the kidneys by a passing hoon, I also had beer bottles thrown at me on many occasions and was "shaved" with the horn blaring "for a laugh" very frequently. I hasten to add that I was always in "good" suburbs, cycling alone and keeping left (not being a bloody-minded obstacle). It wasn't helmet law that put me off, it was the mindless aggression.

I also rather believe that the more friends and family we have who we know ride bikes, the less aggressive we will be towards strangers on bikes. That's just an opinion, but to me it seems logical.

So I'd like the helmet law repealed and to see more people on bikes. I think that would be a good thing, for the reasons stated above.

Cheers - Chasio

I dont and have never thought they would do a lot. Im not a advocate of them.

I just dont believe more people will ride em if the law changes. Its an excuse for being lazy.

[Berries]

No thats very wrong. Bicycles are made to much higher standards today.
See I would disagree with you there as well but we are off topic.

Back to the ODT report, I thought the tip about using bus lanes was invaluable.

[nzspokes]

See I would disagree with you there as well but we are off topic.

Back to the ODT report, I thought the tip about using bus lanes was invaluable.

34 years working in the bicycle trade as first a mechanic and now tech adviser says different.

[Berries]

34 years working in the bicycle trade as first a mechanic and now tech adviser says different.
Figured you were in the trade. I look at the quality of the cheap componentry on my kids bikes and realise they are not built to last. From dodgy QR fittings to cheap and nasty brakes and a seat that tears when you look at it - nothing like what I grew up with. I was one of many unpaid test riders for Raleigh in the late 70's and when I look at the crap they now produce off shore it looks cheap because it is cheap.

[nzspokes]

Figured you were in the trade. I look at the quality of the cheap componentry on my kids bikes and realise they are not built to last. From dodgy QR fittings to cheap and nasty brakes and a seat that tears when you look at it - nothing like what I grew up with. I was one of many unpaid test riders for Raleigh in the late 70's and when I look at the crap they now produce off shore it looks cheap because it is cheap.

Stop buying cheap bikes then. Amazes me how many people buy a $299 bike and expect it to be as good as a $2000 bike.

When I first started in the trade you would take a Raleigh or what ever out of the bike and it would take over an hour to put together as you would have to straighten the frame etc so it could function. Healings were shockers as you would have to bend the handlebars straight from new. Now days you can knock 3 out an hour and the frames etc are exactly straight.

[RDJ]

Dredging my memories now, but yes, Healings were shockers. But affordable in thoze daze - for schoolboys well unto student daze.

[OddDuck]

Just my (late) 2 cents...

Scooter riders get around in pretty much no safety gear because they are fucking clueless. Like an earlier poster said, once you see the A&E pics, it ain't a big choice any more. But if you don't know, it's just hot, sweaty, inconvenient crap that costs a fortune... so why bother.

Cycling: I've had the horns fired for a joke, haven't had anything thrown at me in a while, but getting shot with a BB gun (fuckers) wasn't high on my list of ways to have a good time. A lot of Kiwis treat cyclists like open season targets.

As to why people aren't on them any more... a stack of reasons. Cars got cheaper, tyres got cheaper. People got a lot more risk averse. Once you've been abused at random from some cowardly dickhead in a passing car, the fun kind of goes out of it. And drivers have got a lot of distractions in the car... we didn't have texting drivers when I was growing up. Just didn't happen. Distances got longer, too. More people driving means less local shops. More cars parked on the road verges means less room for pushbikes.

Bike makers haven't helped. Practical, real world bikes have mudguards, carriers, baskets even, relatively upright riding positions, and geartrains that don't need cleaning every ten rides. Don't see many pushbikes like that these days.

It's been a while since the helmet lady quit doing the rounds. I'm seeing a lot more people on bikes without a helmet. Without getting into the arguments - I heard that speech, so did all the hard boys at my high school, and the day afterwards we all had lids.

[nzspokes]

Bike makers haven't helped. Practical, real world bikes have mudguards, carriers, baskets even, relatively upright riding positions, and geartrains that don't need cleaning every ten rides. Don't see many pushbikes like that these days.



Try going to your local bike shop, these styles are getting more common. Reason these were stopped being sold was they ended up in the 90s not selling. Couldnt give a bike away with mudguards because everybody wanted to be a Triathlete or MTB rider.

Now things are swinging back to being more practical.

[JimO]

Giving the people back hours of their lives and families back parents who spend the equivalent of a work day each week or more sitting in traffic.

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not here they dont

[russd7]

Personal responsibility. And I know ACC pays for head injuries I suffer when riding my bike but I sort of feel entitled when I'm paying ACC levies on two bikes, two cars and a trailer, which are parked in my drive when I'm out cycling.

yeah but coming from your past life you should know that trailers don't incur ACC levies :msn-wink:

as fer cycling, when i were a young fella always gettin told off by the local MOT for riding the footpaths delivering news papers and the having motorcycles cruise past as i was peddling (read struggling) uphill on my old single speed treadly, well i couldn't wait to get me a motorised cycle.

makes me laff these days, mums help their kids get jobs delivering papers and flyers then drive them round in the car to deliver them, but hey at least they are learning that they have to do the hard yards first.

as to another comment made about kids learnin road rules, well i taught all our kids to drive, living in rural areas the kids had f all oppertunity to ride treadlies, but my eldest stepdaughter was a shocker to start with, could cruise open road speed no worries, identify hazards, react to them etc but when i took her to town to drive around she put the shits right up me and didn't seem to understand that give way meant slow right down and stop meant stop, she very nearly T boned a friend by not slowing down for a give way enough. after that i just said treat every intersection as a compulsary stop.
took a bit to work out but i realised that the reason she seemed to be so unaware for driving in town was because she hadn't spent time on a treadly as a kid in town.

[rastuscat]

This wandered off topic.

What was the topic?

[rastuscat]

For the record I revere decent classic bikes but what you can buy now for 2k is better than what you could buy for 2k 20 years ago.

My fave is still my 853 Reynolds custom build l.

I'm 12 kg overweight. Feck all point in a lightweight Carbon treddly when you're a fat Bastard.

Helmets provide lazy bastards with another excuse for not cycling.

Back on track, the Ride Forever courses like the one in the OP never fail to deliver. Value for money for sure, given the big ACC subsidy.

The worst that can happen is a good day out on the bike with other riders and you just might learn something.

[JimO]

This wandered off topic.

What was the topic?
harley riders waving?

[awayatc]

No thats because you dont want to ride, not because you would have to wear a helmet.

A helmet is an excuse, not the reason.

How the fuck you know....?

I am Dutch and basically born on a pushbike....

the day helmets became compulsory I ditched my pushbike.

ridiculous law.

[steveworth62]

. .
Road rash there would be a bitch

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[Big Dog]

No thats very wrong. Bicycles are made to much higher standards today. And people were rubbish at looking after them in the old days as well.
Perhaps they are made to a higher standard. That still don't last as well.
I have to buy parts more often.
In my youth the only reason anyone ever upgraded their frame was the last one was stolen.
when i bought my current one finding a bike that does not noticeably deform when I rode it was a major challenge.
Finding one rated to my ideal weight limited me to about 3-4 options. Rated to my actual weight limited me to 2 in the sub 2k range. Even then i had to exchange forks because nothing I found sub 2k cane with forks rated to higher than 90% my ideal weight.

Since then without any off road riding I have had to have pedals, crank set, chain and a few bearings replaced.

Similar level of investment 20 years ago got me a bike rated to my current weight without parts exchange... I blew 2 crank sets off road. Did significantly higher milage with no more maintenance than a bit of 3n1 on the chain at the beginning of each season and adjustment to the rear gears every 1000kms or so.

Brakes and tyres are significantly better but bikes have become far more consumable.

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[Big Dog]

Stop buying cheap bikes then. Amazes me how many people buy a $299 bike and expect it to be as good as a $2000 bike.

When I first started in the trade you would take a Raleigh or what ever out of the bike and it would take over an hour to put together as you would have to straighten the frame etc so it could function. Healings were shockers as you would have to bend the handlebars straight from new. Now days you can knock 3 out an hour and the frames etc are exactly straight.
There is a difference between precise and longer lasting.
Lighter seems to be the order of the day.
If you don't want to spend mega bucks on exotic metals lighter comes at the cost of durability.

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[Big Dog]

not here they dont
I'm guessing you are decentralised from the 16km radius of akl then.

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[nzspokes]

Perhaps they are made to a higher standard. That still don't last as well.
I have to buy parts more often.
In my youth the only reason anyone ever upgraded their frame was the last one was stolen.
when i bought my current one finding a bike that does not noticeably deform when I rode it was a major challenge.
Finding one rated to my ideal weight limited me to about 3-4 options. Rated to my actual weight limited me to 2 in the sub 2k range. Even then i had to exchange forks because nothing I found sub 2k cane with forks rated to higher than 90% my ideal weight.

Since then without any off road riding I have had to have pedals, crank set, chain and a few bearings replaced.

Similar level of investment 20 years ago got me a bike rated to my current weight without parts exchange... I blew 2 crank sets off road. Did significantly higher milage with no more maintenance than a bit of 3n1 on the chain at the beginning of each season and adjustment to the rear gears every 1000kms or so.

Brakes and tyres are significantly better but bikes have become far more consumable.

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There is your problem.

A good bicycle has always worked out to be a bit over a months pay, you are cheaping out.

Only riders that have "blown" cranks out are DH racers and freeriders. You need to look at your riding style.

Tyres were made of rubber in the old days and still are, stop doing epic skids. Brakes are far better than they have ever been.

[Big Dog]

2 weeks after tax wages should be adequate for a light use bike.
If its not that might be why there are less people on the road...

Even the person who sold me the bike I bought told me 2 weeks for a commuter with some light of road. 3 weeks for an of roader. 4+ for competition.
Which made me laugh. Because that was the formula I used to tell people when I worked at the bicycle shop in 90-91.
1600 + upgrades while the bike is already 50% off clearance stock is not cheap. Different paint job was over 3k.

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[rambaldi]

Now you're for it.

When cycling helmets became compulsory head injuries decreased. The zealots were thrilled, the neurosurgeons equally so.

What nobody really noticed was that the introduction of helmets also saw a significant down turn in the number of people cycling. Some as a result of not wanting to wear helmets.

Wind the clock forward to 2016 and ponder why the obesity rate has increased significantly. As the population gets into their cars for journeys less than 3 km which used to be taken by bicycle.

And look at the number of parents who drive their kids to school, instead of cycling. They will tell you that it's far too dangerous for their kids to cycle. A view partly caused by the legislation of helmets, which imply that it must be unsafe.

So now, cycling is a risk which many will not take, or allow their kids to take. When if they had managed the risk the kids would have developed a better understanding of the roads, making them safer, even in later life.

Now I'm on a roll.

I reckon compulsory helmets for sports cycling (anyone riding in excess of 25 kmh) and for under 18s. The idea of wearing a helmet when riding 400 metres to buy milk is a nonsense.

I await all the stats about most crashes being close to home etc, and all the comments about my silly views.

But I'm allowed those silly views as much as anyone is on here.

Personal responsibility. And I know ACC pays for head injuries I suffer when riding my bike but I sort of feel entitled when I'm paying ACC levies on two bikes, two cars and a trailer, which are parked in my drive when I'm out cycling.

All that said, the only time I've ridden with no helmet was uphill in the French Alps, before donning my helmet at the peak of the Galibier, Telegraphe, Alpe de HueZ etc.

It's a challenging life in the blue suit when you don't agree with the rules you are expected to enforce.

There are some good points in there, and some not so good.

Overall our transport choices have changed. Walking the kids to school took a major plummet, it wasn't just them riding. And that is all to do with more people having 2 cars, more families with both parents working and people being more wary of strangers, wanting to always keep an eye on the kids. If it was just the helmet issue then walking wouldn't have suffered as well. It might be part of the problem but isn't all of it. Walking to the shops etc. just doesn't happen as things have moved further away, the dairies have all been replaced with supermarkets (and carrying a slab of beer is always hard on a pushie :p)

I read a summary of a recent study showing 50% of traffic deaths in some or other state in the US was down to Motorcycle riders without helmets. Comparing that to something below 10% for those with helmets ending up kaput. This was all as part of a comparison to how things were when helmet were compulsory a couple years prior. The speeds are very different of course but there is some validity showing that having a helmet is better than not. Now how good a cycle helmet from the wharehouse actualy is?? No idea there.

Someone else brought up the weight of the push bike in an accident vs. a motorcycle or car. Depending on the type of accident having more weight actually helps with safety. Take a light push bike vs. say a motorcycle. If the pushie combo is heavier then there is more energy in the collision but the energy will be distributed to the motorcyle more. If you crash into a wall or truck or something obviously then the difference in mass on the push bike side is going to be minimal but there is a reason why there aren't seat belts on most NZ buses (I believe parts of the US has them for schools etc. so they are out there) a bus is assumed to have so much mass that if it were in a crash it would just go through the obstacle rather than suddenly stopping, throwing everyone forward.

[pritch]

My bike suits me I guess. It didn't cost $2,000 but it wasn't far off. It's supposed to have an aluminium frame & forks but the bloody thing seems to weigh a ton. So much so that I went over it with a magnet - the magnet didn't stick so maybe they're telling the truth.

The MotoGP riders whiz around on their Pinarello Dogma series racers etc and good for them. I'd look bloody silly on one of those, besides which it might snap and stab me in the arse. The old steel frames look really elegant now, compared to the swoopy designs currently in vogue.

There is a percentage of the population refer to cyclists as "road lice". If such a lowly creature holds them up for even a few seconds they lose their cool. (Well, actually they probably never had much "cool" to start with.) Some of these prats post videos of their rant at a cyclist blissfully unaware the the cyclist is completely in the right. I've long felt there should be a psychometric component to driver testing because there are a lot of potential nutjobs out there with only a tenuous grasp on reality.

[RDJ]

I've long felt there should be a psychometric component to driver testing because there are a lot of potential nutjobs out there with only a tenuous grasp on reality.

Half the population is crazier than average :eek:

[Gremlin]

Half the population is crazier than average :eek:
And probably 3/4 of the population say they're sane (which puts at least some in the super crazy category) :eek:

[Big Dog]

And probably 3/4 of the population say they're sane (which puts at least some in the super crazy category) :eek:
I read somewhere that believing you are insane is confirmation you are not.
So I guess it follows the opposite is true.
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[J.A.W.]

And probably 3/4 of the population say they're sane (which puts at least some in the super crazy category) :eek:


Now now.. no need to get mean.. ( if you know what I mean)..


Having fairly recently returned to push-biking, the sense of vulnerability aspect is huge - compared to a motorcycle..

I am even wary enough to take to the footpath - when busy roundabouts appear a tad daunting..

[nzspokes]

2 weeks after tax wages should be adequate for a light use bike.
.

Cheap, light, strong. Pick 2. Buying cheap and expecting great will never work.

[varminter]

A few years ago to help out the wife (she was running a team of door to door surveyors) I helped out on one for Transport NZ as it was. Among the many questions was one about dislikes, by far and away the most hated were push bike riders with all the usual comments like 'they don't pay road tax, acc etc, I don't think anything has changed. Here in Rotorua the council have put in cycle friendly pathways, you should hear the complaints about that, I feel considerably safer on the motorbike and get more respect.

[J.A.W.]

I read somewhere that believing you are insane is confirmation you are not.
So I guess it follows the opposite is true.


Yeah the premise of "Catch 22"..

In my experience, I'd reckon its fair enough to put it like this..

The sane can act out madness at will, but the truly insane won't/can't maintain a sane act very long, if at all..

[Ocean1]

Cheap, light, strong. Pick 2. Buying cheap and expecting great will never work.

There is, at best a tenuous link between the price tag on any given product and it's cost to market.

Sure, you're not usually going to buy the best at the lowest price. But neither is paying the highest price ever any guarantee of high quality.

I suspect bikes are like most things; Between the poles of human factor constants like performance and longevity expectations on one hand and constantly improving materials and design and increased production numbers on the other there's room for some pretty good deals.

It's just a matter of identifying them. A task made all the more difficult by the reduction in general population technical literacy and increasing product sophistication. Which is no excuse to start simply believing the advertising spiel. You might as well consult an aromatherapist.

[Big Dog]

Cheap, light, strong. Pick 2. Buying cheap and expecting great will never work.
Light use as in only used for commuting.

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[Moi]

Half the population is crazier than average :eek:

I have a piece of paper, issued by a government department [remember them?] that reads: "This is to certify..."

I guess that means I'm allowed to be...

[RDJ]

if there is a man alone in a forest who says he is sane, and no woman can hear him say it, is he crazy?

[J.A.W.]

if there is a man alone in a forest who says he is sane, and no woman can hear him say it, is he crazy?

& here it is perhaps apropos to quote Dr Peter Venkmann.. "Are you - Alice - menstruating, right now?"..

[nzspokes]

Light use as in only used for commuting.

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So you consider commuting to be a low stress usage for a bicycle?

[nzspokes]

There is, at best a tenuous link between the price tag on any given product and it's cost to market.

Sure, you're not usually going to buy the best at the lowest price. But neither is paying the highest price ever any guarantee of high quality.

I suspect bikes are like most things; Between the poles of human factor constants like performance and longevity expectations on one hand and constantly improving materials and design and increased production numbers on the other there's room for some pretty good deals.

It's just a matter of identifying them. A task made all the more difficult by the reduction in general population technical literacy and increasing product sophistication. Which is no excuse to start simply believing the advertising spiel. You might as well consult an aromatherapist.

Yes i agree. There is a lot of snake oil salesmen out there talking things up. And also say in $10,000 plus bicycles its very much diminishing returns. You are getting a better product but by less margins as cost increases.

[Big Dog]

So you consider commuting to be a low stress usage for a bicycle?
Composted to some of the things I used to use bicycles for...

Limited or no of road.
Limited or no jumps.
Regular inspection / maintenance.
No curb going.
No stunting.
Yep, per kilometer that's pretty low stress.

My 80's 10 speeds coped with me putting them through their paces at a bmx track (not sanctioned racing just group of mates going up against each other for pace or the highest jump) . After riding 2-3 hours to get there and with enough confidence to ride it home with no more spares than a puncture repair kit and a folding multi tool.

If I was going to try that on modern bike I'd want a few spares.

I'd have greater confidence in the brakes and tyres. Less in just about everything else.

Neither bike died with that kind of abuse.
Both were stolen.

Other than a perforated tube with more holes than I had patches, neither ever left me stranded.

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[nzspokes]

Composted to some of the things I used to use bicycles for...

Limited or no of road.
Limited or no jumps.
Regular inspection / maintenance.
No curb going.
No stunting.
Yep, per kilometer that's pretty low stress.

My 80's 10 speeds coped with me putting them through their paces at a bmx track (not sanctioned racing just group of mates going up against each other for pace or the highest jump) . After riding 2-3 hours to get there and with enough confidence to ride it home with no more spares than a puncture repair kit and a folding multi tool.

If I was going to try that on modern bike I'd want a few spares.

I'd have greater confidence in the brakes and tyres. Less in just about everything else.

Neither bike died with that kind of abuse.
Both were stolen.

Other than a perforated tube with more holes than I had patches, neither ever left me stranded.

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Ah the old Ten Speed lovers. Go buy one and take it for a decent ride and see how much bikes have progressed.

Gawd they were crap but people loved them.

[Racing Dave]

I'm currently in Scotland (near Glasgow) and have been for the last two months, with one month left to go. It is winter (!) and with sunrise at 8:30am and sunset at 3:30pm, the 'safe' daylight hours are limited. I bought a push bike on arrival, and have used it almost exclusively for recreation but also for 'down to the shops'.

It was on special at an outdoors shop, and at the very bottom end of the price range, but given that it has been muddied on almost every ride (used on a mix of public roads, sealed dedicated cycle paths (and there's a plethora of those), and some light-duty proper off-road trails, it has stood up to the wear and tear without any problems.

Helmets here are not compulsory, and I take all of RC's arguments on board (as well as other opinions expressed above) and have chosen to (possibly) protect my £10 head with a £10 helmet. My choice.

Traffic is intense and fast-moving, and roads are narrow, compared to NZ. Cyclists are very few indeed (as are motorcyclists. On a daily basis I see none; on a weekly basis maybe just the one - I'm not kidding. This winter has been horrendously wet, although not especially cold) but despite that I feel pretty happy cycling, everywhere, even in really busy traffic, because it's the attitude of car and truck drivers that differs from their NZ counterparts. They signal their intentions, they wait to pass until there's room, and none have (yet!) opened a car door as I pass them when they're parked. Awareness and respect.

That said, I have had one bottle thrown at me, but it missed.

[Big Dog]

Sometimes I wish I had bought one and kitted it out with modern gear instead... or the canondale special I was offered.

Yes I have recently ridden one.
Yes I still want one.
No, I can't afford another project just now.

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[Big Dog]

If I had the money, I'd go back to no suspension, wider and higher bars, bigger front sprocket. Still couldn't use it as intended because I don't live close enough to work anymore.

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[pritch]

If I had the money, I'd go back to no suspension,


My bike has no suspension - I wanted to keep it simple.

When commuting I used to make sure the tyres were inflated to the max so as to get the maximum result for the effort expended. Now I normally run the tyres 10psi down on the max as the ride is less harsh. These days it seems comfort takes precedence over speed or efficiency. I've got all day after all.

[Gremlin]

I've done road racing when at school, team time trialling etc. Had plenty of close shaves with cars passing too close etc.

Got back into riding a couple of years ago for fitness. Mountain bike only and no desire to ride on roads. However, it does tie nicely into adventure riding. Where motorcycles aren't allowed, bicycles are. NZ scenery rocks :2thumbsup

[Big Dog]

My bike has no suspension - I wanted to keep it simple.

When commuting I used to make sure the tyres were inflated to the max so as to get the maximum result for the effort expended. Now I normally run the tyres 10psi down on the max as the ride is less harsh. These days it seems comfort takes precedence over speed or efficiency. I've got all day after all.
Yeah, converted from "small block" 29" to 700c for better power and speed when I was commuting still but now that I only ride ocassionally and for the hell of it I run down 10 also.
when the kids get the concept of pedalling I will probably go back to the small blocks so we can ride some paddocks.


One thing I will give the suspension... my arms are not as tired after 16 kms as they were on the same bike with rigid forks, albeit at the cosy of more maintenance.

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[rastuscat]

Helmets here are not compulsory, and I take all of RC's arguments on board (as well as other opinions expressed above) and have chosen to (possibly) protect my £10 head with a £10 helmet. My choice..

Bless you.

I lived in Edinburgh for a couple of years a few years ago, and used my helmet when cycling for sport, but not when riding to work.

Made perfect sense to me, given the actual conditions I was cycling in.

That cycle shop down on The Meadows, Edinburgh Bicycle Co-Op, well worth a visit.

[scumdog]

Ah the old Ten Speed lovers. Go buy one and take it for a decent ride and see how much bikes have progressed.

Gawd they were crap but people loved them.


Did 35,000km on mine going to and from work, only ever got a couple of punctures.

After the second one I fitted 'No-more Flats' 'tubes', they obviously never punctured - but sure made for hard effort on the pedals!. :crazy:

[Big Dog]

Did 35,000km on mine going to and from work, only ever got a couple of punctures.

After the second one I fitted 'No-more Flats' 'tubes', they obviously never punctured - but sure made for hard effort on the pedals!. :crazy:
Good effort.
Most bikes these days don't get 1000 kms a year.

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[Racing Dave]

Good effort.
Most bikes these days don't get 1000 kms a year.

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Mine does - I commute four days a week from Prebbleton to the Airport, which is 14km each way; two hundred such trips per year at 28km per trip, plus recreational riding, 'down to the shops', etc gives me around 7000km annually.

As far as safety goes, with a 5am departure from home (no traffic!) and with either a wide (near 2m) cycle lane on the side of the road, or the separated-from-the-road Little River Rail Trail, damn near all of the way, the (perceived) risk from motorists is very low.

After 20 years of pedal-powered commuting, the number of unavoidable confrontations is very small. Most careless/thoughtless/unaware drivers can be avoided with ease.

[Berries]

Amazes me how many people buy a $299 bike and expect it to be as good as a $2000 bike.
You're taking the piss surely? $2,000 for a bike with peddles?

[Gremlin]

You're taking the piss surely? $2,000 for a bike with peddles?
Horses for courses. Why spend more on a motorbike when you can get a cheap chinese one (with corrosion almost from new) for less?

Any mountain bike around $500-$1000 isn't really going to last when you're mountain biking (as we've proved amongst mates). Suspension is budget and quickly needs maintenance, drivetrain wears out quickly, so on and so forth. My first hard-tail mountain bike a couple of years ago was $800 ish on special, then got lured into a $3k one, again on special (RRP $8k - but probably not a real RRP). Full suspension, carbon frame, suspension lockout and nice componentry that continues to shift nicely. Brakes perform well without squeaking etc.

You gets what ya paid for, and mountain biking is hard on the bikes. Through regular maintenance, we've found loose wheels, loose spokes etc.

I remember in school our coach was getting a custom built road bike for her, in excess of $10k...

[gsxr]

My Bergamont has served me well .Used and abused both of mine . Let the old one go earlier this year but my newer one is approaching 15000 km now and no issues

[nzspokes]

You're taking the piss surely? $2,000 for a bike with peddles?

Pedals.

I can do you one for $20,000 if you want. :eek:

[Duncan74]

My triathlon Time trial bike cost more than my wee-strom. Have never added up total cost of TT, full suss mtb, hardtail mtb, commuter, cyclocross, track and road bike. But fair to say when new none were under $2k.

However, if I can wobble back in a direction of topic, I also pay $400+ for helmets so that they are comfortable, well vented, light and likely to do some good.

I've come off twice in races, once hitting the helmet on the road. Based on the state of helmet after then at the least I'd have lost the same chunk of skin off my scalp as my elbow without the helmet. So I'm sold. Also been to visit mates in hospital that came off pedal cycles at gps recorded speeds of over 70kph and whilst the rest of their bodies were battered, they were wearing quality helmets and neither had head injuries.

[6ft5]

I don't give a rats arse about pushies, their costs or whatever else. I want a fair ACC scheme that stop pointing the finger at bikers, penalizes stupid behavior of all road users and puts it in place like today!:Punk::Punk::Punk::Punk::Punk:

[pritch]

I don't give a rats arse about pushies, their costs or whatever else. I want a fair ACC scheme that stop pointing the finger at bikers, penalizes stupid behavior of all road users and puts it in place like today!:Punk::Punk::Punk::Punk::Punk:

Well, why don't you start a thread about that then? :whistle:

[6ft5]

Well, why don't you start a thread about that then? :whistle:

Wasn't the original post about stupid behavior?

[Madness]

Wasn't the original post about stupid behavior?

No, it was an infomercial.

[RDJ]

I don't give a rats arse about pushies, their costs or whatever else. I want a fair ACC scheme that stop pointing the finger at bikers, penalizes stupid behavior of all road users and puts it in place like today!:Punk::Punk::Punk::Punk::Punk:

Yep. Also world peace, no calories in beer, free bacon, legal lane-splitting everywhere and if not then separate motorcycle lanes!

[ellipsis]

...free bacon sounds good...would that be halal or traditionally cured stuff...

[rastuscat]

No, it was an infomercial.

Bollocks.

I wasn't offering a free set of steak knives.

[JimO]

Bollocks.

I wasn't offering a free set of steak knives.
but wait there is more

[Duncan74]

but wait there is more

Two sets of knives, a nutri ninja bullet, ab circle pro with DVD and sprayproof floor mat, renovator pro with engraving tool and 16 pairs of screenprinted jeans? All to try for just $3 (plus $784 post and packing).

[6ft5]

No, it was an infomercial.

Right so now i know that everybody has an opinion about why pushies suck I will start throwing bottles at them while on Happy Valley Road on my way to work!

[RDJ]

...free bacon sounds good...would that be halal or traditionally cured stuff...

Applewood smoked with maple-syrup glaze.

And, "we don't need no steenking halal, gringo" - from the movie The Pork of the Sierra Madre

[rastuscat]

but wait there is more

A blow up doll called Loretta, with real hair.

[RDJ]

A blow up doll called Loretta, with real hair.

Nope - Peggy Sue

[rastuscat]

Just getting back on track........

Nah, fuckit.

[scumdog]

Just getting back on track........

Nah, fuckit.


Nantucket??

[RDJ]

Nantucket sleigh ride. Moby Dick. Classical references... all good.

[6ft5]

Oh yes before i forget, this helmet did save a life!!
318806

[rastuscat]

Oh yes before i forget, this helmet did save a life!!
]

At the same time helmets promote weight gain and obesity related diseases.

[nzspokes]

At the same time helmets promote weight gain and obesity related diseases.

On Harleys and BMWs?

[Big Dog]

At the same time helmets promote weight gain and obesity related diseases.
Personally, if someone is so weak willed as to stop doing something they value because someone else told them to wear a helmet, that more than likely would have meant I was not taking pharmaceuticals daily for the rest of my life, perhaps we don't need them in our gene pool?

Sent via tapatalk.

[OddDuck]

At the same time helmets promote weight gain and obesity related diseases.

I haven't met any people saying that helmets are what keep them off pushbikes. I've met plenty saying that it's fear of traffic which does it.

Given my experiences on the treadly I reckon they're right... I've lost count of the number of times I've had a truck thundering past me with inches of clearance, or car drivers being dickheads.

I'd like to say that I have an answer but with NZ's narrow roads and driving culture, I can't see change any time soon.

[Gremlin]

Given my experiences on the treadly I reckon they're right... I've lost count of the number of times I've had a truck thundering past me with inches of clearance, or car drivers being dickheads.

I'd like to say that I have an answer but with NZ's narrow roads and driving culture, I can't see change any time soon.
Mountain biking. While Motorcycles are seen as a bit evil in some groups, DOC, local councils etc are spending and reserving space for mountain biking. They see it promoting health (don't tell them about arguments with those cunning trees aye), tourism attraction and so on. Plus it's a fun way of seeing grey/brown/green/blue blurs that make up the NZ scenery :lol:

Rotorua, Taupo, Auckland and others all have dedicated parks, then you have the parks with mixed use trails etc. Over the next couple of weeks I'm definitely going to explore some of Old Ghost, Queen Charlotte Track and maybe a few other bits... :ride:

[OddDuck]

True that. MTB parks turning up everywhere!

Next step is a proper network of cycle touring trails, apparently the ones which have been built so far are working wonders for the economy of the little towns they go through.

[scumdog]

Personally, if someone is so weak willed as to stop doing something they value because someone else told them to wear a helmet, that more than likely would have meant I was not taking pharmaceuticals daily for the rest of my life, perhaps we don't need them in our gene pool?

Sent via tapatalk.

Perzactly.

Not riding 'cos you have to wear a helmet makes as much sense as not getting into a car 'cos you have to wear a seatbelt...:rolleyes:

[J.A.W.]

Perzactly.

Not riding 'cos you have to wear a helmet makes as much sense as not getting into a car 'cos you have to wear a seatbelt...:rolleyes:

& I.. almost.. pity the fool..

Research shows that wearing a helmet in the car would save way more( in numbers hurt ) serious head injuries than bike (motor & pushy) helmets do..

But will politicians make it compulsory.. not bloody likely, with all those women ( voters) fretting about 'helmet hair'..

[6ft5]

& I.. almost.. pity the fool..

Research shows that wearing a helmet in the car would save way more( in numbers hurt ) serious head injuries than bike (motor & pushy) helmets do..

But will politicians make it compulsory.. not bloody likely, with all those women ( voters) fretting about 'helmet hair'..

Love it, can you imagine that?:shit:

[Daffyd]

Research shows that wearing a helmet in the car would save way more( in numbers hurt ) serious head injuries than bike (motor & pushy) helmets do..

In my yoof my family always spent our annual hols in Queenstown, (when it was still owned by NZers). My brother and I made friends with this family that had a crib, (batch for foreigners) and their next door neighbour was Mr Big at Cable Price, importers of Mercedes Benz and later Toyota. He lived in the Nelson area and motored down to Queenstown in his BIG Merc. It was the only one of its kind in the country and it was not only fast, but very fast! It wasn't a sports car like a 300SL or 190SL, but a big coupe. He would strap himself in with a full racing harness and wear a crash helmet. He used to post some very quick times from Nelson to Queenstown.

Bear in mind this was some years before seatbelts were introduced into the country.