Got side-swiped on the motorway

[jonnyk5614]

Right - was lanesplitting. Guy hit my side doing a no indicator and obviously no mirror check.

When I lanesplit, I go between cars no worries but am very wary to passing someone when their adjacent lane is empty (I.e. In case they change lane). The only time I will pass them without moving into their adjacent lane is if they are just before or just after the vehicle they are passing (I.e. They would be way too close to be changing lane).

So, yesterday.... 70/80kph traffic. I'm doing my thing at 90 or so and smash, got side swiped. Nice big skid down the road. Munted ankle, wrist, fairings and engine case but I'm OK.
The guy who moves over seemed to think it was Ok to pull into a lane at 80kph leaving 2-3metres in front of the car he was pulling in front of (forgetting about me completely).

The cop says I "might" get a ticket for unsafe overtake in the mail.

So, firstly. Who is at fault insurance wise. The car/bike impact is entirely side to side. He doesn't deny changing lane. He was just moaning to anyone listening that I was doing 500kph in his blind spot. He has a NZ license but his Facebook reveals he passed his driving test in India.

Secondly, was I doing an unsafe overtake? I was within lane 2, within the speed limit, passing on the right with my right hand indicator on for at least three seconds prior.

Fuck my ankle hurts!!!

Also, first three cars that saw me lying in the road went by camera phone out the window.
Car 4 who watched the whole accident (she was the car the guy that hit me was pulling in front of) asked "Are you Rokay?" then drove off.

Ducati rider stopped bike in lane three, dismounted, checked on me, then rode to bike, picked bike up, moved it to hard shoulder, retrieved me from the central barrier and stopped traffic to let me cross then left.
Thanks bud - you da man!

Ambo saw it from the other side and came and checked me out - top blokes.

Cops were both great - one bike cop and one motorway patrol (the Utes with cones). The cop bike did all the forms. The patrol dropped me home.


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[5150]

Ummm, If I am correct, you only ment to lane split stationary traffic or one at no more then 11-14kms an hour. Lane splitting 70-80km traffic is a sheer lunacy.

[Waihou Thumper]

Bugger mate! Glad you are okay...
This thread is gonna go on for a bit I bet.....you might have the time to read whilst your ankle heals. :)
I guess if the copper says you might get a ticket, betcha you do! I will give it no more than 10 days...:msn-wink:

[nzspokes]

I have no words. :no:

[Tazz]

Bit shit no one gave you a hand, impatient mofo's

Fault wise you're both in the wrong from my understanding of the law.

[sidecar bob]

Why does the post start with "Right"?

[Waihou Thumper]

Why does the post start with "Right"?

Euphemism for so.... here is the story boys and girls....(secretly it implies I was in the right the whole time, but this is my input!)

What gets me is the post is a little condescending to the motorists, implying fault is with the driver, right down to impersonating accents! then gives rave reviews for the motorcyclist...
Hmm, tad skewed here...

I want the drivers viewpoint. Anyway it looks, the fault is with the rider IMO - too fast for the conditions here, really!

[Waihou Thumper]

Bit shit no one gave you a hand, impatient mofo's


You get that in the big smoke aye! In your neck of the woods, the whole town would have turned out, three fire trucks, tanker, ambulance and the local press...:) street closed for two hours....and so on...:drool:
Just another day, another rider potentially adding to the statistics and another incremental increase to the ACC Levy once the Beehive hears about it.

[EJK]

1. Indian curry shit eater can't fucking drive.

2. Yeah, your speed mate. At 80kph the officer would assume you to just flow with the traffic.

Well, it's too late for blame game now. Hope you get your insurance claim sorted bud!

[Flip]

Hope you have insurance.

If you filter at 70 kph you don't have a chance of getting away with anything IMHO.

[sidecar bob]

Euphemism for so.... here is the story boys and girls....(secretly it implies I was in the right the whole time, but this is my input!)

What gets me is the post is a little condescending to the motorists, implying fault is with the driver, right down to impersonating accents! then gives rave reviews for the motorcyclist...
Hmm, tad skewed here...

I want the drivers viewpoint. Anyway it looks, the fault is with the rider IMO - too fast for the conditions here, really!

"Right" is a particularly condescending way to start a sentence, usually used by bully bosses preceding some kind of telling off,
That's why I didn't read the rest of the post.

[Katman]

That's why I didn't read the rest of the post.

You didn't miss anything.

[bogan]

"Right" is a particularly condescending way to start a sentence, usually used by bully bosses preceding some kind of telling off,
That's why I didn't read the rest of the post.

Left... alone for a week or two with a busted ankle, he might reconsider the pros and cons of splitting at 80kmhr.

Iirc, it's illegal to split passed non stationary traffic unless you keep within the lane of the vehicle you are passing, and have the right indicator on. Also illegal to lane change without indicating. So tickets for everyone! Which reminds me, I haven't seen star wars yet...

[Mike.Gayner]

"Right" is a particularly condescending way to start a sentence, usually used by bully bosses preceding some kind of telling off,
That's why I didn't read the rest of the post.

The rest of the post has the same attitude. I'm not even going to get into who I think is right or wrong, OP is obviously a bit of a cock with a big race problem.

[sidecar bob]

Oh phew, I figured I was going to get roasted for that, but felt it was worth going out on a limb for.

[WristTwister]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sWHJ_xFJLQ

*Not illegal
* splitting at speed is not good

[Blackbird]

Errr.....didn't he make a post that long ago about binning it on a bend? Bit of a common thread developing here about situational awareness :whistle:

[AllanB]

Hmmmmm

Is it OK to start a post with 'Hmmm"?

Your bad IMO based on your post - looked just like the below vid?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kz4ZGqfwNEM

[TheDemonLord]

A few thoughts:

Were you progressing through the traffic (ie changing lanes and doing a legal overtake, utilizing space too small for cars) or were you actually in his lane? if you were in his lane at 90 Kph - then yeah, I'd say you were at fault (not that I have never done this myself...), if you were in the lane NEXT to him, progressing through traffic, then he's at fault.

Eitherway though, you are still the one that ended up in hospital.

Secondly were you paying attention as you moved through the traffic?

Thirdly You could try the Indian licence defence, but the onus would be on you to prove that the Indian licencing system is not sufficient to allow someone to drive on NZ roads - since our Government doesn't forbid someone with a full Indian licence from driving, I would guess that you would have a tough time convincing someone of that

Fourthly Get well soon, and learn from the experiance.

[FJRider]

Errr.....didn't he make a post that long ago about binning it on a bend? Bit of a common thread developing here about situational awareness :whistle:

He made a post about how he folds his mirrors in whilst lane splitting ... :whistle:

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/176672-GSX-R1000-K4-mirror-help?p=1130918784#post1130918784

[J.A.W.]

Hmmmmm

Is it OK to start a post with 'Hmmm"?

Your bad IMO based on your post - looked just like the below vid below


Yeah, well, that dozy bozo in the vid, did bring the prat-fall.. in & on cue.. useless prick..

That aint to paint the O.P. with the same brush, since - by his testimony, he got punted by the lane-changer.. not the converse..

Adit: & that Injun.. he's gotta pay.. by hook, or by crook.. do not let it.. ah, slide..

[Oakie]

I have no words. :no:

Liar! You just used four!

[Tazz]

Food for the righteous (is that too close to the beginning of the sentence? :bleh:), I bet almost every one of you over takes at over 100kph, therefore if the car you were over taking swerved into you while you were passing you would be in exactly the same boat as this guy, legally speaking.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sWHJ_xFJLQ

*Not illegal
* splitting at speed is not good

Hey, mate mate mate mate mate mate. That's not a knife, that's a spoon.

(Translation: Monica ses New Zealand laws are different to Australian laws au.)

[RGVforme]

Bit shit no one gave you a hand, impatient mofo's

Fault wise you're both in the wrong from my understanding of the law.

Yeah I heard this somewhere also....

Brave man doing this at 70/80kmh.....Im not sure but the police may expect you to just go with the flow of traffic at this speed I guess you will find out soon enough.

Why I don't really lane split....Right or wrong if it comes to the 'Crunch' its going to hurt me more.:wacko:

[nzspokes]

Errr.....didn't he make a post that long ago about binning it on a bend? Bit of a common thread developing here about situational awareness :whistle:

There was even a video.

[nzspokes]

Liar! You just used four!

Thats fair.

[Jin]

Sorry to hear but be glad its only your ankle that hurts. A crash on the motorway could have been a lot worse.

Ignore the self righteous fuckwits who claim they never lanesplit, speed and drive like nanna's on the road.

[AllanB]

by his testimony, he got punted by the lane-changer.. not the converse..

Adit: & that Injun.. he's gotta pay.. by hook, or by crook.. do not let it.. ah, slide..


Fatting along 15kms faster than the lanes of traffic, lane splitting and a vehicle in front makes a lane change - he was never going to see him, brain is not programmed for it in normal driving conditions - the rider was the one to make the decision to alter the standard accepted driving practice.

Race is irrelevant - chances are if Jesus Christ was driving he'd have not looked for the bike.


Years back at the horse racing a guy I know tells the tale of him standing next to this attractive woman in a tight top - he makes the sly glances at the curvaceous profiles present many times, even catches a smile from her if he story is correct. After about ten minutes he realizes her top is actually body paint (apparently the temperature had dropped a bit ....).

Point is he was programmed to see clothing.

Unless you have ridden a motorcycle for a reasonable period of time as a car driver you are expecting the motorcycle (if you see it) to behave like a car.

[jasonu]

OP is obviously a bit of a cock with a big race problem.

Why? He didn't say curry muncher or chink. He pointed out that the driver obtained his license in India and the person who stopped has a speech impediment. You lot are quick to jump on 'shit foreign drivers in rental cars cause accident' stories in the Harold...

[Waihou Thumper]

Harold...

Who the fuck is Harold?

[J.A.W.]

Fatting along 15kms faster than the lanes of traffic, lane splitting and a vehicle in front makes a lane change - he was never going to see him, brain is not programmed for it in normal driving conditions - the rider was the one to make the decision to alter the standard accepted driving practice.

Race is irrelevant - chances are if Jesus Christ was driving he'd have not looked for the bike.


Years back at the horse racing a guy I know tells the tale of him standing next to this attractive woman in a tight top - he makes the sly glances at the curvaceous profiles present many times, even catches a smile from her if he story is correct. After about ten minutes he realizes her top is actually body paint (apparently the temperature had dropped a bit ....).

Point is he was programmed to see clothing.

Unless you have ridden a motorcycle for a reasonable period of time as a car driver you are expecting the motorcycle (if you see it) to behave like a car.


Stop making excuses for the bloody perp.. a 3rd world fuckwit.. from a place well known for shit driving & dishonesty..

[Jin]

Stop making excuses for the bloody perp.. a 3rd world fuckwit.. from a place well known for shit driving & dishonesty..
bit fucking rich for you to be calling someone a fuckwit fuckwit

[J.A.W.]

bit fucking rich for you to be calling someone a fuckwit fuckwit


Awww.. is 'Bombay jin' - having a wee tanty?

When what he really wanted.. was a chutney drippn' poppadom? L.O.L...

[nzspokes]

Sorry to hear but be glad its only your ankle that hurts. A crash on the motorway could have been a lot worse.

Ignore the self righteous fuckwits who claim they never lanesplit, speed and drive like nanna's on the road.

Some of us can lanesplit, filter etc without bouncing off cars.

[R650R]

So your in lane two of the motorway, and lane splitting so at the extreme right of that lane and you expect the car in same lane to see your right indicator going???? And even if he sees it going hes supposed to magically know that it means your Not moving to the right or making a right turn as in the road code but overtaking him whilst in the same lane!!!
Just be thankful your alive and not road kill. I've lived in Auckland for about 3 and half years at one stage and got about by bike heaps and cut ym teeth up there as far as lane splitting goes. But if it had ever turned to shit like that I'd suck it up and admit that your doing an unconventional manoevoure that not all motorists might expect. Never mind the legal greyness......

Anyone whose motorway savvy knows the last thing you do is come to a stop (to help or rubberneck) or you risk being hit yourself. Unless your directly involved or a trained paramedic and/or it looks life threatening best to go with the flow.

Lesson learned aye, people will do unpredictable shit on the motrway and also preditable shit like sudden lane changes.

Although this sucks, guess what. it might be the first time but prob wont be the last... have fun but keep it safe.

[Swoop]

Who the fuck is Harold?

That waste of space daily rag, that confuses actual "news" with utter crap/gossip/trivia that should be in the Woman's Weekly and tabloid magazines.

[Grubber]

Not really sure what he expected was going to happen eventually riding like that.
80k traffic and lane splitting at 90k was always going to end well.
What a pratt!

[Berries]

Secondly, was I doing an unsafe overtake? I was within lane 2, within the speed limit, passing on the right with my right hand indicator on for at least three seconds prior.
You think an indicator does anything when you make an extra lane on the motorway or that a car driver expects to see someone ride past in the same lane when they are doing over 70? It's all your fault if you ask me, which you did by posting.




Also, first three cars that saw me lying in the road went by camera phone out the window.
Car 4 who watched the whole accident (she was the car the guy that hit me was pulling in front of) asked "Are you Rokay? You need amburance?" then drove off.
Wow. A possible witness to actually help you out and you make that racist comment.

[J.A.W.]

Wow. A possible witness to actually help you out and you make that racist comment.

How did you miss - "& then drove off"?

Did she provide a witness statement, or video from her dash cam?

Of course not...

Best you go back to your streaky greasin' & cease the oafish remarks...

[jonnyk5614]

Cheers for all having a good time.
Yup - lane splitting at that speed is probably asking for trouble. I realise that.
No - my mirrors weren't folded in. They get folded at traffic light queues at 15kph.

The point I was getting at is that, my being an idiot aside, the guy didn't indicate prior and changed lane expecting 2-3m of space to be sufficient for the following vehicle at 80kph.

I'd maintained the same road position, to the right of lane 2 vehicles and left of white line for some time and would therefore be in his mirror for some time. I was indicating right. This is what NZ road code - whether safe or not - says is legal.

I don't see any way he checked his mirror.
When I took my test it was mirror, signal, blind spot, manoeuvre. All it looks like he did to me was manoeuvre, signal, crash.

The traffic was stationary because I was lying in lane three. The rights or wrongs of my actions, I'd still stop and help me up if I were the following car.

Also, the Asian lady following should have offered to witness - for either party?

Re the last crash. Yup. Screwed up. Got stuck in my seat cos of stuff shoved in my jacket when I wanted to pretend an empty road was a racetrack. I knocked that practise on the head, booked a ride forever course, genuinely slowed down a lot and invested in better gear.


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[jonnyk5614]

What gets me is the post is a little condescending to the motorists, implying fault is with the driver, right down to impersonating accents! then gives rave reviews for the motorcyclist...
Hmm, tad skewed here...

I want the drivers viewpoint. Anyway it looks, the fault is with the rider IMO - too fast for the conditions here, really!

To be perfectly honest, that biker was just as awesome as I said.
Even if we all conclude that the whole thing was down to my being a idiotic fuckwit (perfectly likely), he was the only person that didn't go "serves you right - toodleloo" but went "OK - this guy has fucked up but needs a hand"


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[jonnyk5614]

1. Indian curry shit eater can't fucking drive.

2. Yeah, your speed mate. At 80kph the officer would assume you to just flow with the traffic.

Well, it's too late for blame game now. Hope you get your insurance claim sorted bud!

Fair enough re the 80kph. To be honest, it had been much slower then was gradually speeding up and I was about to be looking at merging back into traffic.

I guess that is the thing - you have to consciously change mindset to go from splitting to not and I was just pretty focussed on splitting.


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[Madness]

The point I was getting at is that, my being an idiot aside, the guy didn't indicate prior and changed lane expecting 2-3m of space to be sufficient for the following vehicle at 80kph.

So there was nothing unusual about his driving then, considering it's D'Auckland. Seriously though dude, it's time for another attitude adjustment. In this heat and humidity a corpse is going to get smelly pretty quick.

[eldog]

the Asian lady following should have offered to witness - for either party?

Re the last crash. Yup. Screwed up. Got stuck in my seat cos of stuff shoved in my jacket when I wanted to pretend an empty road was a racetrack. I knocked that practise on the head, genuinely slowed down a lot and invested in better gear.

Ever decreasing number of aucklanders willing to become involved.

Good to see you are able to look back and change your activities so it reduces the chance of it happening again.

That ankle will ache for ages, try not to beat your self up, focus on getting fixed up and becoming a better rider.

I have made a good many mistakes in my riding career, learnt the hard way, life can be cruel but there's a lot worst off than me.

Good gear is always worth it.

[FJRider]

expecting 2-3m of space to be sufficient for the following vehicle at 80kph.

I whether safe or not - says is legal.

I don't see any way he checked his mirror.

When I took my test it was mirror, signal, blind spot, manoeuvre. All it looks like he did to me was manoeuvre, signal, crash.

Also, the Asian lady following should have offered to witness - for either party?



"Expecting" .. is never any guarantee of anything.

Legal is no guarantee of safe. Legal and dead is never good.

Could you see him in his mirrors (did YOU look to see if he was looking .. ??) .. ??? (but he probably didn't look)

You put yourself in his blind spot ... and got clobbered. Learn from it.

The Asian lady probably didn't speak English. And ... was probably in a hurry. (Auckland ... right .. ??)

[Jin]

I guess lesson to learn is when lanesplitting always slow down when you see gaps. The guy didnt indicate which means he is in the wrong but its a moot point when you are the one ends up lying on the road.

[jonnyk5614]

A few thoughts:

Were you progressing through the traffic (ie changing lanes and doing a legal overtake, utilizing space too small for cars) or were you actually in his lane? if you were in his lane at 90 Kph - then yeah, I'd say you were at fault (not that I have never done this myself...), if you were in the lane NEXT to him, progressing through traffic, then he's at fault.

Eitherway though, you are still the one that ended up in hospital.

Secondly were you paying attention as you moved through the traffic?

Thirdly You could try the Indian licence defence, but the onus would be on you to prove that the Indian licencing system is not sufficient to allow someone to drive on NZ roads - since our Government doesn't forbid someone with a full Indian licence from driving, I would guess that you would have a tough time convincing someone of that

Fourthly Get well soon, and learn from the experiance.

Making progress but I can't remember inch for inch exactly where I was at impact time. Probably just on the line. Just prior, definitely passing lane two traffic from within lane 2.

Certainly was paying attention. Cop tested me by asking me the models and colours of the cars that I'd just passed. I was spot on.

Meh - Indian license isn't a defence. Law's the law. He can drive here else he would have been nicked. Their whole culture is drive and hope, not drive and avoid was the issue I was getting at.

I was expecting a bollocking from the cops but they said "not our decision but we just write the report." "You're allowed to be alongside sharing a lane at any speed up to 100 as long as you are to the left of the line. It is up to you whether you think it is always a good idea." Unsafe overtake would be determined if I actively placed myself in his blind spot apparently. I wasn't anywhere near his blindspot (afterall, the closer you are too the side of the vehicle, the less exposure to blind spot).




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[jonnyk5614]

He made a post about how he folds his mirrors in whilst lane splitting ... :whistle:

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/176672-GSX-R1000-K4-mirror-help?p=1130918784#post1130918784

At like 10kph Auckland city stationary traffic.
Certainly not on the motorway.


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[jonnyk5614]

So there was nothing unusual about his driving then, considering it's D'Auckland. Seriously though dude, it's time for another attitude adjustment. In this heat and humidity a corpse is going to get smelly pretty quick.

I agree re attitude adjustment - You never stop learning etc.

The point of my questions is to establish if I'm about to end up in court and if my insurance will fuck me over!

Overall, I see myself technically legal but leaving far too little margin for idiocy/error.

What was that signature that someone has - bikes aren't inherently unsafe but inherently unforgiving to fuckwits. Yup - that is spot on.




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[swbarnett]

Yup - lane splitting at that speed is probably asking for trouble.
Not necessarily. If you treat the surrounding traffic with due respect it can be done safely.

The problem here is that you made an assumption about the behaviour of the car driver.


The guy who moves over seemed to think it was Ok to pull into a lane at 80kph leaving 2-3metres in front of the car he was pulling in front of (forgetting about me completely).
How long have you been riding in Auckland? Have you not noticed that the average car to car gap is no more than the length of the following driver's ego? If a car will fit with a gnat's whisker either end then expect someone to try it.

[Madness]

The point of my questions is to establish if I'm about to end up in court and if my insurance will fuck me over...

You pay for insurance so you can afford to do stupid shit. Should be sweet I reckon, pay excess - job done.

Good luck.

[swbarnett]

80k traffic and lane splitting at 90k was always going to end well.
I'm glad you think so. It's certainly ended well for me every time I've done it.

[swbarnett]

Overall, I see myself technically legal but leaving far too little margin for idiocy/error.
Spot on. Been there myself but thankfully only had a near miss. Much more wary after that.

Forgive me if my previous post was perhaps a little condescending. Anyone willing to learn is on the right track in my book.

[jonnyk5614]

Who the fuck is Harold?

I believe it is the same chap that was pointing to how desperate people became on a burning ship that bath toys were their last resort! http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/01/20/299d2c17483799b287da6d8e735c8da2.jpg


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[Berries]

Best you go back to your streaky greasin' & cease the oafish remarks...
Oh, you're in this thread as well now.

[jonnyk5614]

Spot on. Been there myself but thankfully only had a near miss. Much more wary after that.

Forgive me if my previous post was perhaps a little condescending. Anyone willing to learn is on the right track in my book.

Go for gold:
1. This is Kiwibiker - I know what to expect
2. I've got thick skin and it is always covered in thick RST Leathers.
3. I post my cock up so people have a go at me and I see the error in my ways and don't kill myself.


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[jonnyk5614]

Not necessarily. If you treat the surrounding traffic with due respect it can be done safely.

The problem here is that you made an assumption about the behaviour of the car driver.


How long have you been riding in Auckland? Have you not noticed that the average car to car gap is no more than the length of the following driver's ego? If a car will fit with a gnat's whisker either end then expect someone to try it.

Yup

I grew up in the UK. Everyone thinks they leave a 2 sec gap, which is 56m at 100kph. They actually are closer to 1 sec but still - 28m.

I'm used to Auckland drivers being morons and leaving 1/3 of that but this guy was waaaay closer than I've ever seen so I assumed I was all good.

I've been lane-splitting in Auckland for 2 years, yes at 80ks/90ks. This is the first time I've come close to an issue and my first ever accident (London pushbike/car in 14 countries/motorbike here) hence being a bit wound up that I could make such a mistake.


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[jonnyk5614]

"Expecting" .. is never any guarantee of anything.

Legal is no guarantee of safe. Legal and dead is never good.

Could you see him in his mirrors (did YOU look to see if he was looking .. ??) .. ??? (but he probably didn't look)

You put yourself in his blind spot ... and got clobbered. Learn from it.


Surely by being on that white line, I am no where near his blind spot? The one place he is guaranteed to see me in his mirror? Blind spot goes from 90* to 135* from driver's shoulder. I'm sitting at, what 170* the whole time? Perfect.


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[Berries]

Surely by being on that white line, I am no where near his blind spot? The one place he is guaranteed to see me in his mirror?
If a driver knows it is nose to tail traffic the only reason he is going to use his mirrors before a lane change is if he is motorbike aware. Given the number of people splitting up there you would think they are but then there are always going to be many drivers that aren't who won't even look in their mirror. Buyer beware etc.

And getting back to the indicator thing. To me, seeing a bike splitting with the indicator on makes me think the rider has left it on by mistake. The alternative is to think that they are changing lanes so if a car driver did see you indicating in that brief moment he checks the mirror he probably thinks you are moving in to the other lane anyway. I cannot see any reason to use the indicator for this purpose other than trying to comply with some misinterpretation of the overtaking rule, to me it increases your risk.

[FJRider]

Surely by being on that white line, I am no where near his blind spot? The one place he is guaranteed to see me in his mirror? Blind spot goes from 90* to 135* from driver's shoulder. I'm sitting at, what 170* the whole time? Perfect.


His blind spot is where he is not looking. If he doesn't look ... there is NO guaranteed way he will see you.

NEVER assume he (they) will (should) see you ... that is an invitation for pain.

Question ... in your original post you said you were on the motorway ... with traffic flow at 70-80 km/hr ... how come the traffic flow was so slow .. ????

[nzspokes]

His blind spot is where he is no looking. If he doesn't look ... there is NO guaranteed way he will see you.

NEVER assume he (they) will (should) see you ... that is an invitation for pain.

Question ... in your original post you said you were on the motorway ... with traffic flow at 70-80 km/hr ... how come the traffic flow was so slow .. ????

Agreed, never assume a driver knows where you are or what you are about to do.

We had 2 black sport bikes come past us on Sunday on the North western. Guess they were coming back from the bike drags as they had numbers painted on the tanks. We were progressing through traffic but these 2 came through us at least 40 to 50kph faster. First one was 2 up with a girl on the back in jeans. :eek5: Squids.

[FJRider]

The point of my questions is to establish if I'm about to end up in court and if my insurance will fuck me over!

Overall, I see myself technically legal but leaving far too little margin for idiocy/error.



Overtaking another vehicle on it's right ... in the same lane is legal .. but not leaving a sufficient safe distance between the two vehicles could be construed by the highway patrol as being unsafe. Thus ... a ticket may be issued.

Unless your policy forbids lane-splitting ... insurance payout should not be an issue. But expect an increase in your excess ...

[jonnyk5614]

If a driver knows it is nose to tail traffic the only reason he is going to use his mirrors before a lane change is if he is motorbike aware. Given the number of people splitting up there you would think they are but then there are always going to be many drivers that aren't who won't even look in their mirror. Buyer beware etc.

And getting back to the indicator thing. To me, seeing a bike splitting with the indicator on makes me think the rider has left it on by mistake. The alternative is to think that they are changing lanes so if a car driver did see you indicating in that brief moment he checks the mirror he probably thinks you are moving in to the other lane anyway. I cannot see any reason to use the indicator for this purpose other than trying to comply with some misinterpretation of the overtaking rule, to me it increases your risk.

Don't know how often you ride in Auckland but our motorways are clogged and there is usually a queue of bikes splitting between the lanes. To an Auckland diver, it isn't a radical new concept. Many even move over to help us get through.

I was parked up on the bus on an over bridge over the motorway on the North Shore this morning. Southbound traffic moving at 70/80 and counted 6 motorbikes splitting through at 90. It isn't unusual. I was probably only there for 20 seconds.

Law says that if overtaking, you must indicate. The cop checked that my indicator was on and working - it was. Some extra orange LEDs in the car's mirror are going to help you see bikes.

I really struggle with your "you wouldn't check a mirror before changing lane" comment.


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[SVboy]

Stop making excuses for the bloody perp.. I am a 3rd world fuckwit called Just Another Wanker, from a place well known for shit driving & dishonesty..

Edited to reflect reality. To the OP, well done for having the balls to come on here and reflect on your actions and possible mistakes. Hope you mend quickly.

[jonnyk5614]

Question ... in your original post you said you were on the motorway ... with traffic flow at 70-80 km/hr ... how come the traffic flow was so slow .. ????

That is pretty quick for Auckland.... 7pm - not too long after rush hour.


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[Oscar]

"Right" is a particularly condescending way to start a sentence, usually used by bully bosses preceding some kind of telling off,
That's why I didn't read the rest of the post.

You're a sensitive wee flower, ain't you?

Oft times "right" is used for emphasis to start a funny or involved tale.

As in - Right, have you heard this one..!

[swbarnett]

I grew up in the UK. Everyone thinks they leave a 2 sec gap, which is 56m at 100kph. They actually are closer to 1 sec but still - 28m.
Used to be like that here. I started riding when the only "lane-splitting" any biker did was at the lights (just not enough traffic).


I've been lane-splitting in Auckland for 2 years, yes at 80ks/90ks.
Just curious. Northern, Southern or Western motorway?

[BuzzardNZ]

Some of us can lanesplit, filter etc without bouncing off cars.

Surely that wouldn't include you would it? as you're far too fat to lane split :motu:

[jonnyk5614]

Used to be like that here. I started riding when the only "lane-splitting" any biker did was at the lights (just not enough traffic).


Just curious. Northern, Southern or Western motorway?

Southern - Central to Sylvia park


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[J.A.W.]

Edited to reflect reality...

To quote your good buddy Aka.. "Lolocaust"..

"Reflect" eh, too bad you fail to realize that a reflection is a 180' reversal..

As for your tenuous grasp on "reality" - that's yet another hilarious concept..

[nzspokes]

Surely that wouldn't include you would it? as you're far too fat to lane split :motu:

Least I do it on a clean bike....

[Berries]

Don't know how often you ride in Auckland but our motorways are clogged and there is usually a queue of bikes splitting between the lanes. To an Auckland diver, it isn't a radical new concept. Many even move over to help us get through.
Like I said, with the number of people splitting up there you would think that most drivers would be aware of motorbikes coming through but then some are oblivious and always will be.

[swbarnett]

Southern - Central to Sylvia park
I do Bombay to Central (with a nice bit of rural thrown in first). I'm not sure from memory but I think most of the shit lane changing I've seen has been south of Sylvia Park.

[Waihou Thumper]

I do Bombay to Central (with a nice bit of rural thrown in first). I'm not sure from memory but I think most of the shit lane changing I've seen has been south of Sylvia Park.

I had two in front of me this morning....They passed me and then quickly halted as there were two trucks, inside and out.
The first guy just went behind the first truck on the inside lane and then the other bloke was weaving between inside and out...
Then though 'fuck it' He went on the outside of the truck on the outside lane.....He had hazards on for some dickhead reason.
Both riders showed a blatent dis-regard for any road rules, passed me doing approx 70kph and then just flicked left and right as quickly as they changed their underpants....
Wankers! :eek5:

Oh....forgot to add. Some Asian chick passed me doing 109 kph...(GPS) but a guess. She had her cellphone in her right hand and was txting and overtaking three cars!

[J.A.W.]

I had two in front of me this morning...

[I]Oh....forgot to add. Some Asian chick passed me doing 109 kph...(GPS) but a guess. She had her cellphone in her right hand and was txting and overtaking three cars!


Asian?

If I might be so bold.. ( & spared hypocritical remarks - for my plain colloquial, if possibly vulgar usage)..

"Slanty eye" - East Asian, or "darkie" - Indian sub-continental Asian?

[Waihou Thumper]

Asian?

If I might be so bold.. ( & spared hypocritical remarks - for my plain colloquial, if possibly vulgar usage)..

"Slanty eye" - East Asian, or "darkie" - Indian sub-continental Asian?

Focus on the Bikes mate....Those fucking idiots riding...


But...Oh sorry..I forgot. As she drove past I saw her D/L......Taiwan/Hong Kong as I recall.
BTW....Travelling for the best part of 35 years I knew, yes I knew she was from Causeway Bay....Wan Chai actually...:yes:

[jasonu]

Asian?

If I might be so bold.. ( & spared hypocritical remarks - for my plain colloquial, if possibly vulgar usage)..

"Slanty eye" - East Asian, or "darkie" - Indian sub-continental Asian?

Doesn't matter. They are all tarred with the same shit driver brush.

[5150]

And you guys think e have it bad.....

https://www.change.org/p/donne-trotter-john-cullerton-john-d-amico-legalize-lane-filtering-in-illinois

Why cant we do this in NZ? : In California, the only state in America that does not prohibit the act of Lane Splitting/Filtering, the practice is taught to student riders and even encouraged by the California Highway Patrol due to benefits to safety, congestion, and environment.

[Clunge Bucket]

I grew up in the UK

I knew there was something fabulous about you mate. Let the spear chuckers lord themselves over you, if it wasnt for us this lot would still be eating each other. Shame about the Moa's though, reckon they would have made a good roast

[Clunge Bucket]

First one was 2 up with a girl on the back in jeans. :eek5: Squids.

Just jeans.....fucking brilliant

[Big Dog]

Just jeans.....fucking brilliant
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[Big Dog]

Does anyone know how to R18 flag images from tapatalk?

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[sidecar bob]

Does anyone know how to R18 flag images from tapatalk?

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Who cares?

[jonnyk5614]

Who cares?

Need a system so that they are prioritised in my feed :)


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[Katman]

Doesn't matter. They are all tarred with the same shit driver brush.

Oscar should be along soon to cite Section 61 of the Human Rights Act.

[Big Dog]

Who cares?
People who KB from work places with Internet use policies...



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[Voltaire]

People who KB from work places with Internet use policies...



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Just put NSFW next to it

[PrincessBandit]

... lane splitting at that speed is probably asking for trouble. I realise that.


...The point I was getting at is that, my being an idiot aside, the guy didn't indicate prior and changed lane expecting 2-3m of space to be sufficient for the following vehicle at 80kph.




First part of quote: I hope you learned something for you troubles then. Wasted "lesson" if you go out and repeat it.

Second part of quote: If you expect road users to indicate everything they do then you're pretty naive. The fact that they don't do something they're supposed to is irrelevant once you are smeared over the tarseal. Lane splitting (we all do it) is arguably one of the riskiest things riders do. Considering that some seem to think it quite acceptable to do at speed (and generally we only do it when traffic is at its densest) it shouldn't come as any surprise when all turns to shit we come off second best. For the record I only split if traffic is under 50 kph :innocent: ; otherwise I'm happy enough to remain in my lane while others fly past me, carving it up. All good to them - I don't really care - as long as I'm not in their sphere of collateral damage when they cock up.

[J.A.W.]

First part of quote: Blah,blah blah...I don't really care - as long as I'm not in their sphere of collateral damage when they cock up.

Gordon bleedin' Bennett..

If a certain Pommy bastard gets a butchers at that load of Freudian dog's bollocks..

[Clunge Bucket]

Gordon bleedin' Bennett..

If a certain Pommy bastard gets a butchers at that load of Freudian dog's bollocks..

You called sir.......???

[swbarnett]

Lane splitting (we all do it) is arguably one of the riskiest things riders do.
Speak for yourself. I lane-split partly because it's a damn sight safer than staying inline with the traffic*. If done properly can be safe at almost any speed as long as the speed differential between rider and traffic doesn't get out of control.

Take a look at the following experience from California (lane-splitting is illegal in Texas and Florida):



California, when compared to Texas and Florida, has a 30% REDUCED rate of rear-end collision deaths for motorcyclists because they have Lane Splitting.
A University of California - Berkeley study showed that Lane Splitting is safe if done at speeds of 50 mph or less and if motorcyclists do not exceed the speed of other vehicles by more than 15 mph. Speed differentials up to 15 mph were not associated with changes in the frequency of injury; and
Compared to riders who were not splitting lanes, lane-splitting motorcyclists were markedly less likely to suffer head injury (9% vs. 17%), torso injury (19% vs. 29%) or fatal injury (1.2% vs. 3%); Lane-splitting riders were significantly less likely to be rear-ended than non-lane-splitting riders (2.6% vs. 4.6%).


The full article this is from is here (https://www.change.org/p/donne-trotter-john-cullerton-john-d-amico-legalize-lane-filtering-in-illinois).



*It is true, however that a number of bikers do split in a dangerous fassion.

[J.A.W.]

You called sir.......???

Get stuck in, me old mucker..

But be advised, the self-described 'Princess' acts like she's got a few 'undred weight of bleedin' clunge up, in 'er, ah, favour..

[jonnyk5614]

Should point out - my first year of biking, I didn't lane split. No end of people randomly appearing in my lane with my taking evasive action.

Since then, two years splitting - never an issue till Wednesday evening.

The reality is, it is safer. Keep the speed differential down (I do - no more than 10/15kph) and stay very alert.

When you lane-split, you are in someone's mirror when you are 5 car lengths back and never stop being there.

Ride in line with traffic, you are never in the mirror!

The guy never fucking looked




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[Katman]

The guy never fucking looked

You're the only one that gives a fuck.

[AllanB]

The guy never fucking looked



For you....lane splitting in a area cars drivers would never expect to have to EVER look. It is really simple - if you are lane splitting it is your fucking job to be on the look out.


I have no issue with it being done safely - I have a issue with posts like yours crying fowl after you made the choice ....

[PrincessBandit]

Speak for yourself. I lane-split partly because it's a damn sight safer than staying inline with the traffic*. If done properly can be safe at almost any speed as long as the speed differential between rider and traffic doesn't get out of control.

Take a look at the following experience from California (lane-splitting is illegal in Texas and Florida):


The full article this is from is here (https://www.change.org/p/donne-trotter-john-cullerton-john-d-amico-legalize-lane-filtering-in-illinois).



*It is true, however that a number of biker do split in a dangerous fassion.


Like I said ARGUABLY. I'm not going to insult your comprehension but given that you qualify your post with as long as the speed differential between rider and traffic doesn't get out of control. therein lies many a problem. I've never met with any driver - of car or truck - who has squeezed me out of space while splitting, but many here can attest to it being an issue for them. As for choosing to remain in my own lane, I ride in line with the right hand wheels of the car in front of me and keep myself as visible as possible. Obviously that is irrelevant for a daydreaming driver whose brain is not engaged with operating a potentially lethal weapon; but then it's up to me to ensure my own safety as much as possible.

Oh, and going by the piccy at the top of that article you provided the link for, if motorcyclists all had that width (almost a half a lane width) left by other motorists to split in then we'd be pretty damned privileged!

[BuzzardNZ]

Least I do it on a clean bike....

dude, if I choose to clean my bike I can. Can you clean your own filthy fat self up as easily? I doubt it kunt :facepalm: Good luck with that.

[TheDemonLord]

For you....lane splitting in a area cars drivers would never expect to have to EVER look. It is really simple - if you are lane splitting it is your fucking job to be on the look out.


I have no issue with it being done safely - I have a issue with posts like yours crying fowl after you made the choice ....

Exactly what I was thinking.

[PrincessBandit]

.......... It is really simple - if you are lane splitting it is your fucking job to be on the look out.


.......... I have a issue with posts like yours crying fowl after you made the choice ....

319038

bahkaaaaah!!


Btw, if JAW continues farting out of his oversized JAWbum, as he is so prone to do here, I'll have to find my box of matches to get rid of the stench.

[swbarnett]

Like I said ARGUABLY. I'm not going to insult your comprehension but given that you qualify your post with as long as the speed differential between rider and traffic doesn't get out of control. therein lies many a problem. I've never met with any driver - of car or truck - who has squeezed me out of space while splitting, but many here can attest to it being an issue for them. As for choosing to remain in my own lane, I ride in line with the right hand wheels of the car in front of me and keep myself as visible as possible. Obviously that is irrelevant for a daydreaming driver whose brain is not engaged with operating a potentially lethal weapon; but then it's up to me to ensure my own safety as much as possible.

Oh, and going by the piccy at the top of that article you provided the link for, if motorcyclists all had that width (almost a half a lane width) left by other motorists to split in then we'd be pretty damned privileged!
Sounds to me like we're actually in agreement. Lane-splitting can be dangerous if disrespected but is otherwise safe. Pretty much like anything else we do on a bike.

[Laava]

319038

bahkaaaaah!!


Btw, if JAW continues farting out of his oversized JAWbum, as he is so prone to do here, I'll have to find my box of matches to get rid of the stench.

You gonna put the lil retard on bobo nappy watch and approve all his posts again? He never learns!

[J.A.W.]

You gonna put the lil retard on bobo nappy watch and approve all his posts again? He never learns!


Referring to yourself in the 3rd person nowadays, Rattus? Shameful..

As for 'Princess Brute-Squad' sure, she's plenty tough - when she gets to deal to people, & abuse/hide behind/power trip - via - her mod privileges.. how typical that such double standards.. appear to be simply, par-for-the-course..

[FJRider]

Since then, two years splitting - never an issue till Wednesday evening.

The reality is, it is safer. Keep the speed differential down (I do - no more than 10/15kph) and stay very alert.

When you lane-split, you are in someone's mirror when you are 5 car lengths back and never stop being there.

Ride in line with traffic, you are never in the mirror!

The guy never fucking looked




There will never be an issue until somebody does something you don't expect. Or YOU do something THEY don't expect.

Reality is ... a car driver wont feel your pain if they hit you. Most wont even care that they hit you. Did you just learn the "Alert" bit .. ???

If you can see the driver in THEIR mirror ... they will see you. IF ... THEY look.

Air horns get their attention.

He may look a bit harder in future ... then again ... maybe not.

[Swoop]

Like I said, with the number of people splitting up there you would think that most drivers would be aware of motorbikes coming through but then some are oblivious and always will be.
Sadly there are two problems in D'Auckland.
1: Soft-cocks who park their bike during the "chilly months", meaning less bikes = less awareness of them by tin-tops.
2: Serious amounts of road works on the mutterways. The amount of bikes sitting in traffic (WTF is with that?) when they could be pootling along quite merrily between tin-tops.:facepalm:

...if JAW continues farting out of his oversized JAWbum, as he is so prone to do here, I'll have to find my box of matches to get rid of the stench.
Get with the programme. The gob-shite from the land of the giant-jumping-rat is thicker than a mental patient wearing a tinfoil-hat!

He never learns!
True. So very true.

[J.A.W.]

Swoppy goes on..

& its yet more bullshit.. from yet another Pomgolian pontificator..

Lame. So very lame..


The O.P. has to make the perp pay, or eat shit.. simple as that..

[gsxr]

Swoppy goes on..

& its yet more bullshit.. from yet another Pomgolian pontificator..

Lame. So very lame..


The O.P. has to make the perp pay, or eat shit.. simple as that..

Seriously JAW . Your keyboard needs to change its substance of choice.

Obviously the Cyber Controller has picked the wrong subject to control a keyboard.

[J.A.W.]

Seriously JAW . Your keyboard needs to change its substance of choice.

Obviously the Cyber Controller has picked the wrong subject to control a keyboard.


'That does not compute'..

& still no SRAD?

Awww.. widdle bubba gsxr still has to wide his fat ol' shitter, awww.. L.O.L...

[ellipsis]

I cut my ankle

[PrincessBandit]

Got some at the ready...319057 Feel free to share.

[Berries]

1: Soft-cocks who park their bike during the "chilly months"
You're having a giraffe, surely? Chilly months up there?


2: Serious amounts of road works on the mutterways. The amount of bikes sitting in traffic (WTF is with that?) when they could be pootling along quite merrily between tin-tops.
This week I had the very same discussion after splitting though slow moving traffic in the wet. If I wanted to sit in a queue I would get a car. At traffic lights I am not going to sit behind anything more than half a dozen cars if there are two lanes and I can get to the front of the queue. Fuck, might as well have a latte and the radio on otherwise.

[Laava]

Referring to yourself in the 3rd person nowadays, Rattus? Shameful..

As for 'Princess Brute-Squad' sure, she's plenty tough - when she gets to deal to people, & abuse/hide behind/power trip - via - her mod privileges.. how typical that such double standards.. appear to be simply, par-for-the-course..

Too funny. "I know you are but what am I"
Bobo has done a JAW in it's nappies...watch this space

[Voltaire]

319038

bahkaaaaah!!


Btw, if JAW continues farting out of his oversized JAWbum, as he is so prone to do here, I'll have to find my box of matches to get rid of the stench.

Why. It is Rant and Rave after all, and its not like Kiwi Biker is a serious bike forum.

[Swoop]

You're having a giraffe, surely? Chilly months up there?
Come up here during winter, then play "spot the bike".

The scooterista's are more plentiful than bikes.

[jonnyk5614]

Letter from the awesomely named "Officer Trigger":

No action will be taken against me.

Sweet :)


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[jonnyk5614]

Finally got a response from insurance (they've been useless and I've had to keep chasing them).

They claimed that the other driver wasn't answering their calls (funny that). I then got a call from AMI but not for my claim but representing him. Puzzled that they didn't realise he was an AMI customer, phoned my claim handler back.

Neither his name not his car is insured with them.

Turns out he got an insured relative to call up with the same last name and try to claim on his behalf.

They aren't happy at all - eventually got through to him and he said "No comment" and hung up.

The annoying thing is that they've changed their minds on my gear and will only cover it through my contents cover.

He is being pursued through tribunal but while we wait for that, I am up for 2x$500 excesses.

Not too impressed but oh well.....


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[Tazz]

The annoying thing is that they've changed their minds on my gear and will only cover it through my contents cover.

He is being pursued through tribunal but while we wait for that, I am up for 2x$500 excesses.

Not too impressed but oh well.....


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Bullshit. Send them a link to Kiwibike insurance website and tell them to get their shit together or you'll be walking after your payout.

As for the other guy, not having to deal with getting money out of him is why you pay for insurance ;)

[eldog]

As for the other guy, not having to deal with getting money out of him is why you pay for insurance ;)

It might feel like forever before shit is resolved and you are sorted - with a decent insurance company it will happen eventually.


And for dealing with other insured and non insured persons is exactly why I have insurance too.

Ya gotta watch out for the sudden 'name change' from the original driver to someone else. A very good lesson.


Had that happen to me when someone ploughed into me (they were in the wrong) - got the drivers name etc.

Nec minuit Mr Plod rocks up with a claim, eh? Mr Plod - oh dear now I am in trouble :crazy:

Took a minute or too before we both realised driver :Oops:and the person Mr Plod was representing were different people.
The drivers name wasn't the same as the one I was given and the details he was supplied there was no passenger(there certainly was that day).
Mr Plod took off and wasn't happy at all - he had been given false info. Never heard from them again. :sunny:

[eldog]

Letter from the awesomely named "Officer Trigger":

Happy? :Punk:

[caspernz]

Happy? :Punk:

As long as his first name isn't Itchy...:wacko:

[eldog]

As long as his first name isn't Itchy...:wacko:

Or Twitchy :whistle: