Bike to get after getting a full licence: Top powered or upgrade gradually?

[ural]

Hi everyone,

I'm getting my full licence in a couple of months and I'm a bit bewildered. I like that awe factor that a bike which is more powerful than your previous one can deliver. While on my learners/restricted I rode a couple of top powered bikes in LAMS category, they were around 50bhp. And that felt like a huge step up from a 250cc. On the other hand I'd love to have as much power as I can get and tame.

So, two options exist: upgrade gradually, e.g., 50bhp->75->100->150->more, if that's not enough? Or get smth that feels like your dream bike straight away, just because you can!

I understand safety concerns.. the question is more around how not to get bored of a bike too quickly and have fun.

I use my bike almost every day to commute. Another thing is that I won't be keeping my bikes for more than a year, more realistically I'm looking at changing my bikes every 6 months. I just want to try as many as I can as I started riding pretty late, so heaps of stuff to discover.

Well... I think that I may have already answered my question while writing this post. Gradually upgrading should be my thing... or not?

Nevertheless, you can share your stories!

- What was your first full powered bike?
- Which bike have you learnt on?
- Have you upgraded gradually?
- Have you ever sold your big-engine bike and returned back to less powered 600-ish? Why?
- Have you tried different types of bikes (sport, tourers, supermotos etc) or you initially got stuck to one type/model?
- Have you found your dream bike already?

[EJK]

If power is what you are after, why settle for less?

Get a busa.

[Swoop]

It all comes down to your personal ability to control your right wrist.

Any bike (getting a bigger one, OR even a smaller one) can bite. It is nice to have sufficient power to get out of situations though.

[5150]

I think any late model Cross-plane R1 or Busa will do to start with. After all, you want to ease in gradually :eek:

[Big Dog]

Inpossible to say without seeing you ride... but I don't see any value to being gradual up to 600cc. Beyond that type of bike will be a bigger factor than cc.

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[Big Dog]

E.g going from a 600cc r6 to a 883 sportster will not get you in add much trouble as going from a 650cc er6f to a 500cc 2 smoke R.

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[baffa]

If you use the bike regularly, and dont view it as a simple crappy appliance, you'll get bored and want to chop and change.
Ride something fun.

My first big boy bike was a fireblade, but I had experience on 600s etc.

Go for something that makes you happy, as long as you feel comfortable.

Falling off your cool looking sports bike because your feet cant touch the ground doesnt make you cool, it makes you an idiot.

Go ride some stuff

[TheDemonLord]

I went from a 250 to a 650 Lams, which I then derestricted to a full power 650, and am now on a 'Busa. The biggest jump was from the 250 to the 650, once you get used to a bigger capacity bike, the transition is easier.

[00quattro00]

1200 bandit

[neels]

I knocked around on an old 250 for a while, then upsized to an oldish 600, now I'm on a 83hp ducati. One of these days I'll go and buy myself a 'full' powered bike <_<

Also, engine hp is not the only thing to consider.....

[EJK]

Jokes aside, if you are considering to replace bikes every 6 months then I guess graduating in terms of cc and riding style would be much more fun.

Honestly tho, if you have tried a 50hp bike then you don't have to be so scared of 100+ ponies bikes. Most of the horsepower don't come alive until over half of the rpm range anyways. Back in the days when learners/ restricted were limited to 250 we were dealing with going from 20hp to 100hp bikes!

Try a nimble vacuum cleaner sound Triumph Street Triple, then something like a high revving Japanese engineered Yamaha R6, then a torquey twin like a sexy Italian Ducati 848 or a power-house Yamaha MT-09... oh what a joy! Too bad I don't have the luxury of replacing bikes so often, so have to stick to just S1000RR.

[OddDuck]

You could have loads of fun going through the steps. There are heaps of great bikes out there at the moment, why not try a few different things and see what works for you?

[Jin]

What kind of bike do you want? If you like the MT07 get an MT09. Same bike just faster. Lots of fun.

[zmlam]

Hi everyone,

I'm getting my full licence in a couple of months and I'm a bit bewildered. I like that awe factor that a bike which is more powerful than your previous one can deliver. While on my learners/restricted I rode a couple of top powered bikes in LAMS category, they were around 50bhp. And that felt like a huge step up from a 250cc. On the other hand I'd love to have as much power as I can get and tame.

So, two options exist: upgrade gradually, e.g., 50bhp->75->100->150->more, if that's not enough? Or get smth that feels like your dream bike straight away, just because you can!

I understand safety concerns.. the question is more around how not to get bored of a bike too quickly and have fun.

I use my bike almost every day to commute. Another thing is that I won't be keeping my bikes for more than a year, more realistically I'm looking at changing my bikes every 6 months. I just want to try as many as I can as I started riding pretty late, so heaps of stuff to discover.

Well... I think that I may have already answered my question while writing this post. Gradually upgrading should be my thing... or not?

Nevertheless, you can share your stories!

- What was your first full powered bike?
- Which bike have you learnt on?
- Have you upgraded gradually?
- Have you ever sold your big-engine bike and returned back to less powered 600-ish? Why?
- Have you tried different types of bikes (sport, tourers, supermotos etc) or you initially got stuck to one type/model?
- Have you found your dream bike already?

- SV1000s
- VTR250
- No
- Sold the bike as I rarely used it, used to do more daily long distance but then change in work meant that I could walk to work instead and found town commuting - big bike wasn't the most practical. If I were to buy a bike for my current needs (mostly town riding) - I'm considering the Honda MX125 - sounds like a blast to ride despite being much smaller in capacity.
- Had a sports bike then a sport/tourer - CB919. Found a big difference in posture, wind protection in both styles.
- No

There's a post here in these forums about going from 250 to thou. Has great points in them (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/71243-Going-from-a-250-to-a-thou-too-much-of-a-jump)

Personally think anything over 600cc's is more than enough for me (I don't do tracks). I too had an awe for big bikes. After owning a few bikes - I found its then what features I preferred - Vtwin, 4 cyclinder, pannier options, 2-up riding friendly, posture, wind protection, looks, do you like riding hard, does it suit my kind of travelling that I do mostly, costs of refilling/tank capacity, etc. Also a trip to cambodia and renting a 125cc scooter and the joy of riding on two wheels really highlighted really why riding was fun without the need of a big engine.

Enjoy your transition(s) and keep safe - lucky that you can afford to change rides every 6 months!

[Gremlin]

Generally speaking, making a large jump is not a smart move. Sure, some handle it, but most don't.

Put at the simplest, the bike can accelerate faster than you can think when you're a learner, and that's mostly where all the issues occur. By taking intermediate steps you can slowly get used to it. On the flip side, plenty that have gone up, come back down as they realise they don't need all the power.

Personally, I went Kwaka ZZR250 to Kwaka ZX7R (big jump and plenty had bets I wouldn't make it) to Kwaka ZX10R (lost my licence) to KTM 990 Supermoto (same capacity but 2/3 of the power) to BMW R1200GSA (about the same power as the KTM).

Biggest thing I learnt is that if you're chasing speed and power, it's like a drug. You'll need more and more to get the same feeling and it mostly ends one way. Badly. You need to get enjoyment from motorcycling in other ways...

[caspernz]

Doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks as to type of bike... Biggest variable is your own discipline, can you deal with having tons of grunt without feeling the need to use it every 9 seconds?

I started on a 250. Have had 400/550/600/750/900/1100 but not in that order, and my current toy is 1340 (Busa). Not in a position to comment on the folly of going from LAMS bike to a full noise one, can work out for you or could kill you. And yep have seen both outcomes.

If you're talking of changing bikes every 6 months, well you'll find what suits you in short order.

[Berries]

It all comes down to your personal ability to control your right wrist.
This.

Too often I did not get the bike I really really wanted because I thought I couldn't handle it but now I realise that was a mistake. Possibly. As long as you are really aware of what can happen when you twist the throttle hard on a decent bike you should be ok. The problem is that that awareness only comes from experience and if you get that experience on certain bikes they can bite you really hard.

You can argue it both ways. If I had gone straight from my KMX125 in the 80's on to an FZR1000 I am pretty sure I would have wrapped it around a tree like a couple of mates did. Part bike, part inexperience, big part youthful exuberance. In the end it probably comes down to how mature you are - it sounds like you are getting on a bit so all you have to deal with is your riding inexperience - don't underestimate that. If you can afford to change your bike every six months then just keep doing that you lucky bastard. It took me nearly 30 years to finally get my original dream bike, the one I thought I would kill myself on. After a fortnight with it I am still here.

The licence is looking pretty fucked mind.

[Big Dog]

Jokes aside, if you are considering to replace bikes every 6 months then I guess graduating in terms of cc and riding style would be much more fun.

Honestly tho, if you have tried a 50hp bike then you don't have to be so scared of 100+ ponies bikes. Most of the horsepower don't come alive until over half of the rpm range anyways. Back in the days when learners/ restricted were limited to 250 we were dealing with going from 20hp to 100hp bikes!

Try a nimble vacuum cleaner sound Triumph Street Triple, then something like a high revving Japanese engineered Yamaha R6, then a torquey twin like a sexy Italian Ducati 848 or a power-house Yamaha MT-09... oh what a joy! Too bad I don't have the luxury of replacing bikes so often, so have to stick to just S1000RR.
So hard done by.

I'll do you a straight swap for "Gordon" then you will have all the excuse in the world to look for a new bike... lol.

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[Erelyes]

- What was your first full powered bike?
- Which bike have you learnt on?
- Have you upgraded gradually?
- Have you ever sold your big-engine bike and returned back to less powered 600-ish? Why?
- Have you tried different types of bikes (sport, tourers, supermotos etc) or you initially got stuck to one type/model?
- Have you found your dream bike already?

I like that you commute, and plan to change bikes annually or thereabouts. That plan may eventually change when you find something you really gel with.

I went, Scorpio > Ninja250 > SV650 > ZX6R, which is as gradual as you'd want. Had each for around 6 months, except the Ninja 250 which was for a year. I plan on keeping the 6R for a while longer mind. Have thought about a thou, but don't think it would give me much extra grin factor (if any) over my current steed. Which is what it's all about really.

That said, my dream bike would probably be a repsol blade of some sort (I just love the look, I'm a sucker for orange).

https://rideapart.com/articles/sportbike-progression is worth a read.

My opinion tho, do it in steps, you will learn more from riding more / different bikes, learn more about bikes overall, and get an idea of what you really like.

[ural]

Thanks guys, appreciate your input.

A couple of comments: I'm 32 and I hope I can control my right wrist. For racing experience I'm planning to do some track-learning-days, but a bit later. I just like the feeling of the power the bike gives you.

I used to own a MT-07 for more than a year, it's a brilliant bike. But sadly had to sell it, now I'm on a ER-4N, which is not that bad actually. The only thing I didn't like in MT-07 was its front suspension - a bit plush, and I'm afraid MT-09 would have the same issue. Can anyone refute that?

About changing a bike every 6-12 months - why would you think one needs a lot of money to do that? On the contrary, I myself find it more expensive to keep a bike for more than one year, as just commuting puts 12000 ks a year on the clock, putting aside joy rides and touring. I do maintain them of course, it's just about the market price, which looks dependent on mileage hugely. Maybe I'm wrong. However, for some tourers/adventure bikes that won't make a lot of difference... You just invest in a bike once and then you sell it and buy another one for around the same price... I'm not talking about brand new bikes here of course, where you loose around two grands by just riding out of the shop.. That's why I'm afraid of finding my dream bike very soon :-)

So, I'll just try different things and will see how it goes..

[pritch]

Save your shekels and get one of these next year.

[Sable]

I went from a 2 stroke 250 to a GB400 to an FZR1000, then a series of 4 cylinder sportbikes. Ended up with a KTM 950, way more fun to ride but still adequate power. Numbers aren't everything.

[rambaldi]

A lot of the posts in this thread (and the one from in 2008, helpfully linked) seem to talk about solo riding on a sports orientated bike. What about the jump up for two up touring with luggage? Is a 600 region bike enough for that? I am an in a little different boat to the OP, I would intend to keep the bike for a few years at least rather than switching in and out all the time.

[pritch]

A lot of the posts in this thread (and the one from in 2008, helpfully linked) seem to talk about solo riding on a sports orientated bike. What about the jump up for two up touring with luggage? Is a 600 region bike enough for that? I am an in a little different boat to the OP, I would intend to keep the bike for a few years at least rather than switching in and out all the time.

You can tour anything, but the further you get from a bike designed to tour the less comfortable you will be. Guys tour 600 sport bikes, I was on a South Island tour with a guy on the older KTM Duke. And he wasn't particularly tall either. Then again he wasn't two up.

A few more cc might offer a better choice, around 650 to 750cc you should be able to find some capable tourers. You're getting into VFR territory there. Just keep an eye on tank range especially if you plan on touring the South Island

[neels]

A lot of the posts in this thread (and the one from in 2008, helpfully linked) seem to talk about solo riding on a sports orientated bike. What about the jump up for two up touring with luggage? Is a 600 region bike enough for that? I am an in a little different boat to the OP, I would intend to keep the bike for a few years at least rather than switching in and out all the time.
I used an old 600 for 2 up touring with luggage for a few years, comfortable enough for me and mrs and sufficient grunt except when riding with people who were solo on litre bikes who opened the tap going from a 50k to 100k zone, no real dramas it just meant they ended up waiting for me at the other end.

[Icemaestro]

I completely agree re changing bikes yearly..I've gone cbx250rs, cbr250rr, spada 250, ninja 250, vfr400, bros 650, cbr600f2, cbr600f3, er6f, bmw f650, vfr400, bros 400, vfr400, srx600, vfr400 :-p. The last three are there still. If the wife would let me I'd still own a cbr600f2/3/4/4i, an er6f, and if finances allowed a Ducati or Guzi with a single swingarm. Oh and a ninja 636. And maybe a buell firebolt. And a gb500.

The cbr600f and the ninja 650 was just fine for touring 2 up, though wife found the cbr600f the most comfy of every bike I've owned. I found it just fine on power - 100hp was plenty




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[Swoop]

Save your shekels and get one of these next year.

I'd hate to think about the sheer quantity of shekels required.:crazy:

[Gremlin]

A lot of the posts in this thread (and the one from in 2008, helpfully linked) seem to talk about solo riding on a sports orientated bike. What about the jump up for two up touring with luggage? Is a 600 region bike enough for that? I am an in a little different boat to the OP, I would intend to keep the bike for a few years at least rather than switching in and out all the time.
If you thought big bikes chew tyres, wait till you load them up with luggage and another person... You can just about see the tread disappear every day :weep:

I'd also suggest gaining experience in big bikes and pillions separately.

[Banditbandit]

Ride what you are comfortable with - I have seen people go straight to a fire breathing monster - and then they are scared of it and never learn to ride it properly ....

So physical comfort is important - so is mental comfort - you wont enjoy a bike that scares the shit out of you ..

(I love my big bandit but it can still scare the shit out of me occassionally - and I've been riding for more than 40 years)

[Rych]

I went from a first bike ZXR250 (zx2r) which is already 45hp, not the same as your modern 250's, to an 06 Yamaha R6 and that was pretty frightening, but I never had any problems, was still easy enough to just cruise around on seen as the power band was so high in the rpm.

I then went 08 CBR600RR now on a 10 Street Triple R, I've taken my time but I will eventually get a thou, I really like the new CBR1000RR's so will probably go down that road in a year or two.

I personally think 250 > 600 > 1000 is an easier way to get used to the extra hp that is going to come.

[5150]

I went from a first bike ZXR250 (zx2r) which is already 45hp, not the same as your modern 250's, to an 06 Yamaha R6 and that was pretty frightening, but I never had any problems, was still easy enough to just cruise around on seen as the power band was so high in the rpm.

I then went 08 CBR600RR now on a 10 Street Triple R, I've taken my time but I will eventually get a thou, I really like the new CBR1000RR's so will probably go down that road in a year or two.

I personally think 250 > 600 > 1000 is an easier way to get used to the extra hp that is going to come.

Meeh, Go all out you pussy..... :innocent:

[Rych]

Meeh, Go all out you pussy..... :innocent:

You're right. :weep:

[5150]

You're right. :weep:

As my daddy told me..... Better to be dead and cool, then alive and uncool :cool:

[rastuscat]

As my daddy told me..... Better to be dead and cool, then alive and uncool :cool:

Whose funeral were those words spoken at?

[bbnet]

I think the 'excitement' factor is more relative to the bike than it is to gross power, e.g. ripping up to 55mph on a hopped up moped with limited power, brakes, & suspension is just as exciting as ripping up to 150mph on an R6. Sure a new more powerful ride is more exciting when it is beyond your skill level but once your skills catch up it too can become boring if that type of anxiety is what you're after. I always ride safely within my limits, whether thats just cruisin many miles or doing wheelies past a cop around a corner in the rain (sorry johhny, i didn't see you, thanks for the warning though), but most importantly just enjoy the ride.

[mitchilin]

Ideal mid range bike. Plenty of traction. No handling problems. Perfect.

[avimistry]

You've probably long made a decision and upgraded, but I'll post my thoughts for anyone in a similar dilemma. Btw, would be good to know what you decided on?

So on to my 2c..

It's all about learning, upgrading your skill, one step at a time (well for me anyway). Sure you can jump on a 150+ hp monster, but how quickly would you be scared out of your skin? And then there's the room-for-error that a less experienced rider will always need more of. Now I'm a noob myself and haven't ridden anything bigger than LAMS bikes, but I've watched and read and heard enough to know that crawling before you run is just as valid with motorcycle riding. And from what I've learned, there's two vital specifications of a BEEG bike that may inhibit a noob from becoming a refined pro, and that's weight and torque. Sure there are LAMS bikes that weigh almost as much (if not more) than some top tier sportbikes (I'm using this term loosely here for 150+ hp beasts), but the LAMS bikes are designed and fitted with parts that make the whole package more forgiving and easier to handle. On the other hand, a 1000cc+ sportbike is very specific in its' nature and all the components are designed in that way. As for torque, this is what catches most noobs by surprise. And that's simply because there's a lot of it and from very early in the rpm range. Just imagine grabbing a tad too much throttle when coming out of a turn... goodbye rear end. Whereas if you were on a say 600cc bike with a lot less low-midrange torque, a lil extra gas will probably not cause any wheel spin.

But that's just how I see it. At the end of the day it's your hard earnings, and what your goals as a rider are. Only riding to the cafe for a cuppa and catchup, then why not look cool doing so and get whatever your heart desires. If you wanna do the cafe, and also become a better, faster, safer rider, then take the baby steps in both your skill and bike upgrades. Besides, how exciting is it to make that upgrade when the time comes, and to be able to ride different bikes...

Whatever you decide, just be safe out there!

[MrMarko]

I actually prefer more rather than less low down torque as by having more low down torque a bike can feel not so heavy in low speed cornering and when taking off. While I felt like I was going to wheelstand on the first high torque bike I bought it was only on the way home from the shop and I found the torque to my liking overall. I am not a fan of sportsbikes due to the lowered riding position and for a new rider would recommend an adventure bike as they are lighter in the handling than a sports bike and have good low down torque. The only negative about them is that many can be too tall to sit on for shorter riders.

Paging Dr. Virago

[HenryDorsetCase]

You need a BMW S1000RR don't be a fucking little girls blouse.

A ZX10R is an acceptable substitute.