Cage infringements vs bike infringements? Fair?

[SuperRetard]

So was riding with a mate a couple of months ago. Country road, perfectly straight, clear sunny day, no traffic at all, both on Road Legal dirt bikes, doing about 30kph on a 100kph area. Mate pulled a beautiful wheelie, was on back wheel for a good 5 minutes when PC-Plod pulls into a side intersection and of course on come lights....

Pulled over, took the telling off, cop admitted the bike was under total control at all times, on an empty, straight country road with no traffic. No fear of hurting anyone but himself, but still not OK by PC-Plod

Mate gets done for careless riding, Court cost, lawyer costs, Loss of license, and all kinds of pain.


Dick at work, just got busted doing 95kph in a 50kph (middle of town) area in the company vehicle. Cos it was on a speed camera, looks like a fine and walk away for him.....! FFS

Mate was pissed off of course, but just took what was coming to him. But really this seems a bit out of whack... (to me anyway).

[onearmedbandit]

If 'Dick' at work had been caught by a police officer it would've been instant loss of license, vehicle impounded, court costs, lawyer costs etc etc. If your mate had done the wheelie past a speed camera nothing would've happened. The type of vehicle had nothing to do with it.

[leathel]

if the car was doing more than 40km over the speed limit and was caught by a cop he would be walking, instant loss of license for 28 days

not sure what the deal is with camera tickets

[Banditbandit]

if the car was doing more than 40km over the speed limit and was caught by a cop he would be walking, instant loss of license for 28 days

not sure what the deal is with camera tickets

The deal with speed cameras is that they hunt you down and kill you.

But seriously ... once the cops see the speed on the photo they will come knocking. They will be looking to prosecute the rider - and if the registered owner does not tell them who the rider was they will prosecute the owner on the assumption it was them ... ('course the driver can just admit it .. usually easy to see in a speed cam pick of a car.)

It's absolute proof of more than 40ks over the limit .. the driver can expect to lose their licence.

There is unlikely to be a 28-day instant suspension, but I would expect a charge of either dangerous driving or wreckless driving, followed by a suspension.

[Akzle]

i'd be arguing that it was not careless.

:laugh: lawyerjews

[Maha]

Raj is that you?

[EJK]

Raj is that you?

I was thinking Morcs (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/member.php/7450-Morcs)..

[FlangMasterJ]

Don't do wheelies on the road.

[Voltaire]

i'd be arguing that it was not careless.

:laugh: lawyerjews

That would be entertaining, pulling a wheelie on your invisible bike.
:laugh: nonbikeridingjooz

[Maha]

I was thinking Morcs (http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/member.php/7450-Morcs)..

Pete would own it whereas Raj would look to blame someone else.

[Crasherfromwayback]

i'd be arguing that it was not careless.

:laugh: lawyerjews

You won't get off that one. Trust me... :innocent:

[willytheekid]

Why did your mate stop?? :confused:


...revenue, that's all they want mate...nothing about "roadsafety" anymore, just want your wallet...and your unwaving obedience!!


Wheelies...a part of motorcycling since there invention!, Now, just another reason to stop and harass you for money!


...such a sad PC bubble wrap world now

[Gremlin]

Why did your mate stop?? :confused:
coz he was doing 30kph silly!

Careless is often used as a catch all. Don't know what it is (ie, do we have a no wheelies law?), then the acid test is, would a normal driver, behaving prudently, do that? No? Righto, off to careless. Careless doesn't have a mandatory minimum disqualification period. You don't have to have a lawyer either.

As already said, it's camera vs cop (not sure whether they do follow up pictures if 40+ over?)

[Akzle]

You won't get off that one. Trust me... :innocent:

you'd be surprised what i get off...

(first one to make farm animal reference can have my autograph. (signed on their chest with a nailgun))

[Crasherfromwayback]

you'd be surprised what i get off...


I've got off quite a few charges over the years too, because, it obviously wasn't me officer. But wheelies are "Careless use", as you're using a motor vehicle, in a manor which a normal prudent road user wouldn't. Or something like that...:innocent:

[Voltaire]

you'd be surprised what i get off...

(first one to make farm animal reference can have my autograph. (signed on their chest with a nailgun))

...a motorcycle :scooter:

[TheDemonLord]

you'd be surprised what i get off...

(first one to make farm animal reference can have my autograph. (signed on their chest with a nailgun))

No, we really wouldn't be surprised.

(hah! implied farm animal reference but with the added humiliation that we expect it)

[rambaldi]

I've got off quite a few charges over the years too, because, it obviously wasn't me officer. But wheelies are "Careless use", as you're using a motor vehicle, in a manor which a normal prudent road user wouldn't. Or something like that...:innocent:

So what you are saying is we should all wheelie so it becomes what a normal prudent road user would do?

[skippa1]

you'd be surprised what i get off...

(first one to make farm animal reference can have my autograph. (signed on their chest with a nailgun))
Is a gerbil a farm animal?

[jim.cox]

Fair?

Just why do you think life should be fair?

It patently and obviously isn't - never was and never will be.

You've been reading Rousseau again, haven't you?

[Crasherfromwayback]

So what you are saying is we should all wheelie so it becomes what a normal prudent road user would do?

I like you're thinking.

[Moi]

Is a gerbil a farm animal?

Only if you're a gerbil farmer...

otherwise it's an entree... :sick:

[babysteps]

Dick at work, just got busted doing 95kph in a 50kph (middle of town) area in the company vehicle. .

That is enough for Instant Dismissal for gross misconduct. The company I work for has just dismissed someone for exactly the same thing......

[jellywrestler]

So was riding with a mate a couple of months ago. Country road, perfectly straight, clear sunny day, no traffic at all, both on Road Legal dirt bikes, doing about 30kph on a 100kph area. Mate pulled a beautiful wheelie, was on back wheel for a good 5 minutes when PC-Plod pulls into a side intersection and of course on come lights....

Pulled over, took the telling off, cop admitted the bike was under total control at all times, on an empty, straight country road with no traffic. No fear of hurting anyone but himself, but still not OK by PC-Plod

Mate gets done for careless riding, Court cost, lawyer costs, Loss of license, and all kinds of pain.


Dick at work, just got busted doing 95kph in a 50kph (middle of town) area in the company vehicle. Cos it was on a speed camera, looks like a fine and walk away for him.....! FFS

Mate was pissed off of course, but just took what was coming to him. But really this seems a bit out of whack... (to me anyway).
you must have two cocks, no-one can get that silly tugging on just one of them

[jasonu]

beautiful wheelie, was on back wheel for a good 5 minutes

.

Yeah right...:rolleyes:

[jasonu]

you'd be surprised what i get off...

(first one to make farm animal reference can have my autograph. (signed on their chest with a nailgun))

Goat fucker...:niceone:

[old slider]

you must have two cocks, no-one can get that silly tugging on just one of them

bwahaha , have not heard that saying since Wanganui had a Railways workshop.

[Virago]

So was riding with a mate a couple of months ago. Country road, perfectly straight, clear sunny day, no traffic at all, both on Road Legal dirt bikes, doing about 30kph on a 100kph area. Mate pulled a beautiful wheelie, was on back wheel for a good 5 minutes when PC-Plod pulls into a side intersection and of course on come lights....

Pulled over, took the telling off, cop admitted the bike was under total control at all times, on an empty, straight country road with no traffic. No fear of hurting anyone but himself, but still not OK by PC-Plod

Mate gets done for careless riding, Court cost, lawyer costs, Loss of license, and all kinds of pain.


Dick at work, just got busted doing 95kph in a 50kph (middle of town) area in the company vehicle. Cos it was on a speed camera, looks like a fine and walk away for him.....! FFS

Mate was pissed off of course, but just took what was coming to him. But really this seems a bit out of whack... (to me anyway).

You're comparing apples with oranges.

As has been pointed out trying reversing the scenarios. If your mate had wheelied past a speed camera, there would be no consequence. Meanwhile if your workmate had done that +45k speed past a cop, he'd be walking.

It has nothing to do with car vs bike. Get over it.

[Akzle]

No, we really wouldn't be surprised.

(hah! implied farm animal reference but with the added humiliation that we expect it)

humiliation? not at all (and coming from THIS crowd, i don't even think it's possible). just pre empting the predictable horseshit from the drones.

i don't think you've grasped how troll level 9000 works.

[skippa1]

you must have two cocks, no-one can get that silly tugging on just one of them
Lols......havent heard that for a while, green rep

[AllanB]

I did a wheelie once.

[RGVforme]

Don't do wheelies on the road.

X1

Well you can just not in front of the cops..

[Swoop]

If your mate had wheelied past a speed camera, there would be no consequence.

Correct.
How is the camera going to read the plate?

[Laava]

I got a ticket last week for doing 105 on my trailer in a 100 zone. $80, I just kinda laughed with the missus. She wasn't laughing when this week as a result of speeding on my trailer last week, they sent me a fine for no WOF on my trailer. $600! They will waive it etc etc...

[Berries]

I wheelied on the road today.


Sorry.

[EJK]

I wheelied on the road today.


Sorry.

Naughty boy! Go back to your room! You are grounded, no cookies! :spanking:

[rambaldi]

I got a ticket last week for doing 105 on my trailer in a 100 zone. $80, I just kinda laughed with the missus. She wasn't laughing when this week as a result of speeding on my trailer last week, they sent me a fine for no WOF on my trailer. $600! They will waive it etc etc...

The limit for driving with a trailer is 90 km/h for light vehicles (all cars etc.) it was changed up a few years ago I believe (maybe 5, either that or some other period time ago). Many people do not seem to be aware of the reduced speed limit.

[Gremlin]

The limit for driving with a trailer is 90 km/h for light vehicles (all cars etc.) it was changed up a few years ago I believe (maybe 5, either that or some other period time ago). Many people do not seem to be aware of the reduced speed limit.
There isn't too much excuse as the old limit for cars with trailers was 80, now 90.

[Akzle]

The limit for driving with a trailer is 90 km/h for light vehicles (all cars etc.) it was changed up a few years ago I believe (maybe 5, either that or some other period time ago). Many people do not seem to be aware of the reduced speed limit.


There isn't too much excuse as the old limit for cars with trailers was 80, now 90.

yup, lowered the limit for scooters 80 ->70 increased trailers 80 -> 90.

always laugh when i see trucks with "speed limited to 90" signs on, and i'm following at 115...

[GrayWolf]

Other side of this coin....
we have a group at work that go on rides, last long weekend with the 4km limit.. overtaking a couple of cars and.. yup copper sitting on the straight into Featherston from the 'taka's.. one rider clocked at 140+ they still let him ride it home rather than instant removal on the spot...

There are some reasonable PC's out there,,,,, I suspect a lot is to do with 'YOUR' attitude at the time of the infringement.

[pritch]

I suspect a lot is to do with 'YOUR' attitude at the time of the infringement.

Aaah yes, "the attitude test". SD, Patrick and others have mentioned that in the past. Still, sometimes it may not be your attitude that's the problem.
Then again, if you wannabe a smart arse you can, but there will likely be a price.

[R650R]

Your mate at work might still be in for a court appearance yet.... soon as he pasy that fine he has legally declared he was the driver at time (by signing the ticket when he pays it....
And as it is more than 40km/h over the posted limit he is wide open to a careless charge at least or dangerous speed charge.
Just depends on how busy local prosecutor is and if they can be bothered.
A local chap here got taken to court for speed camera ticket at 190 on his ducati.... he was walking for awhile...

Whast really not fair is soon you wont get a ticker I mean certificate of acheivment to pin up on the fridge.
We have letter from police on our work noticeboard today telling company to make sure its email contacts are up to date as 'transactions' (yes that's what they called them) will now be instantly emailed to employer when offence entered into their police app thingy and all (well truck anyway) infringements will be paperless from now....

Wonder if a good lawyer will get anyone off under the old contract law, eg no physical notice served.....

[Erelyes]

I got a ticket last week for doing 105 on my trailer in a 100 zone. $80, I just kinda laughed with the missus. She wasn't laughing when this week as a result of speeding on my trailer last week, they sent me a fine for no WOF on my trailer. $600! They will waive it etc etc...

$600 for a trailer? If it was genuinely $600 isn't that a 'No COF' fine (not a 'no WOF')?

[Akzle]

Wonder if a good lawyer will get anyone off under the old contract law, eg no physical notice served.....

nope they've re-legislated. a person can be served notice by email.

of course, all legislature is a contract... entirely voluntary. silly cunts.

[RGVforme]

Your mate at work might still be in for a court appearance yet.... soon as he pasy that fine he has legally declared he was the driver at time (by signing the ticket when he pays it....
And as it is more than 40km/h over the posted limit he is wide open to a careless charge at least or dangerous speed charge.
Just depends on how busy local prosecutor is and if they can be bothered.
A local chap here got taken to court for speed camera ticket at 190 on his ducati.... he was walking for awhile...

Whast really not fair is soon you wont get a ticker I mean certificate of acheivment to pin up on the fridge.
We have letter from police on our work noticeboard today telling company to make sure its email contacts are up to date as 'transactions' (yes that's what they called them) will now be instantly emailed to employer when offence entered into their police app thingy and all (well truck anyway) infringements will be paperless from now....

Wonder if a good lawyer will get anyone off under the old contract law, eg no physical notice served.....

Dylan Roberts......199kmh Taupo road by Eskdale...Camera Van.
Bike was way faster than he was.

Said he was 'Test riding' and only went up the road once.
6 months disqual and a $400 fine.
Judge said he was the only bike on the road at the time.

He's still a semi retarded muppet.:wacko:

[Jin]

This thread reminds me I really need to move the plate and put under the tail out of sight

[rastuscat]

The attitude test works both ways.

Some cops have awful attitudes.

Some drivers have awful attitudes.

If the two coincide, discretion is ruled out. In fact, if either happens, warnings are most unlikely.

[Morcs]

Pete would own it whereas Raj would look to blame someone else.

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

I probably would notice the cop until id committed three other offenses though. Thats happened before.

[Maha]

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

I probably would notice the cop until id committed three other offenses though. Thats happened before.

R6Kid was good for that also.

[TheDemonLord]

The attitude test works both ways.

Some cops have awful attitudes.

Some drivers have awful attitudes.

If the two coincide, discretion is ruled out. In fact, if either happens, warnings are most unlikely.

The problem is that I can't give a Cop a ticket when they fail the Attitude test...

[rastuscat]

The problem is that I can't give a Cop a ticket when they fail the Attitude test...

Sure you can.

Give up whatever you do now. Go to the Police college for 6 months.

Get to do shitty jobs for most of your first 2 years, and you can write tickets for anyone who breaks the law.

Generally when you are having a conversation with a cop, it's due to you having broken the rules.

Of course, now I expect a chorus of responses from all the innocent people who have been accused of breaking the rules.

Never mind the fact that often, someone breaks the rules (e.g. speed) a thousand times for each time they get caught, then squeal like a girl for the one time about the injustice of it all.

Whew, how's that for a vent.

[russd7]

Sure you can.

Give up whatever you do now. Go to the Police college for 6 months.

Get to do shitty jobs for most of your first 2 years, and you can write tickets for anyone who breaks the law.

Generally when you are having a conversation with a cop, it's due to you having broken the rules.

Of course, now I expect a chorus of responses from all the innocent people who have been accused of breaking the rules.

Never mind the fact that often, someone breaks the rules (e.g. speed) a thousand times for each time they get caught, then squeal like a girl for the one time about the injustice of it all.

Whew, how's that for a vent.


honestly, the only times i have ever ridden or driven over the posted speed limit are the few times i have been ticketed for it. thats the honest to goodness truth :whistle:

[Akzle]

The problem is that I can't give a Cop a ticket when they fail the Attitude test...

like fuck you can't. and it's hilarious as shit.

anyone can serve anyone notice of anything.

[rastuscat]

like fuck you can't. and it's hilarious as shit.

anyone can serve anyone notice of anything.

I hereby serve you with notice that you are an amusing poster.

[jim.cox]

I hereby serve you with notice that you are an amusing poster.

That's "POSEUR" Rastus, "POSEUR"

[caspernz]

I hereby serve you with notice that you are an amusing poster.


That's "POSEUR" Rastus, "POSEUR"

Strange spelling for the word I'm thinking of...

[Akzle]

and an unrebutted notice has standing at law:


I hereby serve you with notice that you are an amusing poster.

i think email service has been allowed, not too sure about KB service...

[Erelyes]

like fuck you can't. and it's hilarious as shit.

It is indeed hilarious to serve crackpot notices for this that and the other. Of course, to whom it is hilarious is a rather limited subset.

I heard about one where you put a note on the windscreen saying 'anyone serving any notice on this vehicle hereby owes the owner $1000' or something like that. While these notices may be hilarious, their effectiveness seems a bit lacking.


i think email service has been allowed, not too sure about KB service...

You think? Aw gummon, I thought you were an eggspurt in these things.

[TheDemonLord]

Sure you can.

Give up whatever you do now. Go to the Police college for 6 months.

Get to do shitty jobs for most of your first 2 years, and you can write tickets for anyone who breaks the law.

Generally when you are having a conversation with a cop, it's due to you having broken the rules.

Of course, now I expect a chorus of responses from all the innocent people who have been accused of breaking the rules.

Never mind the fact that often, someone breaks the rules (e.g. speed) a thousand times for each time they get caught, then squeal like a girl for the one time about the injustice of it all.

Whew, how's that for a vent.

It's pretty average - here is another Vent:

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c8/91/d5/c891d56b5e58ded39f6e3692df47b23d.jpg

but yes, even in your scenario - I wouldn't be able to write a cop a ticket for having a shitty attitude.

[Akzle]

but yes, even in your scenario - I wouldn't be able to write a cop a ticket for having a shitty attitude.
no. but it's not illegal to have a shitty attitude. whatever you got pulled over for probably is.

anyway. it's just a notice of infringement. it doesn't actually compel you to do anything...

It is indeed hilarious to serve crackpot notices for this that and the other. Of course, to whom it is hilarious is a rather limited subset.

I heard about one where you put a note on the windscreen saying 'anyone serving any notice on this vehicle hereby owes the owner $1000' or something like that. While these notices may be hilarious, their effectiveness seems a bit lacking.

yes and no. i use mine to invalidate anything they do to me. I do have a fee schedule (hand THAT to them roadside and watch their eyebrows.. they get autistic really quick)
breach of a default judgement is illegal as, and i've yet to meet the cop willing to argue it, even in their own courts!

[TheDemonLord]

no. but it's not illegal to have a shitty attitude. whatever you got pulled over for probably is.

anyway. it's just a notice of infringement. it doesn't actually compel you to do anything...

Of course it isn't illegal to have a shitty attitude, but a shitty attitude leads a grumpy cop to nitpick everything they can and where there is a judgement call (is it 1.55 mm or 1.6 mm on the tread depth) they err on the side of writing a ticket, with the knowledge that you are

a) unlikely to fight it
and
b) even if you do, the judge is unlikely to rule in your favor, and will probably slap on an additional fine for good measure.

[Akzle]

with the knowledge that you are

a) unlikely to fight it
that helps their cause immensely

and
b) even if you do, the judge is unlikely to rule in your favor, and will probably slap on an additional fine for good measure.
no. the judge is only authorised to rule on the matter as pertaining to legislature.

also, the cops usually don't even bother going to court. which is where the fee schedule comes into it's own, in that they're then obliged to pay your time. which comes back to the first thing you should say to them: nut up or fuck up.

[Banditbandit]

nut up or fuck up.



A woman got pulled over for speeding by a New Zealand Police motorcycle officer. When he walked up to her window and opened his ticket book she said, "I bet you're going to sell me tickets to the Policeman's Ball."

He replied, "No, Ma'am, New Zealand Police don't have balls."

There followed a moment of silence while she smiled. Without saying another word, he closed his book, got back on his motorcycle and left.