Blind idiots in cages [Archive]

riffer

3rd February 2004, 09:52

Hey all. I've had two near incidents yesterday which have prompted me to think about how I ride and what I can do to prevent accidents on my bike.

Both were due to not being "seen" by cars on my way home; however both were different situations.

Situation 1:

Just past Haywards Hill turnoff going north on SH2. I was in the right hand lane just going past a late model Falcon Station wagon. Just as I got alongside the Falcon he indicated and came straight into my lane. Conditions at time - overcast but no rain, no other cars within 100m. Both vehicles doing 95-105km/h.

Situation 2:
Pulled off SH2 at Whakatiki St, going through esses next to Mitre 10, and see a Mitsubishi Galant stopped at the side of the road facing me, indicating to pull into the battery shop on my side of the road. Look the driver straight in the eye as I come through the esses and when I am approx 50m from him he turns straight into my path. Hang on the anchors and just squeeze past him on my left hand side (maybe six inch gap either side).

Now the 1st situation I can understand I probably was in the guys blind spot as I came up towards him so can accept that - He saw me as when he moved across he did the old "lifesaver look" - lucky for me.

But the 2nd situation I am at a loss to explain. The driver could see me coming for nearly 150m and looked me straight in the eye as he turned. I was doing maybe 60km/h so I'm unsure if he underestimated my speed.

Has anyone else encountered drivers who look you straight in the eye and then turn right in front of you?

FWIW, I had my lights and indicator on at the time - low beam, both lights.

I wear Black Cordura jacket and pants with reflective material (no good in the day but), and a silver helmet with blue white and black flashes on it.

What can I do to make myself seen more, or should I accept that some people are just blind idiots and I should assume they will not see me, even if we are looking at each other in the eyes?

Slim

3rd February 2004, 10:14

Blah, blah, blah, etc....

What can I do to make myself seen more, or should I accept that some people are just blind idiots and I should assume they will not see me, even if we are looking at each other in the eyes?
You got it in one. SMIDSY is the norm when you're on a bike & you should ride accordingly. :buggerd:

I probably would have considered stopping & having a wee chat with Situation #2 to find out exactly what was going on in his/her head - removing helmet & speaking calmly, of course.

Ms Piggy

3rd February 2004, 10:16

What can I do to make myself seen more, or should I accept that some people are just blind idiots and I should assume they will not see me, even if we are looking at each other in the eyes?

Being a learner rider I have discovered much to my horror that a lot of cage drivers don't really consider motorbikes as "proper" traffic. I guess it's just a matter of riding defensively at all times...which I'm sure you do :mellow:

duckman

3rd February 2004, 10:24

Make your bike as loud as possible !!! Get crazy loud pipes and install an airhorn - If you ever think a car hasn't seen you give it a blast on the horn as a warning. :Oi:

Apart from that - it's just a case of driving as defensivly as possible. :ride:

Slingshot

3rd February 2004, 10:25

I was reversed into on Friday after work, I was waiting in traffic and the guy in front of me decided to reverse and then go into the Harvey Norman car park. I was in line with his right tyres and I managed to lean the bike over far enough and didn't actually come off, he did end up with a big scratch down him car from my clutch lever...Haha.

My wife was very close to getting hit last week as well, I was following her, we were in the left lane when a guy in the right lane decided to pull into a servo on the left, there were literally inches between the car and her bike.

I hate that startled look drivers give you when they finally see you. :mad:

I don't know that these's much more we can do to be seen (other than the obvious stuff), but if we ride with the mindset that other drivers won't see us then we should be a little safer

MikeL

3rd February 2004, 10:26

I know that bikers are invisible and I try to remember that and allow for it. But sometimes people's behaviour is just unaccountable, like your #2. I seem to specialize in the near miss with the enter-the-roundabout-staring-straight-ahead species of driver who doesn't see me because he doesn't look. Perhaps this species has got into the habit of relying on peripheral vision and they only react if a large mass approaches. A more likely explanation is that they got their licence off a cereal packet and are blissfully unaware of the give way rules. I would like to think that Darwinism will eventually ensure the extinction of the species but I'm not sure it will happen in my lifetime...

Angry Puppy

3rd February 2004, 12:48

I know a guy who had twin 100 watt halogens on his bike and people still managed to pull out in front of him. admittedly, they were squinting when they pulled out!

It's not so much about being seen, (or heard) as perception of risk. Cagers don't see bikes as a thread therefore their subconcious blocks us out. According to an article in Ride magazine anyway. To proove this point, some guy stuck a couple of lights on the ends of his bars to make the bike look bigger and it made a noticalbe difference.

Mike - in this instance Darwin's theory of evolution is not so much 'suvival of the fittest' as 'suvival of the guy with the most mild steel'!

Slim

3rd February 2004, 12:55

I would like to think that Darwinism will eventually ensure the extinction of the species but I'm not sure it will happen in my lifetime...
Considering the fact that they seem to breed at a rate worse than rabbits, I'd have to agree that it's not going to happen in our lifetime. :buggerd:

fpsware

3rd February 2004, 15:24

This afternoon I was riding riding into town (Te Puke) and about 100mtrs away there was van stopped on the right hand side at an intersection (stop sign). There was no traffic ahead of me, and there was no traffic behind me. I got to about 10 mtrs (give or take) and the idiot just decided to pull out right in front of me! It wasn't until he crossed the centerline that he saw me and swerved into the right hand lane. He must have missed me by no more than a foot at most.

I ride with my lights on full beam druing the day. I have a black jacket with reflective stripes on it. My bike is a very bright nice metalic burgandy. Strangely enough I have been thinking about getting a fluro vest just to be more visible, but the thing is I honestly don't think it is going to help that much.

SPman

3rd February 2004, 16:41

:Offtopic:

"Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer."
Or in my case - the Video!

:done:
Keith Code sums it up well in this article - Presence

I ride like I own the road and other traffic knows it. The only time I have trouble, is if I'm being timid......well....its worked for me for 30+ years

DEATH_INC.

3rd February 2004, 16:50

Has anyone else encountered drivers who look you straight in the eye and then turn right in front of you?

Yep,two of them....the first I T-boned when he pulled in front of me then STOPPED :eek5: in the middle of my lane :shit:
The second I dumped the bike trying to stop/avoid a repeat of 1 when she did the same thing :angry2:
Then both denied even seeing me to the cops......

wkid_one

3rd February 2004, 16:52

I agree whole heartedly and I believe if you have driven a car before riding a bike you tend to think like a car driver when in traffic and put your bike in the position a car would expect you to be. This is largely what is comes down to - expectation.

As a bike is quick, nimble, and small - it can often be in places car drivers don't expect you to be. Also - we can put ourselves in positions where we shouldn't be also.

Expecting a car driver to see you when you are closing on him at warp factor nine, just whipping across three lanes from the on ramp is ludicrous.

At the end of the day - if you are going to drive amongst cars - think like a car driver, will save you arse.

Next time a car driver cuts your off et all - cast a little thought as to whether what you were doing at the time was right. I have done this and been in the wrong.

No point slagging car drivers - at the end of the day they are there to stay - learn to live with them........

Also - many of the situations you have described have happened to me in MY CAR as well - no limiting them to motorbikes.

wkid_one

3rd February 2004, 16:54

Yep,two of them....the first I T-boned when he pulled in front of me then STOPPED :eek5: in the middle of my lane :shit:
The second I dumped the bike trying to stop/avoid a repeat of 1 when she did the same thing :angry2:
Then both denied even seeing me to the cops...... I am sorry - but this to me is poor riding. You should have identified the hazard and taken appropriate action - especially if it happened twice.

As Keith Code says - identify the hazard, plan you escape.

wkid_one

3rd February 2004, 16:55

I ride with my lights on full beam druing the day. This isn't a good idea - as riding with your lights on full makes it incredibly hard for someone to judge your speed when coming straight at someone.

Not viewing bike riders as the threat??? Come on - who wants to have an accident???

Seems a little of the us against them mentality here.

Lou Girardin

3rd February 2004, 16:58

Being a learner rider I have discovered much to my horror that a lot of cage drivers don't really consider motorbikes as "proper" traffic.
When I was in the MOT; a woman, who nearly had me off when she turned in front of my patrol bike, said that she didn't have to give way to motorbikes!
They're all out there!
Lou

marty

3rd February 2004, 19:32

how many times have you heard 'i looked and there was nothing coming'? well there was something coming my friend, and it just t-boned you. i saw a crash in cambridge a few years ago where a lady pulled straight out into the side of a cattle truck as it was going past her intersection. she had stopped at the stop sign too! she just went through the motions of looking, but not seeing (a bit like hearing but not listening i guess)

wari

3rd February 2004, 19:47

One time while i was riding along minding my own business ...

I inadvertantly fell into a time portal and was transported in front of a car pulling out of a driveway ... and I SUDDENLY appeared in front of her so she ran me over :eyepoke:

digsaw

3rd February 2004, 20:18

:Oi: umm cages?after 45 years on bikes,the only run in with a cage was one that was stopped! parked! nobody in sight! :sick: my own bloody fault :o I have allways made myself invisable to cages,i dont want them to see me so they can change their minds,or give them the chance to be in command of the situation,treat every one of them as a total idiot and have an escape hole or two up your sleave :Punk:

James Deuce

3rd February 2004, 20:52

Fazerbloke has it. It is simply a threat/survival reflex we all have that stops us challenging things we KNOW will hurt us.

KNOW in this case = BIGGER.

Little do car drivers understand that if they hit us just right we WILL kill them or their passenger(s). F=ma. An 80kg rider will hurt like hell when he hits you through the windscreen at a velocity differential of say 50km/h. His helmet will cave your head in. If the bike enters the passenger cabin NO-ONE is getting out without at least a life changing injury.

However every car driver (inc.me) feels secure with the windows up, a/c on, and stereo blasting, so when your brain is slightly preoccupied it reverts to instinctive reflex to prevent you being injured. But because your brain is conditioned to think of your car as "safe", you'll just pull out in front of the widdle motorbike if you don't actively analyse the image being sent to your brain.

Inattention and lack of concentration should earn the buggers a careless misuse. Especially if your car driver insists that he/she didn't see you. I would've thought admitting criminal negligence would count against you.

I wonder if I could smack the next irritating rude customer in the mouth and claim I didn't see them??? Might be worth a try.

Goddess of Goof

3rd February 2004, 21:09

"Do not meddle in the affairs of cats, for they are subtle and will piss on your computer."
Or in my case - the Video!
And in my case, the bloody vacuum cleaner.
It still pongs, long afta the damn cat has gone to that
Big Mousehole In The Sky.....:done:

Keith Code sums it up well in this article - Presence

I got backed into at a Service Station in Matakana cos an old guy didn't see me, and he'd supposed that I had left the forecourt.
I think Presence is really important, and try to put it into practice.

Trouble is, riding with the knowledge that they are not going to see you is a drag.
At times, I simply wobble the bike so that their attention is drawn to a moving object (my headlights) and maybe the synapses will connect,
I never trust it tho'..........

:eek5:

Jackrat

3rd February 2004, 21:31

Hmmmm,The ones who freak me out the most are the ones looking at me.
I can almost see their little brains mulling over the odds.
When I do catch their eye I will often change position in the lane by quite a bit so as to make them think twice.
Then we get the ones that have been siting looking the other way the whole time you are approaching,Mate their even worse,I always imagine they have looked my way before I came into view and are now just waiting to hit the gas when the other way is clear.And then ya' get the one that you think will and he bloody does :eek5:
I think after a while you develope a sixth sence for these clowns,Well most of em'.I treat all cars as about to do something dumb,Ya just got to watch em' like a hawk at all times.I would rather come across a cow on a back road than one in a Pajero at an intersection.
I did notice on the way back from town today,a big sign saying "Watch out for bikes" has been put up on the pukekohe off ramp.Thats something I suppose.

James Deuce

3rd February 2004, 21:54

I would rather come across a cow on a back road than one in a Pajero at an intersection.

Baahahaa - Can I nick that for my signature please Jackrat?

discodan

3rd February 2004, 22:16

I have noticed that when I'm in the car with sombody else driving they tend to look about 10 metres ahead of them and I cringe when I spot a hazard that they dont spot untill its time to throw out the anchors. Cage drivers are just inferior to us in terms of hazard identification I think. I dont often have close calls anymore now that I have seen almost every trick in the book.
Also they say that loud pipes dont really save lives, but since I've had my full arrow system not one person has tried to change lanes into me so it does help.

Slingshot

3rd February 2004, 22:21

ACC is also has ads on the radio at the moment about looking out for bikes...it'll be just our luck some dumb arse driver will be trying to turn the radio up to hear the message as they plow in to a biker :argh:

I must say that my car driving has improved alot since I have been riding, and I was probably one of the more rider friendly drivers.

jimbo600

3rd February 2004, 22:29

All car drivers are twats....period! We just have to allow for the twat factor. Luckily we have sharp road police to make sure we all drive at a sensible pace. You would really think the the traffic nazis would do a 'blitz' on errant (read blind) car drivers. That way maybe, just maybe the road toll would come down a little and our ACC levvies would return to normal. But hey, it aint about the road toll anyway!!

Zed

3rd February 2004, 22:56

What can I do to make myself seen more, or should I accept that some people are just blind idiots and I should assume they will not see me, even if we are looking at each other in the eyes?
Hi Celtic,

You should accept your last quotation!

Most of us here should have learned by now that "other motorists are the main danger on the roads!" Keeping this in mind, I recommend that you stay in front of and away from all other motorists at all times where possible, except other bikers of course. :yes:

Zed

Lou Girardin

4th February 2004, 05:50

I know we've already been through this, but I use high beam all the time unless it's almost dark. I've had people not see me when using low beam, but never when using high.
I agree with wkid's other points though, if your speed differential is much greater than other traffic, your days are numbered.
Lou

Motu

4th February 2004, 06:45

I saw the look out for motorcycles signs on the Papakura and Manukau off ramps last night - when did they go up,and how many are there?

Jackrat

4th February 2004, 08:36

Baahahaa - Can I nick that for my signature please Jackrat?

Feel free mate.
I think Disco dans comment about hazard identification is spot on.
Driving in a car,not seeing a pot hole means a bump,a white line is just a white line, a dog on the side of the road is not even noticed,But for us they all mean a possilbe off so we look.I shudder at times when I say to somebody
"Did ya' see that" then they look at me a say "See what".
I don't ride with my head light on because my electrics can't keep up.
Yamahas worse ever charging system.I am waiting on a guy in OZ to complete
his work on a replacement for the standard XS system and then I will be changing over.Until then,well lets just say its a worry aye.I'm just waiting for the day somebody says I didn't see you cause your head light wasn't on.
An oxymoron?,maybe not but certainly a contradiction of some type.

DEATH_INC.

4th February 2004, 08:53

I am sorry - but this to me is poor riding. You should have identified the hazard and taken appropriate action - especially if it happened twice.

As Keith Code says - identify the hazard, plan you escape.

This sounds good coming from you :p :finger: ........both drivers pulled in front of me at the last second;you can only stop/turn so fast........what do you think I should have done,stopped in the middle of the road and let them do their turn??????then got run over by those following!!!!Do YOU stop and let all cars signalling a turn go in front of you into their driveways accross the main road????I don't think so.
BTW I NEVER get people turning in front of my 4WD.......

Zed

4th February 2004, 09:20

I saw the look out for motorcycles signs on the Papakura and Manukau off ramps last night - when did they go up,and how many are there?
...these signs have also been erected out East, West, & Northshore Auckland. I'll try and get a photo of one uploaded shortly.

It's a good thing me thinks, but I say "look out for cars, trucks, & buses!"

Zed

Jackrat

4th February 2004, 09:29

Draco

4th February 2004, 10:49

Thanks Guys,Thats my first laugh for the day :lol:
An yep,They don't pull out on my 4x4 either,Odd that huh!!

Yup, i drive deaths 4x4 and they don't try wipe me out like they do on my bike too. Wonder y???

I was riding in traffic the other day and a women in a cage tried to pull up on my left in MY lane. I tooted at her and she hesitated, looked straight at me and then continued to try and push me out of the way. It wasnt until i raised my fist at her right in her window that she finally backed off and let me have my lane back. :angry2:

It has NOTHING to do with poor riding (in most cases) and everything to do with idiotiotic/incompetent/rude/dangerous people who shouldn't be allowed on the road.

wkid_one

4th February 2004, 11:26

This sounds good coming from you :p :finger: ........both drivers pulled in front of me at the last second;you can only stop/turn so fast........what do you think I should have done,stopped in the middle of the road and let them do their turn??????then got run over by those following!!!!Do YOU stop and let all cars signalling a turn go in front of you into their driveways accross the main road????I don't think so.
BTW I NEVER get people turning in front of my 4WD....... to have the same accident twice shows you aren't learning from your mistakes.

You obviously spotted the cars - therefore should have calculated the risks and acted accordingly. Yes the car drivers are at fault - but I would think - once bitten twice shy......

The fact you knew they were turning was worse!!!!!

All I am saying is that whilst the driver didn't look - you are assuming ignorance by not piloting the bike assuming they are going to. First rule I was told on the road (car or otherwise) was assume everyone else is going to do something stupid.

Did you adjust your speed? Did you change your position in the lane? Did you flash your lights? Did you brake slightly???

The way you say it - it looked like you just assumed they would give way and they didn't......that fact you are riding a BIKE (and not your 4WD) should make you even more conscious of the fact

I still maintain this is poor riding behaviour.....as you HAD already identified a hazard (twice) and did NOTHING about it.

wkid_one

4th February 2004, 11:29

I was riding in traffic the other day and a women in a cage tried to pull up on my left in MY lane. I tooted at her and she hesitated, looked straight at me and then continued to try and push me out of the way. It wasnt until i raised my fist at her right in her window that she finally backed off and let me have my lane back. :angry2:

This happens HEAPS at the Nauranga Flyover heading in to Wellington. Those in the two outside lanes quite often both try and go in to the middle lane at the same time once it goes in to three lanes- funny to watch.

I just generally think that very few people use their mirrors properly. I have seen Bike Riders do exactly the same thing - miscalculate the cars speed in the lane next to them when they pull in.

Big Dog

4th February 2004, 15:03

I have only had one cager pull out in front of me in about a year. Interestingly that time frame coincides with my insurance lapsing. Perhaps I am more careful?

Always give way, even when you have right of way (where it even looks like they might have a go). As many a man has died defending their right of way.

Wear bright colours. It is amazing the difference between reaction to my black leather and my blue kevlar.

Having a big bike helps you to be seen but provides a bigger target.

I am regularly asked (usually by 20 yo's) when I am going to replace my o/e indicators with smaller leds (o/e's are about 3sq inches). I reply when cages stop parting like the red sea whenever I flick an indicator on.

Ride confidently but be prepared! you look more like a threat if you don't look like your trying to hide. Treat every cage including those of your partner as a heatseeking surface to motorcycle cruise missile, you are not paranoid they are out to get you. If you take this approach you will be ready for it if it does happen and will be filled with feelings of warmth if it does not.

Spend as little time in their blindspot as possible. If you can't see their face in their rear view they can't see you!

Don't tailgate or you will have no spare room to play with. Don't hang back too far as you are just encouraging them to try for the gap.

Drill for emegency stops / evasive manouvers etc.

Be safe, enjoy your riding, and keep the black bits down.

DEATH_INC.

5th February 2004, 06:25

I still maintain this is poor riding behaviour.....as you HAD already identified a hazard (twice) and did NOTHING about it.

I think you don't know what you're talking about :finger: :moon: :stupid: :kick: :bash:
How do YOU know I didn't brake/change road position,ect?????

Draco

5th February 2004, 06:38

I just generally think that very few people use their mirrors properly. I have seen Bike Riders do exactly the same thing - miscalculate the cars speed in the lane next to them when they pull in.

The women is was referring to was BEHIND me in the same lane, she tried to undertake me in my lane, and i was not prepared to let her continue and end up pushing me into another lane.

You seem to make many assumptions about people's riding skills/abilities that i think you are not qualified to make since you have not seen them ride yourself to judge and your obviously not up to riding on the road yourself. :shutup:

Coldkiwi

5th February 2004, 06:45

Well I can relate to most of the above but I encountered an even more disturbing trend while lane splitting (ooo naughty me blah blah) on Tuesday down the southern motorway at Otara.
Cruising along, indicator, full beam all on: plenty of room. A lot of cars see me coming and part slightly (always gets a thankful wave) but one twit in a red ute decides he's had a bad day. About 40 metres out, he sees me in his mirror and DELIBERATELY moves towards the rear left corner of the truck in the right lane (previous 3m gap rapidly closes!) what a SWINE!
As it happens, I spotted it early enough and had it in 2nd gear still so I gassed up and shot through (stopping is just too annoying). The guy yelled at me as I went past his window and he also got a friendly wave (no point in waving a retalitory finger when a courteous wave annoys them more :p )

But really.. malicious use of a vehicle to stop someone lane splitting? what a prat. Hopefully he's still stuck in traffic somewhere. :niceone:

Slim

5th February 2004, 07:43

Spend as little time in their blindspot as possible. If you can't see their face in their rear view they can't see you!
I just know there's something inherently wrong with this sentence, but I'm having trouble putting my finger on it ....... :confused:

CK - I had something similar happen to me when I was on my little GB250 trying to get out of Auckland for Christmas some 10 years ago, when they were just starting to extend the motorway up the Bombays, but the Bombay intersection was still in existence at the top of the hill. When the 2 lanes merged back into 1 halfway up the hill, c@rs were refusing to merge & so were still in 2 lanes, & I was lane splitting at 5-10kph when a dog-in-the-manger-type of driver decided he didn't like the idea of me getting where I was going quicker than him & swerved sharply to close up the gap I was about to use, just about at the last minute. :shit: Luckily he missed me, and 5 minutes later I was able to duck round the c@r on the left & merrily head off on my way, but it gave me a bit of a shock that someone could threaten my life just because they were pissed off being stuck in holiday traffic.

Big Dog - I think I've got it now. Just cos you can see their face in their rearview mirror, doesn't mean they're actually gonna use it! :moon:

Big Dog

5th February 2004, 14:36

I just know there's something inherently wrong with this sentence, but I'm having trouble putting my finger on it ....... :confused:

Big Dog - I think I've got it now. Just cos you can see their face in their rearview mirror, doesn't mean they're actually gonna use it! :moon:
Yes but as stated If you cant see their face they CAN'T see you. As to will they look? There are no guarantees in life but you can minimise the risk. :baby:

mangell6

5th February 2004, 16:47

I have a simple theory and apply it. "I am invisible and no-one can see me!" I watch the actual driver and take note as to what they do and how they drive, you soon recognise the signs of drivers who can and those that can't . . . . drive that is.

I have had prats move to the middle to prevent me from moving up the middle even though both lanes of traffic are 'stopped'.

I avoid the middle lane on a three lane stretch of MW and keep to the middle when travelling on a two lane MW.

I take note of vehicles and their side mirrors, most people have their side mirrors for looking at the rear seat passengers.

One can never avoid idiots that are determined to take you out and are arrogant enough to believe that might is right, oops thats true ask George and John :).

JMO

Mike :shutup:

Lou Girardin

5th February 2004, 19:48

Some cage drivers will get pissed off, I think it's a function of time spent in traffic and ambient temperature. We got caught up in a fatal on SH1 at Waipu on a stinking hot day and the cops were sending everone through Waipu township, there were queues for 5km. As we went past in the (empty) oncoming lane we got serious abuse. Still, if they don't like it. Buy a bike.
Lou

wkid_one

5th February 2004, 19:51

I think you don't know what you're talking about :finger: :moon: :stupid: :kick: :bash:
How do YOU know I didn't brake/change road position,ect????? ummmm - I didn't assume, I asked you a question or two?

The fact you made the same mistake twice after identifying both hazards is enuf reason for my comment.

Keep going with the 10 Foot Tall and Bullet Proof All Cage Drivers are Ignorant angle - and you may have a third and forth accident exactly the same.

Or you can listen and actually change the way you ride.

Either way - I couldn't give a shit.

pete376403

5th February 2004, 23:13

Situation 2:
Pulled off SH2 at Whakatiki St, going through esses next to Mitre 10, and see a Mitsubishi Galant stopped at the side of the road facing me, indicating to pull into the battery shop on my side of the road. Look the driver straight in the eye as I come through the esses and when I am approx 50m from him he turns straight into my path.
Same thing happened to a mate at Franz Joseph en-route to Brass last year.
Mate said they made eye contact and he is quite sure the car driver knew he was there and approaching. Mate got broken arm (windscreen pillar) and two fractured legs (handlebars or road landing, not sure, and written off F650. Driver got $1500 fine, but didn't loose his license as the judge felt it would "impose too much hardship".

Carry a few nuts and bolts, old spark plugs or similar. Next time in a cage annoys, drop one or two bits of shrapnel - at 50 ks or better the shrap can make quite a mess of what ever it hits. And of course there's no proving exactly where that bit of "road debris" came from... :)

What?

6th February 2004, 05:32

Seems that a whole heap of this thread is repeated from a previous one (a likely event also previously identified) so I will join in and repeat myself...

Alot of car drivers are looking for other CARS when at intersections, or planning U-turns etc. Because they are looking for cars, they do not see bikes, kids, 40 tonne trucks, planes or anything else. No cars = clear road. I have lost count of how many fatals I have seen where someone has turned in front of a B-train in perfect driving conditions. It happens, it is not going to change, so be aware of it and adapt to survive it.

And another thing - a few people talk of making eye contact with car drivers. Forget it. You might honestly believe that you have made eye contact with another road user, but that won't help you one little bit when he turns in front of you. In fact, if yu think you are staring into each others eyes, he probably has NOT consciously seen you...

There endeth my sermon. :sleep:

Jackrat

6th February 2004, 06:21

Firefight

6th February 2004, 07:36

Yeah well,Some of these clowns live through the expereince and then claim they didn't see a train coming.Then theres a big stink about railway crossings.
That kind'a sums it up for me. :crazy: :brick:

Good point Jack, been to a few nasty ones over the years, two things that I could never understand.

1) Why they happen

2) Why transrail have the big witch hunt after the event, & add to the trauma & stress of the train driver, you couldn't pay me enough money to do their job, opps here I go, off topic again, and whats worse I can't find the smiley thing that says off topic!, I better get out on the road and out to clevedon to meet the boys and girls.

firefight.

Coldkiwi

6th February 2004, 11:55

Still, if they don't like it. Buy a bike.
Lou

never a truer word spoken! Give the man a beer!

Hitcher

6th February 2004, 15:44

Carry a few nuts and bolts, old spark plugs or similar. Next time in a cage annoys, drop one or two bits of shrapnel - at 50 ks or better the shrap can make quite a mess of what ever it hits. And of course there's no proving exactly where that bit of "road debris" came from... :)

And if they don't take out the cager they can lie on the road to throw off an unsuspecting biker. Better still, do this in your favourite set of esses so that when Joe Biker comes round the corner all nice and leaned over, the spark plug can throw his front wheel off its line and test his ability to keep his arse off the road. Bloody brilliant suggestion...

mangell6

6th February 2004, 19:19

Hitcher

7th February 2004, 12:47

The other day as I was travelling home I watched a car driver indicate and move into the lane in front of me. The interesting thing was that the people in the car next to them, and in front of me, were not impressed at all. Big swerving by all concerned.

The things you see when you're out without your death-ray gun... I'm sure Helen Keller has a NZ driver's licence...

Ms Piggy

8th February 2004, 09:12

Hitcher

8th February 2004, 12:33

Just yesterday I had just come round the Basin Reserve onto Cambridge Terc and a cage pulled out in front of me, so that I had to slow down. They then proceeded to drive really slowly w/o indicating, obviously looking for a park, they then stopped and finally indicated! :angry2: Obviously b/c I could assume nothing I was stuck behind them trying to figure our what the f*ck they were doing. :crazy:

I gave them a blast with my horn (which is quite loud & sharp) but I wished I'd been able to give them a blast with a ray gun!

The Basin Reserve is the "circumference of death" for bikers at the best of times, but try it at 8:30am-9:00am on a school day when the St Marks mums are dropping of their spawn. Even better in the wet. Reminds me of somebody's comment earlier this week about "cows in Pajeros".

wkid_one

8th February 2004, 13:12

The Basin Reserve is the "circumference of death" for bikers at the best of times, but try it at 8:30am-9:00am on a school day when the St Marks mums are dropping of their spawn. Even better in the wet. Reminds me of somebody's comment earlier this week about "cows in Pajeros". It is the Wellington Champs Ellyses......crap peice of roading engineering whether in a car, bike, truck or moped.

It isn't limited to motorcyclists being caught out there - what you are talking about is just a generally bad intersection regardless of what you are driving.

The fact of the matter is - WE ALL KNOW IT IS BAD - so if you ride/drive like a nutter around there, you are asking to be knocked off/smacked in to.

As they say 49% of all accidents happen at intersections.

I did my civic duty on Thursday nite - as whilst coming back from UHutt and coming under the Petone underpass in the fast lane. This nutter promptly came hooning up the slow lane (as was doing 110kph thru the pass), cut me off, nearly went up the back of the car in front of me, then cut across 3 lanes to go to the Esplanade Lane merger, then back across three lanes to be back in the fast lane before taking off at 140kph. So I *555'ed his arse!

Followed him in to town whilst talking to the Police, gave them his Rego and proceeded to keep following him, he ended up behind me, then passed me on the footpath and tore thru town. He stopped at an intersection and hurled abuse at me as he had figured out what I was doing....

Hitcher

8th February 2004, 13:20

It is the Wellington Champs Ellyses......crap peice of roading engineering whether in a car, bike, truck or moped.

It isn't limited to motorcyclists being caught out there - what you are talking about is just a generally bad intersection regardless of what you are driving.

The fact of the matter is - WE ALL KNOW IT IS BAD - so if you ride/drive like a nutter around there, you are asking to be knocked off/smacked in to.

As they say 49% of all accidents happen at intersections.

I did my civic duty on Thursday nite - as whilst coming back from UHutt and coming under the Petone underpass in the fast lane. This nutter promptly came hooning up the slow lane (as was doing 110kph thru the pass), cut me off, nearly went up the back of the car in front of me, then cut across 3 lanes to go to the Esplanade Lane merger, then back across three lanes to be back in the fast lane before taking off at 140kph. So I *555'ed his arse!

Followed him in to town whilst talking to the Police, gave them his Rego and proceeded to keep following him, he ended up behind me, then passed me on the footpath and tore thru town. He stopped at an intersection and hurled abuse at me as he had figured out what I was doing....

Very public spirited! I hope you have a hands-free kit for your cellphone...

Jackrat

8th February 2004, 16:01

Hey Wkid, seeing how you rode like a fool yourself,with seeming disconcern
for other road users,ain't that a bit off.
Hell that's a side I didn't exspect. :ar15: :mobile:

Zed

8th February 2004, 16:11

I did my civic duty on Thursday nite - as whilst coming back from UHutt and coming under the Petone underpass in the fast lane. This nutter promptly came hooning up the slow lane (as was doing 110kph thru the pass), cut me off, nearly went up the back of the car in front of me, then cut across 3 lanes to go to the Esplanade Lane merger, then back across three lanes to be back in the fast lane before taking off at 140kph. So I *555'ed his arse!

Followed him in to town whilst talking to the Police, gave them his Rego and proceeded to keep following him, he ended up behind me, then passed me on the footpath and tore thru town. He stopped at an intersection and hurled abuse at me as he had figured out what I was doing....
Ha ha, good on you!

Too many "drive" carelessly :sleep:
Many drive dangerously :p
Those who drive recklessly should get narked on like you did to this guy! :angry2:

Now those who "ride" are another story altogether...

Zed