Pukekohe Classic Racing Festival Feb 4/5 2017

[Voltaire]

The 38th Classic Racing Festival is on again Feb 4/5.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p235/rednzep/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_0817_zpskikrlkgb.jpg
MNZ Permit- 16518
This years theme is Marlboro Series Reunion so there should be a good turn out of riders and bikes from that era as well as displays. More bikes and riders to follow.
Entry is $25 a day or $40 for the weekend.
Family pass is $50 for weekend.
Entry for riders is $225
Non members $250
South Islanders $ 125
Track Parade $140
T shirts $30 pre ordered, $35 on the day.
Camping is available Saturday night as part of entry.

Classes are:

Vintage & Pre War - Pre '31, Pre '46 350, Pre '46 500
0-250cc - Pre '63 250 Clubmans, Pre '63 250 Modified, Classic 70's 250
251-350cc - Pre '63 350 Clubmans, Pre '63 350 Factory Racing, Pre '63 350 Modified, Classic 70's 350 and 0-250cc - Pre '63 250 Factory Racing
351-500cc - Pre '63 500 Clubmans, Pre '63 500 Factory Racing, Pre '63 500 Modified, Classic 70's 500
501cc-Open - Pre '63 Open Modified, Classic 70's Open
Sidecars - Pre '63, Pre '76
Post Classic - Pre '82 Senior, Pre '89 F1
Post Classic - Pre '82 Junior, Pre '89 F2, Pre '89 F3
Track Parade

Good opportunity to get those Classic 70's bikes out on the track.
Also looking for any stories and photos from that time that I can post up the Facebook site

https://www.facebook.com/groups/106389289485667/

Cheers John

[Voltaire]

Does anyone have any program information or details on the Series run from December 73 to Jan 78 they could PM me as I'm after some background for the Program. Cheers John

[nodrog]

Will there be ear plugs available, and can you stop the racing so i can push a pram across to the infield?

[Voltaire]

Will there be ear plugs available, and can you stop the racing so i can push a pram across to the infield?

I was under the impression you had sold the BMW?

[Hemi Makutu]

Does anyone have any program information or details on the Series run from December 73 to Jan 78 they could PM me as I'm after some background for the Program. Cheers John

Try this Johnny: http://forums.autosport.com/topic/129227-the-new-zealand-marlboro-series/

[Voltaire]

I've received a copy of the 2017 poster.
Event will feature Stu Avant, Graeme Crosby Kevin Magee

I'm after a bit more info on the Marlboro Series, any pics or stories of the time?

Anyone tell me about Dale Wylie, he won the first series and apparently pretty quick on a Norton Commando.:2thumbsup

Also John Boote, tested out the then new TZ 700.

They set a cracking pace around Pukekohe 40 years ago.


Pat Hennen who won the Series three times was the first American to win a 500 GP race- Finnish GP 1976 and at Pukekohe set the lap record of 54.6 seconds in 1974, 54 in 1975 and 52.6 in 1976, which stood for the next 7 years until David Hiscock in 1983 set a 52.40, following year Robert Holden dropped it to 52.34.

How many of the NZ riders are still here in NZ and are some of the bikes still around?

If you like the smell of 2 stroke there is going to be a lot of it at this event, no more sniffing the weedeater fumes :lol:

[jellywrestler]

I've received a copy of the 2017 poster.
Event will feature Stu Avant, Graeme Crosby Kevin Magee

I'm after a bit more info on the Marlboro Series, any pics or stories of the time?

Anyone tell me about Dale Wylie, he won the first series and apparently pretty quick on a Norton Commando.:2thumbsup

Also John Boote, tested out the then new TZ 700.

They set a cracking pace around Pukekohe 40 years ago.



How many of the NZ riders are still here in NZ and are some of the bikes still around?

If you like the smell of 2 stroke there is going to be a lot of it at this event, no more sniffing the weedeater fumes :lol:
how many words do you want?

[malcy25]

I've received a copy of the 2017 poster.
Event will feature Stu Avant, Graeme Crosby Kevin Magee

I'm after a bit more info on the Marlboro Series, any pics or stories of the time?

Anyone tell me about Dale Wylie, he won the first series and apparently pretty quick on a Norton Commando.:2thumbsup

Also John Boote, tested out the then new TZ 700.

They set a cracking pace around Pukekohe 40 years ago.



How many of the NZ riders are still here in NZ and are some of the bikes still around?

If you like the smell of 2 stroke there is going to be a lot of it at this event, no more sniffing the weedeater fumes :lol:

err, you will find that was 60 something second bracket, not 50 something second bracket. Note there were some changes to the circuit in 1991 which made it about 2 seconds a lap quicker than the original format used.

JB is around on Facebook and he'll confirm, but I understood he first tested the TZ750A at Manfeild before he raced and won at Gracefield, not Puke. Rivet counting, but there is no such thing as a TZ700, just TZ750A and some B models which were 700cc. . Even Yamaha called them 750's from day one.

[Grumph]

Come down to the SCF in December and talk to most of them prior to your event....plus quite a few marlboro series survivors.

John Boote is still around and will be riding down here. Haven't seen Dale for years, don't even know if he's out of jail...

[jellywrestler]

Rivet counting, but there is no such thing as a TZ700, just TZ750A and some B models which were 700cc. . Even Yamaha called them 750's from day one.

just like these often being called the McIntosh BR1, they're a Mcintosh Bathurst Replica, the next model was called a BR2 so people counted back and got BR1...

[Hemi Makutu]

AFAIR, pre-chicane ( did the bikes even have to use them?) in the early `70s the F 5000s were in the mid-to-low 50s..
& the new F 750 bikes were pretty close to them time-wise too, all screaming down the back straight at 170+ mph.

No mufflers back then of course, open megas & straight stingers for the 2Ts..


When Wayne Gardner came over to race V8 Stupidcars at Puke,
- I asked him if he thought he could get around there quicker than the car,
on his factory Honda NSR 500 G.P. bike, & he said "Yeah sure, with the proper set up, maybe low 50s"

Be interesting to see how quick Kevin Magee can get the YZR 500 going, certainly the BSL had the Britten whipped there on exhibition runs..

[Voltaire]

how many words do you want?

I need about 800 for the program, and I gather you are coming up to do the commentary too :yes:,

[Voltaire]

err, you will find that was 60 something second bracket, not 50 something second bracket. Note there were some changes to the circuit in 1991 which made it about 2 seconds a lap quicker than the original format used.

JB is around on Facebook and he'll confirm, but I understood he first tested the TZ750A at Manfeild before he raced and won at Gracefield, not Puke. Rivet counting, but there is no such thing as a TZ700, just TZ750A and some B models which were 700cc. . Even Yamaha called them 750's from day one.

Yes I wondered about the TZ 700 but as it was in a bike magazine article I figured it must have been correct, glad I asked here.:niceone:
I'd prefer to get the details right prior to print. I only know about BMW rivets :msn-wink:

[Voltaire]

Come down to the SCF in December and talk to most of them prior to your event....plus quite a few marlboro series survivors.

John Boote is still around and will be riding down here. Haven't seen Dale for years, don't even know if he's out of jail...

I would but I've got only just enough leave to ride to the Burt and back :weep:,
Kevin Grant is doing the organising of the event, I'm just doing that new fangled internet thingie.

[jasonu]

When Wayne Gardner came over to race V8 Stupidcars at Puke,
..

He planted it in the wall on the hill right in front of me.

[malcy25]

AFAIR, pre-chicane ( did the bikes even have to use them?) in the early `70s the F 5000s were in the mid-to-low 50s..
& the new F 750 bikes were pretty close to them time-wise too, all screaming down the back straight at 170+ mph.


err, no. The times quoted earlier, if you add 10 seconds on are bang on. Someone has made a typo when keying them in. The quickest bike at Puke was about 2008 where Bugden set a lap record at 56.28. Some one may have beaten that, but is marginal as from about 2010 Hampton Downs was used for the nationals. But as you'd be fully aware, despite only being "road production" based, they are by far a better bike in terms of performance than a 1970's TZ750, KR750 or RG500 ever were or could be, on a point to point basis. Also noting my previous comment about the circuit being circa 2 seconds a lap quicker with changes made in 1991.

https://speedhive.mylaps.com/Sessions/740735

[jellywrestler]

I would but I've got only just enough leave to ride to the Burt and back :weep:,
Kevin Grant is doing the organising of the event, I'm just doing that new fangled internet thingie.

there's your failing, go to the burt, park up, fly home, fly back get your bike and pick up the SCF on the way....

[Grumph]

there's your failing, go to the burt, park up, fly home, fly back get your bike and pick up the SCF on the way....

Fly from ChCh, I can park the bike and deliver/collect you from the airport. Or someone at the Burt will hold it for you down there....

[jellywrestler]

Fly from ChCh, I can park the bike and deliver/collect you from the airport. Or someone at the Burt will hold it for you down there....

queenstown a good option, plenty of flights direct and midway, invers will cost you an arm a leg and a sex organ to get to and from, dunners is another option or chch value wise, or of course timaru airport which is a few hundred meters from the track, means you can hammer the bar and turn up like a truck load o spastics cause you don't have to ride anywhere....

[Grumph]

or of course timaru airport which is a few hundred meters from the track, means you can hammer the bar and turn up like a truck load o spastics cause you don't have to ride anywhere....

That's the voice, bowels and bladder of experience talking.....

[jellywrestler]

means you can hammer the bar and turn up like a truck load o spastics cause you don't have to ride anywhere....


That's the voice, bowels and bladder of experience talking.....

except those little planes don't have a bar on them....

[Hemi Makutu]

err, no. The times quoted earlier, if you add 10 seconds on are bang on. Someone has made a typo when keying them in. The quickest bike at Puke was about 2008 where Bugden set a lap record at 56.28. Some one may have beaten that, but is marginal as from about 2010 Hampton Downs was used for the nationals. But as you'd be fully aware, despite only being "road production" based, they are by far a better bike in terms of performance than a 1970's TZ750, KR750 or RG500 ever were or could be, on a point to point basis. Also noting my previous comment about the circuit being circa 2 seconds a lap quicker with changes made in 1991.

https://speedhive.mylaps.com/Sessions/740735


Right Mal, I do recall watching Graham McRae doing the pole lap of 55.2 in the NZ F 5000 G.P. 1972..

But here is some Marlboro Series TVNZ footage showing laps at Puke reportedly ~10 secs slower.. sans chicanes..
Although, to be fair, it did take the Superbikes a few decades to beat the 190+ mph trap speeds recorded by those F 750s..


( Note Mike Hailwood doing trackside interviews & do try to ignore Tony Palmer's execrable commentary)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyx3FnWK2eM

[BuzzardNZ]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YymGJKhGgY

[eelracing]

( Note Mike Hailwood doing trackside interviews & do try to ignore Tony Palmer's execrable commentary)


Eh? go an have another listen,I swear he said "Avant Willing and Woodley are swapping places like swingers wives."
Hear that these day's and some PC anal retentive would be up in arms crying on the 6 0'clock news.

Great vid tho.

[Voltaire]

there's your failing, go to the burt, park up, fly home, fly back get your bike and pick up the SCF on the way....


Fly from ChCh, I can park the bike and deliver/collect you from the airport. Or someone at the Burt will hold it for you down there....


queenstown a good option, plenty of flights direct and midway, invers will cost you an arm a leg and a sex organ to get to and from, dunners is another option or chch value wise, or of course timaru airport which is a few hundred meters from the track, means you can hammer the bar and turn up like a truck load o spastics cause you don't have to ride anywhere....

Thanks for all the good advice but alas plan are made an me and the ol' R90s are booked on Ferries and Airbnb's. I would like to run the race BMW around some SItracks at some point while I still can.:niceone:

[malcy25]

Right Mal, I do recall watching Graham McRae doing the pole lap of 55.2 in the NZ F 5000 G.P. 1972..

But here is some Marlboro Series TVNZ footage showing laps at Puke reportedly ~10 secs slower.. sans chicanes..
Although, to be fair, it did take the Superbikes a few decades to beat the 190+ mph trap speeds recorded by those F 750s..


( Note Mike Hailwood doing trackside interviews & do try to ignore Tony Palmer's execrable commentary)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyx3FnWK2eM

let's just say the 190+mph quoted would have had a certain sensationalist hype/bullshit factor built in to amuse the punters. Paul McLachlan held the NZ outright motorcycle land speed record on a big TZ at only 180mph in the late 70's and held it for many years. I think John Hepburn finally broke it on a Hyabusa superbike.

The F5000 lap sounds about right. Love those things - they are weapons that rearrange your internal organs, sonically! Saw some footage of a modern build F5000 type car (FT5000 aka Formula Thunder) and in testing first time out was doing 1.24's at Phillip Island, he only just needed to roll it off but hold the same gear for turn 1. The bikes are down 2.........best Motogp lap was 1.27.9 in qualifying a few years ago. A good wings and slicks open wheeler with suitable HP will always outrun a bike.

[Hemi Makutu]

let's just say the 190+mph quoted would have had a certain sensationalist hype/bullshit factor built in to amuse the punters. Paul McLachlan held the NZ outright motorcycle land speed record on a big TZ at only 180mph in the late 70's and held it for many years. I think John Hepburn finally broke it on a Hyabusa superbike.

The F5000 lap sounds about right. Love those things - they are weapons that rearrange your internal organs, sonically! Saw some footage of a modern build F5000 type car (FT5000 aka Formula Thunder) and in testing first time out was doing 1.24's at Phillip Island, he only just needed to roll it off but hold the same gear for turn 1. The bikes are down 2.........best Motogp lap was 1.27.9 in qualifying a few years ago. A good wings and slicks open wheeler with suitable HP will always outrun a bike.


Yeah, downforce makes the difference, not that a road vehicle can use it..

Here are the fastest trap speeds recorded in Q for the Daytona 200 in 1974 ( 1st of many TZ 750 wins on the trot there).

From 'Cycle Australia May 1974 P. 22';


1. H. Kanaya Yamaha TZ 750 307.01 Km/h;
2. Y. Du Hamel Kawasaki H2R 298.11 Km/h;
3. G. Romero Yamaha TZ 750 294.11 Km/h;

Mick Grant was also speed trapped at over 190 mph on his KR 750 Kawasaki @ the IoM TT,
- a top speed it took decades for the big Superbikes to beat.

If you check the lap records for Eastern Creek/Sydney Motorsport Park, the current Superbike
lap record there is still not quite as quick as Criville's 500 G.P. best lap from ~20 years ago..

[jellywrestler]

Mick Grant was also speed trapped at over 190 mph on his KR 750 Kawasaki @ the IoM TT,
- a top speed it took decades for the big Superbikes to beat.

i read that before going to the isle of man myself, and was hitching over there and was picked up by this guy. i asked if it was a mick grant replica helmet in his back seat, to which he replied it was the real thing, and he was mick grant....
it was 190.6 and down from creg ny baa, most quoted speeds from the iom are on a flat surface sulby? or similar, his bike wouldn't have done anywhere near that on sulby.

[Hemi Makutu]

I'd have thought that while a downhill gradient might enable a top speed to be reached quicker,
unless the bike had the aero, & gearing to extend out, then the top speed is still a finite thing.

His speed recorded on the trap was, none-the-less - better than all others through there..

Mick Grant is also on record as stating that he'd regularly achieved speeds over 180 mph on
the KR 750 running around the banking at Daytona, which isn't flat either..

[sidecar bob]

Eh? go an have another listen,I swear he said "Avant Willing and Woodley are swapping places like swingers wives."
Hear that these day's and some PC anal retentive would be up in arms crying on the 6 0'clock news.

Great vid tho.

Ummm, yeah, I'm not sure you have heard Jellywrestlers commentary at the cemetery circuit, or anywhere else for that matter.:facepalm:
Is that bloke on the video between 15 & 20 seconds a bit too stoned to pass the drug test next morning or what?
The dude is off his fuckin chops, but very happy nonetheless.

[jellywrestler]

I'd have thought that while a downhill gradient might enable a top speed to be reached quicker,
unless the bike had the aero, & gearing to extend out, then the top speed is still a finite thing.


if that was the case why do they have to survey roads for speed records and they're not allowed to vary in elevation? remember too the tuning for daytona would be precise, whereas the isle of man there'd be some safety tuned in due to the changing elevations and sheer length of the course and the variables, reliability was vital for finishing and safety.

[Hemi Makutu]

Every motorcycle has a potential top speed, usually limited by available power/gearing/aerodynamic profile.
Back in the day, official speed records were the average of two runs in opposite directions within a certain time.

At Daytona when those speed trap figures were produced, Q was predicated on them, rather than lap time,
so the rich teams would build a specific Q engine for all out top end speed capability.

Even so, those F 750 bikes of the day were really pushing the limits of tyre/chassis/suspension tech,
yet were in the main, available to 'regular Joe', or select dealer riders -at a reasonable price,
& were fairly simple machines, to strip/repair/tune...
...certainly by comparison to current Moto GP, or even World Superbike, not that they even visit NZ these days..

[Hemi Makutu]

AFAIR, even in circuit race trim, at places like the Irish NW 200 & the Bol d'Or, where they could 'stretch their legs'
( & at the B.d'O. 24 hour where a TZ 750 led for ~3/4's of the race, lapping seconds quicker than the 4Ts)
speeds around 190 mph being recorded were not that unusal..

As for speed records, when running around banked speed bowls they utterly obliterated the standing 4T records,
thirst for fuel & tyre chunking problems notwithstanding.

Don Vesco got some speed out of the big TZ on the salt too, AFAIR..

& I even remember attending a `70s Meremere drag racing meeting when Ginger Molloy showed up
on his Kawasaki H2R 750 road race bike, to the jeers of the hot rod & Brit bike guys..

His mid 10 sec 1/4 mile @ ~135 mph shut them up though..


H2R service manual, if of interest: www.3cyl.com/mraxl/manuals/h2r/h2rservice.pdf

[Hemi Makutu]

& if anyone really wants to do a Suzuki 'sows ear into silk purse'.. ( it better be a fat purse) see here:

www.bdkraceeng.co.uk/TR750%20Parts.html

[Voltaire]

Nearly 300 bikes entered, over 50 entered in the 500cc class alone.

graeme crosby and Stu Avant will be doing some display riding, understand there could be a few Aussies from the Marlboro

Era attending as well as the NZ riders of the time.

Classic 70's class will be well represented with lots of 2 strokes.

$25 for the day $40 for the weekend, overnight camping on the Saturday

Anyone on here racing?

[jellywrestler]

Nearly 300 bikes entered, over 50 entered in the 500cc class alone.

graeme crosby and Stu Avant will be doing some display riding, understand there could be a few Aussies from the Marlboro

Era attending as well as the NZ riders of the time.

Classic 70's class will be well represented with lots of 2 strokes.

$25 for the day $40 for the weekend, overnight camping on the Saturday

Anyone on here racing?

Avant, he has publicly said his riding days are over and retired many many years ago, is this a comeback?

[roogazza]

lol ,there'll be a lot of size XXXXL leathers on display ? Chance to catch up with a lot of oldies tho,should be good. :cool:

[Voltaire]

<a href="http://faketrumptweet.com/fake-tweet/emnqg862fd_1k8rhwy.png"><img src="http://i.faketrumptweet.com/emnqg862fd_1k8rhwy.png" title="Made in America at faketrumptweet.com"/></a>

[Grumph]

Avant, he has publicly said his riding days are over and retired many many years ago, is this a comeback?

Not unless he can borrow your leathers....I was interested to see that it was Richard Scott doing some of the demo riding at levels, without any fanfare either.
Probably see him out at puke too.

I got blamed for Avant getting fat...I told him he needed to bulk up to ride a 750....Back when he was a scrawny kid.

[Kickaha]

Stu Avant will be doing some display riding
I have a photo here somewhere from one of the early SOT meeting of him on a Ducati Pantah

[Voltaire]

BMW loaded in van, weather looking good. Who else is going to Pukekohe?:niceone:

[jellywrestler]

BMW loaded in van, weather looking good. Who else is going to Pukekohe?:niceone:

on my way in the morning.

[Laava]

Probably. Going to visit my mate who comes over every year from OZ for this. Incidentally, he is racing in the Barry Sheene classic at eastern creek next month,, hoping to get the green card for that one too!

[Bass]

BMW loaded in van, weather looking good. Who else is going to Pukekohe?:niceone:

Family commitments Saturday but will be there on Sunday so don't break anything before I get there!

Is Trustme coming out to play?

[trustme]

Yes. Not as well prepared as I would like but I will be there.

[Laava]

Was some great bikes and racing there today although I left after race 15. I didn't bother taking photos this time as I don't have much flair for it but I did get a photo of the damage to the Norton Manx who snapped a swingarm just as he gained the pits from the exit road. We saw it happen and everyone was thinking WTF! Until they saw the damage. The swingarm snapped on the chain side, at the front end,and dropped down bending and engaging the brake rod, pulling the brake pedal up and locking the wheel at about the same time as the broken end of the swingarm dug into the ashphalt pogoing the bike in a very abrupt 180! Amazingly the rider stayed on, but it was funny watching his expressions as he clocked what had happened.

[RMS eng]

went yesterday,made my day too see and hear a 90s 500GP YZR500 works bike at full noise,thanks to Kevin Magee and crew for the show.

[eelracing]

went yesterday,made my day too see and hear a 90s 500GP YZR500 works bike at full noise,thanks to Kevin Magee and crew for the show.

Ditto,awesome to hear and see these beauties in good ol NZ.
Did you score Mike Sinclair's book it's an excellent insight to the Kenny Roberts "Evil Empire."

Some pic's...

[Laava]

Manx damage...

[husaberg]

Manx damage...

I would have thought the tail would have broke first:killingme
Was it an oval tube swingarm.

[Grumph]

Without seeing it in person I'm making no judgements - but if that's the bike I think it is, it's had a hard life...

[Voltaire]

58....not in the program, is a Jaffa built one?

I saw another manx that looked a bit worse for wear and came upon a bevel drive 900ss lying on the hairpin, not to mention my mates old BMW that was crashed twice and looked a bit mangled.

[Laava]

I would have thought the tail would have broke first:killingme
Was it an oval tube swingarm.
No idea...

Without seeing it in person I'm making no judgements - but if that's the bike I think it is, it's had a hard life...
Looks like it now...

58....not in the program, is a Jaffa built one?

I saw another manx that looked a bit worse for wear and came upon a bevel drive 900ss lying on the hairpin, not to mention my mates old BMW that was crashed twice and looked a bit mangled.

No idea about the bike mate but the fact the guy stayed on it led me to believe he was a pretty accomplished dude!

[Laava]

I would have thought the tail would have broke first:killingme


Boom boom!

[Grumph]

58....not in the program, is a Jaffa built one?

I saw another manx that looked a bit worse for wear and came upon a bevel drive 900ss lying on the hairpin, not to mention my mates old BMW that was crashed twice and looked a bit mangled.

Ha - the Register gets a higher quality of wreckage....

Few years back at a meeting I pointed out to Kevin Grant that the 3rd day of the Sound of Thunder actually had more bikes than day one. By day three of a register event of the period, fields were very thin...

[Doppleganger]

Who did the timing? any results?

[swarfie]

Who did the timing? any results?

Mark Time. Yep results are on his website.

http://www.marktime.co.nz/results/nz-classic-motorcycle-racing-register/2017/02/04

[Voltaire]

Photos of Pukekohe on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/cycl1n/photos/?tab=album&album_id=1348595441828858

[trustme]

Cool pics . A great weekend , seemed to be more crashes compared to last time at Puke, I guess people have upped their game.

[Voltaire]

Cool pics . A great weekend , seemed to be more crashes compared to last time at Puke, I guess people have upped their game.

Crashing is upping your game?:msn-wink:

Fasted lap time was 1 M 10 on an old Suzuki :shifty: