From bad to worse?

[jim.cox]

So that smarmy arrogant Prime Minister of ours has had enough.

Can't say I blame him - I've had enough of him too.

But who's going to replace him?

Bill English is appointed in the short term

And then?

Gerry "Who Ate All The Pies" Brownlee or Judith "Crusher" Collins?

Arrrggggh....

[Katman]

Please, pleeeease not Judith Collins.

[ellipsis]

Gutless piece of shit...the world he wanted just slipped away from him and he quits...maybe Kim Hill having the last word this morning in her interview with the prick was just too much...good riddance...English is a bigger cunt...oh woe...and Brownlee is an even bigger cunt, and not just in the weight department...

[EJK]

Bring back Hone.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Please, pleeeease not Judith Collins.


Gutless piece of shit...the world he wanted just slipped away from him and he quits...maybe Kim Hill having the last word this morning in her interview with the prick was just too much...good riddance...English is a bigger cunt...oh woe...and Brownlee is an even bigger cunt, and not just in the weight department...

And Big Jude is all cunt.

[PrincessBandit]

Winnie for PM.

:eek:

[Akzle]

vote akzle .

[Blackbird]

I'd actually have more respect for the posters above if rather than just sledging John Key, they'd say that Andrew Little and Labour will do a far better job and nail their colours to the mast. Easy to slag off as we we see in virtually every thread on KB these days.

[Brett]

John Key has had a coloured few terms, some ups and definitely some downs such as the flag debacle. But...he remains to me one of the best PM's we have seen since I can remember. Him leaving leaves a bit of a gaping hole...who will fill the seat of PM better? I can't think of a party leader that I would actually support now. I am less of a "party" voter and more of a "leader" voter as I feel that it is the leader in NZ who has the most sway, given that the two main parties are both so centrist. Andrew Little, hell no. Brownlee...nope. Collins? Double nope.

We appear to be a little...*ahem* FUCKED in the leadership department at present.

[Brian d marge]

John Key has had a coloured few terms, some ups and definitely some downs such as the flag debacle. But...he remains to me one of the best PM's we have seen since I can remember. Him leaving leaves a bit of a gaping hole...who will fill the seat of PM better? I can't think of a party leader that I would actually support now. I am less of a "party" voter and more of a "leader" voter as I feel that it is the leader in NZ who has the most sway, given that the two main parties are both so centrist. Andrew Little, hell no. Brownlee...nope. Collins? Double nope.

We appear to be a little...*ahem* FUCKED in the leadership department at present.
Please go and research John keys background ,and especially the reserve Bank governor
They share a common past

sent for a divine source

[TheDemonLord]

I respect someone who knows when it is time to depart gracefully.

Time will tell whether or not it was in fact time.


As for replacements - I can't believe I'm saying this - but I agree with Katman - definitely not Judith Collins.

[Grumph]

Probably be Stephen Joyce - the dildo target. Bastard is slimy enough to come through as a compromise till after the election.

Then with any luck it'll be the night of the long knives in the nat caucus and we'll see the current dross go away.

[mashman]

English. Just not the right one :eek:

"Thanks NZ. I've served my 9 years and will think of you every time I use one of those lovely subsidies you get for 9 years service.".

[Swoop]

Andrew Little and Labour will do a far better job and nail their colours to the mast.

I have yet to see labour get their shit together and create a cohesive ability to lead anything. Sadly still disjointed and internally representative of a kindergarten sandpit...

Winnie for PM!

[jasonu]

You cunts can have Hillary if you want her, apparently she is looking for a job. She comes with Rosie O'Fatarse, Koonyay West and all the other douchbags that said they would move if trump won.

[Brian d marge]

Hang the fkin lot of em

sent for a divine source

[Blackbird]

I have yet to see labour get their shit together and create a cohesive ability to lead anything. Sadly still disjointed and internally representative of a kindergarten sandpit...

Winnie for PM!

Quite agree!

[Madness]

I'd actually have more respect for the posters above if rather than just sledging John Key, they'd say that Andrew Little and Labour will do a far better job and nail their colours to the mast. Easy to slag off as we we see in virtually every thread on KB these days.

But they're all cunts. Except Jacinda. Oh, Jacinda.

[husaberg]

Haley Holt is standing for the green party.....
326614326615326616

[Madness]

Haley Holt

I wouldn't have thought she'd be your type, being over 14 and all. Also, do you lean to the left when you're wanking or what?

[Grumph]

Haley Holt is standing for the green party.....

Announced this morning she was looking at standing in Key's electorate...Perhaps Bronagh wouldn't let him near that ponytail...

Outsider for deputy - Amy Adams.

[husaberg]

yet another post about husberg

Well no one ever accused you of being perceptive or bright, most as far as i know just think you are just another Auckland wantabe fuckwit with ongoing troll fantasies.
Most of which seem to revolve arround me.


Announced this morning she was looking at standing in Key's electorate...Perhaps Bronagh wouldn't let him near that ponytail...
Outsider for deputy - Amy Adams.

The timing a buggar aye. she might have been in with a sniff
Maybe old John just couldn't find anymore crown assets to sell off.
Whats the bet Maurice Williamson throws his hat in yet again for the also ran wooden spoon
I bet Johns on the board of Goldman Saxs/Merrill Lynch in a year.

[Akzle]

I have yet to see labour get their shit together and create a cohesive ability to lead anything. Sadly still disjointed and internally representative of a kindergarten sandpit...

Winnie for PM!

which differs from every other parliamentarian engaged in the farce that is democracy, quite how?

[Brett]

Please go and research John keys background ,and especially the reserve Bank governor
They share a common past

sent for a divine source

They were both securities traders/bankers...not sure quite what you are insinuating there??

[Madness]

...fantasies.

Hey, you're the one sharing girlie pics from your personal collection. What folder do you keep Hayley in, "GILF's"?

[husaberg]

They were both securities traders/bankers...not sure quite what you are insinuating there??

Pretty sure hes onto the they both like Cricket conpiracy.
Graeme was clearly better as he played one game of first class cricket for Wellington.


yet another post about husberg
Clearly not my own personal collection but don't let that get in the way of your own latest husaberg projection fantasy.
http://happybday.to/Hayley-Holt
In case you missed it shes running for Parliament.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11760231

Actually have you ever posted anything about motorbikes on KB?
Or anything that isn't just a sad cry for attention/attempt to troll.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Haley Holt is standing for the green party.....
326614

Sadly, that's not Hayley Holt...

[jim.cox]

Well that didn't take long....

I see Crusher has stuck up her hand for the top job :(

I hope the Nats realise just how unpopular that bitch is - should be enough to give labour a twenty point advantage

[bogan]

Well that didn't take long....

I see Crusher has stuck up her hand for the top job :(

I hope the Nats realise just how unpopular that bitch is - should be enough to give labour a twenty point advantage

Shit, that'll put them only 10 points behind then :bleh:

It's gotta be Bill I reckon, arguably a better option than Key anyway, but certainly the best option remaining.

[Madness]

I see Crusher has stuck up her hand for the top job :(

If she gets in I'll shift to Whangamomona.

[R650R]

*** Breaking News *** *** Breaking News *** *** Breaking News *** *** Breaking News *** *** Breaking News ***

From (source redacted)

Winston Peters to return to the National Party according to party insiders. Its unknown the exact details but tis understood the National Party made an unrefuseable offer for the strong leadership qualities of Winston.
NZF souces say the party will continue a sa separate entity but will no doubt support Mr Peters strongly.

https://i1.wp.com/www.whaleoil.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Winston-Peters-2-630x420.jpg?fit=630%2C420

[Oakie]

This thread is going to be EPIC!

Me ... I think he's been a good P.M. Done some good work in amongst some cringe moments but generally moved NZ forward.

Timing is as expected really ... a year out of the next election to give the new leader time to bed in. Funny the number of people on social media who assume he's been caught doing something he shouldn't have.

Questions?

What happens to the Labour / Greens M.O.U. now that Labour must think they have a sniff? Will they kick the Greens out of bed?

Bill English will lead, but who will be his 2 I.C.?

What happens if National win again thus negating the idea that it was all about JKs personality?

[F5 Dave]

You're all forgetting or probably too scared to utter the Donald Trump in the room- the spectre of Nick Smith:tugger:

[Daffyd]

If Crusher Collins gets it I'm moving to the Philippines!





Oh wait...

[husaberg]

Sadly, that's not Hayley Holt...

No idea, but the second one says Haley Westerna and thats def Haley Holt.

I just googled Hayley Holt and got this page
http://happybday.to/Hayley-Holt
as Jason and Brian_de marge likely have no idea who she is?
Regardless All of them look like pretty effective MP's.

[Oakie]

I reckon Amy Adams for deputy although Paula Bennett may have something to say about that. For a male ... Stephen Joyce ... the Minister of Fixing Things.

[Grumph]

I reckon Amy Adams for deputy although Paula Bennett may have something to say about that. For a male ... Stephen Joyce ... the Minister of Fixing Things.

Amy over Paula every time - Amy's a member of Federated Farmers....

I reckon Joyce is owed so many favours for fixing broken portfolios he'll slime in as caretaker PM.

[george formby]

I met John Key t'other day. Never been a fan, but I was impressed at his interest and consideration of the place and people he visited. He was smart and very perceptive. Bloody good sport, too. Much fun was had for 30 minutes or so and he seemed to lap it up. Quite hilarious for everybody. I confess to dampening my dislike.
Is it true he donates his PM salary to charity?

After the pics that have been posted I'm standing for Hayley Holt..

[BuzzardNZ]

Is it true he donates his PM salary to charity?



People were talking about this at work today and according to them he did for his first term as PM.

[jasonu]

as Jason and Brian_de marge likely have no idea who she is?
.

With tits like that it really doesn't matter...

[Akzle]

you old white cunts carry on like it matters? you cant truly believe that if they (politicos) dropped dead tomorrow, that everything would decay into cannabalism and anarchy, can you?

do you feel like your "vote" has any effect on inivietabiltiy?

do you feel that the main puppet actually has any affect on anything (asides from who moans on internets)?

i mean really. most of you have endured multiple decades of this farce, and you still give it the time of day?

[Paul in NZ]

Being PM in NZ is pretty polarizing... The number of people with a passionate hatred of the guy is astounding when by all accounts, in person hes a pretty decent chap. Hes resisted the hate politics that seem to be popular right now..

Hes not my natural choice - but to be fair he has provided stability and direction. Hes rised our profile overseas and seems to get on well with other world leaders...

I think hes done the right thing - giving a new guy a chance to get going before an election but we will see. What I would hope is that his opponents dont start throwing in all the hate messages etc. Thats how the trumps of the world get elected..

[James Deuce]

I'd actually have more respect for the posters above if rather than just sledging John Key, they'd say that Andrew Little and Labour will do a far better job and nail their colours to the mast. Easy to slag off as we we see in virtually every thread on KB these days.

Andrew Little isn't an electable leader of the Labour Party. The Labour Party has a couple of steps to go before they'll have anything like a majority vote. In the meantime they'll be a coalition partner, at best the leading party in a coalition partnership.


Paula Bennett has been very quiet for a long time. I suspect she is more likely to end up PM than English or Collins, and that this decision was made some time ago.


In terms of nailing my flag to mast, there isn't a mast or a flag that suits. There isn't a party planning for the adoption of a minimum basic income or shift from Primary Produce to "something else" whatever it may be. There's no one opposing the neo-con/neo-liberal adherence to broken capitalist maxims, there's no one planning to improve the bulk of New Zealand's population's living standards.


So I have absolutley no hesitation in saying that it is a good thing that he is gone. The problem is the divisive damage to New Zealand's social fabric is done. There will be a growing pool of have-nots with little access to higher education and housing and a huge bunch of old people moving in with their kids within the next 20 years.

[Blackbird]

In terms of nailing my flag to mast, there isn't a mast or a flag that suits. There isn't a party planning for the adoption of a minimum basic income or shift from Primary Produce to "something else" whatever it may be. There's no one opposing the neo-con/neo-liberal adherence to broken capitalist maxims, there's no one planning to improve the bulk of New Zealand's population's living standards.


So I have absolutley no hesitation in saying that it is a good thing that he is gone. The problem is the divisive damage to New Zealand's social fabric is done. There will be a growing pool of have-nots with little access to higher education and housing and a huge bunch of old people moving in with their kids within the next 20 years.

Jim, massive respect for critical thinking without the norm of instantly slagging someone off who holds a different view - bloody excellent! :niceone:

[Paul in NZ]

Jim, massive respect for critical thinking without the norm of instantly slagging someone off who holds a different view - bloody excellent! :niceone:

Agreed.......

[Paul in NZ]

The problem is the divisive damage to New Zealand's social fabric is done. There will be a growing pool of have-nots with little access to higher education and housing and a huge bunch of old people moving in with their kids within the next 20 years.

And an equally huge bunch of kids moving in with their parents...

[Grumph]

And an equally huge bunch of kids moving in with their parents...

Beat me to it...

At least the left is able to recognise the income inequality where National are still denying it's seriousness.
On much the same line, it'll be interesting to see if they change their party policy on the retirement age.
Key maintained publicly that it was him stopping any change....

[TheDemonLord]

you old white cunts carry on like it matters? you cant truly believe that if they (politicos) dropped dead tomorrow, that everything would decay into cannabalism and anarchy, can you?

do you feel like your "vote" has any effect on inivietabiltiy?

do you feel that the main puppet actually has any affect on anything (asides from who moans on internets)?

i mean really. most of you have endured multiple decades of this farce, and you still give it the time of day?

South Africa.

[george formby]

do you feel like your "vote" has any effect on inivietabiltiy?


Only if it has increased the number "i's" in the alphabet, which may well be true.

[mashman]

you old white cunts carry on like it matters? you cant truly believe that if they (politicos) dropped dead tomorrow, that everything would decay into cannabalism and anarchy, can you?

do you feel like your "vote" has any effect on inivietabiltiy?

do you feel that the main puppet actually has any affect on anything (asides from who moans on internets)?

i mean really. most of you have endured multiple decades of this farce, and you still give it the time of day?

“If, tomorrow, I tell the press that, like, a gang banger will get shot, or a truckload of soldiers will be blown up, nobody panics, because it’s all ‘part of the plan’. But when I say that one little old MP has resigned, well then everyone loses their minds!”

[Akzle]

South Africa.

inevitability

[Ocean1]

Andrew Little isn't an electable leader of the Labour Party. The Labour Party has a couple of steps to go before they'll have anything like a majority vote. In the meantime they'll be a coalition partner, at best the leading party in a coalition partnership.


Paula Bennett has been very quiet for a long time. I suspect she is more likely to end up PM than English or Collins, and that this decision was made some time ago.


In terms of nailing my flag to mast, there isn't a mast or a flag that suits. There isn't a party planning for the adoption of a minimum basic income or shift from Primary Produce to "something else" whatever it may be. There's no one opposing the neo-con/neo-liberal adherence to broken capitalist maxims, there's no one planning to improve the bulk of New Zealand's population's living standards.


So I have absolutley no hesitation in saying that it is a good thing that he is gone. The problem is the divisive damage to New Zealand's social fabric is done. There will be a growing pool of have-nots with little access to higher education and housing and a huge bunch of old people moving in with their kids within the next 20 years.

There's 4 million of us, exactly how well tailored to you in particular do you expect that mast or flag to be?

I see he's coping flack from Don Brash for having done not much of any substance, but that's the main feature of his success: don't alienate too many minorities or those at the ends of the spectrum.

There's a lot that's laid at government's feet that doesn't actually belong there, and the political impossibility of disavowing responsibility for those and the subsequent failure to address them eventually accumulates some baggage. He should have moved earlier on house price increases, but there's a decade of hysteresis for any intervention there, and no solution that wouldn't have been unpopular with many, (see above).

And then, who the fuck would want the job, really? The quantity of vitriolic negativity from those minorities is hugely corrosive, and getting more so as the internet destroys any trace of truth or rational debate.

Which sorta points to off-shore, (impartial) evaluations of his performance as being probably more reliable, and most overseas commentators see him as having done very well.

[James Deuce]

I understand your points completely, however there are 4.7 million of us and a sizable majority of eligible voters don't vote. That can point to either there being a chunk of the population who have no potential representation or that a chunk of the population are not voting because there will be no material change to their personal outcome irrespective of the Government voted in. I suspect the latter. I think young people and the growing body of "elderly" people are bearing an unfair amount of the PR burden of shame for being, lazy, feckless, and economically incompetent. The goal posts have shifted so radically for those parts of society that they may as well be on another planet, and the changes have happened so quickly there was no preparing for it.

From a personal perspective, I have no representation available that provides a rational platform for a cross-society view of issues and the application of solutions. No one has the balls to unbundle and rebuild critical National infrastructure at either a physicalor intellectual level. I don't advocate for further tailoring at all. The current burden of legislation that covers Governance has turned into an unworkable mess that is burdening people and businesses. I'd like to see less granular involvement in people's lives and a far more innovative approach to providing people with an income that allows them to contribute to society instead of leeching the life out of it.

There's a lot of noise about automation and job loss at the moment. My job will be gone within the next decade, if the automation processes I suspect are imminent are implemented. It's a real concern for anyone working in an office. Most admin, legislative and diagnostic/analytical outcomes fall within a heuristic framework that can be documented and manipulated by relatively unsophisticated AI that almost meet the Turing Test parameters. I think it is irresponsible of any "Western" Government/Democracy to not be applying the lessons learned from when mass production jobs vanished in a wave of automation to the wave of middle/creative class jobs about to quietly vanish in an AI mediated wave of comprehensive change. If we do it right, we end up with an innovative growing economy. If we do it wrong we end up with a small "overclass" people supporting 4.7 million people in perpetual welfare misery. The latest round of large earthquakes demonstrated how Cloud technology has quietly revolutionised IT DR and Business Continuity. BUildings were shut,people stayed home, but businesses who had adopted cloud tech, remained operational and profitable.

[trufflebutter]

Naturally Bill English will be voted PM by the caucus. Who the hell wants that job at this point? The position of Deputy PM will be the roll that the remaining members will be vying for. Come the next Election when National could possibly become the opposition, and as per previous lost Elections, the Leader of the opposition will be ousted soon after.

[HenryDorsetCase]

You cunts can have Hillary if you want her, apparently she is looking for a job. She comes with Rosie O'Fatarse, Koonyay West and all the other douchbags that said they would move if trump won.

"Koonyay"

.....really?

in 2016?

You're a symptom of the problem.

But hey, at least your God Emperor got elected so you've got that going for you, which is nice.

[Ocean1]

I understand your points completely, however there are 4.7 million of us and a sizable majority of eligible voters don't vote. That can point to either there being a chunk of the population who have no potential representation or that a chunk of the population are not voting because there will be no material change to their personal outcome irrespective of the Government voted in. I suspect the latter. I think young people and the growing body of "elderly" people are bearing an unfair amount of the PR burden of shame for being, lazy, feckless, and economically incompetent. The goal posts have shifted so radically for those parts of society that they may as well be on another planet, and the changes have happened so quickly there was no preparing for it.

From a personal perspective, I have no representation available that provides a rational platform for a cross-society view of issues and the application of solutions. No one has the balls to unbundle and rebuild critical National infrastructure at either a physicalor intellectual level. I don't advocate for further tailoring at all. The current burden of legislation that covers Governance has turned into an unworkable mess that is burdening people and businesses. I'd like to see less granular involvement in people's lives and a far more innovative approach to providing people with an income that allows them to contribute to society instead of leeching the life out of it.

There's a lot of noise about automation and job loss at the moment. My job will be gone within the next decade, if the automation processes I suspect are imminent are implemented. It's a real concern for anyone working in an office. Most admin, legislative and diagnostic/analytical outcomes fall within a heuristic framework that can be documented and manipulated by relatively unsophisticated AI that almost meet the Turing Test parameters. I think it is irresponsible of any "Western" Government/Democracy to not be applying the lessons learned from when mass production jobs vanished in a wave of automation to the wave of middle/creative class jobs about to quietly vanish in an AI mediated wave of comprehensive change. If we do it right, we end up with an innovative growing economy. If we do it wrong we end up with a small "overclass" people supporting 4.7 million people in perpetual welfare misery. The latest round of large earthquakes demonstrated how Cloud technology has quietly revolutionised IT DR and Business Continuity. BUildings were shut,people stayed home, but businesses who had adopted cloud tech, remained operational and profitable.

A majority don't vote? I thought 3/4 did... http://www.elections.org.nz/events/2014-general-election/election-results-and-reporting/2014-general-election-voter-turnout
You can say those that don't are disenfranchised, but I'd suggest they're mostly just ambivalent. The fact that 99.999% of those non voters don't avail themselves of any of the many opportunities to stick their own hand up for representation of a different shape themselves tends to support that.

Yeah, but even those who's personal understanding of howshitworks aligns well with a particular party have huge holes in their preferred options for many issues. And I don't think it's that nobody has the balls, it's just that the majority of voters wouldn't accept the associated costs, so you never see election promises based on "let's focus on the physical and organisational infrastructure". That resulting unworkable mess is simply the shape of the majority's preferences on the full suite of issues. You can't blame them for not having the insight to understand the effects of each policy on the others. A few have a vague idea what effect policy changes will have within the area they relate to, but that's it. I'd blame politicians for not being the leaders that might present comprehensive analysis of that shit to voters, but the fact is since about the time TVs became common bullshit has been more powerful than intelligent discourse. Maybe let's set up a permanent, web based binding referendum platform and see how that works...

Yeah. Blame me too, I make shit that costs jobs. But inter-generational stability in professional options was last seen about James Watt's time, individual lifespan career options stopped being a thing about the time I got my first job. There has always been those who choose not to change careers when they need to, and as technology moves faster the number of people not actively and continuously learning new shit is increasing. Yes there needs to be a "ministry of job training and placement", but you can only teach so many dogs to new water. At what point does it become the responsibility of the individual to choose something other than multiple redundancy?

Oh, and when they sling your arse out of your nice warm office you can come set up my cloud accounting app for me.

[Akzle]

"Koonyay"

.....really?

in 2016?

You're a symptom of the problem.

But hey, at least your God Emperor got elected so you've got that going for you, which is nice.

be fair. he is does some pretty coon shit. i actively avoid MSM and still manage to hear about his coonery.
not that there isnt plenty of light-skindeds doing coonery too... it's in vogue.

[jasonu]

"Koonyay"

.....really?

in 2016?

You're a symptom of the problem.

But hey, at least your God Emperor got elected so you've got that going for you, which is nice.

Sorry I forgot you lot dote on him and his fat arse ho. Every time I look at the Herald he's in the headlines doing or saying some sort of jigaboo crap.

[PrincessBandit]

I understand your points completely, however there are 4.7 million of us and a sizable majority of eligible voters don't vote. That can point to either there being a chunk of the population who have no potential representation or that a chunk of the population are not voting because there will be no material change to their personal outcome irrespective of the Government voted in. I suspect the latter...



...There's a lot of noise about automation and job loss at the moment. My job will be gone within the next decade, if the automation processes I suspect are imminent are implemented....

First part of quote: holy crap, that sounds just like the US elections!!!

Second part of quote: at our year 9 and 10 prizegivings today our principal showed a video clip titled "Did you know that in 2028..." Don't know what authentication there is for some of the stuff in it, but commonsense yells that even if it's not "in the year 2028, 2028" (a la Zager and Evans) much of this is going to be inevitable. Scary that as teachers we are preparing students for work forces and careers which will be radically different from the status quo of the last few decades.

[Blackbird]

Scary that as teachers we are preparing students for work forces and careers which will be radically different from the status quo of the last few decades.

The rate of change may pick up a bit but certainly in the technical world, a fast rate of change and people having to adapt has been with us for at least 50 years. I don't really want to sound like an old fart (I'm a retired old fart :laugh:) but when I started engineering school, it was slide rules, then punch cards taken to the IBM mainframe, then PC's and a whole new world of engineering technology. I moved into something entirely new at 50. The point I'm making is teaching kids how to think and adapt becomes increasingly important. From personal experience, it isn't anywhere as scary as I might have imagined and life was a whole lot more interesting.

[Brian d marge]

Colman
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Coleman_(politician)
Crusher Collins

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Collins

Bill English

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_English

Oh what a choice .,...


sent for a divine source

[Akzle]

The fact that 99.999% of those non voters don't avail themselves of any of the many opportunities to stick their own hand up for representation of a different shape themselves tends to support that.
jeeeeeeesus. life in la-la land must be milk and honey (at reasonable prices, sustainably farmed and free of neonicitinoids...)
you serieusly can't see any other alternative that would play out to the same result?

and if, as I, one is completely unhappy with the entire farce, and don't want to be represented. then what?


I'd blame politicians for not being the leaders that...

and i'd blame the old white niggers who look to be lead, doubly if by politicians.


Maybe let's set up a permanent, web based binding referendum platform and see how that works...
you're a fucking wonder. 95% antiquated economic horseshit, then you come out with a jem like this

direct democracy. it's a comin (but still doesn't address many, many fundamental issues that not-old-white-niggers have with the system.)


There has always been those who choose not to change careers when they need to, and as technology moves faster the number of people not actively and continuously learning new shit is increasing. Yes there needs to be a "ministry of job training and placement", but you can only teach so many dogs to new water. At what point does it become the responsibility of the individual to choose something other than multiple redundancy?
at what point will you accept that 87 odd % of jobs are to be mechanised this decade? what do you actually propose that 87% of the population do? since the ather 13% is either un-doable by machines, or looking after the machines... that's a lot of people with a lot of time that somehow needs to make the jewgolds so the economoney...

you never answered why you don't pay for anything, either, just tender someone elses promise...

[bogan]

The rate of change may pick up a bit but certainly in the technical world, a fast rate of change and people having to adapt has been with us for at least 50 years. I don't really want to sound like an old fart (I'm a retired old fart :laugh:) but when I started engineering school, it was slide rules, then punch cards taken to the IBM mainframe, then PC's and a whole new world of engineering technology. I moved into something entirely new at 50. The point I'm making is teaching kids how to think and adapt becomes increasingly important. From personal experience, it isn't anywhere as scary as I might have imagined and life was a whole lot more interesting.

And some education institutions are adapting to that, especially the tech side where we're given the knowledge to apply new tools and concepts, rather than rote learn the current ones (tests unfortunately seem to try and combat this though). So many people enjoy and excel in the new fields who wouldn't have been given the opportunity even 30 years ago. And there were still jobless, lazy fuckers 30 years ago (http://www.tradingeconomics.com/new-zealand/unemployment-rate), they just didn't have the internet to soap box on all day.

In any case, now is still the time to have a say in politics, policies are voted on at election time (which will remain a landslide national win), but they are formed in times like this.


and if, as I, one is completely unhappy with the entire farce, and don't want to be represented. then what?

We laugh at your tirades of blither about how you think things should be (I'll give you a hint, that is tantamount to asking for representation).

[Moi]

The rate of change may pick up a bit but certainly in the technical world, a fast rate of change and people having to adapt has been with us for at least 50 years. I don't really want to sound like an old fart (I'm a retired old fart :laugh:) but when I started engineering school, it was slide rules, then punch cards taken to the IBM mainframe, then PC's and a whole new world of engineering technology. I moved into something entirely new at 50.

The point I'm making is teaching kids how to think and adapt becomes increasingly important.

From personal experience, it isn't anywhere as scary as I might have imagined and life was a whole lot more interesting.

The sentence I've made bold is what is often referred to as "transferable skills"...

and probably the most important transferable skills are literacy and numeracy skills.

[Brian d marge]

Being PM in NZ is pretty polarizing... The number of people with a passionate hatred of the guy is astounding when by all accounts, in person hes a pretty decent chap. Hes resisted the hate politics that seem to be popular right now..

Hes not my natural choice - but to be fair he has provided stability and direction. Hes rised our profile overseas and seems to get on well with other world leaders...

I think hes done the right thing - giving a new guy a chance to get going before an election but we will see. What I would hope is that his opponents dont start throwing in all the hate messages etc. Thats how the trumps of the world get elected..
you seems to forget , about the two week memory loss back in the eighties when he ( or at least he was in the same office ) sold NZ down the river to Andy Krieger? ( spelling, cause im to lazy to check )

Try as people might they just cant find any details about that magic time in the teflon Dons career ....

And the replacement aint much better .....

[Brian d marge]

The sentence I've made bold is what is often referred to as "transferable skills"...

and probably the most important transferable skills are literacy and numeracy skills.
What about self sufficiency skills ?

sent for a divine source

[merv]

No idea, but the second one says Haley Westerna and thats def Haley Holt.

I just googled Hayley Holt and got this page
http://happybday.to/Hayley-Holt
as Jason and Brian_de marge likely have no idea who she is?
Regardless All of them look like pretty effective MP's.

The first pic isn't Haley Holt but the other two are.

[R650R]

and getting more so as the internet destroys any trace of truth or rational debate.



That old chestnut of rational debate aye... Ya know your on the internet here......

Back in my day it was the same when we started letting people write books, then some crazy radical started libraries, it was just like the internet but without electricity and porn....
All of a sudden the masses were exposed to other peoples ideas and opinions.... may have caused a revolution or too....

[R650R]

Back to topic.... John Boy resigned after seeing Hillary get smoked.... He wanted to leave with his dignity intact.
Not by losing to a Greens/Maori/Gareth Morgan/colin craig coaliktion.....

Ya see the only people voting these days are hipsters and eco activists. The traditional aprty faithful are in resthomes these days or moved to aussie for better jobs.
The old power monopolies of two partys at the top are crushed, Trumps victory is showing disaffected people their votes matter..... we live in interesting times.....

[Brian d marge]

The first pic isn't Haley Holt but the other two are.
I know who she is , I saw her in that new film ,,

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161206/8614293fdce55512b032f628c7279ded.gif



sent for a divine source

[husaberg]

The first pic isn't Haley Holt but the other two are.

Yeah, but more intersting, its now quite possible that she might actually win John Keys seat.

[Brian d marge]

That old chestnut of rational debate aye... Ya know your on the internet here......

Back in my day it was the same when we started letting people write books, then some crazy radical started libraries, it was just like the internet but without electricity and porn....
All of a sudden the masses were exposed to other peoples ideas and opinions.... may have caused a revolution or too....
National Geographic , Sept 22 1905 edition
Sadly my copy has seen some action

sent for a divine source

[Brian d marge]

Vote Thx1138 , Vote

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/eHgqfVQWv7s" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[HenryDorsetCase]

Sorry I forgot you lot dote on him and his fat arse ho. Every time I look at the Herald he's in the headlines doing or saying some sort of jigaboo crap.

no, my problem is with your blatant and appalling and unacceptable racism.

I dislike Kanye West's music, and in fact the entireity of that celebrity culture and I disengage from it entirely. I dislike his awful music and unenviable lifestyle - I dont care what colour he is.

So we're clear.

[Voltaire]

The rate of change may pick up a bit but certainly in the technical world, a fast rate of change and people having to adapt has been with us for at least 50 years. I don't really want to sound like an old fart (I'm a retired old fart :laugh:) but when I started engineering school, it was slide rules, then punch cards taken to the IBM mainframe, then PC's and a whole new world of engineering technology. I moved into something entirely new at 50. The point I'm making is teaching kids how to think and adapt becomes increasingly important. From personal experience, it isn't anywhere as scary as I might have imagined and life was a whole lot more interesting.

I started off as an apprentice Electrician working for the Post Office based in Newmarket, I caught the train into the city to attend meetings the other day and passed the old workshops, now lots of multi story apartments, the CPO where I used to also work is now a train station.

As long as I have my laptop and phone with me I can work from anywhere, today working from home....I wonder if working from home is easing us into just being at home not working.

Still got my ticket so potentially could be that old guy at Bunnings who knows stuff.:eek5:

[Blackbird]

I started off as an apprentice Electrician working for the Post Office based in Newmarket, I caught the train into the city to attend meetings the other day and passed the old workshops, now lots of multi story apartments, the CPO where I used to also work is now a train station.

As long as I have my laptop and phone with me I can work from anywhere, today working from home....I wonder if working from home is easing us into just being at home not working.

Still got my ticket so potentially could be that old guy at Bunnings who knows stuff.:eek5:

Yep, when I retired, I was retained by my old company for a year to manage a project and largely worked from home by PC. In some ways, it was quite good as I could focus on the task and not get deflected by the corporate crap which gets in the way of daily life in a big organisation. They wanted me to do some more work when I finished the project but that's not why I retired early so turned them down. Really pleased I did!

Funny you should mention the old guy at Bunnings. We haven't got one up this way but Placemakers at Whitianga is staffed by older people who really know their stuff and it's a joy to shop there.

[FatMax]

Being PM in NZ is pretty polarizing... The number of people with a passionate hatred of the guy is astounding when by all accounts, in person hes a pretty decent chap. Hes resisted the hate politics that seem to be popular right now..

Hes not my natural choice - but to be fair he has provided stability and direction. Hes rised our profile overseas and seems to get on well with other world leaders...

I think hes done the right thing - giving a new guy a chance to get going before an election but we will see. What I would hope is that his opponents dont start throwing in all the hate messages etc. Thats how the trumps of the world get elected..

Much as I never trusted a word he said (JK that is, not you Paul), this has got to be the most sensible post of this debate, especially the Trump warning.

Doubt it will make any difference to the inbred apathy that surrounds NZ voters

[pete376403]

Not Collins. The year is looking (very slightly, almost immeasurably) better.

[Brian d marge]

Different masks on the same face

there might be a better way .......

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/imhrDrE4-mI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[yokel]

http://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/86903016/key-says-a-genderbalanced-cabinet-was-a-stupid-idea

Nek minnit, Judith Collins is going for ya job and we now have a solo mum as deputy PM.

I hope this Bill English guy is not a cuck.

[russd7]

news head line on the telly tonight,
"bill english starts as our new prime minister, but what is his stance on gay marriage."

pleased we don't have any real problems that need dealt with

[Grumph]

news head line on the telly tonight,
"bill english starts as our new prime minister, but what is his stance on gay marriage."

pleased we don't have any real problems that need dealt with

It might not be a "real" problem but the Pike River families are going to be a major annoyance for him. And good on them too.

The Govt is dammed if they don't let them in - and dammed if something is found that goes against what their experts have said.
The deal struck with mine management just smells worse the longer things roll on.

[russd7]

It might not be a "real" problem but the Pike River families are going to be a major annoyance for him. And good on them too.

The Govt is dammed if they don't let them in - and dammed if something is found that goes against what their experts have said.
The deal struck with mine management just smells worse the longer things roll on.

hear what you are saying but i heard that it is worksafe that are stopping re-entry, kinda a real hard one. how much life do you risk to bring out bones, and before any one says that if it were my family ect ect ect, then think again. i would not want some one to risk their life to bring out bones, comes a point where one must say that life is for the living and the dead know no different, time to move on.

[Ocean1]

hear what you are saying but i heard that it is worksafe that are stopping re-entry, kinda a real hard one. how much life do you risk to bring out bones, and before any one says that if it were my family ect ect ect, then think again. i would not want some one to risk their life to bring out bones, comes a point where one must say that life is for the living and the dead know no different, time to move on.

It's even simpler than that: When you make someone responsible for safety then you have to abide by their decisions.

[merv]

I could never figure out why they don't have some sort of safe vehicle that can go up the drift that wouldn't trigger methane explosions.

Searching online there is this vehicle https://www.draeger.com/en_aunz/Applications/Products/Rescue-and-Shelter-Systems/Regeneration-Systems/MRV-9000 but would it be good enough?

All we've had with Pike River is no-one will go in there. So why isn't there some sort of robotic vehicle that can go in without people on board? Is this heading in the right direction but have they not been built yet? http://www.argusrobotics.com/a8minerescuevehicle.html

[granstar]

Being tested as you speak...http://www.thehits.co.nz/media/4827438/untitled-1.jpg?mode=crop&width=620&height=349&quality=100&scale=both

[Skidmark McRaven]

Hahahahahaha......Bernie Monk or Tim Shadbolt for PM!

[husaberg]

I could never figure out why they don't have some sort of safe vehicle that can go up the drift that wouldn't trigger methane explosions.

Searching online there is this vehicle https://www.draeger.com/en_aunz/Applications/Products/Rescue-and-Shelter-Systems/Regeneration-Systems/MRV-9000 but would it be good enough?

All we've had with Pike River is no-one will go in there. So why isn't there some sort of robotic vehicle that can go in without people on board? Is this heading in the right direction but have they not been built yet? http://www.argusrobotics.com/a8minerescuevehicle.html

There has already been 3 robots that have failed in the drift.

[Grumph]

There has already been 3 robots that have failed in the drift.

Winston will bring them out.....

[husaberg]

Winston will bring them out.....

If only his bluster was strong enough.
Funny thing is hes certtainly of the right size to go in there. (Shit he short)

[russd7]

I could never figure out why they don't have some sort of safe vehicle that can go up the drift that wouldn't trigger methane explosions.

look up "intrinsically safe", i would think it would be extremely difficult to make a machine that is controlled remotely to go that distance and still be intrinsically safe..

remember Solid Energy (government) did not own the mine when the explosion happened and yet they seem to be getting the blame for not getting the ashes out.

personally i say seal the fucker and let sleeping dogs lie.

[Akzle]

remember Solid Energy (government) did not own the mine when the explosion happened and yet they seem to be getting the blame for not getting the ashes out. might have something to do with johnny saying, rather emphatically " we WILL get them out" innit.


personally i say seal the fucker and let sleeping dogs lie.

and you have skin in the game do you?

[husaberg]

Judge Farish slammed the Pike River company for a “total lack of remorse” and claims that it could not afford to pay reparation to the families.

“It is not often a company steps back and holds its hands up and says ‘I have nothing’. Even a company in a fragile state usually comes forward and offers reparation, but here nothing has been forthcoming.
“I am satisfied the company has the means to pay either by existing shareholders or a combination of the shareholders and directors. I note that the directors have significant insurance.”
But the Judge’s very strong statements did not embarrass the relevant parties into coughing up although it has been said that at least one shareholder has had the decency to make a pro rata offer of cash from his share of the insurance payout.
So how did John Key respond to suggestions that the shareholders of the parent company NZ Oil and Gas should stump up with the cash? After all these included ACC and the Cullen Fund and favourable noises from him would have no doubt persuaded these entities to at least pay their share of the compensation ordered. Between them they own about 7% of NZOG’s shares have a 7% direct or indirect stake in Pike River so on a pro rata basis a miserly $238,000 would have to be paid. Their share of the insurance payout of $80 million that NZOG received would be $5.6 million so the Government could have paid its share of the compensation from this amount and barely missed it.
But Key ruled this out on the basis that he would be creating a precedent
https://thestandard.org.nz/key-refuses-to-pay-compensation-for-pike-river/

“the royal commission into the tragedy found the then Labour Department should have issued a prohibition notice when Pike started hydro extraction of coal in September 2010 because the mine lacked a second emergency exit.” The commission finding said that “[t]he Department of Labour did not have the focus, capacity or strategies to ensure that Pike was meeting its legal responsibilities under health and safety laws. The department assumed that Pike was complying with the law, even though there was ample evidence to the contrary.”


“[t]he royal commission’s report also highlighted that the Government’s mining inspectorate had substantially declined since new health and safety laws were introduced in 1992. It had ignored warnings that the changes could be disastrous for mining” lawyer Nick Davidson QC said.

[bogan]

look up "intrinsically safe", i would think it would be extremely difficult to make a machine that is controlled remotely to go that distance and still be intrinsically safe..

remember Solid Energy (government) did not own the mine when the explosion happened and yet they seem to be getting the blame for not getting the ashes out.

personally i say seal the fucker and let sleeping dogs lie.

That shit's only tricky when you have other constraints, build cost/time, interface/sensor choices. Blanks slate and blank cheque would make it easy enough.

[russd7]

might have something to do with johnny saying, rather emphatically " we WILL get them out" innit.

and you have skin in the game do you?
yeah i understand that about johnny but it is not only politicians that make rash statements in the heat of the moment.

as for skin in the game, no, but anyone that knows me well knows that even if i did i would say the same thing, not cold hearted but i also know that bringing back bones or even ashes isn't going to bring the closure that anyone is expecting. only thing that can do that is people chosing to move on and continue living life while they are still alive.

those people that died will never be forgotten in our lifetime.

to be honest, the only thing i would be hunting for is someone to be held accountable for the whole clusterfuck that lead to this result.

[pete376403]

to be honest, the only thing i would be hunting for is someone to be held accountable for the whole clusterfuck that lead to this result.

Which could be why solid energy are so keen not to have anyone looking in there.

[Akzle]

.

to be honest, the only thing i would be hunting for is someone to be held accountable for the whole clusterfuck that lead to this result.

which IMO, is pretty much what's seeking to be hidden by filling the cunt with concrete.

given the nature of the fires and the falls, it's doubtful you'd even tell which piles of ash were carcasses. the time to have done it would have been immediately after the first explosion, when there was insufficient gas to reignite. SCBAs and y'd've been away.

read a book about it, it put the blame squarely on the controller (peter whitall?) who sounds like a weasely cunt as-is, and i believe has has fucked off to his motorlaunch somewhere. ahhh. justice.

[Ocean1]

look up "intrinsically safe", i would think it would be extremely difficult to make a machine that is controlled remotely to go that distance and still be intrinsically safe..

remember Solid Energy (government) did not own the mine when the explosion happened and yet they seem to be getting the blame for not getting the ashes out.

personally i say seal the fucker and let sleeping dogs lie.


That shit's only tricky when you have other constraints, build cost/time, interface/sensor choices. Blanks slate and blank cheque would make it easy enough.

Aye. I've made wee magnetic crawlers for survey work on/in bulk storage tanks, which are invariably DG class 1 zone 1 designated areas and need intrinsically safe power systems, (unless they've been certified gas free etc).

Simplest approach I've found is to use compressed gas for motive power, there's just no practical way to intrinsically safe that much hp. Instrumentation's a different matter, most of that can be bought intrinsically safe off the shelf. And in fact it's been a long time since I needed to do even that, laser tracking and com's systems are well below the energy limit.

[husaberg]

Aye. I've made wee magnetic crawlers for survey work on/in bulk storage tanks, which are invariably DG class 1 zone 1 designated areas and need intrinsically safe power systems, (unless they've been certified gas free etc).

Simplest approach I've found is to use compressed gas for motive power, there's just no practical way to intrinsically safe that much hp. Instrumentation's a different matter, most of that can be bought intrinsically safe off the shelf. And in fact it's been a long time since I needed to do even that, laser tracking and com's systems are well below the energy limit.

Which is exactly what the underground startermotors use.

[Ocean1]

Which is exactly what the underground startermotors use.

That, or spring starters, (there's a Ford D series spring starter somewhere around here, left over from a boat building project).

But you'd want to be using a shitload less air for a survey crawler than an air starter does. Mine weigh bugger all, couple of KG, the motors are about the size of my thumb, including gearbox. I can do a complete tank survey on well less than a G size bottle of Co2.

[merv]

See now you are talking. The gummint keeps panicking about losing more people, so why send people in if you can send machines in? Job done.

[russd7]

(peter whitall?) who sounds like a weasely cunt as-is, and i believe has has fucked off to his motorlaunch somewhere. ahhh. justice.

thats the fucker, his name escaped me earlier.

[russd7]

Which could be why solid energy are so keen not to have anyone looking in there.

why would solid energy be worried, they took ownership after the fact.

[husaberg]

That, or spring starters, (there's a Ford D series spring starter somewhere around here, left over from a boat building project).

But you'd want to be using a shitload less air for a survey crawler than an air starter does. Mine weigh bugger all, couple of KG, the motors are about the size of my thumb, including gearbox. I can do a complete tank survey on well less than a G size bottle of Co2.

there is an Aussie firm i can't recall the name of, that makes most of the FP starters compressed air = no poential arcing.
They also make very tasty Vincent replicas.
http://www.khequipment.com.au/
http://www.irvingvincent.com/
http://www.irvingvincent.com/bikes

[Ocean1]

See now you are talking. The gummint keeps panicking about losing more people, so why send people in if you can send machines in? Job done.

Because standard H&S protocols consider any avoidable risk should actually be avoided.

And no matter how small the risk in anything/one entering that mine it's still there, so unless there's the possibility of saving lives the answer will always be that it's not worth even a very small risk.

[Ocean1]

there is an Aussie firm i can't recall the name of, that makes most of the FP starters compressed air = no poential arcing.
They also make very tasty Vincent replicas.
http://www.khequipment.com.au/
http://www.irvingvincent.com/
http://www.irvingvincent.com/bikes

Yes, I've seen those hydraulic units before.

One good thing about spring starters: you have to crank them up every time, they tend to encourage a good level of engine maintenance. :laugh: