Another near miss blathering....

[R650R]

Southbound on SH1 towards Wairakei a perfect storm of otherwise negligible happenings brewed up to create a holy heck that could have ended badly moment yesterday morning.
Sure many will know the location, big long sweeping left hander just past Palmer mill road, northbound passing lane on other side of road.
Had been caught up to a dithering 4wd that of course suddenly found speed on the downhill but was the type of driver you didn't want to sit behind. The two of us caught a trio of vehicles, two of which had trailers.
After round the left I saw ample clear road ahead to effect a safe and legal pass of the 4wd to set me up to get the other three on the last southbound passing lane before taupo junction.

Passing the 4wd I got to pull in behind the ute at the back of the trio who are all a bit close for me to want to pass any further here. Suddenly the ute jams his brakes and pulls left. At first I just think hes being an ahole or needlessly helpful when I quickly notice all three of them are emergency braking because their mate up front in light truck towing small trailer has dropped an unsecured ramp which is dragging on the ground behind it.
Thank F$%& the 4wd I just passed was paying attention as it was very quickly turning into a DR sandwich.
Yes there was room withen in the lane to just gas it and nail it but would have resulted in excessive speed gain in a highly policed area and an aggressive looking pass to the *555 brigade.
All in all a real nothing of a situation but a good reminder how anything can happen out there anytime and how the slightest of negligence can initiate an event.

[CB ARGH]

Lucky you're okay!

Thankfully the worst I've had fall in front of me on the bike is ciggy buts and apple cores. Different story in the car though.... a ladder fell off a vehicle and I thought I'd be able to clear it (cmon a Honda Prelude could take the beach) naaah the ladder caught under the engine bay and I grinded to a halt from 100km/hr. No damage.

[ellipsis]

...those cigarette butts are a scourge...I was out riding recently when some arsehole flicked one out the window and it ended up on my visor...it burned through the visor, through my eye and right through my brain and out the back of my skull, through the lining of my helmet which is when I realised what was happening due to the smell, and then right through the shell of the helmet...apart from smelling the foam helmet liner I was quite unaware of what had happened...when I stopped for a latte at my favourite hangout the Barista pointed out the hole in my head...I was wondering what the whistling noise was...a bit like a Shark helmet I once had...it got very annoying, so when I got home I bought a second hand brain from the Nth Island...I got a really good deal on it, a second hand, truck driver's it was, never been used...

[old slider]

...those cigarette butts are a scourge...I was out riding recently when some arsehole flicked one out the window and it ended up on my visor...it burned through the visor, through my eye and right through my brain and out the back of my skull, through the lining of my helmet which is when I realised what was happening due to the smell, and then right through the shell of the helmet...apart from smelling the foam helmet liner I was quite unaware of what had happened...when I stopped for a latte at my favourite hangout the Barista pointed out the hole in my head...I was wondering what the whistling noise was...a bit like a Shark helmet I once had...it got very annoying, so when I got home I bought a second hand brain from the Nth Island...I got a really good deal on it, a second hand, truck driver's it was, never been used...


Lol, Lucky you had a full face helmet. The buggers losing paper out their car window causes a stir when it suddenly clings to your visor, especially if its the NZ herald or similar.

True but sad story was a chap riding along a Wanganui city road many years ago was decapitated by a sheet of corr iron that wasn't secured properly on an approaching vehicle.

[Moi]

...those cigarette butts are a scourge...I was out riding recently when some arsehole flicked one out the window and it ended up on my visor...it burned through the visor, through my eye and right through my brain and out the back of my skull, through the lining of my helmet which is when I realised what was happening due to the smell, and then right through the shell of the helmet...apart from smelling the foam helmet liner I was quite unaware of what had happened...when I stopped for a latte at my favourite hangout the Barista pointed out the hole in my head...I was wondering what the whistling noise was...a bit like a Shark helmet I once had...it got very annoying, so when I got home I bought a second hand brain from the Nth Island...I got a really good deal on it, a second hand, truck driver's it was, never been used...

Margaret Mahy would approve of that story... :yes::first:

[jasonu]

Maybe someone just slamed on their brakes for a dog or some other animal up ahead.

Or maybe it was someone who knows you and was trying to run your annoying arse into the weeds.

[old slider]

I think this Harley rider may have been able to avoided this. But in saying that maybe a quick shift out to the right through the gap would or could result in a really high speed smack from behind.

https://youtu.be/CIuYf5T0d5U

[Jeff Sichoe]

I think this Harley rider may have been able to avoided this. But in saying that maybe a quick shift out to the right through the gap would or could result in a really high speed smack from behind.

https://youtu.be/CIuYf5T0d5U

it looks like he didn't even react until half his stopping distance was gone

[pritch]

I got spooked in the same way myself once when all the traffic in front slamed on their brakes in front of me on a passing lane and I thought there may have been an accident up ahead but I saw no accident. Maybe someone just slamed on their brakes for a dog or some other animal up ahead.

Nah! Somebody realised Cassina was coming. :whistle:

[GazzaH]

it looks like he didn't even react until half his stopping distance was gone

With 20/20 hindsight yes, but he was extremely lucky and very restrained given the circumstances.

The real point for us is to think and learn. Would we have fared so well? I'm not sure I would have!

[nzspokes]

According to some on here if you go to riding school you would have been able to sense

Maybe a trained rider would not have got into the situation in the first place......

[Runty]

Target fixation - he had plenty of time and room to avoid an impact

Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk

[Berries]

The real point for us is to think and learn. Would we have fared so well? I'm not sure I would have!
No offence, but you should be expecting that to happen if you are fapping along in the outside lane. You can watch the video several times and start to pick out a few faults which is the 20:20 hindsight thing but jeez, there should be enough alarm bells ringing before the car even entered his lane. While indicating.


Interesting comments below the video. Perhaps that vid should be posted in the "GoPro wearers are all wankers" thread as well.

[swarfie]

If he'd been riding something with some real brakes instead of a tractor that probably wouldn't have happened. Even my drum braked classics could have avoided that :dodge:

[old slider]

If he'd been riding something with some real brakes instead of a tractor that probably wouldn't have happened. Even my drum braked classics could have avoided that :dodge:

That Fat Bob has decent twin front discs and an adequate rear disc, they pull up nearly 400kg of bike and rider in reasonable fashion, but firstly you must use them.

[FJRider]

I was quite unaware of what had happened ...

You're a Harley rider ... right ... ?? ;)

[old slider]

You're a Harley rider ... right ... ?? ;)


You asking me? if so, yes, the same model as in the video, I also ride a Japanese bike which has a single front disc and a rear drum, if it makes any difference. The 310kg Harley out breaks the Kawasaki.

[FJRider]

According to some on here if you go to riding school you would have been able to sense the vehicle you came up behind was about to slam on their brakes before they actually did. I got spooked in the same way myself once when all the traffic in front slamed on their brakes in front of me on a passing lane and I thought there may have been an accident up ahead but I saw no accident. Maybe someone just slamed on their brakes for a dog or some other animal up ahead.

It does not take a riding school graduate to know ... that to concentrate only on the rear vehicle in a group of three you are approaching from behind ... is a mistake. The one in front largely dictates what the ones behind will do. Two of the three vehicles in front ... towing trailers ... should set your alarm bells ringing. Towing a heavy or un-braked trailer downhill under control can have it's issues. Especially trying to slow for a lower speed zone.

Personally ... I would prefer a speeding ticket ... than get involved in a "foursome" in such cases. When in doubt .. get the fuck out.


ps. What the fuck is your issue with dogs ... ???

[FJRider]

You asking me?

Was I quoting you ??? (if it makes any difference)

[caseye]

Was I quoting you ??? (if it makes any difference)

Don't do it FJ, PLease, it's not worth the life of the next million trees while she tells her lifes worst story about dogs.
Just, let it lie, see what I did there?

[old slider]

Was I quoting you ??? (if it makes any difference)

All good, I see some people seem to have regular quotes on their and wasn't sure if yours was one of these, I couldn't find any relation to your quote in the last few replies. My mistake.

my reply was simply saying the Harley you inferred didn't have real brakes, actually brakes better than my Japanese bike.

[nzspokes]

Even the best riders can come to grief and that was demonstrated by the death of the motorcycle racer on a push bike ride recently. Or are you saying if he had gone to your riding school he would still be alive today?

I dont have a riding school. :tugger:

You are not good on the understandings.......

[FJRider]

BULLSHIT ...

The original poster stated he COULD see ahead ... both before and after the original overtake. He said he could see three vehicles ahead (two with a trailer) before the first overtake. Is English your second language .. ?? You're Asian right .. ??

[FJRider]

Even the best riders can come to grief and that was demonstrated by the death of the motorcycle racer on a push bike ride recently. Or are you saying if he had gone to your riding school he would still be alive today?

He was hit by a car whilst riding a bicycle on a public road. Few Motorcycle schools can teach how to avoid that.

[FJRider]

I got the impression that in your previous post you made a "general statement" in that it is a mistake to only focus on the vehicle in front.

If you live in (or near) Christchurch and dont travel far from there ... and still find it difficult to see three vehicles ahead ... get your eyes tested. That also might explain you high accident rate too ...

And petition your local council to have high vis jackets made compulsory in the city By-laws ... for all dogs within the city boundary. You might get to see them sooner ...

[FJRider]

So its impossible to learn to sense that shit is about to happen if you are riding a push bike and not a motorbike?

Ride your motorcycle in the cycle lane and you might be safe. Works for me .. :shifty:

[nzspokes]

So its impossible to learn to sense that shit is about to happen if you are riding a push bike and not a motorbike?

How many times have you crashed a push bike?

[Berries]

Even the best riders can come to grief and that was demonstrated by the death of the motorcycle racer on a push bike ride recently. Or are you saying if he had gone to your riding school he would still be alive today?
If you don't know what you are talking about why not just keep quiet.

No question mark there as I will ignore any response because you are an idiot.

[SVboy]

By feeding the troll you only encourage it.

[caspernz]

I think this Harley rider may have been able to avoided this. But in saying that maybe a quick shift out to the right through the gap would or could result in a really high speed smack from behind.

https://youtu.be/CIuYf5T0d5U

The GoPro required nothing from the "riding to the conditions" department on this occasion...:rolleyes:


it looks like he didn't even react until half his stopping distance was gone

Well yeah, traffic ahead slowing but let's just keep rolling at same speed, then react like treacle when the obvious happens...:cool:


No offence, but you should be expecting that to happen if you are fapping along in the outside lane. You can watch the video several times and start to pick out a few faults which is the 20:20 hindsight thing but jeez, there should be enough alarm bells ringing before the car even entered his lane. While indicating.


Interesting comments below the video. Perhaps that vid should be posted in the "GoPro wearers are all wankers" thread as well.

It's either for the "GoPro wearers are wankers" thread or the "I may be related to Cassina" thread which may soon be deleted...:mad:

[old slider]

The GoPro required nothing from the "riding to the conditions" department on this occasion...:rolleyes:



Well yeah, traffic ahead slowing but let's just keep rolling at same speed, then react like treacle when the obvious happens...:cool:



It's either for the "GoPro wearers are wankers" thread or the "I may be related to Cassina" thread which may soon be deleted...:mad:



Enjoyed this thread,

Helped me scrutinize my own riding and also reinforced the importance of awareness or lack of.

[caspernz]

Only idiots like you believe going to a riding school will make them bullet proof. I have struck a raw nerve with you and your mates that shit can happen to even better riders than you lot eh?

At no point did anybody ever suggest taking a riding class (or ongoing training of any kind) will make a rider bullet proof. Your choice to make that assumption. Hazard awareness is a skill that can be taught, used properly it can significantly reduce the frequency and/or severity of an accident. The prerequisite to learning is an open mind, which apparently is your downfall. Please give the "stuff happens too quick to react to" record a rest, for it merely reinforces your own shortcomings. It has no benefit for any new rider that you continually wish to bestows this on. If stuff happens too quick to react to, you're either going too fast for the conditions or your forward observation needs to extend further.

Your reluctance to have your skill weighed and measured to a recognized standard thus invalidates any comments you choose to make. Have you done the ACC sponsored Rideforever courses? Have you looked at any Roadcraft style teaching to further your skills? Have you done anything at all to improve your defensive riding? The number of accidents you admit to would certainly warrant some sort of assistance from an external source, rather than just relying on lady luck...

Some of us have done a fair amount of rider training beyond obtaining the licence, and we choose to comment from a mildly more advanced stand point. Your rantings just get in the way, thus you cop a fair bit of flack. Polite mode occasionally works for me...


Enjoyed this thread,

Helped me scrutinize my own riding and also reinforced the importance of awareness or lack of.

Oh heck at least you've kept an open mind about it all. Prerequisite number one :first:

[ellipsis]

...I was enjoying this thread too, until posters started feeding that ignorant fuckwit...why?...it is (the fuckwit) way past the point of being entertaining and almost now, nauseating...

[SVboy]

By feeding the troll, you only encourage it.

[caspernz]

But the point you and your mates dont get is that there is no way of telling in advance when another vehicle, person or animal is going to go from a state of minding their own business to being a hazard. How far you are away from them should they become a hazard towards you all comes down to luck and not riding school training.

Since you've not partaken in any defensive riding/driving education in recent times, may I suggest you actually open your mind and go along to one of the Rideforever courses? You'd be surprised what you may actually pick up. Beyond that I fit into the category of being rather unwilling to debate with you, at least in this manner, or should I add in a civil fashion. It's your choice to have the stance you have, but to foist your single minded opinion upon other members of this forum is what irks quite a number of us.

The basis of the Rideforever series is Roadcraft, in itself proven to work, and used by a number of establishments worldwide. Using Roadcraft reduces my need to rely on luck, as you'd find if you actually attended one of the aforementioned courses. Over and out.


By feeding the troll, you only encourage it.

My sole purpose is to interject, on occasion only mind you, so as to not have newbs suffer from taking onboard stuff that is just so wrong...as obvious as it may seem. I still come across riders who fear using the front brake with any gusto lest it launch them over the handlebars...

[Moi]

Oh heck at least you've kept an open mind about it all. Prerequisite number one :first:

Not just an open mind, but an open mind that is thinking about what's happening... the "What if..." thoughts.

What if someone changes lanes?

What if someone drives out of that farm driveway?

What if there's a mob of cows just round the corner? [esp this time of year]

What if that bus just pulls out?

and so on...

[Moi]

... My sole purpose is to interject, on occasion only mind you, so as to not have newbs suffer from taking onboard stuff that is just so wrong...as obvious as it may seem. I still come across riders who fear using the front brake with any gusto lest it launch them over the handlebars...

Recently spent a Sunday morning with a few riding friends doing a bit of slow riding and emergency stopping practise... a well worthwhile couple of hours...

As I used to tell the kids I taught: "If you want to be good at something you have to practise and you have to critique and be critiqued".

Having someone watch you ride and critique a couple of points is so worthwhile.

[caspernz]

Not just an open mind, but an open mind that is thinking about what's happening... the "What if..." thoughts.

What if someone changes lanes?

What if someone drives out of that farm driveway?

What if there's a mob of cows just round the corner? [esp this time of year]

What if that bus just pulls out?

and so on...


Recently spent a Sunday morning with a few riding friends doing a bit of slow riding and emergency stopping practise... a well worthwhile couple of hours...

As I used to tell the kids I taught: "If you want to be good at something you have to practise and you have to critique and be critiqued".

Having someone watch you ride and critique a couple of points is so worthwhile.

Yes that riding and being critiqued can be tough at first, but I've gone thru that and it just means you come out the other end a better/safer rider for it.

Great to see you've got it sussed :woohoo:

[Jeeper]

Safe following distance is luck, and not driver/rider awareness training and understanding of physics? What a revelation. I've been ignorant of my luck all these years. I have learned so much from this thread. Keep up the good work everyone.

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

[Zedder]

Not just an open mind, but an open mind that is thinking about what's happening... the "What if..." thoughts.

What if someone changes lanes?

What if someone drives out of that farm driveway?

What if there's a mob of cows just round the corner? [esp this time of year]

What if that bus just pulls out?

and so on...


Thankfully you didn't write a "What if " for a dog running out because apparently, they're impossible to avoid...

[pritch]

This time of year those of us out on the rural rump have an extra what if to consider, "What if there has been cow shit dumped around the corner?"

[Moi]

Thankfully you didn't write a "What if " for a dog running out because, apparently, they're impossible to avoid...

'Twas tempted,


but I think that's really tempting the fickle finger of fate... :nono:

[Zedder]

'Twas tempted,


but I think that's really tempting the fickle finger of fate... :nono:


Indeed, the dog bowler knows that too well.

[Zedder]

This time of year those of us out on the rural rump have an extra what if to consider, "What if there has been cow shit dumped around the corner?"


Or a dog taking a dump mid corner...

[pritch]

1. But if riding schools were so good why is it not a prerequisite to go to one when going for a motorcycle license?

2. I have read that going to one can create overconfidence in riding ability.

3. I agree with them as teaching safe riding where the rider is in control but to suggest going to one to keep you safe from the screwups of others is just luck.



1. Simple, it's in the same 'too hard basket' as training car drivers properly.

2. Stop reading comics.

3. Briefly? Bollocks!

[FJRider]

But if riding schools were so good why is it not a prerequisite to go to one when going for a motorcycle license?

Simply ... many believe that unless it's legally required ... they wont. These same people ride their motorcycle in shorts/T-shirt/jandals ... and crash helmet.


I have read that going to one can create overconfidence in riding ability.

I read that too. If you believe everything that is written ... read this- YOU are a fuck wit.


I agree with them as teaching safe riding where the rider is in control

Where do they teach safe riding where the rider has NO control .. ?? (that's probably where you learned all your idiocies)


but to suggest going to one to keep you safe from the screwups of others is just luck.

Motorcycling is dangerous ... but they can help you reduce a lot of the risks. But only if you listen to what they say ... and remember it at the critical times.

Your fate is in your hands ...

[nzspokes]

But if riding schools were so good why is it not a prerequisite to go to one when going for a motorcycle license? I have read that going to one can create overconfidence in riding ability. I agree with them as teaching safe riding where the rider is in control but to suggest going to one to keep you safe from the screwups of others is just luck.

The best way to survive is to be in control.

[Jeeper]

Distance can be controlled with throttle or brakes.

Sent from my F8331 using Tapatalk

[nzspokes]

But how much control you have when someone else fucks up all comes down to the distance you are away from them when they do which can never be predicted.

You should be able to stop in the distance you see to be clear.

[caspernz]

But if riding schools were so good why is it not a prerequisite to go to one when going for a motorcycle license? I have read that going to one can create overconfidence in riding ability. I agree with them as teaching safe riding where the rider is in control but to suggest going to one to keep you safe from the screwups of others is just luck.

I'll suggest that our licensing system has been based on lowest common denominator for too long. To learn Roadcraft properly isn't a practical option for obtaining a licence, for it takes a while to master. But yes I agree it would be good to have a foundation of Roadcraft included in the licence requirements.

The overconfidence angle can't be denied, albeit it for a small proportion. Think of it in terms of benefit of the greater good, the majority of folks who attend advanced rider training improve their skills and own safety, if the small number who choose to ride beyond their ability wish to blame an advanced rider scheme for that...well, they were always gonna crash anyway weren't they?

As for keeping you safe from other peoples' screw-ups, situational awareness and hazard identification takes care of the vast majority. Again I suggest if you partake in a Rideforever course you can judge this for yourself, as at this stage you just don't know what you don't know. Much like I learned quite a few things when going thru advanced rider training, most of these were things I never even thought about, but they've now become second nature. In simple terms, I just didn't know what I didn't know. Ashamed to admit there was quite a bit to learn...


But how much control you have when someone else fucks up all comes down to the distance you are away from them when they do which can never be predicted.

Yeah well, you seem fixated on what others do...yet if I suggest your own responses to a developing situation can make the difference...and one of the keys is in the answer from nzspokes below.


You should be able to stop in the distance you see to be clear.

Yes, this is one of the fundamentals to keeping safe, regardless of the mode of transport. Also one of the simple rules many folks ignore, unfortunately :doh:

[nzspokes]

But unlike you I have been in crashes where going to riding school would not have saved me because things just happened too fast. As I said its all how much gap there is between you and whoever screws up. I will say it again shit happened for the motorbike racer too quick for him to brake or swerve too. I find it very odd that no one on here is critical of his inability to avoid the car. Maybe if I was a motorcycle racer and had a crash with a car no one would be critical of my ridng ability either.

Dont accelerate into developing situation.

[FJRider]

I will say it again shit happened for the motorbike racer too quick for him to brake or swerve too. I find it very odd that no one on here is critical of his inability to avoid the car. Maybe if I was a motorcycle racer and had a crash with a car no one would be critical of my ridng ability either.

I have read most of the reports of his death. None of those reports stated any of the circumstances of that accident. ANY statement you make stating the cause ... or critical of that racers inability to avoid that accident is just ludicrous in the extreme.

He was on a push bike and probably only wearing a bike helmet and Lycra for protection. Not all the safety gear he would normally be wearing on the track.

Talk about something you actually KNOW about. Surprise us ... or remain silent.

[awayatc]

I ride a push bike too so am better qualified than you to say there is a risk similarity.

Woman...

The risk similarity is YOU!

Just Talking to somebody must be extremely hazardous for you....

[nzspokes]

So learning to sense that shit is about to happen can only be taught if you are riding a motorbike? You are the ludicrous one if you see no risk similarity between a push bike and a motorbike. I ride a push bike too so am better qualified than you to say there is a risk similarity.

Not even close. :killingme

[T.W.R]

I ride a tricycle so am better qualified than you to say that I am a fucking risk!!.

Remedied for you ya queer prick :bash: