Motorcycle Gangs

[Zed]

The new Bloke on this site raised an interesting question: "Do the biker gangs (black power etc) give non-gang bikers any trouble or do they keep themselves to themselves?"

Following is a snipet taken from the NZ Herald last June:

Gangs such as Black Power and the Mongrel Mob - who squared off in Whakatane last weekend - have a tight grip on the manufacture, sale and distribution of methamphetamines, drugs more commonly known as speed. Both gangs have grown more sophisticated and the heads of some units have begun to co-operate with each other to dominate the drug market.
"So what we're seeing now is an escalation of violence as a result of methamphetamine."
The drug was so strong and addictive that some motorcycle gangs had barred their members from using it, he said.

Whakatane and Palmerston North were recent hot-spots but the Mongrel Mob and Black Power have also clashed in Taupo, Christchurch and Gisborne lately.

Both gangs established themselves in the late 1950s, early 1960s and have always fought to assert their dominance. Each has thousands of members, associates and prospects nationwide.

Personally I've never had any runins with gangs, mainly because I've avoided those areas commonly regarded as gang territory, but you may have?


Zed

[What?]

The worst gang out there ride ST1100's, or more commonly drive Commodores and Falcons. Nasty bunch - their MO is extortion :moon:

[merv]

The worst gang out there ride ST1100's, or more commonly drive Commodores and Falcons. Nasty bunch - their MO is extortion :moon:

Yep higway robbery and intimidation.

[bondagebunny]

black power and mongrel mob are not bike gangs - they are enthnic based street gangs, only a few of there members ride bikes. most go around in big cars.
There are plenty of Biker Clubs, Hells Angels being best know but most towns have their own club, Out Casts-Hamilton, Titans-Matamata, Loners-Levin, etc. It goes on - even the smallest of towns has a patch club.

To me it is all rather silly, but not as silly as the Old folk who insist on trying to be what they never had the balls to be when they were young, but now they are old and grey they feel the need to try to recapture what they never had, the only difference is money, so they buy a HD or big cruiser, put a cartoon bignose drawing on their back and delude themselves into thinking they are "Real Bikers.

Old Farts take note MOney cant buy you a life style, or Cool. Stop being so sad and get a real life, even if it is as a banker (spelt with a silent W).

And before you all get septic on me - there are some old folk who ride, and ride well, just for the love of it, like the rest of us - but they are the minority.
So if your going to complain - imagine you are 1 of those, and it is the rest I refer to.

HOG owners are the same - most buy HD because they feel it makes people look at them, makes them different, makes them cool, attracts the 50+ wannabe biker mamas to them like flys, or hopefully a young impressionable 40 year old. NO one I know rides a HD because they are a great bike, stylish yes, a fashion statement - yes, holds its value -yes, but a great bike - no.
And Yes I have owned them.
When I get so sad I need an object to make people notice me I will cover my face in piercings or tattoos - people notice those too.

[bluninja]

To me it is all rather silly, but not as silly as the Old folk who insist on trying to be what they never had the balls to be when they were young, but now they are old and grey they feel the need to try to recapture what they never had, the only difference is money, so they buy a HD or big cruiser, put a cartoon bignose drawing on their back and delude themselves into thinking they are "Real Bikers".
So a young penniless HOG rider is ok then ? LMAO. People ride bikes for lots of reasons, and many like to identify with a community or group of like minded people. Nothing wrong with that in my book. For many riders their bikes are actually a lifestyle choice(Harleys, Goldwings, Weekend warriors)...... who's to say they aren't the real bikers?

I wonder what people think when they see a whole bunch of bikers with their Kiwi Biker "patch" on :Punk:

[Zed]

black power and mongrel mob are not bike gangs - they are enthnic based street gangs, only a few of there members ride bikes. most go around in big cars.
There are plenty of Biker Clubs, Hells Angels being best know but most towns have their own club, Out Casts-Hamilton, Titans-Matamata, Loners-Levin, etc. It goes on - even the smallest of towns has a patch club.

To me it is all rather silly, but not as silly as the Old folk...
Hey Bunny, you sound like you know a bit about these bike gangs? I don't now how you digressed into the "aged bikers" thing :wacko: , but back to the thread- Do you know what these gangs think about other non-affiliated bikers? Exactly what experience have you had with motorcycle gangs?

Thanks.


Zed

[James Deuce]

black power and mongrel mob are not bike gangs - they are enthnic based street gangs, only a few of there members ride bikes. most go around in big cars.
There are plenty of Biker Clubs, Hells Angels being best know but most towns have their own club, Out Casts-Hamilton, Titans-Matamata, Loners-Levin, etc. It goes on - even the smallest of towns has a patch club.

To me it is all rather silly, but not as silly as the Old folk who insist on trying to be what they never had the balls to be when they were young, but now they are old and grey they feel the need to try to recapture what they never had, the only difference is money, so they buy a HD or big cruiser, put a cartoon bignose drawing on their back and delude themselves into thinking they are "Real Bikers.

Old Farts take note MOney cant buy you a life style, or Cool. Stop being so sad and get a real life, even if it is as a banker (spelt with a silent W).

And before you all get septic on me - there are some old folk who ride, and ride well, just for the love of it, like the rest of us - but they are the minority.
So if your going to complain - imagine you are 1 of those, and it is the rest I refer to.

HOG owners are the same - most buy HD because they feel it makes people look at them, makes them different, makes them cool, attracts the 50+ wannabe biker mamas to them like flys, or hopefully a young impressionable 40 year old. NO one I know rides a HD because they are a great bike, stylish yes, a fashion statement - yes, holds its value -yes, but a great bike - no.
And Yes I have owned them.
When I get so sad I need an object to make people notice me I will cover my face in piercings or tattoos - people notice those too.

Nothing like a bit of bigotry to round the day off.

[Jackrat]

Bondagebunny,I have owned two HDs.They were both good bikes.

[mangell6]

In Upper Hutt the local BIKE gang, Shin feign (sp), keep to themselves and even arrange some poker runs and other 'charity' events. This is a later thing as they have got older. Most 'biker gangs' will leave you alone if you leave them alone.
In the seventies, at the height of the real biker gangs, my brother and I were heading on a surfing trip to New Plymouth from the Mount. As we travelled up the Kaimais thirty bikes came up behind us, yes it was a biker gang, :eek5: the real McCoy. They split into two groups one in front and one behind and stayed with us for seventeen hours til we got near the top of the Kaimais - at least it felt that long, then they headed off into the distance. We sweated like you wouldn't believe.

[onearmedbandit]

Well looks like bondagebunny has everyone sown up into different groups. Geez man, get over yourself.

[MikeL]

Who is this Bondagebunny person who pontificates about older riders as if he had done some serious sociological research and had some real, valid data on which to hang his prejudices? Has he been on many Ulysses rides? Met a diverse cross-section of members? Been to their meetings? Exactly how many older riders has he canvassed to discover and analyse their motivations, past and present riding habits, financial status and so on, so as to be able to confidently dismiss the majority as deluded, pathetic old farts?

I had thought that what happened with our religion topic might have served as a warning...

BTW re old farts:
When I was twenty, I was a firm believer in euthanasia for people over 40. After all, who would want to live such a useless, pathetic life? As I neared 40 I realized that my earlier judgement had been too harsh. Kill them at 50. Now it's clear to me that a more appropriate age would be 60...

[ching_ching]

Hi folks,

Haven't had much contact with bikie gangs myself. But the odd ones that I've seen like at the Shell servo or something:-

All I tend to do is if I see them and I have my bike, if eye contact is made, just give a little nod as an acknowledgement that we have at least something in common (two wheels) but that's about it. I don't really stick around to chit chat.

BTW bondagebunny, can I ask have you ridden with members from a gang or sat down and talked to them?

ching

[Kickaha]

I've ridden with a gang once and that was to a friends birthday party, awesome with about 30 bikes riding at night,passed most of them when we hit the shingle road and beat them to the party.

At the party they were just normal guys,but I wouldn't want to piss one off with all his mates present.

Another guy I knew was ex Black Power and he was a A grade tosser,always on about how they had beat this guy up and robbed someone else blah,blah,blah.

[bondagebunny]

that anyone who has a back patch is either a gang member or a wannabe gang member -

I made the connection, between gangs, and old farts, but I didnt make the old farts wear a back patch. That was their choice. I am free to disagree with their choice.

When Joe Lunchbox sees a back patch he/she thinks GANG, why would any one who is not a gang member want the public at large to think he/she is a GANG member.

Unless they wanted to be a staunch dude when they were young but were two wimpy to cut the mustard - now they want to PLAY at being a tuff dude.

I admit to being bigoted when it comes to that, but I feel anyone who wears a back patch does a disservice to all other bikers

You dont have to agree, you dont have to like it, I dont care.

TO those who asked if I have Knowledge of gangs - yes.
leave them alone wont bother you if you dont bother them.

[Zed]

TO those who asked if I have Knowledge of gangs - yes. leave them alone wont bother you if you dont bother them.
...and yet most if not all gang related crimes e.g assult, etc, are unprovoked attacks on innocents! :weep: Of course noone intentionally bothers a gang member, you don't have to- they are scouting for trouble and will come to you! Therefore, I just stay away from areas where gang activity is known...such as Ruatoria!


Zed

[Jackrat]

Zed,I have to disagree on one thing but agree on another.
I have had quite a bit of contact with gangs.I have a brother who is a member of a bike gang,As far as I can see you are right,A lot of attacks by these guys are due to nothing more than looking at them wrong.
At one time I would vist my brothers club for the odd party or go on a run with them.Well I can't remember many partys or runs when some unsuspecting outsider did not get dealt to,there was never a good reason.
As to Ruatoria,I vist the area often both while hunting and while on my bike.
The place has a bad rep' that it doesn't really deserve.
When I think of gangs and places to stay away from I tend to consider certain pubs and similar places rather than towns.With the advent of P these
guys are becoming even more unpredictable.If I am at an event and these guys show I will stay right away from them or leave altogeather.

[merv]

that anyone who has a back patch is either a gang member or a wannabe gang member -


Damn is that why I went for the polo shirt with the patch on the back in the latest T-Shirt order - I really wanted to be accepted as part of the Kiwibiker Gang.

SpankMe now that this Translyvania dude has hit the forums maybe we need you to produce a real patch we can stick on the back of our leather jackets.

[Hitcher]

...and yet most if not all gang related crimes e.g assult, etc, are unprovoked attacks on innocents! :weep: Of course noone intentionally bothers a gang member, you don't have to- they are scouting for trouble and will come to you! Therefore, I just stay away from areas where gang activity is known...such as Ruatoria!


Zed

I should start by saying that "all generalisations are false... including this one".

Mrs H and I were through Ruatoria on our 250s back in October. We had a good look around, bought gas, had a yack to some locals including the local cop (he had a Nissan Nivara pursuit vehicle!!). No sign of gangs at all. That's not to say there aren't any. The place is proudly Ngati Porou and probably has a stronger sense of community that most "readilawn" suburbs that get rolled out in parts of Auckland.

[bondagebunny]

Do you want to wear a backpatch ? If yes then you will join a gang and take your lumps from other gangs and cops etc.

IF you dont wear one - ask yourself why - if the answer is - I dont want to be considered an arsehole by other bikers and the general public - police, and society in general.

THen how can you defend people who do - because there is enuff on bikers already. Backpatches bring more unwarrented notoriety in the small minds of car drivers, police , politicians, insurance people etc.

There can not be two classes of patch, ie the heavy dudes, and the cartoon cutouts who wear them supposedly for fun.

Transylvania rocks - Dracula SUX :finger:

[Jackrat]

Do you want to wear a backpatch ? If yes then you will join a gang and take your lumps from other gangs and cops etc.

IF you dont wear one - ask yourself why - if the answer is - I dont want to be considered an arsehole by other bikers and the general public - police, and society in general.

THen how can you defend people who do - because there is enuff on bikers already. Backpatches bring more unwarrented notoriety in the small minds of car drivers, police , politicians, insurance people etc.

There can not be two classes of patch, ie the heavy dudes, and the cartoon cutouts who wear them supposedly for fun.

Transylvania rocks - Dracula SUX :finger:

And just why can there not be two classes of patch,,Because you can't tell the difference??. know a lot of Ulyesses members some who wear a back patch some who don't,Not one that would give a flying fuck what you think.
Hell my sixty year old mother can tell the difference,so does every cop Iv'e ever spoken to.So tell us,What's your real problem??
Come on we won't laugh. <_<

[Zed]

...and yet most if not all gang related crimes e.g assult, etc, are unprovoked attacks on innocents! :weep: Of course noone intentionally bothers a gang member, you don't have to- they are scouting for trouble and will come to you! Therefore, I just stay away from areas where gang activity is known...such as Ruatoria!


Zed
Ruatoria has got a bad reputation becuase of its past gang related activity, I used it as an example to make my point. It's good if things have improved there over the years! :cool:


Zed

[Zed]

Gangs, gangs, & more gangs...


Organised crime in New Zealand

University of Canterbury
Dept. of Socialogy



...Just as globalisation has been a growing phenomenon of legitimate business in recent decades, so has gang activity become internationalised. The oldest of New Zealand's gangs today, the Hell's Angels Motorcycle Club (HAMC), had international connections from the time of its establishment in 1961. HAMC (Auckland) was in fact the first Angels chapter established outside of California. The Hell's Angels are now a worldwide organisation, with at least 67 chapters in 13 different countries. Of the gangs in America, the HAMC is currently the wealthiest and most powerful. Two of America's other powerful gangs, the Outlaws and the Bandidos, also have significant offshore interests, including in New Zealand. Here it has been reported that the Highway 61 gang is on the verge of buying into the Bandidos MC World's international franchise.

New Zealand gangs have exported their influence as well. Highway 61 chapters now exist in Australia, as do chapters of the Mongrel Mob. Within New Zealand, as in Australia and America, a degree of syndication has occurred between various gangs. The Hell's Angels are believed to have co-operative links with groups such as the Headhunters in Auckland and the Road Knights in the South Island. A separate group of six gangs known as 'The Federation' also works co-operatively thoughout New Zealand, outside of the HAMC network.

[bondagebunny]

back you will see I dont care if they give a flying fuck if they care or not.

I dont give the credit for intelligence to car drivers that you seem to - I dont believe they can tell the difference when a rider goes zipping past, or even more when they ride in a pack as some of the cartoon bignose guys do.

Here is an example.

What gives these guys the right to stop other traffic in an intersection so that 20 or 30 of their mates can ride thru against the lights.

Would the KIWIBIKER people out on their ride to the movies do this.

I have seen this sort of riding in town and out on the open road where traffic that has the right of way has a bike firmly parked across the road so these wannabes can all stay together. Lets face if they like the GANG image of tuff biker in leathers and want to play act.

I call it as I see it and I dont give a f**k what they think either.

[Jackrat]

back you will see I dont care if they give a flying fuck if they care or not.

I dont give the credit for intelligence to car drivers that you seem to - I dont believe they can tell the difference when a rider goes zipping past, or even more when they ride in a pack as some of the cartoon bignose guys do.

Here is an example.

What gives these guys the right to stop other traffic in an intersection so that 20 or 30 of their mates can ride thru against the lights.

Would the KIWIBIKER people out on their ride to the movies do this.

I have seen this sort of riding in town and out on the open road where traffic that has the right of way has a bike firmly parked across the road so these wannabes can all stay together. Lets face if they like the GANG image of tuff biker in leathers and want to play act.

I call it as I see it and I dont give a f**k what they think either.

Oh dear what a sad little thing you are.
Why don't you come on the west pac ride an tell us all about it. :laugh:
O sorry you would of course need a bike.
Maybe thats your real problem Hmmmmmmm. :lol:

[bondagebunny]

real bikes - west pac ride, toy runs etc are not the same as a group of 20 club people out for a days ride.

That is a charity thing that takes some control or it would turn into a shambles - 20 people who have to ride so close together that they cant be broken up by traffic is an indication of insecurity. Or perhaps they dont know where to go -
Or may be only one of them carries the incontinence pants and they dont want to miss our at the next stop.

or maybe they just dont want to be late to the camel stables and get an ugly one.

[bondagebunny]

ive probably been on more of those charity runs than you have - been going to most of them since they started - trying to show bikers in a good light.

ANd try to undo some of the image damage done by the patch wearers.

I note you didnt answer my questions - would you ride like that to the movies.
do you wear a patch to show the world youre an arsehole or can they tell
without it.

Do you call every one you dont agree with a troll - is yours the only opinion that matters

What ever happend to freedom of speach :ar15:

[bluninja]

What ever happend to freedom of speach :ar15:
you're still using it aren't you?:kick: As for patches on peoples backs...I don't care if they have tassles on their sleeves...if it does something positive for them..good on them.

I personally have never been threatened or intimidated on or off my bike by a patch wearing gang member. I avoid known or perceived dodgy haunts, so I guess I live in a different world to the 'typical' patch gang members, and that colours my perception.

[Jackrat]

BB,I helped put the very first toy run in the country togeather,Plus the first blood run ,I was on the first BRONZ commitie.I have run into dozens of people like you over the years,All full of your own self importance but not much else.
And no I don't wear a patch,And yes most people can tell I'm an asshole with out one.If you want to come on a site like this and make the stupid comments you have,not only on this thread but others as well,then exspect to attract people like me,I love to have a go at anybody,and I can cop the flack in return.By the way do you know who runs the west pac run.
When anybody sees the Ulysses they Do know the difference,Unless they are utterly blind like you seem to be.Maybe you havn't noticed but we ain't living in the seventys anymore.
Like I said come on the run and tell us about it,I would be only to happy to discuss your views face to face,Or you could just hide behind the safety of
your PC and spew your views on the world.Like I said just a troll.Prove me wrong.

[bondagebunny]

not hiding behind my PC anymore than anyone else here -

I enjoy a good wind up - do you?

We have already crossed paths.

[bondagebunny]

I have run into dozens of people like you over the years,All full of your own self importance but not much else.


not much else to me really - just a rider - just a winder of springs.

Im having a good time (wind wind wind) lets go - and yadda yadda yadda.

but it is one way of getting the number of posts up - like all you other dudes I really really really want to be on the top 10 list. or top ten hit list.

[ching_ching]

that anyone who has a back patch is either a gang member or a wannabe gang member -

I disagree. They may just be advertising their club / group, not acting as a gang per se. You're generalisation is extreme.


I made the connection, between gangs, and old farts, but I didnt make the old farts wear a back patch. That was their choice. I am free to disagree with their choice.

You refer to the older generation as old farts. From this I presume a lack of at least a little respect. Maybe not enough kicks up the wazoo when you were young but I presume mind you...


Unless they wanted to be a staunch dude when they were young but were two wimpy to cut the mustard - now they want to PLAY at being a tuff dude.

If you think they were too wimpy when they were young then wearing a patch now when they're older, a bit slower to bob and weave, a bit unfit then when they were younger, then if they get in a stoush now they'd get laid out... you shouldn't be bringing up this point, this one is in your favour... don't worry about this bunnyrabbit.


I admit to being bigoted when it comes to that, but I feel anyone who wears a back patch does a disservice to all other bikers
Hmm... I agree and disagree. I agree with you that you're bigoted (you forgot to add asshole on the end by the way). But wearing a patch does not necessarily do a disservice to other bikers. Like I said before, their reason for wearing doesn't necessarily advertise themselves as being gang members per se.


You dont have to agree, you dont have to like it, I dont care.
I don't believe you don't care. You come across as being one of the most caring, sharing, touchy, feely people I've had the pleasure to listen to.


TO those who asked if I have Knowledge of gangs - yes. leave them alone wont bother you if you dont bother them.
Knowledge of gangs? Did a bunch of them kick the shit out of you because you're a bigot?

[Jackrat]

I have run into dozens of people like you over the years,All full of your own self importance but not much else.


not much else to me really - just a rider - just a winder of springs.

Im having a good time (wind wind wind) lets go - and yadda yadda yadda.

but it is one way of getting the number of posts up - like all you other dudes I really really really want to be on the top 10 list. or top ten hit list.

So why get upset over being called a troll.
We must all have a bit of it going on.
Cheers.

[MikeL]

not much else to me really - just a rider - just a winder of springs.

Im having a good time (wind wind wind) lets go - and yadda yadda yadda.

but it is one way of getting the number of posts up - like all you other dudes I really really really want to be on the top 10 list. or top ten hit list.


Is this the definition of a troll??

Enuf said.
Freedom of speech, self-expression, blah blah blah. But haven't you got something better to do??

[moko]

Here in the U.k. the patch clubs are pretty much a relic of the 70`s.There are still the Hells Angels and a couple of others kicking around and still doing their thing with the patches e.t.c. I`ll tell you a bit about what the situation is around my way(S.W. England)as I think it`s pretty much the same all over.Locally there are 2 clubs,Aquilla and Scorpio,most of the guys still hang out together but the members are still the older guys from way back,still ride bikes but they tend to be anything big and Japanese that isnt a race rep or a tourer.They`re few in number but mean tough bastards.Scorpio are bad bastards who mutated from a patch club to basically a criminal fraternity like a lot of clubs in this country,they rarely wear patches unless it`s a "Fuck You" to people they`ve got a beef with,and keep a very low profile since a major police bust about 10 years ago.They own pubs,clubs e.t.c and have been tied in with Columbian criminals.Although they`re relatively un-known they`ve got a fearsome rep and have seen off more than one of the better-known gangs,not good people to cross but keep very much to the shadows since the big bust.Aquilla were a big patch club,locally at least,Scorpio pretty much finished them off years back and even fairly recently there have been incidents with a guy ending up on a life-support system,guys threatened with guns e.t.c.Basically when the old die-hards fade away they`re gone.Nationally the situation is pretty much the same,the old guys linger on,patch clubs are definately a rarity now and mass ride-outs even more rare.Over here biking,and bikers,have lost the old anti-social hooligan image,more prevalent than patch clubs from the 50`s up to the 80`s were gangs of bikers who may well have done the boozing and brawling bit but without the fancy dress or the names.Back then you`d get the same kind of lads on bikes as now drive cars and fight at football matches,biking has got a whole new image.When I was in N.Z. I was suprised to find the reaction I got at times to wearing my bike jacket,i.e. got asked to take it off before being allowed into a pub e.t.c.,that was a bit of a throwback,here no-one would bat an eyelid.Not just bikers but we dont get the whole gang thing here as you have it,nearest used to be football hooligans but as with bikers they learned ages ago that you make yourself stick out then you get police hassle and ironically you`ll never see any serious soccer yob wearing club colours unless it`s an England invasion of some other country.
Oh yeah,we`ve got HOG here as well and they also seem to think the 70`s retro bad boy look is cool,basically they`re a bunch of wankers that have delusions of grandeur.If it wasn`t for the snotty attitudes they have then fair enough I`ve got no problems with anyone or what they dress like/do,some prat looks down his nose at me while looking like a Village People reject and I`m not going to be polite enough to hide the laughter.
Old bikers?Dont know what you call old but I`m nearly 46 and have been riding bikes in the shit Brit weather since I was 17.Average age of Brit bikers is 38,youngsters go for cars here now but those snazzy new-style scooters are massive and there`s kind of a biker gang thing there starting to build up,kind of hard to look tough when you`re an acne-riddled punk on a mobile hair-dryer but they try bless`em.Bikers here tend to be either leisure riders,i.e. rich gits who crash their Fireblades in the Summer,or cynical old bastards like me who`ve never wanted anything else.

[bondagebunny]

I have anything better to do - i drop in here when i check my mail - 3 4 times a day - some on you dudes live here - most of the time im out riding.
I dont think yo lot ever get out.

[bondagebunny]

what I was getting at


"Oh yeah,we`ve got HOG here as well and they also seem to think the 70`s retro bad boy look is cool,basically they`re a bunch of wankers that have delusions of grandeur.If it wasn`t for the snotty attitudes they have then fair enough I`ve got no problems with anyone or what they dress like/do,some prat looks down his nose at me while looking like a Village People reject and I`m not going to be polite enough to hide the laughter."
And I didnt write it - so now all you twonks have got someone else to go after.

still dont know what a troll is - but it sounds like - some one who has an opinion and is not afraid to express it despite the ravings of others who never answer the points made

Time for me to retire to the garage to drink piss, start up my bike , put on my colours and go out to raise some hell.

I tire of this thread and winding up the smae people over and over - thought I might get a wider reaction - but there you go, just the same old same old dominating people who comment and dominate all the other threads .

I see you dudes again when I thinnk of something else that might get a stir.
In the mean time thank you all for being so predictable .

:done:

[Lou Girardin]

"Oh yeah,we`ve got HOG here as well and they also seem to think the 70`s retro bad boy look is cool,basically they`re a bunch of wankers that have delusions of grandeur.If it wasn`t for the snotty attitudes they have then fair enough I`ve got no problems with anyone or what they dress like/do,some prat looks down his nose at me while looking like a Village People reject and I`m not going to be polite enough to hide the laughter."
:
:lol: I've got to agree
Lou

[moko]

In reply to Bondagebunny,if anyone wants to take issue with anything I write then fine,something he seems to have some kind of problem with.Same bunch of people all the time?first time I`ve posted for about 10 months,then when someone agrees with at least part of what he says,the bit Lou attributes to him above that I wrote and Lou also seems to agree with,he then buggers off going on about everyone having a go at him.
Seems to me like he dosnt realise that most people are bright enough to spot someone aiming to kick off an argument and someone speaking their mind.
Good thread so a shame he`s gone.When I started biking it was very much a "rebel" thing to do,the public were wary of anyone with a leather jacket,patch or no patch, whereas now,in the U.K at least,it`s turning more and more into a rich man`s hobby.

[merv]

"Oh yeah,we`ve got HOG here as well

So why can't you list where "here" is as I'm guessing the Translyvania thing is all shit?

[spudchucka]

This ha become a rather odd thread!!

I've only one thing to say and admit to having a biased opinion.

"Gang member = dickhead"

Stay away from the losers.

[moko]

So why can't you list where "here" is as I'm guessing the Translyvania thing is all shit?

Hey Merv,Bondagebunny quoted from my post but it seems to have been re-quoted and attributed to him by various people."Here" is U.K., as you`ll see from any of my posts,in my case.Where Bb is from I dont know,if he says Transylvania then who am I to argue?Be interesting to hear whether he knows where Transylvania is,no patch clubs there to my knowledge.

[Zed]

So why can't you list where "here" is as I'm guessing the Translyvania thing is all shit?
If you check out his/her public profile (BBunny that is) there is no personal information given whatsoever...I think this individual wants him/herself to remain anonymous to the other members for a reason! Maybe so he/she can just continue to slag people without receiving any personal repercussions! Maybe we are dealing with a gang member here on the run from the law? Very suspect if you ask me.

BBunny, how can you honestly expect us to take you seriously when you havn't been honest with us since you joined? :mad:


Zed

[Jackrat]

When Bbunny first joined the site,He/She gave His/Her location as Palm'y north and main Fav' bike as a moped,A puch scooter, I think it was.
I Think you will find He/She is not a biker at all,Just somebody with a chip against bikers.I mean not one positive comment on any thread He/She responded to,Then attacks a Nationaly respected MC club.
Anyway,Who's going on the West pac ride.See ya'll there.

[Motu]

This thread has been going for ages and I haven't had a go at it yet - The bondage boy seems to think it's his thread,but it was started by that other troll Zed.

You couldn't ride British bikes like I did through the 70s and halfway into the 80s without coming across the occasional gang member - it was their scene and we had to deal with them at times.They were fragmented amoungst themselves - there were the guys who were right into bikes,these were the ones we delt with.Bikes were their life and a bike gang was one way to imerse themselves totaly in bikes,they were excelent riders and some went on to become top engineers.Then there were the guys who were just in it for the image,an excuse to be a bad boy,be on the wrong side of the law...these were the ones to stay well away from,they rode a bike because they had to,not because they enjoyed riding.But there were some who were a mix of both,they were a bit of fun - from a distance - they played the image to the hilt,had a good time riding,partying,fighting.

The ethnic gangs....oh come on,let's stop the PC...they are Maori gangs,not Samoan,chinese OK?....have never really been bike gangs,although they did start out that way to some extent,but they were also very much into cars.The bike these days is just a symbol,and hey,some of them have nice bikes and take pride in them.

The violence,crime and drugs etc can never be condoned,this has no place in our society whether it involves gangs or not,but the imunity of gangs gives them too much power.These days our gangs are like the Mafia in the 20s.

I have to admit that some of my closest friends have been gang members or had close ties with them - but they are older than me and I met them when they had moved away from the gangs.Don't be too quick to judge some of these guys - you may have admired their riding on the race track or have been taught to ride by one.Or like me,it may be how you met your wife.

[Zed]

...it was started by that other troll Zed. ...I have to admit that some of my closest friends have been gang members or had close ties with them - but they are older than me and I met them when they had moved away from the gangs...
Thank you very much :sly: Now don't feed the trolls!

It's a good balance anyway to hear the viewpoint of an associate of ex-gang members like you Motu.


Zed

[mangell6]

I like the new KIWIBIKER patches on the black t-shirts . . . . .

he he he he

[Timber020]

Most of the patched biker gangs or any gangs are just cowards, tough guys in a group who couldnt hack the real world. How many people are assaulted, robbed, murdered or raped every year by young guys earning their patch?

I know some older guys who were gang members who are good guys now, but then I also knew a guy who was a Nazi (and could be still wanted) who I could say the same thing about.

Like the police, a lawyer and artillery, all great things as long as they arent against you.

[Motu]

Like a pack of dogs,they gain strenghth will numbers....trouble is some dogs are mean all by themselves.Some people need to assemble in groups with others of similar interests,from playgroups to paedophiles,born agains to cannibals,sportsbikes to cruisers.....I don't like to join in with others,just me,myself and I are all we need.

[Redstar]

I have never had a problem with gangs and I think that left alone they tend to keep to themselfs I have two positive encounters !
kataia pub new years eve 1984 tripped a member up aciddentially and expected a thump but got a no worries bro! and a member of the filthy few stopped to offer a hand when my bike broke down. I dont agree that they can fortify headquarters and we all know that they survive on the drug and crime economy but all in all they dont affect my life.

[Zed]

Like a pack of dogs,they gain strenghth will numbers....trouble is some dogs are mean all by themselves.Some people need to assemble in groups with others of similar interests,from playgroups to paedophiles,born agains to cannibals,sportsbikes to cruisers.....I don't like to join in with others,just me,myself and I are all we need.
There is definately a need in every human heart to associate with others of a similar interest! The ones to watch out for are those who sit on the fence all of their lives and never commit to anything- they are deluded and become isolated to the point of becoming anti-social...maybe gang members are on to a good thing then, just like us born-again Jesus freaks, amen!
:Oi:

Zed

[Motu]

Thanks for the personality profile Zed,you got me down to a T.

[Jackrat]

There is definately a need in every human heart to associate with others of a similar interest! The ones to watch out for are those who sit on the fence all of their lives and never commit to anything- they are deluded and become isolated to the point of becoming anti-social...maybe gang members are on to a good thing then, just like us born-again Jesus freaks, amen!
:Oi:

Zed

Hey, I'm not a group person,But then if I need company I can always have a yarn with the voices in my head :wacko: :whistle:

[Zed]

Thanks for the personality profile Zed,you got me down to a T.
Hey, that wasn't necessarily aimed at you Motu, but 'if the shoe fits'...


Zed

[Zed]

Hey, I'm not a group person,But then if I need company I can always have a yarn with the voices in my head :wacko: :whistle:
Isn't talking to yourself one of the first signs of madness? Then again, I suppose you get better answers that way!



Zed

[Big Dog]

Most gang members I have met have been involved more as a replacement for a lack of social order than any need to be "seen".

I have only ever run in to the one "bad bugger", a prospect, He tried to roll me for my jacket in front of his boys, I figured I had nothing to gain so I stood up to give it to him. By the time I had it off there was just the receeding sound of three pairs of boots on the pavement..... and a hastily dropped knife.

There have been a couple of other times I have had to pretend I was not scared...


There has also been a few times they have come to my rescue.
1 Broken down in the middle of nowhere they replaced a snapped chain and gear lever. And refused payment saying just to make sure I never passed a strricken biker.(Magogs)

2 Picked me up hitching for gas, took me for gas and back to the bike. Again refused payment despite thirty bikes (Three stayed back to guard the bike) going 26kms to get gas. (Magogs)

3 Bouncing and a prospect threatened to come back with a gun because I told them no patches. Mate who was wearing the patch cuffed him one and told him not to be stupid.

In my expereince, limited as it is gang memebers are not a threat unless you give them a reason to be one. Prospects tend to be a worry as they have more machismo than brains...... as do most young men.

I think that if the Ulysess club is used responsibly by its members it can be a fountain of information, it can be a support group / network, it can be many things to many people. Until they start selling P (or other class a drugs) they will get no complaints from me. Those members I have met do a lot more for the image of motorcycling in NZ, than most individuals.

In conclusion (for those who found my ramblings difficult to follow), anything that encorages more people to give riding a go get's a :2thumbsup . MC clubs are not bad, some of the members are. Gangs are not all bad, but they are not for me.

[merv]

I chuckle when I see Ulysses mentioned in this thread about gangs. Well I'm a Ulyssian and the only pre-requisite for membership is age and that you are a biker (though there has been a lot of argument lately about non-riders and membership). I can't say I have met any Ulyssians that would even vaguely fit the "threatening" category so just because some wear a "patch" on their back doesn't make them bad bastards. Most I would say are good down to earth every day people with an enthusiasm for bikes - probably not much different than subscribers to this forum except here there is no ageism and even the young people are allowed.

[Lou Girardin]

Isn't talking to yourself one of the first signs of madness? Then again, I suppose you get better answers that way!



Zed

Talking to yourself isn't a sign of madness. However, answering is!
Lou

[Jackrat]

Talking to yourself isn't a sign of madness. However, answering is!
Lou

Oh dear,How about arguing back an finding yourself out numbered :doh:

[Big Dog]

Talking to yourself isn't a sign of madness. However, answering is!
Lou
Nup answering is fine we all need to hear intelligent answers once in a while, for me the problem comes when you are surprised by the answers. :yes:

[Zed]

Travelling home north from a ride down the line today I saw approx 50+, mostly patched, bikers hooning past in the opposite direction. They were spread out in many small groups about 5-10mins apart fom eachother, maybe some convention or meeting? Anyway, coming through Huntly there was 1 x HP car & 2 x unmarked police cars with lights going mad who had pulled over 6 of these roughians and were interrogating them & looked to be issuing them tickets!? Because there were 3 coppers I assume there must may have been a possible chase or emergency callout?

I grinned as I slowed down to pass them...not that they could see my big smile through my tinted visor :D


Zed

[pete376403]

Like a pack of dogs,they gain strenghth will numbers....trouble is some dogs are mean all by themselves.Some people need to assemble in groups with others of similar interests,from playgroups to paedophiles,born agains to cannibals,sportsbikes to cruisers.....I don't like to join in with others,just me,myself and I are all we need.

But you're joining in here, taking part in conversations with heaps of people, both known and unknown. We're members of a virtual gang :cool:

[pete376403]

Hey, I'm not a group person,But then if I need company I can always have a yarn with the voices in my head :wacko: :whistle:

When you start arguing with the voices, and you loose the argument, then you've got a problem :laugh:

[Deano]

My experience with gang members - working in a gas station, middle of the day, 3 mobsters pull in, one enters shop, waits for other customers to leave before approaching counter (methinks something is up here) - then says to me "how about you give me a packet of cigarettes or I will stab you" Now I thought for a moment, do I give him one lousy packet of cigarettes -probably the sensible thing..but being young and headstrong myself thought he was likely just trying to intimidate me, I mean all he wanted was one pack of cigarettes ??

I said "if youv'e got a knife, pull it out and you can have the whole till of money and all the cigarettes" - this brought a confused look on his face and he repated the question - I gave the same answer again. He looked dumbfounded that I was standing up to him ( I had a nice tyre lever under the counter ready for him if he really tried to stab me).

He gave me a funny look, a cross between disbelief that he was not getting what he wanted and embarrassment that a teenager was standing up to him. He walked out of the shop so I hit the security alert button, but they were gone before security came.

Now, my decision/actions may not have been the right ones, and it could have gotten ugly (if he actually had pulled the knife he could have had whatever he wanted).

This story just illustrates that a lot of gang members (and other bullies) rely on intimidation to get what they want.

[RiderInBlack]

Hay Zed, just some advise for you. "Judge Not, Least Ye Be Judged". You probably can quote were that is in the bible:whocares: . Another one you could listen to is "Don't judge a book by it's cover".

Patches don't offen mean "Gang". I belong to the BOP Coastal Crusiers. They have a club "patch" but we are definitely not a "Gang". Naw would I count Ulysses (a few real "Gangs" might be offended by that suggestion). Some of our members are Ex-Gang and on some of the rides I go on have "gang" members on them. Have not had any problem from them even though I ride a "rice eatter".


"I grinned as I slowed down to pass them...not that they could see my big smile through my tinted visor :D " Zed

Hope you can hold that grin when the cops pull you over:Pokey:

PS: good comments on this thread Big Dog:2thumbsup :Punk:

[spudchucka]

Travelling home north from a ride down the line today I saw approx 50+, mostly patched, bikers hooning past in the opposite direction. They were spread out in many small groups about 5-10mins apart fom eachother, maybe some convention or meeting? Anyway, coming through Huntly there was 1 x HP car & 2 x unmarked police cars with lights going mad who had pulled over 6 of these roughians and were interrogating them & looked to be issuing them tickets!? Because there were 3 coppers I assume there must may have been a possible chase or emergency callout?

I grinned as I slowed down to pass them...not that they could see my big smile through my tinted visor :D


Zed

There were three cops there because they would have received information from the public or an off duty cop that there was a group of patched up bikers heading that way. They will endeavour to stop as many of them as they can and issue whatever tickets are appropriate. Why? Because they are low life scum sucking mother f***ers.

[Zed]

Hay Zed, just some advise for you. "Judge Not, Least Ye Be Judged". You probably can quote were that is in the bible

I'll give your advice a miss RIB simply because I don't like your tone.


Patches don't offen mean "Gang". I belong to the BOP Coastal Crusiers. They have a club "patch" but we are definitely not a "Gang". Naw would I count Ulysses (a few real "Gangs" might be offended by that suggestion). Some of our members are Ex-Gang and on some of the rides I go on have "gang" members on them. Have not had any problem from them even though I ride a "rice eatter".

The patch issue has already been hashed out on this site by many, you might want to do a search and read through them?
I'll say it another way then- On my way back home yesterday I saw a MOTORCYCLE GANG riding in the opposite direction, and 6 of them were stopped by the police!


Hope you can hold that grin when the cops pull you over

I'm not such a threat to society that it takes 3 police to pull me over...just 1 will do!

You seem to be defending these individuals? Or are you just disagreeing with everything I say on purpose because you have a problem with me quoting the Bible in previous posts?


Zed

[Zed]

Why? Because they are low life scum sucking mother f***ers.
I take it that you are concluding from experience here spud? Pray tell? :shifty:


Zed

[speedpro]

Isn't talking to yourself one of the first signs of madness? Then again, I suppose you get better answers that way!



Zed
It's the only way to have an inteligent conversation sometimes.

Through association I've had a few casual encounters with gang types.

Chch and the girlfriend says "meet me at the pub, we'll play a few games of pool". I turn up on the Z1 with the leather jacket with Kawasaki across the back and bowl in. The place is packed with the local gang, their bikes are all out the back. Got quite a bit of stick to start with then we all got stuck in to a few beers and played some pool.

Perth and I get home on the Z1000J wearing my white Moriwaki jacket to find a bunch of Harleys in the drive. Bunch of the local Coffin Cheaters havin' a smoke and a beer in the lounge with the flatmate girly. 5 minutes of stick later and we're all sitting round having a smoke and a beer.

The Coffin Cheaters also ran the BIG Bindoon music festival. Lots of bad boys and main stream as well and not a problem.

Some of these guys could be serious trouble but given the circumstances were just fine. You wouldn't shoot your mouth off though.

Actually I just remembered that some Black Power guys started wearing their patches in Perth. There was some discussion where the BP guys were shot and their business bombed, along with the guy who opened the door, and it was agreed in a Police brokered conferance that maybe the BP guys wouldn't wear their patches any more.

[RiderInBlack]

I'll give your advice a miss RIB simply because I don't like your tone

To Fucken Bad:devil2: . Would have done you some good.



I'm not such a threat to society

Well thats a matter of opinion.


You seem to be defending these individuals?

Na, just you running to assumptions again Zed (see advice:niceone: ).


Or are you just disagreeing with everything I say on purpose because you have a problem with me quoting the Bible in previous posts?
No, I don't care wether you quote the bible (or the Kerran, or Snoopy for that matter). It's your hollier than thou attitude Zed. But you don't get it and you don't take advise. If you want to be "loved" more:hug:, stop being so judgemental:Playnice:
Lots of love RIB

[Holy Roller]

some patches from around the world.
http://gloryriders.com/MCpatches/index.html
What defines a patch?
Would that include logos or symbols, or bike brand names :Pokey:

[RiderInBlack]

some patches from around the world.
Cool:niceone: . Thanks for that HR

[spudchucka]

I take it that you are concluding from experience here spud? Pray tell? :shifty:


Zed

Good try Zed but it aint confession time yet!!

[hearty dogg]

Baa baa black sheep
Have you any nuts?
No sir, no sir
Black power sucks
Born in a kennel
Raised in a cell
We are the Mighty Mongrel Mob
Seig Fucking Heilundefined

[Zed]

Good try Zed but it aint confession time yet!!
Yes, I suppose participation on such a site as ours by the powers that be could be seen by some as insubordinate!? Maybe you should carefully guard your online persona Spud!

[Lou Girardin]

Yes, I suppose participation on such a site as ours by the powers that be could be seen by some as insubordinate!? Maybe you should carefully guard your online persona Spud!

You and Spud have something in common; the missionary zeal to convert we heathen sinners.
Lou

[Zed]

You and Spud have something in common; the missionary zeal to convert we heathen sinners.
Lou
Yeah, and we both have our fair share of battles with the lost idolaters along the way...:bleh: (no offense to any lost idolaters out there!)

[spudchucka]

Yes, I suppose participation on such a site as ours by the powers that be could be seen by some as insubordinate!?
Unlikely.


Maybe you should carefully guard your online persona Spud!
Why?

[spudchucka]

You and Spud have something in common; the missionary zeal to convert we heathen sinners.
Lou

Except of course that Zed wants to covert everyone and I have only generally challenged your opinions regarding the NZ constabulary.

I don't know if you are a sinner Lou but you are a good stirrer.

[spudchucka]

Baa baa black sheep
Have you any nuts?
No sir, no sir
Black power sucks
Born in a kennel
Raised in a cell
We are the Mighty Mongrel Mob
Seig Fucking Heilundefined

Isn't it stupid how an ethnic group like the Mighty Moron Mob adopt insignia and phrases from Nazi Germany, the very regime that would have lined them up and had them shot just for smelling bad.

[Holy Roller]

Isn't it stupid how an ethnic group like the Mighty Moron Mob adopt insignia and phrases from Nazi Germany, the very regime that would have lined them up and had them shot just for smelling bad.
More likely because they arn't blue eyed and blond haired, the master race. :stoogie:

[RiderInBlack]

Ya, it does worry me the number of my fellow bikers that instant on having a swazzsticker (don't know if that is spelt right) on them or their bikes. Can anyone explain that one? Cause I can not understand why anyone in their right mind could think that the Holocaust was a cool idea (or burning witches for that matter:Offtopic: ).

[Lou Girardin]

They know nothing about the Nazi period, they just wear Nazi regalia because they think it's cool and it upsets the establishment. But I would like to see how long gangs would have survived in those days. Probably as long as a train ride to Mathausen.
Lou

[marty]

or the idiots that wear the white power south african swastika (the Triskelion) - usually ethnic gang members.....WTF is up with that? it has NO connection to ethnic gangs, apart from their cleansing. i just can't get my head around it. if they think they've got it hard, maybe they need to read the Diary of Anne Frank.

[MikeL]

Unfortunately a liberal and democratic society has no choice but to tolerate such expressions of gross bad taste and historical ignorance, because to repress them would be to start travelling along the same road that led to Mauthausen..
Wearing a swastika communicates the unspoken message "I have the IQ of a retarded Neanderthal, the education of an Appalachian first-grader, and the sensitivity and social graces of a chimpanzee," but none of these is a crime.
I have some sympathy for those who advocate outlawing such displays on the grounds that they are an incitement to hatred, but it would be the thin end of the wedge.

[Two Smoker]

Wearing a swastika communicates the unspoken message "I have the IQ of a retarded Neanderthal, the education of an Appalachian first-grader, and the sensitivity and social graces of a chimpanzee,"
.
Well said MikeL:lol:

[Big Dog]

Wearing a swastika communicates the unspoken message "I have the IQ of a retarded Neanderthal, the education of an Appalachian first-grader, and the sensitivity and social graces of a chimpanzee," but none of these is a crime.
I feel genuinely saddened by the fact that until the 1930's the swastika was a good luck thing in germany intended to signify the end of the crusades (the cross is broken to provide a wheel), and the freedom resulting.

It also saddens me to see that there are some people with such low IQ's that they are both ignorant to the hatred it represents and stupid enough to get it tatooed on their face. :argh:

[Motu]

The swastika was originaly a Tibetan symbol that was reversed by the Nazis,or at least Hitler,he was into the occult - a good read is something called from memory ''The Occult Reich''.

[pete376403]

Christian religion used the symbol as well. Christchurch cathedral has a line of them across the north wall of the nave http://www.christchurchcathedral.co.nz/tour/fylfot_mural.htm
The link gives a possible meaning of the symbol

[El Dopa]

Christian religion used the symbol as well. Christchurch cathedral has a line of them across the north wall of the nave http://www.christchurchcathedral.co.nz/tour/fylfot_mural.htm
The link gives a possible meaning of the symbol

I've also seen them used as a surround for a mural in a temple in Malaysia, the mural depicting the old Chinese legend of monkey.

My understanding was that if it's rotating in a clockwise direction, this was an ancient good luck symbol, but the nazis reversed the direction when they adopted it, so it went anticlockwise, or against the sun. Now that it's such an emotive sign, most people wouldn't get as far as checking.....

There's a guy in Canada, known as 'swastika man' who has his body literally covered in swastika tatoos. Not a Nazi, but a nutcase who has made it his life mission to reclaim the symbol from the nazis.

[Big Dog]

Interesting how many different interpretations of the same symbol.
Is it surprising the unwashed masses know no better?

[Draco]

Interesting how many different interpretations of the same symbol.
Is it surprising the unwashed masses know no better?

Here, here. And isn't it a shame in this supposed age of cultural sensitivity that this subject even comes up.

[deeknow]

My experience with gang members - working in a gas station, middle of the day, 3 mobsters pull in, one enters shop, waits for other customers to leave before approaching counter...

I had a "mobster and Gas station experience" of my own a few years ago. I was in a car driven by a Maori friend of ours Wiki, who was a school teacher in Te Whaiti (tiny settlement between Murupara and Waikaremoana. Wiki pulls in to the gas station in Murupara and standing outside are these three staunch looking patched mob dudes.

Wiki (a not insignificantly sized woman) gets out of our car and approaches the gas station. As she passes the three guys (all in their 20's to 30's) they all kind of stand to attention, Wiki says "hello boys" ... and they all reply in unison in this high pitched un-manly squeel .... "Morning Mrs Robinson".

Turns our she had been their primary school teacher. Jeeze it was funny, of course, we didnt laugh about it till we were a few hundred yards down the road in the car again :-)

[James Deuce]

I had a "mobster and Gas station experience" of my own a few years ago. I was in a car driven by a Maori friend of ours Wiki, who was a school teacher in Te Whaiti (tiny settlement between Murupara and Waikaremoana. Wiki pulls in to the gas station in Murupara and standing outside are these three staunch looking patched mob dudes.

Wiki (a not insignificantly sized woman) gets out of our car and approaches the gas station. As she passes the three guys (all in their 20's to 30's) they all kind of stand to attention, Wiki says "hello boys" ... and they all reply in unison in this high pitched un-manly squeel .... "Morning Mrs Robinson".

Turns our she had been their primary school teacher. Jeeze it was funny, of course, we didnt laugh about it till we were a few hundred yards down the road in the car again :-)

Baaaaahahaaaahahahahaaaaaaaa (snort)!

Mate! I think I just wet myself.

[magnum]

hello,bp and mm are not biker gangs at all,gangs yes.most biker gangs have a distaste for jappas but for me its the enjoyment factor riding not what you ride.have had the occational gang biker give me the bird,i just give one back as if hes gonna catch me on his tractor!!most wont bother you unless you bother them,steve.go green.

[scumdog]

To "bunny" who seemed to think that certain catagories of bike riders had something to "prove" by riding/wearing certain gear, - I ride a '97 H-D Sportster 'S' (the nearest thing to a GT that H-D makes) and I wear a tasled leather jacket and have worn it for 11+ years.
I am a member of BRONZ, N.Z Deerstalker and N.Z. Hot Rod Association.
I wear/ride/belong what I WANT to with no thought of what I am trying to "prove" or because I am a "wannabe", I am over 50 years old and I don't have to "prove" myself to anyone (except the mrs but we'll leave that alone!).
I feel that "bunny" meant what he said at first but when the wave of non-agreement replies hit him he changed it to "just stirring" but those are just my thoughts.
I know gang and ex-gang members but don't "wear" that association with them like a badge to give me "cred" or prove myself.
The people I party with and go to rallies with are mature enough to ask how the ride went rather than "ya don't own one of those old tractors do you?" or "fuck mate, no-one wears tassles", only dick-heads say that and I dob't drink with dick-heads. :spudwhat:

[wkid_one]

One definition of a gang is such: 2 : a group of persons having informal and usually close social relations

Does this not imply that everytime you ride in a group - you are a 'gang'.

Just a thought.....don't place stereotypes and throw stones when you live in a glass house.

We are a 'gang' - by sheer virtue of congregation, similar interest, and numbers.

[Podo]

One definition of a gang is such: 2 : a group of persons having informal and usually close social relations

Does this not imply that everytime you ride in a group - you are a 'gang'.

Just a thought.....don't place stereotypes and throw stones when you live in a glass house.

We are a 'gang' - by sheer virtue of congregation, similar interest, and numbers.
Precisely, why do you think successive governments have not legislated against gangs, they would be outlawing themselves!

[KATWYN]

ive probably been on more of those charity runs than you have - been going to most of them since they started - trying to show bikers in a good light.
This must put you in the "old fart" catagory that you were talking about
earlier on?

[KATWYN]

My experience with gang members - working in a gas station, middle of the day, 3 mobsters pull in, one enters shop, waits for other customers to leave before approaching counter (methinks something is up here) - then says to me "how about you give me a packet of cigarettes or I will stab you" Now I thought for a moment, do I give him one lousy packet of cigarettes -probably the sensible thing..but being young and headstrong myself thought he was likely just trying to intimidate me, I mean all he wanted was one pack of cigarettes ??

I said "if youv'e got a knife, pull it out and you can have the whole till of money and all the cigarettes" - this brought a confused look on his face and he repated the question - I gave the same answer again. He looked dumbfounded that I was standing up to him ( I had a nice tyre lever under the counter ready for him if he really tried to stab me).

He gave me a funny look, a cross between disbelief that he was not getting what he wanted and embarrassment that a teenager was standing up to him. He walked out of the shop so I hit the security alert button, but they were gone before security came.

Now, my decision/actions may not have been the right ones, and it could have gotten ugly (if he actually had pulled the knife he could have had whatever he wanted).

This story just illustrates that a lot of gang members (and other bullies) rely on intimidation to get what they want.

Yea three weeks ago we were intimidated out of $150.00 by a guy. There was no knife or gun involved but you just knew he wasn't going to leave without the money....the police since asked us "why did you give him the money?" .....now we are really confused about procedure, the message we got from the police is "if you are not under physical apprehension, hold on to your money for dear life" :confused2

[pete376403]

Why? Its only money. Coming from a cop that is a piece of full-on stupid advice. When the cops can guarantee that there isn't a gun or knife in the persons pocket, that'll be the day I hold on to the money, until then, if I get mugged, they can have what ever they ask for.

[pete376403]

Precisely, why do you think successive governments have not legislated against gangs, they would be outlawing themselves!

Didn't the police refer to themselves as "New Zealands largest armed gang" at one time?

[Jackrat]

Didn't the police refer to themselves as "New Zealands largest armed gang" at one time?
Yeah that was Gideon Tait during the seventys.
He turned out to be a waste of space.

[Big Dog]

Yea three weeks ago we were intimidated out of $150.00 by a guy. There was no knife or gun involved but you just knew he wasn't going to leave without the money....the police since asked us "why did you give him the money?" .....now we are really confused about procedure, the message we got from the police is "if you are not under physical apprehension, hold on to your money for dear life" :confused2

Official policy from the police is to assume all firearms are loaded and that all violent offenders are armed.

[KATWYN]

Thanks for your comments. I think we will stick with the
status quo...and over look what that cop said to us.

I suppose cops can't be perfect in what they say and do.

[Big Dog]

Official policy from the police is to assume all firearms are loaded and that all violent offenders are armed.
You can get a handy little leaflet (they brought them round door to door after the pizza guy got shot) Called armed holdup safety. In it policy is clearly spelled out as stump up cos the police are not much help until after the fact. Pity most cops that respond to these types of calls have not read it. :eyepoke: :bash:

[jrandom]

Yea three weeks ago we were intimidated out of $150.00 by a guy. There was no knife or gun involved but you just knew he wasn't going to leave without the money

Hmmm.

In the good ol' USA, there's a statistically interesting group. That's the bunch of people with legally issued 'concealed carry' firearms permits.

Not only do they have a vanishingly low rate of violent criminals among them (much lower than the general population), their rate of victimisation to violent crime is hugely lower than average.

There are all sorts of arguments for and against an armed citizenry, but isn't it interesting that legally licensing people to carry weapons for self-defense creates that statistical situation? I'm not going to get started on cause and effect, although I suspect that it's easily demonstrable from a common-sense point of view.

But Katwyn - don't you wish you'd been able to tell that thug to f#$* off, and back it up if necessary?

[Big Dog]

If you illegalise firearms only criminals will have firearms.

Having said that if you are not properly trained in firearms use a gun will do you more harm than good in a real situation.

So you know how to load point and even shoot that gun of yours. In a real adreniline fuelled situation could you guarantee you would only use the minimum appropriate force?
Could you guarantee you would not kill an innocent as well or instead?
Would the hole in the wall/window/floor + lost sales due to closure for the investigation cost less than the $150 dollars they got away with?

The biggest consequence of arming the public is that as a whole the public is stupid. A few would abuse the priviledge and the criminals would have access to better firepower and bulletproof vests.

Sure one stat might have a statistical anomaly but can show me any state in America that has less violent crime than NZ?

[Big Dog]

S%^ if I was a criminal and I thought all citizens were potentially armed I would lay waste to every man woman and child that even flinched to get my hands on enough money to pay for the next hit.

What scares me is how many people are resorting to violent crime to "chase their dragons". Up until a couple of yaers ago the threat of an armed robbery seamed pretty remote and like it would be no big deal in the event something did happen. But the thought of a junkie out of his mind on P but on his way down and suffering from withdrawls, and paranoia brandishing a firearm, that is probably poorly maintained and likely to go off unintentionally, that the offender has never even fired before...
THAT SCARES THE S%^ OUT OF ME!

[KATWYN]

Hmmm.

In the good ol' USA, there's a statistically interesting group. That's the bunch of people with legally issued 'concealed carry' firearms permits.

Not only do they have a vanishingly low rate of violent criminals among them (much lower than the general population), their rate of victimisation to violent crime is hugely lower than average.

There are all sorts of arguments for and against an armed citizenry, but isn't it interesting that legally licensing people to carry weapons for self-defense creates that statistical situation? I'm not going to get started on cause and effect, although I suspect that it's easily demonstrable from a common-sense point of view.

But Katwyn - don't you wish you'd been able to tell that thug to f#$* off, and back it up if necessary?

Yes, definitely. We were pretty p***** about it :kick: . Even though as the thug said "it's ONLY $150 " Yea well ONLY $150.00 is still hard earned money. He was definitely drugged out on something- and that was the scariest part...not knowing what we were dealing with

And as far as the weapon thing goes...it can always be turned back onto you
But its kinda tempting to carry spray stuff or something...something small enough to go on your key ring

[Big Dog]

Katwyn you could consider yourself lucky on eof my staff busted someone for a Chuppa chup. Fortunately I had just given him the never lock them in (you are worth more than the stock) lecture the day before. Son instead he refused to serve their friend.

Chuppa chup = 30c
Window broken by shoplifter = $2,800
Lesson in why you don't confront shoplifters when by yourself = priceless

[FROSTY]

You guys are mising the point. Those wannabee bikers or old farts or whatever you wanna call em are riding two wheels.
Ours is a small enough community without isolating different branches of it.
Why cares if someone rides a rice rocket ,a hoggly doggly.wears fluro leathers with scrapers or black leathers with a patch
We all ride bikes

[jrandom]

And as far as the weapon thing goes...it can always be turned back onto you

Myth. Virtually never happens with handguns, funnily enough. In reality, if one person has a ready firearm, the other party's only options are submission or a much greater than 50% chance of death or serious injury.

And naturally the whole 'trained to use it' thing applies. One could argue that 'carry licenses' should only be issued to those who have proven proficiency in, say, IPSC matches or the like. While we're on the subject, if you're interested in the realities of confronting an attacker armed with a contact weapon, Google for 'Tueller drill' (which also has a very big implication for that Waitara affair a while back - I was surprised that the media never brought it up, but then the pinko tree-huggers wouldn't like that kind of information to be made public, would they?)

There's a big difference between the USA's "anyone can buy a gun, let's go pop a cap in the ass of the local homies" and a hypothetical state where you can't even OWN a fightin' gun without a properly-issued "I'm a responsible and competent gun user" license for self-defense. AFAIK there isn't really *anywhere* at the moment with that kind of legal structure, but wouldn't it be nice...

[Motu]

You could always go and live in Iraq - you can own any damn weapon you like...and use it at will,no licence to carry,heaven for a gun freak.

[speedpro]

I had this cunning idea a while ago. At birth every person is issued with a single shot single use firearm. Once they turn 18 they can use it to kill someone without any legal consequences. There would be huge penalties for using someone elses.

Imagine the dilemmas. You "could" kill that guy who is pissing you off and really in your face, "but" what if one of his friends returned the favour. Would you be so lippy to strangers in confrontational situations, and would you be so ready to use your one and only free shot?

I think it would create a better world as most people would be a lot more tolerant being ever mindful of the possible consequences.

[Jackrat]

I had this cunning idea a while ago. At birth every person is issued with a single shot single use firearm. Once they turn 18 they can use it to kill someone without any legal consequences. There would be huge penalties for using someone elses.

Imagine the dilemmas. You "could" kill that guy who is pissing you off and really in your face, "but" what if one of his friends returned the favour. Would you be so lippy to strangers in confrontational situations, and would you be so ready to use your one and only free shot?

I think it would create a better world as most people would be a lot more tolerant being ever mindful of the possible consequences.
Unless your proposed victim knew you were coming an blew your own ass away.And you could guarante I wouldn't play by the rules either,you wouldn't get past the front gate.An fuck the consequences.See you forgot to take into account the red neck factor. :crazy:

[Motu]

I think the same thing about insurance companies - ban the whole lot of them,let people be responsible for their own fuck ups - oh,you were talking on your phone and bumped into my Pajero,now your SL500 is all dented - WELL FIX IT YOUR FUCKING SELF WANKER!!!

[spudchucka]

While we're on the subject, if you're interested in the realities of confronting an attacker armed with a contact weapon, Google for 'Tueller drill' (which also has a very big implication for that Waitara affair a while back - I was surprised that the media never brought it up, but then the pinko tree-huggers wouldn't like that kind of information to be made public, would they?)
You can be sure this would have been covered in the trial although it was not reported by the media, typical. The reality is that a minimum safe distance from an armed offender, (knife, bat, club, sword) is at least 15 metres. Any less distance can easily be closed in less time than it takes to draw, aim and fire a pistol. This is common knowledge amongst law enforcement agencies and I'm sure it would have been well demonstrated at the trial.

[Lou Girardin]

And of course, three trained cops can't take down one man.
Do you get tired of defending the indefensible?
Lou

[James Deuce]

And of course, three trained cops can't take down one man.
Do you get tired of defending the indefensible?
Lou

To be fair Lou I have seen reports, and I will try to find a copy of one, that state it takes 7 men to subdue 1 person who doesn't want to be subdued. A few of those 7 will be injured in the process too.

[jrandom]

And of course, three trained cops can't take down one man.

He had a lethal weapon and was threatening to kill them, Lou. What were they supposed to do, wrap him in bubblewrap and feed him a hot Milo? Don't let your mini-forum-vendetta with Spud lead you to make silly comments.

I'm glad Spud thinks the Tueller research would have been brought up at the trial. The simple fact is that our LEOs, criticise their traffic enforcement as we might, should be *required* to defend themselves and the public from violence with whatever means necessary.

In any case, speaking to someone who was actually involved or knew those who were (or for that matter reading the Police report, which is on public record) should be a prerequisite before spouting off opinions in situations like this. I've done both of the above, and I honestly can't justify any course of action other than what was taken that night.

[jrandom]

I had this cunning idea a while ago. At birth every person is issued with a single shot single use firearm. Once they turn 18 they can use it to kill someone without any legal consequences. There would be huge penalties for using someone elses.

There was an sf short story published back in the 60s or 70s on a similar theme - the idea was that anyone could just go to a public data terminal and dial in the death of anyone else (they all had little self-destruct chips in their brains, or something). Made for a polite society, you see. Can't remember who wrote it.

Of course, the twist in the story was that as soon as you dialed someone in for nixing, *your* self-destruct chip went off. Cleaned out all the sociopaths real fast...

[marty]

And of course, three trained cops can't take down one man.
Do you get tired of defending the indefensible?
Lou

one trained cop took him down lou.

[spudchucka]

And of course, three trained cops can't take down one man.
Do you get tired of defending the indefensible?
Lou
Do you ever get tired of being a one eyed git?

[scumdog]

one trained cop took him down lou.

Quite right Marty! Lou, it points to a certain lack in the grey matter to want to have a go at someone you know has a firearm and you are "only" armed with a golf club or similar, you would have to be a nutter or a loser.

Three cops to take him down? yeah, like cops are trained in synchronised take-down-of-armed person-at-night, - get real, how much do you think they get trained? and if I was in their shoes I would wonder if I was getting paid enough :shit:

[SPman]

Knowing many of the people involved in this case, including eyewitnesses and having talked to them, having family and friends in Waitara and having lived there myself, lets just say there were disturbing features on both sides of the case and the whole tragedy should never have happened. The offender was out of it and so were some of the police!
Past history, move on. The trials were mishandled - the result was inevitable from the beginning - the police have made changes to procedures in testing due to this case!
And there were no motorcycle gangs involved!

[spudchucka]

Quite right Marty! Lou, it points to a certain lack in the grey matter to want to have a go at someone you know has a firearm and you are "only" armed with a golf club or similar, you would have to be a nutter or a loser.

Three cops to take him down? yeah, like cops are trained in synchronised take-down-of-armed person-at-night, - get real, how much do you think they get trained? and if I was in their shoes I would wonder if I was getting paid enough :shit:
Lou seems to think that cops should be some form of superbeing, capable of apprehending any dangerous offender without suffering any physical consequences. Robo cop was just a movie Lou.

[Big Dog]

I had this cunning idea a while ago. At birth every person is issued with a single shot single use firearm. Once they turn 18 they can use it to kill someone without any legal consequences. There would be huge penalties for using someone elses.

At the risk of being flamed in classic BBQ style.

The flaw in this logic as I see it is that only those with sociopathic tendancies in the first place would actually kill another person for any reason other than self preservation, or preservation of others.

Murder is wrong and hard to deal with even in a justifiable homocide.

I feel confident that in a situation where someone elses life or wellbeing was threatened, I could calmly and methodically kill as many people as it took. I would feel worse if I let them be harmed, easier to live with than the alternative.

I don't think I could do it for my own preservation. That is one hell of a trip.... I killed him.... and widowed his wife.... killed all of his future children.... perhaps killed a loving father.... why? So I could live longer? Who am I to say who should live longer? Same does not go for those who try to threaten me because they want what I earned. That would be a no brainer................
You point a gun at me cos I slept with your wife and her sister. Ce sera sera.
You point it at me cos you want the contents of my till good luck.
You point that same gun at me because you want the key's to my bike you better not drop her and you better be good at hide and seek. Sleep with one eye open!

The problem I see is that by Darwinian selection only the meek and the psycopathic would be around in 1-3 generations. ie those who stayed under the radar and those are the radar.

Violence solves nothing it just trades one set of regrets or problems for another.

[Big Dog]

I would wonder if I was getting paid enough :shit:
I have had a gun pointed at me for $10 an hour, I have had one pointed at me for $50, I have had one pointed at me for nothing.

You are never paid enough.

The one for free was way more satisfying than the $50.
If your motivation is money when the time comes B$1 is not enough. You have to beleive that your reason is right, and be prepared to die to defend it.

[SPman]

In a series of psychological studies,approximately 80% of Humans would not knowingly kill another human, unless it was a matter of life and death, protecting their loved ones.:mellow:
The other 20% would feel little regret in killing someone else! :confused2

Scary! :shit:

[Big Dog]

In a series of psychological studies,approximately 80% of Humans would not knowingly kill another human, unless it was a matter of life and death, protecting their loved ones.:mellow:
The other 20% would feel little regret in killing someone else! :confused2

Scary! :shit:
According to pshyc evals done for my airforce application I would feel little remorse in a justifiable, but I lost a lot of sleep recently when I found a poisoned and dying baby mouse and had to put it out of its obvious misery.
The fact that its poor little body was racked with pain and it was going to die any way do little to ease the guilt.

Now if only the little bastard had attacked the pillion, no guilt I'm sure.

[Lou Girardin]

Getting angry Spud? Resorting to personal abuse is a sign of uncertainty in your arguement.
If three cops can't subdue one man without killing him, there is something very wrong. And this comes from personal experience, not imaginings.
Lou

[Big Dog]

Just a random thought, why is it that police are allowed to tranq animals and not humans?

[marty]

Getting angry Spud? Resorting to personal abuse is a sign of uncertainty in your arguement.
If three cops can't subdue one man without killing him, there is something very wrong. And this comes from personal experience, not imaginings.
Lou


sorry lou, but i have issue with this. as far as i know you have never been a police officer. i am happy though to be corrected if i'm wrong.

[El Dopa]

Just a random thought, why is it that police are allowed to tranq animals and not humans?

A lot of good reasons, here's some off the top of my head:

1) If a person is off his head on P or PCP, the tranq might not work

2) Even if it does, it might not have an effect until the perp has already done what he was threatening to do, e.g. pull the trigger and kill a hostage. The effect isn't instantaneous, unlike a bullet.

3) its a lot harder to get a dart into someone and deliver a payload than it is a bullet

4) if a person had a bad allergic reaction or similar and then died as a consequence, the media would be all over it like a rash for weeks on end. "they said it was harmless, but now her son is dead. Someone must take the blame"

[spudchucka]

Getting angry Spud? Resorting to personal abuse is a sign of uncertainty in your arguement.
If three cops can't subdue one man without killing him, there is something very wrong. And this comes from personal experience, not imaginings.
Lou
Not angry, just suffering from a very low idiot tolerance.

Quite frankly I just think you are full of wind.

[scumdog]

Getting angry Spud? Resorting to personal abuse is a sign of uncertainty in your arguement.
If three cops can't subdue one man without killing him, there is something very wrong. And this comes from personal experience, not imaginings.
Lou

Sure three cops could subdue a man without killing him but you would need a damn fancy crystal ball to see you weren't the one that was probably going to get snotted before the others got control.

I have seen a vodeo where cops were doing pepperspray training, the "bad guy" was another cop who wasn't hyped up on "p" or anything but had just worked himself into a frenzy, the pepperspray had almost no effect and if the weapon he had (I think it was a "sword") had been real and he had pushed home his attack there would have been mayhem.

Put it this way - if I was faced with a deranged person who was holding something that could give me "serious bodily harm" and did not think I could out run them I would use whatever it took to make sure they did not get to me and at those distances you would have to be pretty brave to try the pepperspray first to see if it worked :bash:
ppP

[spudchucka]

Sure three cops could subdue a man without killing him but you would need a damn fancy crystal ball to see you weren't the one that was probably going to get snotted before the others got control.

I have seen a vodeo where cops were doing pepperspray training, the "bad guy" was another cop who wasn't hyped up on "p" or anything but had just worked himself into a frenzy, the pepperspray had almost no effect and if the weapon he had (I think it was a "sword") had been real and he had pushed home his attack there would have been mayhem.

Put it this way - if I was faced with a deranged person who was holding something that could give me "serious bodily harm" and did not think I could out run them I would use whatever it took to make sure they did not get to me and at those distances you would have to be pretty brave to try the pepperspray first to see if it worked :bash:
ppP
Maximum distance for spray is 3 metres, well within the kill zone of a person armed with a stabbing or blunt instrument. A distance of 3 metres can be closed in the blinking of an eye and the spray can take up to 7 - 8 seconds to take effect and can have no effect at all on a motivated offender. It would not have been a good option in the Waitara incident.

[Lou Girardin]

sorry lou, but i have issue with this. as far as i know you have never been a police officer. i am happy though to be corrected if i'm wrong.

No, not Police. But in the MOT and when I was driver testing I had to subdue guys a lot bigger than me. (Nearly everyone's bigger than me)
We had no batons, pepper spray, etc. Just plastic crowd control handcuffs.
Lou

[spudchucka]

No, not Police. But in the MOT and when I was driver testing I had to subdue guys a lot bigger than me. (Nearly everyone's bigger than me)
We had no batons, pepper spray, etc. Just plastic crowd control handcuffs.
Lou
So given your extensive experience in restraing dissatisfied driver licence applicants you would no doubt be happy to take on, (unarmed) a crazed maniac full of muderous intent armed with a baseball bat. On ya.

[marty]

ROTFLMTO..................

[spudchucka]

Getting angry Spud? Resorting to personal abuse is a sign of uncertainty in your arguement.
Lou
Sorry Lou I didn't realise I was arguing with you, I thought I was just insulting you. My mistake I suppose?

[Big Dog]

1) If a person is off his head on P or PCP, the tranq might not work

2) Even if it does, it might not have an effect until the perp has already done what he was threatening to do, e.g. pull the trigger and kill a hostage. The effect isn't instantaneous, unlike a bullet.

3) its a lot harder to get a dart into someone and deliver a payload than it is a bullet

4) if a person had a bad allergic reaction or similar and then died as a consequence, the media would be all over it like a rash for weeks on end. "they said it was harmless, but now her son is dead. Someone must take the blame"

1 yeah but it might.
2 but I mean in circumstances where the perp is contained
3 true.
4 yeah but I am sure the survival rate on a tranq would be higher than survival rate on lead poisoning.

I personally would rather deal with the hangover of a trnaq than a bullet. Given a choice I will take my chances with a tranq dart 10/10 times.

[El Dopa]

1 yeah but it might.
2 but I mean in circumstances where the perp is contained
3 true.
4 yeah but I am sure the survival rate on a tranq would be higher than survival rate on lead poisoning.

I personally would rather deal with the hangover of a trnaq than a bullet. Given a choice I will take my chances with a tranq dart 10/10 times.

Yeah, it does sound like a reasonable option in certain circumstances. Corrall/contain your suspect, then get close enough to pop a dart in his (or her) leg, without exposing yourself/getting within their striking distance.

But I suspect the range of circumstances it could be used in would be narrow, so it isn't really cost effective.

Example: the suspect would almost always have to be unarmed (his bullet goes further and straighter than your dart, and hits harder), and they'd have to be alone, as in not holding a hostage, cos shooting and missing, or shooting, hitting and the drug not taking effect quickly would run the risk of enraging him and tipping him over the edge into hurting the hostage.

I think most police forces worldwide have done the thinking, and decided that in 90% of cases, they can rely on other non-lethal means of restraint when things get that close in. E.g. pepper spray, electric zapper, truncheon, restraint holds etc. The other 10% isn't worth time and money for training and equipment.

[SARGE]

Hmmm.

In the good ol' USA, there's a statistically interesting group. That's the bunch of people with legally issued 'concealed carry' firearms permits.



i am one of those people.. i worked in nightclubs etc (several were " biker Bars") and carried large amounts of cash every night .. i carried a 9mm Berretta everywhere in Condition 1 (round chambered)

[Sniper]

I had gang members come after me once. They were high and wanted m bicycle. I got away which isnt too hard when you are chased by Blen members

[thehollowmen]

OK

People:
Random question

Many of us wear KB hoodies and KB shirts and have ordered the KB patches...

Does this make KB a 'patch club'?

[Bonez]

Does this make KB a 'patch club'?Being new to thread I'd say the answer is a resonding YES!! You big bad patch riding, panel kicking, mirror breaking, fist waving Kiwi Bikers you :wait:

[Bonez]

Well considering KB ain't a club,Id say not. :rofl: Read this my dear Watson :sherlock:
http://www.brainydictionary.com/words/cl/club144935.html

[Beemer]

black power and mongrel mob are not bike gangs - they are ethnic based street gangs, only a few of their members ride bikes, most go around in big cars.
There are plenty of Biker Clubs, Hells Angels being best know but most towns have their own club, Out Casts-Hamilton, Titans-Matamata, Loners-Levin, etc. It goes on - even the smallest of towns has a patch club.

I've just stumbled over this thread after someone revived it and I'd like to know where BB gets his information from. I've lived in Levin for five years and have NEVER heard of the Loners. There is a motorcycle CLUB here - the Levin Custom and Touring Club - but no motorcycle gang. My husband has lived in this area all his life (originally from Otaki) and he said the name Loners vaguely rings a bell - but not in Levin, he thinks they were based in Paekakariki.

In case you don't know, Levin is famous for its nongs (Kimberley) :stupid: , not its gangs!

[Squiggles]

OK

Many of us wear KB hoodies and KB shirts and have ordered the KB patches...

Does this make KB a 'patch club'?

:O i never thought of it like that!

[Bonez]

I've just stumbled over this thread after someone revived it and I'd like to know where BB gets his information from. I've lived in Levin for five years and have NEVER heard of the Loners. There is a motorcycle CLUB here - the Levin Custom and Touring Club - but no motorcycle gang. My husband has lived in this area all his life (originally from Otaki) and he said the name Loners vaguely rings a bell - but not in Levin, he thinks they were based in Paekakariki.

In case you don't know, Levin is famous for its nongs (Kimberley) :stupid: , not its gangs! There was a Tyrants Chapter in Levin, but it's now defunct and the Pahiatua Tyrants membership is waining-the owner of the land the clubrooms is on has insisted it's members have nothing to do with "P".

[RDJ]

HOG owners are the same - most buy HD because they feel it makes people look at them, makes them different, makes them cool, attracts the 50+ wannabe biker mamas to them like flys, or hopefully a young impressionable 40 year old. NO one I know rides a HD because they are a great bike, stylish yes, a fashion statement - yes, holds its value -yes, but a great bike - no.
And Yes I have owned them.
When I get so sad I need an object to make people notice me I will cover my face in piercings or tattoos - people notice those too.

So.... why ever did you own more than one Harley if you are so contemptuous of Harley owners?

[WINJA]

I WAS IN A GANG FOR A WHILE , WE HAD NO NAME BUT WE WENT AROUND ON STREET MAGICS TEARING UP GOLF COURSES, RUGBY FIELDS ,BOWLING GREENS AND PARKS, YEAH FUCKEN BAD ASSES. BUT SOME OF THE GUYS MUMS FOUND OUT ABOUT OUR ANTICS AND PUT A STOP TO IT

[scumdog]

Being new to thread I'd say the answer is a resonding YES!! You big bad patch riding, panel kicking, mirror breaking, fist waving Kiwi Bikers you :wait:

Right on!!

You 'heavy' KBers heading down to Kaka Point from Dunners late on?

We'll show those rubes down there what a Kb gang is!!

PM me all members!! (if your mum lets you)

[Bonez]

Yeah thanks,proves my point exactly.You missed the "To throw, or allow to fall, into confusion. " Oh and the bit about promoting a common goal/aim-riding. :whistle: How's the XS project coming along JR?

[outlawtorn]

I sometimes wear my patched jacket, but the jacket is full of Metallica, Megadeth, Anthrax, Sepultura, Napalm Death patches :Punk: , all music, no gang stuff and I personally couldn't give two shits what other people think about me or my bike....

[mstriumph]

Winja ----- you are soooooooooooooo cute!! :wait:
I WAS IN A GANG FOR A WHILE , WE HAD NO NAME BUT WE WENT AROUND ON STREET MAGICS TEARING UP GOLF COURSES, RUGBY FIELDS ,BOWLING GREENS AND PARKS, YEAH FUCKEN BAD ASSES. BUT SOME OF THE GUYS MUMS FOUND OUT ABOUT OUR ANTICS AND PUT A STOP TO IT

[scumdog]

I WAS IN A GANG FOR A WHILE , WE HAD NO NAME BUT WE WENT AROUND ON STREET MAGICS TEARING UP GOLF COURSES, RUGBY FIELDS ,BOWLING GREENS AND PARKS, YEAH FUCKEN BAD ASSES. BUT SOME OF THE GUYS MUMS FOUND OUT ABOUT OUR ANTICS AND PUT A STOP TO IT

When you're over 14 years old you are not meant to skite about this stuff - you should be embarassed about it!! :rofl: :motu:

[mstriumph]

i liked my admonision better, truly .... :chase:
When you're over 14 years old you are not meant to skite about this stuff - you should be embarassed about it!! :rofl: :motu:

[Juan]

Some "gangs" or patch clubs are top people the www.moddeydhoomcc.co.uk are such guys and gals, they raised somewhere in the region of £50000 for the children of the founder of the Ladies of Man mmc who was killed on her bike....

This is the start of a TT course lap...I am in this pic!!

http://www.moddeydhoomcc.co.uk/sechtml/imgpgs/dcfr/grand/images/dcgs%20(17)_jpg.jpg

[Bonez]

Winja ----- you are soooooooooooooo cute!! :wait:
Be carefull. NC might get jealous. :innocent:

[WINJA]

Winja ----- you are soooooooooooooo cute!! :wait:
HOW YOU DOIN

[WINJA]

When you're over 14 years old you are not meant to skite about this stuff - you should be embarassed about it!! :rofl: :motu:
AND IF WE EVER FOUND OLD MAN SCUMMYS HOUSE WE WOULDA DONE HIS LAWN TOO , AND PINCHED HIS TURNIPS

[mstriumph]

it was irony ... IRONY
Be carefull. NC might get jealous. :innocent:

[hondacmx450]

black power and mongrel mob are not bike gangs - they are enthnic based street gangs, only a few of there members ride bikes. most go around in big cars.
There are plenty of Biker Clubs, Hells Angels being best know but most towns have their own club, Out Casts-Hamilton, Titans-Matamata, Loners-Levin, etc. It goes on - even the smallest of towns has a patch club.

To me it is all rather silly, but not as silly as the Old folk who insist on trying to be what they never had the balls to be when they were young, but now they are old and grey they feel the need to try to recapture what they never had, the only difference is money, so they buy a HD or big cruiser, put a cartoon bignose drawing on their back and delude themselves into thinking they are "Real Bikers.

Old Farts take note MOney cant buy you a life style, or Cool. Stop being so sad and get a real life, even if it is as a banker (spelt with a silent W).

And before you all get septic on me - there are some old folk who ride, and ride well, just for the love of it, like the rest of us - but they are the minority.
So if your going to complain - imagine you are 1 of those, and it is the rest I refer to.

HOG owners are the same - most buy HD because they feel it makes people look at them, makes them different, makes them cool, attracts the 50+ wannabe biker mamas to them like flys, or hopefully a young impressionable 40 year old. NO one I know rides a HD because they are a great bike, stylish yes, a fashion statement - yes, holds its value -yes, but a great bike - no.
And Yes I have owned them.
When I get so sad I need an object to make people notice me I will cover my face in piercings or tattoos - people notice those too.
hahahahahahha i like it well said the whole lot haahahah :rofl: :rofl:

[Lias]

I've been drinking with patched MC members before, and for the most part they are prefectly nice blokes.

Not the sort of people you'd want to piss off, but I can say the same thing for a hell of alot of NON patched people I know too. Like my mate who has "The voices in my head tell me they dont like you" tattooed on the back of his head :-P

[pete376403]

I WAS IN A GANG FOR A WHILE , WE HAD NO NAME BUT WE WENT AROUND ON STREET MAGICS TEARING UP GOLF COURSES, RUGBY FIELDS ,BOWLING GREENS AND PARKS, YEAH FUCKEN BAD ASSES. BUT SOME OF THE GUYS MUMS FOUND OUT ABOUT OUR ANTICS AND PUT A STOP TO IT

Perfect name for a gang of that nature (on Street Magics!) would be "the Shrunken Heads" Yeah!

[Timber020]

Stalin was probably a gas to drink with to. I bet Charles Manson was an interesting dude after a few pints. Pity Hitler didnt drink, Im sure when he had a skinful and you didnt bring up the Jews he would be quite the lad.

Not a fan of gang guys, have known a few and understand to well that its only good if they are on your side, if they have something against you, whether you asked for it or were completely innocent member of the public, your life is utter shit.

Some motorcycle gangs are okay, but some are organising the theft of your bike, the burg of your house, the pimping of your kid sister and the P sold to your kids.

[Pixie]

I've been drinking with patched MC members before, and for the most part they are prefectly nice blokes.

P
It's a pity they are criminal scum,who can't face life without the backing of a gang behind them

[Mooch]

In Upper Hutt the local BIKE gang, Shin feign (sp), keep to themselves and even arrange some poker runs and other 'charity' events. This is a later thing as they have got older. Most 'biker gangs' will leave you alone if you leave them alone.
In the seventies, at the height of the real biker gangs, my brother and I were heading on a surfing trip to New Plymouth from the Mount. As we travelled up the Kaimais thirty bikes came up behind us, yes it was a biker gang, :eek5: the real McCoy. They split into two groups one in front and one behind and stayed with us for seventeen hours til we got near the top of the Kaimais - at least it felt that long, then they headed off into the distance. We sweated like you wouldn't believe.

Shin feign is the only bike gang I've had the pleasure to meet. Few years ago one of my bikes died , These guys were coming back from a rally somewhere. They had a support ute for various reasons. I asked if they could take my bike back to Wellington on the ute (was in Turangi at that point) , reply was "no problem" . unfortunetly by the time they'd got to mangaweka one of there own bikes had stopped so had no room for my bike. They still stopped away to make sure I was ok etc. Haven't met them before this or since after but have always held them in a positive light since.

[Indoo]

I've been drinking with patched MC members before, and for the most part they are prefectly nice blokes.
:-P

Nice blokes who just happen to deal a bit of p, steal a few cars/bikes and bash a few 'bitches' on the side. You sound just like the clever people who organised the girls school afterball at the head hunters pad. Its just a shame they got a few girls hooked on drugs whom they then used to service the gang, so to speak.

Gang members are the ultimate cowards, they are just common criminals who lack the intelligence to go it alone.

[Squiggles]

You sound just like the clever people who organised the girls school afterball at the head hunters pad. Its just a shame they got a few girls hooked on drugs whom they then used to service the gang, so to speak.


s***! when/where was that? :eek5:

[scumdog]

I've been drinking with patched MC members before, and for the most part they are prefectly nice blokes.

Not the sort of people you'd want to piss off, but I can say the same thing for a hell of alot of NON patched people I know too. Like my mate who has "The voices in my head tell me they dont like you" tattooed on the back of his head :-P

Nice troll dude!!

Perfectly nice when they steal/beat/smash/drug people and property too I bet.

How many do NOT have a raft of fairly serious convictions???? :wait:

Probably just mis-understood, the poor mites. :violin:

[Lias]

How many do NOT have a raft of fairly serious convictions????


I never said they were saints lol, just the ones I've met arnt as bad as some people make out.

The ones I know of with convictions generally have them for violence, but that doesnt phase me in the slightest.

[scumdog]

The ones I know of with convictions generally have them for violence, but that doesnt phase me in the slightest.

Until YOU are the recipient.....

[ratusratus]

with the Mothers MC in palmy good bunch of blokes.....rather have a beer with them than the organized gang in blue

[spudchucka]

with the Mothers MC in palmy good bunch of blokes.....rather have a beer with them than the organized gang in blue
They are no different to any other organised criminal group. I'd rather you had a beer with them too.

[Pancakes]

I think the wrong idea is being put forward here. Yes there are some nasty peices of work in our society and just cos they're not in a gang doesn't make them right. Yes, there are people who have patches Ullessys (sp?) who aren't out to menace, just to show belonging to a group. The point is the proper gangs are criminal socielties that exist to act as a network to support activities such as theft, violence, extortion and drug manufacture/dealing. I knew people who are in gangs too and got on with them very well but I grew up and saw that they were feared not respected and were more than capable of doing to me what they had done to many other people. Most of these people aren't happy, the fact that some posts are by folks who (I presume) are not in their early teens like I was when those activities impressed me and the same people seem to be taken in by gang members says that they are probably not too dissimalar types of people and that the gang members might just see you as someone who is weak, lonely and looking for a group to associate with. Buying someone a beer with stolen money means sh*t next to buying them a beer with money you worked hard for, think about it. Fostering the idea that these types of gangs are ok ends quickly for most people when their gear gets burg'ed or their family assaulted etc so do yourself a favour and save yourself the trouble of gaining hindsight. As for the off topic discussion of how many cops it takes to subdue someone. Making a desicion while someone is out-of-it and has proven themself to be irrational and capable of violence is different from sitting on your pc reading the hearald front page. Most cops, military and special services I know would say that they could have done better in most situations and try to learn from their mistakes but also that they feel they made the right call given the information they had at the time. To say that X amount of force is unneccisary in the heat of the moment is a far streatch to waht some are suggesting, that cops just love getting their gun off. Killing someone is awful and stays with the killer for their whole life. I'll stop there 'cos this is long enough already. All I can say is that we influnce 1 6billionth of the world, it's not alot but it can make a difference.

[Everyday]

black power and mongrel mob are not bike gangs - they are enthnic based street gangs, only a few of there members ride bikes. most go around in big cars.
There are plenty of Biker Clubs, Hells Angels being best know but most towns have their own club, Out Casts-Hamilton, Titans-Matamata, Loners-Levin, etc. It goes on - even the smallest of towns has a patch club.

To me it is all rather silly, but not as silly as the Old folk who insist on trying to be what they never had the balls to be when they were young, but now they are old and grey they feel the need to try to recapture what they never had, the only difference is money, so they buy a HD or big cruiser, put a cartoon bignose drawing on their back and delude themselves into thinking they are "Real Bikers.

Old Farts take note MOney cant buy you a life style, or Cool. Stop being so sad and get a real life, even if it is as a banker (spelt with a silent W).

And before you all get septic on me - there are some old folk who ride, and ride well, just for the love of it, like the rest of us - but they are the minority.
So if your going to complain - imagine you are 1 of those, and it is the rest I refer to.

HOG owners are the same - most buy HD because they feel it makes people look at them, makes them different, makes them cool, attracts the 50+ wannabe biker mamas to them like flys, or hopefully a young impressionable 40 year old. NO one I know rides a HD because they are a great bike, stylish yes, a fashion statement - yes, holds its value -yes, but a great bike - no.
And Yes I have owned them.
When I get so sad I need an object to make people notice me I will cover my face in piercings or tattoos - people notice those too.

There are HOG owners who have an ornament they take out on a fine weekend and yeah
$20K+, a fine day, don't make a biker.
But don't knock the 2010 Harleys, I chose a 2010 FXD because it beat all the other cruisers for daily riding, lane splitting, windy wellington days and it sounds better, corners better than a sportsmaster(not by much), tbird, M109, vn900 etc. 2010's have side facing rear airvalve, michelins (always ready), useful choices on the display including auto last 50Ks countdown, excellent factory alarm and 5000kms later it still rocks and yeah attracts 18 to 50yo women for rides. 96 cube has the pull for 6 speed. Good quality chrome and no I dont get commission! And piercings and tattoos get the women I want

[Mom]

There are HOG owners who have an ornament they take out on a fine weekend and yeah
$20K+, a fine day, don't make a biker.
But don't knock the 2010 Harleys, I chose a 2010 FXD because it beat all the other cruisers for daily riding, lane splitting, windy wellington days and it sounds better, corners better than a sportsmaster(not by much), tbird, M109, vn900 etc. 2010's have side facing rear airvalve, michelins (always ready), useful choices on the display including auto last 50Ks countdown, excellent factory alarm and 5000kms later it still rocks and yeah attracts 18 to 50yo women for rides. 96 cube has the pull for 6 speed. Good quality chrome and no I dont get commission! And piercings and tattoos get the women I want

Dude, you have got to have taken the prize for thread dredging!

[merv]

.... and where is Zed these days, he's not riding a Harley with Brian Tamaki by any chance is he?

[PeterJ]

Holy Shit!, Five Years between posts!!!!. How do you even find a thread that old?....

[Hotchefnz]

cruising back to welly and look in rear vision mirror to see 20 odd bikes coming up behind me - holey shit all I need, a group of harleys, triumphs and patches in peak hour traffic and me on anything but chrome , all plastic..... - yep was expecting grief - why? because we've all heard the stories of the grief they give - so yeah arse cheeks were sweating a wee bit.
Anyway they Sat on my tail from otaki all the way to greys road and then when we hit the bays an a couple open up and we had a blast round the bays and over the haywards - and they can ride............ well.
Get to the bottom and they pull into the layby and give a wave - not what I was expecting, but has given me a different perspective.
Perhaps the stories are just that.

[Dadpole]

I love these old thread dredges. The list of names is like a roll call of the fallen. Where is Zed? Sitting on Brians right hand? - Bring back WINJA

[Rogue Rider]

You guys are a crack up, love the comms on here. There are some perspectives here that probably need clarifying. The term "gang" is quite derogatory to MC's, and to speak such to one might cop you a sandwich of knuckles if you are in the wrong company.
NZ does have a gang culture however, the two most profile are as stated above, The Mighty Mongrel Mob, (Notorius and Rogues) and the Black Power, These guys are pretty much a product of cultural indifference and really only dislike each other. Unless you do something to them or get involved in their scene then you won't have any problems with them pretty much.
Black Power do have an MC (Motorcycle Club) chapter, however they like 1% MC's pretty much keep to them selves. If you ride a rice burner then they probably won't even look at you twice.
The other MC's commonly seen ie Hells Angels, Tribesman, Filthy Few, Head Hunters, 61's, 45's, Magog's, Greasy Dogs, Road Knights, Epitaph Riders etc etc, well they inter associate a bit on occasion, and do the occasional toy run or public show. Otherwise for the most part they leave well alone and don't bother general public.
It's also worth mentioning that there are several other charitable, social, and Christian riding and MC clubs. These mostly don't resemble any of the 1% characterisics at all, except for the fact they have colours or what laymen call, "Patches". Colours/ Patches historically identify a group of riders by region and association. It is mostly safe to wear one as long as you have approval and local 1% MC, if you have one doesn't have a problem with you/ or your group. Again if you ride asian oriented motorcycles then you pose no issue to anyone really. If you have 1% friendly ride,then perhaps a patch isn't a good idea as they will draw attention and they might think you need teaching a lesson.... lol.
I personally ride with a Christian MC, we operate under similar protocols and regulations as a 1% MC, including earning colours/ prospecting etc. I can honestly testify, that in 10 years of being patched I have never been intimidated nor felt threatened by any 1% MC or any of the ethnic groups ie Mob/ BP. I have been approached by them, and asked who, what and where...... however once they know such they happily let us continue on, sometimes we even had invitations to visit and to pray for them.

In short, pretty much common sense prevails, ignorance is bliss, just don't do anything silly. Bikers (not bikies) are people just like us.

[JimO]

saw some devils henchmen last xmas and one of them rides a ducati, which i thought looked slightly different to the others

[98tls]

Pulled into a rest area to have a breather awhile back to find 2 blokes on bikes doing the same,both wearing Epitaph patches,was like stepping back in time,i thought they were long gone.Was very impressed with one of thems 850 Commando.

[Conquiztador]

There are HOG owners who have an ornament they take out on a fine weekend and yeah
$20K+, a fine day, don't make a biker.
But don't knock the 2010 Harleys, I chose a 2010 FXD because it beat all the other cruisers for daily riding, lane splitting, windy wellington days and it sounds better, corners better than a sportsmaster(not by much), tbird, M109, vn900 etc. 2010's have side facing rear airvalve, michelins (always ready), useful choices on the display including auto last 50Ks countdown, excellent factory alarm and 5000kms later it still rocks and yeah attracts 18 to 50yo women for rides. 96 cube has the pull for 6 speed. Good quality chrome and no I dont get commission! And piercings and tattoos get the women I want

So why would anyone from KB start a second profile and drag up this from 5 years ago??? What's the angle? Beats me.

[scumdog]

So why would anyone from KB start a second profile and drag up this from 5 years ago??? What's the angle? Beats me.

Ah, it's KB, this sort of shit happens all the time...

[Headbanger]

So why would anyone from KB start a second profile and drag up this from 5 years ago??? What's the angle? Beats me.

He's an instant biker grasping for credibility.

[MIXONE]

Ah, it's KB, this sort of shit happens all the time...

Be fucking boring if the only thing "discussed" was how bad the police are or the best tyre to fit though eh.

[98tls]

He's an instant biker grasping for credibility.

That or simply flashbacks,bastards of things,there you are content watching Coro and whamooo....................back in the Bush Inn carpark eating moths.

[peasea]

Be fucking boring if the only thing "discussed" was how bad the police are or the best tyre to fit though eh.

The best tyre to fit to a policeman?

[MIXONE]

The best tyre to fit to a policeman?

Seen a few with a spare tyre...

[peasea]

Seen a few with a spare tyre...

I was thinking something in vivid black with flames, ala Soweto.

[HenryDorsetCase]

The best tyre to fit to a policeman?

dont they all carry their own? ever ready and all that?

[peasea]

dont they all carry their own? ever ready and all that?

It only takes one police officer to change a tyre, but the tyre has to WANT to change.