Counties Manukau Police advice on lane splitting

[imac]

Anyone seen the Counties Manukau Police advice on lane splitting

https://www.facebook.com/Counties.Manukau.Police/videos/1872714826094268/

Discuss :whistle:

Mac

[rastuscat]

Sounds like sage advice.

[FJRider]

Anyone seen the Counties Manukau Police advice on lane splitting

https://www.facebook.com/Counties.Manukau.Police/videos/1872714826094268/

Discuss :whistle:

Mac

I saw it. My question is ... is the vid shown of the motorcyclist lane splitting ... the approved (or unsafe) example of the practice ... ???

[Berries]

So what did we learn about the legal side of things?

[Akzle]

So what did we learn about the legal side of things?

lol. what do teh politzei have to do wit "legal side" of things?

[Akzle]

Anyone seen the Counties Manukau Police advice on lane splitting

https://www.facebook.com/Counties.Manukau.Police/videos/1872714826094268/

Discuss :whistle:

Mac

no. what's a facebook? and what's a cunties manukau?

i've managed to avoid both of those things for this long. i don't think i'll start.

[Berries]

lol. what do teh politzei have to do wit "legal side" of things?
My Mum could have given that advice. What was the point of using a cop?

[Akzle]

My Mum could have given that advice. What was the point of using a cop?

easier than drinking tea from yours hands...

[GazzaH]

Does your mum wear a uniform, eh eh, does she go, eh?

[FJRider]

So what did we learn about the legal side of things?

Overtaking on the left of a vehicle in the same lane is illegal. Well that's what the road code says ...

[Berries]

Kind of my point. I will do whatever I think is safe if splitting and where the actual lane line is is irrelevant to me, I could be on the left of the vehicle in the same lane or on the right of the other one, depends where they are positioned at that exact moment. I will pick a speed that I feel comfortable with relative to the other vehicle speeds, gaps, day of week and whether I have my mums lucky g-string on - that one's for you Gazza. So the comments from the cop are rubbish. I can look after myself thank you very much when it comes to survival, what I would like to know is what is legal or not so I know what to do if I am splitting past a Police car. I think I have a good idea, but if the Police are going to post advice perhaps they should stick to the law rather than what would appear to be personal opinion with no measurable measure, if there is such a thing.

And anyway, his starting comment about the number of fatalities caused by splitting up that way. Is that actually true or is it linked to the media article about splitting/filtering and dangerous overtaking that was discussed last month on KB, shown to be BS, but now can't be found using the search function?

PS - Has anyone mentioned that the search function on this site is shit?

[Akzle]

PS - Has anyone mentioned that the search function on this site is shit?

i have .

[iYRe]

Kind of my point. I will do whatever I think is safe if splitting and where the actual lane line is is irrelevant to me, I could be on the left of the vehicle in the same lane or on the right of the other one, depends where they are positioned at that exact moment. I will pick a speed that I feel comfortable with relative to the other vehicle speeds, gaps, day of week and whether I have my mums lucky g-string on - that one's for you Gazza. So the comments from the cop are rubbish. I can look after myself thank you very much when it comes to survival, what I would like to know is what is legal or not so I know what to do if I am splitting past a Police car. I think I have a good idea, but if the Police are going to post advice perhaps they should stick to the law rather than what would appear to be personal opinion with no measurable measure, if there is such a thing.

And anyway, his starting comment about the number of fatalities caused by splitting up that way. Is that actually true or is it linked to the media article about splitting/filtering and dangerous overtaking that was discussed last month on KB, shown to be BS, but now can't be found using the search function?

PS - Has anyone mentioned that the search function on this site is shit?

I agree with this sentiment. I will ride in a manner that keeps me safe and alive, and if it is illegal, so be it. Better to have a ticket than be dead.

Also, NEVER NEVER ride a motorcycle in traffic like you drive a car. You are not a car, You will not be seen like a car (hell, people dont even see cars and buses let alone bikes). If you sit in the lane passively, you are just making yourself a target. I regularly see about 3-4 (mainly L plate) riders who dont even know how close they came to an accident. I can see them in front of me and regularly witness people about to pull into their lane and then at the last second realise they are there. Car drivers just see a gap, and not the insignificant motorcyclist who is occupying a small part of it.

Also, for the record, and especially in winter, the ass end of a bike blends into the back end of a car - and it doesnt matter how loud it is, or how much fluro you're wearing, you're invisible. Dont sit still and make yourself a target. Dont stop in the middle of a line of traffic at the lights (you're just asking to get rear ended). Split/filter at a speed that enables you to see what is happening in the cars in front of you and so you can stop or manoever around them in a timely fashion. Just beware that when you are splitting/filtering the best and pretty much only escape routes you have are stopping, or accelerating. Choose wisely.

[jasonu]

i have .

Depends on what you are searching for.

[Banditbandit]

Depends on what you are searching for.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e3-5YC_oHjEY

[Voltaire]

From my daily drive on the Southern Motorway, hazard lights are the in thing, and splitting at speed on nicely flowing traffic.

Does the L plate I see on some of them mean Lucky?

[Navy Boy]

I agree with the previous sentiment that you make your own decisions about what you are comfortable with or not. I know that I split lanes considerably slower than a significant number of riders in and around Auckland. Indeed I work with a chap who is a very capable rider but I simply won't try and stay with him when it comes to lane splitting.

Life's about choices...

Moving about in your lane when you are happy to go with the (Slow) flow of traffic definitely helps too. Far be it from me to decry those who choose to lane split at a different speed to me - If they come up behind me I always make an effort to pull into a gap and let them through. It's easier for me and I'm not hacking them off.

Ultimately that's one of the things I love about my biking - It's down to you and you alone. :niceone:

[Akzle]

Depends on what you are searching for.

not really .

[Swoop]

"Don't lane split with your hazard lights on"...
Well, the KB brains trust will fail that attitude test.






NEVER NEVER ride a motorcycle in traffic like you drive a car.
I find the opposite is quite relevant. "When tin-topping, resist the need to filter to the front of the queue" (unless driving a snow plough).
DHAMIK

[Voltaire]

there is really no point in using indicators at all when lanesplitting as your in neither one lane or the other and car drivers are not stuck in traffic

looking in their rear vision mirrors for motorcycles.

You would be better of doing what they do in India and beep the horn continuously :innocent:, at least the taxi and courier drivers would know.

[Laava]

there is really no point in using indicators at all when lanesplitting as your in neither one lane or the other and car drivers are not stuck in traffic

looking in their rear vision mirrors for motorcycles.

You would be better of doing what they do in India and beep the horn continuously :innocent:, at least the taxi and courier drivers would know.

Beeping the horn is more likely to tip the P heads over the edge and get you raged at in NZ esp here in the P capital of NZ, whangarei, although in principle I am right with you!

[Voltaire]

Beeping the horn is more likely to tip the P heads over the edge and get you raged at in NZ esp here in the P capital of NZ, whangarei, although in principle I am right with you!

When I was in India a couple of years back you didn't bother using indicators only the horn, one day my horn stopped working and I pulled over until the support vehicle turned up, no way was I going thru an uncontrolled intersection with no horn.:shutup:
I'm hearing ya on who is driving on the roads though.

[Laava]

When I was in India a couple of years back you didn't bother using indicators only the horn, one day my horn stopped working and I pulled over until the support vehicle turned up, no way was I going thru an uncontrolled intersection with no horn.:shutup:
I'm hearing ya on who is driving on the roads though.

Yeah mate, i have done my fair share of horn tootin countries. Works for them...

[Reckless]

The big point for me is if they put out an instruction Vid on how to split safely

THEY ARE SAYING THEY CONDON IT :niceone:

Careful tho!
The vid shows a bike passing on the side of the center line that doesn't break the existing law, Its overtaking.
If the bike wanders over to the other side of the center line and is undertaking technically "as I understand it" that still breaks the law. Unless that line is stationary.
So this vid has been very very carefully made.
We all know that when cars get banked up in a que they move over to see down the line and its impossible not to split both sides of the line.
In fact we prob spend over 50% on the wrong side of the line. This is why the current law needs changing.
Very tricky this one, careful out there all, tickets could still be issued.

Hopefully my understanding of the current law is correct but Rastus might come along and have some input??

[Berries]

THEY ARE SAYING THEY CONDON IT :niceone:??
Is that like durex?


Hopefully my understanding of the current law is correct but Rastus might come along and have some input??
Everyone should read up and understand the Road User Rule and not rely on advice from someone on the internet.

Here's your starter for ten. (http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2004/0427/latest/DLM302188.html)

[rastuscat]

Is that like durex?


Everyone should read up and understand the Road User Rule and not rely on advice from someone on the internet.

Here's your starter for ten. (http://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2004/0427/latest/DLM302188.html)

Sage advice.

But don't go looking for the section on lane splitting or filtering. You won't find it. It doesn't exist.

Our laws only talk about passing. When you can pass on the left, and when you can pass on the right.

Then it says that at all times when passing you must do do in a "safe" manner.

And there's the problem. What you think is safe, the cop watching you might not think is safe. It's a subjective call.

That's why there's a catch-all ticket for "Overtaking In An Unsafe Manner". Weighing in at $150.

The biggest issue with lane splitting or filtering is catching someone unawares. Yes, everone should be aware of what's moving around them. But most driver's are only concerned about the space ahead of them.

[Voltaire]

So your filtering down a between two lanes of slow moving traffic, if your on the left of the white line your overtaking but if your on the right your illegally undertaking right?

[iYRe]

I find the opposite is quite relevant. "When tin-topping, resist the need to filter to the front of the queue" (unless driving a snow plough).
DHAMIK

I know 3 people who now no longer are able to ride, and several more who were injured because they a: stopped in a line of traffic at some lights and were rear ended - they weren't seen because they blended in with the vehicle in front or b: were sitting in the lane travelling at the same speed as the car and got side swiped because the driver only saw a gap.

35 years in auckland traffic and I refuse to do either of those things. If it happens to you, there is nowhere to go, no escape route.



Our laws only talk about passing. When you can pass on the left, and when you can pass on the right.

Then it says that at all times when passing you must do do in a "safe" manner.

And there's the problem. What you think is safe, the cop watching you might not think is safe. It's a subjective call..

I keep trying to explain to people; "Yes, it looked unsafe to you, but your perspective and the guy on the bikes in different. You don't know what danger they are trying to mitigate."
A lady at work once saw me go through a red light on my bicycle. The next day at work she abused the hell out of me. I waited till she finished and then explained that the road there was very narrow. The reason I ran the light was because on the other side the road widened and if I get there before the cars, there is less chance I am going to be pushed off the road by impatient drivers who just push past regardless." She said isnt that iilegal? I said yes it is, but I am careful, I only do it when I am sure its safe, and I would rather get a ticket for running a red light than end up in hospital or dead because a car driver cant wait 20 secs to let me through.

I've received 2 tickets for speeding where I had to accelerate to avoid being hit by a car, and one for driving on the flush median because a drunk driver nearly smashed me into the back of a truck and I used the flush median to get out of the way. The officer in question didnt care why, because from his perspective he didnt see it, and I didnt care I got a ticket because its better to get a ticket than be a cripple for the rest of my life.


So your filtering down a between two lanes of slow moving traffic, if your on the left of the white line your overtaking but if your on the right your illegally undertaking right?
yes.

[rastuscat]

So your filtering down a between two lanes of slow moving traffic, if your on the left of the white line your overtaking but if your on the right your illegally undertaking right?

Yes.

But it's still subject to the safe overtaking requirement.

[Reckless]

Yes.

But it's still subject to the safe overtaking requirement.

Thanks for that Mr Meterman :) :P :Police:

I try to explain to people its impossible not to break the passing law when we split as it stands atm.
So from the vid we can take it that Police have decided to ignore the impracticality of the illegal undertaking part (dumb law) and focus on safety.
Wether this be national or just in Manukau is another matter. Remember that guy at the bottom of the Ngauranga Gorge in Welly haha he could still get ya :P

Look guys we are prob better off the way it is in the hands of the officer on the day as if we get a new law they'll make it max speed 40k and we will still break it anyway. :rolleyes:

[iYRe]

if only cars obeyed the road code and "kept left" we'd be fine.

"isnt splitting dangerous?" they say... "only if you dont follow the road code and use defensive driving techniques" I say.

[rastuscat]

Thanks for that Mr Meterman :) :P :Police:

I try to explain to people its impossible not to break the passing law when we split as it stands atm.
So from the vid we can take it that Police have decided to ignore the impracticality of the illegal undertaking part (dumb law) and focus on safety.
Wether this be national or just in Manukau is another matter. Remember that guy at the bottom of the Ngauranga Gorge in Welly haha he could still get ya :P

Look guys we are prob better off the way it is in the hands of the officer on the day as if we get a new law they'll make it max speed 40k and we will still break it anyway. :rolleyes:

The Aussie states have created lane splitting laws. Maybe we will too.

It'll be interesting to see what boundaries they set around it.

[Moi]

From my daily drive on the Southern Motorway, hazard lights are the in thing, and splitting at speed on nicely flowing traffic...

Friday afternoon travelling north on southern before we all got to do the Takanini Tango Tangle, traffic flowing nicely at a sensible 90-95km/h. But not enough for two sportbikes which were "filtering" through every thing at 110km/h+... All lovely until something happens and one or both become human crayons...


if only cars obeyed the road code and "kept left" we'd be fine...

That would mean the drivers taking their hands off their mobile devices and holding them up in front of their face while they stretched out their thumbs to see which hand/thumb made the "L" shape to indicate "Left"...

[TheDemonLord]

I filter, I decide when I think it's safe and when I think it isn't.

I filter with my Hazards on - because the greater number of Flashing lights I'm legally allowed to have on my bike, the greater the chance that someone will notice it (and therefore notice me).

[iYRe]

I filter with my Hazards on - because the greater number of Flashing lights I'm legally allowed to have on my bike, the greater the chance that someone will notice it (and therefore notice me).

The amount of lights you have are irrelevant. As I have said before, if they cant see a bus, or a truck, or another car, they are sure as hell not going to see you. You could have a search light from the Air Force Orion strapped to your bike strobing like a mobile disco and they STILL wouldnt see you.

[Voltaire]

I filter, I decide when I think it's safe and when I think it isn't.

I filter with my Hazards on - because the greater number of Flashing lights I'm legally allowed to have on my bike, the greater the chance that someone will notice it (and therefore notice me).

While your at it use the horn when filtering, then motorists will know the circus is coming past.:laugh:

[Swoop]

That's why there's a catch-all ticket for "Overtaking In An Unsafe Manner". Weighing in at $150.
It could be (probably will be) argued that if the overtaking was done without crashing or injury, then it is patently safe... :blip:



I know 3 people who now no longer are able to ride, and several more who were injured because they a: stopped in a line of traffic at some lights and were rear ended - they weren't seen because they blended in with the vehicle in front or b: were sitting in the lane travelling at the same speed as the car and got side swiped because the driver only saw a gap.

35 years in auckland traffic and I refuse to do either of those things. If it happens to you, there is nowhere to go, no escape route.
My point was: I filter lots. Seriously, large amounts of filtering and pootle to the head of the queue all the time.
When I'm driving the car, I have to resist the temptation to "head for the gap" and filter...
Well, until I get my dream vehicle which is a monster truck snowplough with the > shaped front on it!:devil2:

[Moi]

... When I'm driving the car, I have to resist the temptation to "head for the gap" and filter...
Well, until I get my dream vehicle which is a monster truck snowplough with the > shaped front on it!:devil2:

Like this? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4qZTdMOJBk)

[Blackbird]

Friday afternoon travelling north on southern before we all got to do the Takanini Tango Tangle, traffic flowing nicely at a sensible 90-95km/h. But not enough for two sportbikes which were "filtering" through every thing at 110km/h+... All lovely until something happens and one or both become human crayons...


Hmmm.... I was there on Friday afternoon too! Was on the bike sitting in moving traffic at about 80 km/hr. A sportsbike which was orange and grey shot through two lines of traffic at over the limit. Ok, an accident waiting to happen, but what was the point when the traffic was flowing freely? Wonder how much time he saved and what his stress levels were like?

Harrumph - must be getting old :oi-grr:

Actually, I had to filter on the Southern Motorway heading south on early Saturday morning due to an accident near Hill Rd. Was pretty impressed that cars were clearly using their mirrors as many of them increased the gap for me - awesome! :2thumbsup

[Moi]

Hmmm.... I was there on Friday afternoon too! Was on the bike sitting in moving traffic at about 80 km/hr. A sportsbike which was orange and grey shot through two lines of traffic at over the limit. Ok, an accident waiting to happen, but what was the point when the traffic was flowing freely? Wonder how much time he saved and what his stress levels were like?

Harrumph - must be getting old :oi-grr:

Actually, I had to filter on the Southern Motorway heading south on early Saturday morning due to an accident near Hill Rd. Was pretty impressed that cars were clearly using their mirrors as many of them increased the gap for me - awesome! :2thumbsup

Neither of the bikes was painted in undercoat grey, so definitely wasn't you... :facepalm:

I think the two we saw were probably not capable of registering "stress"...

True about many drivers being more aware, found that in the last couple of years of commuting. :scooter:

We'd driven north from the Manawatu on Friday, via National Park, and enjoyed the sight of a group of Milwaukee Tractors muscling their way through traffic approaching the roundabout at the Waitomo Caves junction - but even those things can't muscle a B-train out of the way...

[rastuscat]

And then there are the two cocks whi split up Main North Road this afternoon.

Traffic travelling at 60, speed limit 60. These two cocks hurtled up the middle of the two lanes at maybe 80 ish. Like Darwin nominees.

Wonder not why cops come down harsh at times.

[eldog]

And then there are the two cocks whi split up Main North Road this afternoon.

Traffic travelling at 60, speed limit 60. These two cocks hurtled up the middle of the two lanes at maybe 80 ish. Like Darwin nominees.

Wonder not why cops come down harsh at times.

You have just described an event from January 2017 while the traffic was at a standstill around Paikakariki (Southward Car Museum)

2 loud sound powered bikes weaving at speed through multiple lanes of stationary traffic.

after quite a while in the heat, I finally came upon those likely lads, having an interview with the local :Police::Police:

meanwhile the rest of the traffic whom they had passed slowly cruised past.

this was around that same time of all the hoopla about more lanes opening......

[SaferRides]

If you're in slow moving traffic and start filtering, check very carefully that there isn't someone behind you already doing it at warp speed. That's definitely the scariest moment I've had filtering.

[Hawkeye]

What gets me is the number of tin tops that state they were 'surprised' when a bike goes past them in the gap.

FFS, bikes lane split every day on the motorway. Why the F$% is it a surprise.

When I'm in the cage, I KNOW there will be bikes lane splitting. I'm certainly not 'surprised' as they go past.

[KezzaCFC]

Sounds like sage advice.

A bit of advise from a north cantab
I've just started riding to work from Tram Road each day. Traffic on Marshlands Road is bad, can I use the shoulder to cruise passed?

[rastuscat]

A bit of advise from a north cantab
I've just started riding to work from Tram Road each day. Traffic on Marshlands Road is bad, can I use the shoulder to cruise passed?

Legally yes, but only if the traffic is stationary. If its moving at all you can't overtake on the left.

The shoulder is not considered a separate lane, so can't be used for overtaking on the left.

Never mind the fact that it's dangerous.

[KezzaCFC]

Legally yes, but only if the traffic is stationary. If its moving at all you can't overtake on the left.

The shoulder is not considered a separate lane, so can't be used for overtaking on the left.

Never mind the fact that it's dangerous.

Thanks, yeah was a bit suspect on the safety aspect of it.
Coming from Auckland, I've noticed a lot of motorcyclists down here like to use the cycle lanes.
And bus lanes okay down here right?

[rastuscat]

Thanks, yeah was a bit suspect on the safety aspect of it.
Coming from Auckland, I've noticed a lot of motorcyclists down here like to use the cycle lanes.
And bus lanes okay down here right?

Bus lanes are able to be used by buses, motorcycles, mopeds and cyclists. E.g, the one by Smiths Hire, just past the Old Waimak Bridge, on Main North Road, before it turns in Marshlands Road at Chaneys Corner.

You are also allowed to go when the B traffic light appears, as long as you are legally using the bus lane.

Just remember that 2 to 3 times each week in Chch a motorcyclist or cyclist gets cleaned up going up the left side of a line of cars, by a vehicle turning through a gap in that line of cars. Whether you are doing it legally or illegally makes no difference. Going up the left puts you in a place where people aren't expecting you to be, so they likely won't see you.

[rastuscat]

https://youtu.be/Q4r_TmkG980

Thanks to Auckland Transport.

[iYRe]

My point was: I filter lots. Seriously, large amounts of filtering and pootle to the head of the queue all the time.
When I'm driving the car, I have to resist the temptation to "head for the gap" and filter...
Well, until I get my dream vehicle which is a monster truck snowplough with the > shaped front on it!:devil2:


Somehow I missed that point. I blame it on old age.

I drive a honda Edix... I am quite tempted to use it like a snowplow.

[KezzaCFC]

Bus lanes are able to be used by buses, motorcycles, mopeds and cyclists. E.g, the one by Smiths Hire, just past the Old Waimak Bridge, on Main North Road, before it turns in Marshlands Road at Chaneys Corner.

You are also allowed to go when the B traffic light appears, as long as you are legally using the bus lane.

Just remember that 2 to 3 times each week in Chch a motorcyclist or cyclist gets cleaned up going up the left side of a line of cars, by a vehicle turning through a gap in that line of cars. Whether you are doing it legally or illegally makes no difference. Going up the left puts you in a place where people aren't expecting you to be, so they likely won't see you.

Thought as much, cheers for that.
Bit off topic but, in terms of road conditions, winters coming up. Do roads like Tram Road tend to ice up in the morning? Or they usually pretty good?

[rastuscat]

Thought as much, cheers for that.
Bit off topic but, in terms of road conditions, winters coming up. Do roads like Tram Road tend to ice up in the morning? Or they usually pretty good?

I don't use Tram Road. I use Lineside Road. There's a bit just before the motorway that is the low point of that road, and that's where the winter is coldest. I can leave home and it's zero, and it'll drop 2 degrees before I get to the motorway, then go back to zero.

Bridges are generally the worst for ice, as they are cold underneath as well as on top.

Given that we are going out on tangents, I fancy Sandra Bullock.

[Akzle]

Given that we are going out on tangents, I fancy Sandra Bullock.

really?


i mean. i'd give her one... but as an actress she's pretty shit.

[slofox]

Seems to me that pretty much all the advice offered in this thread, is something we should do every time we ride a motorcycle. Basic safety practices.

[slofox]

...I fancy Sandra Bullock.

Do ya just...yeah, I quite like her...hur...er I mean... her too! :o

[Grumph]

Thought as much, cheers for that.
Bit off topic but, in terms of road conditions, winters coming up. Do roads like Tram Road tend to ice up in the morning? Or they usually pretty good?

The long straight roads going east-west in canty are very prone to icing up on the North side. Which is your side going in to town...
Any area with trees shading the road will ice up readily. Look for the long lasting damp patches on your route about now - they'll be ice in winter.
And be aware if you're out on the plains, water cooled bikes can get damaged if you've not used good antifreeze...Even in a closed garage....

[rastuscat]

really?


i mean. i'd give her one... but as an actress she's pretty shit.

Yes, marks out of 10, I'd give her 1.

[awayatc]

Bullocks......!!!!

[KezzaCFC]

The long straight roads going east-west in canty are very prone to icing up on the North side. Which is your side going in to town...
Any area with trees shading the road will ice up readily. Look for the long lasting damp patches on your route about now - they'll be ice in winter.
And be aware if you're out on the plains, water cooled bikes can get damaged if you've not used good antifreeze...Even in a closed garage....

Thanks for that! Hoping as Tram Road is pretty busy relative to other rural roads that that cars will do a good job of de-icing.

[KezzaCFC]

Why we lane split

https://gfycat.com/gifs/detail/obedientheftyindianjackal

[Red Dawg]

Anyone seen the Counties Manukau Police advice on lane splitting

https://www.facebook.com/Counties.Manukau.Police/videos/1872714826094268/

Discuss :whistle:

Mac

Thanks for this, at no time did he say it was illegal. Perfect!!:woohoo: