Stop the lie in motorcycling?

[nzspokes]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ihzBIPa00I&fbclid=IwAR3pk0RrOiqNWaykiSufIbz5hVYpMaeBRofgIs-OER81LgKKxcx_5Uq0NOw

[AllanB]

I'm something of a lightweight when it comes to drinking - crack back a quick pint at the end of the day and the buzz starts, no way I'd be comfortable driving/riding if I had two. People are different in how their bodies react to the stuff.

I never drink and ride.

As a side note - I do like a strong black coffee - and I have noticed after one of these the ride home generally is somewhat more, shall we say, spirited.

I can legally have as much coffee as I like and ride.

Did he say 100 American motorcyclists die a week?

[husaberg]

I'm something of a lightweight when it comes to drinking - crack back a quick pint at the end of the day and the buzz starts, no way I'd be comfortable driving/riding if I had two. People are different in how their bodies react to the stuff.

I never drink and ride.

As a side note - I do like a strong black coffee - and I have noticed after one of these the ride home generally is somewhat more, shall we say, spirited.

I can legally have as much coffee as I like and ride.

Did he say 100 American motorcyclists die a week?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/24/california-dui-caffeine-lawsuit-solano-county


The officer then observed the same driver erratically weaving in and out of traffic almost causing several collisions. The officer initiated a traffic stop on the vehicle. During the traffic stop, the driver, Joseph Schwab, was contacted and the officer observed the defendant to be highly agitated, “amped up,” and his pupils were dilated. The officer noticed a number of work out supplements in the vehicle. The officer administered several standardized field sobriety tests, which are used routinely to determine impairment. Based upon the defendant’s performance of the field sobriety tests, the officer believed the defendant was too impaired to operate a motor vehicle and he was arrested for misdemeanor violations of Vehicle Code Section 23152(e) and Vehicle Code Section 23103. The officer offered the defendant to submit to a drug recognition evaluation, but he declined.

Pretty sure the charge was dropped, when only caffeine was found

[sidecar bob]

I'd like to raise two points regarding that clip if he wants to bang on about lying.
The first one is that while 47 percent of riders that die in bike crashes have alcohol in their system, he doesn't say what the cause of the crash was or who's fault, simply that in addition to whatever the cause was of their untimely demise, they also had alcohol on board in an unspecified quantity. Possibly quite a percentage were on Dunlop tyres or riding "cruiser styled motorcycles" how many were in a group ride too? which in my expierence is far more dangerous than a couple of beers on board.
You can be sure that only a small percentage of that 47 percent was directly undoubtedly attributed to alcohol.
Secondly, if alcohol is the only barrow he's pushing, which group would you want to be in? The alcohol 47 percent of fatal crashes one or the non alcohol 53 percent one?
The way he's selling it with his overly simplistic black & white thinking is that it's 3% safer to ride pissed.
He's also suggesting, no, actually preaching, that knocking alcohol on the head will prevent 47 percent of all motorcycle fatal crashes.
Should we test that theory? Then what could he blame 47 percent of motorcycle fatalities on? Bear in mind his figure of 47 percent is based on anyone with a alcohol level of .01 or more, so that includes anyone that's had a tablespoon of cough mixture in the previous hour.
Perhaps if he's got a problem with people selling a lie he should start by looking in the mirror.
I'm no way in favour of people riding pissed, but if you want to create an argument against it at least make it a robust argument, not one that only a simpleton would swallow.
Looking at the comments his followers look as gullible as Destiny church members.

[nzspokes]

I think I can say easily I have met more alcoholics in motorcycling than I have In any other area.

[FJRider]

I'd like to raise two points regarding that clip if he wants to bang on about lying.
The first one is that while 47 percent of riders that die in bike crashes have alcohol in their system, he doesn't say what the cause of the crash was or who's fault, simply that in addition to whatever the cause was of their untimely demise, they also had alcohol on board in an unspecified quantity.

Seldom is there a motor vehicle crash that is caused by one factor alone. Booze in itself will not guarantee an "accident" will happen ... but add a bit of speed into the equation ... plus a few other riders/vehicles in close proximity ... as the number factors involved are increasing, as will the likely-hood of a crash increase.

Speed and booze are the two factors involved in a large number of crashes, so it's hammered in the media's. Removing those two factors off the road wont stop crashes either. Stupid decision making due to impatience and arrogance causes more than a few crashes ... it's probably the (actual) factors that are more common and just as dangerous as speed and booze. It's difficult to Police/prevent stupidity. Just taking booze (and speed) out of the equation ... will not stop the carnage on the roads.

[Grumph]

I think I can say easily I have met more alcoholics in motorcycling than I have In any other area.

You haven't lived long enough or got out enough...

Speedway - across all disciplines, leads for me. Followed closely by yachting. Cruising not racing.

[pritch]

I think I can say easily I have met more alcoholics in motorcycling than I have In any other area.

I have only known a few alcoholics and none owned a bike, they wouldn't have the spare cash after paying for their main hobby. It costs a lot to be a drunk. Most bikers I know have one beer with their lunch and that's it. OK, it might be even better not to have that one but as long as they make allowances?

[Katman]

Stop the lie in motorcycling?

You should concentrate on exposing those faulty sidestand springs.

[slofox]

It costs a lot to be a drunk.

Not if you make your own moonshine...:whistle:

[rastuscat]

Just out of interest, I've always been skeptical about the bike runs starting or ending at pubs.

Even a pint or two slows the mind down. Legal or not doesn't come into it.

[Madness]

I think I can say easily I have met more alcoholics in motorcycling than I have In any other area.

Stop hanging out with fuckwits.

[nodrog]

Imagine all the awesome statistics if they legalise the dumbsmoke.

[rastuscat]

Imagine all the awesome statistics if they legalise the dumbsmoke.


The government supports free use of cannabis.

The government cares about road safety.



You can have one or the other, not both.

[Mike.Gayner]

Ooooh fuck here comes the fun police to make sure we're not enjoying ourselves too much.

Have you guys looked at the lifetime probability of dying in a road accident? I did the maths myself recently.

If you drive at an average speed of 80km/h, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, every day of the year, on average you'd need to drive for over 250 years straight before dying in a motor accident.

Motorcycles are dramatically more dangerous - under the same conditions you'd have to ride for 12 straight years before dying on average. 12 straight years of riding 24/7 without even stopping to take a piss.

Road deaths aren't as common as people think, or as common as the police want you to believe (they have to justify their pathetic existence somehow). So stop fucking leturing people on how dangerous it is out there.

[FJRider]

Imagine all the awesome statistics if they legalise the dumbsmoke.

It wont beat the numbers of those in jail, those dead ... and the number of ruined families ... all due to a legal product that is sold in most supermarkets.

A few hundred more dead on the road wont really be noticed (or cared about). Well you might if you're related to one of those dead ... or in jail.

[Madness]

It wont beat the numbers of those in jail, those dead ... and the number of ruined families ... all due to a legal product that is sold in most supermarkets.

Nutmeg. Not even once.

[nodrog]

Ooooh fuck here comes the fun police to make sure we're not enjoying ourselves too much.

Have you guys looked at the lifetime probability of dying in a road accident? I did the maths myself recently.

If you drive at an average speed of 80km/h, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, every day of the year, on average you'd need to drive for over 250 years straight before dying in a motor accident.

Motorcycles are dramatically more dangerous - under the same conditions you'd have to ride for 12 straight years before dying on average. 12 straight years of riding 24/7 without even stopping to take a piss.

Road deaths aren't as common as people think, or as common as the police want you to believe (they have to justify their pathetic existence somehow). So stop fucking leturing people on how dangerous it is out there.

How did all those people die in that falcon near taupo a couple of months ago? It's not even a 20 year old car? Time travel?

[nodrog]

It wont beat the numbers of those in jail, those dead ... and the number of ruined families ... all due to a legal product that is sold in most supermarkets.

A few hundred more dead on the road wont really be noticed (or cared about). Well you might if you're related to one of those dead ... or in jail.

I wouldn't bet on that.

[Berries]

The government supports free use of cannabis.

The government cares about road safety.



You can have one or the other, not both.
They aren't planning on making it compulsory as far as I know.

[Katman]

The government supports free use of cannabis.

The government cares about road safety.



You can have one or the other, not both.

What a load of shit.

It would still be an offence to drive/ride under the influence of cannabis.

[nodrog]

What a load of shit.

It would still be an offence to drive/ride under the influence of cannabis.

Do they test for cannabis impairment?

[Katman]

Do they test for cannabis impairment?

There are swab tests available to test for recent exposure.

[nodrog]

There are swab tests available to test for recent exposure.

How recent?

[Katman]

How recent?

Look it up.

[FJRider]

... Road deaths aren't as common as people think, or as common as the police want you to believe (they have to justify their pathetic existence somehow). So stop fucking leturing people on how dangerous it is out there.

It's not just the deaths that count, the thousands of fucked up people that take years to learn to walk / talk /do things like feed themselves that few ever hear of. People (their family's) that might think it would have been better for them had they actually did get killed.

Probably a just about the same chance of winning some money in Lotto ... as getting injured / killed in a motor vehicle accident.

Perhaps you change your user name to Lucky. A lot of those killed and injured were not at fault ... just at/in the wrong place when "Shit Happened" ...


But I wish you the best of luck anyway. None of the unlucky options ... I would wish on anybody. Not even you.

[nzspokes]

Imagine all the awesome statistics if they legalise the dumbsmoke.Mate has just come back from Canada, we work in the same field. With dumbsmoke they are getting an increase in workplace accidents. Dramatically so. Looks like workplace testing will become common.

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[Katman]

dumbsmoke


dumbsmoke

How cute. :love:

[rastuscat]

How recent?

I'm loving KB, straight to the point.

Saliva testing looks at the active ingredients of cannabis. These are normally detectable for 4 - 6 hours post consumption.

The latent ingredients of cannabis are detectable by a blood test or body sample for up to a month.

The idea that someone will be prosecuted for drug driving for a joint they smoked 2 weeks ago is propaganda from the people who are opposed to saliva testing.

Or the ignorant.

[rastuscat]

Do they test for cannabis impairment?

The existing Compulsory Impairment Test will still detect impairment. It's been available since around 2012.

It just doesn't get used as much as it should be.

The saliva test doesn't test for impairment. Just for the presence of the active ingredients of cannabis.

[Katman]

The idea that someone will be prosecuted for drug driving for a joint they smoked 2 weeks ago is propaganda from the people who are opposed to saliva testing.

Or the ignorant.

Double post.

[Katman]

The idea that someone will be prosecuted for drug driving for a joint they smoked 2 weeks ago is propaganda from the people who are opposed to saliva testing.

Or the ignorant.

Much like your assertion that the government are supporting a reduction in road safety.

[rastuscat]

Much like your assertion that the government are supporting a reduction in road safety.

When did I assert that?

[Katman]

When did I assert that?

Post number 14.

[rastuscat]

Post number 14.

My bad, ambiguous. It's my conclusion that you cant have both, not theirs.

[Katman]

My bad, ambiguous. It's my conclusion that you cant have both, not theirs.

I understand that it's your conclusion.

That's why I said it was your assertion.

[pritch]

My understanding, apocryphal as it may be, is that cannabis users are easily detectable in traffic. They will be perfectly placed in their lane, doing 30kph and indicating 300metres prior to turning.

[nzspokes]

The existing Compulsory Impairment Test will still detect impairment. It's been available since around 2012.

It just doesn't get used as much as it should be.

The saliva test doesn't test for impairment. Just for the presence of the active ingredients of cannabis.Do they use the "street " drug tests or just test for dumbsmoke?

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

[nzspokes]

I have been informed that 28% of killed or seriously injured were riding impaired in NZ.

Thats still a high number.

[Katman]

I have been informed that 28% of killed or seriously injured were riding impaired in NZ.

Thats still a high number.

How did they manage to figure out the degree of impairment in those who were killed?

Or are you still struggling to figure out the difference between finding the presence of a substance in someone's system and actual impairment?

[nzspokes]

How did they manage to figure out the degree of impairment in those who were killed?

Or are you still struggling to figure out the difference between finding the presence of a substance in someone's system and actual impairment?

Look it up.

[Katman]

Look it up.

Look what up?

You said you had 'been informed'.

How were you informed?

[husaberg]

Look what up?

You said you had 'been informed'.

How were you informed?

By years, of watching you peddle crap on KB, claiming "that there is plenty of facts to back you up", on what ever rubbish you were pushing at the time.
Then, when challenged to prove it, you go telling people, "they need to go find it themselves".....

[F5 Dave]

Inthe past I have used the internet whilst impared.

But not now. Now I'm just better. Better than you.

Drunker than you.


And better.

[Temporary-Kiwi]

Just out of interest, I've always been skeptical about the bike runs starting or ending at pubs.

Even a pint or two slows the mind down. Legal or not doesn't come into it.

my best mate nearly died after 2 cans of beer he had after work, it was just enough to affect his concentration
he rode straight into a parked car at approx 100kph, he didn't even attempt to brake or avoid it, spent 5-6mnths in hospital recuperating.
he was an awesome rider, with amazing skills, but that incident really brought it home to me about the effects of alcohol and driving.
he gave up biking afterwards, which I still can't figure out as he was the only other rider I've been able to race side by side and know exactly what he would do.
it brought back memories of the alcohol awareness program that I saw at high school, " the roadshow".

[sidecar bob]

I have been informed that 28% of killed or seriously injured were riding impaired in NZ.

Thats still a high number.

Once again, it's clearly the safe group.
It sounds like 72 percent of people can't handle a bike unless they've had a beer or two.
Whatever would we do if 100 percent of crashes couldn't be attributed to alcohol? That would give stupidity a big job to handle.

[sidecar bob]

my best mate nearly died after 2 cans of beer he had after work, it was just enough to affect his concentration
he rode straight into a parked car at approx 100kph, he didn't even attempt to brake or avoid it, spent 5-6mnths in hospital recuperating.
he was an awesome rider, with amazing skills, but that incident really brought it home to me about the effects of alcohol and driving.
he gave up biking afterwards, which I still can't figure out as he was the only other rider I've been able to race side by side and know exactly what he would do.
it brought back memories of the alcohol awareness program that I saw at high school, " the roadshow".

I knew a guy like that, we called him Toucan.
If you dont posess the ability to look straight ahead at 100kmh then you've got bigger problems that a couple of cans of piss on board.
Seems a convenient thing to blame though, beats simply calling him stupid.

[jasonu]

Just out of interest, I've always been skeptical about the bike runs starting or ending at pubs.

Even a pint or two slows the mind down. Legal or not doesn't come into it.

Here that is called buzzed driving and you can get done for it even if you are below the limit. Driving under the influence.

[jasonu]

By years, of watching you peddle crap on KB, claiming "that there is plenty of facts to back you up", on what ever rubbish you were pushing at the time.
Then, when challenged to prove it, you go telling people, "they need to go find it themselves".....

Where as you will reply with 3 pages of cut and pastes and blame Donald trump and National.

[husaberg]

Where as you will reply with 3 pages of cut and pastes and blame Donald trump and National.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FnO3igOkOk

Ps i have never blamed Trump for anything, the guys a buffoon, Who is only president due to the number of stupid people in the USA. I blame them.

[rastuscat]

We used to have a few laughs at the after work drinks, putting ourselves on the breath testing machines.

It was eye opening how much you had to drink to get even close to the legal limit.

Most, if not all of us, wouldn't even think of driving with enough on board to get close to the legal limit.

Then on the next late shift we get a guy telling us that he failed the breath test after having two beers. Yeah right. Bollocks.

[sidecar bob]

We used to have a few laughs at the after work drinks, putting ourselves on the breath testing machines.

It was eye opening how much you had to drink to get even close to the legal limit.

Most, if not all of us, wouldn't even think of driving with enough on board to get close to the legal limit.

Then on the next late shift we get a guy telling us that he failed the breath test after having two beers. Yeah right. Bollocks.

I frequently drank at the local police station with the off duty Strategic Traffic Unit guys (police name for traffic cops) around 15-20 years ago.
Blowing into the machine until "fail youth" took a decent effort & leaving there was the most pissed i rode ever, in the knowledge that I was safely under the limit.
Thats why i have no sympathy for people that get done for drink driving. They know full well that theyre proper pissed up.

[SaferRides]

We used to have a few laughs at the after work drinks, putting ourselves on the breath testing machines.

It was eye opening how much you had to drink to get even close to the legal limit.

Most, if not all of us, wouldn't even think of driving with enough on board to get close to the legal limit.

Then on the next late shift we get a guy telling us that he failed the breath test after having two beers. Yeah right. Bollocks.I recall Campbell Live doing this a few years ago as part of the campaign to reduce the alcohol limit. One of the reporters needed something like 10 standard drinks to get over the old limit, and he was pretty drunk by then.

Even a few drinks does affect you. I had a near miss last year driving up the road to get dinner after 3 beers. I felt fine driving but my reaction time was slow when someone pulled out in front of me.

I'll have one light beer and ride but that's it.

[Voltaire]

They could make the limit 0, would make decisions easier and roads safer, Heineken 0 is palatable.

[rastuscat]

I recall Campbell Live doing this s few years ago as part of the campaign to reduce the alcohol limit. One of the reporters needed something like 10 standard drinks to get over the old limit, and he was pretty drunk by then.

Even a few drinks does affect you. I had a near miss last year driving up the road to get dinner after 3 beers. I felt fine driving but my reaction time was slow when someone pulled out in front of me.

I'll have one light beer and ride but that's it.

That was a secret they didn't want to get out. That you could have quite a lot and still drive legal. It would have been dangerous to make it public.

[SaferRides]

That was a secret they didn't want to get out. That you could have quite a lot and still drive legal. It would have been dangerous to make it public.Campbell Live didn't get that memo.

Must be at least 30 years ago, but my wife and I were out one night and both had waaay too much to be driving. I drove home and we were stopped at a checkpoint, so I thought I'd be well over the limit. Passed the roadside test.

I never did that again though. I really don't understand why there is so little breath testing done now. It must be 5 years since I've been stopped, but it used to be every few months.

[Temporary-Kiwi]

I knew a guy like that, we called him Toucan.
If you dont posess the ability to look straight ahead at 100kmh then you've got bigger problems that a couple of cans of piss on board.
Seems a convenient thing to blame though, beats simply calling him stupid.
that was the point , he was looking straight ahead, he had just past my other mate and then within 100mtrs on a slight bend, on the road that led to his home his brain switched off what he was doing, stove in the bluebird boot, which luckily released the bootlid, his pelvis got smashed on the triple trees, handle bars looked like a bowtie, broke most bones in his front side, and this rider could slide both wheels around a corner with ease.
the mate he passed watched him do it, he couldn't imagine any cause, we all checked the bike , it didn't have any fault we could attribute it to, plus he didn't brake at all, no swerving just a complete brain fade, which was not like him at all, his occupation was computer systems analysis
the only thing we could attribute it to was the couple of beers after he finished work

[rastuscat]

I really don't understand why there is so little breath testing done now. It must be 5 years since I've been stopped, but it used to be every few months.


Basically, breath testing is proactive work. It's intended to prevent people from taking the risk of drink driving, by increasing the perception of the risk of getting caught.

Thing is, as with all proactive work, it's the first thing that stops when the reactive workload booms. Notably, when the policy of attending all burglaries within 48 hours came in, that consumed a lot of resources. And that's just one example.

When they wound down the booze bus units around the country, it was to release the staff to other higher priority things.

Inevitably it was going to have pay back, and we are seeing it now. Less breath testing means more drink driving, and that's exactly what we are seeing now.

[jellywrestler]

Basically, breath testing is proactive work. It's intended to prevent people from taking the risk of drink driving, by increasing the perception of the risk of getting caught.

Thing is, as with all proactive work, it's the first thing that stops when the reactive workload booms. Notably, when the policy of attending all burglaries within 48 hours came in, that consumed a lot of resources. And that's just one example.

When they wound down the booze bus units around the country, it was to release the staff to other higher priority things.

Inevitably it was going to have pay back, and we are seeing it now. Less breath testing means more drink driving, and that's exactly what we are seeing now.

as i don't drink drive but am at risk of getting my house burgled i'm fine with that...
however i guess at the same time i've now more chance of getting hit by a drink driver...

[jellywrestler]

They could make the limit 0, would make decisions easier and roads safer, Heineken 0 is palatable.

and the speed limit 0 too, that would solve some problems...

[nzspokes]

By years, of watching you peddle crap on KB, claiming "that there is plenty of facts to back you up", on what ever rubbish you were pushing at the time.
Then, when challenged to prove it, you go telling people, "they need to go find it themselves".....

Yes i did see the irony in that.

[Cracker]

in reply to the fella that made this video.
Your eyes look a bit fucked up mate, like your on 10 prescrition drugs (usa spec) and maybe you read the bible once a week to reset your moral compass. The land of the brave and free or whatever has never been able to handle there booze so you do have a problem there.

I have always riden bikes with a few slow pints during the day. I don't know anyone who doesn't do the same and surprise, surprise, we don't crash bikes. Infact, its a key part of the social interaction of a diverse group of people not to mention the benefits of rehydration and the down side of "must piss now"

[nzspokes]

in reply to the fella that made this video.
Your eyes look a bit fucked up mate, like your on 10 prescrition drugs (usa spec) and maybe you read the bible once a week to reset your moral compass. The land of the brave and free or whatever has never been able to handle there booze so you do have a problem there.

I have always riden bikes with a few slow pints during the day. I don't know anyone who doesn't do the same and surprise, surprise, we don't crash bikes. Infact, its a key part of the social interaction of a diverse group of people not to mention the benefits of rehydration and the down side of "must piss now"He was hit in the eye by a baseball when he was young.

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[sidecar bob]

then within 100mtrs on a slight bend, on the road that led to his home his brain switched off what he was doing

And you can honestly say that no dumbsmoke was consumed along with the couple o jars? Cos that shit'll do that to you.:msn-wink:

[rastuscat]

I have always riden bikes with a few slow pints during the day. I don't know anyone who doesn't do the same and surprise, surprise, we don't crash bikes. Infact, its a key part of the social interaction of a diverse group of people not to mention the benefits of rehydration and the down side of "must piss now"

It's safe because you've always done it, is that right?