Are you committing corner crime?

[Korea]

<i>One of these things is not like the other, one of these things is just not the same... now it's time to play our game</i>

Last weekend's practice session.
Some of these corners are okay, and some are oh-so-wrong.
Can you spot the difference, and why?

(If you can be bothered that is!) :)

[gamgee]

the only difference i can see is where they are looking, some are looking where they should be going, others are looking where they are going

[Mental Trousers]

First 3 you're not looking where you want to go. Last 3 you are

[Korea]

Gamgee and MTrousers are on the money, but there's more to it than that. Look closer...

[gamgee]

and your getting your upper body in the right place in b,c and e i dunno, can't you give us a hint, do we get a free set of fairing for getting it right haha
somehow i doubt it ;)

[gamgee]

not c, but d

[Lou Girardin]

The bike's barely leaning?

[WRT]

The bike's barely leaning?

LOL - that was my thought. Its getting your knee down just for the sake of getting your knee down really.

[InDeSkyz]

Is there any butt left on pic C at all?

[Mental Trousers]

You're not using Yamuda fairings?

Only thing I can see is you're using 2 different styles. One style you get more weight on the inside of the bikes centreline, but the other style you have more control over the bars because your inside shoulder is still roughly inline with your inside hand.

[Dafe]

In A&C, the weight remains on top of the bike, The other pics tend to show the weight getting alot lower centre of gravity, thus more stability.
Did the dude fall asleep on his tank in A&C photos?

[SlowHand]

My, what strong legs you have, holding up a bike on an angle like that standing still!
actually, Im jealous - maybe Yamuda fairings would help me get me knee down?

Is it to do with having your body on the wrong side of the bike? In C, the legs are over in Pusan, but the head & body's in Seoul?

[flash]

in the first and last pic the guy isnt leaning right with the bike and looks as if hes trying to pull it striaght or didnt judge the corner right?

[TwoSeven]

The rider in the last two pics is not indicating to signal intent and since it looks like you are not on private property, I suspect the road code still applies :)

[Korea]

Good points about getting lower for lower center of gravity/more grip and less lean angle.

Keep 'em coming, I'll explain in more detail soon...

Here's one more with a little extra lean from a different angle.

[R6_kid]

as said, a lot of the pics are knee down when you dont need to be (i lean more on my ZXR and never put my knee on the ground)

The only other things i can think of are that in the second to last pic of the first group, the wheel is turning in (not countersteering)... oh yeh and everything you do is done on a paved carpark(?) area... bikes belong on tracks or roads!!!

[Mental Trousers]

The only other things i can think of are that in the second to last pic of the first group, the wheel is turning in (not countersteering)...

Well spotted, although I think his speed is too low to be able to counter steer through the entire manoeuvre.

And I was wrong, he is using Yamuda fairings!!

One question, what exactly are you doing with your inside foot?? It looks like you've got the bottom of your foot flat against the engine cover in a few of them.

[Silage]

Is the bike moving in any of those pics?
(I stared at them a long time and not one moved!!)

[Reefer]

The last picture looks like he has a handfull of front brake. Any closer? BTW checked and looks like his leathers are around the right way!!! :niceone:

[TwoSeven]

Is the bike moving in any of those pics?
(I stared at them a long time and not one moved!!)

No, that would requrie animated gifs. :)

[Random]

oh yeh and everything you do is done on a paved carpark(?) area... bikes belong on tracks or roads!!!


Yeah I was thinking that too gareth !


Ricky.

[Korea]

Okay, here's my take on the cornering techniques shown:
I'll just focus on pictures C and D to save space.

Rider C (okay, so it's me) is so desperately trying to get his knee down, and yes, the angle isn't all that steep but with the cheap 110x80x17 tyres there isn't a lot of grip either.

However, look at the way his upper-body is crossed up. He's gripping the handlebars tight and actually holding himself over the bike's centre line. He isn't going 'with' the bike, but fighting it. He wants the bike to follow the green line, but his body is following a different line, it's crossing the bike's line.

Meanwhile, Rider D has fallen comfotably to the inside of the bike's centre line. He has relaxed into the cornering position and is looking through the turn. His line is following that of the bike with a slightly smaller radius from being left-of-centre. His centre of gravity is lower and he's not fighting the bike, which is letting the suspension and tyres make the most of what little traction there is.

Rider C's style does remind us of some great riders: Norick Abe, and sometimes Doohan (but of course they do it better!) and it does have a small advantage in that he may be able to see further around blind corners. More recently, I believe, we're seeing a change to rider D's style (see pix below).

In the end, you're right. Getting your knee down doesn't mean you're fast. These corners were done at around 50k in a carpark. What you do on the road is up to you but I hope this may have been interesting to see.

[Mental Trousers]

There's nothing wrong with C's style if that's the most comfortable for him (that's basically how I ride and anything else feels wrong to me). It has the advantage of having more control as his shoulder is close to being inline with his inside hand, so he has more leverage on the inside bar and steering accuracy is better. Gripping the bars tightly is definitely wrong and you need a relaxed grip, however, that style and gripping the bars too tightly don't necessarily go together.

The D rider is using a more common style. The main advantage of it is that he's got almost all of his wieght on the inside of bikes centreline. However, that has the disadvantage of generating more sideways force on the tyre unless he wieghts the outside peg.

There really isn't 1 totally correct style. The fastest riders on the planet all ride differently because that's what is fastest for them.

[SlowHand]

I've been thinking :sweatdrop what if I stood up - I mean stand up a fair bit, weight the outside peg while leaning into the corner? Would I get more weight inside, or would I be too much wind resistance/unstability from being too far from the bike?

I'd go out now and try it but I still havent got the bike yet and don't think I'll really notice the diff without going flatout round a track.

[TwoSeven]

What I want to know is how each rider is going to steer the bike with those positions. It'd be safer if they got off and walked. Cant really see rider C, but the other chap looks like his forearm positions are incapable of pushing on the bars effectively. Cant really make it out from the photos, dont know whats intended either, so not bothered with the result.

[flash]

woo hoo i got it right!! (i just writ the wrong answer.....sorta)

[Korea]

I've been thinking :sweatdrop what if I stood up - I mean stand up a fair bit, weight the outside peg while leaning into the corner? Would I get more weight inside, or would I be too much wind resistance/unstability from being too far from the bike?

Do you mean like SuperMoto-style? Some of those riders can get stupendous angles of lean while keeping their body upright.
On a sports bike, I imagine your centre of gravity would get quite messy as your body acts like a lever; meaning any small movements you make while you're up there will translate to big movements down below at your pivot point.
But then again, all I know is that I know nothing. :whistle:

[The Pastor]

I know its an old thread, but does anyone know a good carpark in auckland to practice this sorta stuff at?

EDIT: this really should be a sticky btw. i've had to search for it a number of times.

[CptSolo]

The painted lines on carparks are too slippery, you need to find a large roundabout for this shit but thats only good for right turns of course.

[quallman1234]

What bikes that?

[The Pastor]

best thread on kb :)