Norton closed down.

[Laava]

Seems that all the poor business practices have paid out very badly and the various companies that made up Norton have all gone to the wall. A lot of people who paid deposits will get nothing back it would seem...
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-51303905

[240]

That’s sad 😞

[ellipsis]

That’s sad 😞

...only in a spermatic, necrofilac way though... it's hard to keep cumming over a brit brand that died many tears ago...VIVA, those who keep the originals going...(Indian...cough, cough, cough)...sorry...

[Bonez]

...only in a spermatic, necrofilac way though... it's hard to keep cumming over a brit brand that died many tears ago...VIVA, those who keep the originals going...(Indian...cough, cough, cough)...sorry...They claim they are akin to the original marque when in reality it's name only. Markiting twaddle and nothing else. If they had followed John Bloors Triumph example they my have been in better shape. I do feel sorry for those who got suckered in to making a deposit.

[Oakie]

Well that's a relief. I thought you meant 'Norton', my anti-virus software.

[sidecar bob]

Any company with management that's stupid enough not to pay their tax first has got it coming.
Your local one man band Tradie is smarter than Norton was.

[HenryDorsetCase]

there were a few unsold (not surprising given the prices!) sitting in dealers here.... First European had some and I saw a couple in one of the Orklind shops (AMPS maybe?). Now they're orphans will they be cheap????

Good looking thing but if you're spending 40 large there there way better options (IMHO of course)

[Navy Boy]

Seems that all the poor business practices have paid out very badly and the various companies that made up Norton have all gone to the wall. A lot of people who paid deposits will get nothing back it would seem...
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-51303905

I've just been reading a piece in the Guardian covering this. There are a number of factors in play here with Brexit-related uncertainty playing its part as well as some decidedly questionable business practices. Of course the losers will be those who paid good money for their bikes.

I owned a 961 Sport 6-7 years ago which I then sold when we decided to move to NZ. Seems like that was the right thing to do... <_<

[pritch]

That item was a bit odd treating Norton as if they'd been around since 1898 when in reality the current concern only has the name in common with what went before. Not unlike Triumph.

That was a really sweet 650SS in the photo though.

[Laava]

Any company with management that's stupid enough not to pay their tax first has got it coming.
Your local one man band Tradie is smarter than Norton was.
Thank you.

[Laava]

https://youtu.be/0ryb8qoIdWM

[F5 Dave]

Well that does it. I'm not going to buy a Triumph until they pay those investors back.

[Laava]

Crazy times huh?
Experience Motorcycle in auckland have at least 4 they are trying to sell, they haven't modified their blurb yet to take into account that there is no factory warranty. Feel sorry for them as they probably stand no chance of recovering their cost. They are reports in the UK about people having warranty work done at the factory but when they went to collect their bikes they had been scavenged for parts! One guy got back his chassis and motor, not even sure if he got his wheels! They are saying this is theft though as opposed to fraud so will be treated differently...

[F5 Dave]

Well as long as that money I gave that nice man on the internet for my new BSA Rocket is safe I don't really care.

[Laava]

I will race you on my new Hesketh Radial 34litre.
When they finally deliver...

[F5 Dave]

Don't be despondent , sometimes these things take a while. Heck my Dad has an order in for a car that's been quite some time. He got sick of these rusty jap boxes, so apparently this one comes with a Stainless Steel body. Never rust he says. Thinking about it I was a teenager when he placed the order. . .

[Laava]

I bet this cunt nicked it!
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcS91VaXzQqDfuORW-d6GkDags8ak1hQnxFxLU9Xq_lPDRHMJqPJ

[Laava]

Here is a link to the poor sod picking up the remains of his £40,000 bike from the Norton factory. No bodywork, wheels or front suspension.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1412688948914334&id=165863823596859

[Bonez]

FacePlant sux.

[pritch]

Amazing story. Forget about the unpaid tax and the Bexit bullshit, Superbike magazine asks was it fraud from the start.


https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/norton-was-it-a-fraud-from-the-start

[Laava]

Pretty likely! No doubt Stuart Garner will be off hanging out with Ghislaine Maxwell soon!

[F5 Dave]

Hopefully Davey Jones. Some people are pricks huh?

[Navy Boy]

I bought my 961 Sport after winning a Norton Factory tour during an auction which helped raise funds for Kevin Ash's family back in late 2013.

In case you're wondering Kevin Ash was a UK bike journalist who was killed during the launch of the liquid cooled BMW 1200GS in South Africa in early 2013. I used to enjoy reading his work and so it seemed like a good idea to help raise some money for his family - Especially as it was held at Silverstone and was hosted by the lovely Suzi Perry :niceone:

I was impressed with the Norton facility - This was prior to their move to the Donington Hall factory and was based right at the entrance to the Donington Race circuit where the Ron Haslam race school bases itself from. It was small but was heaven for a bike nut such as myself.

Sadly the bike itself, whilst looking gorgeous and sounding rather nice, always had an erratic idling issue. This would strike when the bike was fully up to temperature and would happen, in accordance with the law of Sod, at just the wrong moments. Like entering a roundabout... Fortunately there was nothing on the roundabout at the time...

They had two attempts to fix this but neither worked. The second time I was told 'Well it is a big twin you know - They are going to be a bit lumpy...'. Funny how my Harley XR1200 before it never had that problem and they weren't exactly known as being super high tech were they??? Patronising as well as being based on dodgy financial dealings - Not a good combination me thinks.

Despite my experiences I really wanted Norton to make it and thrive. It's a real shame for those who've paid for bikes as well as the workers there who will, as always with such things, be the ones who are hit the hardest.

[sidecar bob]

The guy whos collection i maintain has a 961 in the UK.
He only rides it when he feels like a nice long walk in the sunshine.

[Bonez]

I hear they are so unique they have different piston sizes for each bore.

[TheDemonLord]

Amazing story. Forget about the unpaid tax and the Bexit bullshit, Superbike magazine asks was it fraud from the start.


https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/norton-was-it-a-fraud-from-the-start

That was a rather interesting read, not sure of the veracity of any of it, but interesting none-the-less

[James Deuce]

That was a rather interesting read, not sure of the veracity of any of it, but interesting none-the-less
John Hogan has been around a while now and worked for many publications. He's not going write something like that without being able to back it.

[TheDemonLord]

John Hogan has been around a while now and worked for many publications. He's not going write something like that without being able to back it.

Hairy Muff, I didn't mean it in a dismissive sense, more so that I don't follow Motorcycle Journalism - so have no baseline to reference.

[F5 Dave]

The guy whos collection i maintain has a 961 in the UK.
He only rides it when he feels like a nice long walk in the sunshine.
So does he ship it to France for that?

[James Deuce]

Hairy Muff, I didn't mean it in a dismissive sense, more so that I don't follow Motorcycle Journalism - so have no baseline to reference.
It's all good. No attitude here. Just communicating info.

[sidecar bob]

So does he ship it to France for that?

I was in UK for summer last year.
They had it on a Thursday in Lincolnshire.

[Laava]

I was in UK for summer last year.
They had it on a Thursday in Lincolnshire.
Oh, what fun!

[Laava]

In other news, there was a 961 at the drags on sat that I was racing at. My god it was obnoxiously loud and sounded nice but it was slow compared to all the non harley stuff there. There was a guy on a GB400/650 who I reckon was probably quicker.
Surprised me, I thought they had th performance levels up to modern stds for a big bore twin naked bike

[Banditbandit]

Seems that all the poor business practices have paid out very badly and the various companies that made up Norton have all gone to the wall. A lot of people who paid deposits will get nothing back it would seem...
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-51303905

Yeah - well - it's not like they haven't done that before .

[Katman]

....it was obnoxiously loud and sounded nice....

How does that work?

[Bonez]

In other news, there was a 961 at the drags.
I had a feeling you cross dressed.

[Laava]

https://www.rideapart.com/articles/402821/norton-motorcycles-steve-murray-possible-buyer/amp/
usual bullshit...reminds me of all the stories after Buell closed down for the last time.

[Navy Boy]

In other news, there was a 961 at the drags on sat that I was racing at. My god it was obnoxiously loud and sounded nice but it was slow compared to all the non harley stuff there. There was a guy on a GB400/650 who I reckon was probably quicker.
Surprised me, I thought they had th performance levels up to modern stds for a big bore twin naked bike

The 961 was very much a modern day Bonneville with a bit more grunt - I'm talking the air cooled Hinckley models here. They were quite vibey and only made around 80Bhp but they did handle rather nicely and sounded (Depending on which Norton exhaust you went for) rather lovely too. Sadly the gearbox was always a little hit and miss and I can testify that they weren't really comparable, performance-wise at least, to more modern nakeds of a similar capacity.

it was all about the look and sound darling! :cool:

[pritch]

I haven't read it yet but here's part 2:

https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/norton-was-it-a-fraud-from-the-start-part-two

[sidecar bob]

I haven't read it yet but here's part 2:

https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/norton-was-it-a-fraud-from-the-start-part-two

Wow, Garner is a narcissistic sociopath.
No conscience & no shame, full of charisma, wonderful stories & promises.
He is at the centre of his own universe.
I've been forced to do a bit of study on these characters myself recently.
https://www.verywellmind.com/understanding-the-narcissistic-sociopath-4587611
I'm sure it's all a huge misunderstanding, probably the receptionists fault.

[F5 Dave]

It is s tragic story really. That poor guy still doesn't seem to have a handle on the fact that at least some of the money has gone elsewhere.

The Narcissist link is also scary. Worst years of my life dealing with one of those fuckers, for no gain to anyone. Too stupid to realise how ineffective they were.

[Laava]

This is all a bit tragic really. I hope they are able to asset strip Stuart Garner completely. What an arsehole!
https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/norton-creditors-report-how-much-money-is-owed

[sidecar bob]

This is all a bit tragic really. I hope they are able to asset strip Stuart Garner completely. What an arsehole!
https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/norton-creditors-report-how-much-money-is-owed

Like any of those arseholes, most of the money will have already been squandered on a lavish lifestyle & the rest will be untraceable.
Jail & plenty of it is the only satisfaction most will see happen, but only if the nasty prick has missed a vital piece of paper to cover his arse, which these pieces of shit are particularly proficient at organising, if nothing else.

[Gearup]

Like any of those arseholes, most of the money will have already been squandered on a lavish lifestyle & the rest will be untraceable.
Jail & plenty of it is the only satisfaction most will see happen, but only if the nasty prick has missed a vital piece of paper to cover his arse, which these pieces of shit are particularly proficient at organising, if nothing else.


Yep, they have a habit of squandering others money very well.

NZ's biggest Ponzi schemer, David Ross got paroled last month, after only doing 6 of the 10 years handed down. Disgusting for someone who stole $115 million from people who trusted him.

[Laava]

Well this is interesting, might be a resurgence from an unexpected direction!
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/norton-motorcycles/

[sidecar bob]

Well this is interesting, might be a resurgence from an unexpected direction!
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/norton-motorcycles/

That's probably the most expected outcome of all. They were already involved in engine production.
It wouldn't have saved Norton from going broke, not if 7/8 of the money from the Chinese went in Garners personal account, which is the most likely scenario.
These arseholes are full of nasty surprises, I doubt this is the last one.

[pritch]

Well this is interesting, might be a resurgence from an unexpected direction!
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/norton-motorcycles/

The only thing that bothers me about that is the date of the item.

[Laava]

The article says it was published today?

[pritch]

The article says it was published today?

In Britain that was the first.

I've seen very little seasonal silliness this year though.

[Laava]

Hard to say what is going on here but Stuart Garner has resigned as director and the same day Susanah Garner is appointed director. No matter what, you can be sure this is as dodgy as fuck. So far the only customers who have gotten their money back seem to be from credit card deposits.

GARNER, Susannah (https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/officers/g-WDb0nu0f-K8WQKOXz4MqvUepE/appointments)
Correspondence address
Donington Hall, Castle Donington, Derby, Derbyshire, England, DE74 2SG
Role Active
Director
Date of birth
August 1986
Appointed on
11 March 2020
Nationality
British
Country of residence
England
Occupation
Administrator

GARNER, Stuart James (https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/officers/wdVNHS-Ap2tjioFBerPzTFm3Hj4/appointments)
Correspondence address
Donington Hall, Castle Donington, Derby, United Kingdom, DE74 2SG
Role Resigned
Director
Date of birth
November 1968
Appointed on
31 March 2015
Resigned on
11 March 2020
Nationality
English
Country of residence
England
Occupation
Chief Executive

[pritch]

This is one man's take on the latest developments including those in Laava's post.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0uUTgjYaUU

[Laava]

Yep, pretty sad state...

[Stylo]

Don't be despondent , sometimes these things take a while. Heck my Dad has an order in for a car that's been quite some time. He got sick of these rusty jap boxes, so apparently this one comes with a Stainless Steel body. Never rust he says. Thinking about it I was a teenager when he placed the order. . .

I remember my dad poring over the brochures for the new Mazda 808 must have been 1976 ?

Our EJ Holden was getting tired so he decided to buy a Hillman Hunter . Buying British was always the right choice.

[F5 Dave]

Yeah I was kinda going for a Delorean gag:whistle:

[pritch]

Superbike Magazine have reported that they have received paperwork from the Companies Office indicating that TVS has started the process of buying Norton.

[pritch]

TVS have bought Norton for sixteen million quid. I hope they did their due diligence and know what they are getting. Otherwise though I wish them well.

[Laava]

https://www.superbike.co.uk/article/tvs-prepares-to-buy-norton
Hope it works out. Apparently all the staff get to keep their jobs. That is, if they haven't already got a new job and/or they haven't been left with a bad taste in their mouths!...

[Berries]

Also...

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leicestershire-52331528

[Gearup]

TVS have bought Norton for sixteen million quid. I hope they did their due diligence and know what they are getting. Otherwise though I wish them well.


Didn't know much about TVS except their entrance into the Dakar rally in 2015. I've just had a read up on them, they certainly appear to have the ability to turn things around for Norton.

[sidecar bob]

Didn't know much about TVS except their entrance into the Dakar rally in 2015. I've just had a read up on them, they certainly appear to have the ability to turn things around for Norton.

Anyone not stuffing their own pockets with investor & client funds stands a better chance than the last bloke.

[pritch]

It'd be interesting to know what TVS have actually bought - and if it's the same as what they think they've bought.

Post 53 in this thread comments that Norton's big bike engine has already been sold to a Chinese manufacturer. If the Chennai company are knowingly buying just the 650 that's all good, although questions remain about the brand "Norton MC" that Garner recently registered in his wife's name.

[Laava]

It is apparently Norton Motor Cars? And yes, it is well known that S Garner did a deal with one of the large chinese motorcycle manufacturers. Not known how much money changed hands and where that went but that will be for BDO to deal with.

[pritch]

It is apparently Norton Motor Cars?

Used to be. It was reported to have changed to just Norton MC when he put it in his wife's name, and that could be problematical for Norton in future. Unless, of course, the new owners trust Garner to behave, but why would anybody do that?

[sidecar bob]

I doubt the name is trademarked, what with Norton Antivirus & Norton Abrasives.

[pritch]

I doubt the name is trademarked, what with Norton Antivirus & Norton Abrasives.


If the guy in post no 53 is right Garner has registered the name. Well, he changed it from Norton Motor Cars to Norton MC which means he (or his wife) owns that name.

[sidecar bob]

If the guy in post no 53 is right Garner has registered the name. Well, he changed it from Norton Motor Cars to Norton MC which means he (or his wife) owns that name.

I'm sure he will sell it. He doesn't actually want the name, he wants the money he can get for it.
It leaves all sorts of other combinations of the Norton name available though.

[F5 Dave]

How about notroN?

[jim.cox]

How about notroN?

NotRun?

Yeah I had one of them...

[F5 Dave]

Well, I was just going for backwards, hence the capital. But yours is better.

[BMWST?]

Strange things can happen in these transactions when BMW sold rolls royce but then VW found that they hadnt bought what they thought

[sidecar bob]

Strange things can happen in these transactions when BMW sold rolls royce but then VW found that they hadnt bought what they thought

Yes, I remember the exact day that happened, I was running a BMW independent garage at the time.
VW got all the worn out dies & the factory, and BMW got the name & logo.
Im sure VW got a laugh back when BMW got screwed over with Rover though.

[Beekeeper]

Seems that all the poor business practices have paid out very badly and the various companies that made up Norton have all gone to the wall. A lot of people who paid deposits will get nothing back it would seem...
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-51303905


You cant kill a zombie, Norton has been reanimated and fucked like a dead whore like about a million times so just give it 5 minutes.

[pritch]

You cant kill a zombie, Norton has been reanimated and fucked like a dead whore like about a million times so just give it 5 minutes.

Yeah I just don't get the talk of "one of the last remaining". It was dead and buried for decades, it was reincarnated rather than resuscitated. The word 'remaining' just doesn't apply.

Similar to Triumph but a more extreme example because of the missing decades.

[sidecar bob]

Well heres a start at least.
https://www.visordown.com/news/industry/ex-norton-boss-stuart-garner-ordered-pay-back-£14m

[Bonez]

Well heres a start at least.
https://www.visordown.com/news/industry/ex-norton-boss-stuart-garner-ordered-pay-back-£14mExcellent......