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R650R
27th October 2020, 12:02
Weren't you the guy that earlier claimed it was only an alleged virus in NZ?



So is the virus alleged? or the cases of the virus alleged? or the number of cases?
I am genuinely interested.

The position of the adjective and the noun should give you your answer...
But if you were away that day at school I’ll fill the blanks in for you...

I dispute the accuracy of the test being used... anyone with a technical mind who reads up about how the “testing” works will realise it’s shortcomings.
Hence the number of “cases” can be questioned.

The maths alone shows two things, either that the virus doesn’t spread easy or it’s not that lethal...

It’s not even important anymore if the virus is real or not, it’s just a distraction from the massive changes to our rights and freedoms happening in the background which will do far more damage than the virus.

Oh if you’ve found an electron microscope picture of the virus I’d love to see it. Cause you see NO ONE has managed to isolate a culture of the virus itself yet, which is kinda odd given the resources thrown at it. Instead the media keeps flashing fancy photoshop composite artwork on TheVine news.
https://youtu.be/T5dWbxwoCZI
Please hand your homework in by 9am

R650R
27th October 2020, 12:05
In Britain some idiots are suggesting a break from the virus restrictions. A "ceasefire" such as the one that occurred in the trenches during WW1. How they propose to get the virus to cease firing was not explained.

Then there's this:

Well the virus knows not to go to PaknSave or takeaway food outlets so it might be happy to accomodate new requests. The virus only attacks cruise ships, rest homes, independent small businesses and tourist operations.

husaberg
27th October 2020, 16:56
The position of the adjective and the noun should give you your answer...
But if you were away that day at school I’ll fill the blanks in for you...

I dispute the accuracy of the test being used... anyone with a technical mind who reads up about how the “testing” works will realise it’s shortcomings.
Hence the number of “cases” can be questioned.

The maths alone shows two things, either that the virus doesn’t spread easy or it’s not that lethal...

It’s not even important anymore if the virus is real or not, it’s just a distraction from the massive changes to our rights and freedoms happening in the background which will do far more damage than the virus.

Oh if you’ve found an electron microscope picture of the virus I’d love to see it. Cause you see NO ONE has managed to isolate a culture of the virus itself yet, which is kinda odd given the resources thrown at it. Instead the media keeps flashing fancy photoshop composite artwork on TheVine news
Please hand your homework in by 9am

Oh how funny........
How about you answer the questions they were pretty simple. Instead of just attempting to weasel out of it.
So is the virus alleged? or the cases of the virus alleged? or the number of cases?
do you actually have any credible supporting evidence to support your theories?

If you knew anything much about any PCR or antigen antibody or any other biological test. you would know no test will ever be 100% so using that as an excuse to avoid the question is pretty sad.
The fact it has killed so many people over the whole world. (this is a fact not a theory) shows it spreads rapidly and is deadly enough and if it mutates further and reaches the same level of deadliness as Sars it could kill 10% of people infected with it.
this is what happened with sars. Only it wasn't as contagious as Covid 19
The rest of your post is more conspiracy theory.
I will give you a hint, you don't know more than the health authorities do. You really don't.

F5 Dave
27th October 2020, 17:44
Yeah I'm unsubscribing. Just more bat shit crazy pub rants. Dont waste your breath. Hes like a Trump supporter. Made up his mind and his warped social media bubble just points to more Alt Facts (bullshit).

FJRider
27th October 2020, 19:05
Well the virus knows not to go to PaknSave or takeaway food outlets so it might be happy to accomodate new requests. The virus only attacks cruise ships, rest homes, independent small businesses and tourist operations.

And you earlier mentioned your concerns about door knocking canvassers ... unless you can mention a case where one of them was actually accused/suspected of spreading the (alleged ??) virus ... you might as well add them to your above list.



The National Road toll is caused by the premise ... that "It won't happen to them".

And the longer they continue without an issue ... the more they believe it to be true.


And the longer people go on with their lives ... without knowing (personally or otherwise) anybody with the virus ... the less chance they believe they have of getting it.


That being true or false (in either of the above two groups) is actually irrelevant ... But that's the way many like to bet.

With their (and their families) lives.

husaberg
27th October 2020, 19:06
Yeah I'm unsubscribing. Just more bat shit crazy pub rants. Dont waste your breath. Hes like a Trump supporter. Made up his mind and his warped social media bubble just points to more Alt Facts (bullshit).

In fairness I think he's a trump supporter as well............

pritch
29th October 2020, 09:24
For some time Trump rallies have been referred to as super spreader events. The figures are out now and the rallies leave behind a county with a big increase in COVID cases compared to the rest of the state.

This one though was special in a number of ways. Still it's hard to be sympathetic, it's just Darwinism at work. You'd have to be special kind of stupid to go to one of these things.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/10/28/trump-omaha-supporters-stuck-cold/

pritch
29th October 2020, 09:59
The British government in recent years has a history of paying millions to companies for work it subsequenty transpires the company can't do. An outstanding example was the awarding of a contract for shipping to a company that had no ships and no port, but it did have a terms of service contract lifted from a pizza shop. When the stupidity of the situation finally dawned on the politicians the contract was cancelled. The company then sued and won a milions for breach of contract.

The story is here for anyone interested. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/09/government-cancels-brexit-ferry-contract-with-no-ship-firm


And so to their latest effort involving pandemic contact tracing.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/28/england-coronavirus-covid-test-and-trace-teenagers

husaberg
29th October 2020, 18:47
The British government in recent years has a history of paying millions to companies for work it subsequenty transpires the company can't do. An outstanding example was the awarding of a contract for shipping to a company that had no ships and no port, but it did have a terms of service contract lifted from a pizza shop. When the stupidity of the situation finally dawned on the politicians the contract was cancelled. The company then sued and won a milions for breach of contract.

The story is here for anyone interested. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/09/government-cancels-brexit-ferry-contract-with-no-ship-firm


And so to their latest effort involving pandemic contact tracing.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/28/england-coronavirus-covid-test-and-trace-teenagers

A local district council awarded a contract for tourist a town it turned out the company was a cake decorating firm that was alledegedly owned by an assosciate of one of the council employees.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/90384093/westland-district-council-awards-cake-decorators-firm-7-million-contract-to-build-sewage-plant
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/335172/cake-decorator-s-company-loses-west-coast-water-treatment-contract
https://www.sfo.govt.nz/vivek-goel

pritch
30th October 2020, 08:06
A local district council awarded a contract for tourist a town it turned out the company was a cake decorating firm that was alledegedly owned by an assosciate of one of the council employees.


With so many newspapers struggling this is a major concern. If there is no reporter sitting in on the local Council meetings, dirty deeds for mates will become the norm.

husaberg
30th October 2020, 16:42
With so many newspapers struggling this is a major concern. If there is no reporter sitting in on the local Council meetings, dirty deeds for mates will become the norm.
Sometimes it seems the corruption is worse in small people, maybe because we notice.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/635659/Lawyers-struck-off-for-professional-misconduct.
That said NZ is consistently one of the least corrupt countries in the world.

R650R
31st October 2020, 18:42
With so many newspapers struggling this is a major concern. If there is no reporter sitting in on the local Council meetings, dirty deeds for mates will become the norm.

But the govt NEVER lies to or defrauds its people, otherwise a conspiracy would exist ;p

husaberg
31st October 2020, 19:17
But the govt NEVER lies to or defrauds its people, otherwise a conspiracy would exist ;p

if you read both examples the fraud was committed by individuals.

R650R
4th November 2020, 12:28
if you read both examples the fraud was committed by individuals.

Content redacted

scumdog
8th November 2020, 19:52
But the govt NEVER lies to or defrauds its people, otherwise a conspiracy would exist ;p


Meh, that's just the way Governments roll...

pritch
11th November 2020, 21:00
The Pfizer news that they have a COVID 19 vaccine that is effective on 90% of patients is good news. The US stock market thought so too.

Mike Pence tweeted as follows:
The @WhiteHouseCoronavirus Task Force met today to discuss BIG news out of @pfizer this morning.
Under President @realDonaldTrump, we are working at Warp Speed to deliver a Safe & Effective vaccine. This President is DELIVERING for the American People. https://pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-announce-vaccine-candidate-against

Which is lovely and all except that, as Pfizer were quick to point out, they were not part of Operation Warp Speed, and they had accepted no government money. Therefore no credit was due Trump or Pence. Pfizer had been operating independently of the government effort, all credit is theirs.

R650R
14th November 2020, 13:47
Broadcast on mainstream fact checked news so must be true ...
https://youtu.be/uEZk2_3T3j8

Kickaha
14th November 2020, 14:37
Which is lovely and all except that, as Pfizer were quick to point out, they were not part of Operation Warp Speed, and they had accepted no government money. Therefore no credit was due Trump or Pence. Pfizer had been operating independently of the government effort, all credit is theirs.

Yeah they sort of are part of it and took 1.95 billion for advanced purchases but funded their own R & D

https://spectator.us/pfizer-warp-speed-coronavirus-vaccine/

Viking01
18th November 2020, 14:27
https://summit.news/2020/11/16/forced-vaccination-law-in-denmark-abandoned-after-public-protests/

pritch
18th November 2020, 14:59
Yeah they sort of are part of it and took 1.95 billion for advanced purchases but funded their own R & D

https://spectator.us/pfizer-warp-speed-coronavirus-vaccine/

That's a somewhat one eyed report. My understanding was that Pfizer US accepted no development money because a European branch of the company had come up with the vaccine originally. Pfizer say the money they will receive is for distribution.

Viking01
21st November 2020, 10:25
https://www.globalresearch.ca/leading-covid-vaccine-candidates-plagued-safety-concerns/5729982

RDJ
21st November 2020, 14:40
So: we're supposed to love a vaccine that inserts itself into cellular genetic material and which has been tested in very few people compared to potentially eligible billions, and that small group followed up only for 2 months after injection...

- what about longer-term auto-immune enhancement, (illness brought on by the imported virus material's interaction with other cells)?

- it has to be supercooled ~ 100 degrees below zero, from the time it is produced until a few days before it is injected, (mRNA quickly degrades at higher temperatures) yet our government can't even supply PPE at any temperature and measles vaccine at all?

"What could possibly go wrong..."

R650R
24th November 2020, 08:58
cut n paste

A reader recalls another pandemic, Tuberculosis, which puts COVID in perspective.
In 2018, there were more than 10 million cases of active TB which resulted in 1.5 million deaths.[7] This makes it the number one cause of death from an infectious disease.[13] The number of new cases each year has decreased since 2000.[1] About 80% of people in many Asian and African countries test positive while 5-10% of people in the United States population test positive by the tuberculin test.[14] Tuberculosis has been present in humans since ancient times.[15] Wikipedia



Famous people who died prematurely from TB include Henry David Thoreau, D.H. Lawrence, Keats, Chopin, Vivien Leigh...



By Don

I was born in the United States in 1955. I cannot watch television or read a newspaper without seeing articles about COVID-19. It is currently in the spotlight and dominates the news. However, there have been other pandemics that claimed many more lives in the US until fairly recent times. One of them that affected my family was tuberculosis.

When I was about two-years-old I remember waving goodbye to my father as he was being driven away. I didn't know why or where to until I was older. He had tested positive for tuberculosis at his doctor in Seattle and was going back to the sanitarium in Walla Walla, WA.

Back in 1939 he had enlisted in the Coast Guard and served in WW2 guarding the waterfront in Portland, Oregon. It was there he met my mother. His role in protecting shipping from sabotage and other criminal activity was a good background for a career in law enforcement. He got married and had a daughter and eventually three sons.

He was very good at his job and quickly advanced. However, during his time in the Coast Guard, his first assignment was aboard a lightship marking the entrance to the Columbia River. Living aboard a ship in close quarters for months can put people at risk for transmittable diseases.

Years later when he developed tuberculosis it was determined he was exposed to it aboard the ship as others on the ship came down with the disease. My mother and three-year-old sister were told he was going to die. He was taken to the sanitarium in Walla Walla to live out his remaining days. Luckily he was extremely strong and they were developing new cures and drugs. I wouldn't be here otherwise.

Tuberculosis never completely goes away. Periodically he had to report to the doctor in Seattle to spit into a bottle. The bacteria lay dormant in the lungs and if he tested positive he had to go back to the sanitarium to be isolated from family and others. That happened when I was very young.

TB does more than kill an infected person. Although he survived, he was never healthy enough to return to law enforcement. Prior to his sickness he was a detective and had a goal to be a US Marshall. Instead, he found work painting boats and houses. On the freeway going towards Seattle, there is a house that my mother would point to. They had it built just before my father got sick, and had to give it up.

My father rarely touched me or my siblings. He was afraid of transmitting TB to us.

TB was no respecter of person or position. Back then a lot of people believed it was inherited and I was told my grandfather blamed my grandmother for the "Irish" disease. I recently started researching my family roots and my grandmother's family lost very many people to TB. They were young people, business owners, Catholic Priests all taken by this deadly disease.

tb-scene.jpg
My father eventually died in 1985 from another illness. A couple of years later my mother met another man who was from Idaho and was widowed. They spent their remaining years together. As a young man, he was diagnosed with TB and went to a sanitarium. His story was very similar to my father's.

Today you rarely hear about TB. A few years ago you heard it was making a comeback in the US mainly from illegal immigrants. Worldwide it is still a major killer. Far more people die from it than COVID. It has not been eradicated.

It has wiped out many indigenous peoples worldwide. In the US and Canada, it has killed many native people. It has destroyed entire villages. But despite the facts, COVID stays in the spotlight.

I sure many people reading this have similar stories and their families have been affected as mine was. I would encourage them to tell how TB affected their families and loved ones.

RDJ
25th November 2020, 14:14
A new study (@ Frontiers in Public Health) has concluded that "neither lockdowns nor lockdown stringency were correlated with lower death rates."

Researchers analyzed data from 160 countries over the first 8 months of the pandemic, testing several factors—including demographics, public health, economy, politics, and environment—to determine how they are correlated with COVID-19 mortality.

“Stringency of the measures settled to fight pandemia, including lockdown, did not appear to be linked with death rate,” the researchers said.

The researchers found that the criteria most associated with a high death rate was life expectancy.

No sheeeeit, Sherlock. Who'd have thunk it / sarc. I.e. same as the year-on-year flu, definitely one of the nastier years' flu-types, but entirely not unprecedented.

husaberg
25th November 2020, 17:34
A new study (@ Frontiers in Public Health) has concluded that "neither lockdowns nor lockdown stringency were correlated with lower death rates."

Researchers analyzed data from 160 countries over the first 8 months of the pandemic, testing several factors—including demographics, public health, economy, politics, and environment—to determine how they are correlated with COVID-19 mortality.

“Stringency of the measures settled to fight pandemia, including lockdown, did not appear to be linked with death rate,” the researchers said.

The researchers found that the criteria most associated with a high death rate was life expectancy.

No sheeeeit, Sherlock. Who'd have thunk it / sarc. I.e. same as the year-on-year flu, definitely one of the nastier years' flu-types, but entirely not unprecedented.

Yeah for a guy that refers to themselves as being a medical professional this is some pretty petty and easy to dismiss shit.
Trying to corollate the death rate with strategies to minimise amounts of cases or the total deaths.
Rather than the deaths per case or the number of cases or total deaths is rather funny.

Most smart people would realise the idea of lockdowns was to slow to stop the transmission of the disease not really to make it less deadly per case, although a lot died in places where the health system was clearly overrun.


That's almost like trump trying to say they had more cases as they just tested more.
Maybe you would be best stick to just pasting National party press releases like the old days

RDJ
25th November 2020, 17:57
Yeah for a guy that refers to themselves as being a medical professional this is some pretty petty and easy to dismiss shit.
Trying to corollate the death rate with strategies to minimise amounts of cases or the total deaths.
Rather than the deaths per case or the number of cases or total deaths is rather funny.

Most smart people would realise the idea of lockdowns was to slow to stop the transmission of the disease not really to make it less deadly per case, although a lot died in places where the health system was clearly overrun.


That's almost like trump trying to say they had more cases as they just tested more.
Maybe you would be best t stick to just pasting National party press releases like the old days

Sure. You do you. Whatever.

husaberg
25th November 2020, 18:12
Sure. You do you. Whatever.

It seems the new adage is true, RDJ can't argue the facts when they are clearly no facts in RDJ's favour.;)

pritch
25th November 2020, 18:24
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/politics/covid-19-coronavirus-new-zealands-response-rated-best-in-the-world/YQGXONNKDZ6G7OK5CAHK7YZEPE/?utm_campaign=nzh_tw&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter&utm_campaign=nzh_tw#Echobox=1606267170

A factor of particular importance appears to be social cohesion. The countries doing well all have it. The US is the most extreme example of a country that doesn't. Too many people who know their rights, or who know it's a hoax, who know it's a Bill Gates plot, and who are going to travel to their family Thanksgiving dinner in spite of a pandemic.

Hospitals in some parts of the US can no longer take patients. The hospitals they usually pass patients to can't take them, they too are full. And it's about to get a whole lot worse.

NZ is doing well but the virus could be back tomorrow. Guess we should make the most of what we have while we have it.

RDJ
25th November 2020, 18:34
It seems the new adage is true, RDJ can't argue the facts when they are clearly no facts in RDJ's favour.;)

Sure. You do you. History will enlighten our descendants as to who had a more accurate perspective. Enjoy your faux-reality.

husaberg
25th November 2020, 20:05
Sure. You do you. History will enlighten our descendants as to who had a more accurate perspective. Enjoy your faux-reality.



Seven states—Arkansas, Iowa, Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota, Utah, and Wyoming—did not issue orders directing residents to stay at home from nonessential activities in March and April 2020 in response to the coronavirus pandemic. The 43 other states all issued orders at the state level directing residents to stay at home except for essential activities and closing businesses that each state deemed nonessential.[1] Read more about those stay-at-home orders here.

Only one of the seven states that did not issue a stay-at-home order did not require any businesses to close: South Dakota. All seven states also closed schools to in-person instruction.
States that did not issue a stay-at-home order in response to the coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic

347800

States total deaths % based on case of known infection is 0.98%
NZ total deaths % based on case of known infection is 1.23%
Only issue with using this particular statistic is it misses the point.
as the lock down was never to increase a survival rate based on deaths per case it was to allow a greater number of people not to actually die.
US states with no total lockdown had 608 deaths per million people from Covid19
Whilst NZ had 5.16 deaths per million head of population from Covid 19.
Now 600 less deaths per million of the population is the real effect of lockdowns
Using a death rate per infection is just plain idiotic. like I said you lose on facts. Its best you stick to parroting National party press releases.

especially given also.

Due to the lock down we had a 99.8 percent reduction in flu cases.
there were usually 1600 more deaths in winter, compared to other seasons, and around a third of those were caused by influenza, mostly in older people with long-term health conditions.
"What the Covid-19 response has done has largely eliminated those excess winter deaths and mortality as a whole is down around 5 percent," he said. "So that means an extra 1500 people will survive this year who wouldn't have."
But hey..........

RDJ
25th November 2020, 20:23
It seems the new adage is true, RDJ can't argue the facts when they are clearly no facts in RDJ's favour.;)

I'm mildly curious, why you're such an idiot. But, I am not particularly invested in finding out why you are such an idiot. You should just be you. Because the facts of the future will prove you completely idiotic, but you will interpret them as confirming your Weltanschau. Which should help your mental health, and the rest of us will see that you should do you, to help you. OK then.

husaberg
25th November 2020, 21:29
I'm mildly curious, why you're such an idiot. But, I am not particularly invested in finding out why you are such an idiot. You should just be you. Because the facts of the future will prove you completely idiotic, but you will interpret them as confirming your Weltanschau. Which should help your mental health, and the rest of us will see that you should do you, to help you. OK then.

Maybe instead of multiple different replies to the same post with ad hominem attacks you should stick to the facts.
347801347802
347800

As it's irrefutable, the facts show 600 more people per million die without lockdowns. It's all above in black and white. no fudging, it's not an opinion, not an attempt to misrepresent the facts, no made-up crap. Just simple data.

In a country the size of NZ that's 2880 extra dead people, but hey, keep up the attacks. You might convince yourself you know better. you will not convince me with your parroting of National party propaganda (https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/188175-The-journey-that-COVID-19-will-take-us-on?p=1131173241#post1131173241) and your ad hominem attacks that you know much of anything.


Maybe in your "medical professional" prospective is 608 extra deaths per million is not in fact 120 times worse than 5.6 per deaths million. But here in reality it clearly is by simple maths 120 times worse.

pritch
26th November 2020, 14:35
As Americans prepare to gather for Thanksgiving, the world watches with dread and disbelief

That's a headline in The Washington Post today. They are not wrong.

pritch
27th November 2020, 10:47
Catholic and Jewish communities in New York appealed to the Supreme Court against the Governor's ruling banning large gatherings. Trump's new court found in their favour 5-4. The stupid twats are now free to spread the virus at Mass and at the synagogue. It was the "pro life" justices voted for spreading the virus.

pritch
30th November 2020, 10:56
Obviously there's going to be a problem with members of a marching band blowing their instruments while wearing masks.

The caption to this pic was, "We're doomed."

george formby
30th November 2020, 11:29
It's all about perspective, here's a line from an article I read recently:

Globally, the World Health Organization (WHO) estimates that the flu kills 290,000 to 650,000 people per year.

The covid-19 pandemic has so far taken about 110,000 and while I wouldn't want to compare it with the flu, many elements are similar.

The global figures reported at present make it rather plain that China is dodgy :cool:

Yup, flu figures have been touted a lot but I have not seen a statement of how many people contract the flu every year.

It would be very difficult to find an accurate figure as the majority of sufferers just go to bed for a few days, no Dr's visits.

Absolutely no bias in my post, the quote just got me thinking.

husaberg
30th November 2020, 12:13
Yup, flu figures have been touted a lot but I have not seen a statement of how many people contract the flu every year.

It would be very difficult to find an accurate figure as the majority of sufferers just go to bed for a few days, no Dr's visits.

Absolutely no bias in my post, the quote just got me thinking.

Sorry it generates a lot of data i gave the effect on the lockdowns on seasonal flu in NZ here.


Due to the lock down we had a 99.8 percent reduction in flu cases.
there were usually 1600 more deaths in winter, compared to other seasons, and around a third of those were caused by influenza, mostly in older people with long-term health conditions.
"What the Covid-19 response has done has largely eliminated those excess winter deaths and mortality as a whole is down around 5 percent," he said.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018767843/near-extinction-of-influenza-in-nz-as-numbers-drop-due-to-lockdown

https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2020/3/18/21184992/coronavirus-covid-19-flu-comparison-chart
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-54463511



CDC estimates that the burden of illness during the 2019–2020 season was moderate with an estimated 38 million people sick with flu, 18 million visits to a health care provider for flu, 400,000 hospitalizations for flu, and 22,000 flu deaths
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html

on average seasonal flu kills 30,000 to 60,000 Americans every year.

but in the US Covid 19 is 50 times more deadly than Flu
During the 2018-19 flu season, about 35 million people in the US contracted the flu and about 34,000 died, according to the CDC. In that season, about one out of every 1,000 people who got the flu died.
Breaking down the numbers by age range reveals a more complex story. Among children, there was about one death per every 10,000 cases. For adults between 50 and 64 years old, about six out of every 10,000 people who got the flu died. For those 65 and older, the rate rose to about 83 out of 10,000 people. Over 30% of US coronavirus patients over 85 have died
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/coronavirus-death-rate-us-compared-to-flu-by-age-2020-6?r=US&IR=T
We also have a vaccine for flu

https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/iOMarZz9BXgwquIn0fCryQSJW8Y=/0x0:1941x1941/920x0/filters:focal(0x0:1941x1941):format(webp):no_upsca le()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/19816388/flu_covid_comparison_1_high_res.jpg

george formby
30th November 2020, 12:58
:laugh:

No need for me to go looking later. Cheers.

RDJ
30th November 2020, 19:32
Meanwhile, more people died of suicide in one month in Japan, than the entire WuFlu death toll. "The National Police Agency said suicides surged to 2,153 in October alone... more than 17,000 people taking their own lives this year to date." By comparison, fewer than 2,000 people in the country have died from COVID-19 in 2020.

***

Every choice has costs, but when the authorities withhold the figures that measure the damage from their preferred choice v other choices so we cannot participate in informed consent... well, here we are now.

***

It is absolutely no secret at all that the usual annual death toll from the seasonal flu in NZ is ~ 500. We do not crash the economy and imprison people to prevent that. Because until 2020, we knew the cure would be worse than the disease.

pete376403
1st December 2020, 06:35
It is absolutely no secret at all that the usual annual death toll from the seasonal flu in NZ is ~ 500. We do not crash the economy and imprison people to prevent that. Because until 2020, we knew the cure would be worse than the disease.

Where do you get that figure? Using "annual death toll influenza new zealand" in Google gets me "In the winter months of 2009, a total of 49 New Zealand patients1 died with pandemic influenza A(H1N1) 2009 virus infection. While the Ministry of Health identified 35 deaths from pandemic influenza A(H1N1) during the first wave, the processes arranged by the PIMMRG were able to collect information on an additional 14 deaths due to pandemic influenza A(H1N1)." https://www.hqsc.govt.nz/assets/PMMRC/Publications/PMMRC-Pandemic-influenza-report.pdf

Pretty sure that if this number jumped from 49 to over 500 as a usual annual figure there would be some more noise made about it.

mashman
1st December 2020, 07:29
Where do you get that figure? Using "annual death toll influenza new zealand" in Google gets me "In the winter months of 2009, a total of 49 New Zealand patients1 died with pandemic influenza A(H1N1) 2009 virus infection. While the Ministry of Health identified 35 deaths from pandemic influenza A(H1N1) during the first wave, the processes arranged by the PIMMRG were able to collect information on an additional 14 deaths due to pandemic influenza A(H1N1)." https://www.hqsc.govt.nz/assets/PMMRC/Publications/PMMRC-Pandemic-influenza-report.pdf

Pretty sure that if this number jumped from 49 to over 500 as a usual annual figure there would be some more noise made about it.

Learn to speak google and ye shall receive (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4280813/). A couple of other sources showed 500ish, and given that this puppy stated "an average of 401 medical deaths annually from 1990 to 2008" and we're 12 years on, it is quite possible that 500 is closer to the truth than 49. Hence lack of noise I guess.

RDJ
1st December 2020, 08:02
Where do you get that figure? Using "annual death toll influenza new zealand" in Google gets me "In the winter months of 2009, a total of 49 New Zealand patients1 died with pandemic influenza A(H1N1) 2009 virus infection. While the Ministry of Health identified 35 deaths from pandemic influenza A(H1N1) during the first wave, the processes arranged by the PIMMRG were able to collect information on an additional 14 deaths due to pandemic influenza A(H1N1)." https://www.hqsc.govt.nz/assets/PMMRC/Publications/PMMRC-Pandemic-influenza-report.pdf

Pretty sure that if this number jumped from 49 to over 500 as a usual annual figure there would be some more noise made about it.

2015: Ministry of Health stated there were 767 deaths from the flu (about 7 Kiwis out of 100,000 - much better however than the 49 people per 100,000 in 1970.

2017: Otago University scientists' study concluded the flu is likely New Zealand's single biggest infectious disease killer, accounting for about 1.8 per cent of annual deaths in the country. Published in the Journal of Infection.

2019: University of Otago's professor Michael Baker: "...these (susceptible) groups add up to around 500 deaths per year in New Zealand, a figure higher than last year's road toll. This makes influenza one of the biggest infectious disease killers in the country."

Bear in mind that a significant percentage of the elderly who died from pneumonia (what used to be called the 'old man's friend' when I trained for reasons outside the scope of this discussion) would never have been tested for flu pre-WuFlu hysterics, so the number is likely to be higher. But I'm quoting verified scientific sources.

Viking01
3rd December 2020, 12:57
https://www.dw.com/en/coronavirus-uk-approves-pfizer-biontech-vaccine-to-roll-out-next-week/a-55792680

"The UK will be the first country in the West to offer a COVID-19 vaccine to the public after a regulator approved the medicine in record time."

An interesting choice of words.

"British media have reported that hospitals in England have been told to get ready to start doing vaccinations for medical workers as early as next week.

Pfizer said it would immediately begin shipping limited supplies to the UK — and has been gearing up for even wider distribution if given a similar nod by the US Food and Drug Administration, a decision expected as early as next week. But doses everywhere are scarce, and initial supplies will be rationed until more is manufactured in the first several months of next year."

So when might we likely start to notice the effectiveness of the vaccine ? Northern hemisphere Winter 2021 ?

[Edit]

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/dec/03/manchild-gavin-williamson-plumbs-new-depths-of-stupidity-with-vaccine-drivel

RDJ
4th December 2020, 07:47
https://www.dw.com/en/coronavirus-uk-approves-pfizer-biontech-vaccine-to-roll-out-next-week/a-55792680

"The UK will be the first country in the West to offer a COVID-19 vaccine to the public after a regulator approved the medicine in record time."

So when might we likely start to notice the effectiveness of the vaccine ? Northern hemisphere Winter 2021 ?

Methinks it's going to be extraordinarily difficult to separate out any benefit from the vaccine(s) in a very small % of the global population, from the effects of burgeoning herd immunity from an increasing casedemic, and from the effects of waning pathogenicity of the XiVirus (both of the latter are already in action).

I think we can be quite sure that the politicians and the vax manufacturers will of course claim total credit for any measured improvements in immunity and morbidity / mortality.

pritch
4th December 2020, 09:32
Trump has claimed that the figures for the US COVID death toll are wrong. He got that much right, but not for the reason he thinks. It appears the figures are under staed by 41%. The actual figure is close to 345,000.

From the NY Times:
"Our analysis of CDC data shows that 345,000 more people than normal have died in the U.S. from March 15 - Nov. 14. That figure, known as excess deaths, is 41% higher than the official coronavirus fatality count."

husaberg
4th December 2020, 12:59
Methinks it's going to be extraordinarily difficult to separate out any benefit from the vaccine(s) in a very small % of the global population, from the effects of burgeoning herd immunity from an increasing casedemic, and from the effects of waning pathogenicity of the XiVirus (both of the latter are already in action).

I think we can be quite sure that the politicians and the vax manufacturers will of course claim total credit for any measured improvements in immunity and morbidity / mortality.

65 million known cases with 1.5 million known deaths out of a population of 7.8 billion.

Considering you need about 80% plus to achieve herd immunity i would suggest the orifice you are talking out of is south of the border.

By 80% of the world's population mind you.
As this is only 0.833% rather than 80%

7,800,000,000 world population
65,000,000 covid 19 cases
=0.83%
Herd immunity usually requires over 80%.

MaxPenguin
4th December 2020, 15:38
I see billy t kak talk is mobilising an army to fight against the vaccine and Bill Gates.

RDJ
4th December 2020, 16:59
65 million known cases with 1.5 million known deaths out of a population of 7.8 billion.

Considering you need about 80% plus to achieve herd immunity i would suggest the orifice you are talking out of is south of the border.

By 80% of the world's population mind you.
As this is only 0.833% rather than 80%

7,800,000,000 world population
65,000,000 covid 19 cases
=0.83%
Herd immunity usually requires over 80%.

Excellent ad hominem

Fail on the stats' accuracy

That is all

R650R
4th December 2020, 17:19
https://iconnectfx.com/view/eee3a2c3-9433-eb11-9979-00505682f257

husaberg
4th December 2020, 18:21
Excellent ad hominem

Fail on the stats' accuracy

That is all

its not an ad hominem, as it was not an attack on you, only the crap you posted
I will give you a hint, Whilst I can back up my figures, yours are that far off, its not even funny.
that's why you are not defending what you wrote.
back up your 80% of the world infected to given any credence at all to your claims of herd immunity being anywhere even close to being achieved or just go away.
https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/herd-immunity-lockdowns-and-covid-19#:~:text=For%20example%2C%20herd%20immunity%20ag ainst,the%20threshold%20is%20about%2080%25.

because this shows only .83% which is about 100x less than 80%.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/?utm_campaign=homeAdvegas1?%22%20%5Cl%22countries
https://news.google.com/covid19/map?hl=en-NZ&gl=NZ&ceid=NZ%3Aen
347931


ps if I want to attack your lack of character can just post the link to your lies here.

like your last ad hominem

I'm mildly curious, why you're such an idiot. But, I am not particularly invested in finding out why you are such an idiot. You should just be you. Because the facts of the future will prove you completely idiotic, but you will interpret them as confirming your Weltanschau. Which should help your mental health, and the rest of us will see that you should do you, to help you. OK then.

or this total lack of honesty from you and your vain attempt to cover it up
https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/188175-The-journey-that-COVID-19-will-take-us-on?p=1131172984#post1131172984
https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/188175-The-journey-that-COVID-19-will-take-us-on?p=1131173241#post1131173241

mashman
5th December 2020, 06:49
Ten Fatal Errors: Scientists Attack Paper That Established Global PCR Driven Lockdown (https://uncoverdc.com/2020/12/03/ten-fatal-errors-scientists-attack-paper-that-established-global-pcr-driven-lockdown/)...

It's worth a read coz it changes a few things where those supporting the evidence no longer do.

"Dr. Corbett, a Ph.D., and retired RN elaborated: “There are 10 fatal errors in this Drosten test paper. Public Health England is a co-author on it. All the public health authorities across the EU have co-authored this paper. But here is the bottom line: There was no viral isolate to validate what they were doing. The PCR products of the amplification didn’t correspond to any viral isolate at that time. I call it ‘donut ring science.’ There is nothing at the center of it. It’s all about code, genetics, nothing to do with reality, or the actual person, the patient.”"

The following is not representative of the article in any way (it really isn't), but I just had to throw the Lawyers comment from the very end of the article in (because these scientists are saying that it's all shit, and their representative is, well, have a read):

"From his home in Germany, Reiner Fuellmich said, “The reason why I decided to speak out is that I didn’t want these crazy people who are pulling the strings behind the scenes to rule the world. I had no idea when I came out with my first video that these people and their corporations were such a powerful block. We are up against some really powerful and devious and bad, evil people. But they’re not a united front. We on the good side so to speak, I am firmly convinced that we have the better people, who know much more not just intellectually. The thing is . . . we’re humans, and they’re not.”"

R650R
5th December 2020, 08:37
As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????

MaxPenguin
5th December 2020, 09:18
So when the next global pandemic comes along we will do nothing, despite what is happening outside our borders.

R650R
5th December 2020, 09:51
Well, well well... looki what we got here....

This script *cough* sorry research paper written REMAKABLY quickly in late March is ASTOUNDINGLY accurate, like Nostradamus accurate, predicting 20 deaths.
Came across while trying to find original news articles with the mega death predictions, apparently NZ would have 80,000 if we did nothing.
Which is silly as onc significant numbers start actually getting sick or dying people would voluntarily adopt distancing and all the other way ideas.
It's nice they forecasted dates of future lockdowns.....

NZ hospitalisation rate is WAY lower than anywhere else in the world at 6.3%, yet this crystal ball gazing report even optimistically sets it at 5%....So we seeing the rest of the world dropping dead in the streets, trucks gassing neighbourhoods in China with disinfectant on industrial scale, we about to go into mega lockdown and even the EXPERTS think only 5% of infected will need hospital...
Yet our diet and obesity problems are very similar to hard hit America....

https://cpb-ap-se2.wpmucdn.com/blogs.auckland.ac.nz/dist/d/75/files/2017/01/Supression-and-Mitigation-New-Zealand-TPM-006.pdf

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/27/new-zealand-coronavirus-deaths-during-lockdown-could-be-just-20-modelling-suggests

RDJ
5th December 2020, 11:53
Worth a read for those who are reading / reacting to reports and controversy about excess deaths from the XiVirus. Very objective IMO.

https://hub.jhu.edu/2020/09/01/comorbidities-and-coronavirus-deaths-cdc/

MaxPenguin
5th December 2020, 12:05
Worth a read for those who are reading / reacting to reports and controversy about excess deaths from the XiVirus. Very objective IMO.

https://hub.jhu.edu/2020/09/01/comorbidities-and-coronavirus-deaths-cdc/

That is a good article. This covid certainly is a learning curve.

pritch
5th December 2020, 12:48
Worth a read for those who are reading / reacting to reports and controversy about excess deaths from the XiVirus. Very objective IMO.

https://hub.jhu.edu/2020/09/01/comorbidities-and-coronavirus-deaths-cdc/

That had me worried early on mentioning pneumonia, respiratory failure, and cardiac arrest, as comorbidities when they are commonly the result of a Covid infection. They do explain their logic though.

The item is out of date now in some respects, the "excess deaths" figure of 200,000 at the end of August is now 350,000 as at the end of November.

Many of the lemmings who travelled all over the US for Thanksgiving gatherings are now showing symptoms so there is about to be another big jump in the numbers.

US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo is planning on having a Christmas party for 900 people.

husaberg
5th December 2020, 12:56
That had me worried early on mentioning pneumonia, respiratory failure, and cardiac arrest, as comorbidities when they are commonly the result of a Covid infection. They do explain their logic though.

The item is out of date now in some respects, the "excess deaths" figure of 200,000 at the end of August is now 350,000 as at the end of November.

Many of the lemmings who travelled all over the US for Thanksgiving gatherings are now showing symptoms so there is about to be another big jump in the numbers.

US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo is planning on having a Christmas party for 900 people.

Still doesn't explain how he is able to use CDC figure yet claimed he doesn't agree with the death and infection stat a couple of posts earlier.


More than 100 million U.S. adults are now living with diabetes or prediabetes, according to a new report pdf icon released today by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). The report finds that as of 2015, 30.3 million Americans – 9.4 percent of the U.S. population –have diabetes. Another 84.1 million have prediabetes,


Chronic kidney disease, or CKD, causes more deaths than breast cancer or prostate cancer. It is the under-recognized public health crisis. It affects an estimated 37 million people in the U.S. (15% of the adult population


Prevalence of cancer ranges from approximately 5.5 percent of the population in the US


Number of adults aged 18 and over who currently have asthma: 19.2 million
Percent of adults aged 18 and over who currently have asthma: 7.7%

Not to mention all the rest

A post or two before he's 100 times short on his figures required for herd immunity.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWupoHcoLT4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DmW_H4U-MI

https://c.files.bbci.co.uk/97D4/production/_114786883_trumocoll.jpghttps://images.theconversation.com/files/328460/original/file-20200416-192693-non0l1.png?ixlib=rb-1.1.0&q=45&auto=format&w=754&fit=cliphttps://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/2020/03/11/PPYD/339535c0-8371-4e8c-863f-77370ca8e0b4-Trump_tweet.jpg?auto=webp&crop=612,345,x0,y14&format=pjpg&width=1200
https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2020/10/06/20/34066956-0-image-a-26_1602013757081.jpg

R650R
6th December 2020, 15:40
Your odds of dying from Covid in NZ is about the same as winning Powerball....
People dream of winning powerball, actively visit known powerball superspreader hot zones twice a week in hope of winning...

Meanwhile about 6 times as many people die in drink drive car crashes.
We even have mass random surveillance testing for that too, typically about 1.5-2% are ‘ infected’ with the influence of alcohol.....
Would we tolerate say a 24hr lockdown every time you bought a beer at bar?
Or after your night at the bar you don’t leave through the front door, a govt agent escorts you to a ‘quarantine ‘ facility which you can’t leave for 24 hrs.
Just imagine that, we would ABSOLUTELY save 150 lives a year
The govt will NEVER do that so why all this crap with the virus where the potential victim has a 93% chance of not even needing hospital treatment...

MaxPenguin
6th December 2020, 16:59
Your odds of dying from Covid in NZ is about the same as winning Powerball....
People dream of winning powerball, actively visit known powerball superspreader hot zones twice a week in hope of winning...

Meanwhile about 6 times as many people die in drink drive car crashes.
We even have mass random surveillance testing for that too, typically about 1.5-2% are ‘ infected’ with the influence of alcohol.....
Would we tolerate say a 24hr lockdown every time you bought a beer at bar?
Or after your night at the bar you don’t leave through the front door, a govt agent escorts you to a ‘quarantine ‘ facility which you can’t leave for 24 hrs.
Just imagine that, we would ABSOLUTELY save 150 lives a year
The govt will NEVER do that so why all this crap with the virus where the potential victim has a 93% chance of not even needing hospital treatment...

So then please tell us why the world is locking down and vaccinating?

R650R
7th December 2020, 07:39
So then please tell us why the world is locking down and vaccinating?

That really is the $6milliom dollar question of our time...

R650R
7th December 2020, 07:40
But where did all the (normal) Flu go...

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/weeklyarchives2020-2021/data/whoAllregt_phl48.html

Viking01
7th December 2020, 08:40
A sample from this morning's media :

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/dec/06/i-worked-so-hard-in-the-lab-i-cried-when-the-news-came

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300176414/a-gamble-pays-off-in-spectacular-success-how-the-leading-coronavirus-vaccines-made-it-to-the-finish-line

https://www.euronews.com/2020/11/26/meet-the-scientists-fighting-misinformation-and-educating-people-about-covid-vaccines

https://www.smh.com.au/national/the-12-39am-email-that-triggered-australia-s-response-to-covid-19-20201202-p56jzu.html

pritch
7th December 2020, 08:53
Trump has tweeted that Rudy Giuliani has tested positive for the Corona virus.

".@RudyGiuliani, by far the greatest mayor in the history of NYC, and who has been working tirelessly exposing the most corrupt election (by far!) in the history of the USA, has tested positive for the China Virus. Get better soon Rudy, we will carry on!!!"

Interesting writing technique, starting a sentence with a full stop.

MaxPenguin
7th December 2020, 09:39
That really is the $6milliom dollar question of our time...

Because there is a global pandemic. Free of charge.

husaberg
7th December 2020, 11:48
Trump has tweeted that Rudy Giuliani has tested positive for the Corona virus.

".@RudyGiuliani, by far the greatest mayor in the history of NYC, and who has been working tirelessly exposing the most corrupt election (by far!) in the history of the USA, has tested positive for the China Virus. Get better soon Rudy, we will carry on!!!"

Interesting writing technique, starting a sentence with a full stop.

its likely that's this twitter account name, someone already took the name dame as with Donald Trump why he's THEREALDONALDTRUMP.

pritch
7th December 2020, 14:50
its likely that's this twitter account name, someone already took the name dame as with Donald Trump why he's THEREALDONALDTRUMP.

Not that likely. On the actual tweet the full stop is white and prior to the @, part of the text, the Twitter handle is in blue. There is no connection between the two, the full stop is just random.

husaberg
7th December 2020, 16:16
Not that likely. On the actual tweet the full stop is white and prior to the @, part of the text, the Twitter handle is in blue. There is no connection between the two, the full stop is just random.

Maybe he was cutting and pasting?
Rudi having covid at 76 with his medical history. Its odd that they would admit him to hospital for something his own republican supporters claim to be less deadly than the flu.....

pritch
7th December 2020, 21:57
The Arizona legislature has closed, both congress and the senate, following two days contact with Rudy.

R650R
10th December 2020, 08:30
As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????

Any of our resident “doctors” found the extra bodies yet or does the math confuse them?

pritch
10th December 2020, 10:08
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/12/09/health/covid-vaccine-allergies-health-workers-uk-intl-gbr/index.html

mashman
10th December 2020, 12:28
I cannot convey the raft of emotions that I went through watching the first 1 minute 32 seconds of the video... (https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/economics/video/minister-freeland-calling-on-canadians-for-ideas-on-how-to-unlock-the-pre-loaded-stimulus~2093438)

Ok rich guys, this is the future of your money :killingme...

pritch
12th December 2020, 10:21
The US Food and Drug Administration is working through the process to approve, or not, the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine. The FDA is supposed to do this free from any political pressure in the interests of public safety.

Mark Meadows, Trump's Chief of Staff, has told the head of the FDA to approve the vaccine today or submit his resignation. No pressure there then.



Update:

And as if by magic, the FDA have announced that the Pfizer vaccine is approved.

R650R
13th December 2020, 13:01
The US Food and Drug Administration is working through the process to approve, or not, the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine. The FDA is supposed to do this free from any political pressure in the interests of public safety.

Mark Meadows, Trump's Chief of Staff, has told the head of the FDA to approve the vaccine today or submit his resignation. No pressure there then.



Update:

And as if by magic, the FDA have announced that the Pfizer vaccine is approved.

What public safety? Do you know the makers are protected by law from being taken to court if anyone dies from a vaccine???

husaberg
13th December 2020, 13:50
What public safety? Do you know the makers are protected by law from being taken to court if anyone dies from a vaccine???

not entirely correct.

https://www.policymed.com/2011/03/supreme-court-rules-in-favor-of-protecting-vaccine-makers-from-state-lawsuits.html
The Supreme Court explained that the National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 (NCVIA or Act) preempts all design-defect claims against vaccine manufacturers brought by plaintiffs seeking compensation for injury or death caused by a vaccine’s side effects.
products-liability law establishes three grounds for liability—defective manufacture, inadequate directions or warnings, and defective design

They can still sue, but Epidemiological judgments about vaccine design to the FDA and the National Vaccine Program rather than juries.”
The Supreme Court’s decision came from the fact that “vaccine manufacturers fund from their sales an informal, efficient compensation program for vaccine injuries. In exchange, they avoid costly tort litigation and the occasional disproportionate jury verdict.”
According to an article from Reuters, the vaccine court has awarded more than $1.8 billion for vaccine injury claims in nearly 2,500 cases since 1989.
American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) president O. Marion Burton applauded the Supreme Court’s decision in a statement. He noted that the “decision protects children by strengthening our national immunization system and ensuring that vaccines will continue to prevent the spread of infectious diseases in this country.”

R650R
13th December 2020, 14:28
Double whammy here.....

Aussie version of vax produces false positives to HIV....
Never mind the HIV testing issues anyway, two people can have same test results but only be called positive if they made wrong lifestyle choices....

https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireStory/australia-rush-pfizer-homegrown-vaccine-canned-74666426

So if this vax makes people false positive for HIV, how do we know if other vax produce maybe false covid positives?

Viking01
13th December 2020, 15:03
https://www.policymed.com/2011/03/su...-lawsuits.html
....
According to an article from Reuters, the vaccine court has awarded more than $1.8 billion for vaccine injury claims in nearly 2,500 cases since 1989.


Interesting to see the damages amount in the earlier link mentioned above. I'd seen an article this week that quoted a slightly higher amount.

https://thevaccinereaction.org/2019/01/over-4-billion-paid-for-vaccine-injuries-and-deaths/

Just over $4 billion, but qualified it that approx $1 billion had been for vaccine affected victims in just the last 4 years.

husaberg
13th December 2020, 15:36
Interesting to see the damages amount in the earlier link mentioned above. I'd seen an article this week that quoted a slightly higher amount.

https://thevaccinereaction.org/2019/01/over-4-billion-paid-for-vaccine-injuries-and-deaths/

Just over $4 billion, but qualified it that approx $1 billion had been for vaccine affected victims in just the last 4 years.


The compensation paid out is for people that were genuinely medically affected by vaccines. Or where the case was settled.

Approximately 70 percent of all compensation awarded by the VICP comes as result of a
negotiated settlement between the parties in which HHS has not concluded, based upon review
of the evidence, that the alleged vaccine(s) caused the alleged injury

No one has ever said there weren't people that have not had adverse vaccine reactions or compilations or allergies also not all of the compensation is for the drug complications either, some are also from the administration.
in your own linked article

The HRSA report reveals that over the past 30 years (since 1989), the VICP has received 20,123 petitions claiming vaccine injury and death, out of which 18,000 claims have been resolved. Of those 17,576 cases, 6,313 cases (about two out of three claims) have received compensation awards via settlements or judgments.1 2 Nevertheless, HRSA does not acknowledge that vaccine injuries are rare and estimates that one person has been compensated for every million doses distributed in the United States.

How many petitions have been awarded compensation?

According to the CDC, from 2006 to 2018 over 3.7 billion doses of covered vaccines were distributed in
the U.S. For petitions filed in this time period, 7,565 petitions were adjudicated by the Court, and of
those 5,297 were compensated. This means for every 1 million doses of vaccine that were distributed,
approximately 1 individual was compensated.


Since 1988, over 22,685 petitions have been filed with the VICP. Over that 30-year time period, 19,403
petitions have been adjudicated, with 7,705 of those determined to be compensable, while 11,698 were
dismissed. Total compensation paid over the life of the program is approximately $4.4 billion.

by far the largest amount of claims were for flu vaccines. Well over half.
yet the ones claimed by the antivaxer to cause problems have very few awarded claims, or in fact very few claims at all...........


Petitions Filed
Fiscal Year Total
FY 1988 24
FY 1989 148
FY 1990 1,492
FY 1991 2,718
FY 1992 189
FY 1993 140
FY 1994 107
FY 1995 180
FY 1996 84
FY 1997 104
FY 1998 120
FY 1999 411
FY 2000 164
FY 2001 215
FY 2002 958
FY 2003 2,592
FY 2004 1,214
FY 2005 735
FY 2006 325
FY 2007 410
FY 2008 417
FY 2009 397
FY 2010 448
FY 2011 386
FY 2012 401
FY 2013 504
FY 2014 633
FY 2015 803
FY 2016 1,120
FY 2017 1,243
FY 2018 1,238
FY 2019 1,282
FY 2020 1,191
FY 2021 290
Total 22,685


Adjudications
Generally, petitions are not adjudicated in the same fiscal year as filed.
On average, it takes 2 to 3 years to adjudicate a petition after it is filed.
Fiscal Year Compensable Dismissed Total
FY 1989 9 12 21
FY 1990 100 33 133
FY 1991 141 447 588
FY 1992 166 487 653
FY 1993 125 588 713
FY 1994 162 446 608
FY 1995 160 575 735
FY 1996 162 408 570
FY 1997 189 198 387
FY 1998 144 181 325
FY 1999 98 139 237
FY 2000 125 104 229
FY 2001 86 88 174
FY 2002 104 104 208
FY 2003 56 100 156
FY 2004 62 247 309
FY 2005 60 229 289
FY 2006 69 193 262
FY 2007 82 136 218
FY 2008 147 151 298
FY 2009 134 257 391
FY 2010 180 330 510
FY 2011 266 1,742 2,008
FY 2012 265 2,533 2,798
FY 2013 369 650 1,019
FY 2014 370 193 563
FY 2015 519 142 661
FY 2016 698 185 883
FY 2017 696 202 898
FY 2018 544 199 743
FY 2019 641 181 822
FY 2020 706 194 900
FY 2021 70 24 94
Total 7,705 11,698 19,403


https://www.hrsa.gov/sites/default/files/hrsa/vaccine-compensation/data/data-statistics-report.pdf

All of his information is freely available there I no conspiracy to cover up or misrepresent information by anyone other than by antivaxers.

Viking01
13th December 2020, 16:10
The compensation paid out is for people that were genuinely medically affected by vaccines. Or where the case was settled.

No one has ever said there weren't people that have not had adverse vaccine reactions or compilations or allergies also not all of the compensation is for the drug complications either some are the administration.


Thanks for pointing out the distinction. I was struggling to work out why the difference in totals.
Cheers,
Viking

mashman
19th December 2020, 16:41
Covid-19: Mass testing is inaccurate and gives false sense of security, minister admits (https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4916). Garbage in, Garbage out... or at the very least... Garbage in, To justify unrequired vaccination. What looks like corruption, swims like corruption and quacks like corruption. A duck.

F5 Dave
20th December 2020, 19:37
In the UK. Where they have fucked up their whole response.

And why the fuck would you quote a minister? Are you stupid? Well clearly you are. Jesus fuk christ. Actual Science please.

Just understand that you are not good at this. This requires critical thinking.

Go consume some McDonalds and make yourself valuable to some fat family businesses.

R650R
23rd December 2020, 08:54
Spare a thought for the unfortunate households this Xmas....

The households where Karen’s live.....

Instead of milk and cookies they will leave hand sanitiser and toilet paper out for Santa....

But he won’t be here Xmas nite Jonny, he has to stay in quarantine for two weeks first...

I can’t belueve comrade afdrn has t used this.... kids are very observant, how come Santa has freedom of travel?

F5 Dave
23rd December 2020, 12:03
Spare a thought for the unfortunate households this Xmas....

The households where people have died of this imaginary disease. US have had thier worst year for mortality despite the trend going down in previous years.
315,000 in that country from C19. How many fuckload more to come.

If only we had DJT in charge here we could have got some more of that action.

Oh but grumble grumble, I heard doctors are lazy and just write C19 instead of cancer, as its less keystrokes, and their database was run by dominion so they were really bedpan injuries but flipped to c19 whilst all controlled by Hillary and Satan himself.

Fuck right off.

R650R
23rd December 2020, 12:55
No one has said what you said in last paragraph.

However criminal elements within administrative depts may be misreporting the stats to obtain funding advantage or maybe just because they hate trump.

What we DO know is despite this sickening death wave the people on the frontlines are laughing their tits of doing Tik Tok dances AT work FFS, that says it all. Supposed to be all this death but it’s like a comedic episode of M*A*S*H.

How the f$&K do you behave like that if it is what they say it is.... And that the media portray that as acceptable..,

Did we 911 responders dancing in ruins?
Did we see Tsunami clean up dancing on beach
Did we see CHCh quake workers dancing in street

Next season most of the weak will have been weeded out, death rate will drop and then claim vax works.

pritch
23rd December 2020, 13:30
Did we 911 responders dancing in ruins?
Did we see Tsunami clean up dancing on beach
Did we see CHCh quake workers dancing in street


People under immense pressure are known to resort to black humour. People who have not known such pressurees may not understand the humour. This caused problems during the Vietnam war when some journalists were placed with military units and lacked the experience to relate to what they saw and heard.

Hospital staff in some areas have been working extra shifts in dangerous and emotionally draining circumstances for months. They have seen colleagues die of the disease knowing they themselves could be next. They are emotionally and physically exhausted, meantime in the US millions ignored the warnings and travelled to Thanksgiving gatherings ensuring there would be a new wave of cases. Now it's Christmas, rinse and repeat.

If hospital staff want to let off steam on TikTok good luck to them.

pete376403
23rd December 2020, 13:59
It is possible to see some humour in responses to Covid:
https://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2020/12/20?fbclid=IwAR2b7NegOGGtMLEfkzo6ir2STDApliVTccaihS xXlqfgehG3v3MCfyFfYBo

pritch
23rd December 2020, 16:04
Currently Ivermectin is being touted as a promising treatment for Covid. Funny that, I seem to recall Ivermectin being advertised as a cattle drench. We get ads like that out here on the rural rump.

husaberg
23rd December 2020, 16:30
Currently Ivermectin is being touted as a promising treatment for Covid. Funny that, I seem to recall Ivermectin being advertised as a cattle drench. We get ads like that out here on the rural rump.

Usless factoid the interesting thing about the avermectin group of compounds used in the drench it was discovered in soil bacteria in japan.
the dude was given a noble prize much much later for finding it.
The compound revolutionised drenches as we farmers can pour on or inject rather than oral dose.
They also work a heap better.

looks like its real
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7521351/

authors found lower mortality in the ivermectin group (25.2% versus 15.0%, OR 0.52, 95% CI 0.29–0.96). The authors also reported lower mortality among patients with severe pulmonary disease

george formby
23rd December 2020, 17:08
I know the Kiwi accent doesn't lend itself well, but it's covid not cowvid. Co, like coconut or Sebastian Coe.

R650R
23rd December 2020, 21:16
People under immense pressure are known to resort to black humour. People who have not known such pressurees may not understand the humour. This caused problems during the Vietnam war when some journalists were placed with military units and lacked the experience to relate to what they saw and heard.

Hospital staff in some areas have been working extra shifts in dangerous and emotionally draining circumstances for months. They have seen colleagues die of the disease knowing they themselves could be next. They are emotionally and physically exhausted, meantime in the US millions ignored the warnings and travelled to Thanksgiving gatherings ensuring there would be a new wave of cases. Now it's Christmas, rinse and repeat.

If hospital staff want to let off steam on TikTok good luck to them.

I know a paramedic and yes they use black humour to cope with some nasty stuff.

Black hu our does not e tend to having the physical and mental energy to do gleeful til you dances.

R650R
23rd December 2020, 21:16
A very interesting social media post

I want to provide you some very important information. I'm a committee member within the Liberal Party of Canada. I sit within several committee groups but the information I am providing is originating from the Strategic Planning committee (which is steered by the PMO).

I need to start off by saying that I'm not happy doing this but I have to. As a Canadian and more importantly as a parent who wants a better future not only for my children but for other children as well. The other reason I am doing this is because roughly 30% of the committee members are not pleased with the direction this will take Canada, but our opinions have been ignored and they plan on moving forward toward their goals. They have also made it very clear that nothing will stop the planned outcomes.

The road map and aim was set out by the PMO and is as follows:

- Phase in secondary lock down restrictions on a rolling basis, starting with major metropolitan areas first and expanding outward. Expected by November 2020.

- Rush the acquisition of (or construction of) isolation facilities across every province and territory. Expected by December 2020.

- Daily new cases of COVID-19 will surge beyond capacity of testing, including increases in COVID related deaths following the same growth curves. Expected by end of November 2020.

- Complete and total secondary lock down (much stricter than the first and second rolling phase restrictions). Expected by end of December 2020 - early January 2021

- Reform and expansion of the unemployment program to be transitioned into the universal basic income program. Expected by Q1 2021.

- Projected COVID-19 mutation and/or co-infection with secondary virus (referred to as COVID-21) leading to a third wave with much higher mortality rate and higher rate of infection. Expected by February 2021.

- Daily new cases of COVID-21 hospitalizations and COVID-19 and COVID-21 related deaths will exceed medical care facilities capacity. Expected Q1 - Q2 2021.

- Enhanced lock down restrictions (referred to as Third Lock Down) will be implemented. Full travel restrictions will be imposed (including inter-province and inter-city). Expected Q2 2021.

- Transitioning of individuals into the universal basic income program. Expected mid Q2 2021.

- Projected supply chain break downs, inventory shortages, large economic instability. Expected late Q2 2021.

- Deployment of military personnel into major metropolitan areas as well as all major roadways to establish travel checkpoints. Restrict travel and movement. Provide logistical support to the area. Expected by Q3 2021.



Along with that provided road map the Strategic Planning committee was asked to design an effective way of transitioning Canadians to meet a unprecedented economic endeavor. One that would change the face of Canada and forever alter the lives of Canadians.

What we were told was that in order to offset what was essentially an economic collapse on a international scale, that the federal government was going to offer Canadians a total debt relief.


This is how it works: the federal government will offer to eliminate all personal debts (mortgages, loans, credit cards, etc) which all funding will be provided
to Canada by the IMF under what will become known as the World Debt Reset program.


In exchange for acceptance of this total debt forgiveness the individual would forfeit ownership of any and all property and assets forever.

The individual would also have to agree to partake in the COVID-19 and COVID-21 vaccination schedule, which would provide the individual with unrestricted travel and unrestricted living even under a full lock down (through the use of photo identification referred to as Canada's HealthPass) .

Committee members asked who would become the owner of the forfeited property and assets in that scenario and what would happen to lenders or financial institutions, we were simply told "the World Debt Reset program will handle all of the details".

Several committee members also questioned what would happen to individuals if they refused to participate in the World Debt Reset program, or the HealthPass, or the vaccination schedule, and the answer we got was very troubling. Essentially we were told it was our duty to make sure we came up with a plan to ensure that would never happen. We were told it was in the individuals best interest to participate.

When several committee members pushed relentlessly to get an answer we were told that those who refused would first live under the lock down restrictions indefinitely.

And that over a short period of time as more Canadians transitioned into the debt forgiveness program, the ones who refused to participate would be deemed a public safety risk and would be relocated into isolation facilities. Once in those facilities they would be given two options, participate in the debt forgiveness program and be released, or stay indefinitely in the isolation facility under the classification of a serious public health risk and have all their assets seized.

So as you can imagine after hearing all of this it turned into quite the heated discussion and escalated beyond anything I've ever witnessed before.


In the end it was implied by the PMO that the whole agenda will move forward no matter who agrees with it or not.

That it wont just be Canada but in fact all nations will have similar roadmaps and agendas. That we need to take advantage of the situations before us to promote change on a grander scale for the betterment of everyone. The members who were opposed and ones who brought up key issues that would arise from such a thing were completely ignored. Our opinions and concerns were ignored. We were simply told to just do it.


All I know is that I don't like it and I think its going to place Canadians into a dark future.

F5 Dave
24th December 2020, 06:12
No one has said what you said in last paragraph.

. . .
My last paragraph was "Fuck right off"
Short, concise, to the point in just 3 words but still a paragraph.

The proceeding paragraph was of course obvious satire, but no less sensible than the bile you are cut and pasting from sites infected presumably by disenfranchised angry men spreading their brand of fear and distrust.

Kickaha
24th December 2020, 06:21
A very interesting social media post nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit, more nutbar bullshit

What a total load of shit but dumbarse motherfucking cockwomble cunts will lap it up and when it doesn't happen will just move on without a thought to the next bit of nutbar bullshit

Bonez
24th December 2020, 06:45
I'm pleased to see you kids are still playing nicely. :tugger:

I suggest you negitive noddies go for a decent ride. It's good for your health and well being...

pritch
24th December 2020, 08:22
What a total load of shit but dumbarse motherfucking cockwomble cunts will lap it up and when it doesn't happen will just move on without a thought to the next bit of nutbar bullshit

True. Q has been making his prophesies for years without, as far as is known, a single one coming true. And we would have known had he scored one. Yet despite his total lack of success his idiot followers believe his every new utterance.

The attachment is not particularly relevant to this discussion, it's from a military group I watch. A recent event reminded me that it was on my desktop.

pete376403
24th December 2020, 10:04
Another good one - predates my previous post
https://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/2020/12/06

george formby
24th December 2020, 10:11
Despite the UK getting clattered from all angles, the humour is still strong.


https://youtu.be/pVQ29tfOvl8

R650R
24th December 2020, 14:41
The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster

Kickaha
24th December 2020, 14:53
The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster

Or maybe there's other reasons

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-africa-mortality-i-idUSKBN26K0AI

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/22/africa-has-defied-covid-19-nightmare-scenarios-we-shouldnt-be-surprised/

F5 Dave
24th December 2020, 15:01
The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster
Gee was Donald right? Oh I wish we'd listened to his much bigger brain. That's what you are trying to say yeah?

Because they had to waste time testing it cause that orange moron promoted it. Of course it didn't help C19 in real actual controlled trials. Why is that so hard to understand?.

You spouting fucking lies is just disinformation and you are complicit with the damage that shit causes.

R650R
27th December 2020, 10:32
You spouting fucking lies is just disinformation.....

Nothing to do with Trump.
If you widened your reading circle to sources outside the mainstream media machine you’ll find plenty of independant sources were saying hey we experimented with this and had some success.

Hydroxyclhoriquine has been around since 60’s been used years officially as anti malaria drug and its super cheap.

This statement has been fact checked and found to be true.

Kickaha
27th December 2020, 10:37
Nothing to do with Trump.
If you widened your reading circle to sources outside the mainstream media machine you’ll find plenty of independant sources were saying hey we experimented with this and had some success.

Hydroxyclhoriquine has been around since 60’s been used years officially as anti malaria drug and its super cheap.

This statement has been fact checked and found to be true.

It hasn't been proven anywhere that Hydroxyclhoriquine is effective

pritch
27th December 2020, 13:48
It hasn't been proven anywhere that Hydroxyclhoriquine is effective

It can cause heart problems, reports I saw recommended it not be used for COVID. I took it for its originally intended purpose, nobody even suggested heart problems were a possibility.

Multiple countries conducted trials simply because Trump suggested it. A completely ludicrous situation really.

Just as well he started with that otherwise they might have been injecting bleach or shoving lightbulbs up their arses before they realised he was an idiot.

Calix Lee
28th December 2020, 13:59
Will there be a second lockdown? Some European and S.E. Asian countries will close their borders because of Covid-19. I heard that the numbers are starting to spike up again.

husaberg
28th December 2020, 14:50
It can cause heart problems, reports I saw recommended it not be used for COVID. I took it for its originally intended purpose, nobody even suggested heart problems were a possibility.

Multiple countries conducted trials simply because Trump suggested it. A completely ludicrous situation really.

Just as well he started with that otherwise they might have been injecting bleach or shoving lightbulbs up their arses before they realised he was an idiot.

a couple of pages back there was the mention of Invermectins.
These are extensively used in the third world Afric situation to control river blindness.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onchocerciasis#:~:text=Onchocerciasis%2C%20also%20 known%20as%20river,due%20to%20infection%2C%20after %20trachoma.
Unlike trumps crap suggestions ivermectin has been shown to lower the incidence of death in clinical trials
I should note trump was taking hydroxychloroquine as a preventive measure prior to contracting covid:wacko:

Of course africa will be under reporting covid and it has a very young population

F5 Dave
28th December 2020, 19:17
Will there be a second lockdown? Some European and S.E. Asian countries will close their borders because of Covid-19. I heard that the numbers are starting to spike up again.

Where? We've had a 2nd localised lockdown in Auckland to quell a relatively small outbreak. There could likely be more. The border can't be impenetrable. There is still a pandemic on our doorstep. We must keep some guard and contact tracing and testing could help us keep our way of life in tact.

I've just attended a road race meeting with 2500 people. 3rd real road race meeting in the world this year apparently. Wouldn't happen if we had community transmission going on. Unlike some places where they seem to just hope for the best.

pritch
29th December 2020, 08:12
Hospital staff in the US are expecting a big surge of cases in the next couple of weeks following all the Christmas get-togethers. They are just getting over the effects of the Thankgsgiving weekend.

Murdoch's news empire has a lot to answer for. In the US they have created an alternate reality for almost half of the population. In Britain the Murdoch tabloids were influential in spreading misinformation about Brexit. In Australia Murdoch owned TV and papers push the right wing agenda.

pritch
3rd January 2021, 07:44
10 chars...

R650R
3rd January 2021, 11:46
True. Q has been making his prophesies for years without, as far as is known, a single one coming true...

You keep falling back to mentioning Q, despite being told repeatedly that it’s a known govt psy-op controlled outlet designed to discredit alternative media sources.

Bonez
3rd January 2021, 16:14
You keep falling back to mentioning Q, despite being told repeatedly that it’s a known govt psy-op controlled outlet designed to discredit alternative media sources.pritch will believe anything...

Like ANTIFA being peaceful protestors.

pete376403
3rd January 2021, 17:26
For those pointing to Sweden and its "herd immunity" strategy with no lockdowns and expecting people to co-operate with guidelines, unfortunately it didnt work all that well -

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-prageru-sweden-herd-immunit-idUSKBN28C2R7

https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/articles/29296/in-sweden-herd-immunity-has-failed-tragically-will-there-be-a-reckoning

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200813/swedens-no-lockdown-policy-didnt-achieve-herd-immunity

F5 Dave
3rd January 2021, 19:03
It was a bold move for sure. But wherever there is limited data you have problems predicting the outcome.

Would be interesting if there is a infection vs mortality rate that makes it a viable strategy. I can't imagine that there is. Glad someone else did it rather than us. Its a good lesson and at least shut some of the Internet dicks up. Oh. No. They will still be just as deluded .

Kickaha
4th January 2021, 06:18
It was a bold move for sure. But wherever there is limited data you have problems predicting the outcome.

Would be interesting if there is a infection vs mortality rate that makes it a viable strategy. I can't imagine that there is. Glad someone else did it rather than us. Its a good lesson and at least shut some of the Internet dicks up. Oh. No. They will still be just as deluded .

I've seen multiple people point to Sweden and their herd immunity as a success, they obviously haven't done much reading up on it

Kickaha
4th January 2021, 06:32
You keep falling back to mentioning Q, despite being told repeatedly that it’s a known govt psy-op controlled outlet designed to discredit alternative media sources.

More likely Russian Govt though

It's actually not known to be anything and there are still a bunch of theories about who it is

husaberg
4th January 2021, 10:06
More likely Russian Govt though

It's actually not known to be anything and there are still a bunch of theories about who it is

Remember this is the guy who claimed its all a conspiracy

Well well well, our journey into communist hell continues.

There has only been 1650 alleged cases (out of 700,000 tests!!!!) of the virus, but what has spread faster has been submission to communist control.
Nearly 2 million have downloaded the Covid app so you can be sent to a govt “ health” camp to catch the virus if you didnt already have it.

But yay 3 million kiwis have said no to turning their phone into govt spy device.

Tommorow is D-day, public transport will be the barometer of how many of us have rolled belly up to mask wearing.
Hopefully most will say screw this shit and drive their cars to work.

You don’t have to wear a mask if it affects your physical or mental health and you do NOT need to present documents to prove this.

Out and about it’s refreshing to see nearly No one scanning the qr code thingy.

It’s quite clear now as the mountain of contradictions grow that it’s not about stopping the “virus”..


Masks are for destroying social interaction and communication with strangers. You know those moments in life when some shitbag is bashing his missus and enough of you make visual contact to know you’ve got each other back and intervene.
But with masks there will never be any Flight 93 “lets roll” moments of bravery, you’ll never know if your fellow citizen is a Karen or Stasi as you reluctantly board the blacked out train carriage...
A cop will never see your friendly smile, never know you like them and not let you off that minor stop sign indescretion...

onearmedbandit
4th January 2021, 10:22
Remember this is the guy who claimed its all a conspiracy

Fuck that must be a scary world he lives in.

R650R
4th January 2021, 11:07
More likely Russian Govt though

It's actually not known to be anything and there are still a bunch of theories about who it is

Could be right there. They did a slick job wit his RT Russia Today news network. At the start they did lots of pro 911 truth stuff, hired the hottest articulate news presenters prob straight out of project Sparrow. Suddenly we had ‘Independant’ news that we always wanted... then slowly their bias showed through. Still they do make some cool
documentaries....

But the main thing is anyone that suddenly rises to prominence should be suspect....

There’s an old Vietnam’s war vet saying....”if something makes you look up, you better look down real fast”

husaberg
4th January 2021, 12:11
Fuck that must be a scary world he lives in.

The stazi are clearly after him.
my understanding is its a coalition of them and former mod hitcher are behind Grammerly.

F5 Dave
5th January 2021, 09:56
Would you prefer Ants in your pants -
or a Spider in your bra?

These are the questions the government are REFUSING to answer.

But why?

Why indeed.

R650R
7th January 2021, 12:04
Would you prefer Ants in your pants -
or a Spider in your bra?

These are the questions the government are REFUSING to answer.

But why?

Why indeed.

Well the govt never knows much of any importance so theyÂ’ll have to hire a consultant for that.

An interesting tender thatÂ’s not a tender has been sent to transport companies.
The govt has a magical Wishlist for the vaccine distribution...
With a few problems....

They want to know who can offer a same day or overnight service... to 9 major locations then a subsequent 1000 sites where the vaccine will be available.
They want to know who can do this at minus 70deg Celsius and who has experience at doing this and monitoring temps in transit...
And has experience of large quantities of ‘hazardous’ dry ice aka frozen planet decimating carbon dioxide...
This is all despite the transport industry being under 24/7 surveillance that would put any meth dealer out of business if applied same way...
The govt knows nothing...

In my experience youÂ’ll be lucky if any chilled truck body or shipping reefer goes below -30 deg Celsius and even then thatÂ’s an average min temp due to required defrost cycles...
Whether thatÂ’s good enough in conjunction with a dry ice packaged product hhmmm....
Then thereÂ’s a shortage in that market sector already... so IÂ’d start stocking up on ice cream and frozen pizzas now if thatÂ’s your thing....
The smart thing would just be to send all the people on trains to the final destination where the vaccine is. We are a coastal nation with nowhere too far away from a rail linked seaport which is where the product is likely to land due to its shipping requirements...
But then youÂ’ve got your social distance and travel blocks during the next lockdown...

I did have to laugh at the Line of experience dealing with road blocks in govt request...

One things for sure some savvy trucking operator is going to get mega rich on this deal...
ThereÂ’s really only two maybe three outfits that could tender this job...

husaberg
7th January 2021, 12:43
Well the govt never knows much of any importance so theyÂ’ll have to hire a consultant for that.

An interesting tender thatÂ’s not a tender has been sent to transport companies.
The govt has a magical Wishlist for the vaccine distribution...
With a few problems....

They want to know who can offer a same day or overnight service... to 9 major locations then a subsequent 1000 sites where the vaccine will be available.
They want to know who can do this at minus 70deg Celsius and who has experience at doing this and monitoring temps in transit...
And has experience of large quantities of ‘hazardous’ dry ice aka frozen planet decimating carbon dioxide...
This is all despite the transport industry being under 24/7 surveillance that would put any meth dealer out of business if applied same way...
The govt knows nothing...

In my experience youÂ’ll be lucky if any chilled truck body or shipping reefer goes below -30 deg Celsius and even then thatÂ’s an average min temp due to required defrost cycles...
Whether thatÂ’s good enough in conjunction with a dry ice packaged product hhmmm....
Then thereÂ’s a shortage in that market sector already... so IÂ’d start stocking up on ice cream and frozen pizzas now if thatÂ’s your thing....
The smart thing would just be to send all the people on trains to the final destination where the vaccine is. We are a coastal nation with nowhere too far away from a rail linked seaport which is where the product is likely to land due to its shipping requirements...
But then youÂ’ve got your social distance and travel blocks during the next lockdown...

I did have to laugh at the Line of experience dealing with road blocks in govt request...

One things for sure some savvy trucking operator is going to get mega rich on this deal...
ThereÂ’s really only two maybe three outfits that could tender this job...

Both major AB companies in NZ more than meet that critera. They are able to move significant volumes of genetic material around NZ to remote locations on a daily basis to the 12000 odd dairy farms in NZ
So there is a major gap in what you actually know and what you think you know.
Maybe before you start spouting your abnormal conspiracies you do a tiny bit of research first.

pritch
9th January 2021, 14:40
There’s an old Vietnam’s war vet saying....”if something makes you look up, you better look down real fast”

There is? :sherlock:

pritch
9th January 2021, 14:57
Both major AB companies in NZ more than meet that critera. They are able to move significant volumes of genetic material around NZ to remote locations on a daily basis to the 12000 odd dairy farms in NZ
So there is a major gap in what you actually know and what you think you know.
Maybe before you start spouting your abnormal conspiracies you do a tiny bit of research first.

As I understand, and my understanding is limited, the only vaccine that requires storage at -70c is the BioNTech/Pfizer item. NZ has ordered 750,000 doses of that, enough to immunise 375,000 people. They might as well keep that in Auckland for the JAFAs and ship the more easily handled ones around the country.

With parts of Britain's NHS on the verge of collapse, everybody's favourire fascist, Nigel fucking Farage, is forming a new political party to replace the Brexit Party. One of the stated aims is to reduce the restrictions imposed to combat the Covid pandemic. Fucking marvellous!

James Deuce
9th January 2021, 15:43
As I understand, and my understanding is limited, the only vaccine that requires storage at -70c is the BioNTech/Pfizer item. NZ has ordered 750,000 doses of that, enough to immunise 375,000 people. They might as well keep that in Auckland for the JAFAs and ship the more easily handled ones around the country.

With parts of Britain's NHS on the verge of collapse, everybody's favourire fascist, Nigel fucking Farage, is forming a new political party to replace the Brexit Party. One of the stated aims is to reduce the restrictions imposed to combat the Covid pandemic. Fucking marvellous!
The vaccine approach is really cool. The one that needs cool storage is a traditional attenuated vaccine, that is it's a de-natured version of SARS-COV-2 designed to trigger an immune response with no symptomology, thereby making you immune. It's expensive and lengthy to develop, approve, manufacture and store. The other two are mRNA vaccines. The mRNA vaccines provide gene level protection against infection by telling your body what the bad guy looks like and is based in tech that took decades to create but allows for the rapid creation and deployment of a vaccine. This is why the gene profiling of COVID-19 is so important and what has enabled two vaccines to be created in weeks instead of years. Subsequent mutations of COVID-19 such as the new, more infectious version can be addressed rapidly thanks to this new vaccine approach. I'll be angling for the mRNA version myself. It's more likely to provide long term protection due to the method of stimulating your immune system. We live in fantastic times, in all senses of the word.

husaberg
9th January 2021, 16:12
As I understand, and my understanding is limited, the only vaccine that requires storage at -70c is the BioNTech/Pfizer item. NZ has ordered 750,000 doses of that, enough to immunise 375,000 people. They might as well keep that in Auckland for the JAFAs and ship the more easily handled ones around the country.

With parts of Britain's NHS on the verge of collapse, everybody's favourire fascist, Nigel fucking Farage, is forming a new political party to replace the Brexit Party. One of the stated aims is to reduce the restrictions imposed to combat the Covid pandemic. Fucking marvellous!

Yeah i was just countering the limited understanding of R650, he posts crap claiming to be an expert when he's little more than a drip.

F5 Dave
9th January 2021, 19:43
The vaccine approach is really cool. The one that needs cool storage is a traditional attenuated vaccine, that is it's a de-natured version of SARS-COV-2 designed to trigger an immune response with no symptomology, thereby making you immune. It's expensive and lengthy to develop, approve, manufacture and store. The other two are mRNA vaccines. The mRNA vaccines provide gene level protection against infection by telling your body what the bad guy looks like and is based in tech that took decades to create but allows for the rapid creation and deployment of a vaccine. This is why the gene profiling of COVID-19 is so important and what has enabled two vaccines to be created in weeks instead of years. Subsequent mutations of COVID-19 such as the new, more infectious version can be addressed rapidly thanks to this new vaccine approach. I'll be angling for the mRNA version myself. It's more likely to provide long term protection due to the method of stimulating your immune system. We live in fantastic times, in all senses of the word.
Is that right? I thought they were all based mRNA which is why they came to fruition in similar timeframes? Heard some podcast about the development.

James Deuce
9th January 2021, 20:37
Is that right? I thought they were all based mRNA which is why they came to fruition in similar timeframes? Heard some podcast about the development.
One was in the works for much longer. The mRNA ones started months after the Pfizer one, but were ready much quicker. Development time was ludicrously short, in the order of weeks. The Pfizer one has been REALLY pushed hard to get what is normally years of work and trials compressed into a shorter time frame. They've done an astonishing job.

R650R
18th January 2021, 08:46
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-EjrKpKZ63BM/YAJBoTpuvTI/AAAAAAAEQVU/FGUjmEB7cpAy18bJ-s6MPfSgbbTSAsgTgCNcBGAsYHQ/s1745/CANADA%2B%25282%2529.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-fUVMjhUCy2E/YAJBodKbFtI/AAAAAAAEQVM/KNuZtTt4HvQP7Tz71g-YH_SOkvEzSjanACNcBGAsYHQ/s1750/CANADA%2B%25283%2529.jpg

RDJ
18th January 2021, 13:31
https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-EjrKpKZ63BM/YAJBoTpuvTI/AAAAAAAEQVU/FGUjmEB7cpAy18bJ-s6MPfSgbbTSAsgTgCNcBGAsYHQ/s1745/CANADA%2B%25282%2529.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-fUVMjhUCy2E/YAJBodKbFtI/AAAAAAAEQVM/KNuZtTt4HvQP7Tz71g-YH_SOkvEzSjanACNcBGAsYHQ/s1750/CANADA%2B%25283%2529.jpg

Blast that man who introduces facts rather than rely on husarhetoric... / sarc.

Certainly I'm seeing large amounts of delayed treatments for necessary interventions, added to the ill-health of those separated by time and distance, plus e.g. mariners who've not been allowed ashore for months and not seen their families for over a year, to be very sure that the consequences of the political control decisions have been lethal and morbid indeed. Yet, people keep telling us we had to lockdown the village to save just a few of the villagers, even though we burned most of the villagers' lives and incomes and careers and relationships to the ground for the rest of their lives.

husaberg
18th January 2021, 17:13
Blast that man who introduces facts rather than rely on husarhetoric... / sarc.

Certainly I'm seeing large amounts of delayed treatments for necessary interventions, added to the ill-health of those separated by time and distance, plus e.g. mariners who've not been allowed ashore for months and not seen their families for over a year, to be very sure that the consequences of the political control decisions have been lethal and morbid indeed. Yet, people keep telling us we had to lockdown the village to save just a few of the villagers, even though we burned most of the villagers' lives and incomes and careers and relationships to the ground for the rest of their lives.

Maybe you would like to calculate the number of people that die each year of preventable diseases due to lies spread about vaccine safety.
Or do you not have a press release from the national party to claim as being your own.
https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/188175-The-journey-that-COVID-19-will-take-us-on?p=1131172984#post1131172984

R650R
24th January 2021, 10:03
As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????


Well I was right, mainstream press and health fept admit we never got to zero cases as shown by my maths. You’d think a decent journalist would have spotted that by now for themselves...
I do live how they just conveniently dismiss the undetected cases and the lovely miracle they didn’t cause other outbreaks..,,


https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/coronavirus/300212154/zero-cases-the-coronavirus-milestone-that-was-actually-probably-a-myth