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Naki Rat
16th July 2020, 17:57
Some worrying reports coming out from these guys regarding limitations of immunity from COVID and the implications this has for both herd immunity and immunisation strategies.


https://youtu.be/JfDpuouYUFc

Gremlin
16th July 2020, 18:22
That came up a while back, while we were locked down, that some had caught covid for the 2nd time.

R650R
16th July 2020, 18:43
None of that matters under contact tracing bullshit.

All you need is the symptoms to wreck your life or be near someone with symptoms.
Then you must go into isolation for two weeks, unable to earn money to pay your mortgage or other bills.
Come out and nothing stopping you from repeating scenario.
The only thing I’m worried about catching is a Bluetooth tag.

Funny thing is presence of antibodies used to mean you’d had something’s and the body had killed it, now it means you’ve got something, such Orwellian doublespeak of highest order.

Paul in NZ
16th July 2020, 20:05
Theres a LOT we dont know about this virus... and I mean a LOT

Its pointless laying out why I'm saying that BUT there are actually people that have had it 3 times... Each time it get worse like Dengue fever..

Make of it what you will - I'm old and past caring...

FJRider
16th July 2020, 21:08
Theres a LOT we dont know about this virus... and I mean a LOT

Its pointless laying out why I'm saying that BUT there are actually people that have had it 3 times... Each time it get worse like Dengue fever..

Make of it what you will - I'm old and past caring...

Is it that people get it more than once ... or does it gets weak enough in the body ... that it fails to give a positive result to a test .. ???

Naki Rat
16th July 2020, 21:51
Is it that people get it more than once ... or does it gets weak enough in the body ... that it fails to give a positive result to a test .. ???That was my concern. It seems like 3 months is the period when reinfection occurs and if it's coming from within past cases such as a latent remaining viral presence that doesn't bode well for our COVID free status considering we have about 1,500 'recovered' cases (https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-current-situation/covid-19-current-cases) and many of those must be getting to about the 3 month mark since the virus was active.

Paul in NZ
17th July 2020, 09:14
Is it that people get it more than once ... or does it gets weak enough in the body ... that it fails to give a positive result to a test .. ???

Yes - the same thought occurred to me as well... But - theres a lot we don't know about this thing..

Katman
17th July 2020, 10:08
It appears there's still plenty of fear to be wrung out of the public yet.

Paul in NZ
17th July 2020, 11:43
It appears there's still plenty of fear to be wrung out of the public yet.

Meaning we shouldn't be concerned about covid-19 or something else?

Katman
17th July 2020, 11:47
Meaning we shouldn't be concerned about covid-19 or something else?

It seems some people just love to live in fear Paul.

I'm just not one of them.

Paul in NZ
17th July 2020, 12:06
It seems some people just love to live in fear Paul.

I'm just not one of them.

Oh OK... Fear is one thing.

Informed precautions are another... Its a bit like riding a motorcycle. The more knowledge you have the safer you are and there is a LOT still to learn about this virus.. That's not fear - that's common sense.

Katman
17th July 2020, 12:22
The more knowledge you have the safer you are and there is a LOT still to learn about this virus.. That's not fear - that's common sense.

And I don't disagree with that.

I suspect though, the media are more intent on fostering fear rather than knowledge.

Paul in NZ
17th July 2020, 12:34
And I don't disagree with that.

I suspect though, the media are more intent on fostering fear rather than knowledge.

Strangely I agree with you - The media are more concerned with their own stardom and making a good living and if fear does that - so be it... Sadly a lot of the media believe that they are the smartest people on the planet and the arbiters of all that is good and great. One week its all keep the borders open and save the economy and then its all why didn't you close the border sooner and oh by the way save the tourist industry and don't let anyone else in and don't borrow too much and... Mental...

Viking01
17th July 2020, 13:11
And I don't disagree with that.

I suspect though, the media are more intent on fostering fear rather than knowledge.

Maybe they are in good company :

https://www.globalresearch.ca/european-commission-adopts-gmo-vaccine-combat-non-existent-covid-19-virus/5718670

R650R
18th July 2020, 19:29
It’s the first tactically aware virus.

It knows to not go to PaknSave, Mega10, BLM protests, Amazon parcel centres or logistics workers.

It only likes to hang out on Cruise ships, resthomes, beaches, weddings, funerals, small businesses, cafes and pubs. It’s like the virus doesn’t like free speech as it seems to habit the places where there’s the least amount of govt/corporate control of environment.

Never mind the whole data set is obscured.
As fear builds more tests are conducted so obviously more allegedly positive (the PCR test is known for false positives and the inventor went to his grave regretting what he had unleashed) cases are reported.
And of its so contagious a mouth swab or cough/sneeze on a petty dish should be sufficient as in testing for previous pathogens.
Funny how the test they have used is the perfect technique if you wanted to jam a RFID chip where the victim could never remove it themselves...

pritch
18th July 2020, 21:43
As fear builds more tests are conducted so obviously more allegedly positive (the PCR test is known for false positives and the inventor went to his grave regretting what he had unleashed) cases are reported.


That's the exact opposite of the situation as I've read it repeatedly. The tests produce too many false negatives.

Your comment looks close to the Donald Trump theory of pandemic response, "If we do less testing we'll have less cases."

Using that logic no worried teen should ever do a pregnancy test.

R650R
30th August 2020, 14:09
That's the exact opposite of the situation as I've read it repeatedly. The tests produce too many false negatives.

Your comment looks close to the Donald Trump theory of pandemic response, "If we do less testing we'll have less cases."

Using that logic no worried teen should ever do a pregnancy test.

Do you have any evidence of the false negatives?

Love the teen analogy as pregnancy testing doesn’t stop young ladies from getting pregnant or getting pregnant again lol

pritch
1st September 2020, 13:30
Do you have any evidence of the false negatives?


Type "US Covid tests: false negatives" into the search engine of your choice. There should be heaps. One scary item mentions that including both false negatives, and false positives, the error rate is about 50%.

You need to mention the US because Trump decided the US should manufacture their own tests rather than use what everybody else uses.
Subsequently it seems, Trump's tests are as accurate as a coin toss.

Bonez
2nd September 2020, 19:29
Type "US Covid tests: false negatives" into the search engine of your choice. There should be heaps. One scary item mentions that including both false negatives, and false positives, the error rate is about 50%.

You need to mention the US because Trump decided the US should manufacture their own tests rather than use what everybody else uses.
Subsequently it seems, Trump's tests are as accurate as a coin toss.pritch have you not learnt anything the four years of posting dribble in the 2016 US presidential Election thread?

It is you, the accuser, who is to supply credible and verifiable sources not the rest of the KB members to go down that rabit hole.

HTH

Viking01
13th October 2020, 14:31
https://www.france24.com/en/20201013-doubts-over-immunity-after-man-gets-covid-second-time-with-more-severe-symptoms

SPman
17th October 2020, 16:58
Yes, people have caught it twice, and apparently it's more severe 2nd time around.....

MaxMax
15th January 2021, 04:57
Yes, people have caught it twice, and apparently it's more severe 2nd time around.....

Yes, this is the worst thing. People, who have just recovered, have nothing to worry about only for 3 or 4 months (I don't remember exactly). Then they can get Coronavirus again. I do hope the vaccination will solve this problem.

Calix Lee
20th January 2021, 17:32
The vaccine has an issue, and there's a new variant that's what the number of cases spikes up. I guess our safety really depends on us.

_Shrek_
31st July 2021, 11:54
Yes, this is the worst thing. People, who have just recovered, have nothing to worry about only for 3 or 4 months (I don't remember exactly). Then they can get Coronavirus again. I do hope the vaccination will solve this problem.

no it doesn't front line worker who's been vaccinated tests positive a month later, so no point in getting the vaccination unless you really want it, comes down to choice

FJRider
31st July 2021, 16:28
Yes, this is the worst thing. People, who have just recovered, have nothing to worry about only for 3 or 4 months (I don't remember exactly). Then they can get Coronavirus again. I do hope the vaccination will solve this problem.

The only certainty in life ... is death. With or without (or by) Covid.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/06/global-rollout-of-vaccines-is-no-longer-a-guarantee-of-victory-over-covid-19

pritch
31st July 2021, 18:28
no it doesn't front line worker who's been vaccinated tests positive a month later, so no point in getting the vaccination unless you really want it, comes down to choice

Information from the front lines suggests otherwise. People who have been vaccinated can get COVID but are not badly affected. There really is no choice, if you want to keep yourself and your family safe, you will get vaccinated.

There is a huge amount of bullshit about the vaccinations. At this stage we have no choice but to trust the experts.

I've posted this JPG before but it fits here.

F5 Dave
1st August 2021, 08:58
Today we are going to do a refresher in maths for the hard of thinking.

Let's say we have 100 people who get vaccinated with a 97% effective vaccine. Then expose them to the virus.

Ok I know this is difficult. Can you make a prediction of how many will likely get sick?.

a) no one, - if the vaccine worked
b) all of them because the fuckn vaccine doesnt work I read on the internet
c) my brain hurts, cant I just go back to spouting misinformation?

husaberg
1st August 2021, 13:29
Today we are going to do a refresher in maths for the hard of thinking.

Let's say we have 100 people who get vaccinated with a 97% effective vaccine. Then expose them to the virus.

Ok I know this is difficult. Can you make a prediction of how many will likely get sick?.

a) no one, - if the vaccine worked
b) all of them because the fuckn vaccine doesnt work I read on the internet
c) my brain hurts, cant I just go back to spouting misinformation?

You forget anti vax math is different
A Test used wide wide for all sorts of disease that has 99% success in accuracy detecting it, is great and to be trusted, unless used for detecting a disease that can be vaccinated against then it's not accurate enough.

Natural immunity
If you wanted to gain immunity to measles, for example, by contracting the disease, you would face a 1 in 500 chance of death from your symptoms. In contrast, the number of people who have had severe allergic reactions from an MMR vaccine, is less than one-in-one million. but for antivaxers the risk of vacination is to large..

The vaccine reduces the risk of transmission, probably by 60 to 80 percent. no one claims its 100%
but they are concerned about a research paper written by a convicted fraudster that has been 100% debunked shown to used made up data and never able to be repeated for 2 decades.

Covid has a mortality rate of 1-3% that's very low for an antivaxer to warrant vaccination. Yet somehow a death rate to vaccines of 1000 times lower is too high to risk vaccinating.

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/d2/86/6d/d2866d3a3247378d43846149ff23e891.jpghttps://i.pinimg.com/474x/16/dd/8c/16dd8cf6c79eeb2c230edb7d224fb797.jpghttps://ahseeit.com//king-include/uploads/2021/06/uadxf0u-4682318461.jpghttps://64.media.tumblr.com/415b8181d087ab4cd1979d3d56e41228/042deec78dd90553-58/s640x960/47df453322ab5aec81aec60d9e196090ef8deea7.jpghttps://ahseeit.com//king-include/uploads/2021/06/tumblr_l_353493150183432-3579722511.jpg

_Shrek_
2nd August 2021, 09:54
Information from the front lines suggests otherwise. People who have been vaccinated can get COVID but are not badly affected. There really is no choice, if you want to keep yourself and your family safe, you will get vaccinated.

There is a huge amount of bullshit about the vaccinations. At this stage we have no choice but to trust the experts.

I've posted this JPG before but it fits here.

still comes down to choice pritch

mashman
2nd August 2021, 15:02
Today we are going to do a refresher in maths for the hard of thinking.

Let's say we have 100 people who get vaccinated with a 97% effective vaccine. Then expose them to the virus.

Ok I know this is difficult. Can you make a prediction of how many will likely get sick?.

a) no one, - if the vaccine worked
b) all of them because the fuckn vaccine doesnt work I read on the internet
c) my brain hurts, cant I just go back to spouting misinformation?

I know, let's look at some of the latest studies, yes, published on the internet, and see what they're saying...

Pfizer vaccine’s efficacy declined from 96% to 84% four months after second dose, company reports (https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1920)

"During the blinded, controlled period of the study, 15 vaccine recipients and 14 placebo recipients died. In the open label period, three Pfizer recipients and two original placebo recipients who received Pfizer after unblinding died. Investigators concluded that none of these deaths was considered to be related to the vaccine."

husaberg
2nd August 2021, 16:16
I know, let's look at some of the latest studies, yes, published on the internet, and see what they're saying...

Pfizer vaccine’s efficacy declined from 96% to 84% four months after second dose, company reports (https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n1920)

"During the blinded, controlled period of the study, 15 vaccine recipients and 14 placebo recipients died. In the open label period, three Pfizer recipients and two original placebo recipients who received Pfizer after unblinding died. Investigators concluded that none of these deaths was considered to be related to the vaccine."

You do realize that vaccines' efficacy declines as a virus mutates. Alsoand that 84 percent is a lot higher than 0%. 84% higher in fact.
The delta variant of the coronavirus now accounts for 82% of new COVID-19 cases in the U.S.


A study published in the New England Journal of Medicine on July 21 by Public Health England, for example, found that after the two recommended doses, the effectiveness of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine in preventing symptomatic disease in the U.K. fell only slightly, to 88.0% against delta from 93.7% against the alpha variant — another more contagious version of the virus, known as B.1.1.7, that previously predominated in the country. The authors, however, noted that a larger decline and lower effectiveness was observed after a single dose, underscoring the importance of receiving both immunizations.

In an unpublished study that has not yet been peer reviewed, the U.K. health agency also found the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine was very effective at preventing hospitalization with the delta variant, reducing the risk by 94% after one dose and by 96% after two.

Other countries have reported similar preliminary results. In an unpublished study from Ontario, Canada, researchers estimated the effectiveness of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine against symptomatic infection with delta to be 87% after two doses, while a report from Scotland, published in the British medical journal the Lancet, pegged the figure at 79% for infection with delta.

The Canadian report also found that one dose of the Moderna vaccine was 70% effective in preventing symptomatic disease and 95% effective in preventing hospitalization or death; there were too few COVID-19 cases among the vaccinated to estimate the effectiveness after two doses.


Meanwhile, in Israel, the health ministry released preliminary, unpublished information on July 5 suggesting that with the rise of the delta variant in the nation, the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine was now 64% effective against infection or symptomatic illness, but still 93% effective in preventing serious illness and hospitalization.

US Flu vaccine effectiveness
by start year
2004 10%
2005 21%
2006 52%
2007 37%
2008 41%
2009 56%
2010 60%
2011 47%
2012 49%
2013 52%
2014 19%
2015 48%
2016 40%
2017 38%
2018 29%
2019 39%

the MMR vaccine is only about 88% effective against Mumps polio vaccine is generally only about 90% effective, chicken pox only about 88% the HPVis only about 90%
these are common levels of effectiveness in real world situations.



You also realize that if an equal amount of people died that received a placebo it means nothing. that one of the reasons to have placebos in trails
also, as investigators concluded that none of these deaths was considered to be related to the vaccine let's assume nothing was related to the vaccine, so why add the deaths.
Do you know more?

As predicted only a page ago
Mashy always delivers
349428

pritch
2nd August 2021, 16:30
still comes down to choice pritch

It may come down to the choice to stay at home. People who choose not to vaccinate will not be able to go anywhere.

R650R
3rd August 2021, 10:35
Today we are going to do a refresher in maths for the hard of thinking.

Let's say we have 100 people who get vaccinated with a 97% effective vaccine. Then expose them to the virus.

Ok I know this is difficult. Can you make a prediction of how many will likely get sick?.

a) no one, - if the vaccine worked
b) all of them because the fuckn vaccine doesnt work I read on the internet
c) my brain hurts, cant I just go back to spouting misinformation?

Oh goodo, now for some advanced maths....

As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????

husaberg
3rd August 2021, 12:00
Oh goodo, now for some advanced maths....

As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????


from 8 months ago....
You have tried this same troll before the exact same post in fact as justification why we never needed a lockdown its was especially stupid then, Guess what? it's still stupid now.

As of Dec 4 2020

1,298,455 Total tests

2219 positive test results

139 (estimated based on 6.3% in previous data of 1600/80 approx) Hospitalised

25 dead

WHY is it SO HARD to find the data on how many people in NZ NEEDED hospital treatment for this.
This number has to be actively suppressed as ALL the other data comes up very EASY in searches.
The answer is so people don’t ask WHY are we scared.
Can you imagine a Pandemic being declared of the PM said oh by the way 93% of you that actually manage to contract the virus won’t need to go to hospital just stay home and rest.
Nothing else matters the maths tells the story, especially post lockdown any new cases should have spread massively as everyone suddenly enjoyed a watered down form of freedom.
And just think of all those Asymptomatic cases in the 3,800,000 people that have NOT been tested...
There should be another 6600 odd positive cases, another 400 extra in hospital and another 75 people dead, where are they????


https://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/188175-The-journey-that-COVID-19-will-take-us-on/page37?p=1131177522#post1131177522

you followed it up with this silly post

Your odds of dying from Covid in NZ is about the same as winning Powerball....
People dream of winning powerball, actively visit known powerball superspreader hot zones twice a week in hope of winning...

Meanwhile about 6 times as many people die in drink drive car crashes.
We even have mass random surveillance testing for that too, typically about 1.5-2% are ‘ infected’ with the influence of alcohol.....
Would we tolerate say a 24hr lockdown every time you bought a beer at bar?
Or after your night at the bar you don’t leave through the front door, a govt agent escorts you to a ‘quarantine ‘ facility which you can’t leave for 24 hrs.
Just imagine that, we would ABSOLUTELY save 150 lives a year
The govt will NEVER do that so why all this crap with the virus where the potential victim has a 93% chance of not even needing hospital treatment...

then this wee ripper

The media are tripping over themselves trying to solve the mystery of why Africans aren't dying from covid as badly as the west.
Africans routinely take a cheap safe anti malaria drug invented in n 1960's called hydroxychloroquine....
Scooby Doo would solve that puzzle faster

F5 Dave
3rd August 2021, 13:08
And trying to use an argument like that in isolation of info from the WHOLE REST OF THE FUCKING WORLD.

pritch
3rd August 2021, 20:18
R650R's argument is up there with the argument the self interested arseholes use, those who say that we should not have had all this fuss over 26 deaths. it's almost as if they want more deaths to justify the shut downs. They just can't credit that the shut downs worked.

husaberg
3rd August 2021, 21:33
R650R's argument is up there with the argument the self interested arseholes use, those who say that we should not have had all this fuss over 26 deaths. it's almost as if they want more deaths to justify the shut downs. They just can't credit that the shut downs worked.

pretty sure he said exactly that, in essence that we only had a few ases here and only a few deaths si there was no need for a lockdown;)

MaxMax
6th December 2021, 22:34
As far as I know, natural immunity to Covid-19 can decay within about 90 days. Immunity from COVID-19 vaccines has been shown to last longer. According to Online Pharmacy (https://www.canadadrugsdirect.com/online-pharmacy), both Pfizer and Moderna reported strong vaccine protection for at least six months. Older people and people with many serious medical conditions are the most likely to experience lingering COVID-19 symptoms, but even young, otherwise healthy people can feel unwell for weeks to months after infection. My grandmother was 76 when she caught Covid. She felt terrible, had a fever, pneumonia, and couldn't recover for more than three months. After that hse started experiencing heart issues she didn't have before. I understand that she is not a young lady, but she is active and leads a healthy lifestyle, and still, the consequences are irreversible.

R650R
23rd January 2022, 09:56
Listening to an American contractor last night. He’s working well into night on construction project, seemsceveryone in his workforce and family has had covid at least two or three times. No ones wearing masks and his wife is still working a machine but he’s gonna drop her off at motel soon. He has set up a seperate smoko room for the one she feeling ill....
It seems like they are under tremendous pressure to keep working thanks to How USA legal system is he will get sued out of existance if projects delayed....
At one point he says the latest version feels like flu and cold combined but worse and same as here different people are affected in different ways...
So yeah from horses mouth there definitely can catch it more than once...

george formby
23rd January 2022, 10:02
Listening to an American contractor last night. He’s working well into night on construction project, seemsceveryone in his workforce and family has had covid at least two or three times. No ones wearing masks and his wife is still working a machine but he’s gonna drop her off at motel soon. He has set up a seperate smoko room for the one she feeling ill....
It seems like they are under tremendous pressure to keep working thanks to How USA legal system is he will get sued out of existance if projects delayed....
At one point he says the latest version feels like flu and cold combined but worse and same as here different people are affected in different ways...
So yeah from horses mouth there definitely can catch it more than once...

It is tenacious.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jan/21/the-uk-student-nurse-who-has-caught-covid-four-times