Close call....

[johcar]

Commuting home on Friday and a dickhead in a blue tradie ute deliberately tries to take me out.


https://youtu.be/N-0A5slm_uw

The video shows:


he's not indicating to change lanes
there's no opening in the lane to our left
the vehicle in front is not braking (therefore not an evasive measure)


If I dropped my throttle hand down at the car's closest point, it would have rested on his fender.

I encounter idiots on the road every day, but because I'm looking out for them, I have survived a number of years motorcycle commuting in Auckland and its motorways.

Generally, the issue is carelessness on the part of the cager.

But this one seemed to be deliberate.

If anyone can decipher his rego I would be very pleased to pass it on to the Constabulary (along with the video evidence)...

[R650R]

Right at the start of your video you can see a huge sign indicating what lane people to need to be in for the next exit....
This is usually where most people that suddenly realise oh fuck I’m in the wrong lane are going to make a rapid lane change possibly unindicated, RED FLAG #1

Red Flag 2 is the twilight lighting conditions, many people’s eyes struggle at this changeover point some prob still got shades on and all he can prob see is lots of headlights in his mirror.

Red Flag 3 is the age of the ute. A vehicle of this vintage cares not for a few minor low speed bumps and scrapes likely driven by someone on lower socioeconomic scale so likely lower education, less observant and more likely substance impaired...

Red Flag 4 turn off your hazards official police advice as you just confuse other motorists. Did you consider that perhaps he only can see clearly your right indicator and thinks you or a car are going to pull in behind him making a gap....

Red Flag 5 your speed differential is on the high side and the very constant speed says to me your overlyvrekaxed and not fully analysing each car your passing...

You have no case at all, very much looks like your on right side of white line so your in HIS lane overtaking on left. Swallow it as a wake up call and move on. Police will likely ticket you $150 improper manoevoure.

[Berries]

Perhaps he was confused by a bike coming up behind him with its hazard lights on so turned to look over his shoulder to see what it was towing?

Or sending a text, or eating a pie, or checking his make up.

Like you said, shit happens all the time on a motorbike, I wouldn't get worked up about it.

[nerrrd]

Yeah here's my perspective, while the car on the left was level with the ute, there was space behind it, so he/she may have been moving early into that, Auckland drivers do tend to elbow their way around these days.

So not a clearcut attempt to impede you would be my call. I doubt the police would be interested in following it up, and if you did involve them as mentioned they might decide it's easier just to ping you for (technically) undertaking cars in the same lane and using your hazards inappropriately.

[Jeff Sichoe]

It did look like he swerved a little to either scare or potentially graze you. But it's hard to tell.

[Laava]

Now this is what I call a close call!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-daily-news/news/125432355/watch-truck-driver-captures-near-headon-collision-on-blind-corner-of-taranaki-gorge

[Berries]

Bloody truck drivers.

[Swoop]

Riding with hazard lights on... :pinch: :facepalm:

[release_the_bees]

Now this is what I call a close call!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-daily-news/news/125432355/watch-truck-driver-captures-near-headon-collision-on-blind-corner-of-taranaki-gorgeI saw that. I've certainly ridden that bit of road a bit too enthusiastically over the years. Good job that it wasn't whenever that footage was taken.

Sent from my SM-G965F using Tapatalk

[caspernz]

I doubt the police would be interested in following it up, and if you did involve them as mentioned they might decide it's easier just to ping you for (technically) undertaking cars in the same lane and using your hazards inappropriately.

What he said ^^ is about all I saw.

Differential speed is kinda hard to tell, as it looks faster on camera than it feels doing it.

[Navy Boy]

Now this is what I call a close call!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-daily-news/news/125432355/watch-truck-driver-captures-near-headon-collision-on-blind-corner-of-taranaki-gorge

Blimey! A shame someone didn't get the car's registration number. A good job the biker was well to the left of their lane.:facepalm:

[Hoonicorn]

The reflection on the plate makes it a challenge to see it clearly. The vehicle is distinct though, so keep an eye out for it in future. This should be an example to riders who go 80 while lane splitting that this random BS happens.

There's a view that you shouldn't attribute something to malice that you can attribute to incompetence. If he was intending on hitting you, he wouldn't get far in rush hour traffic, and he'd have to be looking in his mirrors to see you coming.

As other people have said, he was probably pushing into the left lane. Some people just seem totally random with their lane changes and he probably didn't even think a bike could be coming up the middle - even if you were flashing your lights - some drivers don't even notice emergency vehicles lights and sirens.

[rocketman1]

Commuting home on Friday and a dickhead in a blue tradie ute deliberately tries to take me out.


https://youtu.be/N-0A5slm_uw

If anyone can decipher his rego I would be very pleased to pass it on to the Constabulary (along with the video evidence)...


You are lane splitting a lot faster than I figure I safely would. Just saying.
In my opinion there should be a law against changing lanes continually on motorways, whether in a car or a motorbike.
I rarely use the motorways, but when I do I am amazed at what I call fn idiots in cars swerving in and out of lanes trying to get a few cars further up the road, like it was game of dodgems.
You should only really change lane to get to an off ramp IMHO.

[jellywrestler]

You should only really change lane to get to an off ramp IMHO.

It's good to see someone of your advanced years is able to adapt and cope to using a computer, well done.

[R650R]

I rarely use the motorways...

Thank god for that.

There are a number of reasons to necessitate slightly more frequent lane changes. Putting distance between you and a high risk feral, inattentive or accident imminent driver. The biggest one of all though is avoiding the brake pedal dancer who frequent cries wolf without their brake lights....

[mcshaz]

Red Flag 3 is the age of the ute. A vehicle of this vintage cares not for a few minor low speed bumps and scrapes likely driven by someone on lower socioeconomic scale so likely lower education, less observant and more likely substance impaired...


I realise the comment is likely, and maybe I am biased because my cage is a cheap old bomb (which equals more cash to spend on bikes:eek:!). We all develop confirmation biases, but I am usually more wary of people driving flash new Audis than old utes when it comes to being an aggressive & thoughtless dickhead. Best point is every other road user is out to kill us (either intentionally or through incompetence - it doesn't really matter at the moment you are flying over the bonnet) until proven otherwise.

[onearmedbandit]

. Best point is every other road user is out to kill us (either intentionally or through incompetence - it doesn't really matter at the moment you are flying over the bonnet) until proven otherwise.

I totally disagree with this thought process. It creates an 'us vs them' situation. No one sets out to kill another road user. Instead I see it as 'they haven't seen me so I need to be in control of the situation'.

[Racing Dave]

I totally disagree with this thought process. It creates an 'us vs them' situation. No one sets out to kill another road user. Instead I see it as 'they haven't seen me so I need to be in control of the situation'.

Hear, hear!

[mcshaz]

I totally disagree with this thought process. It creates an 'us vs them' situation.

regarding us vs them - I meant every other road user, bikes included (I have had a bike coming the other way get past me on the inside of a left hand corner once), so actually it is me vs everyone else - no us.

As to intentionally, I agree it is a minority, but I disagree with none. Just the other week I had someone at Anawhata road hammer into T junction while looking straight at my eyes and tracking me for the preceding several seconds, making me pull hard on the anchors despite me having clear right of way, and as they accelerated up to speed give me the finger out the back window (I didn't beep them or rev bomb them, so the finger was just confirmation they saw me). Car full of 17-19 year old lads. I am sure they will eventually grow up, but for now, they were intentionally using the fact that I would come out worse in an accident to avoid waiting another few seconds and obey the road code - something I am sure they would not have done had I been a Mack truck. Similarly we have all seen people look in their mirror intentionally close lane filtering gaps. They may not think the potential consequences through, so to be pedantic "human factors mean that it is harder for the brains of many drivers to see and register our presence on the road. Additionally many road users are incompetent and don't even look in the first place and some are intentionally out to impede our progress and/or dangerously ignore right of way without regard for the consequences, including fatal consequences".

To go more extreme, generally arguments like "No one sets out to kill another road user" will always fall down to extreme and rare examples. I have been in this situation many years ago - that is the police (in NSW) advised me in the strongest possible terms that I not ride my bike until after a particular person was incarcerated.

[onearmedbandit]

I didn't think I would need to explain there would be rare exceptions. It's like saying everyone is out to mug you because there is a chance that one in a 100,000 people might, no one says that. If people believed that or thought like that no good would come from it.

My point remains, I don't think adopting the mentality of 'everyone is out to kill you' is the right mentality.

[Stylo]

I didn't think I would need to explain there would be rare exceptions. It's like saying everyone is out to mug you because there is a chance that one in a 100,000 people might, no one says that. If people believed that or thought like that no good would come from it.

My point remains, I don't think adopting the mentality of 'everyone is out to kill you' is the right mentality.

I wouldn't have posted the original complaint because I would be sitting behind the traffic rather trhan filter through. Lane splitting on my Hayabusa would be a 'never do' in my book.

Just saying..

[pritch]

My point remains, I don't think adopting the mentality of 'everyone is out to kill you' is the right mentality.

I've always read that there are better ways of looking after yourself than that. If you aren't aware of the others though that's certainly better than nothing. When I was riding a moped to work it was common for people ot pull out in front of me while looking directly at me. It would be entirely possible to believe they were out to get you.

One of the alternative approaches is to keep clear space around you. If nothing comes into that space nothing can hit you. I can't recall the suggested distance - it was a long time ago, maybe a metre and a half or 2m? If the guy doing the filtering was using that approach he would not have had a problem.

Another approach is to watch for anything unusual. Most of the traffic will flow normally and unless you do something silly there is minimal danger. Anybody doing anything different should set off alarm bells.

I might have a look in my library tomorrow and see what I can find?

[Motig]

So you speed between the lanes and you expect a sympathy vote. Well you won't get one here.

[FJRider]

So you speed between the lanes and you expect a sympathy vote. Well you won't get one here.

Over and above the potential safety issues involved ... there is some confusion on whether or not lane splitting is actually legal on New Zealand roads. The short answer is ... it depends. Lane splitting falls within the overtaking rules as found in the Land Transport (Road User) Rule 2004.

There is not a simple yes or no to the legality of the practice. Just because you can ... doesn't always mean you should. Or always legal/illegal.

https://www.legislation.govt.nz/regulation/public/2004/0427/latest/DLM303050.html

2.8 Passing on left

(1) A driver must not pass or attempt to pass on the left of another vehicle moving in the same direction except in accordance with this clause.

(2)In any case in which the movement referred to subclause (1) may be made,—

(a) The 2 vehicles must be in different lanes; or

(b) The overtaken vehicle must be stationary or its driver must have given or be giving the prescribed signal of that driver’s intention to turn right

This bit takes a bit of thought though ...

(3) If the roadway is marked in lanes, the driver may make the movement referred in subclause (1) only if the driver’s vehicle does not encroach on a lane that is unavailable to a driver.

But the basic fact when Lane splitting ... you are moving faster than the general speed of the traffic flow. You stand out. You get noticed by other vehicle drivers ... often ones with the red and blue flashing stuff on the roof. They may ignore you ... usually because they have another (more important) issue they have to deal with FIRST. Not always just because you are riding within the law ... and/or ... riding safely.

And as already mentioned ... those tin-top drivers you are passing ... don't like it. Tough you say ... well ... it can be tough if (for ANY reason) ... you make contact with any other vehicle. The difference between accidental and intentional is hard to prove in a court of law.

Even a careless use charge found proven in court should be counted as a win. Getting it TO court is a start though.


And stop using the Hazard lights ... the improper use of Hazard lights IS a traffic offense. And it attracts more attention to YOU than it should ... by the wrong people.

Think about who those "Wrong" people are ... or could be.

[onearmedbandit]

I've always read that there are better ways of looking after yourself than that. If you aren't aware of the others though that's certainly better than nothing. When I was riding a moped to work it was common for people ot pull out in front of me while looking directly at me. It would be entirely possible to believe they were out to get you.

One of the alternative approaches is to keep clear space around you. If nothing comes into that space nothing can hit you. I can't recall the suggested distance - it was a long time ago, maybe a metre and a half or 2m? If the guy doing the filtering was using that approach he would not have had a problem.

Another approach is to watch for anything unusual. Most of the traffic will flow normally and unless you do something silly there is minimal danger. Anybody doing anything different should set off alarm bells.

I might have a look in my library tomorrow and see what I can find?

Being aware is key. I guess my stance on the 'out to kill you' approach is that I've seen it lead to road rage over simple minor mistakes that really were not dangerous and didn't warrant that response. At the end of the day we all have to share the road and if we can do that amicably rather than with division and anger then that can only be a good thing.

[FJRider]

Being aware is key. I guess my stance on the 'out to kill you' approach is that I've seen it lead to road rage over simple minor mistakes that really were not dangerous and didn't warrant that response. At the end of the day we all have to share the road and if we can do that amicably rather than with division and anger then that can only be a good thing.

I've noticed that the people that are pushing the boundaries of "Safe" riding ... are often the first to rage about another drivers "Dangerous" driving when there is a close call ... Go figure ...

[Navy Boy]

What he said ^^ is about all I saw.

Differential speed is kinda hard to tell, as it looks faster on camera than it feels doing it.

Having taken a look at the video I'm not convinced that this was a deliberate act.

Other factors to note are:

1. Use of hazards - Just say 'No!'

2. Differential speed - That is always key when filtering. Use the 30/30 rule - That is don't filter when the traffic is going faster than 30Km/hr and don't let the difference between your speed and those around you be greater than 30Km/hr.

I was told that some years ago on a Ride Forever course and it has served me well.

Putting the issue of legality to one side - I have filtered on AKL's motorways many times and it was always a case of 'If in doubt don't do it', as with any city environment. :(

[FJRider]

... My point remains, I don't think adopting the mentality of 'everyone is out to kill you' is the right mentality.

Is the "I've been doing it for years with no issues ... what's the problem .. ??" attitude ... the correct way to look at it as well .. ??

[R650R]

I totally disagree with this thought process. It creates an 'us vs them' situation. No one sets out to kill another road user. Instead I see it as 'they haven't seen me so I need to be in control of the situation'.

You’d like the zen road rage series filmed in London....

While it might work for you the adversarial approach is prob quite s natural human instinct in Wolfpack scenario of crowded traffic and works with How our brains are hardwired. Most intelligent people can utilise this without letting it turn to road rage.

While this incident likely wasn’t on purpose many a trucker will tell you of cars DELIBERATELY obstructing them with little regard to their own safety or that of others. The classic brake check or other crap like in video below. And if people are willing to try it on with a truck you can bet they don’t give a flying feck about bikes or cars....


https://youtu.be/NI_HjmckL_w

[FJRider]

I've always read that there are better ways of looking after yourself than that. If you aren't aware of the others though that's certainly better than nothing. When I was riding a moped to work it was common for people to pull out in front of me while looking directly at me. It would be entirely possible to believe they were out to get you.

If you adopt the attitude that everybody could be after your wallet ... you make more effort to keep it safe. If you adopt the attitude everybody could be out to kill you with their car ... you spend more time and care looking out for them. What could be the downside to that .. ??


One of the alternative approaches is to keep clear space around you. If nothing comes into that space nothing can hit you. I can't recall the suggested distance - it was a long time ago, maybe a metre and a half or 2m? If the guy doing the filtering was using that approach he would not have had a problem.

We have a few stretches of road down here ... laughingly called motorways. Little chance of avoiding them and still get out of town quickly. They bear little similarities to Auckland's ones. But I keep a good spacing from other vehicles. They are not long enough to gain anything by filtering. On the open roads however ... I treat all vehicles within 100 meters of me as a possible threat. If they are behind me ... or in front ... it matters little. But I have had more issues with vehicles approaching from behind.


Another approach is to watch for anything unusual. Most of the traffic will flow normally and unless you do something silly there is minimal danger. Anybody doing anything different should set off alarm bells.

Try thinking ... "If THEY do anything silly" ... let the alarms go off ... ;)

[onearmedbandit]

As long as we are looking out for ourselves rather than relying on others then we're doing the right thing. Just with different approaches.

[onearmedbandit]

Is the "I've been doing it for years with no issues ... what's the problem .. ??" attitude ... the correct way to look at it as well .. ??

Not sure why you are asking that, but the obvious answer is no. And yes. Depending on accurate analysis of all factors.

[FJRider]

... And yes. Depending on accurate analysis of all factors.

I guess ... when your ass is sliding across the road ... it might be safe to say ... that your analysis of the situation wasn't that accurate (or complete).

Bugger eh .. !!!

[onearmedbandit]

I guess ... when your ass is sliding across the road ... it might be safe to say ... that your analysis of the situation wasn't that accurate (or complete).

Bugger eh .. !!!

Maintaining situational awareness reduces that. I just choose to do it by considering people haven't seen me rather than thinking everyone is out to kill me.

[FJRider]

Maintaining situational awareness reduces that. I just choose to do it by considering people haven't seen me rather than thinking everyone is out to kill me.

When people pull out in front of me ... giving me the finger (as some actually have) ... I think it would be safe to say there was NO doubt they DID see me.

When they are cocooned in their car ... they may not see me as great a threat to them ... as I see them to me.

The seemingly cynical attitude means I'm expecting issues to avoid. Reaction times are quicker if you were expecting trouble ... when it happens.

The TV advertisements (the ... my car, my rules one specifically) shows the issue is widespread. And the issue is about more than just speed. It's simply a lack of consideration for other road users ... an attitude which is becoming more and more widespread on NZ roads.

[onearmedbandit]

Cool. Enjoy your ride.

[R650R]

... my car my rules...

The woke lefties that made that add and other crap safety adds stuffed that one up. The correct line would have been "hey stop here I want to get out and walk".
And every my car my rules driver would be sweet with that... ok gtfo then :)
Same with the V8 fella he always hoofs it ad, those workers would all be liable under OSH for failing to report and correct his driving and letting the new guy ride with him.
And then there's the fake cop who says he's never seen anyone crash well, hilarious when it plays during motorway patrol and the narrator says amazingly everyone steps out uninjured !!

Just imagine the real lives saved if the money wasted on these scratchy and scratch extravaganzas was spent sweeping up loose gravel.

[TheDemonLord]

my 2c (I used to Filter everyday on that stretch of road - for nearly 4 years I think)

Whilst I disagree with everyone else on the use of Hazards (I always used mine when filtering - if the Law would allow me to add a Siren and giant rotating flashing light, I'd have had those on too)

And the Speed difference looks about what I'd typically do.

This is one of those times where it's 'if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen' - Yes, it's a dumb fuck move by the Ute, but when you Filter - that's the tradeoff you are making.

It would be nice to have the Law clarify filtering, however with the current Police/Government combination - I'd rather they leave it in the Grey Area than inevitably Fuck it up.

[Dean]

If you can’t stand the heat…

[FJRider]

my 2c (I used to Filter everyday on that stretch of road - for nearly 4 years I think)

As usual ... you have placed a overly high value on your own opinion ... :shifty:


Whilst I disagree with everyone else on the use of Hazards (I always used mine when filtering - if the Law would allow me to add a Siren and giant rotating flashing light, I'd have had those on too)

as above ... :shifty:


And the Speed difference looks about what I'd typically do.

as above ... :shifty:


This is one of those times where it's 'if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen' - Yes, it's a dumb fuck move by the Ute, but when you Filter - that's the tradeoff you are making.

When jail time is considered a "Hazard of the job" by many in the various criminal activities ... but it's really just another tradeoff ... Another tradeoff is sometimes making contact with the vehicle you are overtaking ... :shifty:


It would be nice to have the Law clarify filtering, however with the current Police/Government combination - I'd rather they leave it in the Grey Area than inevitably Fuck it up.

For "Clarification" purposes ... ;)

https://www.rideforever.co.nz/assets/Uploads/PDFs/ACC7009-RIDEFOREVER-Infosheet-FA.pdf

Note: 2.8 Passing on left
(1) A driver must not pass or attempt to pass on the left of another vehicle moving in the same direction except in accordance with this clause.

(2)In any case in which the movement referred to sub clause (1) may be made,

(a)the 2 vehicles must be in different lanes; or

(b) the overtaken vehicle must be stationary or its driver must have given or be giving the prescribed signal of that driver’s intention to turn right;

[FJRider]

Perhaps he was confused by a bike coming up behind him with its hazard lights on so turned to look over his shoulder to see what it was towing?

Confusion ... if the ute driver could only see the right indicator flashing on the motorcycle in his mirrors ... and then moved to the left to give him room ... ;)

[TheDemonLord]

As usual ... you have placed a overly high value on your own opinion ... :shifty:

as above ... :shifty:

as above ... :shifty:

Sure, but I ask how many times you've been filtering along that exact bit of road? Every weekday, come Wind, Rain or Shine for 5-6 years for me - I dare say I'm quite familiar


When jail time is considered a "Hazard of the job" by many in the various criminal activities ... but it's really just another tradeoff ... Another tradeoff is sometimes making contact with the vehicle you are overtaking ... :shifty:

I've had a fair few brown-stain moments on that very bit of road (probably the worst was someone opening the car Door. Car doors suddenly become very large and intimidating when they appear suddenly in your path.

Furious at the time, but that's life when you are filtering.


For "Clarification" purposes ... ;)

https://www.rideforever.co.nz/assets/Uploads/PDFs/ACC7009-RIDEFOREVER-Infosheet-FA.pdf

Note: 2.8 Passing on left
(1) A driver must not pass or attempt to pass on the left of another vehicle moving in the same direction except in accordance with this clause.

(2)In any case in which the movement referred to sub clause (1) may be made,

(a)the 2 vehicles must be in different lanes; or

(b) the overtaken vehicle must be stationary or its driver must have given or be giving the prescribed signal of that driver’s intention to turn right;

I'm aware of what the law is and that filtering is technically enabled by that (and the other bit about passing stationary 'parked' vehicles) however - just because it falls into a liberal reading of the current legislation, along with an acceptance by the Blue Hat Brigade of 'So long as you aren't doing it like a Twat, we'll turn a blind eye' - this is different from an explicitly allowed Filtering law (which in principle I'd be in favor of, I just don't trust the Government not to fuck it up).

The most common gripe for me is that when Filtering - the practical reality is that most drivers hug the right-hand side of the lane, thus the most 'Space' is in the left-hand side of the lane - which as you've rightly pointed out is illegal, but often is ignored so long as the rider isn't riding like a Twat. What it does mean however is should something happen, the law will side with the driver who likely caused the crash by not having appropriate situational awareness.

[FJRider]

Sure, but I ask how many times you've been filtering along that exact bit of road? Every weekday, come Wind, Rain or Shine for 5-6 years for me - I dare say I'm quite familiar

As stated in every post I make ... My Location is Paradise. And it's a long way from Auckland ... ;)

Will your 2 cents worth ... prove to be the value you place on your own life .. ?? ;)


I've had a fair few brown-stain moments on that very bit of road (probably the worst was someone opening the car Door. Car doors suddenly become very large and intimidating when they appear suddenly in your path.

Furious at the time, but that's life when you are filtering.

Tell me again how perfectly safe it is again ... ;)


I'm aware of what the law is and that filtering is technically enabled by that (and the other bit about passing stationary 'parked' vehicles) however - just because it falls into a liberal reading of the current legislation, along with an acceptance by the Blue Hat Brigade of 'So long as you aren't doing it like a Twat, we'll turn a blind eye' - this is different from an explicitly allowed Filtering law (which in principle I'd be in favor of, I just don't trust the Government not to fuck it up).

It would be generally ignored ... as it would put them and you at more risk trying to stop you and issuing you an infringement notice.

So ... you are holding out for a law to be introduced ... to legally allow something that is currently illegal on NZ roads ... ?? :pinch:


The most common gripe for me is that when Filtering - the practical reality is that most drivers hug the right-hand side of the lane, thus the most 'Space' is in the left-hand side of the lane - which as you've rightly pointed out is illegal, but often is ignored so long as the rider isn't riding like a Twat. What it does mean however is should something happen, the law will side with the driver who likely caused the crash by not having appropriate situational awareness.

Riding like a Twat ... is that riding in a manner deemed illegal in law ... or just in some way ... unsafer than the way you do it .. ?? ;)

If "not having appropriate situational awareness" means he didn't see you ... or didn't look for you ... perhaps it might be you not making yourself be seen. And as you admit ... as some of your actions on the motorway are currently illegal ... the Police will continue to side with the car drivers. Unless THEIR actions were seen to be illegal.

It HAS happened ... ;)