I'm looking for a Waikato engineering firm to build me a motorcycle lift

[MarkH]

Anyone know a suitable engineering company in the Waikato (Pref Morrinsville or Hamilton, but anywhere near could be worth knowing about)?

At the last Burt Munro rally (2021) I took a bunch of photos of this:

https://i.imgur.com/JrvJzBP.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/j2s1BC5.jpg

It looks fairly straight forward with an electric winch to lift the thing into place, then a couple of steel pins holds it there. An engineering firm near Invercargill made that one, but surely plenty of engineers should be able to make something like this. I don't want to tow a trailer, my motorhome is long enough as it is (11M). I can just start visiting engineering firms and ask if they can build me one, but if someone knows of a good place to approach it could save me some time.

[Laava]

Nice setup!

[MarkH]

Nice setup!

I looked at it and thought "that looks pretty simple" and I think that is the hallmark of a good design - achieving the desired result with a simple design.

I need to get a WoF on the motorbike, while they are doing it I might go for a walk and chat to the people in a couple of engineering shops.

I'll be picking up the motorhome in about 3 weeks and it will become my new full-time home, I definitely want my motorcycle handy. It would be good to be able to travel by motorcycle and not have to drive an 11M vehicle with a Cummins 5.9L turbo diesel engine (I think the motorhome weighs over 8T).

[nerrrd]

Depending on the bike that will be an interesting conversation with your insurer…but sounds like it would be an awesome set up.

[Kickaha]

Unless it's a larger bike there are far less complicated systems to use, FlashG has an easy to use towbar mounted system but that's only a 100kg trailbike

[Grumph]

It's going to need certification too. I worked for an outfit that did the towbar mounted ones and the paperwork to make them legal was not funny.

Design has to be by a properly qualified engineer from memory.

[Laava]

Has been my experience that it is easier to build and then get an engineers approval, than to ask them for a design in the first place. Bearing in mind that if you make it only strong enough for a gn125, it will fail.
Surely it would be relatively easy to have a very solid mount from the back of the chassis on both sides?

[HenryDorsetCase]

Has been my experience that it is easier to build and then get an engineers approval, than to ask them for a design in the first place. Bearing in mind that if you make it only strong enough for a gn125, it will fail.
Surely it would be relatively easy to have a very solid mount from the back of the chassis on both sides?

You have to be really careful about adding stuff to the chassis of these vehicles - a client had a motor home that turned out not to be compliant because the levelling jacks had been welded to the chassis instead of bolted and the design said they were to be bolted. Lot of drama at COF renewal time - I dont fully understand it but it meant his $300k motorhome was not going to be usable for some time. Not a happy camper.

[MarkH]

Unless it's a larger bike there are far less complicated systems to use, FlashG has an easy to use towbar mounted system but that's only a 100kg trailbike

My CRF1000L Africa Twin was already over 250kg before I added the crash bars & pannier racks, I'd be looking for a very strong bike lift that I could be confident in.

[MarkH]

It's going to need certification too. I worked for an outfit that did the towbar mounted ones and the paperwork to make them legal was not funny.

Design has to be by a properly qualified engineer from memory.

Yep, that's why I'm asking about who to go to - I really want someone that can do the job right.

[Grumph]

My CRF1000L Africa Twin was already over 250kg before I added the crash bars & pannier racks, I'd be looking for a very strong bike lift that I could be confident in.

If you're going to be carting something of that weight around, perhaps look at a trailer. Or alter the access to the interior to bring it on board.
That's really too much to hang off the arse of a camper.

[Laava]

Isn't it a small bus tho as opposed to a camper? That is a big bike tho too…

[MarkH]

Isn't it a small bus tho as opposed to a camper? That is a big bike tho too…

It isn't that small, you can get 7M buses like the Toyota Coaster and 9M buses from Isuzu, Hino, Nissan & Mitsubishi Fuso. My new motorhome is 11M and somewhere over 8 Tonne. The pics I showed from the Burt Munro were from the back of a 9M Mitsubishi Fuso bus, the owner told me that the engineer that built the lift had assured him that the lift would happily carry any motorbike and would be fine with 500kg on it.

How heavy an object can a lift on the back of a motorhome carry? Some of these examples look a LOT heavier than my bike: https://hydralift-usa.com

My bike may be fairly big, but the 1000cc twin motor would be less thirsty than the Cummins 5.9L turbo diesel on the motorhome, so I'd happily take the bike for a ride rather than move the motorhome if it was just a day ride. One example would be while the motorhome is parked in Hamilton I would ride the bike to Morrinsville to visit my dear old mum. To visit Cape Reinga I could drive the motorhome to Kaitaia and stay there, then ride the bike to Cape Reinga during a fine day - way more fun than trying to drive a large motorhome on those roads!

[Moi]

Just thinking aloud...
Does putting something like this on the back of the motorhome require certification?
What about insurance? You'd not want it to fall off the back in front of following traffic.

[onearmedbandit]

How heavy an object can a lift on the back of a motorhome carry? Some of these examples look a LOT heavier than my bike: https://hydralift-usa.com



Well see there's your problem. In America if it can be done it will be done. But in NZ if it can be done but looks too hard you'll get told why it shouldn't/couldn't be done.

[pete376403]

You have to be really careful about adding stuff to the chassis of these vehicles - a client had a motor home that turned out not to be compliant because the levelling jacks had been welded to the chassis instead of bolted and the design said they were to be bolted. Lot of drama at COF renewal time - I dont fully understand it but it meant his $300k motorhome was not going to be usable for some time. Not a happy camper.


From my time working at International Harvester - I enquired then why any attachments to the truck chassis had to be bolted or rivetted to the frames rather than welded - the answer was the frames were high tensile steel and the heat of welding would alter the steel enough to make it crack. This was a long time ago so welding techniques might have changed things.

[MarkH]

Well see there's your problem. In America if it can be done it will be done. But in NZ if it can be done but looks too hard you'll get told why it shouldn't/couldn't be done.

Well, the lift I showed on the first post was done in NZ by an engineer and it is on a vehicle that requires a CoF every 6 months - so I'm pretty sure this is something that can be done in NZ.

[MarkH]

Just thinking aloud...
Does putting something like this on the back of the motorhome require certification?
What about insurance? You'd not want it to fall off the back in front of following traffic.

This is why I created this thread, I'm looking for a good engineer that can do this right.

[Laava]

It isn't that small, you can get 7M buses like the Toyota Coaster and 9M buses from Isuzu, Hino, Nissan & Mitsubishi Fuso. My new motorhome is 11M and somewhere over 8 Tonne. The pics I showed from the Burt Munro were from the back of a 9M Mitsubishi Fuso bus, the owner told me that the engineer that built the lift had assured him that the lift would happily carry any motorbike and would be fine with 500kg on it.

How heavy an object can a lift on the back of a motorhome carry? Some of these examples look a LOT heavier than my bike: https://hydralift-usa.com

My bike may be fairly big, but the 1000cc twin motor would be less thirsty than the Cummins 5.9L turbo diesel on the motorhome, so I'd happily take the bike for a ride rather than move the motorhome if it was just a day ride. One example would be while the motorhome is parked in Hamilton I would ride the bike to Morrinsville to visit my dear old mum. To visit Cape Reinga I could drive the motorhome to Kaitaia and stay there, then ride the bike to Cape Reinga during a fine day - way more fun than trying to drive a large motorhome on those roads!
if you are going to cape reinga you would be better off parking in Opua and riding west then up over the maungmukas and then up the beach thru te paki stream. Any other route is simply unacceptable!
sorry, I went off piste a bit there…

[Grumph]

Well, the lift I showed on the first post was done in NZ by an engineer and it is on a vehicle that requires a CoF every 6 months - so I'm pretty sure this is something that can be done in NZ.

The simple way out is to get the same people to do yours.
Yes, it's at the other end of the country - but the paperwork alone makes it worth doing.

Even if the same people make it and someone local to you fits it, the cert papers should still apply.

[onearmedbandit]

Well, the lift I showed on the first post was done in NZ by an engineer and it is on a vehicle that requires a CoF every 6 months - so I'm pretty sure this is something that can be done in NZ.

It was a tongue-in-check comment on the attitude quite often seen in NZ, and backed up by some of the responses here. A lot in this country goes into the 'too hard' basket.

[F5 Dave]

Actually I can see your problem from the pictures and it's a bit arse about face.

You really just need a simple retractable ramp system . First of all clean out any of the shit in the way (beds, kitchens and so forth) so you can get it in the door. You will need a dolly to turn it around unless you have a supplementary door to exit.

When your wife finally shows up at the motel simply ride it in allowing easy serving area and secure parking. Make sure you don't have too much to drink before the bike is safely secured unless you trust her to ride it up a reasonably steep ramp and she can perform the detailing, chain maintenance, tyre pressure etc ready for the next day.

You may need to book several units in a row to ensure parking spaces, but the upside is you can have separate living spaces in case she gets grumpy for 'some reason or other'.
They usually find a reason to complain (instead of getting on with their duties and clean between the spokes thoroughly enough) so sometimes it's best to let them have time to themselves to sob down the phone talking to their sister.

[MarkH]

The simple way out is to get the same people to do yours.
Yes, it's at the other end of the country - but the paperwork alone makes it worth doing.

Even if the same people make it and someone local to you fits it, the cert papers should still apply.

Shit mate, I don't even know who did it. I remember the guy telling me that it was somewhere 1 hour from Invercargill (or was it half an hour). I took a whole bunch of pics and it looks like a straight forward enough design that a good engineer could make the same thing and anyone that can't isn't good enough for me to want them to do the work for me. Getting to the other end of the country, including taking time off work would be very expensive - ain't nobody got time for that!

[HenryDorsetCase]

From my time working at International Harvester - I enquired then why any attachments to the truck chassis had to be bolted or rivetted to the frames rather than welded - the answer was the frames were high tensile steel and the heat of welding would alter the steel enough to make it crack. This was a long time ago so welding techniques might have changed things.

that makes sense (to me at least). I will be seeing the client late this week or next - I am now intrigued and will try to remember to ask what happened. He has definitely been out in the thing since then but he is the guy who would just go "Fuck it" and drive off.

[Laava]

I wonder if it is worthwhile contacting Trikeworks, as they are prob very likely to know someone, being in the vehicle modification business?

[jellywrestler]

Shit mate, I don't even know who did it. I remember the guy telling me that it was somewhere 1 hour from Invercargill (or was it half an hour). I took a whole bunch of pics and it looks like a straight forward enough design that a good engineer could make the same thing and anyone that can't isn't good enough for me to want them to do the work for me. Getting to the other end of the country, including taking time off work would be very expensive - ain't nobody got time for that!

read his post again, Greg is a very clever and very smart engineer and what he said is sage advice. It could be made to measure and shipped north to fit.

[MarkH]

read his post again, Greg is a very clever and very smart engineer and what he said is sage advice. It could be made to measure and shipped north to fit.

Read my post again - I don't actually know who made that bike lift that I have pictures of. Getting them to make it for me would be difficult if I don't know who they are.

[Laava]

I wonder if it is worthwhile contacting Trikeworks, as they are prob very likely to know someone, being in the vehicle modification business?
Actually, firther to that, maybe the best people to approach would be the people that fit wheelchair access lifts to vans etc…
these guys are prob worth an email…http://www.thomasengineers.co.nz/lightvehicle.htm

[jellywrestler]

Read my post again - I don't actually know who made that bike lift that I have pictures of. Getting them to make it for me would be difficult if I don't know who they are.

that would be the easiest bit of the whole challenge I'm sure

[Berries]

There must be enough Southlanders on here to track them down. I will guess that whoever built it has nothing to do with motorbikes but is a farm machinery outfit in Winton and the bike hoist is a modified form of some kind of farming implement.

I would take your photos to a couple of those farm machinery places up your way and ask them before you try general engineering firms. Probably find it is B-1220 lockable feed baler with a piece of steel channel welded to it.

[MarkH]

I would take your photos to a couple of those farm machinery places up your way and ask them before you try general engineering firms.

Around the Waikato a decent proportion of the engineering firms are making stuff for farmers and deal with farm machinery. Near to me is Morrinsville, Hamilton, Matamata, Cambridge & Te Awamutu - there are a LOT of engineering places that I could potentially talk to about this project. I was hoping someone could suggest a place that they were familiar with and I have had one suggestion for a place in Matamata from someone on the NZ Motorhome forum. I don't know what this will cost me, but it has to be worth it to have my motorcycle with me when I'm living in my new (actually 28 years old) motorhome. I might buy an E-bike, but that wouldn't be suitable for a 74km round trip to see my mum (maybe it would be doable, but for that distance I'd much rather have 1000cc than a 1kw electric motor).

At Piako Transport Engineering I've seen a motorhome more than once, but I don't know what sort of work they might have been doing on them, couldn't hurt to talk to them though and if they can't help me then they may be able to suggest the best place to talk to.
If I don't have any luck around here then I could do as jellywrestler suggests and track down the place near Invercargill. How hard is it to get someone's contact details if you have the number plate of their motorhome? Now I wish I had got the details when I was talking to the guy.

[geoffm]

That is a clever carrier with the winch.
I made mine, and it has a ramp to load and it has a front wheel holder to hold the bike while you do up the strops. I made it to high, so it was ok for a scooter or a light bike, the RD350LC was a bit heavy single handed.
Check your overhang on the rear. It is a maximum of 4m from the back axle. Mine is to long as I have a light board on the back since the bike obscures the taillights and holder for the ramp. I could shorten it, but for now I just take it off for the COF.
When I had the towbar made, I had a couple of 65x65 box section pieces included on the side of the towbar mount, The carrier slides into that and has a 16mm bolt through it. It is made to disassemble for storage but is plenty stiff when it is together.
You can see it and how it fits together here
https://the-shed.nz/2021-3-9-a-scooter-carrier-for-a-campervan/

[MarkH]

One option would be to have this bike lift removable - then I'd just have to take it off every 6 months for a CoF. It would still need to be made well enough that I could be confident that it would not fail and drop my bike, of course. I'm picking the motorhome up next Tuesday, so I'll take it to the engineers and let them work out what they can do.

[jellywrestler]

One option would be to have this bike lift removable - then I'd just have to take it off every 6 months for a CoF. It would still need to be made well enough that I could be confident that it would not fail and drop my bike, of course. I'm picking the motorhome up next Tuesday, so I'll take it to the engineers and let them work out what they can do.

and what about roadside checks?

[MarkH]

and what about roadside checks?

Well, it will have an up-to-date CoF on it . . .

[onearmedbandit]

Well, it will have an up-to-date CoF on it . . .

Which doesn't mean anything. That's like arguing that having bald tyres is ok if you have a current wof. And then if your insurer finds out and the part was directly involved in a claim then goodbye cover.

[BMWST?]

i think you guys are over thinking this. It is not unusual for 4wd and utes to have towbars rated for 180-250 kg. Something like a small to medium truck will have a serious chassis.A couple of conversations with local engineering places will very quickly lead to a font of knowledge. That font of knowledge will likely have the capability to design and certify something. It may not be just be the engineeering shop itself .

[MarkH]

Things are not going well. I think my idea is great and as per the photos in the OP it is something that can be done. But I had a conversation with one engineering firm where I asked if I would still be able to get a CoF with a bike lift added, basically answered with "dunno". I managed to get hold of another engineer that was recommended elsewhere, he seemed to be much more knowledgeable and has worked on motorhomes - he said the tow hitch couldn't be used because it wasn't rated for the weight of a big 1000cc bike and exceeding its ratings would mean no CoF pass next time, he also said that mounting to the chassis for a diesel pusher would not be easy, much easier to just use a trailer. It turns out that my great idea is not nearly as straightforward as I had hoped it would be.

I might just end up buying a covered trailer and if I can get a bike lift sorted later then I would sell the trailer at that point. I really want to take my motorbike & my e-MTB with me Jan/Feb next year when I head down the south island to the Woodstock Rally, Vincent County Rally & Burt Munro Rally. Of course a covered trailer has some advantages like providing a sheltered garage for my bike, while also having disadvantages like adding ~5m to my 11m long motorhome - making parking and backing harder and ferry crossings more expensive. Still, I'll do what I have to do to have my 2-wheeled transport available to me. With the Cold Kiwi Rally this weekend I'll be getting out on the bike, so I have that to look forward to. I work Thursday - Monday and wanting Fri-Sun for the Cold Kiwi it made no sense to work Thu or Mon so I have the entire week off - no work for me until Thursday week! The bike now has a new battery and new front disk pads - all good to do some riding!

[HenryDorsetCase]

Plan B: sell the motorhome and buy a 16m one. convert the back 5m of the motorhome to your garage/pit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW_MCJruPqM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPW10YithVc

https://www.rvingknowhow.com/rv-with-motorcycle-storage/

[Gremlin]

I've always liked the idea of horse trucks. Garage in the rear (including a very useful ramp) for the toys, with accommodation up front.
As long as I think >50% is living space, it's classed as a motorhome, no log book etc.

[F5 Dave]

Plan B: sell the motorhome and buy a 16m one. convert the back 5m of the motorhome to your garage/pit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YW_MCJruPqM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPW10YithVc

https://www.rvingknowhow.com/rv-with-motorcycle-storage/
That's what I suggested a page or so back but without the hassle of having to sell the present one.

[MarkH]

I'm currently looking at tandem axle horse float trailers, they already have a good ramp/rear door and plenty of height to wheel the bike in without hitting my head. Maybe I'd modify one to eliminate the gap above the closed door for better security and add some padlocks, adding some tie-down points would be easy enough to do. Brand new is way too expensive, so I'm just looking at 2nd hand - still $6k and above though.

[HenryDorsetCase]

I'm currently looking at tandem axle horse float trailers, they already have a good ramp/rear door and plenty of height to wheel the bike in without hitting my head. Maybe I'd modify one to eliminate the gap above the closed door for better security and add some padlocks, adding some tie-down points would be easy enough to do. Brand new is way too expensive, so I'm just looking at 2nd hand - still $6k and above though.

Or a racecar trailer. One of my clients had a big-ass trailer that could hold two sprintcars, spares (they go through a lot of spares), tyres, tools, and could also sleep the pitcrew. He used to tow it with an F450. But currently he has one big enough for a TQ, spares, and tools and a small sit-down area. It is high enough to stand in plus has an area for a piewarmer and kettle. Definitely enclose it if you do go the horsefloat way

[MarkH]

Definitely enclose it if you do go the horsefloat way

Enclose it and add locks! Yeah, a horsefloat has plenty of head height and a ramp to ride up on, most of the way there. I'd add front wheel chocks and D-Rings for tie-downs. The back tends to have a big ventilation gap, but how hard could that be to close up. Maybe extend the ramp to make it longer for easier slope to get the bike in and then close off the small gap remaining.

I've been riding the bike over the last few days and tomorrow I'm riding it to the Cold Kiwi, as I ride I remember why I really need to have my bike. I don't want to lock it back up in my dear old mum's garage and barely use it for month, it deserves to be ridden and I love being the one to ride it!

[MarkH]

Update -

Home & garage:
https://i.imgur.com/08Ce2K9.jpg

My Motorbike & e-MTB parked:
https://i.imgur.com/6ePq2bW.jpg

The bare plywood at the bottom is the new door section that has been added. There are also three padlocks that use the same key - one on the front door and two on the back door. I took the motorbike out to fill the petrol tank and then put it back in, it was pretty easy to unload and load again. The e-MTB is secured by 4 straps and the motorbike has 6 straps, both have their respective front wheel up against bolted down wheel chocks and I don't think either will move while I'm driving. This all seems to be working rather well for my needs and I'm able to park my home & garage in Hamilton less than 1km from work for $50 per week.

[F5 Dave]

Probably a better solution after all, if a little tricky on the ferry.

Not as fun as trying to see if you can overturn Kia Rios in the PacknSave carpark with the lift though.

[MarkH]

Probably a better solution after all, if a little tricky on the ferry.

The main gain is a sheltered garage for the bike. The ferry crossing is $100 dearer with the trailer on (with NZMCA discount) - I've already booked and paid for the Wellington to Picton crossing in January so that I can go to the Woodstock rally, Vincent County rally & Burt Munro rally. I'll often need to unhitch the trailer when parking unless there is room to park something with around 16m total length, not a problem where I'm staying in Hamilton but could be in many other places.