Sprockets

[diesel pig]

What is the best way to look for Sprockets online? I have a old Suzuki with a weird 525 size which with modern chains is outkill. I want to go a 520 or a hign quality 428 chain. But if I go with the 428 size I would have to work out what sizes I will need to get the right final drive ratio. If I go that way with the 428 chain I would have to find if those sizes are available in the spines and mounting holes I would need. And I don't know the best way to go about it.

[husaberg]

What is the best way to look for Sprockets online? I have a old Suzuki with a weird 525 size which with modern chains is outkill. I want to go a 520 or a hign quality 428 chain. But if I go with the 428 size I would have to work out what sizes I will need to get the right final drive ratio. If I go that way with the 428 chain I would have to find if those sizes are available in the spines and mounting holes I would need. And I don't know the best way to go about it.


JT cattledog
no difference in sprocket sizes for 428 vs 520, ratios are ratios
pm me if you want to DP (butt only to talk about sprockets)
https://www.jtsprockets.com/catalogue/

guessing this is the 520 one you want suzuki gsx400? t350 isnt listed but early gt250 is same as gsx
https://www.jtsprockets.com/catalogue/part/JTF1373/
likely this one rear https://www.jtsprockets.com/catalogue/part/JTR1826/

[SaferRides]

Deleted, already been answered.

[F5 Dave]

. .
pm me if you want DP
. . .
And with that one post husi went on ban for sexual harassment :Police:

[husaberg]

And with that one post husi went on ban for sexual harassment :Police:

Somewhat explains the 10 pms after 10pm from the hutt last night.....

[diesel pig]

I understand ratio's are ratio's but in the decades of messing with motorbikes one rarely can get a direct replacements when doing things like this. Such as replaceing 525 14/38 set up with set of 428 sprockets and say I can get a correct 38 back 428 sprocket but not a 14 front sprocket but can get a 13 and 15 front sprockets. That means to keep the orginal ratio, I would have to find either a correct 428 sprocket in 35 teeth for the 13 front sprocket or a 41 one for 15 front sprocket. I was Hoping there was a site where you could tap in some numders and it would spit out some answers. I want my life to be easy!

[husaberg]

I understand ratio's are ratio's but in the decades of messing with motorbikes one rarely can get a direct replacements when doing things like this. Such as replaceing 525 14/38 set up with set of 428 sprockets and say I can get a correct 38 back 428 sprocket but not a 14 front sprocket but can get a 13 and 15 front sprockets. That means to keep the orginal ratio, I would have to find either a correct 428 sprocket in 35 teeth for the 13 front sprocket or a 41 one for 15 front sprocket. I was Hoping there was a site where you could tap in some numders and it would spit out some answers. I want my life to be easy!

you divide the rear by the front ie 45/15 equals 3.0 as does 12x36 13x39 14x42.
https://www.jtsprockets.com/fileadmin/files/jtgearratio.pdf

in your case 13 36 would be close enough.

tell me the bike and your gearing you want to replicate.

Personally i wouldn't use 428 on a bike over 250/350 unless it was a race bike.
That said a 415 race chain can cope with 50HP ie RS125 Honda.

[F5 Dave]

415 is typically higher quality than shitty tiddler chains. Some of that stuff is budget in a lousy way.

An RS125 is about 37hp. 50hp is the realm of SotA tuners and riders who replace stuff several times a year.

[jato]

if you are getting close to the limits of a chain, running say 15 : 45 will decrease the tensile load 20% compared to running 12 : 36.
another thought ... 2 engines put out 50 hp. one does it at 13000 rpm the other at 7000 - one of them loads the chain almost twice as much as the other

[diesel pig]

I am starting to think a light weight High Quality 520 X - Ring would be the way to go and it would make finding the right size sprockets easiler.

[husaberg]

I am starting to think a light weight High Quality 520 X - Ring would be the way to go and it would make finding the right size sprockets easiler.
https://www.ducatispares.co.nz/products/did-520-vx3-chain-118-links-with-clip-link

[husaberg]

if you are getting close to the limits of a chain, running say 15 : 45 will decrease the tensile load 20% compared to running 12 : 36.
another thought ... 2 engines put out 50 hp. one does it at 13000 rpm the other at 7000 - one of them loads the chain almost twice as much as the other
Squat is considerably different as well big differences in singles twins and fours too.
Some bikes you can't go to big or small as you run out of room or eat the swingarm.
Ducatis at the 916 changed the primary ratio to allow for less strain on trany and clutch and allowing gearing that would work with the swingarm and hub and countershaft room. Also they never had a hunting tooth.

[diesel pig]

OK, So I am thinking about a DID 520VX3 on a JTR431 14 and either a JTR1826 37 or 39 (there is no 38 listed) So do I want to slightly over gear it or under gear it? It's for a Bike I would be road touring, I suppose that's the right name for what I will do with it. I won't want to hurt the performance but I also don't want a petrol drinking monster. Any ideas?

[husaberg]

OK, So I am thinking about a DID 520VX3 on a JTR431 14 and either a JTR1826 37 or 39 (there is no 38 listed) So do I want to slightly over gear it or under gear it? It's for a Bike I would be road touring, I suppose that's the right name for what I will do with it. I won't want to hurt the performance but I also don't want a petrol drinking monster. Any ideas?
try oe or another sprocket company that does a 38 if thats what you want?
Just cross reference it with other bikes that list this. I would try metal gear pbr renthal afam.
Or if you have the room in the front 41 and 15 is essentially so close you will never notice the difference. There is likely more difference in changing the rear tire width and profile.
A lower number will give less revs at 100KM/h i.e 37/14 =2.64, 39/14=2.78

It might be easier if you actually tell us what the bike is. That said a tooth on either side on the is unlikely to make much noticeable difference.

but if you are hyper interested load the gear ratios into this
this will tell you the exact speed an rev differences.
https://www.gearingcommander.com/

we run the motard on regina chains made for supermoto, they wear very well and are one of the few high rated chains that are non oring that are still affordable.

[F5 Dave]

OK, So I am thinking about a DID 520VX3 on a JTR431 14 and either a JTR1826 37 or 39 (there is no 38 listed) So do I want to slightly over gear it or under gear it? It's for a Bike I would be road touring, I suppose that's the right name for what I will do with it. I won't want to hurt the performance but I also don't want a petrol drinking monster. Any ideas?
Ahh. Standard. 100%.
Only exceptions were 90s eurobikes trying to get past noise testing.

[diesel pig]

Ahh. Standard. 100%.
Only exceptions were 90s eurobikes trying to get past noise testing.

That is what I was thinking. husaberg's suggestion of doing 15/41 is possible as I have checked and there are those sizes of sprokets in those type's of sprockets I need. The bike is the one listed on my bio 1971 Suzuki T350R. I am doing (slowly) what I think the yanks call rest-o-moddying. What I picked up on the Two Stroke Thread is Suzuki made power in 1971 on the T350 by throwing petrol at it. Which is why I think she get's 160K's on 13 litres of petrol. I would like to rise that range as close as possible to 300K's. What I would like to do is use those modern idea's of burning more petrol to made more power. I want to use those idea's instead to use those same idea's to burn less petrol and still made the same power as before. I have realised that I first need to reduce the rolling resistance to as low as possible first. that is why I am looking at better chains and wheel bearings etc...

[diesel pig]

My take on Rest-o-modding is you can moditfy the machine but it has to look like the sort of modification a enthusiast would do in the decade fellowing the machine's release. So the Mod's look of the time but what they really are is under the skin is your business. So since the T350 came out in the 1970's mod's that look like they were done in the 70s is what I am going for. Throught I would just clear that up.

[husaberg]

That is what I was thinking. husaberg's suggestion of doing 15/41 is possible as I have checked and there are those sizes of sprockets in those type's of sprockets I need. The bike is the one listed on my bio 1971 Suzuki T350R. I am doing (slowly) what I think the yanks call rest-o-moddying. What I picked up on the Two Stroke Thread is Suzuki made power in 1971 on the T350 by throwing petrol at it. Which is why I think she get's 160K's on 13 litres of petrol. I would like to rise that range as close as possible to 300K's. What I would like to do is use those modern ideas to instead of burning more petrol to made more power. I want to use those same idea's to burn less petrol and still made the same power as before. I have realised that I first need to reduce the rolling resistance to as low as possible first. that is why I am looking at better chains and wheel bearings etc...
Add a set of modern carbs that way with a PJ you can tailor your fueling a steady speeds.
As you are not chasing hp go slightly smaller in the carb. If economy is what you are chasing.
Add in a decent ignition
You could get away with a 428 on one of these, but not sure if its worth the hassle.
But a non-oring chain is slightly more efficient than a x or o ring.

https://www.ducatispares.co.nz/products/did-520v-chain-112-links-o-ring-professional
a hd 428 is about 1/2 at only $40
https://www.ducatispares.co.nz/products/did-428h-heavy-duty-chain-120l-from-rk
https://www.ducatispares.co.nz/products/did-428hd-racing-chain-134l-solid-bush-chain

The 350 was okay on gas compared to the T500.

[SaferRides]

OK, So I am thinking about a DID 520VX3 on a JTR431 14 and either a JTR1826 37 or 39 (there is no 38 listed) So do I want to slightly over gear it or under gear it? It's for a Bike I would be road touring, I suppose that's the right name for what I will do with it. I won't want to hurt the performance but I also don't want a petrol drinking monster. Any ideas?The DID VX3 is good chain, you're unlikely to ever replace it on a T350. The 530 version lasted over 50,000 km on the R1.

Sent from my SM-S938B using Tapatalk

[husaberg]

My take on Rest-o-modding is you can moditfy the machine but it has to look like the sort of modification a enthusiast would do in the decade fellowing the machine's release. So the Mod's look of the time but what they really are is under the skin is your business. So since the T350 came out in the 1970's mod's that look like they were done in the 70s is what I am going for. Throught I would just clear that up.

My take is similar but you make it usable, but visually correct to a causal obsever to the appropriate period factory product.

My rd the idea of the (never finished)AC RD with LC top end period TZ tank and seat like a cafe racer but with more modern tires and rim sizes and suspension, but still RSU and twin shock, still spoked alloy rims decent 4 piston caliper brakes, period looking lights but modern led tech and controls.
Mostly bolt together so Yamaha could have made it themselves.

[diesel pig]

Some good suggestions there husaberg. I have some new made 28VM's to replace the the stock 32VM's. (Have not fitted them yet) I was intrigued by the PJ idea. So I asked myself if PJ's were a thing in the 70's? When I looked in my old Bell tuning book his two PJ exsamples were 70's Yamaha's. So no worries there. I will get two PJ kits from MikuniOz. The 28VM's look like they are right out of the 70's but apart from the round slides everything else inside them looks like it came out of a brand new carb. I have all ready fitted a ignitech CDI. I hid it under the seat and replaced the huge old stator with one off I think a KX85. I used a spare wiring loop for the wires and plugs where one can see them on the bike. It is what got me thinking about rest-o-modding the rest of the bike. I don't know if the CDI makes the bike more economic over the old points but it does make the T350 easlier to start.

[husaberg]

Some good suggestions there husaberg. I have some new made 28VM's to replace the the stock 32VM's. (Have not fitted them yet) I was intrigued by the PJ idea. So I asked myself if PJ's were a thing in the 70's? When I looked in my old Bell tuning book his two PJ exsamples were 70's Yamaha's. So no worries there. I will get two PJ kits from MikuniOz. The 28VM's look like they are right out of the 70's but apart from the round slides everything else inside them looks like it came out of a brand new carb. I have all ready fitted a ignitech CDI. I hid it under the seat and replaced the huge old stator with one off I think a KX85. I used a spare wiring loop for the wires and plugs where one can see them on the bike. It is what got me thinking about rest-o-modding the rest of the bike. I don't know if the CDI makes the bike more economic over the old points but it does make the T350 easlier to start.

Some older carbs had airjets that lean off like an old webber, when crusing as you only need the richer mixture for acceleration.
Using a pj you can kind of do the same. You can also have a shallower longer taper on the needle.

[SaferRides]

Some good suggestions there husaberg. I have some new made 28VM's to replace the the stock 32VM's. (Have not fitted them yet) I was intrigued by the PJ idea. So I asked myself if PJ's were a thing in the 70's? When I looked in my old Bell tuning book his two PJ exsamples were 70's Yamaha's. So no worries there. I will get two PJ kits from MikuniOz. The 28VM's look like they are right out of the 70's but apart from the round slides everything else inside them looks like it came out of a brand new carb. I have all ready fitted a ignitech CDI. I hid it under the seat and replaced the huge old stator with one off I think a KX85. I used a spare wiring loop for the wires and plugs where one can see them on the bike. It is what got me thinking about rest-o-modding the rest of the bike. I don't know if the CDI makes the bike more economic over the old points but it does make the T350 easlier to start.Interesting. One question, how does a PJ kit work?

I never rode a T350, but recall that they were basically a T250 with a bigger engine.

Sent from my SM-S938B using Tapatalk

[husaberg]

Interesting. One question, how does a PJ kit work?

I never rode a T350, but recall that they were basically a T250 with a bigger engine.

Sent from my SM-S938B using Tapatalk

old school ones use an additional metered circuit that draws in additional fuel from the float bowl at high rpm past 9/10 or so throttle.
tz late 70's and IT175's were the first bikes i remember having them.
356972

bikes with carbs to big tend to naturally lean off at revs over peak power.
wrks using a vacuum created over the venturi that pulls up the fuel same a a mainjet works, its in essence just a high speed mainjet.

basically it can give better economy and more accurate fuelling at medium to higher revs as the power jet bike has a smaller mainjet
say if the bike on a conventional carb is a 200 main then the powerjet bike can have a 175 main-jet and a 25 power-jet carb. for the same ultra top end fuelling.

later ones now cut off fuel to warm up the pipes with electric solenoids as they now use different fuels so they get more overev.
they have a TPS show they can be set where ever suits them best

356973

As DP has a ignitech he can set up the timing to give max fuel economy at cruising conditions he can ass a inline TPS say of a splitter cable and a TPS off say a RGV

[diesel pig]

I think husaberg is reading my mind.

[diesel pig]

Interesting. One question, how does a PJ kit work?

I never rode a T350, but recall that they were basically a T250 with a bigger engine.

Sent from my SM-S938B using Tapatalk

Literaly just bigger pistons and carbs. I have a factory Manual which is called a T250/T350 Manual and only mentions the T350 when it different from a T250 and that's not often.

[pete376403]

Literaly just bigger pistons and carbs. I have a factory Manual which is called a T250/T350 Manual and only mentions the T350 when it different from a T250 and that's not often.
Not even a 350, only a 315 - in spite of which they could still give R5 Yamahas (predecessor of RD350) a fright

[husaberg]

I think husaberg is reading my mind.
Sorry i never noticed he asked you....:innocent:
this was the look i am after only on 2.5x17 and 3.5x17 for modern SS300 size tires
similar look but different mudguard and tail light and full floating 320 disc and 4 pot. 39mm rsu forks.
plus i think i am going to try and blend in RD400E side covers.
356974356975356977356976356979

[diesel pig]

Outside of a racetrack (which they are perfect for) clip-ons soon begin to suck. Long fuel tanks look cool but suck to deal with even on a race track. Otherwise how are you reading my mind?

[husaberg]

Outside of a racetrack (which they are perfect for) clip-ons soon begin to suck. Long fuel tanks look cool but suck to deal with even on a race track. Otherwise how are you reading my mind?

I get what you are saying but to me they only suck bad if you are not going fast enough or try to ride too far. To my way of thinking the whole idea of a cafe style is about impractically it was more for posing at cafes. My fav road which is rated one of the best scenic route in the world is a max of a about 45 minutes between cafes.
i also don't want to encourage passengers....
Having the TZ long tank short seat is a nod to the ultimate RD Yamaha. IE a TZ350A
If i could justify them it would have the dry clutch and the TZ750 6 port cylinders as well.
357010

[diesel pig]

OK, I will give you the clip-ons, but long fuel tanks suck no-matter what. I had to shorten a pre-95 Honda RS125 fuel tank because of damage to the back of it and really liked being further forward on the RS. So ever since I don't like long tanks.

[husaberg]

OK, I will give you the clip-ons, but long fuel tanks suck no-matter what. I had to shorten a pre-95 Honda RS125 fuel tank because of damage to the back of it and really liked being further forward on the RS. So ever since I don't like long tanks.
My triple clamp doesn't have the provision for bars anyway :)
I had thought about stretching the std RD coffin tank but the one that came with the bike is a bit far gone.
i had posted an okay looking modified RD4.lc350 with ugly pipes before. My thoughts on ergo is the pegs should be inline with the end of the tank or slightly further back. so if i want rearsets i also need a longer tank.


in the std tanked rd like yellow it looks about 2 -4 inches short (say tit should end the middle of the side cover and the seats to my taste should have a longer rear cowl covering the seat hump.
357013357011357014357015357016

TZ and RD had some styling clues i am following like the gap in the guard to mimic the stays the upright shocks spoked wheels, rake on the pipes the style of the Radiator sides, swan neck top triple clamp

[SaferRides]

HeliBars may have made replacement clipons which are flatter and more comfortable. I have raised clipons on the R1 which make a huge difference to comfort. They were made by someone in Ngaruawahia, can't remember the name.

Sent from my SM-S938B using Tapatalk

[Kickaha]

Having the TZ long tank short seat is a nod to the ultimate RD Yamaha

Short seats look arse, the proportions are wrong, the early SS Ducati got it right and not much has since

[husaberg]

Short seats look arse, the proportions are wrong, the early SS Ducati got it right and not much has since
Kind of surprised you would coment about aesthetics given how ugly that gn seat tank combo was;)
357017357018
To me The SS seat is about 2 inches to long it throws off the symmetry of the rear guard, it does recreate the tank's lines nicely though.
Ducati had it right with the 350 racers that where the 900ss fairing came from. (although the 350 bike needs jacking up at the rear and the tank is a little out of kilter
357019

prettiest seats are a tie between the supermono the 916 and the bimota db1 plaus th e xrtt
357024357025357026

[F5 Dave]

OK, I will give you the clip-ons, but long fuel tanks suck no-matter what. I had to shorten a pre-95 Honda RS125 fuel tank because of damage to the back of it and really liked being further forward on the RS. So ever since I don't like long tanks.

I had bruises on my thighs for days after riding your MBRS. Square edges are worse.

[diesel pig]

I had bruises on my thighs for days after riding your MBRS. Square edges are worse.

I don't mind it. The square corners give my outside knee something to hang on to when hanging off.

[husaberg]

Okay, Seems like Dave maybe isn't used to have any large appendages between his thighs?