2 or 4 stroke for a new rider?

[khabel]

Me and some friends are getting into trail riding but before I can decide on what bike to buy I need to narrow it down on 2 or 4 stroke.

I have riden a little both on and off road but nothing serious and am a fairly big guy, 120kg 6'2". I was thinking something along the lines of a 4 stroke 250.

I want something I go grow into and I don't mind fixing myself.

Whats the benefits of 2 vs 4 stroke and what would you recommend?

I am wanting to spend up to $3000

[WRT]

2 stroke you get waaaay more power and torque for the CC rating, but its all in one big wallop. 4 stroke is much easier to control, power comes on smoothly and progressively over the whole rev range (rather than just at high revs), gives you loads of traction and good down low pull.

But even the 250cc 4 strokes make good power these days, and could be a good place to start. Once you are confident blasting round on that, then try a couple of 2 strokes and see how you go - you might just convert to the dark side ;)

[Motu]

I'd go with a 4 stroke for learning - the 2 strokes are either doddery farm bike types of pretty low performance,or banzai enduro or MX bikes.But even a high performance thumper is pretty easy to ride,so long as you don't go to the extreme and get an MX thumper.Some will recomend a KDX200,but I feel the power is still a bit aggressive for a learner,you may find yourself bogging out and stalling or wheelspinnig crazily until you figure out how to ride a 2 stroke,while a 4 stroke will plod you through some difficulty as you are still figuring out what the hell do I do in this situation.You may be able to find some between era 2 stroke like a late 70s early 80s DT250 which will have almost some handling and a powerful yet torquey motor.XR250 is the best learner bike,it has handling beyond most riders ability and an engine that takes some serious effort to kill.

[WRT]

Yup, I'd second Motu on that, the XR's are legendary. Easy to ride, tough as, and bullet proof. I think there was one model to steer clear of, something like a late 80's twin carbie 350 - someone may be able to confirm. Otherwise all good.

I would suspect you would want something like a 250 so that you dont get bored of it too soon, and it will handle 6'2" and 120kg easily enough.

[NordieBoy]

I think there was one model to steer clear of, something like a late 80's twin carbie 350 - someone may be able to confirm.
But if you do get an XR350 then I have at least half an engine for one here :D

[Mattyc]

if you are 120 kg a 4 stroke 250 prolly wont cut it, specially if like you say "you are looking for a bike you can grow into" you may have to go to something bigger

IMO KDX200 is about the best power spread of any 2 stroke ive ever owned/ ridden - on a 120kg person you may find that even the kdx wont satisfy your power demons - they are relatively tame and the powerband is reasonably flat - Go See scott at Mr Motorcycles in puke and organise a demo

Im a big 2 stroke fan cause i can rebuild them myself, and they are reasonably cheap to rebuild, if you dont get them to a stage where they are completely fucked. and plus you get good power to weight

as a general rule - (not in all cases) 4 strokes are heavier, and in my personal experience a pain in the arse to rebuild yourself, although it is do-able

another option is a KLX300 ? - near the same chassis as a kdx but about 6 kg heavier, a wee bit more poke than a 4 stroke 250

[VasalineWarrior]

So exactly how much experience have you had mate? A four stroke 250 will definitly be the biz for a complete learner, but if this seems a little tame a 2 stroke 250 might be the go with heaps of scope to grow into :blip: . Trouble is they are hard to find, not cheap, are usually in poor order and not well maintained.

[Motu]

another option is a KLX300 ? - near the same chassis as a kdx but about 6 kg heavier, a wee bit more poke than a 4 stroke 250

That'd be my pick,but for under $3000? He's in XR territory.

[avgas]

Depends what your after in a bike, while the four strokes are reliable this can have a downside - as i learnt So MUch with my two strokes.
But i love a good thumper all the same.
Also depends on how you ride as well.

[khabel]

I've ridden around on a farm bike a few times a while back which is pretty much all the off road riding I have done so serious off road riding is all new to me.

I was thinking either 2 stroke 200/250 or a 4 stroke 250.

I'll be doing mostly trail riding.

[khabel]

How about something like these?

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Dirt-bikes/auction-40184528.htm

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Trade-Me-Motors/Motorbikes/Motorbikes/Dirt-bikes/auction-40326398.htm

[Cary]

if you are 120 kg a 4 stroke 250 prolly wont cut it

Sorry Mattyc but rubbish:shake: I'm 110, 6'1" and I pass 450's all the time:blip:

$3000, XR250 or KDX200/220 is the bike to get.

[cheese]

yeah how good are you with fixing things?

If you like to get hands on and fix things, get a 2 stroke.

if you hate that shit, get a 4.

steer clear of the old 80's XR's with the RFVC, they were the shit ones. you should be able to get a early 90's one for that sort of money though.

[clint640]

Go the XR, even an XR400 would be good but prolly more than $3K. Much as I like the KDX's they are a pretty small bike for someone that is 6'2", although bars & things can be altered it's all extra money.

Whatever you get, once you gain a bit of confidence and start going faster you'll want to upgrade the suspension. Dirt bikes are generally designed for a 70kg rider so you'll be maxing it out well & truly.

Cheers
Clint

[crazyxr250rider]

120kg.......6'2''................get a cr500-250 ya' big woss! Seriously.

[Mattyc]

Sorry Mattyc but rubbish:shake: I'm 110, 6'1" and I pass 450's all the time:blip:

$3000, XR250 or KDX200/220 is the bike to get.

Good on you Buddy!!

Maybe on an MX track you pass a few 450's.... lol , My Mrs passes dudes on 450's (NOVICES) on her BW CR80 - As the dude said, he wants something for TRAIL riding

For 3000$ go for a 2 stroke - you wont get a powerful 4 stroke for that - you may get good XR ..... but id say it might be a long hunt for one

also remember 2 strokes can have a bottom end, with the right reeds/jetting/pipe, and one thing i think people forget is that they only go as hard as you turn the throttle. The exhaust powervalve can also be adjusted on some models to soften the hit of the powerband or to flatten it out while u get used to the bike, MX bikes generally have better suspension, than the average trailie

[Motu]

I still think a 2 stroke is a bit yappy for a learner.If we take my DT230 as a supposedly low performance trail bike,it's probably what you skilled riders consider as pretty tame for a 2 stroke,but it's much harder to control traction with than with a milder 4 stroke like an XR.A touch of throttle and they light up the rear tyre,find traction and they snap back,riding a bit harder and it's going strong with no real idea what the motor is doing,it's just going nuts.A 4 stroke breaks and makes traction much slower and doesn't need the same reactions,you can hear the load on the motor and know where it is in the rev range,just things that help a learner with bike control.

I'm not totaly inexperianced,I started trail riding in 1971 on a 2 stroke and have always had a 2 stroke in my stable since 1970,I love them and the power delivery,but my do or die days are over.I love the DT230,I'm so happy I got it over a 4 stroke,I'd need a 600cc to get this much performance,but carry less weight than a 250 thumper.

Hey,I weighed it the other day - 116kg with a little fuel and oil,not bad for street legal and electric start.

[Fryin Finn]

I have recently gone from a WR450 4 stroke to a Gas Gas 250 2 stroke and have rediscovered the joys of 2 stroking. The 450 was prone to stalling or wheelying at low revs where the 250 just lugs. Traction has not been a problem so far. What happens with 2 strokes is getting on the pipe in low traction situations - the back wheel goes mental. My old PE and IT 175's were great in the slippery stuff just lugging along.
For less than $3000 you ain't gonna get a bike with a fresh motor - I know what I would sooner be rebuilding.

[Mattyc]

The 450 was prone to stalling or wheelying at low revs where the 250 just lugs.

Haha, this is the same reason why one of my mates on a yz400 cant make it up the some of the hills on our trail rides (it either stands up on him or stalls), his bike is geared really tall and wont just LUG along like our 2 smokers.

another situation is steep downhills on the 4 stroke, touch the back brake too much and the engine stalls, then compression locks and proceeds to skid down the hill........

gimme a 2 stroke any day :P :doobey:

[chris]

If you are new to trail riding, it will be a long time before you can ride the nuts of a 250. Don't fall into the trap of thinking you need a 450. I've been riding a CRF250X for most of this year and it has got me everywhere and I'm 100kg and 6 foot. As some have said, don't overlook a KDX200 either.

[kro]

For what its worth, I have ridden a fair few 250 four strokes, and I'm 6'4, and 110kg, and find myself wanting a bit more poke when riding the 4 stroke 250's, even at my novice level.

I am currently looking to acquire a DR350, or an XR400, and if the budget allows, a DRZ-400, as I have ridden all these, and can safely say they will keep me amused for ages to come.

As has been said numerous times, a 2 stroke will keep most riders happy with its power, but its a trade off, with sometimes higher maintenance costs, and not being suited to just putting along a Forest track, and tooling around at slow speeds for long periods of time, as they will foul plugs before too long. I ride an 84 KX250 fairly regularly, and it still scares the crap out of me, and I have been riding one litre road bike for quite some years, if this gives you an idea of the power delivery.

You can grab a good 1993-1998 DR350 for 3 or just under quite easily. The DR350 is air cooled, and potentially a bit lower maintenance.

Personally, I love riding the KLX300R that my brother just bought, hence whey Im going four stroke too.