NOT another oil thread

[kerryg]

I've read up all about it, I've heard all the different opinions, I don't want to know the merits of one type of diesel oil compared to another, or synthetic versus mineral or any opinions about what is good or bad. It's all just TOO CONFUSING!

I've got an '02 ZX6R with 34000kms on it. Just been given a major service at Red Baron, all checks out perfect. I love it, I've never liked a bike so much, I may actually keep this one, it seems damn near perfect for what I want but it's been ridden hard by previous owners (a few track days included) and I want to keep it sweet. Sooooo..... I am going to switch to fully synthetic, but it's bloody dear (like $100 a 4 litres) so I went onto the ZX6R forum in the US of A and found a lot of those guys are using Mobil 1 15W50 full synthetic car oil because it's a lot cheaper than the Mobil 1 motorcycle oils. Plus it performed very well in an evaluation done by Sport Rider magazine back in 2003 against a lot of more expensive oils. Chemical analysis is very comparable to the motorcycle oil (MX4T). It is not an energy-conserving oil in 15W50 form (but is in the other variants evidently) so doesn't have those nasty friction modifiers in it, and nearly everyone on the ZX6R forum seems to sing its praises.

So, my question (sorry for the long preamble): has anyone here had experience using Mobil 1 15W50 car oil in a late model Japanese sportbike? If no, no need to tell me why I shouldn't use it (I've heard the arguments already). If yes, I'm most interested to know how it performed, any problems with it etc.

Cheers

[vifferman]

Kerry,

If you want to try a full synthetic, go to AMPS. I bought Mobil 4T or whatever it's called for $67 (if I remember correctly), which is cheaper than you'll get the car oil for at Repco, Supercheap or whatever.

[R1madness]

I used MOBIL 1 back in 1989/90 in a FZR400SP in F3. It was fine, never had any problems with clutch or wear, but we changed it often (got it cheap). Shop around and you will find the proper Mobil 4T?? bike oil at a good price.

[kerryg]

Kerry,

If you want to try a full synthetic, go to AMPS. I bought Mobil 4T or whatever it's called for $67 (if I remember correctly), which is cheaper than you'll get the car oil for at Repco, Supercheap or whatever.

Thanks Ian. That's good information. I'll check it out right now. Cheers

[kerryg]

I used MOBIL 1 back in 1989/90 in a FZR400SP in F3. It was fine, never had any problems with clutch or wear, but we changed it often (got it cheap). Shop around and you will find the proper Mobil 4T?? bike oil at a good price.

Cheers for that. Glad I asked the question now!

[vifferman]

You have to be careful of anecdotal evidence, Kerry. There was a thread yesterday on VFRd, and it reiterated that stories about clutch slippage using full synthetic erl were unproven by proper testing, and wer most likely the result of one or two instances of people who abused their clutches (and/or whose clutches were on the way out anyway) and then tried synthetic oil and their clutch slipped. Their are lots of cases of people using all kinds of car oils in their bikes without any issues.
Having said that, there's a couple of guys on various forums I'm on, who work in the US oil industry, one of whom works for a company who suplies additives to Mobil, and another who analyses oils, and yet another who is a consultant to oil companies. The additive packages for motorcycle-specific oils ARE different to those for car oils, but using either, provided the oil is changed regularly, is fine.

Check this, especially posts #14 and #29 (ignore the posts from that 'asshat' enzed_viffer):
http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=16951&st=0

And this (check the posts by ScootR):
http://www.vfrdiscussion.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=7349

The reason I said about "anecdotal evidence" is that you get people saying, "My bike ran smoother, shifted gear easier, ran cooler, had more power", etc. using synthetic. Similarly, I was told by a technician at Cycletreads that synthetic oil was very bad, as it coated the engine internals with a glaze.
I've used Mobil 1 for bikes once before (when you could get it at garages, and before the price skyrocketed), and didn't notice anything good or bad. So what?
I'm also currently using it in the VFR, first time in a bike in over 10 years (always use Motul 5100), because I saw it 'cheap' at AMPS. I think it makes gear-changing worse. But what the hell would I know? How would I tell, unless I could ride absolutely identical bikes back-to-back, on different oils, then drain them both, and switch oils?

[Lou Girardin]

[QUOTE=kerryg.. I am going to switch to fully synthetic, but it's bloody dear (like $100 a 4 litres) [/QUOTE]

Viffermans right, AMPS sell Mobil Racing 4T for $67.00 inc.
I noticed the same with Motul semi-syn.

[kerryg]

The reason I said about "anecdotal evidence" is that you get people saying, "My bike ran smoother, shifted gear easier, ran cooler, had more power", etc. using synthetic. Similarly, I was told by a technician at Cycletreads that synthetic oil was very bad, as it coated the engine internals with a glaze.
I've used Mobil 1 for bikes once before (when you could get it at garages, and before the price skyrocketed), and didn't notice anything good or bad. So what?
I'm also currently using it in the VFR, first time in a bike in over 10 years (always use Motul 5100), because I saw it 'cheap' at AMPS. I think it makes gear-changing worse. But what the hell would I know? How would I tell, unless I could ride absolutely identical bikes back-to-back, on different oils, then drain them both, and switch oils?


You'd hardly guess ....but I don't have enough to keep me busy at work (a good enough thing in small doses but a very bloody tedious thing in large doses) and so I have the luxury (?) of the time to research various things like this. I've spent a good few hours looking at all sorts of (admittedly internet-based) sources about motorcycle oils and it really has become a case of too much information. There is a lot, actually a massive amount, of very credible information (to a layman like me, anyway) arguing for many different views, some of them diametrically opposed. There is also a lot of plausible misinformation (it can't ALL be right) so at the end of the day you have to make a judgement. Who knows who's right?

[vifferman]

There is also a lot of plausible misinformation (it can't ALL be right) so at the end of the day you have to make a judgement. Who knows who's right?
For me, I believe Motul 5100 is OK, I like the smell, I like to think it's at least OK (if not very good), so I use it. There's enough evidence out there that Mobil Racing 4T is very good, and it was only the unjustifiably high price keeping me from using it. Seeing it at AMPS for $67, when I'd seen the Mobil 1 at Repco etc. for around $90 was enough to make me buy it.

[kerryg]

Viffermans right, AMPS sell Mobil Racing 4T for $67.00 inc.
I noticed the same with Motul semi-syn.


Yeah I made a phone call little while ago and confirmed that. That's a good price, there's no point in using the car version at that price, so I'll come in on Saturday and grab some for sure

[Brian d marge]

This weekend I will be changing the oil in my little truck, Semi synthetic used for short journeys in heavy traffic 69910 km on the clock all nearly half of which was done on the current oil. As in I bought the thing changed the oil and ran it .
Doesnt use oil runs fine no problem what so ever , The only reason I am changing the oil is because I found some new oil in the garage

These modern oils are getting so good, its getting to the point that you will hardley have to change the oil for the life of the motor .

On my bikes however I change often) makes me feel good) using good mineral with a narrow viscosity spread , ( I use diesil oil before I change to a really expensive one as diesil has a lot of detergent in it )

Must dash ,,,but a quick thought ..never really noticed any wear in Engines due to quality of oil ( have on 2 strokes , done a crank in using cheap yamaha oil ) The wear has always been due to Lack of oil and particles in suspension .
The last big end shell I took out of a Jap motor showed a good wear pattern on the bearing

Right now I am late ,,,

Stephen

[FROSTY]

My suggestion is the motul synthetic.
I'm using it in black ice and i swear it feels smoother and seems a fraction gruntier