Campaign aims to dispel bad Asian drivers myth

[Postie]

er ok, so according this http://www.nzherald.co.nz/topic/story.cfm?c_id=308&objectid=10359471, its all a myth. i know for one that i have been the victim of an asian u turn special, but if i knew it was all a myth, then i would have just sat there and laughed and laughed.

[Lou Girardin]

The problem with the LTNZ is that they only take note of statistics. But all near misses and most non-injury dings don't come to their attention. So, unless you actually use the roads, you don't have a clue what's happening out there.
Which sums up all of the LTNZ's activities.

[Ixion]

Well , the arrogant little shit in a Misubishi thing that decided on Saturday that shoving me into the gutter was the easiest way to move over into the left lane at the last minute, so he could turn left, was no myth.

And then when I bailed him up at the lights, he just shrugged his shoulders and laughed. Big joke, eh.

Nope, it's no myth. Some of them (NOT all, but some) really are appallingly bad drivers, and worse, they don't give a shit. And they actually think they are perfect- note the comment from the Asian woman in the other news article
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10359469
And the one that sits at roundabouts for 2 or 3 seconds because she can't figure it out - then no doubt decides the easiest way out of her dilemma is to pull out in front of the oncoming bike , cos it's smaller than her cage.

[enigma51]

Yeah I wonder how its a myth when at the bottom it reads

* September 2005: Chinese student Xhong Hen Ding, 23, is killed and four other Asian students injured when a car rolls 200m down Christchurch's Port Hills and off a 20m cliff.

* May 2005: West Auckland mother Karen Jolly is killed when her car is struck by out-of-control "boy racer" Kok Kie. The 38-year-old is jailed for two years and ordered to pay $35,000 in reparation.

* April 2005: Huntly coroner warns of more accidents involving overseas drivers after an inquest into the deaths of Yuan Zhang, 20, and his girlfriend, Shuang Yang, 19, who died when their car crossed the centre line and collided with a light truck.

* February 2003: A 5-year-old girl is killed and her father seriously injured when Ding Yan Zhao, 19, crashes his car into a Waikato service station while trying to avoid police. Zhao is later deported after serving six months in prison.

* May 2001: Within a period of 11 days, three Asian students die in separate crashes near Christchurch, Nelson and Te Anau.

[The_Dover]

With all these bloody asians, south africans and poms on the road New Zealand's becoming a pretty dangerous place to be eh?

Bloody foreigners ruining our green and pleasant land. Headbutt them all I say!!

[Marmoot]

Well I for one am not saying it is a myth or not.
But there are 2 sides in every coin, don't you think?

If you only focus to the statistic, then all kind of conclusion can be drawn depending on how you process the data (and what conclusion you want to come out).
That is why Scientific Methods require the researcher to first make an anti-hypothesis and entirely disprove that to draw a valid conclusion, as opposed to simply twiddle with the statistics to support their original assumptions.

There are also numerous near-misses by non-asians. Not to mention fatalities in the non-asian populations that did not get mentioned in the statistics in the post above. Where is that Maori lady driving drunk with her baby on board? Or 4 Pacific Islander kids killed in South Auckland this year? There was a caucassian died in Piha when his car rolled down the bank (and probably some more unmentioned). And if we talk about crossing centreline, why are the german tourist accidents not mentioned? There is also a question whether africans are counted as asians. Or, is there only White/Maori against non-native?

The debate is too open and has a moot point.

Personally, my conclusion is: there are a hell lot of bad drivers out there with various skin colours.

Maybe the debate should not centre on whether asians are bad drivers or not, but rather focus on whether our overall drivers quality are good enough or not. I think when even 15 year-olds, who does not know what's right or wrong and are in their rebelious years, are permitted to get in control of what the government refer to as 'lethal machine' without the requirements for proper education in the process then there is definitely something wrong with our driving system. :slap:

[kerryg]

You can dance this subject as much as you like and quote all the statistics you like but dammit it's absolutely fecking obviouis to anyone who regularly drives in Auckland how USELESS a good proportion of Asian drivers are. Of course there are awful drivers of every race, age, colour, religion, whatever but on average you are far more likely to see incomptetent driving if the driver's Asian. Fact. Just go drive around Auckland. Stuff the statistics,I'm tired of being PC

[Marmoot]

You can dance this subject as much as you like and quote all the statistics you like but dammit it's absolutely fecking obviouis to anyone who regularly drives in Auckland how USELESS a good proportion of Asian drivers are. Of course there are awful drivers of every race, age, colour, religion, whatever but on average you are far more likely to see incomptetent driving if the driver's Asian. Fact. Just go drive around Auckland. Stuff the statistics,I'm tired of being PC

yea, far more likely to see. because white and black are not colours. That's not PC, that's technical in physics definition.

[Hitcher]

Irrespective of the "facts", this is a classic example of where perception has become the reality. LTNZ will be pushing it up hill for a while.

At least New Zealand has yet to degenerate to the level shown during the weekend's fracas outside the Cronulla Surf Lifesaving Club...

[kerryg]

yea, far more likely to see. because white and black are not colours. That's not PC, that's technical in physics definition.


I don't know what you mean, sorry.

I'm not saying that Asians (and really I'm talking about recent immigrants) are bad people. I'm saying their driving, on average, is poor in comparison to the average kiwi driver. I will say the same about a good many teenage drivers. And quite a lot of very elderly drivers. It's obvious if you drive regularly around Auckland. It's BS to deny it.

[Marmoot]

I don't know what you mean, sorry.

I'm not saying that Asians (and really I'm talking about recent immigrants) are bad people. I'm saying their driving, on average, is poor in comparison to the average kiwi driver. I will say the same about a good many teenage drivers. And quite a lot of very elderly drivers. It's obvious if you drive regularly around Auckland. It's BS to deny it.

I'm just saying perhaps they surface up because they are more prominent. That they are different.
I drive and ride around Auckland. And I find same proportion of bad drivers from all race and creed.
Do you swear "damn blonde!" when a blonde almost hit you the same as you swear "damn asian driver" when an asian almost hit you? Most people don't. And that signals different perception to incidents that heavily dependant upon the perpetrators. Hence, the conclusion that "Asian drivers are worse than others".

And to complicate matters, where do you classify the teenage drivers and elderly drivers you mentioned in your post above? Since we are debating driving quality based on race, shouldn't they belong to their respective race too instead of being boxed into separate "teenage drivers" and "elderly drivers"? If you do that, I'm quite sure that would even things out a bit and perhaps change your original perception in the previous post.

[Damon]

I've seen some pretty shocking driving in this crap hole, and often the person behind the wheel is asian, and then we find out that they've just paid for their licence rather than actualy earned it, how am i expected to resect a driver when they just hand over cash rather than prove their worth on the road, LTNZ are full of shit!!

[kerryg]

I'm just saying perhaps they surface up because they are more prominent. That they are different.
I drive and ride around Auckland. And I find same proportion of bad drivers from all race and creed.
Do you swear "damn blonde!" when a blonde almost hit you the same as you swear "damn asian driver" when an asian almost hit you? Most people don't. And that signals different perception to incidents that heavily dependant upon the perpetrators. Hence, the conclusion that "Asian drivers are worse than others".

And to complicate matters, where do you classify the teenage drivers and elderly drivers you mentioned in your post above? Since we are debating driving quality based on race, shouldn't they belong to their respective race too instead of being boxed into separate "teenage drivers" and "elderly drivers"? If you do that, I'm quite sure that would even things out a bit and perhaps change your original perception in the previous post.


Well if your observations don't coincide with mine I'm at a loss to account for it. But that doesn't alter what I observe on a daily basis. Anyway I can't be arsed having an argument about it. You can neatly try to categorise my comments as racist or something if that suits your particular pre-disposition. Help yourself. They're not though, which is why I made reference to other readily recognisable (by age rather than ethnicity) groups of drivers who similarly stand out out as being, in a disproportionate number of cases, poorer drivers than average. So I guess I'm racist and ageist. Shame on me.

[Fart]

After talking to a number of overseas tourist (includes Europeans and Poms) and ex-pat NZers, NZ drivers are one of the worst in the world. Most kiwi drivers and riders have delusions of grandeur on the road - we all think we are as good if not better than Rossi and Schumaker. Hence why NZ has such high road deaths stats.


I've seen some pretty shocking driving in this crap hole, and often the person behind the wheel is asian, and then we find out that they've just paid for their licence rather than actualy earned it, how am i expected to resect a driver when they just hand over cash rather than prove their worth on the road, LTNZ are full of shit!!

I on the other hand didnt pay for my licence. I got it out of the Weetbix packet, thank you very much ! Get your fucken facts right ! Are all South Islanders Sheep farmers? It is a know fact, is it not? Abit like JAFFAS are all assholes? Well, a few in here are... LOL

Oh shit, am I stereotyping and generalising again? Me bad man, vely vely bad man ! ...lmao !

[Waylander]

Do you swear "damn blonde!" when a blonde almost hit you the same as you swear "damn asian driver" when an asian almost hit you? Most people don't.
I do. Usually along the lines of, "Stupid Blonde!!" "Fucking old peaple" Cock sucking boy racer" "Idiot Asian" "God Damned Brit" "Jerk ass American"
The last two happend to have thier countries flags on their vehicle. and the "Idiot Asian" does come out more often cause they are the ones that do stupid shit on the road the most. Atleast that I see.


Another question slightly off topic, why are Russians not called Asians? Russia is part of asia isn't it?

[Marmoot]

Well if your observations don't coincide with mine I'm at a loss to account for it. But that doesn't alter what I observe on a daily basis. Anyway I can't be arsed having an argument about it. You can neatly try to categorise my comments as racist or something if that suits your particular pre-disposition. Help yourself. They're not though, which is why I made reference to other readily recognisable (by age rather than ethnicity) groups of drivers who similarly stand out out as being, in a disproportionate number of cases, poorer drivers than average. So I guess I'm racist and ageist. Shame on me.

I was not implying that you are racist. However, I do believe your observation was not done objectively enough. It was made against a group just because of partial observation on the fact without looking at the other side to balance and check your conclusion.
I also tried to explore whether your response on incidents caused by other race group would be similar to ones caused by Asian group or not. There is a possibility that you did not view many no-asian incidents simply because you do not observe they are happening (no special bias, resulting in not registered in mind).

Bad Asian drivers are still far from being the majority (definition: 50% + 1) in Asian driver group. Hence the assumption "Asian drivers are bad drivers" are not valid in the situation.

A more proper and useful debate is to focus on how to improve overall NZ driving quality and awareness instead of focusing on finger-pointing. The later would only cause a stereotyping, dissent, racial-hatred, worse assumptions and more finger-pointing.

[Marmoot]

I do. Usually along the lines of, "Stupid Blonde!!" "Fucking old peaple" Cock sucking boy racer" "Idiot Asian" "God Damned Brit" "Jerk ass American"
The last two happend to have thier countries flags on their vehicle. and the "Idiot Asian" does come out more often cause they are the ones that do stupid shit on the road the most. Atleast that I see.

Good on you.



Another question slightly off topic, why are Russians not called Asians? Russia is part of asia isn't it?
my question since I understand the word "superpower"
But they sure hell don't look like Asians as we know it :wait:
You sure they are not included in "europe" part?

[The_Dover]

Another question slightly off topic, why are Russians not called Asians? Russia is part of asia isn't it?

It spans two continents. As does Turkey.

The continental divide is along the Ural Mountains.

[Waylander]

my question since I understand the word "superpower"
But they sure hell don't look like Asians as we know it :wait:
You sure they are not included in "europe" part?
Nah, Russia is part of the Asian contenint(probably spelled that wrong) so technically they are asians aswell. I think it's more that for peaple that have not spent alot of time in The Orient it's hard to tell the difference between, a Mongolian, Chinese, Japanese, Korean or what have you.

[Fart]

The last two happend to have thier countries flags on their vehicle. and the "Idiot Asian" does come out more often cause they are the ones that do stupid shit on the road the most. Atleast that I see.


There is evidence that American's are buying up all our prime beach front properties and building $20 million holiday homes. You rich bastards ! You guys are vely vely bad people. :killingme

[Marmoot]

If europe gets its own continent name despite sharing land border with Asia, how come South America is not considered separate continent? Afterall, it has smaller land border with North America compared to Europe-asia border.

:blip:

[Fart]

I tried really hard to buy a drivers licence, but they wouldnt sell it to me after all the bad press release. After a long and hard discussion with my girlfriend, I went out and bought myself a packet of Weetbix and found a free licence inside.

Yehhhaaaa ! I can now drive in NZ !

Me vely happy !:blip: :2thumbsup

[Waylander]

If europe gets its own continent name despite sharing land border with Asia, how come South America is not considered separate continent? Afterall, it has smaller land border with North America compared to Europe-asia border.

:blip:
Um as far as I'm aware south america is considerd a seperate contenant. Just share the name given them on behalf of the explorer that actually figured out that they were not the Philippines.

[The_Dover]

If europe gets its own continent name despite sharing land border with Asia, how come South America is not considered separate continent? Afterall, it has smaller land border with North America compared to Europe-asia border.

:blip:

It is.

Europe, Asia, Africa, North America, South America, Antarctica and Oceania are all seperate continents.

Tectonic plates or some shit.....

[kerryg]

NZ drivers are one of the worst in the world. Most kiwi drivers and riders have delusions of grandeur on the road - we all think we are as good if not better than Rossi and Schumaker.


Yes, I've heard that.

But I think we are at risk of missing the point: what is being discussed here is whether Asian drivers are (on average) worse than even the average (arguably) "awful" NZ driver. I note that that Asians are not over-represented in the RTA statistics and also that the report characterised them as tending to be cautious. Fair enough. It's hesitation, failure to signal, sudden stopping, failing to anticipate, getting in the wrong lane etc. Things that don't necessarily cause accidents but do show poor driving skills and habits, but don't show in statistics. Which means you can't point to hard data and say "see, I'm right". But that doesn't make it incorrect.

[Motu]

And the one that sits at roundabouts for 2 or 3 seconds because she can't figure it out - then no doubt decides the easiest way out of her dilemma is to pull out in front of the oncoming bike , cos it's smaller than her cage.

I work outside a busy roundabout all day,on a good day we can have half a dozen ''accidents'',all races are involved,but Asians are involved in at least 50%,I'd say much more,but 50% is enough by themselves.The dithering and then pulling out is one of their biggest faults.We often hear horns tooting as they miss 4 good chances,then a blaring horn as they pull out on someone.All the accidents here are unreported,just minor dings - no way do LTNZ,the Herald or the Womans Weekly know what's happening daily on our roads.

[Marmoot]

Ooookay....now I just realized this fact:



Five Ways to Count Continents

#1 - Seven Continents
Africa - Antarctica - Asia - Europe
North America - South America - Oceania

#2 - Six Continents
Africa - Antarctica - Eurasia - Oceania
North America - South America

#3 - Six Continents
Africa - America - Antarctica
Asia - Europe - Oceania

#4 - Five Continents
Africa - America - Antarctica
Eurasia - Oceania

#5 - Four Continents
Eurafrasia - America - Antarctica - Oceania


And this is the entry in Wikipedia.com


The 7-continent model is usually taught in Western Europe, the United States, Australia, and much of Asia. In Canada, the government-approved Atlas of Canada names 7 continents and teaches Oceania instead of Australia. The 6-continent combined-America model is taught in Iran, and Latin America. The 6-continent Eurasia model is preferred by the scientific community, and as such is commonly found in all parts of the world, but is especially used in Russia and other countries of Eastern Europe, and in Japan. Historians may use the 5-continent model in which North Africa is separated from Sub-Saharan Africa and attached to Eurasia (Jared Diamond) or the 4-continent Afro-Eurasian model (Andre Gunder Frank).


Yes, America can be split into 2, and Russia can be included in Asia or not is entirely up to your point-of-view.

Wow. I've been quite wrong for some time and thought they are only America, Asia, Africa, Australia and Europe.

[judgeshock]

Yes, I've heard that.

But I think we are at risk of missing the point: what is being discussed here is whether Asian drivers are (on average) worse than even the average (arguably) "awful" NZ driver. I note that that Asians are not over-represented in the RTA statistics and also that the report characterised them as tending to be cautious. Fair enough. It's hesitation, failure to signal, sudden stopping, failing to anticipate, getting in the wrong lane etc. Things that don't necessarily cause accidents but do show poor driving skills and habits, but don't show in statistics. Which means you can't point to hard data and say "see, I'm right". But that doesn't make it incorrect.

To some extent I agree, however how often do we gather statistics on kiwi drivers? I also believe that the media play a huge part in showing us what is the hot topic of the day, they never seem to show a fair balance to each story.I can't really make a judgement without seeing all the statistics that you have.
I do tend to agree that their may seem to be alot of bad asian drivers out there, but is this somewhat our circle of perception? I guess living in Timaru where the amount of asian drivers is very few, I see lots of useless Kiwi drivers also.
A hot topic either way we look at it.:yes:

[Marmoot]

All the accidents here are unreported,just minor dings

That is an understatement. In my experience, minor dings is a more serious crime than burglary

It takes 3-7 days for police to turn up for burglary, but it normally takes them less than 1 hour for minor dings.
Not that I blame the police, of course. They turn up and that's good on them.

[onearmedbandit]

Ha! I'd love to see any average Kiwi driver survive in a big city enviroment for the first time, and for a while after that as well. In my time in Japan saw more traffic that I ever thought possible, and guess what it flowed properly, no one got lost or confused, saw no accidents, only seen one instance of road rage. Saw polite, patient, well educated drivers. Typical Kiwi attitude shown here, blatant ignorant generalisation.

What needs to be addressed in NZ backward laws in certain areas regarding road rules, and the lack of proper driver trsting carried out in this country. To get a licence in Japan costs a lot of money (ie you don't want to fail it at all so you practise lots) and also requires driver training. In NZ it requires a small display of car control and answering a few questions, which I've heard the testers provide the answers to if the applicant is struggling.

[kerryg]

However, I do believe your observation was not done objectively enough. It was made against a group just because of partial observation on the fact without looking at the other side to balance and check your conclusion.
There is a possibility that you did not view many no-asian incidents simply because you do not observe they are happening (no special bias, resulting in not registered in mind).


A more proper and useful debate is to focus on how to improve overall NZ driving quality and awareness instead of focusing on finger-pointing. The later would only cause a stereotyping, dissent, racial-hatred, worse assumptions and more finger-pointing.


I think you take too much upon yourself. So I am not objective, and (by implication) you are? This kind of didactic approach doesn't wash unless you support it with something more cogent than your own chauvinistic point of view. I personally find it disagreeable that you see yourself as being a proper arbiter of what is a "proper and useful debate". I don't grant you that right.

Stereotyping, finger pointing...what are you on about? Is it stereotyping to say that Maori are over-represented in crime statistics? Or finger pointing to say they suffer from diabetes disproportionately?

Anyway, enough. I really can't be stuffed.

[Waylander]

Ooookay....now I just realized this fact:



And this is the entry in Wikipedia.com


Yes, America can be split into 2, and Russia can be included in Asia or not is entirely up to your point-of-view.

Wow. I've been quite wrong for some time and thought they are only America, Asia, Africa, Australia and Europe.
Hmm never knew about the Oceana one. I'm guessing that's Australia, New Zealand and other pacific Islands? Kinda makes more sence in a PC sort of way.

[Eurodave]

Here in good old GodZone Im afraid that us true NZ born 'Kiwis' [both pakeha & maori] are fast becoming a minority, just take a stroll round Christchurch or worse yet Auckland, & which ethnic majority/s do you see everywhere...........ASIANS, albeit koreans,chinese, japanese, cambodian thai etc etc and an ever increasing amount of fijians,samoans,iraquis etc etc. We are now more, than ever before ,a multi cultural society.
[Bugger, I forgot the point I was trying to make:spudwhat: goes away to think]

[judgeshock]

Here in good old GodZone Im afraid that us true NZ born 'Kiwis' [both pakeha & maori] are fast becoming a minority, just take a stroll round Christchurch or worse yet Auckland, & which ethnic majority/s do you see everywhere...........ASIANS, albeit koreans,chinese, japanese, cambodian thai etc etc and an ever increasing amount of fijians,samoans,iraquis etc etc. We are now more, than ever before ,a multi cultural society.
[Bugger, I forgot the point I was trying to make:spudwhat: goes away to think]

I think it's fantastic if we can open ourselves to multiculturism.

[Ixion]

It may be that the NATURE of the badness is different. I suspect that "bad driving" differs in nature from country to country. We become accustomed to the common faults of our own country and automatically adjust for them. A different sort of "bad" catches us out. What I DO notice amongst Asians (and I know quite a few) is that they almost invariably think they are "perfect" drivers, when they are very far from it. I suspect that the Asian driver is the quintessence of LTSA driving - they know the rules perfectly, drive quite slowly and are completely oblivious of what is going on around them. This I find the main problem with Asian drivers - they just do totally stupid shit because they ignore what is happening around them on the road. Which is different to , say, elderly drivers. They can be bad too, but in a different way. And young guys are different again.

[The_Dover]

Here in good old GodZone Im afraid that us true NZ born 'Kiwis' [both pakeha & maori] are fast becoming a minority, just take a stroll round Christchurch or worse yet Auckland, & which ethnic majority/s do you see everywhere...........ASIANS, albeit koreans,chinese, japanese, cambodian thai etc etc and an ever increasing amount of fijians,samoans,iraquis etc etc. We are now more, than ever before ,a multi cultural society.
[Bugger, I forgot the point I was trying to make:spudwhat: goes away to think]

Gotta disagree there ED.

Since the sun has been shining I've been walking around and noticing nothing but fine totty of all races wearing next to nothing. Just the way I like it.:bleh:

[kerryg]

I guess living in Timaru where the amount of asian drivers is very few, I see lots of useless Kiwi drivers also.



No offence intended, so please don't take offence. Timaru's a lovely town (I visit it a couple of times a year)...but are there ANY Asians there? I live in Auckland. Auckland is not Timaru .

[Marmoot]

I think you take too much upon yourself. So I am not objective, and (by implication) you are? This kind of didactic approach doesn't wash unless you support it with something more cogent than your own chauvinistic point of view. I personally find it disagreeable that you see it yourself as being a proper arbiter of what is a "proper and useful debate". I don't grant you that right.

Stereotyping, finger pointing...what are you on about? Is it stereotyping to say that Maori are over-represented in crime statistics? Or finger pointing to say they suffer from diabetes disproportionately?

Anyway, enough. I really can't be stuffed.

I think you take too much upon yourself too. I am not implying that I am 100% objective. I am merely pointing out the fact that some of your arguments were made based on partial fact only and in a public forum where arguments can influence others then this has to be pointed out to prevent public misunderstanding.

If you see me as being a proper arbiter, then thank you. I have no intention of being one and was merely suggesting a more appropriate recourse for public's time. A discussion on improving New Zealand driver quality would be more appropriate and productive, and that is a suggestion. If I were a moderator and has locked the topic then you can properly disagree.

I am sorry but I am entirely at lost with your last point. What were you trying to establish here? For clarification's sake, I don't believe saying "Maoris are over-represented in crime statistics" to be stereotyping, but saying "Maoris are most-likely to be criminal" simply because of quite a number of Maoris did crime would be stereotyping. As Hitcher would agree, I'm sure.
I believe "finger-pointing" would be more appropriate when you see a head-on collision involving an asian driver and the first thing popping in your mind would be "must be the asian driver's fault". or is this stereotyping too?

[Eurodave]

I think it's fantastic if we can open ourselves to multiculturism.


Yeah, wot he said. There are bad drivers/riders of all nationalities,races ,creeds, ages, sexes, & religions everywhere.:slap: Just lets be carefull out there folks so we can each live to ride/drive another day:rockon:

[judgeshock]

No offence intended, so please don't take offence. Timaru's a lovely town (I visit it a couple of times a year)...but are there ANY Asians there? I live in Auckland. Auckland is not Timaru .

Yes you are correct, I imagine out of the 30,000 people that live here probably only a couple of dozen are Asian. Hard for me to really have thoughts on this issue without more first hand experience.
No offence taken, this is certainly a hot topic around the place :yes:

[Marmoot]

Yeah, wot he said. There are bad drivers/riders of all nationalities,races ,creeds, ages, sexes, & religions everywhere.:slap: Just lets be carefull out there folks so we can each live to ride/drive another day:rockon:

and to praise Dover, same logic applies to the other side of the story:
there are nice chicks of all nationalities, races, creeds, ages, sexes (err...no...sorry....) & religions everywhere :banana:
Don't forget the rubber so you can each live to ride another day

[Al]

With all these bloody asians, south africans and poms on the road New Zealand's becoming a pretty dangerous place to be eh?

Bloody foreigners ruining our green and pleasant land. Headbutt them all I say!!

Well, the Kiwi drivers do not have any accidents, no drink driving and no speeding...... Shit, I am now a citizen, will have to lose my driving skills, put a loud pipe on the cage too....

Nah mate, there are bad drivers from all nationalities on the NZ roads!

Al

[Swoop]

What I DO notice amongst Asians (and I know quite a few) is that they almost invariably think they are "perfect" drivers, when they are very far from it.

So asians really ARE genuine kiwis then!!!
ALL kiwi drivers think that their driving is perfect.:lol: :2thumbsup

[kerryg]

I think you take too much upon yourself too. I am not implying that I am 100% objective. I am merely pointing out the fact that some of your arguments were made based on partial fact only and in a public forum where arguments can influence others then this has to be pointed out to prevent public misunderstanding.

If you see me as being a proper arbiter, then thank you. I have no intention of being one and was merely suggesting a more appropriate recourse for public's time. A discussion on improving New Zealand driver quality would be more appropriate and productive, and that is a suggestion. If I were a moderator and has locked the topic then you can properly disagree.

I am sorry but I am entirely at lost with your last point. What were you trying to establish here? For clarification's sake, I don't believe saying "Maoris are over-represented in crime statistics" to be stereotyping, but saying "Maoris are most-likely to be criminal" simply because of quite a number of Maoris did crime would be stereotyping. As Hitcher would agree, I'm sure.
I believe "finger-pointing" would be more appropriate when you see a head-on collision due to a car crossing the centreline and the first thing popping in your mind would be "must be an asian driver". or is this stereotyping too?


Marmoot

You're probably a nice fella but I really don't think you're making an attempt to grasp what I've said. Not to agree with it necessarily, but to read and think and then respond. I am not interested enough in this "discussion", if I may characterise it so generously,to keep laboriously re-stating and clarifying my point of view for you. Let's agree to disagree. I'm a red-neck. There. You win. I'm nicely categorised,. Now we can move on.

[Marmoot]

Marmoot

You're probably a nice fella but I really don't think you're making an attempt to grasp what I've said. Not to agree with it necessarily, but to read and think and then respond. I am not interested enough in this "discussion", if I may characterise it so generously,to keep laboriously re-stating and clarifying my point of view for you. Let's agree to disagree. I'm a red-neck. There. You win. I'm nicely categorised,. Now we can move on.

well, uh....not really my point there about the redneck bit :confused:
But yeah, I agree on one thing. I'm quite a nice fella :blip:

[Swoop]

It is.

Europe, Asia, Africa, North America, South America, Antarctica and Oceania are all seperate continents.

Tectonic plates or some shit.....

Forgot Australia - I know it has been raised in previous posts.
Todays totally useless piece of information:
Australia is the ONLY country in the world that has to defend and police an entire continent.
Can't you all feel your brains filling up with these wonderful facts!:lol: :killingme

[The_Dover]

Forgot Australia - I know it has been raised in previous posts.
Todays totally useless piece of information:
Australia is the ONLY country in the world that has to defend and police an entire continent.
Can't you all feel your brains filling up with these wonderful facts!:lol: :killingme

Not really, Australia is the major land mass of Oceania. Start calling it it's own continent and those noisy wankers will start believing their own hype...........

oh hang on..........:lol:

[kerryg]

well, uh....not really my point there about the redneck bit :confused:

Actually this is the really ironic thing. You have set out from the beginning to characterise anyone and everyone (I will safely assume overwhelmingly comprising Pakeha NZers) who says "Asians are bad drivers" as being less than objective, only partially informed, selective in their observations, guilty of stereotyping and finger pointing.... (read your own posts)...i.e. rednecks, racists, whatever. What is that? Inverse racism, isn't it?

[Marmoot]

Australia is the ONLY country in the world that has to defend and police an entire continent.

Not valid! If Australia IS the entire continent, then New Zealand belongs to Asia? :crazy:

[Marmoot]

Actually this is the really ironic thing. You have set out from the beginning to characterise anyone and everyone (I will safely assume overwhelmimgly comprising Pakeha NZers) who says "Asians are bad drivers" as being less than objective, only partially informed, selective in their observations, guilty of stereotyping and finger pointing.... (read your own posts)...i.e. rednecks, racists, whatever. What is that? Inverse racism, isn't it?

Not really. I was set out to straighten public's opinion from the biased and sensationalist opinions aired in the Newspaper (well, if it is not sensational then it wouldn't sell) by pointing out the flaw in their conclusion-making process. I wasn't trying to accuse anybody as racist or redneck.

And my posts implied that if this sensationalist and biased opinion continues then it would lead to widespread stereotyping and finger pointing, and racism. I came from a country with high level of racism, and I know where it started. Not from a great rethoric by a great leader, but by everyday assumptions and mislead facts amongst commoner. Surely we do not want NZ to degenerate to something such?

[Swoop]

Not valid! If Australia IS the entire continent, then New Zealand belongs to Asia? :crazy:

I think we are on the "daggy bit" between two plates (mind your step)...
Hmm, having ockers all off on their lonesome dosen't seem tooooo bad an idea...:whistle: :drinknsin

[Marmoot]

I think we are on the "daggy bit" between two plates (mind your step)...

reminds me of a small spot on top of a crack on women anatomy.....

No wonder it's nice living here :whistle:

[Hitcher]

My head hurts. Apart from seeing why several people failed to pass School C Geography and English, and why some Americans think Libido is the capital of Paraguay, we are no closer to understanding the alleged "problem" of Asian drivers. Remember, everybody has to come from somewhere, and that New Zealand is a nation of immigrants. You should always walk a mile in sombody else's shoes. At the end of that experiential journey you're a mile away, and you've got their shoes...

[boomer]

It spans two continents. As does Turkey.

The continental divide is along the Ural Mountains.

bugger me.. you went to one of those school things dint ya:spudbn:

[WINJA]

MY WIFE IS SOME SORT OF ASIAN AND HER DRIVING IS GOOD , SHE THINKS OUR DRIVING IN HER COUNTRY IS TERRIBLE.
SHE STICKS TO THE SPEED LIMIT AND ALWAYS INDICATES WHICH IS MORE THAN I CAN SAY FOR MOST OTHER PEOPLE I KNOW.
SAYING THAT I KNOW A CHINESE STUDENT VERY YOUNG GUY AND HE BOUGHT THE FASTEST SUBARU HIS DAD COULD AFFORD , HE GOT DISQUALIFIED THEN CAUGHT DRIVING WHILE DISQUALIFIED , HE FIGURED OUT THE PIGS HAD FLAGGED HIS CAR , SO HE BOUGHT AN EVEN FASTER SKYLINE AND GAVE THE SUBARU TO HIS UNLICENCED GF .
BOTH CARS WERE DENTED TO FUCK FROM USING THE PARKING BY BRAILLE TECHNIQUE. THE ABOVE IS COMMON WITH YOUNG CHINESE STUDENTS , THEY KNOW IF THEY KILL SOMEONE THEYLL JUST BE SENT HOME

[speedpro]

My wife is Asian as well and she is a great driver. Her opinion of the typical "Asian" driver in AK is not that good. If we ever saw something dodgy happening she'd be the first to guess an Asian driver. Typically she'd be right. It's just a fact.

[WINJA]

WORST DRIVERS IVE SEEN WERE MY TONGAN NEIGHBOURS, ABOUT 6 OF THEM SHARED THE SAME LICENCE , I USED TO GO OUT WITH THEM ALOT , THEYD DRIVE EVERY WHERE AT ABOUT 25 KMH , CEPT ON THE MOTORWAY SOMETIMES THEY GOT UP TO 40 KMH , I LOST COUNT OF THE AMOUNT OF TIMES THEY PARKED THEIR CAR IN THE NEIGHBOURS HEDGE OR THEIR OWN FENCE , OR THRU THE BACK OF THEIR GARAGE .

ON INTREPID JOURNEYS AT THE MOMENT THEIR TALKING ABOUT ROAD RULES , AFTER YOUVE KILLED YOUR THIRD PERSON ON THE ROAD IN INDIA YOU LOSE YOUR LICENCE , SORTA SOUNDS LIKE THE CHINESE STUDENTS HERE IN NZ

[Marmoot]

...and why some Americans think Libido is the capital of Paraguay...

sorry to be out of topic, but how do you pronounce 'libido'?
Is it lee-bee-dow? or is it Li-bee-do (Li as in 'Bisexual')?
I saw this word a few times during the past 2 days and curiosity got the better of me.

[Waylander]

My head hurts. Apart from seeing why several people failed to pass School C Geography and English, and why some Americans think Libido is the capital of Paraguay, we are no closer to understanding the alleged "problem" of Asian drivers. Remember, everybody has to come from somewhere, and that New Zealand is a nation of immigrants. You should always walk a mile in sombody else's shoes. At the end of that experiential journey you're a mile away, and you've got their shoes...
Well pardon me for having a random thought, lol. Here is another for ya Hitcher, kinda along the same lines.
Is the middle east part of Asia aswell, or is it part of Europe? If it's part of Asia, why are they not called Asians aswell? Does anybody really care about the middle east?

[Hitcher]

sorry to be out of topic, but how do you pronounce 'libido'?
Is it lee-bee-dow? or is it Li-bee-do (Li as in 'Bisexual')?
I saw this word a few times during the past 2 days and curiosity got the better of me.
Li as in lip
bi as in bee
do as in "Doe a deer a female deer, Ray a drop of golden sun, Me the name I call myself, Far a long long way to run... [Apparently Grizzly bears don't like show tunes]

[James Deuce]

Well pardon me for having a random thought, lol. Here is another for ya Hitcher, kinda along the same lines.
Is the middle east part of Asia aswell, or is it part of Europe? If it's part of Asia, why are they not called Asians aswell? Does anybody really care about the middle east?

The Middle-East is the Eurasian interstice.

[geoffm]

IMO, and based on information from others in the community, one of the problems with Asian drivers was some of students that came in in the past Many had dodgy licenses, no license, or just poor skills and experience on NZ's crap roads. Combine with cheap, fast cars, freedom from the folks, a peer group and money, and it all ends in tears.
geoff

[Marmoot]

so, erm....talking about continents.... what's the pasifika people then? Australis or Asiaticus?
Or is it true that some place just don't belong into those continental areas?

[Hitcher]

Well pardon me for having a random thought, lol. Here is another for ya Hitcher, kinda along the same lines.
Is the middle east part of Asia aswell, or is it part of Europe? If it's part of Asia, why are they not called Asians aswell? Does anybody really care about the middle east?
Here's a random answer.

A lot of these descriptors are hangovers from our colonial age. "The Middle East" is the "Far West" from our point of view. American news agencies would have you believe that "Asia" includes everything from Saipan to Iran and also including us poor fuckers who, depending on which Merkin classroom map you use as a reference either exist twice, or not at all. There's bugger all in common between your average Japanese, Pakistani, and rednecked Tui drinker. Unless you're an "Asian" news anchor with an American accent...

Sorry. Back to your question. You forgot Africa. Why can't the Middle East be part of Africa? I wonder what the people who live there call it? Probably something that losely translates as "home", I suspect.

[Marmoot]

Africa is from Egypt to southwest of it.
Middle East is definitely not Africa.
err....hang on....actually, is Egypt middle east too?

[Hitcher]

so, erm....talking about continents.... what's the pasifika people then? Australis or Asiaticus?
Or is it true that some place just don't belong into those continental areas?
Gahhhhh!

Enough with this already.

A continent is a single land mass. In fact a quite large land mass. By definition a fucking big ocean containing a few scroty islands cannot be a continent. Therefore speculating about how its occupants should be classified, based on some continentally-inspired nomenclature, is an exercise in fantastic futility. And please, don't get started on the Olympic rings.

[Waylander]

Odd how something I just sorta thought of earlier today has led to all this and now seems to be causing Hitcher some problems.:2thumbsup

[Marmoot]

Gahhhhh!

Enough with this already.

A continent is a single land mass. In fact a quite large land mass. By definition a fucking big ocean containing a few scroty islands cannot be a continent.
Therefore speculating about how its occupants should be classified, based on some continentally-inspired nomenclature, is an exercise in fantastic futility. And please, don't get started on the Olympic rings.

sHEESH....so impatient :doh:
was just gonna start on the rings, actually.
And then Lemuria and Atlantis discussion coming up too....

[WINJA]

Odd how something I just sorta thought of earlier today has led to all this and now seems to be causing Hitcher some problems.:2thumbsup
ARENT YOU CANADIAN , IT MUST BE CONFUSING FOR YOU

[Waylander]

ARENT YOU CANADIAN , IT MUST BE CONFUSING FOR YOU
Texan actually. Yes I know, Bush country but we hate that guy. Only elected him president so the rest of the country could enjoy the misery we had with him as govener.

[kro]

Ive fallen victim to shiteloads of different drivers, and can't honestly say that Asians have any sort of majority. In fact if truth be told, the worst drivers I have encountered are the "silvers", who are the 65+ brigade, who travel at 40kph in a 50k zone, and then suddenly, with no indication, make a right hand trun from the centre of their lane.\

They are easily identifiable, as they mostly drive Misti Colts, or Diahatsu Charades, with a tartan rug thrown over the back seat, or a bowling hat up in the rear window tray (if driving a sedan)

Approach with caution.

[tracyprier]

Ha! I'd love to see any average Kiwi driver survive in a big city enviroment for the first time, and for a while after that as well. In my time in Japan saw more traffic that I ever thought possible, and guess what it flowed properly, no one got lost or confused, saw no accidents, only seen one instance of road rage. Saw polite, patient, well educated drivers. Typical Kiwi attitude shown here, blatant ignorant generalisation.

What needs to be addressed in NZ backward laws in certain areas regarding road rules, and the lack of proper driver trsting carried out in this country. To get a licence in Japan costs a lot of money (ie you don't want to fail it at all so you practise lots) and also requires driver training. In NZ it requires a small display of car control and answering a few questions, which I've heard the testers provide the answers to if the applicant is struggling.

But that's the point, we aren't talking about Japanese but people of Chinese origin. It is a well publicised fact that you can just buy your licence in China without showing any ability or skill behind the wheel of a car. Then they turn up here and the bloody LTSA let them drive here on their worthless licences for one year.

Someone needs to clue up the LTSA to this fact.

[Lou Girardin]

Here's some generalisations from my time as a driver tester:
Chinese drivers are slow and oblivious to anything around them, they learn enough by rote to get a licence and that's all they do.
Koreans aren't called the Italians of Asia for nothing.
Middle eastern people have real problems with speed control.
Kiwi learners are good while they're new, retesting drivers who've been driving a while shows their true level of arrogance mixed with incompetence.
Russians are quite good drivers and their women are gorgeous.
Many elderly drivers shouldn't be on the road, but their saving grace is that they tend to use roads they know well and usually cope OK.
Some driving instructors don't warrant the name. They don't even teach correct driving posture.

[Damon]

Here's some generalisations from my time as a driver tester:

Ahh haa! an opinion from someone with educated experience! a nice round up of the different drivers there Lou, pretty much confirms what we all though, russian women are HOT!!!

[Fart]

My wife is Asian as well and she is a great driver. Her opinion of the typical "Asian" driver in AK is not that good. If we ever saw something dodgy happening she'd be the first to guess an Asian driver. Typically she'd be right. It's just a fact.

My wife is European from Europe. She has the opinion that NZ drivers are one fo the worst in the world. Inconsiderate, impatient and with delusions of grandeur making them drive like lunatics on "P". Mind you, I drive like a lunatic at times, so do most of the KB riders in here. Figure why we have accidents on KB regularly, especially on organised rides, but yet do dont complaint kiwi riders. :stupid:

[Marmoot]

But that's the point, we aren't talking about Japanese but people of Chinese origin.*snip*

That's right. We're talking about Asian drivers, so Japanese shouldn't be included.

As Hitcher said: "By definition a fucking big ocean containing a few scroty islands cannot be a continent."

That definition should also covers Koreans, Srilankans, Indonesians, Philipinos and a few others, including HongKongese and Taiwanese.

Oh, and Hawaians are not Americans. :killingme

[James Deuce]

That's right. We're talking about Asian drivers, so Japanese shouldn't be included.

As Hitcher said: "By definition a fucking big ocean containing a few scroty islands cannot be a continent."

That definition should also covers Koreans, Srilankans, Indonesians, Philipinos and a few others, including HongKongese and Taiwanese.

Oh, and Hawaians are not Americans. :killingme

Not Koreans or half of Indonesia.

You may want to get a map out.

Not Americans? There's two great f__king continents right there.

[Marmoot]

but Mr. Hitcher said..... :bash:

[The Stranger]

It is very difficult to quantify using statistical data, however it is easy to see the problem on a commercial basis.

It is not that long ago that rental car companies in NZ loaded premiums for asian drivers. I am not sure if they still do as in our current PC climate as it is probably ilegal.

[James Deuce]

but Mr. Hitcher said..... :bash:

Something that I think you've grossly misunderstood.

[Marmoot]

Something that I think you've grossly misunderstood.

I thought so too.....it started when I asked whether NZ islands belong to Australian continents or Asia, because according to other info "Australia is the only country in the world that police entire continent", ergo the entire continent belongs to Australia. And because NZ does not belong to Australia (or does it?) then it is not part of Australia Continent.

Anyway, my logic seems to have serious flaw in here, so I'm off to get a can of Fresh Up now.... :slap:

[SlashWylde]

With all these bloody asians, south africans and poms on the road New Zealand's becoming a pretty dangerous place to be eh?

Bloody foreigners ruining our green and pleasant land. Headbutt them all I say!!

Oi! don't forget the French, can't have any of those fucking Frogs on our roads either now can we...

[Swoop]

reminds me of a small spot on top of a crack on women anatomy.....

No wonder it's nice living here :whistle:

Ahhh, the best place on the entire planet! My tonge likes to spend time there....

[Waylander]

Oi! don't forget the French, can't have any of those fucking Frogs on our roads either now can we...
Ooh!! Those damned dirty French!!:bash:

[The_Dover]

Oi! don't forget the French, can't have any of those fucking Frogs on our roads either now can we...

Everyone knows the French are a bunch of fags and will only drive poofy french cars with wafer thin panels, that are usually broken down anyway.

Fuckin snail eating surrender monkeys.

And you can normally smell them coming too.

[WINJA]

That's right. We're talking about Asian drivers, so Japanese shouldn't be included.

As Hitcher said: "By definition a fucking big ocean containing a few scroty islands cannot be a continent."

That definition should also covers Koreans, Srilankans, Indonesians, Philipinos and a few others, including HongKongese and Taiwanese.

Oh, and Hawaians are not Americans. :killingme
ID HAVE TO SAY THAT JAPANESE DRIVERS ON A WHOLE ARE GREAT . IVE MET A COUPLE OF JAPS WHO WOULD GIVE A LOT ON THIS SITE A DRIVING/RIDING LESSON AND THEYD BE HUMBLE ABOUT IT .
AS FOR CARS AND DRIVING ONE THING TO REMEMBER IS THAT WE BUY THEIR SECOND HAND RUBBISH AND THINK WE ARE COOL DRIVING IT . JAPAN IS A COUNTRY OF CARS AND DRIVERS , JUST LOOK AT THEIR TUNING SHOPS AND RACING SCHOOLS

[WINJA]

CANT BELIEVE NO ONES NOT COMMENTING ON MY PARKING

[RantyDave]

February 2003: A 5-year-old girl is killed and her father seriously injured when Ding Yan Zhao, 19, crashes his car into a Waikato service station while trying to avoid police.
This *still* makes me feel sick thinking about it. I mean, shit, we're nearly three years on from this and the thought of watching your five year old daughter getting smeared across a service station by some fuckwit boy racer.... Shit. I shouldn't go there.

Was talking to my neighbour last night about the subject of bikes, going quickly, and personal responsibility. Like, when's the last time a bike crashed killing all four occupants?

Dave

[Pixie]

That's right. We're talking about Asian drivers, so Japanese shouldn't be included.

As Hitcher said: "By definition a fucking big ocean containing a few scroty islands cannot be a continent."

That definition should also covers Koreans, Srilankans, Indonesians, Philipinos and a few others, including HongKongese and Taiwanese.

Oh, and Hawaians are not Americans. :killingme
And anything east of Greece.
Asia...From the Greek,meaning "over there"

[scumdog]

This *still* makes me feel sick thinking about it. I mean, shit, we're nearly three years on from this and the thought of watching your five year old daughter getting smeared across a service station by some fuckwit boy racer.... Shit. I shouldn't go there.

Was talking to my neighbour last night about the subject of bikes, going quickly, and personal responsibility. Like, when's the last time a bike crashed killing all four occupants?

Dave

And remember: The driver in that scenario would have paid ONE ACC levy, the motorcyclist who at best could kill one or two is charged a larger ACC levy - where's the logic??????:slap: :angry:

[Motu]

CANT BELIEVE NO ONES NOT COMMENTING ON MY PARKING

You stupid fucking idiot!! Possums sometimes sleep in those things! You could of killed one,or worse yet a whole family! You were lucky mate,fucking lucky.....

[Lou Girardin]

C'mon Spud, you know the levy is not calculated on potential body count. Just on how likely you are to get hurt by someone else.

[The_Dover]

Fuck, me and Maurice sometime sleep in those things when we get pissed up at country YMCA meetings and staggering home just becomes too much of a mission.

You were lucky WINJA, Maurice really gets the horn after a few bevvies and being woken by a man in leather woulda been too much for him. Even if I had his leash on I couldn't have controlled him. He's a big boy....

[scumdog]

C'mon Spud, you know the levy is not calculated on potential body count. Just on how likely you are to get hurt by someone else.


D'ya mean me??

The getting hurt by somebody else bit applies too - witness the three-car pile-up near here - 1 dead, two likely to be and one undecided plus 6 with various degrees of injury that will require months of physio etc.
And only 3 ACC levies (well 2 - one car wasn't registered ofr warranted) pay for all this??

[Hitcher]

Fuckin snail eating surrender monkeys.
Cheese-eating surrender monkeys.

And you can normally smell them coming too.
That must make faking it incredibly hard...

[Sniper]

Farking asians. Not all of them though. Only ones in Honda's and things that make that pish noise

[Marmoot]

Farking asians. Not all of them though. Only ones in Honda's and things that make that pish noise

Dammit! Lucky my lowered-car is not turboed, or otherwise I would be offended :mad:

I mean, what's wrong with my Honda?

[Test Pilot]

i not overly racist but asian drivers are shiite, dont look, dont care, dont think, pretty much sums up the majority of them. and what the hell is up with wearing little gloves in there 1999 honda accord (that isnt exctly a non power steering, torque eating beast) cant they hold the wheel properly or are they affraid there cousin or son has the bird flu. personaly i think they should have to go through harder test fot there licences and those with overseas ones should need to do a more extensive test rather than just being given it

[Lou Girardin]

i not overly racist but asian drivers are shiite, dont look, dont care, dont think, pretty much sums up the majority of them. and what the hell is up with wearing little gloves in there 1999 honda accord (that isnt exctly a non power steering, torque eating beast) cant they hold the wheel properly or are they affraid there cousin or son has the bird flu. personaly i think they should have to go through harder test fot there licences and those with overseas ones should need to do a more extensive test rather than just being given it

The cotton gloves are to prevent their hands getting tanned.
I used to get them to remove them on tests. Nothing like gloves on a slippery steering wheel when you're trying to avoid that truck you just didn't see right in front of your face.

[The_Dover]

Cheese-eating surrender monkeys.


Nope, many countries eat and are famed for cheese but only those dirty garlic scented coq munchers are famed for their taste for the gastropod.:weird:

[Motu]

You gotta laugh at those ''Tweety Bird'' sun shades that stick on windows with a sucker - they stick them on the drivers window!! DUH!! Like....''I didn't see you''....no,and I didn't see you either,hiding behind Tweety Bird.

[Marmoot]

You gotta laugh at those ''Tweety Bird'' sun shades that stick on windows with a sucker - they stick them on the drivers window!! DUH!! Like....''I didn't see you''....no,and I didn't see you either,hiding behind Tweety Bird.

well *duh* it's yellow. The same colour as the driver. What are you moaning about not being able to see him? :nono:

[Motu]

Her...invarably her with a sunshade stuck to the drivers window....also invarably Asian,never seen a Samoan,or an Eastern European,or a Westie with one stuck on the drivers window....

[Marmoot]

Her...invarably her with a sunshade stuck to the drivers window....also invarably Asian,never seen a Samoan,or an Eastern European,or a Westie with one stuck on the drivers window....

nah mate. They do the Tazmanian devil on the back wheel. But they never look out their window either even without the shades.

Actually, most car drivers don't look out their windows.

Argh! Damn those harley/cruiser riders don't look side too at times!

Feckin bicycles also ride like crap, going slow and 3 side by side trundling along on public road.

In fact, those stagecoach bastards leapfrogging each other like bastards leapfrogging each other.

Then we have the taxi drivers doubleparking and u turning like crazy.

Not to mention the truckies! They are big so they think they own the road???

Kill them all I say! Let only sportsbike and horses own the road. In fact, ban the dirty horses too! :ar15: :ar15: :ar15:

[Motu]

I got a Beep! Beep!

[Lou Girardin]

Nope, many countries eat and are famed for cheese but only those dirty garlic scented coq munchers are famed for their taste for the gastropod.:weird:

You surprise me Dover, I thought you lived by the "don't knock it till you've tried it credo".

BTW esargot are delicious

[The_Dover]

You surprise me Dover, I thought you lived by the "don't knock it till you've tried it credo".

BTW esargot are delicious

I worked as a chef in France for fucks sake but I eating slimy little snot rockets is just horrible.

Nearly as bad as eating pussy.

[Lou Girardin]

I worked as a chef in France for fucks sake but I eating slimy little snot rockets is just horrible.

Nearly as bad as eating pussy.

I've never tried garlic pussy.

[Test Pilot]

The cotton gloves are to prevent their hands getting tanned.
I used to get them to remove them on tests. Nothing like gloves on a slippery steering wheel when you're trying to avoid that truck you just didn't see right in front of your face.


To stop them getting tans, how pathetic is that

[Lou Girardin]

To stop them getting tans, how pathetic is that

It was a revelation dealing with the various Asian peoples.
Things like asking the same question of different staff to see if they get the same answer.

[Hitcher]

Nearly as bad as eating pussy.
I understand that it tastes like beaver...

[FEINT]

Asian drivers.... what and who is asian? Yellow people born in NZ, are they asian? Well, they sure look asian.

Those "asians" that drive on NZ roads, those who are licensed, those who didn't buy their licenses, those who didn't get them out of weetbix boxes and are still shit .... should have never received a drivers license from the LTSA... ... that should go for all non-asians as well.... :blip:

I drive around Auckland and I encounter crazy dangerous drivers from all ages and races.

:blip: :blip: :blip: :blip:

[Brett]

Some of the worst drivers I know are Asian, however some of the best are Asian too! It isn't the races problem, it is the environment they were taught to drive in, what was accepted as ok, and how they were inspected before getting their licenses!
I live in Howick, so see a lot of asian drivers doing stupid things, have nearly been killed by people of all races!
In fact, i had someone do a u turn across me on Pakuranga highwaythat drove into the side of me...how the hell they didn't see me i don't know...i sure couldn't see them come out of the sie road untill it was farrrrrr too late.
You can'e just balme the asians for bad driving...some of my kiwi mates are pretty damn shit...
Must say, some of the ASIAN IMMIGRATED asians around this area would have to take the cake tho...

[WINJA]

asian drivers.... what and who is asian? yellow people born in nz, are they asian? well, they sure look asian.

those "asians" that drive on nz roads, those who are licensed, those who didn't buy their licenses, those who didn't get them out of weetbix boxes and are still shit .... should have never received a drivers license from the ltsa... ... that should go for all non-asians as well.... :blip:

i drive around auckland and i encounter crazy dangerous drivers from all ages and races.

:blip: :blip: :blip: :blip:
you stick to the kung fu and rice and leave the driving/riding to us, everyone knows you chinese are shit on the road , if you wanna to handle a vehicle good you need to be part fijian and part scottish like me

[Marmoot]

you stick to the kung fu and rice and leave the driving/riding to us, everyone knows you chinese are shit on the road , if you wanna to handle a vehicle good you need to be part fijian and part scottish like me

Well taken, but you gotta admit your average manhood size is smaller than our western asians (that is middle east) brothers :motu:

[WINJA]

well taken, but you gotta admit your average manhood size is smaller than our western asians (that is middle east) brothers :motu:
i think youd be mistaken , i said im part fijian , not chinese,mine looks like a baby holding onto an apple

[Marmoot]

...mine looks like a baby holding onto an apple

Once I stop laughing I might think of posting a response to this :niceone:


Btw, :love:

[WINJA]

once i stop laughing i might think of posting a response to this :niceone:


btw, :love:
have you got some colour as well?

[Rashika]

To stop them getting tans, how pathetic is that
one of the biggest sellers in tourist shops is Whitening cream, to make you look whiter....bizarre IMHO ...and nope that aint no joke :yeah:

[Marmoot]

have you got some colour as well?

nope. Mine seems to appear normal.

Does yours have a slightly greenish/blueish tip? I suggest checking it out with your doctor asap.

[Fart]

one of the biggest sellers in tourist shops is Whitening cream, to make you look whiter....bizarre IMHO ...and nope that aint no joke :yeah:

The funniest I see when I am at the beach are Asians & Islanders all hide under the shade, while the whities stay all day in the sun trying to get that all natural tan. And you wonder why skin cancer is such a big problem here.:shifty: :rofl: :crazy:

[Rashika]

The funniest I see when I am at the beach are Asians & Islanders all hide under the shade, while the whities stay all day in the sun trying to get that all natural tan. And you wonder why skin cancer is such a big problem here.:shifty: :rofl: :crazy:
yep...doesn't take much to see why does it? I wonder why we have such a thing about trying to get a tan? :spudwhat:

[Skyryder]

If LTNZ wanted to do something consructive on road saftey they should run a campaign for ASIAN DRIVERS so that they know our driving laws and what the road signs MEAN.

Skyryder

[Fart]

If LTNZ wanted to do something consructive on road saftey they should run a campaign for ASIAN DRIVERS so that they know our driving laws and what the road signs MEAN.

Skyryder

A compulsory defensive driving course for all new immigrant drivers would be good and not just for "Asian Drivers". As we know, I got my licence from a Weetbix packet !

[Marmoot]

A compulsory defensive driving course for all new immigrant drivers would be good and not just for "Asian Drivers". As we know, I got my licence from a Weetbix packet !

a compulsory defensive driving couse for everyone would be better.
As long as it is afordable. Better yet, get those battered-piece-o-shite cages out of the road.

On the other hand, it might induce more unlicensed-drivers simply because they cannot afford to get licensed? :brick:

Compulsory 3rd party insurance perhaps?

[Motu]

I was sent on a Defensive Driving Course by the courts as part of a Dangerous Driving charge,very common in those days when the DD course first started.Now I drive a Pajero....musta learned something out of it eh?

[Grahameeboy]

If LTNZ wanted to do something consructive on road saftey they should run a campaign for ASIAN DRIVERS so that they know our driving laws and what the road signs MEAN.

Skyryder

So NZ drivers are better and know the rules?? Isn't this a bit prejudice...before Asian drivers became a so called problem (which I don't agree is fair) NZ had the 2nd worst road toll per head of population despite having one of the lowest average speed limits.....plus some of our driving laws are dangerous which does not help classic eg indicate for at least 3 seconds before moving.....fuck anyone you cut up cause you have followed the rules or how about the rules for roundabouts which contradict eachother.....

Noodles for Thought!!

[Lou Girardin]

.plus some of our driving laws are dangerous which does not help classic eg indicate for at least 3 seconds before moving.....fuck anyone you cut up cause you have followed the rules or how about the rules for roundabouts which contradict eachother.....

Noodles for Thought!!

What's dangerous about indicating your intentions in advance?
Ther's no contradiction in the roundabout rules either.

[Marmoot]

I was sent on a Defensive Driving Course by the courts as part of a Dangerous Driving charge,very common in those days when the DD course first started.Now I drive a Pajero....musta learned something out of it eh?

Totally right, motu. couldn't be any more defensive than sitting in a Pajero.

:rockon:

[Grahameeboy]

What's dangerous about indicating your intentions in advance?
Ther's no contradiction in the roundabout rules either.

Mmmm, actually checking that it is safe to move?? Agree you need to indicate but you still have to makes sure it is safe to move...indicating does not give you the right to just pull out....

Look at the Road Code pages on roundabouts with lanes which does not make sense with 12 o'clock rule...

[scumdog]

Totally right, motu. couldn't be any more defensive than sitting in a Pajero.

:rockon:

A marked Police car helps too - but not ALL the time!:(

[WINJA]

totally right, motu. couldn't be any more defensive than sitting in a pajero.

:rockon:


wanker......

[Marmoot]

wanker......

LOL :killingme

[Skyryder]

So NZ drivers are better and know the rules?? Isn't this a bit prejudice...before Asian drivers became a so called problem (which I don't agree is fair) NZ had the 2nd worst road toll per head of population despite having one of the lowest average speed limits.....plus some of our driving laws are dangerous which does not help classic eg indicate for at least 3 seconds before moving.....fuck anyone you cut up cause you have followed the rules or how about the rules for roundabouts which contradict eachother.....

Noodles for Thought!!

Noodles for Thought???????...............Not for me.

Of course we're better. We've lived here longer and have had more experiance for our driving conditions. And yes we have had to pass a driving licence not pay some fucking AA tester to write out the licence for us.

Not too sure of the stats with your claim that we are the 2nd worst road toll per head of population but will not claim any different than yourself on this. Your example of the 'dangerous' 3 second driving law is wrong. The 3 second indication is before commenceing a turn or change lane etc. Not as you state 3 seconds before moving. One thing I do agree with you on is the roundabout rule. No idea where that one came from. Andy Knackers from LTNZ probably had a junket to Asia and saw it there so thought he would make Asians feel more at home..........'bout the only explanation I can come up with.

Skyryder

[Marmoot]

And yes we have had to pass a driving licence not pay some fucking AA tester to write out the licence for us.

Just happen to be interested in the numbers, so could someone please tell me how many of them actually pay AA testers to pass the license test?

Anyone also happen to have the total number of Asian drivers in NZ?

[myvice]

Foreign drivers aren’t to blame for the accidents that they are involved in!
Its perfectly acceptable to do a U-turn on a one way road, and backing out of your drive at 90k's an hour is standard practice...
The "pulling over to your left then swinging into a drive on the right side of the road without even realising you car has indicators or mirrors" technique will be in the revised road code so you better study up!

[Skyryder]

Ther's no contradiction in the roundabout rules either.

Yes there is. On a normal intersection if you are going straight through you are not required to use the indicator.

On a roundabout intersection if you are going straight through you are required to use an indicator.

Now if that's not a contradiction I don't know what is.

Skyryder

[myvice]

Indicators? We don’t need no stinking indicators!

[Lou Girardin]

Mmmm, actually checking that it is safe to move?? Agree you need to indicate but you still have to makes sure it is safe to move...indicating does not give you the right to just pull out....

Look at the Road Code pages on roundabouts with lanes which does not make sense with 12 o'clock rule...

You're talking about different things here, where does the road code say "indicate and pull out"?

[Lou Girardin]

Just happen to be interested in the numbers, so could someone please tell me how many of them actually pay AA testers to pass the license test?

Anyone also happen to have the total number of Asian drivers in NZ?

It was around 100 that they traced.

[Lou Girardin]

Yes there is. On a normal intersection if you are going straight through you are not required to use the indicator.

On a roundabout intersection if you are going straight through you are required to use an indicator.

Now if that's not a contradiction I don't know what is.

Skyryder

They are two different intersections. One is a ROUNDABOUT, it has different rules because the layout is different.
Simple really.

[Marmoot]

It was around 100 that they traced.

so, the proportion to total number of Asian drivers in New Zealand would be....?

[Lou Girardin]

so, the proportion to total number of Asian drivers in New Zealand would be....?

Very small.
But what is not said, are the number driving on false o'seas licences and the number that don't bother with a licence at all. We'll never know these numbers because there are no processes in place to identify them.
For all LTNZ's blathering about road safety, they are remarkably casual about driver training and licencing.

[Marmoot]

the number that don't bother with a licence at all.

And that is exclusive to Asians? or 95% Asians? Any decent statistics here? Or simply general assumptions without supporting numbers (which may as well be off. perhaps there is a silent majority that are not normally reported because they are 'simply normal' and not suitable for selling newspaper or political issues?)

On top of that, I fail to see the justification for the 'very small' number as indicated in Lou's post being mentioned as the major argument everytime this debate comes up.

[Hitcher]

One of the reasons behind the LTNZ-inspired CBTA license programme was to get unlicensed bikers licensed. Apparently there are "heaps" (rounded to the nearest whole integer) of unlicensed bikers.

[Biff]

Here in good old GodZone Im afraid that us true NZ born 'Kiwis' are fast becoming a minority, just take a stroll round Christchurch or worse yet Auckland, & which ethnic majority/s do you see everywhere...........ASIANS, albeit koreans,chinese, japanese, cambodian thai etc etc and an ever increasing amount of fijians,samoans,iraquis etc etc. We are now more, than ever before ,a multi cultural society.
[Bugger, I forgot the point I was trying to make goes away to think]



Bloody brilliant isn't it. I love diverse societies.


Anyhoo - back to the topic in hand - Yes, on the whole, in general (yes - I admit to generalising), 'Asians' (although it depends which country they're originaly from) are even worse drivers than Kiwi's IMO.

Why? Just take a look at the nations that they hail from (as per OAB's comments) and the big cities that they (in general) learnt to drive in. In China people generally ignore traffic lights and very rarely use their indicators. The driving standard there is appalling, and there is very little by the way of traffic law enforcement there (but heaven forbid you accuse the govt of incompetency). But they (the drivers) cope with traffic volumes several times that which we experience here. In Malaysia and Korea the driving standard is somewhat better, and possibly on a par with NZ drivers.

The only 'open' country in Asia I haven't travelled to over the last 2 years is Japan. So I like to think I'm experienced in witnessing the driving standards in many Asian countries. Although I admit to never have driven anywhere in Asia myself. I'm not brave enough!

But spend some time here driving, then travel around Europe. You'll soon see how crap NZ drivers are compared to the majority of the 'developed' western world. And I include some Asian countries.

It's kinda amusing seeing how irate some people here get with Asian drivers, considering your pretty crap yourself.

(Biff ducks and large objects and insults are hurled at him for telling the truth as he sees it).


My head hurts. Apart from seeing why several people failed to pass .. [B]English.

You should always walk a mile in sombody else's shoes.

What's it like to be almost perfect ?

[Lou Girardin]

One of the reasons behind the LTNZ-inspired CBTA license programme was to get unlicensed bikers licensed. Apparently there are "heaps" (rounded to the nearest whole integer) of unlicensed bikers.

One reason for which was the LTNZ 'loosing' hundreds of old bike licences when they changed to photo licences.

[Fart]

Take a trip around Europe, especially Italy. By the sound of things, most in here have not travelled much. Goes to show the ignorance.

[Skyryder]

They are two different intersections. One is a ROUNDABOUT, it has different rules because the layout is different.
Simple really.

Yes it is simple. Both are intersections. And both have different rules as to the use of indicators. Layout is only to expedite traffic flow.

But your original post states that there are no contradictions and now you say they have different rules due to layout. Which is exactly my pont.



Skyryder

[Lou Girardin]

Yes it is simple. Both are intersections. And both have different rules as to the use of indicators. Layout is only to expedite traffic flow.



But your original post states that there are no contradictions and now you say they have different rules due to layout. Which is exactly my pont.
Skyryder

I can't believe you were a professional driver. Take a look at the Panmure or Royal Oak roundabouts and then tell me that X intersection rules will work.
All this smacks of justifying why people are too lazy to drive properly.

[Ixion]

I can't believe you were a professional driver. Take a look at the Panmure or Royal Oak roundabouts and then tell me that X intersection rules will work.
All this smacks of justifying why people are too lazy to drive properly.

*NOTHING* will work on the Panmure roundabout. I emailed the guy who drew up the new rondabout rules. He admitted he lived in Christchurch and had no experience of roundabouts aother than the 4 way 90 degree types. But said he'd "be happy to takeon comments about more complicated roundabouts."

Bloody wallys from the provinces thinking they know how to write rules for big cities. Piss off unless you live in a 1000000 + city

[Ixion]

One of the reasons behind the LTNZ-inspired CBTA license programme was to get unlicensed bikers licensed. Apparently there are "heaps" (rounded to the nearest whole integer) of unlicensed bikers.


Yeah ? so ?

[Hitcher]

Yeah ? so ?
Yeah. So Asians don't hold the patent on being unlicensed. So there.

[Marmoot]

Yeah. So Asians don't hold the patent on being unlicensed. So there.

seems quite prominent amongst Maori and Pacific Islander communities too. And young white teenage males, for that matter.

Begs a question....drivers who breach their license conditions....should they get classified into the same box? <_<

[Hitcher]

should they get classified into the same box?
And which box would that be then, Ted?

[Marmoot]

And which box would that be then, Ted?

the "people whose vehicles exceed their legally permitted driving-capability" box.

(not the actual driving-capability)

[SPman]

Campaign aims to dispel bad Asian drivers myth

They're fuckin dreamin...........

[Skyryder]

Russians are quite good drivers and their women are gorgeous.

Use to carry three Russian woman on the shuttle. All three were a delight to talk to. If I was to pick a nationality for a wife. Russian, and British a distant second

Skyryder