New Vehicle Law, Vodascam and World Destruction

[StoneChucker]

1) I hear that from the 16th Jan '06, a new law comes into effect that gives police the power to give a $250 fine AND 10 demerit points, to any person they believe is driving a vehicle that is too noisy. They can do it by ear, no equipment or instrumentation. Wouldn't this give rise to unequal enforcement of the law? It would vary from officer to officer. If you had an attitude that the officer didn't like, it could just be slapped on as a punishment. I really think they should use db meters like they have been. I do support a strong stance against boy racers, they annoy the heck out of me, but this doesn't seem logical. I know police have a hard time policing these cretins, but why not give each police car/bike a db meter? (Note, I rarely get stopped, and I never have an attitude, but some people are more assertive than me...)

2) Vodafone seems to have sent everyone of their prepay customers a message, explaining that overseas text messages now cost only 30c each! They've always cost 20c, so their misleading "special offer" was a price hike of 50%. So many people seem to have noticed, that there was a news item on it on the radio around 8pm tonight.

3) I guess the world has had a "good" run so far, so we can't complain. We can't complain about bird flu arising from people in "certain" countries insisting on breeding so many poultry that they are forced to live inbetween them. We can't complain that those same people breed so many transitional animals, pigs for example, that they are forced to live inbetween them too, causing the transition of bird flu from bird to humans. We also can't complain that people are given so little information, that they allow their children to play with dead birds they've found in the wild, causing them to catch the H5N1 (bird flu) virus. Now we just wait for those birds to migrate, infect other species of birds which then migrate, etc... It seems more and more likely each day that bird flu as a pandemic is not a matter of if, but rather WHEN!

Hell, that doesn't matter, Iran starting up their nuclear research program against nuclear restrictions might be much more of a risk than bird flu. Being told by countries who already have nuclear arms, that they can't have, must be rather insulting. Noone having nuclear programs (for weapons) seems such an easy answer, that it'll never happen.

Oh, GreenPeace clearly rammed that whaling ship, when they claimed it was the other way round. Japan/China now want patrols over their ships to protect them. GreenPeace want escorts/patrols to protect them. Just wait till one patrol attacks another, doesn't war start that way? I totally support GreenPeace's stance against whaling, but I'm not so sure about using direct force againt them.

Funny, it seems life, and the world has problems in it. I've always thought it was like the Truman Show, I'm truly shocked :buggerd:

[N4CR]

Greenpeace had no choice but to hit it - large vessels are not maneuverable. Look at the wake from the Nissin Maru in the video and you can see the Jap ship has pulled a large sweeping turn to block the way of Greenpeace. There is an article on the front of the Harold proving what I first thaught.

Iran should have nukes, it will stop further aggression by that shithole Israel and also stop 'Amerika' invading should they need more natural resources. Funny how North Korea has been left alone isn't it? No natural resources and they have actually got nukes already. Of course they are less of a threat than Iran then, right? No they ain't.

Just leave them be and it's all good. Nukes will be a deterrent to war action. I would prefer there to be no nukes at all in the world but when one person has them, power is unbalanced and open for abuse, especially in the case of Israel/Iran.

Look at how India/Pakistan has stabilised quite a bit more than it used to now they both have nukes.
/rant

[Pixie]

1)
Oh, GreenPeace clearly rammed that whaling ship, when they claimed it was the other way round. :
bollocks.
The japs clearly charged their ship sideways at the bow of the hippy shippy.

PS Sea sheppard claim not to be part off Green Peace Corporation.
But they were started by one of the Green Peace Corporation s Founders.
They obviously claim no connection with GP Corp so that their violent piracy tactics don't reflect on their parent company.

I laughed when their stupid "can opener" folded over on the whalers' hull.

[scumdog]

Re No.1 - I work on this priciple: If I get complaints (from the public) it makes work for me, if it makes work for me - it makes tickets for them.

If the turds that insist on showing off thier boom-box/blow-off valve/exhaust note insist on showing off such stuff in a residential area late at night causing complaints then they know what to expect.
The local 'boy-racers' have all the life preservation instincts of a lemming, I mean how smart is it to leave the local Caltex with the stereo blaring, windows wound down, stoking the crap out of the car in 1st and 2nd gear (blow off valve 'pisshing' away and the zorst going blaaaaargh -blaaaaaargch)-- RIGHT PAST THE COP SHOP????

[Colapop]

You'd need some serious engineering to have a piece of equipment attached to your boat that tears holes in other boats (bulkheads etc) The phonecians used the ram their opponents head on coz side mounted apparatus destroyed too many of their own canoes! Oooh Aarrrr! Pirate talk.




Excuse me for saying this Stoney, but it's not ALL that bad is it?:calm:

[Deano]

1) I hear that from the 16th Jan '06, a new law comes into effect that gives police the power to give a $250 fine AND 10 demerit points, to any person they believe is driving a vehicle that is too noisy. They can do it by ear, no equipment or instrumentation. Wouldn't this give rise to unequal enforcement of the law? It would vary from officer to officer. If you had an attitude that the officer didn't like, it could just be slapped on as a punishment. I really think they should use db meters like they have been. I do support a strong stance against boy racers, they annoy the heck out of me, but this doesn't seem logical. I know police have a hard time policing these cretins, but why not give each police car/bike a db meter? (Note, I rarely get stopped, and I never have an attitude, but some people are more assertive than me...)


Hi Dave,

this is not dissimilar to the noise control provisions where a noise meter is not required to assess excessive noise from parties etc. There would be several difficulties I see with Police monitoring noise with a meter including:

1. Training of the operator.
2. Capturing the noise in question (would a boy racer replicate the noisy circumstances if the cop didn't get it on the noise meter. (This is similar to a cop not getting you on his radar but seeing you overtake him at over 120k - you can still get knicked)
3. Cost.
4. Validity of the equipment used.

A simple noise meter can cost you $150 from Dick Smith, but wouldn't stand up in court as technical evidence. A Type 1 or 11 noisemeter that is certified for use as evidence in court can cost you around $20- 30K.

A cheap noisemeter could be used to add weight to an officer's testimony but I don't believe it would not stand on it's own merits.

As far as unequal enforcement goes, that is and has been occurring since the dawn of the Police - best just to accept that and get over it. Police use discretion all the time - just don't ride late at night or rev it hard if your pipe is excessively loud. We have the boy racers to thank for this because of their 'circuits' and meeting places which isolate the noise nuisance to one area, pissing off the locals.

One thing that riles me is where did this legislation come from - my understanding is that they were able to issue a $150 fine under the boy racer legislation, which is already in effect isn't it ? So why the need for yet another bloody law.

[scumdog]

One thing that riles me is where did this legislation come from - my understanding is that they were able to issue a $150 fine under the boy racer legislation, which is already in effect isn't it ? So why the need for yet another bloody law.


I guess too many of the little f***ers never paid their fines - this way it's 5 noise tickets and your licence is gone for 3 months (20 demerits each time) - and you can just bet the noise tickets would not be the only demerit ones they would have got!!

[riffer]

Iran starting up their nuclear research program against nuclear restrictions might be much more of a risk than bird flu.

Iran having nukes is potentially a lesser problem for stability in the Middle East than their recent announcement that they would, in March, refuse to accept the US Dollar as the standard for sales of oil.

Some of you may recall that Iraq made a similar announcement about 6 months before the US attacked.

The US Dollar has been the official currency of oil worldwide, and moving to the Euro would have a massive destabilising effect on the US Dollar.

Enough so, that the US would find itself being forced to attack Iran, in orer to, like in Iraq, bring "democracy" to Iran.

First you see the demonisation of the country (Islamic terrorism, links to Al-Queda), then the "weapons of Mass Destruction, then finally, the attack will begin.

Take a close look at how the news media are working now. It's identical to 2001.

Expect another burning Reichstag/World Trade Centre - style event in the next month or two. The US won't allow the Euro to take over.

Then the troops will leave Iraq to go to Iran.

[awd]

Greenpeace had no choice but to hit it - large vessels are not maneuverable. Look at the wake from the Nissin Maru in the video and you can see the Jap ship has pulled a large sweeping turn to block the way of Greenpeace. There is an article on the front of the Harold proving what I first thaught.
How come a boat 10 times the mass was able to manoeuvre itself into an unmissable position? I don't agree with the whaling at all, but I also find the tactics and manipulation of Greenpeace (misnomer?) to be at about the same level in the proberbial barrel.

[James Deuce]

Seamanship.

Greenpeace are not above faking propaganda. The fella Taggart that set it up created and organisation as insidious as Ron Hubbard's Scientology. Suck the young in. Brainwash them. Put them in the line of fire so the "general public" get upset about the young and good looking being put at risk by grizzled sea captains.

[Lias]

Much thou I think the unwashed hippie masses in general need a good beating, I'm all for sinking a jap whaling boat. What pisses me off teh most is the whole "scientific research" fallacy.. We know its not for research, they know its not for research, but they insist on maintaining the lie. If they just out and out said "we're hunting it because its a freaking delicay" I'd object far less.

Iran is 100% entitled to refine its own nuclear fuel, and I sincerely hope they do manage to successfully create nuclear weapons and nuke the crap out of Israel. The world will be a much better place if it happens.

[James Deuce]

Don't forget, it isn't just Japan: Iceland, Greenland, and Norway all do "Whaling Research", and the Inuit nation is trying to find a way to get involved too.

[riffer]

If the Japanese are killing whales for scientific research, when can we expect to see the results of the research?

I guess it will be a three word report - "Whales taste yummy"

[MisterD]

How come a boat 10 times the mass was able to manoeuvre itself into an unmissable position? I don't agree with the whaling at all, but I also find the tactics and manipulation of Greenpeace (misnomer?) to be at about the same level in the proberbial barrel.

Pretty easy really, imagine a bloody great artic pulled across you and you only had engine braking to try to stop...

[MisterD]

If the Japanese are killing whales for scientific research, when can we expect to see the results of the research?

I guess it will be a three word report - "Whales taste yummy"

It'll be a bit more extensive than that I reckon...I'm nicking (I think) Douglas Adams' observation that what the Japanese are currently researching is how many whales they can catch in a day. Bastards.

If their real grounds for catching them (and this goes for the Norweigians too) is that it's a traditional part of their culture and diet etc etc yadda yadda, then fine, just as long as they do it from one of those old fashioned rowing boats.

[Grahameeboy]

I know this is a silly question but there are a few bikes with standard pipes that could be considered noisy in the wrong place or if in a low gear so what happens there....even my SV sounds noisy in built up areas due to the acoustics.......what is the score there Scumbag.......

[Biff]

Iran and nuclear weapons are a deadly mix IMO. Just take a look at the latest muppet/psycho/ideologist to 'run' the country. Well, not quite run the country, because it's the religious luddites that are really running the show there. They, and he, believe that Israel should be wiped off the face of the planet. Not necessarily a bad idea, but the death of millions of people, irrespective of their nationality, isn't a good thing in my book. The fear is that with radical clerics running the show, should they actually have access to a shiny red button that would, in effect, wipe Israel off the planet, they’d use it. And then the US and Israel would retaliate, and everything would get rather messy very quickly.

While it's somewhat hypocritical of the western world to attempt to dictate to other countries who should and shouldn't have a nuclear (weapon) capability, there are certain countries I feel shouldn't have nuclear weapons. And Iran, under the current regime, is one of them. Any country that preaches death to westerners as part of their school curriculum should be considered irresponsible and ever so slightly nutty. Even though if you every fancy visiting Tehran you'll be treated really well and welcomed like and old friend. Providing you're not American, or a jew, or both.

[scumdog]

I know this is a silly question but there are a few bikes with standard pipes that could be considered noisy in the wrong place or if in a low gear so what happens there....even my SV sounds noisy in built up areas due to the acoustics.......what is the score there Scumbag.......

Don't piss off the neighbours and other public late at night, don't stoke it past the cop-shop or any cops and you should be sweet.
It's the fuckwits who ruin it for all by blatting around town in convoy at 2am and testing out their stereo/blow-off-valve/zorsts that piss me off.
Theres plenty of 'noisy' bikes and cars that never get looked at - because the owners know when and when not to make noise.

Why wind your little shitbox to 5,0000pm in 1st when your going past a cop-shop and are not in a hurry???
Why play Rap-Crap at full volume - with all the windows wound down? The rest of the public never asked you to share your 'taste' in music with them.

End of rant but you can see where I'm coming from - it's NOT the sideways cap-wearing, pimple-necked, stinky-sneaker txting hoody-up on a 24 degree day teenagers that make the laws. or get annoyed by the aforementioned noises.

And it's Scumdog to you sonny.......

[Marmoot]

Don't piss off the neighbours and other public late at night, don't stoke it past the cop-shop or any cops and you should be sweet.
It's the fuckwits who ruin it for all by blatting around town in convoy at 2am and testing out their stereo/blow-off-valve/zorsts that piss me off.


Maybe for you, but what about the other constabulary staff?
I DO believe you would not ticket a tinted-visor wearer, but there has been others.

See where I'm getting at? :Pokey:

[MisterD]

[SIZE=2][FONT=Verdana] The fear is that with radical clerics running the show, should they actually have access to a shiny red button that would, in effect, wipe Israel off the planet, they’d use it. And then the US and Israel would retaliate, and everything would get rather messy very quickly.


..and on the plus side, that fear should help our immigration numbers and keep the housing market strong.

[Grahameeboy]

And it's Scumdog to you sonny.......

Sorry....genuine mistype........you can cal me 'Crapeeboy' if you like

Yeah I understand that, but for example...Victoria Road, Devonport makes my bike sound loud even at 4,000 revs in 3rd due to the way it is and also along Queen Street at 7am........I knew it sounded like a crap question but you only need one over zealous peeler.......I mean there is that Insurance Broker guy who was driving his $250,000 Merc with his Wife and Mum in the back who was stopped under the drag law for spinning his tyres......

[Hitcher]

Vodafone claims: If nobody is going to take legal action against Telecom for marketing 256k rate-limited ADSL as "broadband", I doubt much is going to happen about Vodafone misleading teenage girls about the true cost of international text messages.

Iran's nukes: So what. Iran has no recent history as a military aggressor. Their last major stoush was against a US-backed Iraq, which ended in a stalemate. Now Saddam is the bad guy. I'm sure that makes the Iranians sleep more soundly at night. Don't forget that Iran is islamic but is not an Arabic nation. They're Persians. No love lost there.

[scumdog]

Maybe for you, but what about the other constabulary staff?
I DO believe you would not ticket a tinted-visor wearer, but there has been others.

See where I'm getting at? :Pokey:

Ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..STOP IT!!

Yeah, we're all individuals but what i said holds true with the majority.:niceone:

[scumdog]

Sorry....genuine I knew it sounded like a crap question but you only need one over zealous peeler.......I mean there is that Insurance Broker guy who was driving his $250,000 Merc with his Wife and Mum in the back who was stopped under the drag law for spinning his tyres......

Maybe he DID spin the tires? The price of the wheels has nothing to do with the brains of the driver....

[Colapop]

Ve are only takink enuff Vhale to ensure there iz a soostainabul harvezt. Pleeze not makink mine peeplez to be bad like japanze Vhalink wessels are. Ve Vikinks are peeceful peeplz and not for pilag... pelag.. piillagi.... F*ck it!! Olaf, sound der horn - Ve attack!

[Grahameeboy]

Maybe he DID spin the tires? The price of the wheels has nothing to do with the brains of the driver....

I agree.....or the price of the car.....I mean think of all the bikes you could buy for that money

......he may have just sqealed the tyres pulling out of somewhere by accident......I park my Mazda MPV (yeah don't laugh) on a hill, it is automatic and sometimes my tyres grab and spin a little as I turn.......it happens...

[scumdog]

I agree.....or the price of the car.....I mean think of all the bikes you could buy for that money

......he may have just sqealed the tyres pulling out of somewhere by accident......I park my Mazda MPV (yeah don't laugh) on a hill, it is automatic and sometimes my tyres grab and spin a little as I turn.......it happens...

The 'media' showed a long black skid-mark on the road on the news last night, NOW if they got it right (doubtful) and the mark WAS left by the MB then I think it was more than 'spun a little'.

[Grahameeboy]

....remember I am 'Troller'.........

[Lou Girardin]

Using a shotgun approach here stonechucker?
The problem with relying on Police discretion is typified by the middle-aged, Merc driving "pillar of the community" who was done under the boy-racer law for sustained loss of traction. This isn't the first Populist politicians enact laws aimed at a section of lawbreakers and Plod uses it on everyone.

[Deano]

Using a shotgun approach here stonechucker?
The problem with relying on Police discretion is typified by the middle-aged, Merc driving "pillar of the community" who was done under the boy-racer law for sustained loss of traction. This isn't the first Populist politicians enact laws aimed at a section of lawbreakers and Plod uses it on everyone.

Hang on - should someone get away with sustained loss of traction because they are a pillar of society in a Merc ? Is he a good enough driver to control the vehicle in that situation any better than a boy racer ? Maybe, maybe not.

Good one them for applying the law consistently.

[pete376403]

It'll be a bit more extensive than that I reckon...I'm nicking (I think) Douglas Adams' observation that what the Japanese are currently researching is how many whales they can catch in a day. Bastards.

If their real grounds for catching them (and this goes for the Norweigians too) is that it's a traditional part of their culture and diet etc etc yadda yadda, then fine, just as long as they do it from one of those old fashioned rowing boats.

Eating whale meat only became "traditional" in japan at the end of WWII, when that was the only meat they could get. Besides, they are weird f*ckers - where else in the world would whale sperm be a "popular drink"?

[Grahameeboy]

Using a shotgun approach here stonechucker?
The problem with relying on Police discretion is typified by the middle-aged, Merc driving "pillar of the community" who was done under the boy-racer law for sustained loss of traction. This isn't the first Populist politicians enact laws aimed at a section of lawbreakers and Plod uses it on everyone.

There maybe some truth in them words Lou which highlights what I was trying to say.....but not all Plods overdo the use of laws......

[ManDownUnder]

Poison the whales!

The dead/harpooned/beyond help ones.

As they're going up the slipway, shoot a bloody big load of Cyanide into it. It'd be a more merciful dispatch for the whale and render the meat unusable... Maybe a dose of aresenic and/or mercury for good measure.

[Swoop]

If the Japanese are killing whales for scientific research, when can we expect to see the results of the research?

I guess it will be a three word report - "Whales taste yummy"
Nope, there'll be more than that...
What type of sauce goes best with each type of whale..
Best wine/saki to accompany...
Wasabi? You betcha...

[Lias]

Hang on - should someone get away with sustained loss of traction because they are a pillar of society in a Merc ? Is he a good enough driver to control the vehicle in that situation any better than a boy racer ? Maybe, maybe not.

Good one them for applying the law consistently.
I dunno, but I'm all in favour of making all the boy racer laws only apply to people under 25 :-)

[jazbug5]

PS Sea sheppard claim not to be part off Green Peace Corporation.
But they were started by one of the Green Peace Corporation s Founders.
They obviously claim no connection with GP Corp so that their violent piracy tactics don't reflect on their parent company.

Incorrect, tempting as it may be to think so. The guy who started the Sea Shepherd thing was indeed a founding member of Greenpeace, but stomped away as he didn't feel that they were radical enough any more and he wanted to be free to take more direct action. Plus he wasn't too keen on their 'corporate whoring'.
They are none too happy with the connection, it seems...

[Grahameeboy]

Hang on - should someone get away with sustained loss of traction because they are a pillar of society in a Merc ? Is he a good enough driver to control the vehicle in that situation any better than a boy racer ? Maybe, maybe not.

Good one them for applying the law consistently.

Good point but I guess it is the 'Intent' that is important......that is why hey have 'Murder' and 'Manslaughter'.......some is killed but reasons are different..

[Marmoot]

Yeah, we're all individuals but what i said holds true with the majority.:niceone:

True with the 'majority' bits.

But it only takes 1 to ruin my life.....if I ever get unlucky.

That is why I do not believe this matter should be an instant fine without check-and-balance measure such as the ones employed in breathtesting (with blood-testing option as safety net to filter the irregularities before putting the matter to court).

[Hitcher]

In some respects Greenpeace is like a religion -- particularly the love:hate responses it engenders. While it may have started as a 'noble cause' based on the beliefs of well-meaning conspiracy theorists, today it is just the Starbucks of environmentalism -- a global organisation that needs to publicise its activities to remain financially viable. A global organisation that the anti-globalisation nutters surprisingly seem to overlook.

Unlike Starbucks, however, it has no accountability structures: no board of directors elected by members, no published code of conduct, etc. Greenpeace is a corrupt and immoral manipulator of public opinion. They'll take your money but they're not interested in what you think. It's up to you to align with "them" (whoever "they" are).

[Deano]

I dunno, but I'm all in favour of making all the boy racer laws only apply to people under 25 :-)

You don't know any 'boy' racers over the age of 25 ?

Hooning around like an idiot isn't only the domain of the young.

[Deano]

Good point but I guess it is the 'Intent' that is important......that is why hey have 'Murder' and 'Manslaughter'.......some is killed but reasons are different..

This is where the courts would decide (if it goes that far). If for arguments sake he defends it and goes to court, I'd say he would get a much lesser penalty if he can prove there was little, if any intent involved (even if he lied, because after all, he is well respected and no-one would expect him to lie), as opposed to a backward cap wearing, snot nosed, unclean boy racer (no offence !!)

[kerryg]

Eating whale meat only became "traditional" in japan at the end of WWII, when that was the only meat they could get. Besides, they are weird f*ckers - where else in the world would whale sperm be a "popular drink"?


If whales are plentiful and their existence in good numbers is not threatened by limited harvesting and they are killed humanely the only objections one can make about whaling are based on emotion, romanticism, sentimentality etc etc. Some countries do not share our sentimentality about whales. That we are sentimental (and I find the killing of whales repugnant, so don't get me wrong) and they are not...well that's more our problem than theirs.

It could be argued that opposing whaling while sanctioning or at least not actively opposing other abhorrent things (big game fishing, the killing of other animals for sport, the fur trade, vivisection, for example) is hypocrisy.

I have heard a Japanese describe the whale as "the cow of the sea" and point out our enthusiasm for eating the meat of cows, while expressing horror that anyone would eat rabbit or a deer (a bit like eating a child's pet or a panda to a Japanese). We are less sentimental about these protein sources.

The images I've seen of whales being taken are pretty horrible and I hate to think of any animals undergoing such suffering but I wonder if we are missing the point: IF(I repeat) IF the Japanese were (1) legally taking whales (2) in limited numbers that represent no risk to the viability of each species and (3) killing them humanely, what right, moral or otherwise, would we have to oppose them doing so?

Just thought I'd run it up the flagpole...................

[Patrick]

Re No.1 - I work on this priciple: If I get complaints (from the public) it makes work for me, if it makes work for me - it makes tickets for them.

If the turds that insist on showing off thier boom-box/blow-off valve/exhaust note insist on showing off such stuff in a residential area late at night causing complaints then they know what to expect.
The local 'boy-racers' have all the life preservation instincts of a lemming, I mean how smart is it to leave the local Caltex with the stereo blaring, windows wound down, stoking the crap out of the car in 1st and 2nd gear (blow off valve 'pisshing' away and the zorst going blaaaaargh -blaaaaaargch)-- RIGHT PAST THE COP SHOP????

JEEZ I thought that just happened outside my cop shop...looks like we work to the same rule too BTW...

[Lou Girardin]

There maybe some truth in them words Lou which highlights what I was trying to say.....but not all Plods overdo the use of laws......

Maybe not, but giving the Police more and more powers tempts too many of them to use it indiscriminately.
The latest is the UK giving their Police the power of arrest for ANY offence "if the Officer believes it is reasonable to do so".
"He called me a power mad nazi, your Honour. I thought it was reasonable to arrest him for jaywalking"

[Patrick]

Ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..ow! that hurts my eye..STOP IT!!

Yeah, we're all individuals but what i said holds true with the majority.:niceone:

Gotta second that call...

but like anything, I suppose there are a few out there that dont like bikes (if that is possible) so they will ticket a tinted visor wearer (haven't known of that law though...) can see where you are coming from, but believe me, scummy described the "target" perfectly in his post.

[Lou Girardin]

Hang on - should someone get away with sustained loss of traction because they are a pillar of society in a Merc ? Is he a good enough driver to control the vehicle in that situation any better than a boy racer ? Maybe, maybe not.

Good one them for applying the law consistently.

But the legislation was sold to the great unwashed as a measure to deal with boy racers. That's why they thought it was a great idea.
Now it's used to target anyone they want.
As were speed cameras, "they are only being used to target the 15th percentile fastest drivers".
As were laser guns, "we only want to catch the clever speeders" - ad infinitum.
This is why you don't give away rights or grant Police powers lightly.

[Patrick]

It was actually introduced to deal with the problem of "thier actions," regardless of age, race, religion etc etc...not just the "youth" aspect. Boy racers come in all shapes and sizes...and ages!!! If a "pillar of society" wants to re-live his misspent youth, bad luck. He is not above the law.

[Deano]

It was actually introduced to deal with the problem of "thier actions," regardless of age, race, religion etc etc...not just the "youth" aspect. Boy racers come in all shapes and sizes...and ages!!! If a "pillar of society" wants to re-live his misspent youth, bad luck. He is not above the law.

Apparently he is claiming it was an accident and not intentional.

It is also reported that the traction control of the Merc was 'off'.

So, looks to me like this dick should'nt bite off more than he can chew. (If it was him that turned it off)

Removing the traction control is for people who know how to handle a car.

Suck eggs and pay the fine like every other pleb.

[Grahameeboy]

Apparently he is claiming it was an accident and not intentional.

It is also reported that the traction control of the Merc was 'off'.....

I still reckon guilt should be based on 'intent'....so he was stupid and turned off the traction control but does that make him guilty of 'Drag Racing' if he was not actually 'Dragging'.....I mean he had his Wife and Mum in the back for Bhudhas sake.....

[Ixion]

Hang on - should someone get away with sustained loss of traction because they are a pillar of society in a Merc ? Is he a good enough driver to control the vehicle in that situation any better than a boy racer ? Maybe, maybe not.

Good one them for applying the law consistently.


My understanding was that the law was enacted to deal with people doing do-nuts and burnouts. Not someone pulling out of an intersection.

I have mentioned before that Mrs Ixion (as timid and lawabiding driver as could be found - refuses to go over 70km, never drives on the motorway etc) has on occasion to negoitate starting off on a steep hill intersection in her Nissan Sunny. Almost invariably, the weight transfer of the front wheel drive car, and her "rev it up real high and then bunny hop away" technique, means that she gets a tyre squeal as she gets under way. She lives now in dread of being ticketed and having her precious Sunny impounded, for "sustained loss of traction". Was this what parliament intended? I doubt it.

I wonder what the REAL reason the cops had a down on the guy was?

[Lou Girardin]

1)


3) I guess the world has had a "good" run so far, so we can't complain. We can't complain about bird flu arising from people in "certain" countries insisting on breeding so many poultry that they are forced to live inbetween them. We can't complain that those same people breed so many transitional animals, pigs for example, that they are forced to live inbetween them too, causing the transition of bird flu from bird to humans. We also can't complain that people are given so little information, that they allow their children to play with dead birds they've found in the wild, causing them to catch the H5N1 (bird flu) virus. Now we just wait for those birds to migrate, infect other species of birds which then migrate, etc... It seems more and more likely each day that bird flu as a pandemic is not a matter of if, but rather WHEN!


When the virus mutates to be transmittable by other than direct contact. Until then you're at more risk from lightening

Hell, that doesn't matter, Iran starting up their nuclear research program against nuclear restrictions might be much more of a risk than bird flu. Being told by countries who already have nuclear arms, that they can't have, must be rather insulting. Noone having nuclear programs (for weapons) seems such an easy answer, that it'll never happen.
If you were the Iranian Govt being treatened by the worlds largest imperial power, wouldn't you want them too. Korea's looking pretty secure from attack isn't it?

:buggerd:

But what do I know.

[Grahameeboy]

My understanding was that the law was enacted to deal with people doing do-nuts and burnouts. Not someone pulling out of an intersection.

Agreed

I wonder what the REAL reason the cops had a down on the guy was?

Flash 'Fanny Magnet'...perhaps

[Darryboy]

She lives now in dread of being ticketed and having her precious Sunny impounded, for "sustained loss of traction".

That got me thinking, how long does the loss of traction have to be for it to be deemed 'sustained'?

[mstriumph]

.............................
Iran should have nukes, it will stop further aggression by that shithole Israel .....................

nice to see someone who doesn't allow his personal prejudices to colour his viewpoint lol


............................. and also stop 'Amerika' invading should they need more natural resources. Funny how North Korea has been left alone isn't it? No natural resources and they have actualy got nukes already...................................

i'm confused - you mean that north korea needs nukes to protect against amerika invading them for natural resources they haven't got?

.... i suppose that makes sense if you consider that america is also leaving zimbabwe alone [that is awash in natural resources and has NO nukes
to protect them] ... :msn-wink:


............................. I would prefer there to be no nukes at all in the world ........

i just KNEW there was something we could agree on :hug:


............................. Look at how India/Pakistan has stabilised quite a bit more than it used to now they both have nukes.
/rant
:sweatdrop now you are scaring me again ........

[Grahameeboy]

Maybe not, but giving the Police more and more powers tempts too many of them to use it indiscriminately.
The latest is the UK giving their Police the power of arrest for ANY offence "if the Officer believes it is reasonable to do so".
"He called me a power mad nazi, your Honour. I thought it was reasonable to arrest him for jaywalking"

I guess the Govt are now delegating powers to the Police to make them decision makers so poor old plod ends up in a dilemma and you are gonna get the over zealous plods doing anything that moves and the nice joe plod feeling peer pressure and of course the Govt will need figures to show that their dirty work is being carried out...........what a mess

[scumdog]

That got me thinking, how long does the loss of traction have to be for it to be deemed 'sustained'?

From my experience (with a soft judge) more than 2 seconds - less than that and he ammended the charge to 'Careless Use':woohoo: :rofl:

Screwed either way - unless you appear in Court less than 28 days after your car was impounded, at least then you get it back earlier (but MAYBE not your licence).

Let the Judge decide!

[Grahameeboy]

Geeze that is tough.....crazy world......does 'Careless Use' really cover less than 2 seconds.....I mean, say traffic is busy and to filter into traffic from an intersection you see a reasonable size gap (knowing that no one will let you out) and accelerate quickly to filter safely and the tyres squeal.......you can be found guilty of 'careless use'..........but to put in prespective, you go to the pub, drink just enough to keep you under the limit, you get stopped but intoxication 'legal' and you are not charged........which means that you can intentionally drink and drive upto a point but if you accidentally squeal your tyres you are 'careless' and you are charged for it.....gotta be something wrong there........

[Lou Girardin]

It looks like we're all 'careless' most of the time.
It's actually just another catch-all offence, "not the actions of a prudent driver"

[WINJA]

But the legislation was sold to the great unwashed as a measure to deal with boy racers. That's why they thought it was a great idea.
Now it's used to target anyone they want.
As were speed cameras, "they are only being used to target the 15th percentile fastest drivers".
As were laser guns, "we only want to catch the clever speeders" - ad infinitum.
This is why you don't give away rights or grant Police powers lightly.
I THINK MORE BOY RACERS WILL DO RUNNERS CAUSE OF THIS NEW LAW , IF YOU HAD 90 POINTS WOULD YOU WANNA STOP AND LOSE YOUR LICENCE FOR A NOISY EXHAUST , ESPECIALLY AS YOU KNOW ITS NO LOUDER THAN A BUS , TRUCK OR TRAIN BUT IN THE PIGS OPINION IT IS , FUCK YEAH MORE RUNNERS BRING IT ON .
I LIVE ON A 100 K STREETCH OF ROAD AND BOY RACERS TEST THEIR CARS HERE , BLOWN V8S WITH DUMP HEADERS , ROTORIES WITH A RUBBISH BIN SIZED MUFFLER OUT THE BACK YET THE ONLY THING THAT ANNOYS ME IS THE FUCKEN TRUCKS USING JAKE BRAKES AND MAKING A HUGE BANGING SOUND GOING OVER BUMPS WHEN THERE EMPTY , THE LAWS AN ASS AND SHOULD BE APPLIED TO ALL NOISY VEHICLES EVENLY OR NOT AT ALL, FUCK THE PIGS

[scumdog]

Geeze that is tough.....crazy world......does 'Careless Use' really cover less than 2 seconds.....I mean, say traffic is busy and to filter into traffic from an intersection you see a reasonable size gap (knowing that no one will let you out) and accelerate quickly to filter safely and the tyres squeal.......you can be found guilty of 'careless use'..........but to put in prespective, you go to the pub, drink just enough to keep you under the limit, you get stopped but intoxication 'legal' and you are not charged........which means that you can intentionally drink and drive upto a point but if you accidentally squeal your tyres you are 'careless' and you are charged for it.....gotta be something wrong there........

'Squealing' the tyres is a shit-load different to smoking them and leaving 10 metres of black strip on the road - we all know when our Dunlops a skidding, we all know to back off if we don't want trouble - and doing it on front of a cop is asking for trouble.

[scumdog]

It does - and that means stereos too.

[onearmedbandit]

where else in the world would whale sperm be a "popular drink"?

That's a new one on me. Where did you hear this from? I'll have to ask the wife about that!!

[N4CR]

i'm confused - you mean that north korea needs nukes to protect against amerika invading them for natural resources they haven't got?

.... i suppose that makes sense if you consider that america is also leaving zimbabwe alone [that is awash in natural resources and has NO nukes
to protect them] ... :msn-wink:


What I am trying to point out is that the 'war of terror' has no emphasis on decreasing terrorism what-so-evurr. North Korea has nukes and is a larger threat to stability around the world than Iran/wherever. It won't ever turn into Iraq2 because of the Nukes it has and the fact there are no resources/inscentives for Amerika to invade. If the murkins truely cared about 'errorism' and that sort of thing they would have put the boot down on North Korea. With a cost..

-Which I can picture already: 40,000 US troops wiped out in Nuke blast, 30,000 survivors with radiation poisoning. Hiroshima nuked again, 42159714853trillion dead, the missile comes from North Korea etc. (When/If their missile tech gets good enough.)

The saddest thing from all of these conflicts/spats is that when trade embargoes etc are enforced, (especially in the case of NK) it is the people that suffer and not the ones in charge. Good on ya dubaya! :2guns: Good thinking! Fuck yeah! Go team America! Piss and Misjustice for all!

[Marmoot]

THE LAWS AN ASS AND SHOULD BE APPLIED TO ALL NOISY VEHICLES EVENLY OR NOT AT ALL, FUCK THE PIGS

The noisiest things (and the most-polluting) around where I live are Stagecoach buses.
God knows why government has not done anything to address this.

[MisterD]

North Korea has nukes and is a larger threat to stability around the world than Iran/wherever.

North Korea a larger threat to stability than a country who's leader has stood up and said a neighbouring country is "a tumour that should be wiped off the map"? Methinks not.

[Lou Girardin]

'Squealing' the tyres is a shit-load different to smoking them and leaving 10 metres of black strip on the road - we all know when our Dunlops a skidding, we all know to back off if we don't want trouble - and doing it on front of a cop is asking for trouble.

It'll be an interesting defence to sustained loss of traction on a bike, "if I had backed off the throttle, I would have high-sided and crashed".
Doubtless there would be ample expert witnesses to support this.

[Grahameeboy]

'Squealing' the tyres is a shit-load different to smoking them and leaving 10 metres of black strip on the road - we all know when our Dunlops a skidding, we all know to back off if we don't want trouble - and doing it on front of a cop is asking for trouble.

I agree.....I was just raising pointers......I had this Toyota Corolla jobbie and once I accelerated out of a junction.....tyres grabbed, I was not hooning it, foot off the clutch and wheels still span for about 5 metres (15 feet) so not long and it was embarrasing......clutch must have grabbed or something.....like I said it should be the intent to 'burn rubber'.....

Laws are not consistent and this is where issues arise.....like my point about 'Drinking/Driving'.....we all know that any alcohol has the ability to affect your driving, even under the limit but the law still allows you to drink and drive.....like they receive import duties, Gst on cars and bikes that can break the speed limit, in the case of bikes, more than twice the max speed limit and then ping you for breaking the speed limit......

I think it is called legalised extortion.....I am not complaining but just filling the pot cause at the end of the day we have to abide by the laws and if we do not we will get pinged whether it is fair,reasonable or not

'Just being a 'Troller''

[Marmoot]

I agree.....I was just raising pointers......I had this Toyota Corolla jobbie and once I accelerated out of a junction.....tyres grabbed, I was not hooning it, foot off the clutch and wheels still span for about 5 metres (15 feet) so not long and it was embarrasing......clutch must have grabbed or something.....like I said it should be the intent to 'burn rubber'.....'

Ah, you're talking about Mens Rea........

[Lou Girardin]

Ah, you're talking about Mens Rea........

Which isn't a required component of most traffic offences.

[Deano]

'Squealing' the tyres is a shit-load different to smoking them and leaving 10 metres of black strip on the road - we all know when our Dunlops a skidding, we all know to back off if we don't want trouble - and doing it on front of a cop is asking for trouble.

Exactly. The guy either did it on purpose or has shit car handling skills.

[Grahameeboy]

Exactly. The guy either did it on purpose or has shit car handling skills.

But he had his Wife and Mum in back so chances he did it on purpose are slim and it was just shit skills

[SPORK]

Well, I'm happy

[Indiana_Jones]

I hate those pricks who try to take on whaling ships, As soon as they start to defend themselves greenpeace cries bloody murder, dicks :p

anyways, I dare say most cops will only slap that noise fine into mainly boy racer knobs who drive their mum's Civic with a Milo can tapped onto the exhuast :moon:

-Indy

[Grahameeboy]

[QUOTE=Indiana_Jones]I hate those pricks who try to take on whaling ships, As soon as they start to defend themselves greenpeace cries bloody murder, dicks :p

Yep, don't agree with Whaling and good on Greenpeace for trying to do something, but if you start a war you have to expect some grief back so shouldn't complain........

Problem is that stopping Whaling is not easy....they have been trying for last 10 years or more and they still use the same tactics......90% of the supports 'No Whaling' but when they have meetings the Japs buy more time so it waits until next meeting and they also buy the African nations for votes.......

[Indiana_Jones]

I don't like whaling myself. But to stop them we need to act as one. I mean really they can fish all they want, it's in international waters, just like the French ripped the Titanic wreck to bits (well ok they mainly grabbed stuff from the debris field, which is ok by me, but they did jank some stuff of the ship itself)

-Indy

[Slingshot]

I couldn't give a toss about the whaling...if the whales were endangered then it would be a bit crap but as far as I know they're not.
The Jappers could save themselves a heap of effort though, they could set up a team to jump on a plane and fly to the site of whales that have come ashore.
Greenpiece piss me off because they're hyprocites and their ideals are not the same as mine!

It's good that the dude in the Merc got pinged, he was obviously being a dick. Just because your mother is in the car doesn't mean you'll automatically be less of a dick either.
He's turned traction control off and then planted boot...throw the book at him. He could have at least done it out of sight of the fuzz.

I don't have a real problem with boy racers, it's not my cup of tea to race around with nosiy cars and phssing blow-off values but each to their own...the problem is that they sometimes put others at risk.
Shit, that sounds familar...bikers (generally speaking) are not the most law abiding group on the road. Ah...but I guess I'm forgetting that we're all perfect.

And why the hell shouldn't a country be able to choose how to provide power (read: defend themselves).
The Western world has some ego to believe that it can dicitate what other countries can and can't do. In a perfect world, there'd be no nukes...but this is far from a perfect world we live in. Let em build the nukes and then lets hope someone pushes the button...next thing we know there'll be nukes flying everywhere (hopefully a couple will land in NZ too)...the human race will be wiped out and everything will be easy again.

[StoneChucker]

Damn, forgot about this thread, so much to read!

Firstly, as I said I agree the best thing would be for no country to have nukes. It's really worrying when certain countries proclaiming to hate westerners want to devellop nuclear programs. But thats always been the case, nothing new there really. Does anyone know if America has ever invaded a country with a tyranical/ruthless leader, removed said leader and helped the country regain or attain democracy, WITHOUT any other motives, financial for example? I don't know of any, but I'm not a historian. For example, it would be really refreshing for the US to overthrow Robert Mugabe and all his cohorts in Zimbabwe, and set the country on the right path, just for helping a country regain stability. I've seen figures of how many gallons of gasoline the US use per DAY and it's unbelievable. Seriously, something like 130 Million, or even more, I'm not exactly sure. It's sickening. The same abuse of the environment is what causes the suprisingly thick smog over okyo (I think). ZPeople walk around with face masks on, not for bird flu in this case.

In all honesty, someone here reminded me that whaling, if done in a humane, sustainable way, is realy similar to us westerners eating cows and other game. I believe it's not sustainable, and done barbarically, but a country that eats cats and dogs isn't really going to take any notice. The "research" is however being released for their scientific studies. Only they don't call it that, they prefer the name "receipe".

The new noise law, boy racer law and other high profile laws are there to serve a purpose. From the replies here, the enforcement of noise restrictions on property is also judged by ear. So I guess, for the majority, police will enforce the laws with discretion. If you drive an illegally lowered and modified car, have no licence, reg or wof and have an attitude, you're likely to "come a cropper". I guess it comes down to driving maturely with logic. When I think about it, we all know the precise point where the line gets crossed, when we're doing something legal which then becomes illegal. Obviously what alot of the people that get caught get pissed off about is, that they were caught in the first place, not that they were wrongly accused/charged. Another thing someone said that I think could be used (and probably is already), is if you're over 25 and look more mature, not to get as much of the boy racer treatment, unless you clearly warrant it. The reason some laws worry me is, I have on a few occasions I've lost traction, normally only half a second tho, while pulling off from lights in the wet, over those slippery white lines. I am trying to pull away quickly, but not racing or spinning my wheels for fun. Loosing my car or licence would really stuff up my day/month/job, just because unluckily one day through my carelessness yes, but some cop sees me and thinks I'm intending to do so. To jump the fence again, I think we shouldn't complain all the time, NZ police do a good job, in all areas. Compare them to US police: On shows like cops, where they must be on some level of better behaviour or more restraint, they rip people out the car, handle them violently and speak down to the with nothing but disgust/lack of respect. (Granted, it's a different society.)

I guess you can over debate issues. I've been pulled over about 5 times, two breath tests, one speeding (got heaps of leneancy from this guy, made my day), one licence check and one curteousy check as I was map reading on the roadside. Drive sensibly, and it won't be an issue. Intent is an issue, but normally judged fairly as I've encountered.

[James Deuce]

There's no humane way to kill a whale without cluster bomb munitions. It always takes at least 20 minutes for a whale to die.

The approved technique is to harpoon them in the head with an explosive harpoon and then let them tow the boat around until they die from blood loss.

Of course if you get the one in a hundred shot that penetrates to the brain then you have an instantly dead animal, bit like the way cows are slaughtered.

[Slingshot]

Another thing someone said that I think could be used (and probably is already), is if you're over 25 and look more mature, not to get as much of the boy racer treatment, unless you clearly warrant it.

That's bullocks!!!
Why should a law be applied differently to different groups of society? Imagine if you replaced the references to age with:
Another thing someone said that I think could be used (and probably is already), is if you're white and look affluent, not to get as much of the boy racer treatment, unless you clearly warrant it.

Imagine the outcry!!!

[Grahameeboy]

I couldn't give a toss about the whaling...if the whales were endangered then it would be a bit crap but as far as I know they're not.
The Jappers could save themselves a heap of effort though, they could set up a team to jump on a plane and fly to the site of whales that have come ashore.
Greenpiece piss me off because they're hyprocites and their ideals are not the same as mine!

It's good that the dude in the Merc got pinged, he was obviously being a dick. Just because your mother is in the car doesn't mean you'll automatically be less of a dick either.
He's turned traction control off and then planted boot...throw the book at him. He could have at least done it out of sight of the fuzz.

I don't have a real problem with boy racers, it's not my cup of tea to race around with nosiy cars and phssing blow-off values but each to their own...the problem is that they sometimes put others at risk.
Shit, that sounds familar...bikers (generally speaking) are not the most law abiding group on the road. Ah...but I guess I'm forgetting that we're all perfect.

And why the hell shouldn't a country be able to choose how to provide power (read: defend themselves).
The Western world has some ego to believe that it can dicitate what other countries can and can't do. In a perfect world, there'd be no nukes...but this is far from a perfect world we live in. Let em build the nukes and then lets hope someone pushes the button...next thing we know there'll be nukes flying everywhere (hopefully a couple will land in NZ too)...the human race will be wiped out and everything will be easy again.

Oh....................................

[StoneChucker]

That's bullocks!!!
Why should a law be applied differently to different groups of society? Imagine if you replaced the references to age with:
Another thing someone said that I think could be used (and probably is already), is if you're white and look affluent, not to get as much of the boy racer treatment, unless you clearly warrant it.

Imagine the outcry!!!
Hmm, yes I see my post on that point is leaking mortally... What I was trying to convey, was that like you get insurance reductions at/after 25, police should use more/detailed discretion when dealing with older people. Obviously there are people of any age doing illegal shit, but with regards to accidental misuse of a vehicle, it's more likely that the story of accidental loss of traction is true from an older person, than from a 18 year old boy, with a back to front cap and blasting music. This may mean the difference between the loss of your vehicle, and a careless use fine for your lack of skill/judgement. Being judged as a boy racer/liar and loosing your car seems unfair if it was just an unintentional mistake (which would still be punished, but less severely)

But like I said, depending on what the officer saw, age/gender/ethnicity/wealth is irrelevant if someone has broken the law. I never intended to imply otherwise:slap:

[Slingshot]

Oh....................................


Oh...........................What?

[Lou Girardin]

That's bullocks!!!
Why should a law be applied differently to different groups of society? Imagine if you replaced the references to age with:
Another thing someone said that I think could be used (and probably is already), is if you're white and look affluent, not to get as much of the boy racer treatment, unless you clearly warrant it.

Imagine the outcry!!!

It's what happens already. How many white collar criminals get jail for their crimes compared to poorer people.

[Slingshot]

It's what happens already. How many white collar criminals get jail for their crimes compared to poorer people.

Yes, we live in a corrupt and unjust world...hence my comments about nuking the lot of us.

[StoneChucker]

Yes, we live in a corrupt and unjust world...hence my comments about nuking the lot of us.
Err, speak for yourself:2guns: I think of myself as a good person, at least not by any means in the same class/thought of people who are prejudiced, or who attain wealth at the direct expense of others. If what you want had to transpire, there should be a nuclear shelter, so once the scurge of the earth is cleared, there are people to repopulate the earth. Yes, I would take on that burden, that's just the sort of guy I am:shifty:

[Colapop]

Is not war futile? To kill another one must kill every person that that individual has ever had contact with and then kill every person who shares the same ideals then kill all the people that they've ever had contact with then kill all those people who may share the same ideals......

[thehollowmen]

If the police were really around to 'tax' us they would put a cop car or a camera beside burger king / shell in dunedin. And even better that's where the boyracers often hang out.

It is almost impossible to not spin your wheels on the way out of there, I do it in my FWD car, my boss does it in the WRX, my lil bro does it in his RWD and I've also done it on the bike.

anyways, haven't seen a ticket handed out :-(

[Slingshot]

If what you want had to transpire, there should be a nuclear shelter, so once the scurge of the earth is cleared, there are people to repopulate the earth. Yes, I would take on that burden, that's just the sort of guy I am:shifty:

A nuclear shelter is a great idea...and yes...that is the sort of guy you are.

[StoneChucker]

A nuclear shelter is a great idea...and yes...that is the sort of guy you are.
Hmm, ok, yet another situation where the inanimate nature of the internet bestows ambiguity to the reader. I assume you were being ironic? If not:finger:

[Slingshot]

Hmm, ok, yet another situation where the inanimate nature of the internet bestows ambiguity to the reader. I assume you were being ironic? If not:finger:

No...I was actually meaning you are a nice guy...no offence meant.